Does GDP growth mean Federal Tax revenue growth?

[The Derp]

I've called myself a libertarian since I joined the board, Speed Racer. There's nothing new in that.

Well, let's see...

You joined the boards in December 2010, right around the time that the teabags (who also brand themselves as "libertarian") achieved political power. What's not here is your presence on the boards prior to 2010. What I hypothesize is that you had a different profile during Bush the Dumber, one that had post after post of you supporting and defending his policy, and then when Bush left office in disgrace leaving behind a wrecked economy, you rebranded yourself as this new thing in an attempt to avoid culpability, responsibility, and accountability for your support of all the shit policies that created the environment where a guy like Obama could win an election.

I think you want me to accept this new side of yourself because you ultimately don't want to accept responsibility for any of the past shit policies you've supported and defended.

But the problem is you can never erase that stink because so much of what you think makes you a "libertarian" today also makes you a Conservative. You tipped your hand when you said the tax cut wasn't big enough. That was the first real clue that you're just posturing on message boards because of your ego.

Get over yourself.

 

[kaz]

I've called myself a libertarian since I joined the board, Speed Racer. There's nothing new in that.

Well, let's see...

You joined the boards in December 2010, right around the time that the teabags (who also brand themselves as "libertarian") achieved political power

That's a lie, they never called themselves libertarians

What's not here is your presence on the boards prior to 2010. What I hypothesize is that you had a different profile during Bush the Dumber, one that had post after post of you supporting and defending his policy, and then when Bush left office in disgrace leaving behind a wrecked economy, you rebranded yourself as this new thing in an attempt to avoid culpability, responsibility, and accountability for your support of all the shit policies that created the environment where a guy like Obama could win an election.

I think you want me to accept this new side of yourself because you ultimately don't want to accept responsibility for any of the past shit policies you've supported and defended.

But the problem is you can never erase that stink because so much of what you think makes you a "libertarian" today also makes you a Conservative. You tipped your hand when you said the tax cut wasn't big enough. That was the first real clue that you're just posturing on message boards because of your ego.

Get over yourself.

Hence why I keep pointing out how desperate and hysterical you are to say anyone not a leftist is a Republican. Look at the ridiculous lengths you go to. You just lie on the floor kicking and screaming, conservative, conservative, conservative!

What's funny is that I disagree with Trump all the time. He's as militaristic as Obama was. He's anti-free trade and I'm an avid free trader. He's almost the pig Clinton was with women, though he didn't actually rape them like slick. He spends like a Democrat.

That while your claimed disagreement with the Democrat party is you want Trump to be impeached. You're exactly like them, but someone who agrees with Trump on anything is a Trump supporter.

Exactly the totalitarianism I'm talking about, not leftist = Republican. You're not capable of anything else

 

[The Derp]

I called it a spellcheck thing because you were attacking spelling.

NO! I wasn't attacking your spelling, I was attacking your IGNORANCE. It's not a misspelling to forget about the "ic" in Democratic Party. It's either an active choice of disparagement or an inactive choice of ignorance. I know you know how to spell "Democrat" and "Democratic". What you don't seem to know is that when you refer to the Democratic Party, it's "Democratic Party". So you're trying to make this a game of spelling, how? I don't understand.

And you turned around and said you knew it was a slur, which means you knew I did it on purpose. But now you don't know, but you do, but you don't ... You really are an idiot

I don't know whether you were being disparaging or not because you've not given indication whether you knew you were being disparaging, and because you redefine the parameters of what you say seemingly every single post. The fact that you squealed about spelling means that you weren't intending to be disparaging and that you actually thought that you refer to the Democratic Party as the Democrat Party. So that means your statement was one of ignorance, not disparagement. Which explains why your response to my criticism was to pretend it was a spelling issue. It's not. It's an ignorance issue on your part.

I'm a classic liberal, that is a libertarian. It's the same thing. What an idiot.

You're just pulling this out of your ass, aren't you? You're a libertarian, but you're a liberal, but you're not. No. Libertarian and liberal are not the same thing and whoever told you they were lied to you because they knew you had shit instincts and weren't very intuitive.

