Capitalism or Communism? Is communism really that horrible?

[francoHFW]

The CPUSA has officially given up on communism too.

 

[Londoner]

In essence capitalism is smaller government and communism is huge government. Now before your western instincts tell you to instantly choose capitalism think of the benefits of huge government control in your life.

The US Government is larger and spends more money than any government in history. It makes the Soviet Union seem small. Research the size of the military. We have less than 1/3 of the world's population and we use well over 25% its resources. We have military tentacles and markets all over the planet. We are the largest government that has ever existed by an unimaginably large factor. We manage the global capitalist system. This requires a massive government.

You've been lied to by movement conservatism which is centrally controlled by a small group of ultra wealthy people who use government services but use overseas labor and keep most of their money offshore. They've captured your government. Don't be their useful idiot. Don't let them convince you that we have a quaint form of Adam Smith capitalism. AIG is larger than the Edinburgh of Adam Smith's youth. AIG is larger than many governments. It has no competition in most markets. Turn off Sean Hannity. You've been lied to.

In communism ideal/original communism everyone is equal. Though it almost never happens that a nation goes completely on the guidelines of a known social policy. Everyone is equal and therefore have the same things to live on and lean on their whole lives. Everyone once again must be equal in society and as a result you lose the right to earn. So in exchange for a lifetime safety net given by the government you give up the ability to earn your way up the ladder. This is because only one social class exist and that is common working class. So you have nothing to look foward to besides that life forever.

This is the version of communism that high school kids and/or republicans are fed. Marx theorized communism because he didn't want one group of people to be slaves to the property of another group. He didn't want - for instance - people to use big government to build a monopoly around things like oil, which would allow them to charge rent to the powerless hordes. He wanted to free people from this kind slavery so they would have time to develop their human side. He saw working for someone else's surplus (while you only made subsistence wages) as the primary destroyer of freedom.

In ideal/original capitalism they're is pretty much no government interference in your life. Of course they still have laws as any other nation but if you follow them you are left alone for all of your life. Capitalism is that sweet freedom you taste, love and learn about.

The final phase of capitalism is monopoly capitalism. This is when the market winners capture government, media, and all markets. They drive out competition so they can raise prices on captive consumers in order to increase profits for an elite group of investors. They use some of their profits to fund things like talk radio, which convinces people that anything done to challenge their control of government, media and markets is socialism.

Again. The kind of capitalism we have depends on an interventionist state sector which provides military, financial, infrastructure and regulatory support to the capitalist. You've been lied to about how small a capitalist government is. Capitalism depends on ever cheaper resources and labor in order to provide a higher return on investment. This requires a massive military. Do you know the resource-needs of global capitalism? Do you the energy needs of global capitalism? Do you know how big the military (and thus government) must be to stabilize the middle east? Do you have any idea where capitalism gets its raw material? Go into any Walmart. Read the labels on the products. Read where the goods are made. Many of the goods are made in unstable parts of the developing world. Do you know what it takes to stabilize those parts of the globe. Research Reagan's Structural Adjustment programs where the US leant massive amounts of money to corrupt regimes in the developing world (mostly the global south) because that is where the cheap labor and raw material was/is. Do you know how big government must be to manage global capitalism. Son, capitalism requires the biggest government and biggest military of all. This is why the USA makes all other governments look small.

You've been lied to by special interest groups on the Right. The small capitalism of Adam Smith is beautiful. I feel you. But then you graduate from 10th grade and you learn that we ain't in Kansas anymore.

 

[Cowman]

You've obviously run out of arguments. But then, you never had any.

How am I to argue with a delusional idiot who creates fantasies for himself? You believe that liberals and progressives are somehow "communists" and your premise is so fucking far fetched that you know it, and so you resort to creating an imaginary world for yourself that helps you choke it down.

There's nothing at all far fetched about it. Go check out the platform of the American Communist Party. There isn't a thing on it that any libturd in this forum would disagree with - including you.

THERE ARE LESS THAN THREE THOUSAND MEMBERS IN THE AMERICAN COMMUNIST PARTY.

You understand big and small numbers, right son?

There are more KKK members nationally than there are members of the American Communist Party.

Who the fuck dropped you on your god damn head?

 

[Unkotare]

In essence capitalism is smaller government and communism is huge government. Now before your western instincts tell you to instantly choose capitalism think of the benefits of huge government control in your life.

