Casey Anthony

[MaggieMae]

I didn't even notice the poll was gone.
Um..I don't wanna ask him. He skeers me. You guys ask him.
Start a poll, leave it open, as a mod to merge it with this one. Then nobody has to disturb the bear in his den, cuz I know I ain't!!

If a merge happens, you won't want to return. It will be so cluttered you won't know where you left off or where to begin again, and you might just decide not to play at all. This one's already up to over 800 posts. Whoever tought up the "merge" idea on major stories du jour should be shot at dawn. (Now if that comment doesn't bring Gunny rushing in to give me a lashing, nothing will. So you can ask him to re-up the poll then.)

 

[MaggieMae]

I don't know about anyone else, but for myself, I plan on going only by what is said and proven or shown and examied/cross examined in the court proceeding on TV as it progresses. I am pretending to be in the jury. Outside transcripts/blogs, websites the jurors cannot see or read, I will not click on any more.
But that's me.

I'm a little concerned to twice hear one of the inside reporters says that the jury doesn't seem to be taking notes at all. WHAT? That indicates to me, they've already made up their minds and it won't be good news for Casey.

 

[Texas Writer]

Good Mornin' Y'all.

Sorry, I haven't checked in before this, but I spent last night lost in the reading transcripts from Hell and this morning in a video conference.

Wow. So much information to go through and absorb.
I thought the research for my books was all consuming, I can't even imagine doing this for a living.

Anyway -- a few WOW moments from reading over here:

Case Documents Released*|*

"Toxicology testing detected no drugs."

They tested for Caylee's hair for eleven different types of drugs, but oddly enough did not test for Chloroform.

Why the Hell wouldn't they test for that? That's the State's entire case.

Well I don't recall the opening where the State claimed that.

That hair from car shows decomposition (page 2, 1st document) and residue of chlorophorm in other items tested from the trunk (page 2, 5th document)
LINK

And . . .

"Duct tape had been placed on her head while her body was still fresh or while she was alive."
"This duct tape was clearly placed prior to decomposition, keeping the mandible in place."

Hmmm . . . really.

THAT is the states entire case.

There's also a really sad exchange of emails between Cindy and her brother, Rick. He's pleading for her to quit acting and looking like a moron and also talks about George's family and his families history of "mental illness". :-o

Again, if you're really interested in the facts of this case -- this is a great site full of transcripts of sworn statements, DNA information and evidence reports.

Again, George is not really on trial. Cayse is.

Did you even take the time to glance through the link I posted the other day on Chloroform/Chlorine? And how Chlorine can break down and turn into chloroform?

"Chloroform can be formed during the break-down of chlorine-containing compounds, and may be found in in small amounts in chlorinated drinking or swimming pool water."

And before you start citing the massive amounts of chloroform supposedly found in the trunk, please consider that different amounts of chlorine could break down to different amounts of chloroform -- ie say if a pool had just been shocked.

The "Air Science" that the State is using, I think, will really be up for grabs. Seeing as this air science we're talking about has never been introduced as evidence in a criminal case and that for I'm sure it will turn into a battle of experts who do/don't belive in it.

And this fact may be why the State didn't test for Chloroform during the autopsy:

"Chloroform is rapidly flushed from the body. Chloroform can be measured in exhaled breath, urine, blood, and other tissues, but no reliable method exists to determine the level of your exposure. Because chloroform can be formed in the body following exposure to other substances, levels found in tests cannot always be linked to just chloroform exposure."

Yeah, about that duct tape theory. The medical examiners report.

"Duct tape had been placed on her head while her body was still fresh or while she was alive."

Looks like the jury has their work cut out for them.

BTW -- I mentioned the part about George and his family, because mental illness can and does run in families and I thought it was odd that the DT didn't opt for that kind of defense.

 

[Texas Writer]

Gotta run for a while -- be back later to read the most assured response to above post.

 

[MaggieMae]

Does Casey seem disinterested in Lee's words?

Yes, sounds like Lee doesn't trust JB too much in that interview

It's so interesting how different people read different things into the testimony. I saw Lee as being very hesitant to say anything that would directly go against Casey's actions, especially when he was being questioned by Frank and/or the lady prosecutor (can't think of her name). Later, when we saw the taped visits between Lee and Stacy at the jail, Lee seemed determined to sleuth out the truth, not just of Stacy's activities, but of all the other activities of those involved. Two years have passed since then, and it sure didn't appear to me that Lee had uncovered a whole lot of information that would indict Stacy and he wasn't about to be led down that path by the prosecution. Of course the parade of reporters all decided that Lee's demeanor seemed to indicate he was bored. Uh huh...

 

[MaggieMae]

JB is an idiot.

He is asking question to the head detective and has been sustained because his snark of "you aren't looking at the jury this time. Look at the jury and tell us......"........................Sustained.

He IS a jerk. Very unqualified, in my opinion. I can only hope one of the others leads when it's the defense's turn. Of course an inadequate defense is excellent grounds for a new trial on appeal.

