Hatred or Anger?

[Correll]

I just searched this entire thread. Show me one post of yours that isn't a troll post. What a fucking loser you must be.

Says the troll who has repeatedly lied and falsely accused me of being a racist but has always failed to produce one single post proving it.

Do you support Trump? He's a liar too you know

You've trolled and lied. Now you are deflecting. Sorry, dude, but I've lost all respect for you because you are dishonest.

He's more honest than you.

He's accused me and others of being racists then ran providing evidence of that libel. Conversely, I've accused both of you for being racists and racially divisive then produced quotes of your posts where you either denigrate people for being white, broad brush people for being white or otherwise attacked being simply because of the color their skin and not the content of their character. That, sir, is racist. Something I am not.

If you think lying and personal attacks will achieve the goals you seek, you are wrong, sir. Very wrong. It will only achieve the opposite such as my lack of respect for dishonest people like sealybobo .

Good post, except that history shows that such tactics DO WORK, and if demographic shift continues, will, within our lifetimes grant them unchecked power.

 

[Correll]

There are people hiring the immigrants. They have a choice. They choose the immigrant. The immigrant doesn't come here demanding a job. They apply like everyone else.

If the immigrant weren't here that job would have went to an American. My dad worked with lots of blacks from Detroit and all their friends wanted them to get them jobs at Ford.

I agree the white hiring manager could have hired a black but didn't because they had a white hard working immigrant who would show up early, stay late, work overtime. We have to eliminate the competition so blacks can prove they are hard working too if given the chance.

The major problem with what you are saying is that blacks have done all these things and then some. You're talking stupid again sealybobo. Nobody black is going to turn down time and a half for overtime or for going past 40 hours. It's more money in our pockets.

And I'm sorry but I'm not just making fun of black Americans. I'm pro union but the lazy American union workers drove the Lincoln ford plant in my town to Mexico. My dad complained for years about the waste, laziness, incompetent coworkers. They were not good employees. Those stupid blue collar workers took their great jobs for granted. Greedy. And they were black and white.

One black guy my dad worked with lost his job trying to steal a car off the lot. Lost a great job with a pension.

And I agree Trump ain't bringing their jobs back.

Did you hear Trump's advice to poor people is move? Didn't I say that too? Lol

It's easy to blame the little guys. They might be somewhat at fault.


I believe the real culprit is bad trade policy.

Agreed it's easy to blame the little guys. There is plenty of blame to go around. Trump oversimplifying the situation by stealing a line from Sam Kinison doesn't help either.

It's a multifaceted situation and I strongly doubt any of us have all the answers. What I do know that it is in our nation's best interests to maximize the potential of our fellow citizens thus producing more productive taxpayers, innovators and soldiers. It's better to have someone producing taxes by earning $30,000 a year than having to pay $30,000 to put them in prison. The Democrat's "war on poverty" has successes but far too many failures over the last half century. Treating Americans like children only results in too many American adults acting like children. This one of the main problems in creating a culture that is dependent upon the largess of government.

All that said, Liberals and Conservatives are, in many ways, like a Mother and Father. They both provide vital elements to the success of raising children to become fully independent, strong and intelligent adults. If one or the other is too dominant, there will be problems. For the past few decades, our nation's government has been like a dysfunctional family. Some want a divorce (secession), others just keep putting down the other side resulting in further dysfunction. There's a reason why most Americans believe our nation is on the wrong track and this dysfunction, IMO, is the main reason.

The problem is simple. Both parties have not bothered protecting or pursuing the interests of Middle America for generations.


Trump was right on the money on issues of Trade and Immigration.


Deport the illegals. Curtain legal immigration. Let the supply of labor decrease giving power and money back to the American worker.

 

[Divine Wind]

Says the troll who has repeatedly lied and falsely accused me of being a racist but has always failed to produce one single post proving it.

Do you support Trump? He's a liar too you know

You've trolled and lied. Now you are deflecting. Sorry, dude, but I've lost all respect for you because you are dishonest.

He's more honest than you.

He's accused me and others of being racists then ran providing evidence of that libel. Conversely, I've accused both of you for being racists and racially divisive then produced quotes of your posts where you either denigrate people for being white, broad brush people for being white or otherwise attacked being simply because of the color their skin and not the content of their character. That, sir, is racist. Something I am not.

If you think lying and personal attacks will achieve the goals you seek, you are wrong, sir. Very wrong. It will only achieve the opposite such as my lack of respect for dishonest people like sealybobo .

Good post, except that history shows that such tactics DO WORK, and if demographic shift continues, will, within our lifetimes grant them unchecked power.

It only works for the dumb half of the voting population....which is a good reason to require an IQ test to vote.

 

[Correll]

The major problem with what you are saying is that blacks have done all these things and then some. You're talking stupid again sealybobo. Nobody black is going to turn down time and a half for overtime or for going past 40 hours. It's more money in our pockets.

That's not the point. And no, no one white or black wanted the overtime. That's why my miser dad always got it. He even worked holidays. And if you didn't take vacation they gave you the money so the cheap ass never took a day off.

Anyways, that wasn't the point. The point is blacks and blue collar whites would definitely benefit if we didn't keep flooding the market with immigrants.

Our immigration policy was written by corporations. We take in enough every year that it keeps wages low. Flood the market.

That was then and at that one factory. My father worked overtime and weekends. He worked at a postal facility. I know of other blacks who worked the factories and did work overtime as much as they could. But any way immigrants aren't taking all that many jobs.

They must be. How many immigrants do we take in every year? They must work somewhere.

And it's not just hurting blacks. There's a small blue collar town in Minnesota where they put a bunch of refugees. If the Americans don't have jobs why did they put refugees there? So you can imagine the tensions are high

I live in the Rust Belt. It hurts scores of millions of whites.

That is why the Rust Belt flipped. Trump was the only one willing to speak out for them.

Not that he's doing much for them, but I agree; between the two deplorables up for the vote, the less deplorable one won the election.

