Common sense gun regulations--need to be passed now.

[Spare_change]

Yeah --- I've given this issue a lot of thought.

Now, why is this happening with increasing regularity?

We had guns 50-60-70 years ago. Why didn't it happen then, or at this pace? Is it simply because the population is higher, and therefore, you are going to have a corresponding increase in "nuts" who will do these kinds of things? The numbers don't support that.

What has changed in the last 50-60-70 years? Why are youth so callous about others that they will take their lives? Why do we have mass shootings? Why do we have massive shootings in Chicago, New York, Atlanta, Dallas, St. Louis, or New York?

We have created an "epidemic of lack of respect". Our children don't respect their parents, their teachers, police, or any authority figures. They don't care about others - they only care about their own self-satisfaction. Anything that interferes with their happiness is necessarily bad and must be removed, whether it be speeches or people. So - the question is why.

The most significant social change in the past 50 years is the secularization of our society. We no longer go to church, we don't believe in God, we don't adhere to a single moral code. Instead, we have moral relativism, in which moral ethics are determined based on the situation, rather than a strict code. We self-justify our actions. We twist our moral standards in order to justify our own grievous actions. Our children saw us do this - they live with it every day.

This lack of strict moral fiber - frankly, taught and demonstrated by our generation - creates a younger generation that has no respect for the value of life of others. They can self-justify their actions. They do not consider the impact on others, because frankly, they just don't care. They don't commit to each other - their only concern is their own personal satisfaction.

Every one of us here are going to say - Oh no, not my kids. I raised them right! But, the cold, hard reality is that each one of us, somewhere in our extended family, has somebody who either has broken the law, hurt somebody, or justified hurting someone because of their own, selfish concerns. He got her pregnant - and just walked away. He robbed a liquor store - to get money for drugs. He's mean to his parents. He had trouble in school because he just wouldn't listen to the teachers. On and on and on .... it might not be your children, it might be your sister's children, it might be your neighbor's children.

We don't demand respect, and we don't demand they respect others. THAT is the lesson we've taught them. Instead, they practice expediency, selfishness, and moral relativism. Someone once said - as ye sow, so shall ye reap - well, we're reaping what we have sown now.

 

[Brain357]

Yeah --- I've given this issue a lot of thought.

Now, why is this happening with increasing regularity?

We had guns 50-60-70 years ago. Why didn't it happen then, or at this pace? Is it simply because the population is higher, and therefore, you are going to have a corresponding increase in "nuts" who will do these kinds of things? The numbers don't support that.

What has changed in the last 50-60-70 years? Why are youth so callous about others that they will take their lives? Why do we have mass shootings? Why do we have massive shootings in Chicago, New York, Atlanta, Dallas, St. Louis, or New York?

We have created an "epidemic of lack of respect". Our children don't respect their parents, their teachers, police, or any authority figures. They don't care about others - they only care about their own self-satisfaction. Anything that interferes with their happiness is necessarily bad and must be removed, whether it be speeches or people. So - the question is why.

The most significant social change in the past 50 years is the secularization of our society. We no longer go to church, we don't believe in God, we don't adhere to a single moral code. Instead, we have moral relativism, in which moral ethics are determined based on the situation, rather than a strict code. We self-justify our actions. We twist our moral standards in order to justify our own grievous actions. Our children saw us do this - they live with it every day.

This lack of strict moral fiber - frankly, taught and demonstrated by our generation - creates a younger generation that has no respect for the value of life of others. They can self-justify their actions. They do not consider the impact on others, because frankly, they just don't care. They don't commit to each other - their only concern is their own personal satisfaction.

Every one of us here are going to say - Oh no, not my kids. I raised them right! But, the cold, hard reality is that each one of us, somewhere in our extended family, has somebody who either has broken the law, hurt somebody, or justified hurting someone because of their own, selfish concerns. He got her pregnant - and just walked away. He robbed a liquor store - to get money for drugs. He's mean to his parents. He had trouble in school because he just wouldn't listen to the teachers. On and on and on .... it might not be your children, it might be your sister's children, it might be your neighbor's children.

We don't demand respect, and we don't demand they respect others. THAT is the lesson we've taught them. Instead, they practice expediency, selfishness, and moral relativism. Someone once said - as ye sow, so shall ye reap - well, we're reaping what we have sown now.

70 years ago semi-autos with high capacity magazines weren't common. That has changed in the last 30 years.

 

[2aguy]

You see that entire list...a list of public shootings.....in a country that banned and confiscated guns....the only thing that keeps those shootings from being mass public shootings is the decision of the shooter, who is shooting people, to not shoot more people, or he simply fails to kill all the people he shoots...

And you respond with that stupidity........

Typical.

Stupid is not recognizing it is a US problem. Nobody else has regular school shootings.

Moron...we know it is a problem, you asswipes just don't have the solution...we do. You get rid of gun free zones and allow some staff, with training, to carry guns....

Funny, mass shootings aren't a problem where there is strong gun control.

Other countries do not have the Second Amendment, firearm ownership is not a right in those countries… So your point is not valid

Antonin Scalia says 2nd Amendment has its limits

Yes......and since you won't list what he said, you are lying by omission...

Felons and the dangerously mentally ill can be kept from owning guns.....those are the limits....

 

[2aguy]

Yeah --- I've given this issue a lot of thought.

Now, why is this happening with increasing regularity?

We had guns 50-60-70 years ago. Why didn't it happen then, or at this pace? Is it simply because the population is higher, and therefore, you are going to have a corresponding increase in "nuts" who will do these kinds of things? The numbers don't support that.

What has changed in the last 50-60-70 years? Why are youth so callous about others that they will take their lives? Why do we have mass shootings? Why do we have massive shootings in Chicago, New York, Atlanta, Dallas, St. Louis, or New York?

We have created an "epidemic of lack of respect". Our children don't respect their parents, their teachers, police, or any authority figures. They don't care about others - they only care about their own self-satisfaction. Anything that interferes with their happiness is necessarily bad and must be removed, whether it be speeches or people. So - the question is why.

The most significant social change in the past 50 years is the secularization of our society. We no longer go to church, we don't believe in God, we don't adhere to a single moral code. Instead, we have moral relativism, in which moral ethics are determined based on the situation, rather than a strict code. We self-justify our actions. We twist our moral standards in order to justify our own grievous actions. Our children saw us do this - they live with it every day.

This lack of strict moral fiber - frankly, taught and demonstrated by our generation - creates a younger generation that has no respect for the value of life of others. They can self-justify their actions. They do not consider the impact on others, because frankly, they just don't care. They don't commit to each other - their only concern is their own personal satisfaction.

Every one of us here are going to say - Oh no, not my kids. I raised them right! But, the cold, hard reality is that each one of us, somewhere in our extended family, has somebody who either has broken the law, hurt somebody, or justified hurting someone because of their own, selfish concerns. He got her pregnant - and just walked away. He robbed a liquor store - to get money for drugs. He's mean to his parents. He had trouble in school because he just wouldn't listen to the teachers. On and on and on .... it might not be your children, it might be your sister's children, it might be your neighbor's children.

We don't demand respect, and we don't demand they respect others. THAT is the lesson we've taught them. Instead, they practice expediency, selfishness, and moral relativism. Someone once said - as ye sow, so shall ye reap - well, we're reaping what we have sown now.

70 years ago semi-autos with high capacity magazines weren't common. That has changed in the last 30 years.

Yes...they were common, doofus......we had fully automatic weapons accessible to the general population and we didn't have mass shootings....moron.

 

[Spare_change]

Yeah --- I've given this issue a lot of thought.

Now, why is this happening with increasing regularity?

We had guns 50-60-70 years ago. Why didn't it happen then, or at this pace? Is it simply because the population is higher, and therefore, you are going to have a corresponding increase in "nuts" who will do these kinds of things? The numbers don't support that.

What has changed in the last 50-60-70 years? Why are youth so callous about others that they will take their lives? Why do we have mass shootings? Why do we have massive shootings in Chicago, New York, Atlanta, Dallas, St. Louis, or New York?

We have created an "epidemic of lack of respect". Our children don't respect their parents, their teachers, police, or any authority figures. They don't care about others - they only care about their own self-satisfaction. Anything that interferes with their happiness is necessarily bad and must be removed, whether it be speeches or people. So - the question is why.

The most significant social change in the past 50 years is the secularization of our society. We no longer go to church, we don't believe in God, we don't adhere to a single moral code. Instead, we have moral relativism, in which moral ethics are determined based on the situation, rather than a strict code. We self-justify our actions. We twist our moral standards in order to justify our own grievous actions. Our children saw us do this - they live with it every day.

This lack of strict moral fiber - frankly, taught and demonstrated by our generation - creates a younger generation that has no respect for the value of life of others. They can self-justify their actions. They do not consider the impact on others, because frankly, they just don't care. They don't commit to each other - their only concern is their own personal satisfaction.