There is nothing liberal about leftists. You are intolerant of new ideas, of anyone who doesn't agree with you, of hearing anything you disagree with.You are not liberals, you are totalitarian leftists

LOL! We're not tolerant of BAD IDEAS, of which you have nothing but. So really, this is all about your feelings and emotions, and feeling attacked for having stupid ideas and dumb beliefs.

Grow the fuck up.

 

[The Derp]

To get to a surplus, you have to double count social security taxes.

SS taxes go into the general fund.

FFS...

 

[kaz]

You're just pulling this out of your ass, aren't you? You're a libertarian, but you're a liberal, but you're not. No. Libertarian and liberal are not the same thing and whoever told you they were lied to you because they knew you had shit instincts and weren't very intuitive

I am a libertarian, I am a liberal. A true liberal is a political libertarian because that's the only way people are free to exercise their own values.

I am a liberal because I believe in choice and freedom. That is why I am a political libertarian, we are the only ideology that gives people the choice to run their own lives. That is in every way a liberal.

You are not a liberal, you are a leftist. You give people the choice to agree with you only or you will shut them down with violence and arrest or possibly kill them. You are open to nothing you disagree with, even allowing that which you disagree with to be heard. You're a fascist, an authoritarian leftist.

What's unclear about that?

I never said I'm not either libertarian or liberal, I'm both. You can't be one without the other. That's just you doing your business with your hands down your pants.

 

[The Derp]

That's a lie, they never called themselves libertarians

Rand Paul doesn't call himself a Libertarian? Reason Magazine isn't a libertarian magazine? Ted Cruz even called himself a libertarian. FFS...this is more of that entitled bullshit you're been spreading.

Here's Cato saying the teabags are rooted in Libertarianism. That must be why they're so intellectually, fiscally, and morally bankrupt.

 

[kaz]

To get to a surplus, you have to double count social security taxes.

SS taxes go into the general fund.

FFS...

That's what I said. You count it double. You count the money that went into the general fund to pay bills like every other tax as some sort of trust fund. Then you claim it's a surplus, which requires counting the same taxes twice.

You can believe there is no social security trust fund, or you can believe that Clinton ran a surplus.

You cannot believe both. You have to count the same taxes twice to do that.

To believe Clinton ran a surplus, besides double counting, you have to ignore unrealized liabilities as well

 

[kaz]

That's a lie, they never called themselves libertarians

Rand Paul doesn't call himself a Libertarian? Reason Magazine isn't a libertarian magazine? Ted Cruz even called himself a libertarian. FFS...this is more of that entitled bullshit you're been spreading.

Here's Cato saying the teabags are rooted in Libertarianism. That must be why they're so intellectually, fiscally, and morally bankrupt.

You said the tea party called themselves libertarian. That was a lie.

They are fiscally conservative, but they are not libertarian and never said they were

 

[healthmyths]

It also increases debt and deficits because the people in Congress won't control spending..

Moonglow... you have a very good idea regarding deficit reductions by..."Control spending".... where are the areas you would "control spending"? Ideas?

A) One starting point is duplicate agency functions for example. This was brought to the current administration's attention... but was anything done?
It takes 10 different offices at the Department of Health and Human Services to run programs addressing AIDS in minority communities.
Autism research is spread out over 11 different agencies.
Eight agencies at the Defense Department are looking for prisoners of war and missing in action.
And Schriever Air Force Base in Colorado has eight different satellite control centers to control 10 satellite programs.
The report, by the non-partisan Government Accountability Office, identifies 26 new areas where federal government programs are fragmented, duplicative, overlapping or just inefficient. Add that to the 162 areas identified in past reports, and Congress has a road map for saving tens of billions of dollars a year.

I found this link simply by typing "how many government agencies are duplicated by other agencies"

Government often has 10 agencies doing one job

So how complicated is that to find out and then figure out how to consolidate these agencies efforts?

B) Rules and regulations by the federal government require people and other expenses to enforce. This is what Trump calls the "swamp".