Trump, as a populist, did appeal more greatly to blue collar Americans than Ms. Hillary "I'll keep doing things the same" Clinton. The Democrats, over the past two decades, have moved away from supporting blue collar Americans and moved closer to special interest elitists while using race politics to garner more votes among the poor by offering them money.

After the 2012 debacle and the "Republican Autopsy", the RNC had the opportunity to recruit a "huuuuge" voting block of very conservative, traditional, family oriented and religious Americans, but didn't do it because most Hispanics skin color didn't pass the white paper test. Heck, even GW knew the Hispanic vote was a very important voting block, one that would continue to increase and one that, in many, many ways, was anti-"Liberal".

Trump played hard ball with his opponents. That hardly deserves the term "Deplorable".

Hillary smeared half the nation and told the other half to hate them. She was vile.

What is your point about Hispanics?

 

[LOIE]

I just posted a response to someone saying that Blacks are full of hate. I would like to expand on that post. I believe there is a big difference between anger and hate.

Most married folks have been angry with their spouse at one time or another. Most parents have been angry with their children. But being angry at them does not mean that we hate them.

Lots of black people are angry, and with good reason. But how free have they been to express that anger? How much have they held back and for how long? When black people express their anger over slavery they’ve been told to forget about it. That was years ago. We’re tired of hearing about the past. Stop blaming your troubles on somebody else. Pull yourselves up by your own bootstraps, etc., etc.

I think that eventually many people stopped expressing themselves and held it in because they always got the same answer. They were told how to think, how to feel and how to respond to something that was done to their ancestors. And all the while they watch other groups hold annual prayer vigils in order to “remember the past, so that we do not repeat it.”

While some folks think we should forget the past, others, like me, believe we should apologize for it. The Southern Baptist Convention passed a resolution apologizing for supporting racism for much of its history. It reads in part, “We unwaveringly denounce racism in all its forms, as deplorable sin; and that we lament and repudiate historic acts of evil such as slavery from which we continue to reap a bitter harvest.”

I think Black people have good reason to be angry. I, as a White person, have never felt the pangs from the stares, the negative vibes from the body language, the rejection from the crossing to the other side that many black people have felt. Every time a white person inches away, screws up their face, follows customers around the store, pulls someone over because he looks suspicious, assumes a child can’t learn, passes over someone for a promotion, pays someone less money for the same job, clutches a purse or quickly locks a car door, it is a reminder that for many white people, color still matters. And I don’t think we can get past it until we face it.

I must finally say that I see a big difference between placing blame and telling the truth. People who refuse to hear and accept the truth have no hope of finding solutions to their differences. People who embrace the truth, no matter how painful or self-revealing it may be, will ultimately find themselves set free.

Hello everyone. I am so grateful for the many views and responses to my original post. I've actually been very sick with an upper respiratory infection since the day after I posted it, so this is the first I've been back to the board. Conversation is good!

 

[Divine Wind]

If the immigrant weren't here that job would have went to an American. My dad worked with lots of blacks from Detroit and all their friends wanted them to get them jobs at Ford.

I agree the white hiring manager could have hired a black but didn't because they had a white hard working immigrant who would show up early, stay late, work overtime. We have to eliminate the competition so blacks can prove they are hard working too if given the chance.

The major problem with what you are saying is that blacks have done all these things and then some. You're talking stupid again sealybobo. Nobody black is going to turn down time and a half for overtime or for going past 40 hours. It's more money in our pockets.

And I'm sorry but I'm not just making fun of black Americans. I'm pro union but the lazy American union workers drove the Lincoln ford plant in my town to Mexico. My dad complained for years about the waste, laziness, incompetent coworkers. They were not good employees. Those stupid blue collar workers took their great jobs for granted. Greedy. And they were black and white.

One black guy my dad worked with lost his job trying to steal a car off the lot. Lost a great job with a pension.

And I agree Trump ain't bringing their jobs back.

Did you hear Trump's advice to poor people is move? Didn't I say that too? Lol

It's easy to blame the little guys. They might be somewhat at fault.


I believe the real culprit is bad trade policy.

Agreed it's easy to blame the little guys. There is plenty of blame to go around. Trump oversimplifying the situation by stealing a line from Sam Kinison doesn't help either.

It's a multifaceted situation and I strongly doubt any of us have all the answers. What I do know that it is in our nation's best interests to maximize the potential of our fellow citizens thus producing more productive taxpayers, innovators and soldiers. It's better to have someone producing taxes by earning $30,000 a year than having to pay $30,000 to put them in prison. The Democrat's "war on poverty" has successes but far too many failures over the last half century. Treating Americans like children only results in too many American adults acting like children. This one of the main problems in creating a culture that is dependent upon the largess of government.

All that said, Liberals and Conservatives are, in many ways, like a Mother and Father. They both provide vital elements to the success of raising children to become fully independent, strong and intelligent adults. If one or the other is too dominant, there will be problems. For the past few decades, our nation's government has been like a dysfunctional family. Some want a divorce (secession), others just keep putting down the other side resulting in further dysfunction. There's a reason why most Americans believe our nation is on the wrong track and this dysfunction, IMO, is the main reason.

The problem is simple. Both parties have not bothered protecting or pursuing the interests of Middle America for generations.


Trump was right on the money on issues of Trade and Immigration.


Deport the illegals. Curtain legal immigration. Let the supply of labor decrease giving power and money back to the American worker.

While I agree that both parties have failed to protect the Middle Class, this plan to curtail immigration will, IMHO, likely backfire and result in most agricultural jobs going to Mexico and developing countries. Of course, with the further distances involved, costs will go up to cover transportation.

 

[Correll]

Do you support Trump? He's a liar too you know

You've trolled and lied. Now you are deflecting. Sorry, dude, but I've lost all respect for you because you are dishonest.

He's more honest than you.

He's accused me and others of being racists then ran providing evidence of that libel. Conversely, I've accused both of you for being racists and racially divisive then produced quotes of your posts where you either denigrate people for being white, broad brush people for being white or otherwise attacked being simply because of the color their skin and not the content of their character. That, sir, is racist. Something I am not.

