BREAKING: White Marine Vet To Be Charged In Death of Jordan Neely

[multivita-man]

That's good, because most people have no idea what it is like.

When you watch the video I think you'll come away with a different perspective.

Respectfully come to a different conclusion. Being put into dizzy land and also having read a thing or two about death from trauma made me appreciate how quickly things can go wrong.

People think things like a punch to the jaw is just a punch to the jaw - until dude falls backward and cracks his head on the cement parking lot. Just the same, people think a choke is just some shit they see on UFC, until dude dies from a lack of oxygen to the brain* or a fatal tachycardia.

*Technically, that's how everyone dies: lack of oxygen to the brain, regardless of the proximity cause or triggering event.

 

[Missourian]

I agree he wasn't consistently choked for 15 minutes, but Penny's applying a choke and he's got leverage, too, which he didn't have before.

It doesn't matter what you say, man. The fact is that Neely goes night night after Penny applied that final choke. I'm guessing Penny was getting tired and fed up with having to restrain him and being locked in place for that long and said "That's it, your ass is going to sleep." I agree Penny didn't mean to kill him. Clearly an accident. But it's still excessive force.

That's why he's being charged. The DA didn't necessarily say that people were unjustified in restraining him; they're unjustified in restraining him with potentially lethal force. That's the problem Penny's defense team has.

On the flip side, I don't think a conviction is automatic. Jurors may have a totally different understanding of "reasonable" force than I do or than the DA. And I'm guessing some jurors will be able to the fear of being a victim of random street violence.

That's not what I see.

I agree that Penny does eventually choke him out intentionally.

Had Neely submitted and gave up the struggle, the continuation of force would not have been necessary.

You know...tapped out.

But Neely continues to struggle and Penny put him out.

That's just escalation of force.

And like I said...you've been choked out, I've been choked out, the soldier in the video was choked out ...

...none of us die.

So saying that putting someone that is struggling to sleep is lethal force isn't an accurate statement.

That's my opinion based on experience on the street.

If you're interested, I'll tell you about it.

 

[Lisa558]

But we have many cases where someone, via their actions, accidentky causes the death of another - and they’re not charged with a crime.

What about that awful case some years back where a black guy was racing His bike through a crosswalk and killed a totally innocent white woman (as opposed to a long term criminal who was threatening people)? He wasn’t.charged at all. But in today‘s climate, and the races were reversed and a white dude killed a kind, decent, law-abiding black woman, he would indeed be charged. We simply cannot have two approaches to criminal charges based on race.

 

[Lisa558]

That's not what I see.

I agree that Penny does eventually choke him out intentionally.

Had Neely submitted and gave up the struggle, the continuation of force would not have been necessary.

You know...tapped out.

But Neely continues to struggle and Penny put him out.

That's just escalation of force.

And like I said...you've been choked out, I've been choked out, the soldier in the video was choked out ...

...none of us die.

So saying that putting someone that is struggling to sleep is lethal force isn't an accurate statement.

That's my opinion based on experience on the street.

If you're interested, I'll tell you about it.

The results of the toxicology report might provide some answers.

 

[multivita-man]

And like I said...you've been choked out, I've been choked out, the soldier in the video was choked out ...

...none of us die.

But people do die of chokeholds - that's a well-documented fact.

I didn't die because either I was either fucken around with friends or I was in sparring and it was understood that when someone taps, the guy who's got his arm around your neck has to stop.

I think the fact that this was a street encounter between two different people from two different worlds is why this turned out tragic. It's too bad there weren't police or security involved sooner to relieve Penny. Maybe that's what he argues in his defense. I don't think he's an evil guy; I think he just acted and didn't know the potential he had to kill someone and didn't know the law.

So saying that putting someone that is struggling to sleep is lethal force isn't an accurate statement.

That's my opinion based on experience on the street.

If you're interested, I'll tell you about it.

Nah again, no disrespect to you or your experience but it's clear to me from the video what happened.

 

[multivita-man]

The results of the toxicology report might provide some answers.

Nah, doubt it.

I suspect that Penny is being charged now because a) he was recorded on video ending someone's life - fact...and b) because he was stupid enough to talk to the fucken cops without his attorney present.

Let me just put a little PSA out there. If detectives ever show up at your door and want to ask you questions about what you did or what you know or what you whatever, don't talk to the fucken cops. Okay?

 

[Harpy Eagle]

Golfing Gator

Newsflash...the SAME GUY who shot the video...

...is the same guy who said he didn't think there was a chance Neely was going to die...

...is the SAME GUY these "news organizations" are quoting as saying the chokehold lasted 15 minutes...

"Neely was held in the chokehold for about 15 minutes, said Vazquez, who recorded the video. The video showed two other subway riders appearing to help restrain Neely."

What a bunch of bullshiters the media are.

Vazquez likely said the whole incident lasted 15 minutes...but the man who shot the video surely didn't contradict himself three times.

"Oh...we missunderstood..." they'll say.

Correction on page 32.

NYC subway rider who put Jordan Neely in fatal chokehold to be charged with manslaughter

Neely, a subway busker who performed dance routines in costume as Michael Jackson, was unconscious when officers arrived. He was pronounced dead at the hospital.

www.nbcnews.com

If the reported 15 min of choke hold is not accurate then that changes everything

 

[Rambunctious]

I don't know how it will play out. I suspect there was no intent, but yes it has been ruled a homicide, and somebody is responsible, but to what degree, I am not sure. If the dead guy had actually attacked somebody, even if not the guy that choke him out, it would be justifiable. But, I have not read that being the case. The jury will decide this, and I will support with whatever they decide.

