Callous Conservatives, Time to wake up!

[TemplarKormac]

Raising the minimum wage, receiving a living wages, having health insurance and enough to save for the future are the unmet dreams of too many in America, and providing these meager things won't make it harder for those of us who play on our computers for hours each day

No, that is asking government to live our lives for us. We rise and fall on our own merits, our own circumstances. It isn't government's place to change those circumstances. Government cannot play God, nor can it alter the human condition.

What exactly is a "living wage" anyway? Isn't that nothing more than a buzzword? How do you define a "living wage?" What's the limit, Wry? How high must you go before you'll call it a "living wage?"

High enough perhaps that you force business to cut workers to keep in the black? Is it such that it is enough to compel a global food franchise to resort to automation to serve its customers?

You want people to live on reasonable wages, yet, I sense you have no idea what's reasonable, now do you?

 

[TemplarKormac]

you lack a common basic characteristic of the human species, empathy.

I have plenty of it. My empathy tells me that people should prosper, not live under the weight of government. If you truly had any empathy unique to this human species, you would give these people jobs, make their path to employment easier. Yet here you are demanding a "living wage." That only complicates matters because you lack empathy for those who have to make a living, just as people like you do, those who run those small mom and pop business, the small business owners. Not all of them are rich tycoons or magnates, they fight the same fight you do. Now, here you are wanting to penalize them for their success.

Then again, what good is a living wage if nobody's around to pay it --- or receive it? "Living wage" will hurt employers ability to employ people. It will hurt those employees laid off because of it. People on welfare or food stamps won't be there to earn it, because they're sucklings on the government teat. You defend both, but don't have the solution to either.

My oh my, what a little Pandora's box we have here.

What happens when you put the business owners out on the street huh? Where will your "living wage" be then? Your quest to bridge the gap in income will only be Pyrrhic in nature. You're given to ignore the ones you knocked off the bridge in order to get to the other side.

Government assistance only goes so far. Sometimes you have to stand up on your own two feet. But that's something I gather you'll have none of, am I correct?

On one side, you have "living wage" on the other you have "entitlements." You fight that counterproductive fight. How can you be for both if one is like a poison to the other?

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

economic fairness

Your version of "economic fairness" is impossible. You talk about human nature, but as I see it, human nature is the want to prosper, to succeed and look after their welfare; not have the magnitude of those things be dictated by the likes of you or by their government.

You are the callous one, Wry. You and your liberal kind delude yourselves into fantasies of "fairness" when you are simply trying to make the game harder for everyone else.

Human nature is first and foremost about a need to survive, for most of the people on our planet the ability to prosper isn't even in the realm of possibility.

Your comment is both naive and the stinking thinking of a callous conservative. Raising the minimum wage, receiving a living wages, having health insurance and enough to save for the future are the unmet dreams of too many in America, and providing these meager things won't make it harder for those of us who play on our computers for hours each day

It's easy for you and others like you to judge those in need,without any knowledge of how and why they are in the situation they are. Easy because you and other callous conservatives have something in common with sociopaths (now deemed personality disordered); you lack a common basic characteristic of the human species, empathy.

economic fairness

Your version of "economic fairness" is impossible. You talk about human nature, but as I see it, human nature is the want to prosper, to succeed and look after their welfare; not have the magnitude of those things be dictated by the likes of you or by their government.

You are the callous one, Wry. You and your liberal kind delude yourselves into fantasies of "fairness" when you are simply trying to make the game harder for everyone else.

Human nature is first and foremost about a need to survive, for most of the people on our planet the ability to prosper isn't even in the realm of possibility.

That may be true of the planet, but not of this country.

Why do you think people are dying to get into this country anyway? Freedom and opportunity.

In this country, most people can be anything they want. If you want to be poor, sit home like the 93 million Americans are now (thank you Obama). If you want to be middle-class, learn a trade, go to school, maybe open up your own business. If you want to be upper-class, make a lot of sacrifices in life, get a college degree, make riskier investments. It's all up to the individual and what they want.

Foreigners come here all the time with twenty cents in their pocket and little understanding of English. But they work night and day, they study when any available minute presents itself. They save every nickel and dime and eventually open up their own business. Americans? They are sitting home watching their big screen talking on their Obama phones and getting fat off their SNAP's allotment every month.