Every one of us here are going to say - Oh no, not my kids. I raised them right! But, the cold, hard reality is that each one of us, somewhere in our extended family, has somebody who either has broken the law, hurt somebody, or justified hurting someone because of their own, selfish concerns. He got her pregnant - and just walked away. He robbed a liquor store - to get money for drugs. He's mean to his parents. He had trouble in school because he just wouldn't listen to the teachers. On and on and on .... it might not be your children, it might be your sister's children, it might be your neighbor's children.

We don't demand respect, and we don't demand they respect others. THAT is the lesson we've taught them. Instead, they practice expediency, selfishness, and moral relativism. Someone once said - as ye sow, so shall ye reap - well, we're reaping what we have sown now.

70 years ago semi-autos with high capacity magazines weren't common. That has changed in the last 30 years.

Given that the semi-auto rifle was invented in 1885, the first semi-automatic pistol in 1892, and the first semi-automatic shotgun in 1902, I'm guessing your argument doesn't hold much water.

None of those, however, explain the increase in frequency of these incidents. It ain't the gun - it's the shooter.

 

[2aguy]

how many mass shootings in japan ,,in australia land??

How many mass shootings or how many murders in general? After the 1996 gun ban in Australia they saw higher homicide rates in 1997, 1999, 2000, and 2002. They've seen small spikes and small decreases in other years.

Overall, their rate of murders has declined in the last 20 years, but so has the United States as you can see from the below statistics.

From 1991 to 2016, the murder rate fell by roughly half, from 9.8 killings per 100,000 to 5.3. The murder rate rose last year by an estimated 7.8 percent. With violence at historic lows, modest increases in the murder rate may appear large in percentage terms. Similarly, murder rates in the 30 largest cities increased by 13.2 percent in 2015 and an estimated 14 percent in 2016. These increases were highly concentrated. More than half of the 2015 urban increase (51.8 percent) was caused by just three cities, Baltimore, Chicago, and Washington, D.C. And Chicago alone was responsible for 43.7 percent of the rise in urban murders in 2016. It is important to remember the relatively small base from which the percentage increases are calculated

Crime Trends: 1990-2016

Australia's murder rate declined with a gun ban and ours declined without one. Has Australia had any mass shooting? No, but so what? A murder is a murder. What's the difference if 17 people are killed at once or 17 people are killed individually at 17 different locations. They are all equally dead. The mass shooting simply generates more shock factor and gets more media coverage, so you find it more abhorrent, but the individual victims are just as dead as the mass victims.

And as far as Japan, are you seriously comparing Japanese society to American society? Japan is a homogeneous country with one language and one culture that highly values education, personal honor, and respect for others. They are completely opposite of Americans who are ignorant and crass assholes.

yes taz murder is murder but so many at one time vs one or 2 at a time? If the guy shooting from his hotel window didn't have automatic weapons how many lives would have been saved?

The bump stock actually saved lives because as he continued to fire, it forced the gun muzzle up and over the crowd...had he fired without the bump stock he would have had more hits........

The Vegas shooter used 2 rifles, firing over 1,000 rounds of ammon into a tightly packed crowd of over 22,000 people......he murdered 58 people....

The muslim terrorist in Nice, France used a rental truck and murdered 86 in 5 minutes.....more people murdered than in each year of mass public shootings but one.......

Rental trucks kill more people....

 

[Spare_change]

A post from middle school teacher Kelly Guthrie Raley is going viral on social media for what she said was a pressing issue to fix amid the recent school shooting in the Parkland, Florida area.

Raley, who is a sixth-grade language arts teacher, was awarded the Eustis Middle School Teacher of the Year honor last month for the 2017 to 2018 school year and in the post, she said the onus for preventing future attacks rests on good parenting.

“Okay, I’ll be the bad guy and say what no one else is brave enough to say, but wants to say,” Raley said in the now-viral post. “I’ll take all the criticism and attacks from everyone because you know what? I’m a teacher.”

The teacher said she enjoys teaching and “wouldn’t do anything else,” but understands her occupation puts her in a situation like the one which recently occurred in Parkland.

“Until we, as a country, are willing to get serious and talk about mental health issues, lack of available care for the mental health issues, lack of discipline in the home, horrendous lack of parental support when the schools are trying to control horrible behavior at school (oh no! Not my kid. What did you do to cause my kid to react that way?), lack of moral values, and yes, I’ll say it-violent video games that take away all sensitivity to any compassion for others’ lives, as well as reality TV that makes it commonplace for people to constantly scream up in each others’ faces and not value any other person but themselves, we will have a gun problem in school,” the sixth-grade language arts teacher wrote. “Our kids don’t understand the permanency of death anymore!!!”

Per Fox News:

Raley, who loves hunting and four-wheeling in her spare time, added that she grew up with guns in her home.
“But you know what? My parents NEVER supported any bad behavior from me,” Raley said.

She said when she began teaching 20 years ago, she never had to worry about calling a student’s parents and getting cussed out, told to go to hell, or threatened with a public shaming all because she was calling out their child’s behavior. Something, she said, has got to change.

“I was terrified of doing something bad at school, as I would have not had a life until I corrected the problem and straightened my a** out,” Raley wrote. “My parents invaded my life. They knew where I was all the time. They made me have a curfew. They made me wake them up when I got home. They made me respect their rules.”

The teacher challenged other parents to prioritize strict parenting, to teach their children respect, and to know everything about their own children.

“Parents: it’s time to step up!” Raley wrote. “Be the parent that actually gives a crap! Be the annoying mom that pries and knows what your kid is doing. STOP being their friend. They have enough “friends” at school. Be their parent.”
---------------------------------------------------------------

She's nailed it ... the question is - do you have the balls to do anything about it?

 

[BasicHumanUnit]

Bottom line.....

Clearly the Radical Left wants to take America on a course AWAY from the Constitution that made this nation great.
The time has come that Thomas Jefferson warned us about.
Occasionally the tree of Liberty must be refreshed with the blood of Tyrants and Patriots.
We are there.

Compromise on the 2nd Amendment, and every other part of the Constitution is done

 

[ThunderKiss1965]

Well I just hope you're caught up in one of these "knee-jerk" reactions one of these days and are running for your own life.

Sandy Hook, Columbine, San Bernandino, Las Vegas, Orlando, Aurora, church in Texas, Virginia tech and south Florida two days ago--and all those other "knee jerk" reactions that have gone on across this country.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...t-weapons-in-one-post/?utm_term=.8136e2c09b3f

I tend to stay away from gun free zones so I'm not likely to get shot by a mass murder. I also live in Alabama an open carry state the cowards that target unarmed people wouldn't last long here.

I would live in Zambia before Alabama, the KKK racist white trash state

I was married to a black women and have mixed race kids and saw as much or more racism in states like NY and California then I did in Alabama so you are completely full of shit.

By the way the prevalent racism your thinking of hasn't been an issue since the days of the Democrats Jim Crow laws, segregation and the KKK was the militant arm of the party.

BULLSHIT--there is a new arm of the Republican party called the ALT-RIGHT. They came from Brietbart.com

Bannon’s Breitbart also realized that there was a large online community that naturally gravitated to Trump, a mix of people who saw themselves as far too radical to be accepted by polite society. This was the alt-right,

a collection of racists, pick-up artists, men’s rights activists, and other noxious trolls of the internet.

Steve Bannon and the alt-right: a primer

And they showed up in Charlottesville, Virgina to make a statement.

As the official start of the “Unite the Right” rally kicked off in Charlottesville, Virginia, former Ku Klux Klan leader David Duke said the gathering of white supremacists, neo-Nazis and far-right individuals pointed to a future fulfillment of President Donald Trump’s “promises.”

Ex-KKK Leader David Duke Says White Supremacists Will 'Fulfill' Trump's Promises

So don't tell me the south isn't racist, they sure as hell are. We have a few of them on this board that are more than vocal about it, and every dam one of them is a major Trump supporter.

Please show where white supremist are getting support from the RNC to run for office ?

 

[Spare_change]

how many mass shootings in japan ,,in australia land??

How many mass shootings or how many murders in general? After the 1996 gun ban in Australia they saw higher homicide rates in 1997, 1999, 2000, and 2002. They've seen small spikes and small decreases in other years.

Overall, their rate of murders has declined in the last 20 years, but so has the United States as you can see from the below statistics.

From 1991 to 2016, the murder rate fell by roughly half, from 9.8 killings per 100,000 to 5.3. The murder rate rose last year by an estimated 7.8 percent. With violence at historic lows, modest increases in the murder rate may appear large in percentage terms. Similarly, murder rates in the 30 largest cities increased by 13.2 percent in 2015 and an estimated 14 percent in 2016. These increases were highly concentrated. More than half of the 2015 urban increase (51.8 percent) was caused by just three cities, Baltimore, Chicago, and Washington, D.C. And Chicago alone was responsible for 43.7 percent of the rise in urban murders in 2016. It is important to remember the relatively small base from which the percentage increases are calculated

Crime Trends: 1990-2016

Australia's murder rate declined with a gun ban and ours declined without one. Has Australia had any mass shooting? No, but so what? A murder is a murder. What's the difference if 17 people are killed at once or 17 people are killed individually at 17 different locations. They are all equally dead. The mass shooting simply generates more shock factor and gets more media coverage, so you find it more abhorrent, but the individual victims are just as dead as the mass victims.

