Ending DACA will see the true beginning of Trump's downward economic spiral

[Unkotare]

While in theory I agree with your post, operationally I do not.

That is what the whole, "college conspiracy," is all about. Schools and the establishment only propagate one point of view.

ALL kids are brain washed since a very early age that their only way to have a piece of the American dream is via college.

A greater percentage of kids DO NOT fully comprehend the ramifications of their student loan contracts, they believe they have no other choice. All of your posts in this thread have been to convince me of that fact; that if kids want to have a chance at the good life, they need to sign these contracts. They are too immature to make these decisions that will impact their lives for decades after they sign these contracts. It's wonderful that this discussion has come full circle to the point where you are now telling me that students should beware before they sign these contracts. Funny. Before you were telling me how essential it was to get an education. You can't have both, you really can't. The poor either need to accept the brainwashing, or refuse the slavery of these loan contracts.

These are predatory laws and contracts that take advantage of those who do not understand how the system works. Naturally, you are correct, terms and conditions are clearly laid out, but implications are not understood by the kids who sign on to them. You are being disingenuous if you do not acknowledge this.

As you and I both have been to University, we have both read Plato, we understand this. We know the conditions from which, and under how the different mentalities of the different social strata operate. I not only understand it, but have lived in it. I am not interested in the legalese. You can lawyer this all you want, I am not interested in that. I am only interested in the ethics. If you set up a system to take advantage of those who are the weakest, slowest, and least capable, then surely none of us should be surprised by increasing wealth, opportunity, and educational concentration.

Hell, my friends think I am crazy when I read all the TOS and EULA of websites and Video games. Most middle class folks don't even read that stuff. No one knows what FB and Google has of rights to your data. I usually do, though they change those terms with freighting regularity.

I agree with your position on the banks. It is patently unfair what we did for the banks, yet we do not do the same for America's poor and middle class. It's criminal.

We have de facto two sets of laws which exist in this nation, but this is no different than has existed in every other civilization in throughout history. In this nation, we only give lip service to equality of opportunity. If it weren't, we wouldn't have folks from the same families running for President and Congress, and massive corporations entangled with family foundations monopolizing the nation for centuries with help from the government.

And please, don't get me wrong, I DO see your POV. I am not saying that this is the absolutely true for every poor and middle class person. If you honestly do not believe the system is encouraging folks that don't belong at college and University because Universities have become for profit businesses and because banks have been profiting off of this scam, by all means, keep this up. You won't convince me of that. We have too many degree and not enough jobs for those degrees, IN SOME FIELDS.

In others, your position is true. However, I don't think you will find schools telling kids this truth.

The fact is, the establishment isn't keeping up with trends because it is more concerned with profits.
The Labor Market for Recent College Graduates
FEDERAL RESERVE BANK of NEW YORK

Can the economy absorb more college-educated workers?

Millennial College Graduates: Young, Educated, Jobless

https://www.usnews.com/news/blogs/r...here-the-jobs-are-and-the-college-grads-arent

What a load of crap.

As usual, thanks for your well thought out critical analysis.

As usual, thanks for the endless pile of rubbish. Someone freely entering into a loan agreement for something they value highly is not a "boo-hop, poor, stupid me!" victim. They are adults making decisions, and not helpless, "brainwashed" little babies. Cut the crap.

Cut the crap.

FWIW, though I share your sentiment re: "brainwashed," I wouldn't call all of what MisterBeale has presented "crap." For instance, his assertion that college isn't the right path for everyone is accurate. There is, however, a conspiratorial theme that underlies his "storyline" and I simply do not agree with that. I have seen no evidence that there is, on the part of the actors he's identified, a collaborative, willful and concerted effort to undermine the futures of young Americans who are not "to the manor born."


Were I to identify any single problem with our current education-to-work model, it's that it's currently structured to provide largely only via post-secondary education the KSAs needed to obtain the "regular good jobs." Complicating matters is the fact that employers these days demand a greater level and different genre of skills than they did prior to the 1980s and before. Quite simply, the bar has risen, and no longer is it so that "everything one really needs to know is taught in high school."

The reason I see the aforementioned disconnect as problematic is that until the 21st century, one could obtain in high school the highly demanded KSAs that allowed one to obtain a job that paid a "livable wage." These days, high schools do not. Why not? I suspect because in crush to simply graduate students, they have refrained from raising the bar defining the minimum requirements to graduate from high school. In other words, while businesses have raised the bar for prospective employees, school systems have not done the same. Thus industry's demands and the what our K-12 education system offers are not well aligned. The result is that one must enroll in a post-secondary institution of some sort: junior college, college/university or trade school.

With that post, I can mostly agree.