 

[Wry Catcher]

Raising the minimum wage, receiving a living wages, having health insurance and enough to save for the future are the unmet dreams of too many in America, and providing these meager things won't make it harder for those of us who play on our computers for hours each day

No, that is asking government to live our lives for us. We rise and fall on our own merits, our own circumstances. It isn't government's place to change those circumstances. Government cannot play God, nor can it alter the human condition.

What exactly is a "living wage" anyway? Isn't that nothing more than a buzzword? How do you define a "living wage?" What's the limit, Wry? How high must you go before you'll call it a "living wage?"

High enough perhaps that you force business to cut workers to keep in the black? Is it such that it is enough to compel a global food franchise to resort to automation to serve its customers?

You want people to live on reasonable wages, yet, I sense you have no idea what's reasonable, now do you?

A living wage is one which provides enough income to take care of basic needs: food, clothing, shelter, health care and some left over to save/invest for retirement.

See number 1 on Maslow's hierarchy of needs, and think about all five on the list:

http://www.simplypsychology.org/maslow.html

 

[TemplarKormac]

Raising the minimum wage, receiving a living wages, having health insurance and enough to save for the future are the unmet dreams of too many in America, and providing these meager things won't make it harder for those of us who play on our computers for hours each day

No, that is asking government to live our lives for us. We rise and fall on our own merits, our own circumstances. It isn't government's place to change those circumstances. Government cannot play God, nor can it alter the human condition.

What exactly is a "living wage" anyway? Isn't that nothing more than a buzzword? How do you define a "living wage?" What's the limit, Wry? How high must you go before you'll call it a "living wage?"

High enough perhaps that you force business to cut workers to keep in the black? Is it such that it is enough to compel a global food franchise to resort to automation to serve its customers?

You want people to live on reasonable wages, yet, I sense you have no idea what's reasonable, now do you?

A living wage is one which provides enough income to take care of basic needs: food, clothing, shelter, health care and some left over to save/invest for retirement.

See number 1 on Maslow's hierarchy of needs, and think about all five on the list:

http://www.simplypsychology.org/maslow.html

I didn't ask for something I learned about in high school, I asked for a fixed, definite number. Or are you incapable of counting past the number 10?

 

[kaz]

My thread was not intended to attract trolls and partisans. If the Mods would please move this thread into the clean zone, so rational people can post, and the trolls cannot side track a current event of significance, the thread may become thought provoking, and not a place for whiners and ostriches.

your thread clearly is designed for trolls, starting with the first post...

 

[kaz]

Raising the minimum wage, receiving a living wages, having health insurance and enough to save for the future are the unmet dreams of too many in America, and providing these meager things won't make it harder for those of us who play on our computers for hours each day

No, that is asking government to live our lives for us. We rise and fall on our own merits, our own circumstances. It isn't government's place to change those circumstances. Government cannot play God, nor can it alter the human condition.

What exactly is a "living wage" anyway? Isn't that nothing more than a buzzword? How do you define a "living wage?" What's the limit, Wry? How high must you go before you'll call it a "living wage?"

High enough perhaps that you force business to cut workers to keep in the black? Is it such that it is enough to compel a global food franchise to resort to automation to serve its customers?

You want people to live on reasonable wages, yet, I sense you have no idea what's reasonable, now do you?

A living wage is one which provides enough income to take care of basic needs: food, clothing, shelter, health care and some left over to save/invest for retirement.

See number 1 on Maslow's hierarchy of needs, and think about all five on the list:

http://www.simplypsychology.org/maslow.html

people should care enough to be worth doing a job that pays for their basic needs. Employers should pay them what they are worth

 

[TemplarKormac]

Raising the minimum wage, receiving a living wages, having health insurance and enough to save for the future are the unmet dreams of too many in America, and providing these meager things won't make it harder for those of us who play on our computers for hours each day

No, that is asking government to live our lives for us. We rise and fall on our own merits, our own circumstances. It isn't government's place to change those circumstances. Government cannot play God, nor can it alter the human condition.

What exactly is a "living wage" anyway? Isn't that nothing more than a buzzword? How do you define a "living wage?" What's the limit, Wry? How high must you go before you'll call it a "living wage?"