And as far as Japan, are you seriously comparing Japanese society to American society? Japan is a homogeneous country with one language and one culture that highly values education, personal honor, and respect for others. They are completely opposite of Americans who are ignorant and crass assholes.

yes taz murder is murder but so many at one time vs one or 2 at a time? If the guy shooting from his hotel window didn't have automatic weapons how many lives would have been saved?

The bump stock actually saved lives because as he continued to fire, it forced the gun muzzle up and over the crowd...had he fired without the bump stock he would have had more hits........

The Vegas shooter used 2 rifles, firing over 1,000 rounds of ammon into a tightly packed crowd of over 22,000 people......he murdered 58 people....

The muslim terrorist in Nice, France used a rental truck and murdered 86 in 5 minutes.....more people murdered than in each year of mass public shootings but one.......

Rental trucks kill more people....

Don't focus on the weapon --- don't respond to those who focus on the weapon.

They are not interested in solving the problem - they are only interested in being heard, advancing a political agenda.

Ignore the white noise.

 

[BasicHumanUnit]

You are right

 

[Contumacious]

OK--so this year we have 18 school shootings, and it's not even March yet. Yesterday in Florida 15 young people with their entire lives in front of them, along with 2 school teachers trying to protect them were massacred. Then we have Las Vegas. Then a church in Texas were generations of family members were wiped out. We have a movie theatre in Aurora Colorado, then San Diego were a straw buyer purchased semi-automatics for a slaugther there, and Orlando, Florida another one. And Sandy Hook where 5 to 7 year olds were slaughtered.

People have called for better gun regulations in this country and it has continually fallen on deaf ears. Republicans are owned by the NRA and right wing gun extremists.

Here are my suggestions.
1. Ban semi-automatic weapons and 30 round gun clips.
2. People with existing semi-automatics & ammo be required to keep them in a locked secure gun case, and required to maintain an insurance liability policy on that weapon in order to keep them.
3. Parents of children & teenagers are required to keep all of their guns & ammo in locked secure gun safes, inaccessible at all times to their kids.
4. No private sales. If someone wants to sell their gun, it has to be dropped off at a licensed gun dealer for resale so a background check can be done.
5. Background checks including extended mental health checks before any purchase of a gun is made.
6. Straw buyers of guns, those who buy guns for others, be under the same prosecutable standards as those that pull the trigger.
7. Those that are on a no fly list, or FBI terrorist watch list not be able to purchase any guns or ammo.

If these simple regulations were in place--there would have never been a Las Vegas, a Sandy Hook, a Columbine massacre, a church in Texas, San Diego slaughter, Orlando, Florida massacre, a Virginia Tech etc. etc. etc., and 15 young kids and 2 teachers that were killed yesterday would be here today.

You won't convince Republicans to do any of this. They are OWNED by the NRA, and right wing gun extremists, and will fight (tooth & nail) on any new gun regulations. They are more interested in the donations they get from the NRA than keeping the public and our schools safe.

If you're tired of all the condolences & sympathies, then do something about it. Vote for Democrats in the midterm election cycle this coming November for common sense gun regulations.

Common sense gun regulations--need to be passed now.

1- ABOLISH all federal laws regulating firearms , especially GUN FREE ZONES

2- Replace SCOTUS "justices" with individuals who are , at the very least, familiar with our Constitution (1787) and our 2A.

.

 

[oreo]

OK--so this year we have 18 school shootings, and it's not even March yet. Yesterday in Florida 15 young people with their entire lives in front of them, along with 2 school teachers trying to protect them were massacred. Then we have Las Vegas. Then a church in Texas were generations of family members were wiped out. We have a movie theatre in Aurora Colorado, then San Diego were a straw buyer purchased semi-automatics for a slaugther there, and Orlando, Florida another one. And Sandy Hook where 5 to 7 year olds were slaughtered.

People have called for better gun regulations in this country and it has continually fallen on deaf ears. Republicans are owned by the NRA and right wing gun extremists.

Here are my suggestions.
1. Ban semi-automatic weapons and 30 round gun clips.
2. People with existing semi-automatics & ammo be required to keep them in a locked secure gun case, and required to maintain an insurance liability policy on that weapon in order to keep them.
3. Parents of children & teenagers are required to keep all of their guns & ammo in locked secure gun safes, inaccessible at all times to their kids.
4. No private sales. If someone wants to sell their gun, it has to be dropped off at a licensed gun dealer for resale so a background check can be done.
5. Background checks including extended mental health checks before any purchase of a gun is made.
6. Straw buyers of guns, those who buy guns for others, be under the same prosecutable standards as those that pull the trigger.
7. Those that are on a no fly list, or FBI terrorist watch list not be able to purchase any guns or ammo.

If these simple regulations were in place--there would have never been a Las Vegas, a Sandy Hook, a Columbine massacre, a church in Texas, San Diego slaughter, Orlando, Florida massacre, a Virginia Tech etc. etc. etc., and 15 young kids and 2 teachers that were killed yesterday would be here today.

You won't convince Republicans to do any of this. They are OWNED by the NRA, and right wing gun extremists, and will fight (tooth & nail) on any new gun regulations. They are more interested in the donations they get from the NRA than keeping the public and our schools safe.

If you're tired of all the condolences & sympathies, then do something about it. Vote for Democrats in the midterm election cycle this coming November for common sense gun regulations.

Your approach creates nice little bromidic headlines about all the great things you are going to do to fix a problem by not addressing the real issue. Then, six months later, you'll be scratching your head about why a shooter used a car full of fertilizer instead of a gun - how he used a shotgun instead of an AR-15, how he used a samurai sword, how he used a truck, how he used a bulldozer. The tool ISN'T the problem - the disturbed individual IS the problem, and until you attack the root cause of the problem, you're just pissing in the wind.

Tell me what gun control law you would institute that would have stopped Sandy Hook, Columbine, or Parkland. Sandy Hook - kid goes off the deep end, murders his mother, breaks into her gun safe, goes to school and kills 13 people. What law is going to stop that? The "don't kill your mother" law? The "don't break into gun safes" law? Kid says on YouTube - I want to be a professional school shooter. What do you propose? A law that says we can lock him away because he had "murderous thoughts"? The ACLU would have a freakin' field day.

As for this absolute idiocy about "military style killing machines" - what if he had a shotgun instead? Frankly, using an AR-15 semi-automatic is a poor choice. A 12 gauge shotgun would be a much more effective weapon in close quarters. Shotguns using buckshot and slugs are known to be particularly brutal. Typical 00 buckshot is the rough equivalent of 9 – 12x 9mm bullets hitting a target at once and a slug is a a solid lead meat pulverizer. Buckshot maintains its lethality up to about 70 yards - how many shots in Parkland do you suppose were over 70 yards? A shotgun with slugs is roughly as lethal as your average hunting rifle with its range - about 120 yards. You can buy a SEMI-AUTOMATIC shotgun for a lot less than an AR-15. Every gun enthusiast likes an AR-15 because it LOOKS bad-ass, and every gun control enthusiast hates an AR-15 because it LOOKS bad-ass. In truth, it's a pretty poor weapon to use in a school shooting.

Banning all the AR-15s in the world won't stop what happened -because the problem isn't the gun. Yeah, but, you say - if he didn't have an AR-15, he still would have killed people - just not so many. That's a ridiculous argument. That doesn't make the first child shot, or the second, or the third, any less dead. That's attacking the symptom, not the problem, and frankly, until liberals are willing to admit that it's the individual, not the gun, we are never going to fix this problem. I recognize it makes cute headlines to advocate for gun control, but it doesn't accomplish a damn thing.

I understand - people want to do something - anything - to make it stop. It doesn't matter if it's effective, it doesn't matter if it addresses the problem. Just do SOMETHING!!!! We all want a nice, simple, safe fix that doesn't inconvenience us - one that takes away somebody's freedom, as long as it isn't mine. That simple fix doesn't exist ------ address the problem, not the symptom. The problem is mentally disturbed people who do bad things.

In the military, when we plan a mission, we identify the "risk profile" for each alternative approach. We need to do the same here - assign EVERY individual a Risk Profile. Your risk profile is higher than mine because you have a demonstrated history of mental maladjustment. Mine is higher than yours because, in addition to taking anti-psychotic drugs, I have had multiple confrontations with police or authority figures. His neighbors have turned him in twice for cruelty to animals AND he's taking anti-depressants. Create a risk spectrum - rate all people on that spectrum. Use that rating to determine the viability/risk of them owning a weapon. Not sure how that's going to stop him from getting a stolen weapon, but, hey, it's your world.