The number and cost of federal regulations increased substantially in 2015, as regulators continued to tighten restrictions on American businesses and individuals.
The addition of 43 new major rules last year increased annual regulatory costs by more than $22 billion, bringing the total annual costs of Obama Administration rules to an astonishing $100 billon-plus in just seven years.

Regulation acts as a stealth tax on the American people and the U.S. economy. The weight of this tax is crushing, with independent estimates of total regulatory costs
exceeding $2 trillion annually—more than is collected in income taxes each year.[2] This estimate, however useful as a general guide, is far from precise and likely modest.[3]
Red Tape Rising 2016: Obama Regs Top $100 Billion Annually

 

[The Derp]

ence why I keep pointing out how desperate and hysterical you are to say anyone not a leftist is a Republican. Look at the ridiculous lengths you go to. You just lie on the floor kicking and screaming, conservative, conservative, conservative!

If it smells like shit, looks like shit, walks like shit, talks like shit, believes in shit...then it's shit.

What's funny is that I disagree with Trump all the time. He's as militaristic as Obama was. He's anti-free trade and I'm an avid free trader. He's almost the pig Clinton was with women, though he didn't actually rape them like slick. He spends like a Democrat.

1. I've never seen you say squat about the military.
2. I have doubts that you even know what "free trade" means. And of course Trump's pro-free trade! That's how he makes his money off his branded products that are all manufactured overseas or in Mexico.
3. Spends like a Democrat, how? Your tax cut is why the deficit is at $1T again. Obama had it down to $500B, but you just skyrocketed it back to $1T. Trump wants to cut Medicare and Medicaid by $300B-$500B.
4. Clinton didn't rape anyone, but there are accusations of sexual abuse by Trump. And not only that, but Trump's made it a habit of protecting and defending abusers; from Porter to Neo-Nazis in Charlottesville.

That while your claimed disagreement with the Democrat party is you want Trump to be impeached. You're exactly like them, but someone who agrees with Trump on anything is a Trump supporter.

I'm exactly like them because I disagree with them that Trump should be impeached? Huh?

Exactly the totalitarianism I'm talking about, not leftist = Republican. You're not capable of anything else

Bad, shitty ideas are bad, shitty ideas and simply because you don't like that they're called bad, shitty ideas doesn't mean you're some kind of victim. It just means you're obstinate and ignorant.

 

[The Derp]

I am a libertarian, I am a liberal. A true liberal is a political libertarian because that's the only way people are free to exercise their own values.

You're neither of those things. What you are is lazy and entitled (which are what defines Conservatives). One that thinks hiding behind labels will save you the embarrassment of having your shit ideas called out. What a fucking baby. Everyone must take care around your ego because otherwise you might get upset at having invalid ideas and beliefs...when an adult would admit that they're wrong, accept responsibility, and change their thinking. You're not an adult. You're an entitled brat.

I am a liberal because I believe in choice and freedom. That is why I am a political libertarian, we are the only ideology that gives people the choice to run their own lives. That is in every way a liberal.

Libertarians are like house cats; completely convinced of their own independence, yet wholly dependent on others to survive. My cat thinks he can live just fine free...but that little fucker knows that I'm the one putting food in its dish, scooping its litterbox, and taking it to the vet. He just acts like you...entitled. So congrats for being no better than my cat.

You are not a liberal, you are a leftist. You give people the choice to agree with you only or you will shut them down with violence and arrest or possibly kill them. You are open to nothing you disagree with, even allowing that which you disagree with to be heard. You're a fascist, an authoritarian leftist.

I've never said I was a liberal...so this was you constructing another straw man. I'm a Progressive. A major difference between Progressives and Liberals is that Liberals want to hug Nazis, and Progressives want to punch them. So this is also a tactic of Conservatives; to stake a claim in something, then warp whatever that something is to fit within the narrow argument you've made. I give you plenty of choice to not agree with me, but holding you accountable for that disagreement isn't totalitarianism, it's responsibility. You are here saying that you shouldn't be held accountable for saying and thinking the things you believe because you think you're entitled to it.