However, where we depart in our agreement, and where I see the collusion between the financial world, big education, and the government, is the emphasis placed on kids to focus exclusively on college to the exclusion of trade schools, and the current restructuring of high schools that make kids unprepared for life and ready to enter the market once they graduate. They seem unready for anything other than post-secondary education at anything other than a college or junior college. Or at least, that seems to be the purpose for most high schools. Encourage consumption and encourage kids to take on loans to go to college.

A good percentage of these kids shouldn't even be going to college.

http://www.users.humboldt.edu/jwpowell/27806948-Dumbing-Us-Down-by-John-Taylor-Gatto.pdf

Your assumptions are wrong. More and more students are going the vocational route. Competition for enrollment therein is increasing.

 

[MisterBeale]

According to PEW, the majority of Republicans think college is bad for America. Getting rid of those who benefited from DACA means tossing away nurses, engineers, entrepreneurs, not to mention thousands in the military. Republicans have this fantastical idea that once they leave jobs will magically open up for those who have no education nor skills.

There are 6 million jobs available right now that can't be filled because of a lack of skills. Republicans, instead of being jealous and coveting what others have, you need to make your own. That's the only way it works.

4 Years Later: Lives Built By DACA at Risk in 2016 Elections

Once approved, she was able to work as a teaching assistant while pursuing a master's degree in engineering. After graduating in June 2014, she moved back to Arizona and now works as a project engineer.

Her husband Juan Amaya is also a DACA recipient and an engineer. The Phoenix couple recently became parents and purchased a home.

--------------------

See what I mean? Like I said, Republicans don't believe in education. The majority think college is bad for America.

The majority of Republicans say colleges are bad for America (yes, really)

Remember, in Bible, you aren't supposed to "covet" what isn't yours. Instead of 6 million unfilled jobs because of a lack of skills, it will be 7 million. And the Business community is going to love that (snicker).

My kid will either have a tech. certification or marketable associates degree before he graduates high school.

He understands that the corruption coming out of the federal government, intertwining the federal student aid and loan program have encouraged the debt folks take on in this nation and have caused higher education cost to be ludicrously over priced and out of touch with their true cost to benefits.

Every kid needs to watch this documentary entering High School.



The fact is, many illegals get free rides, while citizens get piled on with huge debt.

No social security number? No ability of the FED or credit agencies to put you into a life time of debt, eh? Sure doesn't seem fair for the rest of us.

If they broke the law, they need to be shipped out.

You need to get that critical theory brainwashing outta your head.

The brainwashing is right wingers thinking that deporting the undocumented immigrants is going to magically improve job potentials, decrease social spending, and lower their taxes. It won't. If anything their costs are going to go up.

All of the work currently being done for cheap by undocumented workers, is either not going to be done (like picking crops), or it's going to cost you a whole lot more.

Currently, those undocumented workers working under phoney green cards and SS numbers have the same withholding taxes as legal citizens, but can't apply for government benefits, so their taxes are paid, with no benefits. Once their tax dollars dry up, Americans will have to make up the shortfall.

With 11 million people taken out of the economy and no longer buying food, clothing, cars and shelter, demand for these and other consumer goods will decline, as will the GDP.

But keep believing that things will be better for you when you get rid of 11 million illegals.

meh, it'll all come out in the wash.

11 million fewer folks getting a free ride at college and using free government services, thus, less taxes are needed to run the government.

Have a little faith.


You know what I never see in the media?

How do folks go to college with no SS# I remember when I went, in order to fill out a FAFSA, you needed one?

Does the society just give them a free ride? Do wealthy foundations just fork over the money to them because they are undocumented and disadvantaged?

Basically, I am finding out, they get scholarships, with out exception, just for being the offspring of law breakers. Must be nice.

 

[MisterBeale]

What a load of crap.

As usual, thanks for your well thought out critical analysis.

As usual, thanks for the endless pile of rubbish. Someone freely entering into a loan agreement for something they value highly is not a "boo-hop, poor, stupid me!" victim. They are adults making decisions, and not helpless, "brainwashed" little babies. Cut the crap.

Cut the crap.

FWIW, though I share your sentiment re: "brainwashed," I wouldn't call all of what MisterBeale has presented "crap." For instance, his assertion that college isn't the right path for everyone is accurate. There is, however, a conspiratorial theme that underlies his "storyline" and I simply do not agree with that. I have seen no evidence that there is, on the part of the actors he's identified, a collaborative, willful and concerted effort to undermine the futures of young Americans who are not "to the manor born."


Were I to identify any single problem with our current education-to-work model, it's that it's currently structured to provide largely only via post-secondary education the KSAs needed to obtain the "regular good jobs." Complicating matters is the fact that employers these days demand a greater level and different genre of skills than they did prior to the 1980s and before. Quite simply, the bar has risen, and no longer is it so that "everything one really needs to know is taught in high school."