 

[LawKitteh]

Can the jury use that as an excuse even though JB didn't claim any diminished capacity. Or am I an idiot and he did in a round about way?

I don't care if she is medically speaking insane or not. The punishment should be death imo


eta: This mornings tapes. "Hi, how are you?" cheerful and giggle giggle.
"My heart is aching, I just want to be back with my family" "I just want to get out of here" Each time Caylee is an after thought

The jury is supposed to apply the law that will be given by the judge before deliberation, but that doesn't mean that members of the jury won't let their subjective emotions come into play, especially during the penalty phase. They may find her guilty but decide to be 'merciful' by not giving her the death penalty because of her mental state. I'm sure it will be brought up as one of the mitigating factors against the death penalty.

JB didn't actually come out and say anything about "diminished capacity", but his opening statement did suggest that there might be mental issues with the whole family stemming from the alleged sexual abuse and alleged cover-up of an accidental drowning. He suggested that the entire family has a history of covering up things (like Casey being pregnant). And now I hear he wants to bring in a new expert witness to testify about how different people go through the grieving process. I'm wondering if this expert is going to say that this family and especially Casey did not behave as most normal people do when it comes to grieving, further making the case that there are serious mental issues with the family and that's why Casey has acted so unconcerned and fabricated such elaborate lies about her life.

 

[MaggieMae]

Watching the first visit CA had with Lee while she is in jail.
I find it very odd how much he is treating her with kid gloves. Everyone so far has treated her with kid gloves during that process, like they are afraid of her. Why be afraid? Because she and only she can tell them what happened and IS a vindictive bitch as she herself claimed. Anyone else get what I'm saying?

I find this very sad that even her own family members have to tippytoe around her to try to save or find HER daughter. This bitch, I hope is found guilty and disposed of.

Their reason might be that they think if she is upset even more, she might just go on the lam once out on bail. Another reason is that the press follows every member of the family around 24/7, and with a trial coming up, they probably didn't want any more publicity about family fighting.

 

[R.D.]

Does Casey seem disinterested in Lee's words?

Yes, sounds like Lee doesn't trust JB too much in that interview

It's so interesting how different people read different things into the testimony. I saw Lee as being very hesitant to say anything that would directly go against Casey's actions, especially when he was being questioned by Frank and/or the lady prosecutor (can't think of her name). Later, when we saw the taped visits between Lee and Stacy at the jail, Lee seemed determined to sleuth out the truth, not just of Stacy's activities, but of all the other activities of those involved. Two years have passed since then, and it sure didn't appear to me that Lee had uncovered a whole lot of information that would indict Stacy and he wasn't about to be led down that path by the prosecution. Of course the parade of reporters all decided that Lee's demeanor seemed to indicate he was bored. Uh huh...

Oh I agree with you as to when he was on the stand.

Before we were (at least I was ) discussing the jail tapes. JB even went so far as to have the Judge make sure the jury does not take the comments about him into consideration when deliberating. JB felt they diminished his credibility in the eyes of the jury. Dum-dum was to have addressed that in January

 

[MaggieMae]

Does anybody know at what point NPD, manipulating, pathelogical liar becomes a "out of touch" in a clinical sense?

Casey is in her "own little world". How is she not insane?

Honest question. Not being snarky.

She's disassociated from reality, but I don't know what the clinical diagnosis is. When the defense begins, they will be questioning at least one psychiatrist on her state of mind, and she was also seeing a prison psychiatrist on a daily basis all during the time she was locked up.

My personal impression is that Stacy at some point developed an alter personality. She is so believable when talking about this Zanny person, I think Casey herself was Zanny (or other invisible babysitters) when she had to be. There were also two other nannies with different names that she mentioned. Her communication was almost exclusively done by texting, not by her own voice, which also raises an identity question for me.

Stacy couldn't deal with the tragic death of her daughter (however it happened), and it may have been the final event that pushed her over the edge, which is when Zanny the Nannie took over and started babysitting. That kept Caylee alive in Stacy's mind.

 

[R.D.]

Does anybody know at what point NPD, manipulating, pathelogical liar becomes a "out of touch" in a clinical sense?

Casey is in her "own little world". How is she not insane?

Honest question. Not being snarky.

She's disassociated from reality, but I don't know what the clinical diagnosis is. When the defense begins, they will be questioning at least one psychiatrist on her state of mind, and she was also seeing a prison psychiatrist on a daily basis all during the time she was locked up.

My personal impression is that Stacy at some point developed an alter personality. She is so believable when talking about this Zanny person, I think Casey herself was Zanny (or other invisible babysitters) when she had to be. There were also two other nannies with different names that she mentioned. Her communication was almost exclusively done by texting, not by her own voice, which also raises an identity question for me.

Stacy couldn't deal with the tragic death of her daughter (however it happened), and it may have been the final event that pushed her over the edge, which is when Zanny the Nannie took over and started babysitting. That kept Caylee alive in Stacy's mind.