So first someone has to get their faced smashed in before action and force can be used?... you do know that this so called M Jackson dancer hit a 76 year old woman (one punch) so hard she has permanent brain damage but you think patience was called for.... unbelievable....
He also tried to kidnap an 8 year old girl and would have raped her if he succeeded....
If anyone is guilty here its the justice system in NYC.... for not locking this thug up and tossing out the key.... and patrolling the damn subway....

 

[multivita-man]

So first someone has to get their faced smashed in before action and force can be used?... you do know that this so called M Jackson dancer hit a 76 year old woman (one punch) so hard she has permanent brain damage but you think patience was called for.... unbelievable....

If that happened, then he should have been confined. I think we're going to find many points of failure by the time this is over.

 

[multivita-man]

If the reported 15 min of choke hold is not accurate then that changes everything

Not necessarily. If it's a 60 or 90-second choke, that's still potentially excessive force. People watch UFC and think that chokes are benign, but they're not.

There are other restraints that a person can apply that don't involve cutting off oxygen to the brain or putting stress on the Vagus Nerve and triggering abnormal heart rhythms.

That's really the issue here. Not whether Penny and others were justified in restraining Neely but whether excessive force was applied.

 

[White 6]

What card? I don't get what you mean.

 

[Rambunctious]

If NYC and other blue cities are going to take cops off the street reduce the power they have and then arrest folks for defending themselves then we are no longer a free people....

 

[Dogmaphobe]

So first someone has to get their faced smashed in before action and force can be used?... you do know that this so called M Jackson dancer hit a 76 year old woman (one punch) so hard she has permanent brain damage but you think patience was called for.... unbelievable....
He also tried to kidnap an 8 year old girl and would have raped her if he succeeded....
If anyone is guilty here its the justice system in NYC.... for not locking this thug up and tossing out the key.... and patrolling the damn subway....

The media has trained unthinking leftists to identify with the absolute dregs of society instead of those who contribute something positive to it.

 

[multivita-man]

If NYC and other blue cities are going to take cops off the street reduce the power they have and then arrest folks for defending themselves then we are no longer a free people....

Let me put this another way: what if instead of restraining Neely with a chokehold, Penny had swept him off his feet and pummeled him to death. Would that be any more acceptable?

 

[Rambunctious]

Let me put this another way: what if instead of restraining Neely with a chokehold, Penny had swept him off his feet and pummeled him to death. Would that be any more acceptable?

You were not there... a subway car is not a park or a boxing ring.... its a confined place with no doors until the car stops... Once I had him I wouldn't have let go either.... you would be crazy to let go...

 

[Dogmaphobe]

Let me put this another way: what if instead of restraining Neely with a chokehold, Penny had swept him off his feet and pummeled him to death. Would that be any more acceptable?

What if the psychotic criminal you idolize had not menaced passengers in the first place, eh?

 

[EvilCat Breath]

Just for some reference Neeley actually a broke an elderly woman's face and slugged another senior, and in another instance he attempted to kidnap a 7 year old girl off the street for who knows what. He got 4 months for that crime. This is who wacky people out there are protesting for? Be glad he's dead and not kidnapping your children or breaking your grandmothers face, idiots.

Jordan Neeley is getting the Trayvon Martin washing treatment. The pictures of Martin as a winsome 12 year old were plastered everywhere instead of the thug he really looked like. Some 10 year old pictures of Neeley have been dug up from his street performer days. He's being described as a beloved subway fixture who brought light into everyone's life. He struck terror into the lives of everyone who saw him.

 

[White 6]

So first someone has to get their faced smashed in before action and force can be used?... you do know that this so called M Jackson dancer hit a 76 year old woman (one punch) so hard she has permanent brain damage but you think patience was called for.... unbelievable....
He also tried to kidnap an 8 year old girl and would have raped her if he succeeded....
If anyone is guilty here its the justice system in NYC.... for not locking this thug up and tossing out the key.... and patrolling the damn subway....

Pretty much, if you want to get away with killing somebody, as talk is cheap and always has been. I have always used the hands on rule. I had two guys after me in AIT, I never took the bait, just on words. I waited until told they had seen me enter the building and were going to "throw that little white redneck cracker down the stairs", so I insisted on going up by myself (to avoid a race riot), knowing I would kill the first one, and deal with the other, but expecting him to retreat. So, the first to grasp and swing, got thrown down two flights of stairs, bouncing off a concrete wall, but with less than expected result, only getting compound fracture, forearm and wrist, with severe bleeding, and a huge bleed dent on the right side of his head and a concussion that kept him in the base hospital 3 or 4 days, but even then I treated his injuries, immobilizing the fracture, packing the bleed with his t-shirt and tourniquet above the elbow and calling the ambulance. The other guy retreated. I don't make the first move unless outnumbered beyond abilities, as thin it becomes a matter of getting your payback in first while you are still able. If somebody dies, it's the fault of the one that initiates action, in my book.

 

[multivita-man]

You were not there... a subway car is not a park or a boxing ring.... its a confined place with no doors until the car stops... Once I had him I wouldn't have let go either.... you would be crazy to let go...

None of us were there. That's what evidence is for. That's what juries are for. We'll see.

 

[multivita-man]

Jordan Neeley is getting the Trayvon Martin washing treatment. The pictures of Martin as a winsome 12 year old were plastered everywhere instead of the thug he really looked like. Some 10 year old pictures of Neeley have been dug up from his street performer days. He's being described as a beloved subway fixture who brought light into everyone's life. He struck terror into the lives of everyone who saw him.

That probably won't matter. What will matter is evidence.