The reason I see the aforementioned disconnect as problematic is that until the 21st century, one could obtain in high school the highly demanded KSAs that allowed one to obtain a job that paid a "livable wage." These days, high schools do not. Why not? I suspect because in crush to simply graduate students, they have refrained from raising the bar defining the minimum requirements to graduate from high school. In other words, while businesses have raised the bar for prospective employees, school systems have not done the same. Thus industry's demands and the what our K-12 education system offers are not well aligned. The result is that one must enroll in a post-secondary institution of some sort: junior college, college/university or trade school.

With that post, I can mostly agree.

However, where we depart in our agreement, and where I see the collusion between the financial world, big education, and the government, is the emphasis placed on kids to focus exclusively on college to the exclusion of trade schools, and the current restructuring of high schools that make kids unprepared for life and ready to enter the market once they graduate. They seem unready for anything other than post-secondary education at anything other than a college or junior college. Or at least, that seems to be the purpose for most high schools. Encourage consumption and encourage kids to take on loans to go to college.

A good percentage of these kids shouldn't even be going to college.

http://www.users.humboldt.edu/jwpowell/27806948-Dumbing-Us-Down-by-John-Taylor-Gatto.pdf

Your assumptions are wrong. More and more students are going the vocational route. Competition for enrollment therein is increasing.

You know what the difference between my posts are yours are? Links. Evidence.

I have seen or heard nothing about this. Maybe they do where you are from, but I live in an area where demand for this is high, but it is still not emphasized.

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

According to PEW, the majority of Republicans think college is bad for America. Getting rid of those who benefited from DACA means tossing away nurses, engineers, entrepreneurs, not to mention thousands in the military. Republicans have this fantastical idea that once they leave jobs will magically open up for those who have no education nor skills.

There are 6 million jobs available right now that can't be filled because of a lack of skills. Republicans, instead of being jealous and coveting what others have, you need to make your own. That's the only way it works.

4 Years Later: Lives Built By DACA at Risk in 2016 Elections

Once approved, she was able to work as a teaching assistant while pursuing a master's degree in engineering. After graduating in June 2014, she moved back to Arizona and now works as a project engineer.

Her husband Juan Amaya is also a DACA recipient and an engineer. The Phoenix couple recently became parents and purchased a home.

--------------------

See what I mean? Like I said, Republicans don't believe in education. The majority think college is bad for America.

The majority of Republicans say colleges are bad for America (yes, really)

Remember, in Bible, you aren't supposed to "covet" what isn't yours. Instead of 6 million unfilled jobs because of a lack of skills, it will be 7 million. And the Business community is going to love that (snicker).

Says the moron who said we'd have economic collapse if Trump won. Then when he won the markets went up and said moron left for a couple month recovery from his breakdown.

Forgive me for this bit of honesty but you are a certifiable loon. Everything you said was going to happen FAILED TO MATERIALIZE so forgive me for saying your opinion is worthless

 

[Dragonlady]

According to PEW, the majority of Republicans think college is bad for America. Getting rid of those who benefited from DACA means tossing away nurses, engineers, entrepreneurs, not to mention thousands in the military. Republicans have this fantastical idea that once they leave jobs will magically open up for those who have no education nor skills.

There are 6 million jobs available right now that can't be filled because of a lack of skills. Republicans, instead of being jealous and coveting what others have, you need to make your own. That's the only way it works.

4 Years Later: Lives Built By DACA at Risk in 2016 Elections

Once approved, she was able to work as a teaching assistant while pursuing a master's degree in engineering. After graduating in June 2014, she moved back to Arizona and now works as a project engineer.

Her husband Juan Amaya is also a DACA recipient and an engineer. The Phoenix couple recently became parents and purchased a home.

--------------------

See what I mean? Like I said, Republicans don't believe in education. The majority think college is bad for America.

The majority of Republicans say colleges are bad for America (yes, really)

Remember, in Bible, you aren't supposed to "covet" what isn't yours. Instead of 6 million unfilled jobs because of a lack of skills, it will be 7 million. And the Business community is going to love that (snicker).

My kid will either have a tech. certification or marketable associates degree before he graduates high school.

He understands that the corruption coming out of the federal government, intertwining the federal student aid and loan program have encouraged the debt folks take on in this nation and have caused higher education cost to be ludicrously over priced and out of touch with their true cost to benefits.

Every kid needs to watch this documentary entering High School.



The fact is, many illegals get free rides, while citizens get piled on with huge debt.

No social security number? No ability of the FED or credit agencies to put you into a life time of debt, eh? Sure doesn't seem fair for the rest of us.

If they broke the law, they need to be shipped out.

You need to get that critical theory brainwashing outta your head.

The brainwashing is right wingers thinking that deporting the undocumented immigrants is going to magically improve job potentials, decrease social spending, and lower their taxes. It won't. If anything their costs are going to go up.