At what point are you willing to sacrifice YOUR freedoms in order to attack this problem? At what point are you willing to allow government intrusion into YOUR life in order to keep kids safe? You want a nice, easy, simple solution - all wrapped in a pretty bow. You want to be able to say you did something - anything - you want to be able to say you tried. More accurately, you don't care what we do - just do SOMETHING! Then, when it happens again, you can just shake your head and say that you tried. And, more kids will still be dead.

None of that, by the way, prevents him from killing his mother and stealing her guns. Ask Chicago how well strict gun control laws work - ask Washington DC how well strict gun control laws work. You have a "solution" - it just doesn't fit the problem.

I like a "comprehensive" approach - increase school security protocols. The high school had access control, armed police officers, and trained security personnel. The only thing left is 30 foot walls and machine gun turrets. Moats and drawbridges? You can argue whether their response to the incident was appropriate - though, I've seen nothing to indicate it wasn't. But, what would you propose to stop this particular incident? How about Columbine? If you recall, they pre-positioned bombs (never used) and set up sniper nests outside the school. You can't fix the problem, until you address the root cause.

Mental health treatment and access? Absolutely. But, you failed to address the key issue - how do you get the disturbed people to the treatment? How do you identify them? How do you force them to take their drugs? How do you force them to attend therapy sessions? Keep in mind - these people haven't done anything that justifies court action. Are YOU willing to be subject to the level of scrutiny, and freedom restriction, necessary to pre-screen these individuals, and force them to get help?

I don't think most people realize how many incidents happen at your local school. Tuesday, a lone individual was identified walking the halls of the high school. He was confronted, and had no legitimate reason to be there (he claimed he was a graduate and was visiting an old teacher - he wasn't). The law here says that the police will not respond unless there is a direct altercation. No confrontation? Just escort him off the property. The security guard "nudged" him into a confrontation - two took him down, and the police arrived. Fortunately, he was just a registered sex offender, not a mass murderer. How did he get in? After checking the cameras, they found out. He came in the loading dock behind a student who had opened the door with his access card to offload some art supplies.

This type of incident happens 3 -5 times a month. Check with security personnel at your local school - you'll be shocked. So, school security is a definite area of improvement.

BUT - that doesn't change the attack at the mall or the concert or the football game.

Once again, the left has presumed a solution, and bent the evidence to support a preconceived notion. It is the same, old, simplistic rehash of a continued effort to use apples to prove oranges. While it's pretty with all its charts and pictures, it's the same old liberal propaganda - false.

Until the left is willing to talk about the real root causes of these problems, we are going to get nowhere. We will continue to hear a hue and cry to take away our freedoms, and people will continue to die.

We shouldn't be asking why there are more shootings - we should be asking why more school shootings are being executed by millennials and children? What did we do wrong with THIS generation? We've had guns in this nation since its inception. Why is this suddenly an issue?

We've had mentally disturbed people kill groups of people - Richard Speck comes to mind. We've had people, driven by ideological or religious difference, kill groups of people. Remember the Pulse nightclub or Charleston church.

But, never, never, in our history, have we had so many killings done by 14-15-16 year old kids. The last shooting, in Florida, was done by a 19 year old kid.

You can't fix the problem until you address the problem.

Thanks for the novel but we have do have restrictions on fertilizer after the Oklahoma City bombing--

This continual support for semi automatic weapons that as we witnessed in Las Vegas-- turned into automatic fire, makes the Repubican party and those that still support these type weapons being sold in this country, complicit in mass murder.

The Republican party is owned by the NRA. They're only objective is to protect the NRA--because the NRA is their campaign cash cow.

The gun rights organization (NRA) spent a stupendous $54.4 million in the 2016 election cycle, almost all of it in "independent expenditures," meaning spending for or against a candidate but not a direct contribution to a campaign. The money went almost entirely to Republicans to a degree that almost looks like a misprint (but isn't): Of independent expenditures totaling $52.6 million, Democrats received $265. Yes, that's $265 dollars.

'Thoughts and prayers' — and fistfuls of NRA money: Why America can't control guns

Trump & Republicans even repealed the mental health requirement that Obama initiated after 5 and 6 year old kids were slaughtered at Sandy Hook.
Trump repeals an Obama regulation keeping guns from people with certain mental health conditions

Republicans aren't going to do JACK SHIT about any mass shooting, except hand out their sympathies and do prayer vigils.

We've got suspected terrorists on FBI watch lists and people who are on no fly lists-- that today can walk into any gun store and load up. When Obama said let's do something about this--REPUBLICANS said NO. Then the Orlando Florida massacre happened.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/worl...b6c1998b7a0_story.html?utm_term=.dae277e8b0b0

Vote for Democrats this coming November in the midterm election cycle--and let's get back to common sense gun regulations.

 

[BasicHumanUnit]

How is it possible that the exact same people calling for an end to the 2nd amendment because a dozen people are killed.......

Are the same ones screaming for more funding for abortions that already take MILLIONS of lives every year?

Does that defy sanity or what?

 

[2aguy]

OK--so this year we have 18 school shootings, and it's not even March yet. Yesterday in Florida 15 young people with their entire lives in front of them, along with 2 school teachers trying to protect them were massacred. Then we have Las Vegas. Then a church in Texas were generations of family members were wiped out. We have a movie theatre in Aurora Colorado, then San Diego were a straw buyer purchased semi-automatics for a slaugther there, and Orlando, Florida another one. And Sandy Hook where 5 to 7 year olds were slaughtered.

People have called for better gun regulations in this country and it has continually fallen on deaf ears. Republicans are owned by the NRA and right wing gun extremists.

Here are my suggestions.
1. Ban semi-automatic weapons and 30 round gun clips.
2. People with existing semi-automatics & ammo be required to keep them in a locked secure gun case, and required to maintain an insurance liability policy on that weapon in order to keep them.
3. Parents of children & teenagers are required to keep all of their guns & ammo in locked secure gun safes, inaccessible at all times to their kids.
4. No private sales. If someone wants to sell their gun, it has to be dropped off at a licensed gun dealer for resale so a background check can be done.
5. Background checks including extended mental health checks before any purchase of a gun is made.
6. Straw buyers of guns, those who buy guns for others, be under the same prosecutable standards as those that pull the trigger.
7. Those that are on a no fly list, or FBI terrorist watch list not be able to purchase any guns or ammo.

If these simple regulations were in place--there would have never been a Las Vegas, a Sandy Hook, a Columbine massacre, a church in Texas, San Diego slaughter, Orlando, Florida massacre, a Virginia Tech etc. etc. etc., and 15 young kids and 2 teachers that were killed yesterday would be here today.

You won't convince Republicans to do any of this. They are OWNED by the NRA, and right wing gun extremists, and will fight (tooth & nail) on any new gun regulations. They are more interested in the donations they get from the NRA than keeping the public and our schools safe.

If you're tired of all the condolences & sympathies, then do something about it. Vote for Democrats in the midterm election cycle this coming November for common sense gun regulations.

Your approach creates nice little bromidic headlines about all the great things you are going to do to fix a problem by not addressing the real issue. Then, six months later, you'll be scratching your head about why a shooter used a car full of fertilizer instead of a gun - how he used a shotgun instead of an AR-15, how he used a samurai sword, how he used a truck, how he used a bulldozer. The tool ISN'T the problem - the disturbed individual IS the problem, and until you attack the root cause of the problem, you're just pissing in the wind.

Tell me what gun control law you would institute that would have stopped Sandy Hook, Columbine, or Parkland. Sandy Hook - kid goes off the deep end, murders his mother, breaks into her gun safe, goes to school and kills 13 people. What law is going to stop that? The "don't kill your mother" law? The "don't break into gun safes" law? Kid says on YouTube - I want to be a professional school shooter. What do you propose? A law that says we can lock him away because he had "murderous thoughts"? The ACLU would have a freakin' field day.

As for this absolute idiocy about "military style killing machines" - what if he had a shotgun instead? Frankly, using an AR-15 semi-automatic is a poor choice. A 12 gauge shotgun would be a much more effective weapon in close quarters. Shotguns using buckshot and slugs are known to be particularly brutal. Typical 00 buckshot is the rough equivalent of 9 – 12x 9mm bullets hitting a target at once and a slug is a a solid lead meat pulverizer. Buckshot maintains its lethality up to about 70 yards - how many shots in Parkland do you suppose were over 70 yards? A shotgun with slugs is roughly as lethal as your average hunting rifle with its range - about 120 yards. You can buy a SEMI-AUTOMATIC shotgun for a lot less than an AR-15. Every gun enthusiast likes an AR-15 because it LOOKS bad-ass, and every gun control enthusiast hates an AR-15 because it LOOKS bad-ass. In truth, it's a pretty poor weapon to use in a school shooting.