Entitlement is earned, and you haven't earned S-H-I-T.

 

[The Derp]

That's what I said. You count it double.

No you fucking don't.

Sigh...

I mean at this point...I don't even know what more to say other than you're a fucking idiot who has no idea what the fuck you're talking about.

 

[kaz]

1. I've never seen you say squat about the military

I said it twice ... today ... to you ...

We also want to greatly reduce our military, get it out of all the wars and make it defensive focused. We're like Democrat Party in that except we mean it

kaz: I want to slash the military by at 1/3 to 1/2, close all foreign bases and make our military defensive focused

2. I have doubts that you even know what "free trade" means. And of course Trump's pro-free trade! That's how he makes his money off his branded products that are all manufactured overseas or in Mexico

by free trade I mean there should be no trade deals, our government should not be involved in trade. Is that free enough for you?

Trump is not free trade. "Fair" trade is his euphemism for government controlled trade. Using the word "fair" with government is idiotic, nothing government ever does is fair

3. Spends like a Democrat, how? Your tax cut is why the deficit is at $1T again. Obama had it down to $500B, but you just skyrocketed it back to $1T. Trump wants to cut Medicare and Medicaid by $300B-$500B

You answered your own question

4. Clinton didn't rape anyone, but there are accusations of sexual abuse by Trump. And not only that, but Trump's made it a habit of protecting and defending abusers; from Porter to Neo-Nazis in Charlottesville.

Clinton raped Juanita Broaderrick and sexually assaulted Paula Jones and Kathleen Wiley.

The nazis are "sexual abusers?" WTF?

And Trump condemned them, he condemned both sides, as he should have done. It was the Nazi fascists versus the antifa fascists and he condemned them both immediately

 

[The Derp]

You said the tea party called themselves libertarian. That was a lie.

NO IT WASN'T!

You had teabaggers claiming they're libertarians while campaigning. Both Rand Paul and Ted Cruz are two examples of Conservatives who called themselves "Libertarians" as they rode the teabag wave into Congress.

See, this is what I mean when I say you do sloppy, lazy work. When given clear examples and cases you completely ignore them and maintain what is (now) a completely false point!

I think you just don't like having your views challenged because it makes you think less of yourself. BARF. Get over yourself.

They are fiscally conservative, but they are not libertarian and never said they were

Ted Cruz tries to seize Rand Paul's libertarian mantle

I mean, really...like, why at this point are you even still posting?

 

[healthmyths]

I've called myself a libertarian since I joined the board, Speed Racer. There's nothing new in that.

Well, let's see...

You joined the boards in December 2010, right around the time that the teabags (who also brand themselves as "libertarian") achieved political power

That's a lie, they never called themselves libertarians

What's not here is your presence on the boards prior to 2010. What I hypothesize is that you had a different profile during Bush the Dumber, one that had post after post of you supporting and defending his policy, and then when Bush left office in disgrace leaving behind a wrecked economy, you rebranded yourself as this new thing in an attempt to avoid culpability, responsibility, and accountability for your support of all the shit policies that created the environment where a guy like Obama could win an election.

I think you want me to accept this new side of yourself because you ultimately don't want to accept responsibility for any of the past shit policies you've supported and defended.

But the problem is you can never erase that stink because so much of what you think makes you a "libertarian" today also makes you a Conservative. You tipped your hand when you said the tax cut wasn't big enough. That was the first real clue that you're just posturing on message boards because of your ego.

Get over yourself.

Hence why I keep pointing out how desperate and hysterical you are to say anyone not a leftist is a Republican. Look at the ridiculous lengths you go to. You just lie on the floor kicking and screaming, conservative, conservative, conservative!

What's funny is that I disagree with Trump all the time. He's as militaristic as Obama was. He's anti-free trade and I'm an avid free trader. He's almost the pig Clinton was with women, though he didn't actually rape them like slick. He spends like a Democrat.

That while your claimed disagreement with the Democrat party is you want Trump to be impeached. You're exactly like them, but someone who agrees with Trump on anything is a Trump supporter.