All of the work currently being done for cheap by undocumented workers, is either not going to be done (like picking crops), or it's going to cost you a whole lot more.

Currently, those undocumented workers working under phoney green cards and SS numbers have the same withholding taxes as legal citizens, but can't apply for government benefits, so their taxes are paid, with no benefits. Once their tax dollars dry up, Americans will have to make up the shortfall.

With 11 million people taken out of the economy and no longer buying food, clothing, cars and shelter, demand for these and other consumer goods will decline, as will the GDP.

But keep believing that things will be better for you when you get rid of 11 million illegals.

meh, it'll all come out in the wash.

11 million fewer folks getting a free ride at college and using free government services, thus, less taxes are needed to run the government.

Have a little faith.


You know what I never see in the media?

How do folks go to college with no SS# I remember when I went, in order to fill out a FAFSA, you needed one?

Does the society just give them a free ride? Do wealthy foundations just fork over the money to them because they are undocumented and disadvantaged?

Basically, I am finding out, they get scholarships, with out exception, just for being the offspring of law breakers. Must be nice.

You are misinformed. 11 million people are not getting "free college". There are only 800,000 people who are eligible for college under DACA.

Dreamers pay for college tuition. What they are getting is access to tuition loans, and only after filling out a lot of paper and getting a work visa and temporary green card valid for two years. Those cards will expire starting in 6 months. Those whose cars expire in the next six months, can apply for one more 2 year extension. This would affect fewer than 200,000 of those currently with cards.

The 6 month period is to give Congress time to come up with a permanent solution to letting them stay.

The 600,000 Dreamers whose cards start expiring 6 months from now will have to leave. And because they filled out all of the paperwork to get temporary status, ICE will have a wealth of information to help find them.

 

[usmbguest5318]

According to PEW, the majority of Republicans think college is bad for America. Getting rid of those who benefited from DACA means tossing away nurses, engineers, entrepreneurs, not to mention thousands in the military. Republicans have this fantastical idea that once they leave jobs will magically open up for those who have no education nor skills.

There are 6 million jobs available right now that can't be filled because of a lack of skills. Republicans, instead of being jealous and coveting what others have, you need to make your own. That's the only way it works.

4 Years Later: Lives Built By DACA at Risk in 2016 Elections

Once approved, she was able to work as a teaching assistant while pursuing a master's degree in engineering. After graduating in June 2014, she moved back to Arizona and now works as a project engineer.

Her husband Juan Amaya is also a DACA recipient and an engineer. The Phoenix couple recently became parents and purchased a home.

--------------------

See what I mean? Like I said, Republicans don't believe in education. The majority think college is bad for America.

The majority of Republicans say colleges are bad for America (yes, really)

Remember, in Bible, you aren't supposed to "covet" what isn't yours. Instead of 6 million unfilled jobs because of a lack of skills, it will be 7 million. And the Business community is going to love that (snicker).

My kid will either have a tech. certification or marketable associates degree before he graduates high school.

He understands that the corruption coming out of the federal government, intertwining the federal student aid and loan program have encouraged the debt folks take on in this nation and have caused higher education cost to be ludicrously over priced and out of touch with their true cost to benefits.

Every kid needs to watch this documentary entering High School.



The fact is, many illegals get free rides, while citizens get piled on with huge debt.

No social security number? No ability of the FED or credit agencies to put you into a life time of debt, eh? Sure doesn't seem fair for the rest of us.

If they broke the law, they need to be shipped out.

You need to get that critical theory brainwashing outta your head.

The brainwashing is right wingers thinking that deporting the undocumented immigrants is going to magically improve job potentials, decrease social spending, and lower their taxes. It won't. If anything their costs are going to go up.

All of the work currently being done for cheap by undocumented workers, is either not going to be done (like picking crops), or it's going to cost you a whole lot more.

Currently, those undocumented workers working under phoney green cards and SS numbers have the same withholding taxes as legal citizens, but can't apply for government benefits, so their taxes are paid, with no benefits. Once their tax dollars dry up, Americans will have to make up the shortfall.

With 11 million people taken out of the economy and no longer buying food, clothing, cars and shelter, demand for these and other consumer goods will decline, as will the GDP.

But keep believing that things will be better for you when you get rid of 11 million illegals.

meh, it'll all come out in the wash.

11 million fewer folks getting a free ride at college and using free government services, thus, less taxes are needed to run the government.

Have a little faith.


You know what I never see in the media?

How do folks go to college with no SS# I remember when I went, in order to fill out a FAFSA, you needed one?

Does the society just give them a free ride? Do wealthy foundations just fork over the money to them because they are undocumented and disadvantaged?

Basically, I am finding out, they get scholarships, with out exception, just for being the offspring of law breakers. Must be nice.

You know what I never see in the media?

How do folks go to college with no SS# I remember when I went, in order to fill out a FAFSA, you needed one?