High enough perhaps that you force business to cut workers to keep in the black? Is it such that it is enough to compel a global food franchise to resort to automation to serve its customers?

You want people to live on reasonable wages, yet, I sense you have no idea what's reasonable, now do you?

A living wage is one which provides enough income to take care of basic needs: food, clothing, shelter, health care and some left over to save/invest for retirement.

See number 1 on Maslow's hierarchy of needs, and think about all five on the list:

http://www.simplypsychology.org/maslow.html

people should care enough to be worth doing a job that pays for their basic needs. Employers should pay them what they are worth

My grandmother said this to me a lot when I was younger:

"When you want something bad enough, you'll get it yourself."

 

[kaz]

Raising the minimum wage, receiving a living wages, having health insurance and enough to save for the future are the unmet dreams of too many in America, and providing these meager things won't make it harder for those of us who play on our computers for hours each day

No, that is asking government to live our lives for us. We rise and fall on our own merits, our own circumstances. It isn't government's place to change those circumstances. Government cannot play God, nor can it alter the human condition.

What exactly is a "living wage" anyway? Isn't that nothing more than a buzzword? How do you define a "living wage?" What's the limit, Wry? How high must you go before you'll call it a "living wage?"

High enough perhaps that you force business to cut workers to keep in the black? Is it such that it is enough to compel a global food franchise to resort to automation to serve its customers?

You want people to live on reasonable wages, yet, I sense you have no idea what's reasonable, now do you?

A living wage is one which provides enough income to take care of basic needs: food, clothing, shelter, health care and some left over to save/invest for retirement.

See number 1 on Maslow's hierarchy of needs, and think about all five on the list:

http://www.simplypsychology.org/maslow.html

people should care enough to be worth doing a job that pays for their basic needs. Employers should pay them what they are worth

My grandmother said this to me a lot when I was younger:

"When you want something bad enough, you'll get it yourself."

Democrats needed to have your grandmother

 

[Lonestar_logic]

Raising the minimum wage, receiving a living wages, having health insurance and enough to save for the future are the unmet dreams of too many in America, and providing these meager things won't make it harder for those of us who play on our computers for hours each day

No, that is asking government to live our lives for us. We rise and fall on our own merits, our own circumstances. It isn't government's place to change those circumstances. Government cannot play God, nor can it alter the human condition.

What exactly is a "living wage" anyway? Isn't that nothing more than a buzzword? How do you define a "living wage?" What's the limit, Wry? How high must you go before you'll call it a "living wage?"

High enough perhaps that you force business to cut workers to keep in the black? Is it such that it is enough to compel a global food franchise to resort to automation to serve its customers?

You want people to live on reasonable wages, yet, I sense you have no idea what's reasonable, now do you?

A living wage is one which provides enough income to take care of basic needs: food, clothing, shelter, health care and some left over to save/invest for retirement.

See number 1 on Maslow's hierarchy of needs, and think about all five on the list:

http://www.simplypsychology.org/maslow.html

Should an employer pay a person a living wage even if that person is uneducated, inexperienced and/or untrustworthy?

 

[Iceweasel]

A living wage is one which provides enough income to take care of basic needs: food, clothing, shelter, health care and some left over to save/invest for retirement.

That's the thinking of a child, and it's why you need government over sight. Houses, clothing health care needs all are highly variable to the individuals. Most grown ups make a living wage, look around, the evidence is everywhere. If you're starting out in life you need to do what people have always done, find room mates and share expenses. Or go move to a socialist country and drag them down.

 

[kaz]

Raising the minimum wage, receiving a living wages, having health insurance and enough to save for the future are the unmet dreams of too many in America, and providing these meager things won't make it harder for those of us who play on our computers for hours each day

No, that is asking government to live our lives for us. We rise and fall on our own merits, our own circumstances. It isn't government's place to change those circumstances. Government cannot play God, nor can it alter the human condition.

What exactly is a "living wage" anyway? Isn't that nothing more than a buzzword? How do you define a "living wage?" What's the limit, Wry? How high must you go before you'll call it a "living wage?"

High enough perhaps that you force business to cut workers to keep in the black? Is it such that it is enough to compel a global food franchise to resort to automation to serve its customers?

