Colorado is after this guy.

[dblack]

Yes. Let's.

Everybody here knows damn well that if it were a Muslim baker, you would be saying NONE of these things

Heck, a Muslim baker could lop off the head of the tranny and you would be here refusing to say there is anything wrong with it, you would be ridiculing those who objected to it by indicating it was funny and you would be demanding people attack some christians, instead.

Now you are being pathetic and silly. In Colorado, if they serve the public they cannot discrimminate. Sorry you are too dense to comprehend it

In the United States the First guarantees an indivudual the right to freedom of religion, it shall not be stifled nor infringed That overrides any PA law.

A Constituional right is paramount.

It is not unlimited however and that is the issue to be resolved...at what point does one right overrule another? I think on one side there are thise clearly trying to bait and set up people like the baker but on the other side ther are people stretching the meaning of religious freedom until it becomes a thin veneer to mask blatent discrimmination.

The man is a Christian. In Christianity homosexuality is clearly sinful. He's within his constitutional rights to refuse.

These gays targeting these Christians and yes they are can easily find a baker to accomodate them but instead they're pushing it. Then absolutely shocked when the push back begins.

It is not unlimited however and that is the issue to be resolved...at what point does one right overrule another?

If there actually were two rights conflicting, you'd have a point. Cake is not a right.

You are right, cake isnt.. However...that is not the right in question.

I agree. Ultimately, it's a free speech issue.

 

[Bob Blaylock]

It is not unlimited however and that is the issue to be resolved...at what point does one right overrule another?

If there actually were two rights conflicting, you'd have a point. Cake is not a right.

And neither is the use of another person's labor or resources, even if you're willing to pay for them.

 

[JoeB131]

For that level of "discrimination" the result shouldn't be "bake or die"

Sorry, guy, I wasn't paying attention... when did someone threaten to kill the Homophobic baker? It was more like, "Follow the law or pay a fine just like anyone else who breaks the law would pay a fine."

He's a sad little man. A person who upon his departure from this life will make the rest of our lives better.

And yet you are the one losing your shit... speaking of things that make you lose your shit.

B-b-b-but it's a PRIVATE business!!!! You know, like Facebook?

Tell me guys, with no consistent principles, how do you keep track of which side you're on in any given argument? I guess it just depends on which party is pushing which argument that day. Or maybe which way the wind is blowing?

Private businesses have to comply with the law.

Look the argument here isn't that PA laws are wrong. If he refused to bake a cake just because he hates gays or blacks, there would be no issue here. He'd be in violation of the law, period. Fine paid.

The argument he is making here is that the law we all agreed was perfectly sensible should have an exemption because of a supposedly sincere religious belief.

It would be as ridiculous as claiming that the murder laws shouldn't apply to me if I claim to be a worshiper of Quetzalcoatl and I should be able to cut out the hearts of my enemies as long as I use a traditional obsidian knife.

This has nothing to do with Facebook deciding that they no longer want to be a party to Alex Jones' libelous claims.

 

[JoeB131]

So, a muslim baker can be forced to make Matzo for a Jew? Just wondering....

If they already sold Matzo cakes, um... yeah. Wouldn't be an issue.

The funny thing is they don't realize they are being the assholes here. They have to win 100%, no compromise.

Again, I've known gays who have been fired for being gay, I've known gays who've been beaten up for being gay. Gay folks have "compromised" quite enough with the haters.

So do I. PA laws highlight the hypocrisy and authoritarianism inherent in 'social democracy'.

Quite the contrary, they are law and order.

You see, the Anarchist view (not Libertarians, who just play at being anarchists) would be, the Homophobic baker can refuse to bake the cake, but the gays can burn down his shop if he doesn't. That would be bad.

The liberal view is, the gays should be able to get a cake, but if the homophobic baker doesn't like it, he can find something else to do for a living. But if someone tries to burn down his shop, they'll be arrested.

What you want is a law that protects only the rights of one side. Of course, it's the side with money and property.

 

[JoeB131]

The people in question don't discriminate when it comes to point of sale items, only for custom items for specific events.

And this guy won't even make halloween cakes due to his religious beliefs.

No person in his store is turned away from point of sale items, i.e. the Public Accommodation portion of his business.

Oh, please society, please can I have this little corner where I'm allowed to hate people who are different than me in peace? Pretty please?

Um.. no.

If your religious beliefs are such that you hate gay people so much you can't provide services for them, FIND SOMETHING ELSE to do for a living.