??? You don't because there's nothing to talk about, i.e., how folks do anything that for folks like you and would be done via a SSN isn't newsworthy. How to do those things without a SSN is among the things that (1) individuals who need to do them without having a SSN, or (2) individuals who want to talk about how people do "this and that" without a SSN, research for themselves.

People spend what they spend on their smartphones and use them to diddle all over Internet sites like Twitter, F-book, I-gram, USMB, the confirmation-bias-supporting blogs and other BS they seek, etc. They should consider using them to perform substantive research too if their phone is their preferred mode of interacting with the greatest research engine/tool ever created.

 

[MisterBeale]

According to PEW, the majority of Republicans think college is bad for America. Getting rid of those who benefited from DACA means tossing away nurses, engineers, entrepreneurs, not to mention thousands in the military. Republicans have this fantastical idea that once they leave jobs will magically open up for those who have no education nor skills.

There are 6 million jobs available right now that can't be filled because of a lack of skills. Republicans, instead of being jealous and coveting what others have, you need to make your own. That's the only way it works.

4 Years Later: Lives Built By DACA at Risk in 2016 Elections

Once approved, she was able to work as a teaching assistant while pursuing a master's degree in engineering. After graduating in June 2014, she moved back to Arizona and now works as a project engineer.

Her husband Juan Amaya is also a DACA recipient and an engineer. The Phoenix couple recently became parents and purchased a home.

--------------------

See what I mean? Like I said, Republicans don't believe in education. The majority think college is bad for America.

The majority of Republicans say colleges are bad for America (yes, really)

Remember, in Bible, you aren't supposed to "covet" what isn't yours. Instead of 6 million unfilled jobs because of a lack of skills, it will be 7 million. And the Business community is going to love that (snicker).

My kid will either have a tech. certification or marketable associates degree before he graduates high school.

He understands that the corruption coming out of the federal government, intertwining the federal student aid and loan program have encouraged the debt folks take on in this nation and have caused higher education cost to be ludicrously over priced and out of touch with their true cost to benefits.

Every kid needs to watch this documentary entering High School.



The fact is, many illegals get free rides, while citizens get piled on with huge debt.

No social security number? No ability of the FED or credit agencies to put you into a life time of debt, eh? Sure doesn't seem fair for the rest of us.

If they broke the law, they need to be shipped out.

You need to get that critical theory brainwashing outta your head.

The brainwashing is right wingers thinking that deporting the undocumented immigrants is going to magically improve job potentials, decrease social spending, and lower their taxes. It won't. If anything their costs are going to go up.

All of the work currently being done for cheap by undocumented workers, is either not going to be done (like picking crops), or it's going to cost you a whole lot more.

Currently, those undocumented workers working under phoney green cards and SS numbers have the same withholding taxes as legal citizens, but can't apply for government benefits, so their taxes are paid, with no benefits. Once their tax dollars dry up, Americans will have to make up the shortfall.

With 11 million people taken out of the economy and no longer buying food, clothing, cars and shelter, demand for these and other consumer goods will decline, as will the GDP.

But keep believing that things will be better for you when you get rid of 11 million illegals.

meh, it'll all come out in the wash.

11 million fewer folks getting a free ride at college and using free government services, thus, less taxes are needed to run the government.

Have a little faith.


You know what I never see in the media?

How do folks go to college with no SS# I remember when I went, in order to fill out a FAFSA, you needed one?

Does the society just give them a free ride? Do wealthy foundations just fork over the money to them because they are undocumented and disadvantaged?

Basically, I am finding out, they get scholarships, with out exception, just for being the offspring of law breakers. Must be nice.

You know what I never see in the media?

How do folks go to college with no SS# I remember when I went, in order to fill out a FAFSA, you needed one?

??? You don't because there's nothing to talk about, i.e., how folks do anything that for folks like you and would be done via a SSN isn't newsworthy. How to do those things without a SSN is among the things that (1) individuals who need to do them without having a SSN, or (2) individuals who want to talk about how people do "this and that" without a SSN, research for themselves.

People spend what they spend on their smartphones and use them to diddle all over Internet sites like Twitter, F-book, I-gram, USMB, the confirmation-bias-supporting blogs and other BS they seek, etc. They should consider using them to perform substantive research too if their phone is their preferred mode of interacting with the greatest research engine/tool ever created.

Thank you.

That doesn't change the fact that the government and financial institutions don't give illegals loans.

"Federal dollars are out of reach for students in the country illegally, but scholarship dollars are not."
https://www.usnews.com/education/be...ants-without-legal-status-can-pay-for-college

 

[MisterBeale]

FWIW, I don't think kids of illegals should be rewarded just because their folks broke the law.