If you think lying and personal attacks will achieve the goals you seek, you are wrong, sir. Very wrong. It will only achieve the opposite such as my lack of respect for dishonest people like sealybobo .

Good post, except that history shows that such tactics DO WORK, and if demographic shift continues, will, within our lifetimes grant them unchecked power.

It only works for the dumb half of the voting population....which is a good reason to require an IQ test to vote.

YOu are kidding yourself if you think that high iq protects you from propaganda.

There are plenty of smart people on this site who have completely bought into this horror show, for reasons, I do not understand.

Rightwinger is one.

 

[LOIE]

If the immigrant weren't here that job would have went to an American. My dad worked with lots of blacks from Detroit and all their friends wanted them to get them jobs at Ford.

I agree the white hiring manager could have hired a black but didn't because they had a white hard working immigrant who would show up early, stay late, work overtime. We have to eliminate the competition so blacks can prove they are hard working too if given the chance.

The major problem with what you are saying is that blacks have done all these things and then some. You're talking stupid again sealybobo. Nobody black is going to turn down time and a half for overtime or for going past 40 hours. It's more money in our pockets.

And I'm sorry but I'm not just making fun of black Americans. I'm pro union but the lazy American union workers drove the Lincoln ford plant in my town to Mexico. My dad complained for years about the waste, laziness, incompetent coworkers. They were not good employees. Those stupid blue collar workers took their great jobs for granted. Greedy. And they were black and white.

One black guy my dad worked with lost his job trying to steal a car off the lot. Lost a great job with a pension.

And I agree Trump ain't bringing their jobs back.

Did you hear Trump's advice to poor people is move? Didn't I say that too? Lol

It's easy to blame the little guys. They might be somewhat at fault.


I believe the real culprit is bad trade policy.

Agreed it's easy to blame the little guys. There is plenty of blame to go around. Trump oversimplifying the situation by stealing a line from Sam Kinison doesn't help either.

It's a multifaceted situation and I strongly doubt any of us have all the answers. What I do know that it is in our nation's best interests to maximize the potential of our fellow citizens thus producing more productive taxpayers, innovators and soldiers. It's better to have someone producing taxes by earning $30,000 a year than having to pay $30,000 to put them in prison. The Democrat's "war on poverty" has successes but far too many failures over the last half century. Treating Americans like children only results in too many American adults acting like children. This one of the main problems in creating a culture that is dependent upon the largess of government.

All that said, Liberals and Conservatives are, in many ways, like a Mother and Father. They both provide vital elements to the success of raising children to become fully independent, strong and intelligent adults. If one or the other is too dominant, there will be problems. For the past few decades, our nation's government has been like a dysfunctional family. Some want a divorce (secession), others just keep putting down the other side resulting in further dysfunction. There's a reason why most Americans believe our nation is on the wrong track and this dysfunction, IMO, is the main reason.

The problem is simple. Both parties have not bothered protecting or pursuing the interests of Middle America for generations.


Trump was right on the money on issues of Trade and Immigration.


Deport the illegals. Curtain legal immigration. Let the supply of labor decrease giving power and money back to the American worker.

Interesting. I've just read something that said the big problem is the failure of government to prosecute the companies that hire illegal immigrants, making it more attractive for them to come here when work is scarce in their country.

 

[Divine Wind]

That's not the point. And no, no one white or black wanted the overtime. That's why my miser dad always got it. He even worked holidays. And if you didn't take vacation they gave you the money so the cheap ass never took a day off.

Anyways, that wasn't the point. The point is blacks and blue collar whites would definitely benefit if we didn't keep flooding the market with immigrants.

Our immigration policy was written by corporations. We take in enough every year that it keeps wages low. Flood the market.

That was then and at that one factory. My father worked overtime and weekends. He worked at a postal facility. I know of other blacks who worked the factories and did work overtime as much as they could. But any way immigrants aren't taking all that many jobs.

They must be. How many immigrants do we take in every year? They must work somewhere.

And it's not just hurting blacks. There's a small blue collar town in Minnesota where they put a bunch of refugees. If the Americans don't have jobs why did they put refugees there? So you can imagine the tensions are high

I live in the Rust Belt. It hurts scores of millions of whites.

That is why the Rust Belt flipped. Trump was the only one willing to speak out for them.

Not that he's doing much for them, but I agree; between the two deplorables up for the vote, the less deplorable one won the election.

Trump, as a populist, did appeal more greatly to blue collar Americans than Ms. Hillary "I'll keep doing things the same" Clinton. The Democrats, over the past two decades, have moved away from supporting blue collar Americans and moved closer to special interest elitists while using race politics to garner more votes among the poor by offering them money.

After the 2012 debacle and the "Republican Autopsy", the RNC had the opportunity to recruit a "huuuuge" voting block of very conservative, traditional, family oriented and religious Americans, but didn't do it because most Hispanics skin color didn't pass the white paper test. Heck, even GW knew the Hispanic vote was a very important voting block, one that would continue to increase and one that, in many, many ways, was anti-"Liberal".

Trump played hard ball with his opponents. That hardly deserves the term "Deplorable".

Hillary smeared half the nation and told the other half to hate them. She was vile.

What is your point about Hispanics?

You don't recall the shit-slinging fest after the Republican Autopsy? https://prod-static-ngop-pbl.s3.amazonaws.com/docs/RNC_Growth_Opportunity_Book_2013.pdf

The Autopsy of the Autopsy
... Tactically, the autopsy also said Republicans needed to revamp their data strategies, perfect micro-targeting and raise lots and lots of money. It suggested “symposiums, lectures and forums” to exchange ideas with minority communities” and “a message that is non-inflammatory and inclusive to all.”

The obvious problem with the 2012 autopsy is that Republican voters in the real world didn't want any part of it. Instead of ideas, they wanted passion. Instead of immigration, they wanted a wall. Instead of a “non-inflammatory” message, they chose a man who channeled their rage. That he tweeted a picture of himself eating a taco bowl on Cinqo de Mayo was just the gravy on the pork chop....