Hey, here's a funny thing. You only want this to provide these special rights to business owners, not workers. If some Clerk said, "I'm not serving this Mormon because Joseph Smith was a con man!" his ass would be fired so fast, his head would spin, and you'd have no problem with it.

 

[JoeB131]

What is the benefit to society of forcing this guy out of business or to go against his morals?

Besides the micro-boner you get from being a statist twat, of course.

It serves as a warning to all the other haters, "um, yeah, that would be a bad idea, let's not do that."

Kind of the benefit of society of ALL punishment, isn't it?

Once again for the brain dead a wedding is a PRIVATE event, the baker sells all of his publicly sold goods to everybody. Let me know the next time a wedding is a public event that everyone can come too, m'kay...

But he sells the cakes publicly, so this isn't an issue.

In this case, BTW, the Homophobic Baker refused to sell a birthday cake, which was pink with blue frosting, which he had no problem with until he found out the guy who wanted it was a tranny.

In short, he was all cool with it until he found out WHO it was for.

Was he being set up? Probably. Sucks to be him, doesn't it?

 

[JoeB131]

Never eat a cake that you had to force someone to bake for you.
Troglocrats are dumb.

Wedding cakes aren't about eating so much as they are about the symbolism. (Which isn't even a Christian thing, it's a pagan thing that carried over into Christianity.)

It's pretty much the same thing as forcing a Jewish Deli to make you a ham sandwich.
It's just pure hate.
CO will have to get another lesson on the 1st amendment.
Troglocrats are dumb.

Not really. The only "lesson" they got was that they were mean to Mr. Homophobe when one of them pointed out that lots of bad stuff has been justified with religion.

this case is more clear cut. He was willing to make the cake as ordered until he found out who it was for.

Yes, he does. He has generic cakes that are sold to everyone, HIS creative work though, is not. That is called a Right. A Right that no matter how much you rail you can't deny, which is why you wish to destroy the Bill of Rights. All dictator loving swine do. Hello swine

And what do you do when rights contradict? The old saying is, "Your right to swing your arm ends at my nose". The thing was, he had a generic cake that was ordered here, and refused to sell it when he found out the person who wanted it was Trans.

 

[Mac1958]

The Regressive Left is really into "the law" 'n stuff. The offended couple had NO CHOICE but to file a complaint. Just letting it go wasn't an option. This baker absolutely had to be punished to the fullest extent of the law for their hideous transgression.

But bring up illegal immigration or dozens of kids being slaughtered on the streets of Chicago over the weekend, and there's something wrong with YOU.


.

 

[JoeB131]

Lets be consistent. Even private entities have to obey the law. FB also states it's ToS up front.

The problem with Facebook is that they don't consistently apply their TOS. They only do it if someone complains.

A friend of my racist brother once complained to me that Facebook blocked her account after she called Obama that word we can't use on USMB.

 

[JoeB131]

The Regressive Left is really into "the law" 'n stuff. The offended couple had NO CHOICE but to file a complaint. Just letting it go wasn't an option. This baker absolutely had to be punished to the fullest extent of the law for their hideous transgression.

But bring up illegal immigration or dozens of kids being slaughtered in Chicago over the weekend, and there's something wrong with YOU.

I wasn't aware that murder suddenly became legal in Chicago, Stormy Mac. I must have missed the memo. Last time I checked, the cop will still arrest you for that.

As for illegal immigration, the problem is, everyone knows those laws don't work.

PA Laws work just fine, they've worked just fine for 50 years.

 

[JoeB131]

And for point of sale items he doesn't refuse anyone.

Only for specific contracted specialty items does he say what he wants to do, and what he doesn't want to do.

But he can't break the law in those contracts, that's the point, buddy.

Plus this guy is far more consistent than most. No Halloween special cakes, not bachelor party special cakes.

Meh, not really. frankly, if he were consistent, he wouldn't make ANY wedding cakes. Wedding cakes are mentioned nowhere in the bible. It is in fact a Pagan Roman tradition that carried into Christianity.

If he were "consistent', he would also refuse service to couples who line in cohabitation, women who wear pants, women who wear braids, women who wear jewelry, any dude with a tattoo, chicks who aren't virgins on their wedding nights (that'd be a hard one to check).

again, this isn't about a wedding cake, this is about a cake with special coloring he had no problem making until he was informed about the significance of the colors.