Banning all the AR-15s in the world won't stop what happened -because the problem isn't the gun. Yeah, but, you say - if he didn't have an AR-15, he still would have killed people - just not so many. That's a ridiculous argument. That doesn't make the first child shot, or the second, or the third, any less dead. That's attacking the symptom, not the problem, and frankly, until liberals are willing to admit that it's the individual, not the gun, we are never going to fix this problem. I recognize it makes cute headlines to advocate for gun control, but it doesn't accomplish a damn thing.

I understand - people want to do something - anything - to make it stop. It doesn't matter if it's effective, it doesn't matter if it addresses the problem. Just do SOMETHING!!!! We all want a nice, simple, safe fix that doesn't inconvenience us - one that takes away somebody's freedom, as long as it isn't mine. That simple fix doesn't exist ------ address the problem, not the symptom. The problem is mentally disturbed people who do bad things.

In the military, when we plan a mission, we identify the "risk profile" for each alternative approach. We need to do the same here - assign EVERY individual a Risk Profile. Your risk profile is higher than mine because you have a demonstrated history of mental maladjustment. Mine is higher than yours because, in addition to taking anti-psychotic drugs, I have had multiple confrontations with police or authority figures. His neighbors have turned him in twice for cruelty to animals AND he's taking anti-depressants. Create a risk spectrum - rate all people on that spectrum. Use that rating to determine the viability/risk of them owning a weapon. Not sure how that's going to stop him from getting a stolen weapon, but, hey, it's your world.

At what point are you willing to sacrifice YOUR freedoms in order to attack this problem? At what point are you willing to allow government intrusion into YOUR life in order to keep kids safe? You want a nice, easy, simple solution - all wrapped in a pretty bow. You want to be able to say you did something - anything - you want to be able to say you tried. More accurately, you don't care what we do - just do SOMETHING! Then, when it happens again, you can just shake your head and say that you tried. And, more kids will still be dead.

None of that, by the way, prevents him from killing his mother and stealing her guns. Ask Chicago how well strict gun control laws work - ask Washington DC how well strict gun control laws work. You have a "solution" - it just doesn't fit the problem.

I like a "comprehensive" approach - increase school security protocols. The high school had access control, armed police officers, and trained security personnel. The only thing left is 30 foot walls and machine gun turrets. Moats and drawbridges? You can argue whether their response to the incident was appropriate - though, I've seen nothing to indicate it wasn't. But, what would you propose to stop this particular incident? How about Columbine? If you recall, they pre-positioned bombs (never used) and set up sniper nests outside the school. You can't fix the problem, until you address the root cause.

Mental health treatment and access? Absolutely. But, you failed to address the key issue - how do you get the disturbed people to the treatment? How do you identify them? How do you force them to take their drugs? How do you force them to attend therapy sessions? Keep in mind - these people haven't done anything that justifies court action. Are YOU willing to be subject to the level of scrutiny, and freedom restriction, necessary to pre-screen these individuals, and force them to get help?

I don't think most people realize how many incidents happen at your local school. Tuesday, a lone individual was identified walking the halls of the high school. He was confronted, and had no legitimate reason to be there (he claimed he was a graduate and was visiting an old teacher - he wasn't). The law here says that the police will not respond unless there is a direct altercation. No confrontation? Just escort him off the property. The security guard "nudged" him into a confrontation - two took him down, and the police arrived. Fortunately, he was just a registered sex offender, not a mass murderer. How did he get in? After checking the cameras, they found out. He came in the loading dock behind a student who had opened the door with his access card to offload some art supplies.

This type of incident happens 3 -5 times a month. Check with security personnel at your local school - you'll be shocked. So, school security is a definite area of improvement.

BUT - that doesn't change the attack at the mall or the concert or the football game.

Once again, the left has presumed a solution, and bent the evidence to support a preconceived notion. It is the same, old, simplistic rehash of a continued effort to use apples to prove oranges. While it's pretty with all its charts and pictures, it's the same old liberal propaganda - false.

Until the left is willing to talk about the real root causes of these problems, we are going to get nowhere. We will continue to hear a hue and cry to take away our freedoms, and people will continue to die.

We shouldn't be asking why there are more shootings - we should be asking why more school shootings are being executed by millennials and children? What did we do wrong with THIS generation? We've had guns in this nation since its inception. Why is this suddenly an issue?

We've had mentally disturbed people kill groups of people - Richard Speck comes to mind. We've had people, driven by ideological or religious difference, kill groups of people. Remember the Pulse nightclub or Charleston church.

But, never, never, in our history, have we had so many killings done by 14-15-16 year old kids. The last shooting, in Florida, was done by a 19 year old kid.

You can't fix the problem until you address the problem.

Thanks for the novel but we have do have restrictions on fertilizer after the Oklahoma City bombing--

This continual support for semi auto weapons that as we witnessed in Las Vegas-- turned into automatic fire, makes the Repubican party and those that still support these type weapons being sold in this country, complicit in mass murder.

The Republican party is owned by the NRA.

The gun rights organization (NRA) spent a stupendous $54.4 million in the 2016 election cycle, almost all of it in "independent expenditures," meaning spending for or against a candidate but not a direct contribution to a campaign. The money went almost entirely to Republicans to a degree that almost looks like a misprint (but isn't): Of independent expenditures totaling $52.6 million, Democrats received $265. Yes, that's $265 dollars.

'Thoughts and prayers' — and fistfuls of NRA money: Why America can't control guns

Trump & Republicans even repealed the mental health requirement that Obama initiated after 5 and 6 year old kids were slaughtered at Sandy Hook.
Trump repeals an Obama regulation keeping guns from people with certain mental health conditions

Republicans aren't going to do JACK SHIT about any mass shooting, except hand out their sympathies and do prayer vigils.

We got suspected terrorists and people who are on no fly lists that today can walk into any gun store and load up. When Obama said let's do something about this--REPUBLICANS said no.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/worl...b6c1998b7a0_story.html?utm_term=.dae277e8b0b0

Vote for Democrats in this coming November--and let's get back to common sense gun regulations.

Knives kill more people every single year than the last 35 years of mass public shooters....

US mass shootings, 1982-2018: Data from Mother Jones’ investigation
Total murders by mass public shooters...1982-2017

795


knife murders.....2009-2013.....

2009----1,836
2010----1,933
2011----1,611
2012---1,769
2013---1.956

Rifle murder....

2009---351
2010---367
2011---332
2012---298
2013---285

 

[BasicHumanUnit]

Which PROVES......

They are either ignorant as all hell.....

Or.....they don't really care about saving lives.....only making Americans defenseless

 

[2aguy]

OK--so this year we have 18 school shootings, and it's not even March yet. Yesterday in Florida 15 young people with their entire lives in front of them, along with 2 school teachers trying to protect them were massacred. Then we have Las Vegas. Then a church in Texas were generations of family members were wiped out. We have a movie theatre in Aurora Colorado, then San Diego were a straw buyer purchased semi-automatics for a slaugther there, and Orlando, Florida another one. And Sandy Hook where 5 to 7 year olds were slaughtered.

People have called for better gun regulations in this country and it has continually fallen on deaf ears. Republicans are owned by the NRA and right wing gun extremists.

Here are my suggestions.
1. Ban semi-automatic weapons and 30 round gun clips.
2. People with existing semi-automatics & ammo be required to keep them in a locked secure gun case, and required to maintain an insurance liability policy on that weapon in order to keep them.
3. Parents of children & teenagers are required to keep all of their guns & ammo in locked secure gun safes, inaccessible at all times to their kids.
4. No private sales. If someone wants to sell their gun, it has to be dropped off at a licensed gun dealer for resale so a background check can be done.
5. Background checks including extended mental health checks before any purchase of a gun is made.
6. Straw buyers of guns, those who buy guns for others, be under the same prosecutable standards as those that pull the trigger.
7. Those that are on a no fly list, or FBI terrorist watch list not be able to purchase any guns or ammo.

If these simple regulations were in place--there would have never been a Las Vegas, a Sandy Hook, a Columbine massacre, a church in Texas, San Diego slaughter, Orlando, Florida massacre, a Virginia Tech etc. etc. etc., and 15 young kids and 2 teachers that were killed yesterday would be here today.

You won't convince Republicans to do any of this. They are OWNED by the NRA, and right wing gun extremists, and will fight (tooth & nail) on any new gun regulations. They are more interested in the donations they get from the NRA than keeping the public and our schools safe.

If you're tired of all the condolences & sympathies, then do something about it. Vote for Democrats in the midterm election cycle this coming November for common sense gun regulations.

Your approach creates nice little bromidic headlines about all the great things you are going to do to fix a problem by not addressing the real issue. Then, six months later, you'll be scratching your head about why a shooter used a car full of fertilizer instead of a gun - how he used a shotgun instead of an AR-15, how he used a samurai sword, how he used a truck, how he used a bulldozer. The tool ISN'T the problem - the disturbed individual IS the problem, and until you attack the root cause of the problem, you're just pissing in the wind.