3 years ago, Republicans released an 'autopsy report' — but Donald Trump already shattered it
He continued:

And frankly, it is an issue Donald Trump's going to have to face in a fascinating way. Because if much of the evidence is true that he's bringing in new voters and the Republican turnout is up, the question is can he change the math? But I'm very worried that Trump is going to do dismally with African-Americans and with Hispanics.​

One recommendation of the report in particular dogs Republicans with a devastating contrast between what the party desired to become and the reality in 2016.

It appeared on the eighth page of the report. The Republican Party, it said, "must embrace and champion comprehensive-immigration reform." This came off an election in which the party's nominee had, in the primary, advocated the practice of "self-deportation," which followed Romney until Election Day. He lost the Hispanic vote, 73% to 27%, according to exit polls.

The report warned that if the party did not back immigration reform, its appeal to minority groups would continue to shrink, particularly among Hispanic voters.

 

[Correll]

The major problem with what you are saying is that blacks have done all these things and then some. You're talking stupid again sealybobo. Nobody black is going to turn down time and a half for overtime or for going past 40 hours. It's more money in our pockets.

And I'm sorry but I'm not just making fun of black Americans. I'm pro union but the lazy American union workers drove the Lincoln ford plant in my town to Mexico. My dad complained for years about the waste, laziness, incompetent coworkers. They were not good employees. Those stupid blue collar workers took their great jobs for granted. Greedy. And they were black and white.

One black guy my dad worked with lost his job trying to steal a car off the lot. Lost a great job with a pension.

And I agree Trump ain't bringing their jobs back.

Did you hear Trump's advice to poor people is move? Didn't I say that too? Lol

It's easy to blame the little guys. They might be somewhat at fault.


I believe the real culprit is bad trade policy.

Agreed it's easy to blame the little guys. There is plenty of blame to go around. Trump oversimplifying the situation by stealing a line from Sam Kinison doesn't help either.

It's a multifaceted situation and I strongly doubt any of us have all the answers. What I do know that it is in our nation's best interests to maximize the potential of our fellow citizens thus producing more productive taxpayers, innovators and soldiers. It's better to have someone producing taxes by earning $30,000 a year than having to pay $30,000 to put them in prison. The Democrat's "war on poverty" has successes but far too many failures over the last half century. Treating Americans like children only results in too many American adults acting like children. This one of the main problems in creating a culture that is dependent upon the largess of government.

All that said, Liberals and Conservatives are, in many ways, like a Mother and Father. They both provide vital elements to the success of raising children to become fully independent, strong and intelligent adults. If one or the other is too dominant, there will be problems. For the past few decades, our nation's government has been like a dysfunctional family. Some want a divorce (secession), others just keep putting down the other side resulting in further dysfunction. There's a reason why most Americans believe our nation is on the wrong track and this dysfunction, IMO, is the main reason.

The problem is simple. Both parties have not bothered protecting or pursuing the interests of Middle America for generations.


Trump was right on the money on issues of Trade and Immigration.


Deport the illegals. Curtain legal immigration. Let the supply of labor decrease giving power and money back to the American worker.

While I agree that both parties have failed to protect the Middle Class, this plan to curtail immigration will, IMHO, likely backfire and result in most agricultural jobs going to Mexico and developing countries. Of course, with the further distances involved, costs will go up to cover transportation.

Most agricultural jobs?

You aren't falling for that line of bull that illegals are mostly migrant farm workers are you?

That hasn't been true in generations, if ever.

Deport them ALL.

Curtain Legal immigration.

 

[Divine Wind]

You've trolled and lied. Now you are deflecting. Sorry, dude, but I've lost all respect for you because you are dishonest.

He's more honest than you.

He's accused me and others of being racists then ran providing evidence of that libel. Conversely, I've accused both of you for being racists and racially divisive then produced quotes of your posts where you either denigrate people for being white, broad brush people for being white or otherwise attacked being simply because of the color their skin and not the content of their character. That, sir, is racist. Something I am not.

If you think lying and personal attacks will achieve the goals you seek, you are wrong, sir. Very wrong. It will only achieve the opposite such as my lack of respect for dishonest people like sealybobo .

Good post, except that history shows that such tactics DO WORK, and if demographic shift continues, will, within our lifetimes grant them unchecked power.

It only works for the dumb half of the voting population....which is a good reason to require an IQ test to vote.

YOu are kidding yourself if you think that high iq protects you from propaganda.

There are plenty of smart people on this site who have completely bought into this horror show, for reasons, I do not understand.

Rightwinger is one.

Disagreed about stupid people and intelligent people being equally susceptible to propaganda. It's usually the intelligent people manipulating the stupid people with propaganda. Sure, some intelligent people can let themselves fall for it, but overall, they are in a much better position to see it for what it is.

5 habits of stupid people that smart people don’t have

 

[Divine Wind]

And I'm sorry but I'm not just making fun of black Americans. I'm pro union but the lazy American union workers drove the Lincoln ford plant in my town to Mexico. My dad complained for years about the waste, laziness, incompetent coworkers. They were not good employees. Those stupid blue collar workers took their great jobs for granted. Greedy. And they were black and white.

One black guy my dad worked with lost his job trying to steal a car off the lot. Lost a great job with a pension.

And I agree Trump ain't bringing their jobs back.

Did you hear Trump's advice to poor people is move? Didn't I say that too? Lol

It's easy to blame the little guys. They might be somewhat at fault.


I believe the real culprit is bad trade policy.

Agreed it's easy to blame the little guys. There is plenty of blame to go around. Trump oversimplifying the situation by stealing a line from Sam Kinison doesn't help either.

It's a multifaceted situation and I strongly doubt any of us have all the answers. What I do know that it is in our nation's best interests to maximize the potential of our fellow citizens thus producing more productive taxpayers, innovators and soldiers. It's better to have someone producing taxes by earning $30,000 a year than having to pay $30,000 to put them in prison. The Democrat's "war on poverty" has successes but far too many failures over the last half century. Treating Americans like children only results in too many American adults acting like children. This one of the main problems in creating a culture that is dependent upon the largess of government.