Exactly the totalitarianism I'm talking about, not leftist = Republican. You're not capable of anything else

What do you mean Trump is "He's as militaristic as Obama was. He's anti-free trade and I'm an avid free trader."...?
A) regarding "militaristic"... one acronym for you ROE. Trump is listening to the experts, i.e. military leaders... Obama.. he micromanaged.
Case in point this ROE:
The Obama administration process frustrated many in the military.
Now for a perfect example of one of the many many onerous ROEs... A laminated card with the following text was distributed to all U.S. Army and Marine personnel in Iraq.
Policies about limiting civilian casualties have soldiers complaining they can't effectively fight; one showed author Michael Hastings a card with regulations including:
"Patrol only in areas that you are reasonably certain that you will not have to defend yourselves with lethal force."
For a soldier who has traveled halfway around the world to fight, that’s like telling a cop he should only patrol in areas where he knows he won’t have to make arrests.
“Does that make any f–king sense?” Pfc. Jared Pautsch.
In Afghanistan, a New General -- But An Old Strategy
Really? That is "militaristic"?????
B) regarding Trump being "anti-free trade" My goodness! you are a product of the biased ignorant MSM!
First to give you an example of how you have been influenced in that opinion about Trump... I just did a Google on
Is this what you base your opinion... ?
Trump is NOT against FREE TRADE! What he like YOU should be is for "FAIR FREE TRADE"!
GEEZ this is a perfect example of how people like you assume things about Trump.
FACT:
Throughout his election campaign, he referred to the TPP as a “horrible deal”, and would withdraw the U.S. from it when elected. When he became president, getting the U.S. out of the TPP was one Trump’s first acts, since he believed that it steals American jobs while benefiting large corporations.

Trump wasn’t entirely wrong. Companies from developed countries that signed up to the deal, such as Japan and the United States,
would have outsourced to developing countries that have low-cost labor and fewer labor laws, such as Vietnam.
In which case, unemployment in developed countries could have risen.
Why Did Donald Trump Kill This Big Free Trade Deal?

...

 

[The Derp]

They are fiscally conservative

Since when is adding at least $1.5T to the debt "fiscally conservative"?

SINCE FUCKING NEVER.

So this is an example of what I mean when I say that you people just keep trying to re-brand yourselves a la "No true Scotsman". Fact is, you can call yourself whatever the fuck you want...when it comes down to it, you're just a lazy, entitled brat.

 

[kaz]

That's what I said. You count it double.

No you fucking don't.

Sigh...

I mean at this point...I don't even know what more to say other than you're a fucking idiot who has no idea what the fuck you're talking about.

You said there was no deficit.

That means you are counting taxes as general revenue because without the social security taxes, there was a deficit

Even though you netted social security taxes against revenue, you're counting them as a trust fund.

1+1=2. You didn't know that, LOL. And I called you an idiot. Nailed it ...

And again, by claiming we had a surplus at all means you have to ignore unfunded liabilities. That's like saying you didn't have a deficit because you're ignoring that the balance on your credit cards went up by more than you saved

 

[kaz]

They are fiscally conservative

Since when is adding at least $1.5T to the debt "fiscally conservative"?

Strawman. I never said that. I said Trump and the Republicans are not fiscally conservative, they spends like Democrats, Speed Racer. Spending is out of control.

You're a hoot. Dumb as a brick, and proud of it!

I simply have to be a Republican or you have no talking points. That's why you're so frantic that I simply have to be a Republican.

I want to slash the military, repeal morality laws, drastically cut spending and all you hear is Republican, Republican, Republican!

LOL, what an idiot

 

[kaz]

What do you mean Trump is "He's as militaristic as Obama was. He's anti-free trade and I'm an avid free trader."...?

On the military, I said "militaristic," I didn't say they used the same strategy. I agree with a lot of what you said, but here's what the argument boils down to.

Saying that Trump is running the war better than Obama may be true, but that doesn't make me want to be in a war that I don't want to be in. Captain Drone (Obama) and Trump both are all over the middle east. I want to leave the middle east. We are just in an endless quagmire and we're not really accomplishing anything. OK, Trump makes enemies then kills them. I'd rather not make enemies.