Zanny existed long before Caylee died

 

[SFC Ollie]

Oh my God, I just had a very disturbing thought.

Many people actually name their cars. If Casey called he car Zanny that poor baby could have spent many a night in the trunk before she died.

 

[R.D.]

Gotta run for a while -- be back later to read the most assured response to above post.

You won't get one from me


I am not interested in trashing the family or defending them, they are not on trial. I am interested in the trial itself. Not what coulda or shoulda. So no, I didn't click your link. I trust the LE and State did what was necessary and the defense will tell us what to ignore. I'll wait on that.

I don't mean to be snarky and I know you don't agree with me, I just think it's in the best intrests of honest debate at this point and time to deal with only what is put in front of the jury. For example, the jail tapes. I am even more convinced that the defense accusations of molestation are false. The same goes for the attempts to make the whole family the same as cayse .....she alone is the problem.

 

[Grace]

Gotta run for a while -- be back later to read the most assured response to above post.

You won't get one from me


I am not interested in trashing the family or defending them, they are not on trial. I am interested in the trial itself. Not what coulda or shoulda. So no, I didn't click your link. I trust the LE and State did what was necessary and the defense will tell us what to ignore. I'll wait on that.

I don't mean to be snarky and I know you don't agree with me, I just think it's in the best intrests of honest debate at this point and time to deal with only what is put in front of the jury. For example, the jail tapes. I am even more convinced that the defense accusations of molestation are false. The same goes for the attempts to make the whole family the same as cayse .....she alone is the problem.

 

[Grace]

Oh my God, I just had a very disturbing thought.

Many people actually name their cars. If Casey called he car Zanny that poor baby could have spent many a night in the trunk before she died.

Well...Zany being the car is something I didn't think of but I do believe caylee has seen the inside of that trunk quite a few times while mom was out partying.
I think Zany is xanax. Which is what she used to knock her out so she would sleep quietly.

 

[JimH52]

I have never seen anyone who has left such a long list of lies and deception. I don't know how you believe a word this woman says.

 

[JimH52]

I don't know about anyone else, but for myself, I plan on going only by what is said and proven or shown and examied/cross examined in the court proceeding on TV as it progresses. I am pretending to be in the jury. Outside transcripts/blogs, websites the jurors cannot see or read, I will not click on any more.
But that's me.

I'm a little concerned to twice hear one of the inside reporters says that the jury doesn't seem to be taking notes at all. WHAT? That indicates to me, they've already made up their minds and it won't be good news for Casey.

Honestly, what does the Defense have? They have already presented their theory of how the child died. That was a huge mistake, in my estimation. The Presecution has presentled, knowingly or unknowingly, evidence that directly contradicts the defense theory. The Defense is now stuck with the lame theory. There is no way that they can go back on the drowning theory. I think she is cooked.

 

[Dabs]

I didn't even notice the poll was gone.
Um..I don't wanna ask him. He skeers me. You guys ask him.
Start a poll, leave it open, as a mod to merge it with this one. Then nobody has to disturb the bear in his den, cuz I know I ain't!!

If a merge happens, you won't want to return. It will be so cluttered you won't know where you left off or where to begin again, and you might just decide not to play at all. This one's already up to over 800 posts. Whoever tought up the "merge" idea on major stories du jour should be shot at dawn. (Now if that comment doesn't bring Gunny rushing in to give me a lashing, nothing will. So you can ask him to re-up the poll then.)

No, we just wanted the poll re-opened. I asked, and was told to start a new poll, which I did, just as Grace as orginally done. Altho, if everyone will notice, the decisions have shifted somewhat!

 

[Grace]

I don't know about anyone else, but for myself, I plan on going only by what is said and proven or shown and examied/cross examined in the court proceeding on TV as it progresses. I am pretending to be in the jury. Outside transcripts/blogs, websites the jurors cannot see or read, I will not click on any more.
But that's me.

I'm a little concerned to twice hear one of the inside reporters says that the jury doesn't seem to be taking notes at all. WHAT? That indicates to me, they've already made up their minds and it won't be good news for Casey.

Honestly, what does the Defense have? They have already presented their theory of how the child died. That was a huge mistake, in my estimation. The Presecution has presentled, knowingly or unknowingly, evidence that directly contradicts the defense theory. The Defense is now stuck with the lame theory. There is no way that they can go back on the drowning theory. I think she is cooked.

I agree with maggie. No notes. And one was even napping.

Know who to put this on? Defense. What a fucked up opening statement he did. From what I've seen, even the parents were concerned about JB being her defense attorney. He sucks.

 

[Dabs]

Does anyone else notice, again I ask...about the homicide part??
The autopsy states Caylee's death was a homicide, by undetermined means. That means she was murdered. Somebody killed her.
How can they keep talking about an accidental drowning??
Accidental drowning is not a homicide.
Damn, I am so confused.