All that said, Liberals and Conservatives are, in many ways, like a Mother and Father. They both provide vital elements to the success of raising children to become fully independent, strong and intelligent adults. If one or the other is too dominant, there will be problems. For the past few decades, our nation's government has been like a dysfunctional family. Some want a divorce (secession), others just keep putting down the other side resulting in further dysfunction. There's a reason why most Americans believe our nation is on the wrong track and this dysfunction, IMO, is the main reason.

The problem is simple. Both parties have not bothered protecting or pursuing the interests of Middle America for generations.


Trump was right on the money on issues of Trade and Immigration.


Deport the illegals. Curtain legal immigration. Let the supply of labor decrease giving power and money back to the American worker.

While I agree that both parties have failed to protect the Middle Class, this plan to curtail immigration will, IMHO, likely backfire and result in most agricultural jobs going to Mexico and developing countries. Of course, with the further distances involved, costs will go up to cover transportation.

Most agricultural jobs?

You aren't falling for that line of bull that illegals are mostly migrant farm workers are you?

That hasn't been true in generations, if ever.

Deport them ALL.

Curtain Legal immigration.

No, I'm not, but I also know that many are. No matter. We'll all know by November 2018.

 

[Correll]

The major problem with what you are saying is that blacks have done all these things and then some. You're talking stupid again sealybobo. Nobody black is going to turn down time and a half for overtime or for going past 40 hours. It's more money in our pockets.

And I'm sorry but I'm not just making fun of black Americans. I'm pro union but the lazy American union workers drove the Lincoln ford plant in my town to Mexico. My dad complained for years about the waste, laziness, incompetent coworkers. They were not good employees. Those stupid blue collar workers took their great jobs for granted. Greedy. And they were black and white.

One black guy my dad worked with lost his job trying to steal a car off the lot. Lost a great job with a pension.

And I agree Trump ain't bringing their jobs back.

Did you hear Trump's advice to poor people is move? Didn't I say that too? Lol

It's easy to blame the little guys. They might be somewhat at fault.


I believe the real culprit is bad trade policy.

Agreed it's easy to blame the little guys. There is plenty of blame to go around. Trump oversimplifying the situation by stealing a line from Sam Kinison doesn't help either.

It's a multifaceted situation and I strongly doubt any of us have all the answers. What I do know that it is in our nation's best interests to maximize the potential of our fellow citizens thus producing more productive taxpayers, innovators and soldiers. It's better to have someone producing taxes by earning $30,000 a year than having to pay $30,000 to put them in prison. The Democrat's "war on poverty" has successes but far too many failures over the last half century. Treating Americans like children only results in too many American adults acting like children. This one of the main problems in creating a culture that is dependent upon the largess of government.

All that said, Liberals and Conservatives are, in many ways, like a Mother and Father. They both provide vital elements to the success of raising children to become fully independent, strong and intelligent adults. If one or the other is too dominant, there will be problems. For the past few decades, our nation's government has been like a dysfunctional family. Some want a divorce (secession), others just keep putting down the other side resulting in further dysfunction. There's a reason why most Americans believe our nation is on the wrong track and this dysfunction, IMO, is the main reason.

The problem is simple. Both parties have not bothered protecting or pursuing the interests of Middle America for generations.


Trump was right on the money on issues of Trade and Immigration.


Deport the illegals. Curtain legal immigration. Let the supply of labor decrease giving power and money back to the American worker.

Interesting. I've just read something that said the big problem is the failure of government to prosecute the companies that hire illegal immigrants, making it more attractive for them to come here when work is scarce in their country.

The time for discussing with part of the issue is the "big problem" is past. For decades such quibbling has been used as a SUBSTITUTE for action.

DO IT ALL, DO IT RIGHT NOW.

DEPORT THEM ALL.

BUILD THE WALL.

FUCK THE EMPLOYERS.

IGNORE NAY SAYERS.

 

[Correll]

That was then and at that one factory. My father worked overtime and weekends. He worked at a postal facility. I know of other blacks who worked the factories and did work overtime as much as they could. But any way immigrants aren't taking all that many jobs.

They must be. How many immigrants do we take in every year? They must work somewhere.

And it's not just hurting blacks. There's a small blue collar town in Minnesota where they put a bunch of refugees. If the Americans don't have jobs why did they put refugees there? So you can imagine the tensions are high

I live in the Rust Belt. It hurts scores of millions of whites.

That is why the Rust Belt flipped. Trump was the only one willing to speak out for them.

Not that he's doing much for them, but I agree; between the two deplorables up for the vote, the less deplorable one won the election.

Trump, as a populist, did appeal more greatly to blue collar Americans than Ms. Hillary "I'll keep doing things the same" Clinton. The Democrats, over the past two decades, have moved away from supporting blue collar Americans and moved closer to special interest elitists while using race politics to garner more votes among the poor by offering them money.

After the 2012 debacle and the "Republican Autopsy", the RNC had the opportunity to recruit a "huuuuge" voting block of very conservative, traditional, family oriented and religious Americans, but didn't do it because most Hispanics skin color didn't pass the white paper test. Heck, even GW knew the Hispanic vote was a very important voting block, one that would continue to increase and one that, in many, many ways, was anti-"Liberal".

Trump played hard ball with his opponents. That hardly deserves the term "Deplorable".

Hillary smeared half the nation and told the other half to hate them. She was vile.

What is your point about Hispanics?

You don't recall the shit-slinging fest after the Republican Autopsy? https://prod-static-ngop-pbl.s3.amazonaws.com/docs/RNC_Growth_Opportunity_Book_2013.pdf

The Autopsy of the Autopsy
... Tactically, the autopsy also said Republicans needed to revamp their data strategies, perfect micro-targeting and raise lots and lots of money. It suggested “symposiums, lectures and forums” to exchange ideas with minority communities” and “a message that is non-inflammatory and inclusive to all.”