You want people to live on reasonable wages, yet, I sense you have no idea what's reasonable, now do you?

A living wage is one which provides enough income to take care of basic needs: food, clothing, shelter, health care and some left over to save/invest for retirement.

See number 1 on Maslow's hierarchy of needs, and think about all five on the list:

http://www.simplypsychology.org/maslow.html

Should an employer pay a person a living wage even if that person is uneducated, inexperienced and/or untrustworthy?

There really is something wrong with you if you can't earn enough to live in this country with all the opportunity. As an employer, the overwhelming reason the ones not worth it aren't worth it is they don't care. They don't care about their jobs or their employers. They quit, they don't show up, they don't work when they are there. Then Democrats tell us we are the problem. Bull

 

[TemplarKormac]

Raising the minimum wage, receiving a living wages, having health insurance and enough to save for the future are the unmet dreams of too many in America, and providing these meager things won't make it harder for those of us who play on our computers for hours each day

No, that is asking government to live our lives for us. We rise and fall on our own merits, our own circumstances. It isn't government's place to change those circumstances. Government cannot play God, nor can it alter the human condition.

What exactly is a "living wage" anyway? Isn't that nothing more than a buzzword? How do you define a "living wage?" What's the limit, Wry? How high must you go before you'll call it a "living wage?"

High enough perhaps that you force business to cut workers to keep in the black? Is it such that it is enough to compel a global food franchise to resort to automation to serve its customers?

You want people to live on reasonable wages, yet, I sense you have no idea what's reasonable, now do you?

A living wage is one which provides enough income to take care of basic needs: food, clothing, shelter, health care and some left over to save/invest for retirement.

See number 1 on Maslow's hierarchy of needs, and think about all five on the list:

http://www.simplypsychology.org/maslow.html

people should care enough to be worth doing a job that pays for their basic needs. Employers should pay them what they are worth

My grandmother said this to me a lot when I was younger:

"When you want something bad enough, you'll get it yourself."

Democrats needed to have your grandmother

Well, she was a Democrat for 40 years. She saw the shitfest coming from miles away and decided to jump ship.

 

[Wry Catcher]

you lack a common basic characteristic of the human species, empathy.

I have plenty of it. My empathy tells me that people should prosper, not live under the weight of government. If you truly had any empathy unique to this human species, you would give these people jobs, make their path to employment easier. Yet here you are demanding a "living wage." That only complicates matters because you lack empathy for those who have to make a living, just as people like you do, those who run those small mom and pop business, the small business owners. Not all of them are rich tycoons or magnates, they fight the same fight you do. Now, here you are wanting to penalize them for their success.

Then again, what good is a living wage if nobody's around to pay it --- or receive it? "Living wage" will hurt employers ability to employ people. It will hurt those employees laid off because of it. People on welfare or food stamps won't be there to earn it, because they're sucklings on the government teat. You defend both, but don't have the solution to either.

My oh my, what a little Pandora's box we have here.

What happens when you put the business owners out on the street huh? Where will your "living wage" be then? Your quest to bridge the gap in income will only be Pyrrhic in nature. You're given to ignore the ones you knocked off the bridge in order to get to the other side.

Government assistance only goes so far. Sometimes you have to stand up on your own two feet. But that's something I gather you'll have none of, am I correct?

On one side, you have "living wage" on the other you have "entitlements." You fight that counterproductive fight. How can you be for both if one is like a poison to the other?

Good grief. That you believe income inequality is okay and government has no role in social policy is, in a word, nuts.

 

[TemplarKormac]

Good grief. That you believe income inequality is okay and government has no role in social policy is, in a word, nuts.

Good grief. You ain't no Charlie Brown. You're Jack Ass. No matter how hard you kick, the football isn't there.

Do I think there's a disparity in income? Yes I do. Do I think it needs to be solved by crushing the backs of businesses by raising the minimum wage? No.

You are more concerned with the "social" impact, and not on the "real world" impact. There are 93 million people (like me) who want work but cannot find it. Yeah, sure, 15 bucks an hour will surely do the trick.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

Raising the minimum wage, receiving a living wages, having health insurance and enough to save for the future are the unmet dreams of too many in America, and providing these meager things won't make it harder for those of us who play on our computers for hours each day

No, that is asking government to live our lives for us. We rise and fall on our own merits, our own circumstances. It isn't government's place to change those circumstances. Government cannot play God, nor can it alter the human condition.