The US Government is larger and spends more money than any government in history. It makes the Soviet Union seem small. Research the size of the military. We have less than 1/3 of the world's population and we use well over 25% its resources. We have military tentacles and markets all over the planet. We are the largest government that has ever existed by an unimaginably large factor. We manage the global capitalist system. This requires a massive government.

You've been lied to by movement conservatism which is centrally controlled by a small group of ultra wealthy people who use government services but use overseas labor and keep most of their money offshore. They've captured your government. Don't be their useful idiot. Don't let them convince you that we have a quaint form of Adam Smith capitalism. AIG is larger than the Edinburgh of Adam Smith's youth. AIG is larger than many governments. It has no competition in most markets. Turn off Sean Hannity. You've been lied to.

In communism ideal/original communism everyone is equal. Though it almost never happens that a nation goes completely on the guidelines of a known social policy. Everyone is equal and therefore have the same things to live on and lean on their whole lives. Everyone once again must be equal in society and as a result you lose the right to earn. So in exchange for a lifetime safety net given by the government you give up the ability to earn your way up the ladder. This is because only one social class exist and that is common working class. So you have nothing to look foward to besides that life forever.

This is the version of communism that high school kids and/or republicans are fed. Marx theorized communism because he didn't want one group of people to be slaves to the property of another group. He didn't want - for instance - people to use big government to build a monopoly around things like oil, which would allow them to charge rent to the powerless hordes. He wanted to free people from this kind slavery so they would have time to develop their human side. He saw working for someone else's surplus (while you only made subsistence wages) as the primary destroyer of freedom.

In ideal/original capitalism they're is pretty much no government interference in your life. Of course they still have laws as any other nation but if you follow them you are left alone for all of your life. Capitalism is that sweet freedom you taste, love and learn about.

The final phase of capitalism is monopoly capitalism. This is when the market winners capture government, media, and all markets. They drive out competition so they can raise prices on captive consumers in order to increase profits for an elite group of investors. They use some of their profits to fund things like talk radio, which convinces people that anything done to challenge their control of government, media and markets is socialism.

Again. The kind of capitalism we have depends on an interventionist state sector which provides military, financial, infrastructure and regulatory support to the capitalist. You've been lied to about how small a capitalist government is. Capitalism depends on ever cheaper resources and labor in order to provide a higher return on investment. This requires a massive military. Do you know the resource-needs of global capitalism? Do you the energy needs of global capitalism? Do you know how big the military (and thus government) must be to stabilize the middle east? Do you have any idea where capitalism gets its raw material? Go into any Walmart. Read the labels on the products. Read where the goods are made. Many of the goods are made in unstable parts of the developing world. Do you know what it takes to stabilize those parts of the globe. Research Reagan's Structural Adjustment programs where the US leant massive amounts of money to corrupt regimes in the developing world (mostly the global south) because that is where the cheap labor and raw material was/is. Do you know how big government must be to manage global capitalism. Son, capitalism requires the biggest government and biggest military of all. This is why the USA makes all other governments look small.

You've been lied to by special interest groups on the Right. The small capitalism of Adam Smith is beautiful. I feel you. But then you graduate from 10th grade and you learn that we ain't in Kansas anymore.

You usually have to go to the Conspiracy Theory Forum to see "you've been lied to" that many times in one post.


Same mentality, I suppose.

 

[bripat9643]

How am I to argue with a delusional idiot who creates fantasies for himself? You believe that liberals and progressives are somehow "communists" and your premise is so fucking far fetched that you know it, and so you resort to creating an imaginary world for yourself that helps you choke it down.

There's nothing at all far fetched about it. Go check out the platform of the American Communist Party. There isn't a thing on it that any libturd in this forum would disagree with - including you.

THERE ARE LESS THAN THREE THOUSAND MEMBERS IN THE AMERICAN COMMUNIST PARTY.

Perhaps. Now they're all Democrats.

You understand big and small numbers, right son?

There are more KKK members nationally than there are members of the American Communist Party.

Who the fuck dropped you on your god damn head?

Democrats are indistinguishable from communists. Are you able to read? My point obviously went right over your head.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

The CPUSA has officially given up on communism too.

Now that they have control of the Democrat Party, why bother?

You can't tell the difference between stories from CPUSA and the DNC

 

[regent]

So with all this am I to believe the United States is now governed by communists, well not the House, that's good old Americanism. But then a new question arises were the ideas for government put forth by the founders also communism? They had a lot of strange beliefs and wore funny clothes. Seems like communists run everything, well not the Republican party that's good old Americanism.