The obvious problem with the 2012 autopsy is that Republican voters in the real world didn't want any part of it. Instead of ideas, they wanted passion. Instead of immigration, they wanted a wall. Instead of a “non-inflammatory” message, they chose a man who channeled their rage. That he tweeted a picture of himself eating a taco bowl on Cinqo de Mayo was just the gravy on the pork chop....


3 years ago, Republicans released an 'autopsy report' — but Donald Trump already shattered it
He continued:

And frankly, it is an issue Donald Trump's going to have to face in a fascinating way. Because if much of the evidence is true that he's bringing in new voters and the Republican turnout is up, the question is can he change the math? But I'm very worried that Trump is going to do dismally with African-Americans and with Hispanics.​

One recommendation of the report in particular dogs Republicans with a devastating contrast between what the party desired to become and the reality in 2016.

It appeared on the eighth page of the report. The Republican Party, it said, "must embrace and champion comprehensive-immigration reform." This came off an election in which the party's nominee had, in the primary, advocated the practice of "self-deportation," which followed Romney until Election Day. He lost the Hispanic vote, 73% to 27%, according to exit polls.

The report warned that if the party did not back immigration reform, its appeal to minority groups would continue to shrink, particularly among Hispanic voters.

Oh, yes, I recall that.


1. It was based on the flawed premise that there were no more white votes to be gained. Partially true if you insist on the COnventional Wisdom that A. there are no white interests, and B. that it is racist to even discuss white interest and c that nothing can be done for white people. All which are lies.

2. A political culture based on, at best, malign neglect of it's largest single ethnic group, is a fucked up culture.

3. GW played by that plan. He managed to lose the Hispanic vote by LESS.

Losing by LESS in not a winning strategy.

4. As long as the current liberal lock on the culture, ie POlitical Correctness, remains unchallenged, the GOP will always be doomed.


5. Immigration reform is bullshit. It is code of open borders and republicans HAVE backed that in the past and still lose hispanic votes.

 

[sealybobo]

Says the troll who has repeatedly lied and falsely accused me of being a racist but has always failed to produce one single post proving it.

Do you support Trump? He's a liar too you know

You've trolled and lied. Now you are deflecting. Sorry, dude, but I've lost all respect for you because you are dishonest.

He's more honest than you.

He's accused me and others of being racists then ran providing evidence of that libel. Conversely, I've accused both of you for being racists and racially divisive then produced quotes of your posts where you either denigrate people for being white, broad brush people for being white or otherwise attacked being simply because of the color their skin and not the content of their character. That, sir, is racist. Something I am not.

If you think lying and personal attacks will achieve the goals you seek, you are wrong, sir. Very wrong. It will only achieve the opposite such as my lack of respect for dishonest people like sealybobo .

Good post, except that history shows that such tactics DO WORK, and if demographic shift continues, will, within our lifetimes grant them unchecked power.

Not with all the gerrymandering. They have the poor communities sectioned off

 

[sealybobo]

The major problem with what you are saying is that blacks have done all these things and then some. You're talking stupid again sealybobo. Nobody black is going to turn down time and a half for overtime or for going past 40 hours. It's more money in our pockets.

And I'm sorry but I'm not just making fun of black Americans. I'm pro union but the lazy American union workers drove the Lincoln ford plant in my town to Mexico. My dad complained for years about the waste, laziness, incompetent coworkers. They were not good employees. Those stupid blue collar workers took their great jobs for granted. Greedy. And they were black and white.

One black guy my dad worked with lost his job trying to steal a car off the lot. Lost a great job with a pension.

And I agree Trump ain't bringing their jobs back.

Did you hear Trump's advice to poor people is move? Didn't I say that too? Lol

It's easy to blame the little guys. They might be somewhat at fault.


I believe the real culprit is bad trade policy.

Agreed it's easy to blame the little guys. There is plenty of blame to go around. Trump oversimplifying the situation by stealing a line from Sam Kinison doesn't help either.

It's a multifaceted situation and I strongly doubt any of us have all the answers. What I do know that it is in our nation's best interests to maximize the potential of our fellow citizens thus producing more productive taxpayers, innovators and soldiers. It's better to have someone producing taxes by earning $30,000 a year than having to pay $30,000 to put them in prison. The Democrat's "war on poverty" has successes but far too many failures over the last half century. Treating Americans like children only results in too many American adults acting like children. This one of the main problems in creating a culture that is dependent upon the largess of government.

All that said, Liberals and Conservatives are, in many ways, like a Mother and Father. They both provide vital elements to the success of raising children to become fully independent, strong and intelligent adults. If one or the other is too dominant, there will be problems. For the past few decades, our nation's government has been like a dysfunctional family. Some want a divorce (secession), others just keep putting down the other side resulting in further dysfunction. There's a reason why most Americans believe our nation is on the wrong track and this dysfunction, IMO, is the main reason.

The problem is simple. Both parties have not bothered protecting or pursuing the interests of Middle America for generations.


Trump was right on the money on issues of Trade and Immigration.


Deport the illegals. Curtain legal immigration. Let the supply of labor decrease giving power and money back to the American worker.

Interesting. I've just read something that said the big problem is the failure of government to prosecute the companies that hire illegal immigrants, making it more attractive for them to come here when work is scarce in their country.

I've been saying that for years. So has Thom Hartman. Back before Clinton signed NAFTA Democrats were the union party. Clinton should have vetoed NAFTA. I said back then he let us down.

I know Republican h w bush invented NAFTA and every Republican voted for it but he owned it when he signed it.

Interesting he put worker and environmental protection in no doubt bush and Chaney removed them with Tom delay and Dennis hastert help

 

[sealybobo]

They must be. How many immigrants do we take in every year? They must work somewhere.

And it's not just hurting blacks. There's a small blue collar town in Minnesota where they put a bunch of refugees. If the Americans don't have jobs why did they put refugees there? So you can imagine the tensions are high

I live in the Rust Belt. It hurts scores of millions of whites.

That is why the Rust Belt flipped. Trump was the only one willing to speak out for them.

Not that he's doing much for them, but I agree; between the two deplorables up for the vote, the less deplorable one won the election.