What exactly is a "living wage" anyway? Isn't that nothing more than a buzzword? How do you define a "living wage?" What's the limit, Wry? How high must you go before you'll call it a "living wage?"

High enough perhaps that you force business to cut workers to keep in the black? Is it such that it is enough to compel a global food franchise to resort to automation to serve its customers?

You want people to live on reasonable wages, yet, I sense you have no idea what's reasonable, now do you?

A living wage is one which provides enough income to take care of basic needs: food, clothing, shelter, health care and some left over to save/invest for retirement.

See number 1 on Maslow's hierarchy of needs, and think about all five on the list:

http://www.simplypsychology.org/maslow.html

Should an employer pay a person a living wage even if that person is uneducated, inexperienced and/or untrustworthy?

There really is something wrong with you if you can't earn enough to live in this country with all the opportunity. As an employer, the overwhelming reason the ones not worth it aren't worth it is they don't care. They don't care about their jobs or their employers. They quit, they don't show up, they don't work when they are there. Then Democrats tell us we are the problem. Bull

There are jobs in this country that are not designed to be careers, they are called entry level jobs designed primarily for young people with no work experience, little skill and little knowledge. You can't expect an employer to pay top dollar for such an employee.

You and I may be on the same page but just looking at it differently.

 

[kaz]

Raising the minimum wage, receiving a living wages, having health insurance and enough to save for the future are the unmet dreams of too many in America, and providing these meager things won't make it harder for those of us who play on our computers for hours each day

No, that is asking government to live our lives for us. We rise and fall on our own merits, our own circumstances. It isn't government's place to change those circumstances. Government cannot play God, nor can it alter the human condition.

What exactly is a "living wage" anyway? Isn't that nothing more than a buzzword? How do you define a "living wage?" What's the limit, Wry? How high must you go before you'll call it a "living wage?"

High enough perhaps that you force business to cut workers to keep in the black? Is it such that it is enough to compel a global food franchise to resort to automation to serve its customers?

You want people to live on reasonable wages, yet, I sense you have no idea what's reasonable, now do you?

A living wage is one which provides enough income to take care of basic needs: food, clothing, shelter, health care and some left over to save/invest for retirement.

See number 1 on Maslow's hierarchy of needs, and think about all five on the list:

http://www.simplypsychology.org/maslow.html

Should an employer pay a person a living wage even if that person is uneducated, inexperienced and/or untrustworthy?

There really is something wrong with you if you can't earn enough to live in this country with all the opportunity. As an employer, the overwhelming reason the ones not worth it aren't worth it is they don't care. They don't care about their jobs or their employers. They quit, they don't show up, they don't work when they are there. Then Democrats tell us we are the problem. Bull

There are jobs in this country that are not designed to be careers, they are called entry level jobs designed primarily for young people with no work experience, little skill and little knowledge. You can't expect an employer to pay top dollar for such an employee.

You and I may be on the same page but just looking at it differently.

I'm not seeing any disagreement between us. there are people with serious physical and mental disabilities. I'm just saying the ones who don't earn enough to support themselves are self selecting in that

 

[Wry Catcher]

Raising the minimum wage, receiving a living wages, having health insurance and enough to save for the future are the unmet dreams of too many in America, and providing these meager things won't make it harder for those of us who play on our computers for hours each day

No, that is asking government to live our lives for us. We rise and fall on our own merits, our own circumstances. It isn't government's place to change those circumstances. Government cannot play God, nor can it alter the human condition.

What exactly is a "living wage" anyway? Isn't that nothing more than a buzzword? How do you define a "living wage?" What's the limit, Wry? How high must you go before you'll call it a "living wage?"

High enough perhaps that you force business to cut workers to keep in the black? Is it such that it is enough to compel a global food franchise to resort to automation to serve its customers?

You want people to live on reasonable wages, yet, I sense you have no idea what's reasonable, now do you?

A living wage is one which provides enough income to take care of basic needs: food, clothing, shelter, health care and some left over to save/invest for retirement.