Tell me what gun control law you would institute that would have stopped Sandy Hook, Columbine, or Parkland. Sandy Hook - kid goes off the deep end, murders his mother, breaks into her gun safe, goes to school and kills 13 people. What law is going to stop that? The "don't kill your mother" law? The "don't break into gun safes" law? Kid says on YouTube - I want to be a professional school shooter. What do you propose? A law that says we can lock him away because he had "murderous thoughts"? The ACLU would have a freakin' field day.

As for this absolute idiocy about "military style killing machines" - what if he had a shotgun instead? Frankly, using an AR-15 semi-automatic is a poor choice. A 12 gauge shotgun would be a much more effective weapon in close quarters. Shotguns using buckshot and slugs are known to be particularly brutal. Typical 00 buckshot is the rough equivalent of 9 – 12x 9mm bullets hitting a target at once and a slug is a a solid lead meat pulverizer. Buckshot maintains its lethality up to about 70 yards - how many shots in Parkland do you suppose were over 70 yards? A shotgun with slugs is roughly as lethal as your average hunting rifle with its range - about 120 yards. You can buy a SEMI-AUTOMATIC shotgun for a lot less than an AR-15. Every gun enthusiast likes an AR-15 because it LOOKS bad-ass, and every gun control enthusiast hates an AR-15 because it LOOKS bad-ass. In truth, it's a pretty poor weapon to use in a school shooting.

Banning all the AR-15s in the world won't stop what happened -because the problem isn't the gun. Yeah, but, you say - if he didn't have an AR-15, he still would have killed people - just not so many. That's a ridiculous argument. That doesn't make the first child shot, or the second, or the third, any less dead. That's attacking the symptom, not the problem, and frankly, until liberals are willing to admit that it's the individual, not the gun, we are never going to fix this problem. I recognize it makes cute headlines to advocate for gun control, but it doesn't accomplish a damn thing.

I understand - people want to do something - anything - to make it stop. It doesn't matter if it's effective, it doesn't matter if it addresses the problem. Just do SOMETHING!!!! We all want a nice, simple, safe fix that doesn't inconvenience us - one that takes away somebody's freedom, as long as it isn't mine. That simple fix doesn't exist ------ address the problem, not the symptom. The problem is mentally disturbed people who do bad things.

In the military, when we plan a mission, we identify the "risk profile" for each alternative approach. We need to do the same here - assign EVERY individual a Risk Profile. Your risk profile is higher than mine because you have a demonstrated history of mental maladjustment. Mine is higher than yours because, in addition to taking anti-psychotic drugs, I have had multiple confrontations with police or authority figures. His neighbors have turned him in twice for cruelty to animals AND he's taking anti-depressants. Create a risk spectrum - rate all people on that spectrum. Use that rating to determine the viability/risk of them owning a weapon. Not sure how that's going to stop him from getting a stolen weapon, but, hey, it's your world.

At what point are you willing to sacrifice YOUR freedoms in order to attack this problem? At what point are you willing to allow government intrusion into YOUR life in order to keep kids safe? You want a nice, easy, simple solution - all wrapped in a pretty bow. You want to be able to say you did something - anything - you want to be able to say you tried. More accurately, you don't care what we do - just do SOMETHING! Then, when it happens again, you can just shake your head and say that you tried. And, more kids will still be dead.

None of that, by the way, prevents him from killing his mother and stealing her guns. Ask Chicago how well strict gun control laws work - ask Washington DC how well strict gun control laws work. You have a "solution" - it just doesn't fit the problem.

I like a "comprehensive" approach - increase school security protocols. The high school had access control, armed police officers, and trained security personnel. The only thing left is 30 foot walls and machine gun turrets. Moats and drawbridges? You can argue whether their response to the incident was appropriate - though, I've seen nothing to indicate it wasn't. But, what would you propose to stop this particular incident? How about Columbine? If you recall, they pre-positioned bombs (never used) and set up sniper nests outside the school. You can't fix the problem, until you address the root cause.

Mental health treatment and access? Absolutely. But, you failed to address the key issue - how do you get the disturbed people to the treatment? How do you identify them? How do you force them to take their drugs? How do you force them to attend therapy sessions? Keep in mind - these people haven't done anything that justifies court action. Are YOU willing to be subject to the level of scrutiny, and freedom restriction, necessary to pre-screen these individuals, and force them to get help?

I don't think most people realize how many incidents happen at your local school. Tuesday, a lone individual was identified walking the halls of the high school. He was confronted, and had no legitimate reason to be there (he claimed he was a graduate and was visiting an old teacher - he wasn't). The law here says that the police will not respond unless there is a direct altercation. No confrontation? Just escort him off the property. The security guard "nudged" him into a confrontation - two took him down, and the police arrived. Fortunately, he was just a registered sex offender, not a mass murderer. How did he get in? After checking the cameras, they found out. He came in the loading dock behind a student who had opened the door with his access card to offload some art supplies.

This type of incident happens 3 -5 times a month. Check with security personnel at your local school - you'll be shocked. So, school security is a definite area of improvement.

BUT - that doesn't change the attack at the mall or the concert or the football game.

Once again, the left has presumed a solution, and bent the evidence to support a preconceived notion. It is the same, old, simplistic rehash of a continued effort to use apples to prove oranges. While it's pretty with all its charts and pictures, it's the same old liberal propaganda - false.

Until the left is willing to talk about the real root causes of these problems, we are going to get nowhere. We will continue to hear a hue and cry to take away our freedoms, and people will continue to die.

We shouldn't be asking why there are more shootings - we should be asking why more school shootings are being executed by millennials and children? What did we do wrong with THIS generation? We've had guns in this nation since its inception. Why is this suddenly an issue?

We've had mentally disturbed people kill groups of people - Richard Speck comes to mind. We've had people, driven by ideological or religious difference, kill groups of people. Remember the Pulse nightclub or Charleston church.

But, never, never, in our history, have we had so many killings done by 14-15-16 year old kids. The last shooting, in Florida, was done by a 19 year old kid.

You can't fix the problem until you address the problem.

Thanks for the novel but we have do have restrictions on fertilizer after the Oklahoma City bombing--

This continual support for semi auto weapons that as we witnessed in Las Vegas-- turned into automatic fire, makes the Repubican party and those that still support these type weapons being sold in this country, complicit in mass murder.

The Republican party is owned by the NRA.

The gun rights organization (NRA) spent a stupendous $54.4 million in the 2016 election cycle, almost all of it in "independent expenditures," meaning spending for or against a candidate but not a direct contribution to a campaign. The money went almost entirely to Republicans to a degree that almost looks like a misprint (but isn't): Of independent expenditures totaling $52.6 million, Democrats received $265. Yes, that's $265 dollars.

'Thoughts and prayers' — and fistfuls of NRA money: Why America can't control guns

Trump & Republicans even repealed the mental health requirement that Obama initiated after 5 and 6 year old kids were slaughtered at Sandy Hook.
Trump repeals an Obama regulation keeping guns from people with certain mental health conditions

Republicans aren't going to do JACK SHIT about any mass shooting, except hand out their sympathies and do prayer vigils.

We've got suspected terrorists on FBI watch lists and people who are on no fly lists-- that today can walk into any gun store and load up. When Obama said let's do something about this--REPUBLICANS said no.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/worl...b6c1998b7a0_story.html?utm_term=.dae277e8b0b0

Vote for Democrats in this coming November--and let's get back to common sense gun regulations.

Vote democrat? Criminals kill over 10,000 people every year, far more than all mass shooters since 1982.....and democrats keep letting these violent gun criminals out of jail to commit murder....

If you want murderes let loose in your town, vote democrat.....they love to let violent criminals loose...

California Democrats hate the gun, not the gunman – Orange County Register

Now that Democrats have supermajorities in the California state Legislature, they’ve rolled into Sacramento with a zest for lowering the state’s prison population and have interpreted St. Augustine’s words of wisdom to mean, “Hate the gun, not the gunman.”

I say this because, once they finally took a break from preaching about the benefits of stricter gun control, the state Senate voted to loosen sentencing guidelines for criminals convicted of gun crimes.

Currently, California law requires anyone who uses a gun while committing a felony to have their sentence increased by 10 years or more in prison — on top of the normal criminal penalty. If enacted, Senate Bill 620 would eliminate that mandate.

The bill, which passed on a 22-14 party-line vote, with support only from Democrats, now heads to the state Assembly for consideration.

Republicans and the National Rifle Association have vowed to campaign against it.

Why have Democrats suddenly developed a soft spot for criminals convicted of gun crimes? The bill’s author, state Sen. Steve Bradford, D-Gardena, says that he was motivated to write the bill after a 17-year-old riding in a car involved in a drive-by shooting was sentenced to 25 years in prison, even though he claims that he wasn’t the one who pulled the trigger.

and for all those anti-gunners who want to know where criminals get guns....well...this law lowers the prison time for those who give guns to criminals.....

Why is that?

Prop. 57, for example, very deceptively and fundamentally changed the definition of what constitutes a “non-violent” offense.


supplying a firearm to a gang member,

l
felon obtaining a firearm,

discharging a firearm on school grounds
------------
=============

The democrat prosecutor let this monster loose.......