It doesn't matter. It is a PRIVATE CONTRACTED SERVICE. How plain does it have to be made to you? PA laws do NOT EVER APPLY to private contracted services. EVER!

Except the law has found they can.

There's actually a pretty simple solution. Take the money, and then subcontract out the work to someone who isn't a bigot.

 

[Carl in Michigan]

Oh, please society, please can I have this little corner where I'm allowed to hate people who are different than me in peace? Pretty please?

It's not "hate" you ignorant tard. He's not using his labor to SUPPORT a lifestyle that all but the insane understand to be wrong.

Do you HATE a child if you tell him not to touch a hot stove?

.you sure seem invested in denying this man his basic freedoms. Your hate for Christianity has been noted.

 

[JoeB131]

Oh BS it was no "birthday" cake. What a bunch of fucking nonsense

Take your PA and politically correct shit and stick it. Leave the man alone

Except he had no problem with a pink frosting on a blue cake when he was told it was a birthday cake. When he was told, "Oh yeah, and I'm ALSO celebrating my transition to being a woman", Bible boy freaked.

 

[JoeB131]

It's not "hate" you ignorant tard. He's not using his labor to SUPPORT a lifestyle that all but the insane understand to be wrong.

Do you HATE a child if you tell him not to touch a hot stove?

again, there's real damage to touching a hot stove.

the only problem with being gay is your obsession. You see, I'm straight. One of my dearest friends is a gay woman. Really, what kind of sex she has is none of my business. If she's in a relationship that makes her happy, I'm okay with that.

Hey you know what, we all have to deal with people we don't like and don't approve of professionally. And we suck it up (no pun intended) and get the job done, because that's the job.

 

[JoeB131]

Yep. Ignoring the fact that this is all so obviously a set up as the tranny chose this specific baker quite intentionally in order to harass, if the baker refused to sell him,her a cookie off the rack, that would be a matter of public accommodation. Requiring a baker to sign off on an agenda isn't.

Fair minded people understand this. Only those who place their agenda above all else don't.

You know what else is a set up... The Cop who hides at the long stretch of road where the speed limit isn't clearly marked.

This baker was fine with making a custom cake, until he told it was for a Trans person.

Just like Facebookburning and Alex Jones, amiright?

Quite the contrary, Facebook probably realized if they continued to carry Jones, and the Sandy Hook families won their defamation case in court, they could be held liable.

 

[Carl in Michigan]

Whine about this all you want. The baker's gonna win. The Constitution is on his side.

This violates every aspect of the Constitution.

 

[JoeB131]

…Including the Constitution itself. The First Amendment is quite clear enough about freedoms of expression, religion, conscience, and association. Coyote, like most left wrong-wing filth, is all too willing to violate the highest law of this nation, if she doesn't like how it is applied, all the while hypocritically playing empty lip service to “the rule of law”.

Um, no. Freedom of religion doesn't give you the right to violate other laws.

It's why you Mormons can't have plural marriages anymore.

So let's break this down. If I as an atheist refused to provide a service because I didn't like you because you were gay or black or Mormon, I would be in clear violation of Public Accommodation laws, because I was discriminating. Pretty clear, isn't it?

But if I did that because I made up a bullshit religious excuse, does it suddenly become okay? Because I could make a pretty good religious argument about why not serving Mormons is part of my religious beliefs.

 

[JoeB131]

In the United States the First guarantees an indivudual the right to freedom of religion, it shall not be stifled nor infringed That overrides any PA law.

A Constituional right is paramount.

Um, no, it isn't. It doesn't exempt you from other laws.

It's why I can't go out and kill my Wiccan ex-Girlfriend because the Bible says, "Thou Shall not Suffer a Witch to Live".

Probably my mistake for dating a Wiccan to start with.. but never mind.

 

[JoeB131]

And neither is the use of another person's labor or resources, even if you're willing to pay for them.

Except when you promise your labor or resources for sale, you have to provide them if someone has the money.

 

[JoeB131]

.you sure seem invested in denying this man his basic freedoms. Your hate for Christianity has been noted.

Naw, he has his basic freedoms. He's totally free to go to his little church every Sunday and grovel in front of his imaginary friend in the sky and totally miss the point that Jesus was trying to make. Freedom, baby.

What he can't do is break the laws the rest of us have agreed to as being fair and sensible.

If we've all agreed that you should have access to public services and accommodations no matter your race, religion, gender or sexual orientation, then that's the law. It's pretty simple.