My standard was "militaristic." They are both militaristic. Again, arguing which is accomplishing their goals better doesn't contradict that.

On the free trade, why did you cut my answer what I meant then ask what I meant? If you want to build on my answer, fine. But don't ignore it

 

[The Derp]

I said it twice ... today ... to you ...

Today...so...yeah...maybe you just came up with that position today for the sake of your argument, which you've already said you have no problems redefining the parameters of before...so...yeah...whatever.

by free trade I mean there should be no trade deals, our government should not be involved in trade. Is that free enough for you? Trump is not free trade. "Fair" trade is his euphemism for government controlled trade. Using the word "fair" with government is idiotic, nothing government ever does is fair

So then who protects the patents from China? Who protects intellectual property from pirates? Who monitors workplace standards and safety for workers? Who protects the environment? See, these are the questions you people never think to ask, mostly because you're just posturing for the sake of your own egos. You're not very serious people. For every trade deal we pull back from, China steps in to fill the void. So all you're doing is ceding influence in the global marketplace to China. Way to go, dingus.

Also, trying to boil the concept of "free trade" down to what you have done really just shows how little you know about the subject. But that's kind of an ongoing theme with you; you spout off about things of which you know very little, and then wiggle around the parameters later on to "clarify what you meant". Well, why didn't you just say what you meant in the first place? Simple; because you don't have a well-thought out position...you're just winging it as you go, aren't you?

I've seen better improv in freshman theater classes.

3. Spends like a Democrat, how? Your tax cut is why the deficit is at $1T again. Obama had it down to $500B, but you just skyrocketed it back to $1T. Trump wants to cut Medicare and Medicaid by $300B-$500B

You answered your own question.

No, I didn't. In fact, what I wrote is the exact opposite of what Democrats do. Obama had the deficit down to $500B, Trump exploded it back up to $1T. So right there, you're saying Trump -who is a Conservative Republican- and Congress -which is controlled by Conservative Republicans- are Democrats because they reversed the Democratic policy of deficit reduction to increase the deficit to $1T while also cutting Medicare and Medicaid. It's Democratic policy to cut Medicare and Medicaid? Since when. This is what I mean when I say you don't know what the fuck you're talking about and are making this shit up as you go, just to preserve your own goddamned ego.

So now we've reached the point of the conversation where you've just given up making sense and having a consistent through line. You're just trolling now, and you can't even do a halfway decent job of that. Is there anything you can do competently? Sure as shit doesn't seem like it.

Clinton raped Juanita Broaderrick and sexually assaulted Paula Jones and Kathleen Wiley.

So now you're really showing that you're a partisan hack, and a Conservative masquerading as a Libertarian (same difference) on a message board. Juanite Broaderrick said, in a sworn affidavit to Paula Jones' lawyers about allegations "that Mr. Clinton had made unwelcome sexual advances toward me in the late seventies... These allegations are untrue" <-directly from her affidavit.

So why are you saying that Clinton raped her when she swore in an affidavit that the allegation was untrue?

The answer is the same thing we always come back to with you; YOU'RE AN ENTITLED BRAT WHO THINKS HE CAN GET AWAY WITH IT.

That's abuser mentality.

And what does Clinton have to do with Trump? Nothing. You're trying to connect them because you have to find an equivalence in everything in order to preserve the shitpile you call an ego. It's not enough to have to admit that Trump's conned you, you have to drag everyone else down to your level to prove that...what...you're not the only shitty person?

Too bad I'm not defending Clinton.

The nazis are "sexual abusers?" WTF?

No, they're just abusers (though they probably also are rapists because they're, you know, nazis).

And Trump condemned them, he condemned both sides, as he should have done. It was the Nazi fascists versus the antifa fascists and he condemned them both immediately

LOL! It wasn't a both sides thing. Trump didn't condemn them, he said that some of them were "very fine people". So is that what you libertarians believe? That there are very fine nazis?