 

[usmbguest5318]

According to PEW, the majority of Republicans think college is bad for America. Getting rid of those who benefited from DACA means tossing away nurses, engineers, entrepreneurs, not to mention thousands in the military. Republicans have this fantastical idea that once they leave jobs will magically open up for those who have no education nor skills.

There are 6 million jobs available right now that can't be filled because of a lack of skills. Republicans, instead of being jealous and coveting what others have, you need to make your own. That's the only way it works.

4 Years Later: Lives Built By DACA at Risk in 2016 Elections

Once approved, she was able to work as a teaching assistant while pursuing a master's degree in engineering. After graduating in June 2014, she moved back to Arizona and now works as a project engineer.

Her husband Juan Amaya is also a DACA recipient and an engineer. The Phoenix couple recently became parents and purchased a home.

--------------------

See what I mean? Like I said, Republicans don't believe in education. The majority think college is bad for America.

The majority of Republicans say colleges are bad for America (yes, really)

Remember, in Bible, you aren't supposed to "covet" what isn't yours. Instead of 6 million unfilled jobs because of a lack of skills, it will be 7 million. And the Business community is going to love that (snicker).

My kid will either have a tech. certification or marketable associates degree before he graduates high school.

He understands that the corruption coming out of the federal government, intertwining the federal student aid and loan program have encouraged the debt folks take on in this nation and have caused higher education cost to be ludicrously over priced and out of touch with their true cost to benefits.

Every kid needs to watch this documentary entering High School.



The fact is, many illegals get free rides, while citizens get piled on with huge debt.

No social security number? No ability of the FED or credit agencies to put you into a life time of debt, eh? Sure doesn't seem fair for the rest of us.

If they broke the law, they need to be shipped out.

You need to get that critical theory brainwashing outta your head.

The brainwashing is right wingers thinking that deporting the undocumented immigrants is going to magically improve job potentials, decrease social spending, and lower their taxes. It won't. If anything their costs are going to go up.

All of the work currently being done for cheap by undocumented workers, is either not going to be done (like picking crops), or it's going to cost you a whole lot more.

Currently, those undocumented workers working under phoney green cards and SS numbers have the same withholding taxes as legal citizens, but can't apply for government benefits, so their taxes are paid, with no benefits. Once their tax dollars dry up, Americans will have to make up the shortfall.

With 11 million people taken out of the economy and no longer buying food, clothing, cars and shelter, demand for these and other consumer goods will decline, as will the GDP.

But keep believing that things will be better for you when you get rid of 11 million illegals.

meh, it'll all come out in the wash.

11 million fewer folks getting a free ride at college and using free government services, thus, less taxes are needed to run the government.

Have a little faith.


You know what I never see in the media?

How do folks go to college with no SS# I remember when I went, in order to fill out a FAFSA, you needed one?

Does the society just give them a free ride? Do wealthy foundations just fork over the money to them because they are undocumented and disadvantaged?

Basically, I am finding out, they get scholarships, with out exception, just for being the offspring of law breakers. Must be nice.

You know what I never see in the media?

How do folks go to college with no SS# I remember when I went, in order to fill out a FAFSA, you needed one?

??? You don't because there's nothing to talk about, i.e., how folks do anything that for folks like you and would be done via a SSN isn't newsworthy. How to do those things without a SSN is among the things that (1) individuals who need to do them without having a SSN, or (2) individuals who want to talk about how people do "this and that" without a SSN, research for themselves.

People spend what they spend on their smartphones and use them to diddle all over Internet sites like Twitter, F-book, I-gram, USMB, the confirmation-bias-supporting blogs and other BS they seek, etc. They should consider using them to perform substantive research too if their phone is their preferred mode of interacting with the greatest research engine/tool ever created.

Thank you.

That doesn't change the fact that the government and financial institutions don't give illegals loans.

"Federal dollars are out of reach for students in the country illegally, but scholarship dollars are not."
https://www.usnews.com/education/be...ants-without-legal-status-can-pay-for-college

Thank you.

You're welcome.

"Federal dollars are out of reach for students in the country illegally, but scholarship dollars are not."

Yes. U.S. citizens and non-governmental organizations are, with very few exceptions, free to give resources to whomever they want and they are free to define the criteria others must meet in order to receive those resources. Such is part of the nature of charitable giving in the U .S.

 

[usmbguest5318]

My kid will either have a tech. certification or marketable associates degree before he graduates high school.

He understands that the corruption coming out of the federal government, intertwining the federal student aid and loan program have encouraged the debt folks take on in this nation and have caused higher education cost to be ludicrously over priced and out of touch with their true cost to benefits.

Every kid needs to watch this documentary entering High School.



The fact is, many illegals get free rides, while citizens get piled on with huge debt.

No social security number? No ability of the FED or credit agencies to put you into a life time of debt, eh? Sure doesn't seem fair for the rest of us.

If they broke the law, they need to be shipped out.

You need to get that critical theory brainwashing outta your head.