 

[healthmyths]

Communism is dead. Socialism is European/Aus/NZ/Canadian/US social democracy. It's always democratic and is just fair, just, intelligent (once we have health reform) capitalism.

Cold war dinosaur Pub dupes! Change the channel.

You fail to recognize WHY nationalized single payer (as preferred by Obama) will NOT work in the USA based on already proven USA experience and realities.

1) NOT ONE person advocating Obamacare and more shocking Obamacare critics have considered this $100 billion a year cost!
Any nationalized, single payer assumes ONE payer right? That's the definition.
If there is ONE payer that means 1,300 insurance companies are out of business.
That means $100 billion A YEAR in Federal/state/local INCOME taxes and local property taxes will no longer be paid.
That means 400,000 people will be out of work no longer paying payroll taxes but will BE receiving unemployment benefits.

2) The USA is NOT a homogeneous country with 64.7% white, Hispanic 15.1% black 12.85% Asian 4.43% ethnic groups.
Versus your example that are almost ALL white populations with same food,life style, that is conducive to similar health solutions.
Whites have different life styles the most black,hispanic,etc. and if you disagree you are a racist!
Blacks don't live as long as Hispanics. Asians live longer then all.

3) Proof is we have a form of nationalized health i.e. Medicare now and it doesn't work as efficient as private health insurance.
People throw out Medicare's 3% overhead DON"T KNOW that Medicare doesn't process one single claim, nor handles any of the
3 million providers. It is subcontracted to for profit companies that the key word is "profit" don't make any profits they won't be in
business as the state insurance regulators will close them down as they can't make the reserve requirements to pay future claims!

The second proof comes directly from Medicare.
For example In 2009 the University Community Hospital in Tampa sent Medicare 2,110 claims for CAT scan no contrast.
Each claim averaged: $2,635 which is what was billed by the hospital to Medicare...
But the hospital's ACTUAL COSTS to perform the CAT SCAN was $43 a mark up 6,127.91%

Please logic dictates that if Medicare is ok with paying 6,000% mark ups for Medicare, what will happen if there is ONLY one health care payer in the USA???

 

[bripat9643]

So with all this am I to believe the United States is now governed by communists, well not the House, that's good old Americanism. But then a new question arises were the ideas for government put forth by the founders also communism? They had a lot of strange beliefs and wore funny clothes. Seems like communists run everything, well not the Republican party that's good old Americanism.

The Founders respected the institution of private property, so they obviously weren't communists. Modern Democrats evidence no such respect.

 

[regent]

So with all this am I to believe the United States is now governed by communists, well not the House, that's good old Americanism. But then a new question arises were the ideas for government put forth by the founders also communism? They had a lot of strange beliefs and wore funny clothes. Seems like communists run everything, well not the Republican party that's good old Americanism.

The Founders respected the institution of private property, so they obviously weren't communists. Modern Democrats evidence no such respect.

Yes, the founders were much endowed with property, it was at times another word for liberty. But a puzzle occurred in July 1776, Locke had always put life, liberty, and property as the three code words for liberalism. Jefferson in the Declaration of Independence changed property to the pursuit of happiness. The question is why? The committee also made many changes to the Jefferson document but not to the pursuit of happiness. Did the founders use the word property to mean what we think of property today.

 

[bripat9643]

So with all this am I to believe the United States is now governed by communists, well not the House, that's good old Americanism. But then a new question arises were the ideas for government put forth by the founders also communism? They had a lot of strange beliefs and wore funny clothes. Seems like communists run everything, well not the Republican party that's good old Americanism.

The Founders respected the institution of private property, so they obviously weren't communists. Modern Democrats evidence no such respect.

Yes, the founders were much endowed with property, it was at times another word for liberty. But a puzzle occurred in July 1776, Locke had always put life, liberty, and property as the three code words for liberalism. Jefferson in the Declaration of Independence changed property to the pursuit of happiness. The question is why? The committee also made many changes to the Jefferson document but not to the pursuit of happiness. Did the founders use the word property to mean what we think of property today.

Of course they did. In those days, all property was either owned privately or owned by the king ( which amounted to the same thing ). The concept of "public property" didn't exist.