But Democrat State’s Attorney Julia Reitz cut a deal to let Robbie Patton, a sociopathic predator who will never contribute anything but sewage and sadness to our society, avoid serving hard time for attempted murder.

It’s true. Bad guys in prison don’t victimize the innocent. Florida had proven success with 10-20-Life sentencing enhancements for the use of a firearmwhile committing a violent crime. A court struck down the law in 2016. Under the law, Florida’s firearmviolent crime rate plummeted to the lowest levels in the Sunshine State’s recorded history.


----------

John Boch: Lock Them Up! - The Truth About Guns

When you lock up violent criminals, you prevent them from victimizing other innocents. Crime in America dipped almost 50%after America abandoned “soft on crime” attitudes of the 1970s. Of course, many soft-on-crime politicians like Reitz have once more taken a love to “diversion” programs. And that’s how we get Robbie Patton (above), a local crime celebrity of sorts.

In 2015, he had an altercation at a Champaign Steak ‘n Shake restaurant commonly frequented by my friends and me. While none of us were enjoying a milkshake or steakburger at 5:30pm, Robbie was.

Robbie found himself in an altercation inside the restaurant. He felt one of his friends had been “disrespected”, so little Robbie went outside. He waited for the other group to emerge, pulled out of gun and tried to kill those other people.

He missed, and fled the scene with an Illinois State Trooper in hot pursuit. After a short, high-speed chase in a stolen car, Robbie crashed and escaped on foot.

Cops caught up with him. Local prosecutor Julia Reitz then went soft on little Robbie. She let him go to “boot camp”, even though that sentencing option is not supposed to be available for violent offenders. And squeezing off a bunch of shots at other people, trying to kill them, pretty much fits the bill as a violent crime.

After serving eight months on an eight-year sentence, Robbie returned to the streets of Champaign-Urbana. In less than two days, cops arrested him again for drugs and who knows what else. Not even three weeks after that, he’s illegally got agun. When someone “disrespects” another one of Robbie’s friends, guess what he does? He pulls out the gun and fires shots at those he believes responsible.




He misses his intended targets, but in the busy University of Illinois campustown district, his errant, not-so-late-night rounds found four innocent people within a block or two. George Korchev, the recent nursing school graduate due to start his career as a registered nurse at a hospital in Libertyville, IL, the following Monday morning, was struck and killed a blockaway from one of Robbie’s bullets

 

[Contumacious]

OK--so this year we have 18 school shootings, and it's not even March yet. Yesterday in Florida 15 young people with their entire lives in front of them, along with 2 school teachers trying to protect them were massacred. Then we have Las Vegas. Then a church in Texas were generations of family members were wiped out. We have a movie theatre in Aurora Colorado, then San Diego were a straw buyer purchased semi-automatics for a slaugther there, and Orlando, Florida another one. And Sandy Hook where 5 to 7 year olds were slaughtered.

People have called for better gun regulations in this country and it has continually fallen on deaf ears. Republicans are owned by the NRA and right wing gun extremists.

Here are my suggestions.
1. Ban semi-automatic weapons and 30 round gun clips.
2. People with existing semi-automatics & ammo be required to keep them in a locked secure gun case, and required to maintain an insurance liability policy on that weapon in order to keep them.
3. Parents of children & teenagers are required to keep all of their guns & ammo in locked secure gun safes, inaccessible at all times to their kids.
4. No private sales. If someone wants to sell their gun, it has to be dropped off at a licensed gun dealer for resale so a background check can be done.
5. Background checks including extended mental health checks before any purchase of a gun is made.
6. Straw buyers of guns, those who buy guns for others, be under the same prosecutable standards as those that pull the trigger.
7. Those that are on a no fly list, or FBI terrorist watch list not be able to purchase any guns or ammo.

If these simple regulations were in place--there would have never been a Las Vegas, a Sandy Hook, a Columbine massacre, a church in Texas, San Diego slaughter, Orlando, Florida massacre, a Virginia Tech etc. etc. etc., and 15 young kids and 2 teachers that were killed yesterday would be here today.

You won't convince Republicans to do any of this. They are OWNED by the NRA, and right wing gun extremists, and will fight (tooth & nail) on any new gun regulations. They are more interested in the donations they get from the NRA than keeping the public and our schools safe.

If you're tired of all the condolences & sympathies, then do something about it. Vote for Democrats in the midterm election cycle this coming November for common sense gun regulations.

Your approach creates nice little bromidic headlines about all the great things you are going to do to fix a problem by not addressing the real issue. Then, six months later, you'll be scratching your head about why a shooter used a car full of fertilizer instead of a gun - how he used a shotgun instead of an AR-15, how he used a samurai sword, how he used a truck, how he used a bulldozer. The tool ISN'T the problem - the disturbed individual IS the problem, and until you attack the root cause of the problem, you're just pissing in the wind.

Tell me what gun control law you would institute that would have stopped Sandy Hook, Columbine, or Parkland. Sandy Hook - kid goes off the deep end, murders his mother, breaks into her gun safe, goes to school and kills 13 people. What law is going to stop that? The "don't kill your mother" law? The "don't break into gun safes" law? Kid says on YouTube - I want to be a professional school shooter. What do you propose? A law that says we can lock him away because he had "murderous thoughts"? The ACLU would have a freakin' field day.

As for this absolute idiocy about "military style killing machines" - what if he had a shotgun instead? Frankly, using an AR-15 semi-automatic is a poor choice. A 12 gauge shotgun would be a much more effective weapon in close quarters. Shotguns using buckshot and slugs are known to be particularly brutal. Typical 00 buckshot is the rough equivalent of 9 – 12x 9mm bullets hitting a target at once and a slug is a a solid lead meat pulverizer. Buckshot maintains its lethality up to about 70 yards - how many shots in Parkland do you suppose were over 70 yards? A shotgun with slugs is roughly as lethal as your average hunting rifle with its range - about 120 yards. You can buy a SEMI-AUTOMATIC shotgun for a lot less than an AR-15. Every gun enthusiast likes an AR-15 because it LOOKS bad-ass, and every gun control enthusiast hates an AR-15 because it LOOKS bad-ass. In truth, it's a pretty poor weapon to use in a school shooting.

Banning all the AR-15s in the world won't stop what happened -because the problem isn't the gun. Yeah, but, you say - if he didn't have an AR-15, he still would have killed people - just not so many. That's a ridiculous argument. That doesn't make the first child shot, or the second, or the third, any less dead. That's attacking the symptom, not the problem, and frankly, until liberals are willing to admit that it's the individual, not the gun, we are never going to fix this problem. I recognize it makes cute headlines to advocate for gun control, but it doesn't accomplish a damn thing.

I understand - people want to do something - anything - to make it stop. It doesn't matter if it's effective, it doesn't matter if it addresses the problem. Just do SOMETHING!!!! We all want a nice, simple, safe fix that doesn't inconvenience us - one that takes away somebody's freedom, as long as it isn't mine. That simple fix doesn't exist ------ address the problem, not the symptom. The problem is mentally disturbed people who do bad things.

In the military, when we plan a mission, we identify the "risk profile" for each alternative approach. We need to do the same here - assign EVERY individual a Risk Profile. Your risk profile is higher than mine because you have a demonstrated history of mental maladjustment. Mine is higher than yours because, in addition to taking anti-psychotic drugs, I have had multiple confrontations with police or authority figures. His neighbors have turned him in twice for cruelty to animals AND he's taking anti-depressants. Create a risk spectrum - rate all people on that spectrum. Use that rating to determine the viability/risk of them owning a weapon. Not sure how that's going to stop him from getting a stolen weapon, but, hey, it's your world.

At what point are you willing to sacrifice YOUR freedoms in order to attack this problem? At what point are you willing to allow government intrusion into YOUR life in order to keep kids safe? You want a nice, easy, simple solution - all wrapped in a pretty bow. You want to be able to say you did something - anything - you want to be able to say you tried. More accurately, you don't care what we do - just do SOMETHING! Then, when it happens again, you can just shake your head and say that you tried. And, more kids will still be dead.

None of that, by the way, prevents him from killing his mother and stealing her guns. Ask Chicago how well strict gun control laws work - ask Washington DC how well strict gun control laws work. You have a "solution" - it just doesn't fit the problem.

I like a "comprehensive" approach - increase school security protocols. The high school had access control, armed police officers, and trained security personnel. The only thing left is 30 foot walls and machine gun turrets. Moats and drawbridges? You can argue whether their response to the incident was appropriate - though, I've seen nothing to indicate it wasn't. But, what would you propose to stop this particular incident? How about Columbine? If you recall, they pre-positioned bombs (never used) and set up sniper nests outside the school. You can't fix the problem, until you address the root cause.

Mental health treatment and access? Absolutely. But, you failed to address the key issue - how do you get the disturbed people to the treatment? How do you identify them? How do you force them to take their drugs? How do you force them to attend therapy sessions? Keep in mind - these people haven't done anything that justifies court action. Are YOU willing to be subject to the level of scrutiny, and freedom restriction, necessary to pre-screen these individuals, and force them to get help?