The brainwashing is right wingers thinking that deporting the undocumented immigrants is going to magically improve job potentials, decrease social spending, and lower their taxes. It won't. If anything their costs are going to go up.

All of the work currently being done for cheap by undocumented workers, is either not going to be done (like picking crops), or it's going to cost you a whole lot more.

Currently, those undocumented workers working under phoney green cards and SS numbers have the same withholding taxes as legal citizens, but can't apply for government benefits, so their taxes are paid, with no benefits. Once their tax dollars dry up, Americans will have to make up the shortfall.

With 11 million people taken out of the economy and no longer buying food, clothing, cars and shelter, demand for these and other consumer goods will decline, as will the GDP.

But keep believing that things will be better for you when you get rid of 11 million illegals.

meh, it'll all come out in the wash.

11 million fewer folks getting a free ride at college and using free government services, thus, less taxes are needed to run the government.

Have a little faith.


You know what I never see in the media?

How do folks go to college with no SS# I remember when I went, in order to fill out a FAFSA, you needed one?

Does the society just give them a free ride? Do wealthy foundations just fork over the money to them because they are undocumented and disadvantaged?

Basically, I am finding out, they get scholarships, with out exception, just for being the offspring of law breakers. Must be nice.

You know what I never see in the media?

How do folks go to college with no SS# I remember when I went, in order to fill out a FAFSA, you needed one?

??? You don't because there's nothing to talk about, i.e., how folks do anything that for folks like you and would be done via a SSN isn't newsworthy. How to do those things without a SSN is among the things that (1) individuals who need to do them without having a SSN, or (2) individuals who want to talk about how people do "this and that" without a SSN, research for themselves.

People spend what they spend on their smartphones and use them to diddle all over Internet sites like Twitter, F-book, I-gram, USMB, the confirmation-bias-supporting blogs and other BS they seek, etc. They should consider using them to perform substantive research too if their phone is their preferred mode of interacting with the greatest research engine/tool ever created.

Thank you.

That doesn't change the fact that the government and financial institutions don't give illegals loans.

"Federal dollars are out of reach for students in the country illegally, but scholarship dollars are not."
https://www.usnews.com/education/be...ants-without-legal-status-can-pay-for-college

Thank you.

You're welcome.

"Federal dollars are out of reach for students in the country illegally, but scholarship dollars are not."

Yes. U.S. citizens and non-governmental organizations are, with very few exceptions, free to give resources to whomever they want and they are free to define the criteria others must meet in order to receive those resources. Such is part of the nature of charitable giving in the U .S.

FWIW, I don't think kids of illegals should be rewarded just because their folks broke the law.

Okay. You're free to think that and to state as much. I accept that you do think that.

Are there scholarships that one must have broken the law in order to qualify for them? For the most part, I don't know. (see below) My kids may know because they each reviewed an assortment of websites, including the ones listed below, to find merit-based scholarships for which they qualified, and they applied for quite a few of them. They did heeded my instruction for several reasons:

• They knew from "square one" that no organization would give them financial-need-based scholarships, grants or loans.
• They wanted to to go to college.
• They understood that finding and applying for merit scholarships is among the first things a mature and responsible adult who takes ownership of their goals would do to make those goals come to fruition.
• Because they would be adults by the time they got to college, I required them to earn the "Dad will pay your college tuition scholarship" by making a genuine effort to obtain whatever other scholarship monies they could. In return for their effort, the "Dad scholarship" would make up the difference between what they obtained on their own and what they needed to pay for tuition, room, board and books.
  
  That requirement I promulgated was the first major one in the process of weaning them off me. They're adults now. They have to start fending for themselves and applying for merit scholarships was the first "real" thing they had to do on their own. They had to show me (1) the list of scholarships they reviewed along with their analysis of them, and (2) their applications for the various scholarships for which they applied. Seriously, had any one of them not demonstrated what I felt was a suitable level of effort, that child would not have received the "Dad scholarship," and s/he have had to find other means to finance their college education.

Each of my kid's efforts paid off. While they didn't get enough scholarship to pay the full cost of their college tuition, room, board, and books, they did get enough to markedly reduce the sum I had to spend to make up the difference. They also learned that the free ride care of Dad is approaching its end. My oldest is completely off the "Dad train" and conducting his own "train" on his own "railroad." I don't imagine he'll "derail," but if he does, he's going to have to figure out how to get the "train" righted and resume his journey.

Why did I share the anecdote above? Because although my kids didn't secure enough merit-based scholarships to fund their tuitions, they each obtained enough to pay for from a quarter to a third of the tuition to attend, as out of state students, schools like the UC Berkeley, UCLA, UVA, UMCP, UNC Chapel Hill, U. Michigan Ann Arbor, and other excellent public universities/colleges that if one is in-state, are affordable enough that high performing graduates from them should have no trouble repaying loans they may have to take out to make up the difference between any scholarships and grant monies they receive and the costs of going to college.