 

[daveman]

Initially, I'm sure some think it's great because they have what they need and don't have to do anything for it. Then, those who are busy keeping the whole system running smoothly by working get tired of carrying the load. Then the money starts running out because government is not, nor will ever be, a creator of wealth. In the end, all suffer equally. Well, except for the dictators, who live like royalty.

Our constitution guarantees equal opportunity. Equal outcome is an impossible goal and the government should never try.

Most people who advocate Communism think they'll be the ruling class.

The reality is they'll be up against the wall the very second their useful idiocy is no longer useful.

 

[daveman]

How come we only get is a choice between capitalism or communism? Other countries get to choose among a number of political and economic options, some even get to mix some so they find what's right for them, but not us, how come? It's not fair.

 

[daveman]

I find it funny how some people still believe communism works.

Home » cpusa

Here's just some of their bullshit.

Marxist ideas have been elaborated and modernized by other great revolutionaries such as Vladimir Lenin, Ho Chi Minh and Fidel Castro.

The validity of Marxism has been repeatedly demonstrated by its role in guiding successful social struggles and revolutions in every part of the world. Marxism is not a rigid dogma, but relies on the scientific method to analyze and change society, so it is constantly developing and adapting as society itself changes.

And remember...these people endorsed Obama.

 

[tooAlive]

I find it funny how some people still believe communism works.

Home » cpusa

Here's just some of their bullshit.

Marxist ideas have been elaborated and modernized by other great revolutionaries such as Vladimir Lenin, Ho Chi Minh and Fidel Castro.

The validity of Marxism has been repeatedly demonstrated by its role in guiding successful social struggles and revolutions in every part of the world. Marxism is not a rigid dogma, but relies on the scientific method to analyze and change society, so it is constantly developing and adapting as society itself changes.

And remember...these people endorsed Obama.

Of course they did. Today's democrats are practically communists. They paint the wealthy as greedy exploiters, and push to make everything an entitlement.

 

[Cecilie1200]

The "it" in the above quote refers to who or what?

Whichever lame, failed attempt at communism one wishes to choose from history, all of which you are pre-emptively dismissing in essentially the fashion I demonstrated.

So what was your first language, since it clearly wasn't English?

So no nation has practiced Marxian communism, right?

::snore:: You are just NOT going to give up trying, are you? Deliberately obtuseness is not the way to go with me, Snookums. You and I both know that many nations have tried Marxism; none of them have made it work. We both ALSO know that you refuse to hear anything unless you can take it as a chance to say, "Ah ha! It's still untested!"

We're done here.

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

I find it funny how some people still believe communism works.

Home » cpusa

Here's just some of their bullshit.

And remember...these people endorsed Obama.

Of course they did. Today's democrats are practically communists. They paint the wealthy as greedy exploiters, and push to make everything an entitlement.

so true!! Barry had two communist parents and voted to the left of Bernie Sanders, the only open communist in the Senate.

Does anyone wonder why the liberals spied for Stalin and gave him the bomb??

Norman Thomas quotes:
The American people will never knowingly adopt Socialism. But under the name of 'liberalism' they will adopt every fragment of the Socialist program, until one day America will be a Socialist nation, without knowing how it happened.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Yes there are. These people call themselves "liberals" or "progressives." Every time they demand the rich "pay their fair share" they are wishing for communism.

God you're a fucking idiot, son. I failed you.

You've obviously run out of arguments. But then, you never had any.

He's also apparently hallucinating that he's your father.

 

[Cecilie1200]

The CPUSA has officially given up on communism too.

Suuuure they have, honey. That's why it's still in their name, and all over their mission statement.

 

[Cecilie1200]

How am I to argue with a delusional idiot who creates fantasies for himself? You believe that liberals and progressives are somehow "communists" and your premise is so fucking far fetched that you know it, and so you resort to creating an imaginary world for yourself that helps you choke it down.

There's nothing at all far fetched about it. Go check out the platform of the American Communist Party. There isn't a thing on it that any libturd in this forum would disagree with - including you.

THERE ARE LESS THAN THREE THOUSAND MEMBERS IN THE AMERICAN COMMUNIST PARTY.

You understand big and small numbers, right son?

There are more KKK members nationally than there are members of the American Communist Party.

Who the fuck dropped you on your god damn head?

You seem to be under the odd delusion that the number of people who willingly and openly accept an ideology under its own name is somehow relevant to something. The problem is ALWAYS the "useful idiots", as Lenin called them, who can be persuaded to embrace that ideology unwittingly.

Take a bow, Useful Idiot.