Trump, as a populist, did appeal more greatly to blue collar Americans than Ms. Hillary "I'll keep doing things the same" Clinton. The Democrats, over the past two decades, have moved away from supporting blue collar Americans and moved closer to special interest elitists while using race politics to garner more votes among the poor by offering them money.

After the 2012 debacle and the "Republican Autopsy", the RNC had the opportunity to recruit a "huuuuge" voting block of very conservative, traditional, family oriented and religious Americans, but didn't do it because most Hispanics skin color didn't pass the white paper test. Heck, even GW knew the Hispanic vote was a very important voting block, one that would continue to increase and one that, in many, many ways, was anti-"Liberal".

Trump played hard ball with his opponents. That hardly deserves the term "Deplorable".

Hillary smeared half the nation and told the other half to hate them. She was vile.

What is your point about Hispanics?

You don't recall the shit-slinging fest after the Republican Autopsy? https://prod-static-ngop-pbl.s3.amazonaws.com/docs/RNC_Growth_Opportunity_Book_2013.pdf

The Autopsy of the Autopsy
... Tactically, the autopsy also said Republicans needed to revamp their data strategies, perfect micro-targeting and raise lots and lots of money. It suggested “symposiums, lectures and forums” to exchange ideas with minority communities” and “a message that is non-inflammatory and inclusive to all.”

The obvious problem with the 2012 autopsy is that Republican voters in the real world didn't want any part of it. Instead of ideas, they wanted passion. Instead of immigration, they wanted a wall. Instead of a “non-inflammatory” message, they chose a man who channeled their rage. That he tweeted a picture of himself eating a taco bowl on Cinqo de Mayo was just the gravy on the pork chop....


3 years ago, Republicans released an 'autopsy report' — but Donald Trump already shattered it
He continued:

And frankly, it is an issue Donald Trump's going to have to face in a fascinating way. Because if much of the evidence is true that he's bringing in new voters and the Republican turnout is up, the question is can he change the math? But I'm very worried that Trump is going to do dismally with African-Americans and with Hispanics.​

One recommendation of the report in particular dogs Republicans with a devastating contrast between what the party desired to become and the reality in 2016.

It appeared on the eighth page of the report. The Republican Party, it said, "must embrace and champion comprehensive-immigration reform." This came off an election in which the party's nominee had, in the primary, advocated the practice of "self-deportation," which followed Romney until Election Day. He lost the Hispanic vote, 73% to 27%, according to exit polls.

The report warned that if the party did not back immigration reform, its appeal to minority groups would continue to shrink, particularly among Hispanic voters.

Oh, yes, I recall that.


1. It was based on the flawed premise that there were no more white votes to be gained. Partially true if you insist on the COnventional Wisdom that A. there are no white interests, and B. that it is racist to even discuss white interest and c that nothing can be done for white people. All which are lies.

2. A political culture based on, at best, malign neglect of it's largest single ethnic group, is a fucked up culture.

3. GW played by that plan. He managed to lose the Hispanic vote by LESS.

Losing by LESS in not a winning strategy.

4. As long as the current liberal lock on the culture, ie POlitical Correctness, remains unchallenged, the GOP will always be doomed.


5. Immigration reform is bullshit. It is code of open borders and republicans HAVE backed that in the past and still lose hispanic votes.

If you want this to remain a "white" society, and I think you mean holsome safe prosperous hard working rewards success type of country I think we need to cut immigration until wages go up again so that people are saving and spending again. I mean the average guy can support his family working at Walmart. Otherwise no one will work at Walmart.

Republicans think the free market should be free to get our government to pass policies that screw the people. The government represents the people not the corporations.

You Republicans now see the government does have a lot to do with the free market. You're finally admitting the government is the ultimate referee judge jury and executioner. If they flood the market with cheap labor they screw us all. Supply and demand.

 

[Divine Wind]

They must be. How many immigrants do we take in every year? They must work somewhere.

And it's not just hurting blacks. There's a small blue collar town in Minnesota where they put a bunch of refugees. If the Americans don't have jobs why did they put refugees there? So you can imagine the tensions are high

I live in the Rust Belt. It hurts scores of millions of whites.

That is why the Rust Belt flipped. Trump was the only one willing to speak out for them.

Not that he's doing much for them, but I agree; between the two deplorables up for the vote, the less deplorable one won the election.

Trump, as a populist, did appeal more greatly to blue collar Americans than Ms. Hillary "I'll keep doing things the same" Clinton. The Democrats, over the past two decades, have moved away from supporting blue collar Americans and moved closer to special interest elitists while using race politics to garner more votes among the poor by offering them money.

After the 2012 debacle and the "Republican Autopsy", the RNC had the opportunity to recruit a "huuuuge" voting block of very conservative, traditional, family oriented and religious Americans, but didn't do it because most Hispanics skin color didn't pass the white paper test. Heck, even GW knew the Hispanic vote was a very important voting block, one that would continue to increase and one that, in many, many ways, was anti-"Liberal".

Trump played hard ball with his opponents. That hardly deserves the term "Deplorable".

Hillary smeared half the nation and told the other half to hate them. She was vile.

What is your point about Hispanics?

You don't recall the shit-slinging fest after the Republican Autopsy? https://prod-static-ngop-pbl.s3.amazonaws.com/docs/RNC_Growth_Opportunity_Book_2013.pdf

The Autopsy of the Autopsy
... Tactically, the autopsy also said Republicans needed to revamp their data strategies, perfect micro-targeting and raise lots and lots of money. It suggested “symposiums, lectures and forums” to exchange ideas with minority communities” and “a message that is non-inflammatory and inclusive to all.”

The obvious problem with the 2012 autopsy is that Republican voters in the real world didn't want any part of it. Instead of ideas, they wanted passion. Instead of immigration, they wanted a wall. Instead of a “non-inflammatory” message, they chose a man who channeled their rage. That he tweeted a picture of himself eating a taco bowl on Cinqo de Mayo was just the gravy on the pork chop....