I do know there a many scholarships that "reward" folks for having accomplished one or more things other than breaking the law. Those scholarships have a variety of criteria. One must examine them to find out what those criteria are.

• Merit-Based Scholarships, Find a Merit-Based Scholarship for College | Scholarship Directory | Unigo
  
• Academic Scholarships And Merit Scholarships - Scholarships.com
  
• Merit-Based Scholarship - Scholarships for College
  
• 10 High Dollar Award Scholarships for College
  
• The Complete List of Colleges Offering Merit Scholarships (so the publisher of the document claims)

Based on a news article from US News, most students receive merit-based rather than financial-need-based scholarships.


Out of curiosity, I "googled" for scholarships for felons and scholarships for refugees/immigrants. I found found the following:

• Scholarships for Felons
  
• Scholarships for refugees/immigrants

I have no idea whether they are the only such scholarships. I suspect that most privately funded scholarships have no "law breaker" provisions in their qualification requirements.

 

[Crixus]

Oh yes, because America didn't prosper until 2012.

Fucking Rdean strikes again and out stupids himself.

Makes me long for Truth Matters.

 

[easyt65]

'Ending DACA'?

DACA does NOT exist. There is no such thing as DACA.

When the Democrats held a near super-majority control of Congress and had Barak Obama in the WH, the Democrats did not care enough to pass DACA Legislation.

Barak Obama did - admittedly, however, violate the Constitution, specifically the Separation of Powers, by by-passing Congress to illegally attempt to create his own personal law.

A while back the GOP offered the Democrats DACA...and the Democrats walked away from the deal...and Latinos, seeing and understanding the Democrats preferred to have the ISSUE of DACA still out there to use to attempt to manipulate them to go to the polls to vote 'Democrat', began to walk away from the Democrats.

At this point, the Latinos should be running. Just recently the GOP offered the Democrats DACA again - everything they wanted...and again the Democrats walked away from the deal...breaking their promise to the Latinos again. This time Pelosi showed she and the Democrats preferred to hold Latinos and this country 'hostage', refusing to do what was best for people and instead doing what they thought is best for PARTY - hurting Trump's 2020 re-election chances.

So, there is STILL No DACA....NOT because of the GOP, and NOT because of the President. There is no DACA because the Democrats have rejected the deal for it several times.

 

[Rustic]

According to PEW, the majority of Republicans think college is bad for America. Getting rid of those who benefited from DACA means tossing away nurses, engineers, entrepreneurs, not to mention thousands in the military. Republicans have this fantastical idea that once they leave jobs will magically open up for those who have no education nor skills.

There are 6 million jobs available right now that can't be filled because of a lack of skills. Republicans, instead of being jealous and coveting what others have, you need to make your own. That's the only way it works.

4 Years Later: Lives Built By DACA at Risk in 2016 Elections

Once approved, she was able to work as a teaching assistant while pursuing a master's degree in engineering. After graduating in June 2014, she moved back to Arizona and now works as a project engineer.

Her husband Juan Amaya is also a DACA recipient and an engineer. The Phoenix couple recently became parents and purchased a home.

--------------------

See what I mean? Like I said, Republicans don't believe in education. The majority think college is bad for America.

The majority of Republicans say colleges are bad for America (yes, really)

Remember, in Bible, you aren't supposed to "covet" what isn't yours. Instead of 6 million unfilled jobs because of a lack of skills, it will be 7 million. And the Business community is going to love that (snicker).

Lol
Only stupid fuckers support DACA...

You’re a socialist, obviously you don’t understand economics

 

[BasicHumanUnit]

Your assumptions are wrong. More and more students are going the vocational route. Competition for enrollment therein is increasing.

Like I said before....exaclty....

because your Screwals are pumping out lazy drones too stupid to go after advanced, high tech or degrees and professions that required advanced mathematics & sciences.
And those are the "smart" ones who actually get off their asses instead of making a career of pursuing lawsuits and govt handouts.

so, we'll have 300,000,000 waiters and 100 Physicists and Neurosurgeons.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Oh yes, because America didn't prosper until 2012.

Fucking Rdean strikes again and out stupids himself.

Makes me long for Truth Matters.

I will never Phear you!

Lair!!!!

 

[Crixus]

Oh yes, because America didn't prosper until 2012.

Fucking Rdean strikes again and out stupids himself.

Makes me long for Truth Matters.

I will never Phear you!

Lair!!!!

Nor will my puppy pear you. TM could be quite gabby.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Oh yes, because America didn't prosper until 2012.

Fucking Rdean strikes again and out stupids himself.

Makes me long for Truth Matters.

I will never Phear you!

Lair!!!!

Miz Truthy!!!! An homage!