I don't think most people realize how many incidents happen at your local school. Tuesday, a lone individual was identified walking the halls of the high school. He was confronted, and had no legitimate reason to be there (he claimed he was a graduate and was visiting an old teacher - he wasn't). The law here says that the police will not respond unless there is a direct altercation. No confrontation? Just escort him off the property. The security guard "nudged" him into a confrontation - two took him down, and the police arrived. Fortunately, he was just a registered sex offender, not a mass murderer. How did he get in? After checking the cameras, they found out. He came in the loading dock behind a student who had opened the door with his access card to offload some art supplies.

This type of incident happens 3 -5 times a month. Check with security personnel at your local school - you'll be shocked. So, school security is a definite area of improvement.

BUT - that doesn't change the attack at the mall or the concert or the football game.

Once again, the left has presumed a solution, and bent the evidence to support a preconceived notion. It is the same, old, simplistic rehash of a continued effort to use apples to prove oranges. While it's pretty with all its charts and pictures, it's the same old liberal propaganda - false.

Until the left is willing to talk about the real root causes of these problems, we are going to get nowhere. We will continue to hear a hue and cry to take away our freedoms, and people will continue to die.

We shouldn't be asking why there are more shootings - we should be asking why more school shootings are being executed by millennials and children? What did we do wrong with THIS generation? We've had guns in this nation since its inception. Why is this suddenly an issue?

We've had mentally disturbed people kill groups of people - Richard Speck comes to mind. We've had people, driven by ideological or religious difference, kill groups of people. Remember the Pulse nightclub or Charleston church.

But, never, never, in our history, have we had so many killings done by 14-15-16 year old kids. The last shooting, in Florida, was done by a 19 year old kid.

You can't fix the problem until you address the problem.

Thanks for the novel but we have do have restrictions on fertilizer after the Oklahoma City bombing--

This continual support for semi auto weapons that as we witnessed in Las Vegas-- turned into automatic fire, makes the Repubican party and those that still support these type weapons being sold in this country, complicit in mass murder.

The Republican party is owned by the NRA.

The gun rights organization (NRA) spent a stupendous $54.4 million in the 2016 election cycle, almost all of it in "independent expenditures," meaning spending for or against a candidate but not a direct contribution to a campaign. The money went almost entirely to Republicans to a degree that almost looks like a misprint (but isn't): Of independent expenditures totaling $52.6 million, Democrats received $265. Yes, that's $265 dollars.

'Thoughts and prayers' — and fistfuls of NRA money: Why America can't control guns

Trump & Republicans even repealed the mental health requirement that Obama initiated after 5 and 6 year old kids were slaughtered at Sandy Hook.
Trump repeals an Obama regulation keeping guns from people with certain mental health conditions

Republicans aren't going to do JACK SHIT about any mass shooting, except hand out their sympathies and do prayer vigils.

We've got suspected terrorists on FBI watch lists and people who are on no fly lists-- that today can walk into any gun store and load up. When Obama said let's do something about this--REPUBLICANS said no.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/worl...b6c1998b7a0_story.html?utm_term=.dae277e8b0b0

Vote for Democrats in this coming November--and let's get back to common sense gun regulations.

Yo dingle berry

every kid in Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School knew that Cruz was going to come back and shoot every body in the school. But the FBI had more important things in their minds, ie, deposing our duly elected 45th President from office.

.SHUT THE FUCK UP>


.

 

[eddiew37]

my bottom line is the scum in the wh now has insisted russia wasn't involved in our election ,,,now the orange anus is proven wrong again ,,,,wrong or lying

 

[Spare_change]

Thanks for the novel but we have do have restrictions on fertilizer after the Oklahoma City bombing--

(I'm sorry --- I assumed that you wanted intelligent discussion about the issue. Mea culpa)

This continual support for semi automatic weapons that as we witnessed in Las Vegas-- turned into automatic fire, makes the Repubican party and those that still support these type weapons being sold in this country, complicit in mass murder.

The Republican party is owned by the NRA. They're only objective is to protect the NRA--because the NRA is their campaign cash cow.

The gun rights organization (NRA) spent a stupendous $54.4 million in the 2016 election cycle, almost all of it in "independent expenditures," meaning spending for or against a candidate but not a direct contribution to a campaign. The money went almost entirely to Republicans to a degree that almost looks like a misprint (but isn't): Of independent expenditures totaling $52.6 million, Democrats received $265. Yes, that's $265 dollars.

'Thoughts and prayers' — and fistfuls of NRA money: Why America can't control guns

From a NYT columnist who proposes to delete the 2nd Amendment.

...why do liberals keep losing the gun control debate?

Maybe it’s because they argue their case badly and — let’s face it — in bad faith. Democratic politicians routinely profess their fidelity to the Second Amendment — or rather, “a nuanced reading” of it — with all the conviction of Barack Obama’s support for traditional marriage, circa 2008. People recognize lip service for what it is.

Then there are the endless liberal errors of fact. There is no “gun-show loophole” per se; it’s a private-sale loophole, in other words the right to sell your own stuff. The civilian AR-15 is not a true “assault rifle,” and banning such rifles would have little effect on the overall murder rate, since most homicides are committed with handguns. It’s not true that 40 percent of gun owners buy without a background check; the real number is closer to one-fifth.

The National Rifle Association does not have Republican “balls in a money clip,” as Jimmy Kimmel put it the other night. The N.R.A. has donated a paltry $3,533,294 to all current members of Congress since 1998, according to The Washington Post, equivalent to about three months of Kimmel’s salary. The N.R.A. doesn’t need to buy influence: It’s powerful because it’s popular.

So much for THAT argument. Your $54 million was spent to further their cause ... not buy politcians. Since you are an active supporter of Hillary, I'm pretty sure you don't even want to go there.

Trump & Republicans even repealed the mental health requirement that Obama initiated after 5 and 6 year old kids were slaughtered at Sandy Hook.
Trump repeals an Obama regulation keeping guns from people with certain mental health conditions

Now, this is funny stuff. The Obama mental health requirement was an illegal intrusion into personal liberties. It required the Social Security to identify all recipients who were receiving assisted living, and turning their names of to HHS. I mean - we're talking 50.000 - 70,000 seniors who can't go to the bathroom by themselves, can't walk, can't feed themselves. Explain to me how that impacts sechool security.

Republicans aren't going to do JACK SHIT about any mass shooting, except hand out their sympathies and do prayer vigils.

We've got suspected terrorists on FBI watch lists and people who are on no fly lists-- that today can walk into any gun store and load up. When Obama said let's do something about this--REPUBLICANS said NO. Then the Orlando Florida massacre happened.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/worl...b6c1998b7a0_story.html?utm_term=.dae277e8b0b0

Cute how you offer up a thread that can't be read as proof for something that the article doesn't say at all.

Vote for Democrats this coming November in the midterm election cycle--and let's get back to common sense gun regulations.

Mayhaps you can explain why Democrats filibustered, and blocked, the Grassley-Cruz bill. You know, the one that proposed an additional $300 million of school security nationwide, and increased protective measures to ensure that shooters like the one in San Antonio are identified sooner. Maybe you can explain why Democrats voted to kill the proposal to increase funding to HHS for further implementation and modification of the background check processes.

People have called for better gun regulations in this country and it has continually fallen on deaf ears. Republicans are owned by the NRA and right wing gun extremists.

Here are my suggestions.
1. Ban semi-automatic weapons and 30 round gun clips.
2. People with existing semi-automatics & ammo be required to keep them in a locked secure gun case, and required to maintain an insurance liability policy on that weapon in order to keep them.
3. Parents of children & teenagers are required to keep all of their guns & ammo in locked secure gun safes, inaccessible at all times to their kids.
4. No private sales. If someone wants to sell their gun, it has to be dropped off at a licensed gun dealer for resale so a background check can be done.
5. Background checks including extended mental health checks before any purchase of a gun is made.
6. Straw buyers of guns, those who buy guns for others, be under the same prosecutable standards as those that pull the trigger.
7. Those that are on a no fly list, or FBI terrorist watch list not be able to purchase any guns or ammo.

If these simple regulations were in place--there would have never been a Las Vegas, a Sandy Hook, a Columbine massacre, a church in Texas, San Diego slaughter, Orlando, Florida massacre, a Virginia Tech etc. etc. etc., and 15 young kids and 2 teachers that were killed yesterday would be here today.

Just exactly which one of these would have stopped Las Vegas? You know - the shooting by a lucid adult. Or, Sandy Hook? Of, Newton? You know, the one where the shooter killed his mother, broke into her locked gun safe, and then went to the school. Which one would have sopped the Florida massacre, the Va Tech shooting?

The answer --- NONE.

There Is a case to be made for mental health reviews, as I outlined above. But, Democrats aren't interested in that - they only want to take away guns.