3 years ago, Republicans released an 'autopsy report' — but Donald Trump already shattered it
He continued:

And frankly, it is an issue Donald Trump's going to have to face in a fascinating way. Because if much of the evidence is true that he's bringing in new voters and the Republican turnout is up, the question is can he change the math? But I'm very worried that Trump is going to do dismally with African-Americans and with Hispanics.​

One recommendation of the report in particular dogs Republicans with a devastating contrast between what the party desired to become and the reality in 2016.

It appeared on the eighth page of the report. The Republican Party, it said, "must embrace and champion comprehensive-immigration reform." This came off an election in which the party's nominee had, in the primary, advocated the practice of "self-deportation," which followed Romney until Election Day. He lost the Hispanic vote, 73% to 27%, according to exit polls.

The report warned that if the party did not back immigration reform, its appeal to minority groups would continue to shrink, particularly among Hispanic voters.

Oh, yes, I recall that.


1. It was based on the flawed premise that there were no more white votes to be gained. Partially true if you insist on the COnventional Wisdom that A. there are no white interests, and B. that it is racist to even discuss white interest and c that nothing can be done for white people. All which are lies.

2. A political culture based on, at best, malign neglect of it's largest single ethnic group, is a fucked up culture.

3. GW played by that plan. He managed to lose the Hispanic vote by LESS.

Losing by LESS in not a winning strategy.

4. As long as the current liberal lock on the culture, ie POlitical Correctness, remains unchallenged, the GOP will always be doomed.


5. Immigration reform is bullshit. It is code of open borders and republicans HAVE backed that in the past and still lose hispanic votes.

1) The flawed premise is people who think "white", "black" or any other subsection of people's interests supersede American interests.

2) The malign neglect of any Americans is wrong, but I fail to see how that applies with the "Republican Autopsy".

3) GW recognized good Republicans when he saw them. That doesn't mean he was neglecting other Republicans. As a governor, he also recognized he represented all Texans, not just those who were white.

4) PC is being challenged all the time. Notice the inroads on taking down institutionalized racism like Affirmative Action.

5) Immigration reform is complex, but it's certainly not "open borders" even if idealistic Liberals want it that way.

 

[Unkotare]

I live in the Rust Belt. It hurts scores of millions of whites.

That is why the Rust Belt flipped. Trump was the only one willing to speak out for them.

Not that he's doing much for them, but I agree; between the two deplorables up for the vote, the less deplorable one won the election.

Trump, as a populist, did appeal more greatly to blue collar Americans than Ms. Hillary "I'll keep doing things the same" Clinton. The Democrats, over the past two decades, have moved away from supporting blue collar Americans and moved closer to special interest elitists while using race politics to garner more votes among the poor by offering them money.

After the 2012 debacle and the "Republican Autopsy", the RNC had the opportunity to recruit a "huuuuge" voting block of very conservative, traditional, family oriented and religious Americans, but didn't do it because most Hispanics skin color didn't pass the white paper test. Heck, even GW knew the Hispanic vote was a very important voting block, one that would continue to increase and one that, in many, many ways, was anti-"Liberal".

Trump played hard ball with his opponents. That hardly deserves the term "Deplorable".

Hillary smeared half the nation and told the other half to hate them. She was vile.

What is your point about Hispanics?

You don't recall the shit-slinging fest after the Republican Autopsy? https://prod-static-ngop-pbl.s3.amazonaws.com/docs/RNC_Growth_Opportunity_Book_2013.pdf

The Autopsy of the Autopsy
... Tactically, the autopsy also said Republicans needed to revamp their data strategies, perfect micro-targeting and raise lots and lots of money. It suggested “symposiums, lectures and forums” to exchange ideas with minority communities” and “a message that is non-inflammatory and inclusive to all.”

The obvious problem with the 2012 autopsy is that Republican voters in the real world didn't want any part of it. Instead of ideas, they wanted passion. Instead of immigration, they wanted a wall. Instead of a “non-inflammatory” message, they chose a man who channeled their rage. That he tweeted a picture of himself eating a taco bowl on Cinqo de Mayo was just the gravy on the pork chop....


3 years ago, Republicans released an 'autopsy report' — but Donald Trump already shattered it
He continued:

And frankly, it is an issue Donald Trump's going to have to face in a fascinating way. Because if much of the evidence is true that he's bringing in new voters and the Republican turnout is up, the question is can he change the math? But I'm very worried that Trump is going to do dismally with African-Americans and with Hispanics.​

One recommendation of the report in particular dogs Republicans with a devastating contrast between what the party desired to become and the reality in 2016.

It appeared on the eighth page of the report. The Republican Party, it said, "must embrace and champion comprehensive-immigration reform." This came off an election in which the party's nominee had, in the primary, advocated the practice of "self-deportation," which followed Romney until Election Day. He lost the Hispanic vote, 73% to 27%, according to exit polls.

The report warned that if the party did not back immigration reform, its appeal to minority groups would continue to shrink, particularly among Hispanic voters.

Oh, yes, I recall that.


1. It was based on the flawed premise that there were no more white votes to be gained. Partially true if you insist on the COnventional Wisdom that A. there are no white interests, and B. that it is racist to even discuss white interest and c that nothing can be done for white people. All which are lies.

2. A political culture based on, at best, malign neglect of it's largest single ethnic group, is a fucked up culture.

3. GW played by that plan. He managed to lose the Hispanic vote by LESS.

Losing by LESS in not a winning strategy.

4. As long as the current liberal lock on the culture, ie POlitical Correctness, remains unchallenged, the GOP will always be doomed.


5. Immigration reform is bullshit. It is code of open borders and republicans HAVE backed that in the past and still lose hispanic votes.

If you want this to remain a "white" society, and I think you mean holsome [sic] safe prosperous hard working rewards success type of country ......

How fucking racist must one be to define that as "a white society"? More shameless hypocrisy from the left.

 

[Unkotare]

.......

Republicans think the free market should be free to get our government to pass policies that screw the people. .......

That is, of course, not true. That is more ignorant, hyper-partisan nonsense of the sort that precludes reasonable discussion.