See number 1 on Maslow's hierarchy of needs, and think about all five on the list:

http://www.simplypsychology.org/maslow.html

Should an employer pay a person a living wage even if that person is uneducated, inexperienced and/or untrustworthy?

There really is something wrong with you if you can't earn enough to live in this country with all the opportunity. As an employer, the overwhelming reason the ones not worth it aren't worth it is they don't care. They don't care about their jobs or their employers. They quit, they don't show up, they don't work when they are there. Then Democrats tell us we are the problem. Bull

Maybe your employees don't care is because you don't care about them. I had an interesting (and for me a disgusting) conversation with the the owner of several Burger Kings. He's in the NFL Hall of Fame and pissed and moaned about his employees, kids mostly, just like you have.

 

[kaz]

Raising the minimum wage, receiving a living wages, having health insurance and enough to save for the future are the unmet dreams of too many in America, and providing these meager things won't make it harder for those of us who play on our computers for hours each day

No, that is asking government to live our lives for us. We rise and fall on our own merits, our own circumstances. It isn't government's place to change those circumstances. Government cannot play God, nor can it alter the human condition.

What exactly is a "living wage" anyway? Isn't that nothing more than a buzzword? How do you define a "living wage?" What's the limit, Wry? How high must you go before you'll call it a "living wage?"

High enough perhaps that you force business to cut workers to keep in the black? Is it such that it is enough to compel a global food franchise to resort to automation to serve its customers?

You want people to live on reasonable wages, yet, I sense you have no idea what's reasonable, now do you?

A living wage is one which provides enough income to take care of basic needs: food, clothing, shelter, health care and some left over to save/invest for retirement.

See number 1 on Maslow's hierarchy of needs, and think about all five on the list:

http://www.simplypsychology.org/maslow.html

Should an employer pay a person a living wage even if that person is uneducated, inexperienced and/or untrustworthy?

There really is something wrong with you if you can't earn enough to live in this country with all the opportunity. As an employer, the overwhelming reason the ones not worth it aren't worth it is they don't care. They don't care about their jobs or their employers. They quit, they don't show up, they don't work when they are there. Then Democrats tell us we are the problem. Bull

Maybe your employees don't care is because you don't care about them. I had an interesting (and for me a disgusting) conversation with the the owner of several Burger Kings. He's in the NFL Hall of Fame and pissed and moaned about his employees, kids mostly, just like you have.

Playground! The right place for you. that isn't what I said, holmes

 

[Wry Catcher]

Raising the minimum wage, receiving a living wages, having health insurance and enough to save for the future are the unmet dreams of too many in America, and providing these meager things won't make it harder for those of us who play on our computers for hours each day

No, that is asking government to live our lives for us. We rise and fall on our own merits, our own circumstances. It isn't government's place to change those circumstances. Government cannot play God, nor can it alter the human condition.

What exactly is a "living wage" anyway? Isn't that nothing more than a buzzword? How do you define a "living wage?" What's the limit, Wry? How high must you go before you'll call it a "living wage?"

High enough perhaps that you force business to cut workers to keep in the black? Is it such that it is enough to compel a global food franchise to resort to automation to serve its customers?

You want people to live on reasonable wages, yet, I sense you have no idea what's reasonable, now do you?

A living wage is one which provides enough income to take care of basic needs: food, clothing, shelter, health care and some left over to save/invest for retirement.

See number 1 on Maslow's hierarchy of needs, and think about all five on the list:

http://www.simplypsychology.org/maslow.html

Should an employer pay a person a living wage even if that person is uneducated, inexperienced and/or untrustworthy?

There really is something wrong with you if you can't earn enough to live in this country with all the opportunity. As an employer, the overwhelming reason the ones not worth it aren't worth it is they don't care. They don't care about their jobs or their employers. They quit, they don't show up, they don't work when they are there. Then Democrats tell us we are the problem. Bull

There are jobs in this country that are not designed to be careers, they are called entry level jobs designed primarily for young people with no work experience, little skill and little knowledge. You can't expect an employer to pay top dollar for such an employee.

You and I may be on the same page but just looking at it differently.

I do expect an employer to treat employees fairly, not abuse them or exploit them. Some of these entry level jobs turn into careers for some, the reasons for that are myriad. To judge them as does Kaz without knowing the facts is asinine.