Healthcare Poll

[Centrism'sVoice]

4. In addition, I support requiring all non-elective care to be given only on a not-for-profit basis.

Like you, nodog, I think all 5 of the other items are of equal importance, but if I HAD to rank them, it would be (in descending order) B, C, E, A, D.

 

[ElmerMudd]

The health care available in America is the best health care in the world. However, there needs to be some tweaks to the system. I believe the following things would greatly improve the health care system here in America:

(1) Standardized prices for medical services throughout the entire US. Shouldn't it cost the same thing in North Dakota as it does in Southern California to fix a broken arm?

(2) Reasonable charges for services provided by hospitals. An aspirin shouldn't cost more than 50 cents. It surely shouldn't cost $9.00 or more.

(3) Medical insurance that is accepted by every doctor, every hospital and every clinic. If you have medical insurance it should be accepted by everyone who provides medical care.

(4) Medical insurance that is affordable for every American. It is entirely your own personal choice to purchase medical insurance. However, if you decide to invest in medical insurance it should be affordable enough that anybody who was really serious about wanting it could afford it. It should be standardized. Should cost the same thing, country wide.

(5) No co-pays.

(6) No deductables.

(7) People who provide medical care should accept whatever the insurance company pays as full payment for those services.

(8) Your insurance coverage cannot be cancelled except for lack of payment of the policy. Specifically, the insurance companies cannot drop your coverage after you have just had a $100,000 surgery bill or have been diagnosed with a major illness.

(9) Timely payments to the providers of your medical care by the insurance companies.

(10) No medical services provided to any illegal alien within the United States by any medical facility.

(11) If your doctor says you need a particular medical treatment or procedure, the insurance company would be bound by law to pay for that service in full.

(12) Because medications are a part of the medical care directed by your physician, insurance companies should provide full coverage for these meds.

(13) Cannot be denied insurance coverage due to pre-existing conditions.

I believe if we could get the government to pass laws governing these issues we would be better off as a country. Other than passing these kind of laws, the government has no business in the health care business.

I agree with your changes. I could live with that. But I think it is more than a tweak.

 

[KMAN]

3

 

[ElmerMudd]

Elmer - good points and I respect your opinion. But I don't see where making healthcare "unaffordable" maximizes profits for insurance companies. I mean if it's "unaffordable" wouldn't they lose customers and doesn't that LOWER their profits?

With publicly traded corporations gross profit margins are more important than gross profit dollars.

They would rather have fewer policies at higher profit margins than many policies at a very low profit margin.
They can increase profit margins by offering less coverage at the lower price levels.

They cannot price so high they would lose all customers or too many customers but as they push to incrase profit margins thery price many out of the market.

They are measured by the same financial criteria as all publicly traded corporations.

I feel there is a place for private insurance in the healthcare model but ther needs to be government options or government regulations.

If not we will all be treated like WalMart employees.

 

[nodoginnafight]

So, you don't believe that people should be responsible for themselves?

Are you asking me if it is my opinion that people should be responsible for themselves? My agreeing with a particular opinion doesn't make it a fact in my opinion.

And, from examples I've stated, you can see they fail at that job. if they can't handle the responsibilities we have already entrusted them with how do you think they can handle even more? To me that is poor judgment. EDIT: Lets take wage war from your list of important issues....they failed to interpret 9/11 intelligence and failed at their Iraq WMD intelligence (at least they gave iraq a govt but look at the expensive, in money and lives, failures in getting there.) OH and afghanistan, yeah thats not going to good right now either.

I think our elected representatives have sometimes made decisions about important issues that I agree with and sometimes they make decisions that I disagree with. But whether I agree or not, it is still their job. I don't advocate abolishing government because they've made some decisions I don't like.

I wouldn't expect anything less from a bleeding heart liberal.

Up until three years ago I was a registered republican and I am still fiscally conservative, I oppose abortion, I volunteer for several organizations, and yesterday I presented about $30,000 in donations to non-profit community help organizations (it's part of my job to help raise and distribute grants.)
Maybe you should learn more about someone before you try to pigeon hole them and vilify them for positions they don't even hold .... just a suggestion.

 

[nodoginnafight]

(1) Standardized prices for medical services throughout the entire US. Shouldn't it cost the same thing in North Dakota as it does in Southern California to fix a broken arm?

Not really - Wages and the costs of transporting your supplies can vary tremendously. The same applies for your number 4. The cost of insuring inner-city folks is not the same as the cost of insuring suburbanites.

But the rest of your suggestions sound pretty good to me.

 

[Yukon]

yukon, so then would you say that you lean toward 4 or 5?

.............# 5 !

 

[Lonestar_logic]

So, you don't believe that people should be responsible for themselves?

Are you asking me if it is my opinion that people should be responsible for themselves? My agreeing with a particular opinion doesn't make it a fact in my opinion.

And, from examples I've stated, you can see they fail at that job. if they can't handle the responsibilities we have already entrusted them with how do you think they can handle even more? To me that is poor judgment. EDIT: Lets take wage war from your list of important issues....they failed to interpret 9/11 intelligence and failed at their Iraq WMD intelligence (at least they gave iraq a govt but look at the expensive, in money and lives, failures in getting there.) OH and afghanistan, yeah thats not going to good right now either.

I think our elected representatives have sometimes made decisions about important issues that I agree with and sometimes they make decisions that I disagree with. But whether I agree or not, it is still their job. I don't advocate abolishing government because they've made some decisions I don't like.

I wouldn't expect anything less from a bleeding heart liberal.

Up until three years ago I was a registered republican and I am still fiscally conservative, I oppose abortion, I volunteer for several organizations, and yesterday I presented about $30,000 in donations to non-profit community help organizations (it's part of my job to help raise and distribute grants.)
Maybe you should learn more about someone before you try to pigeon hole them and vilify them for positions they don't even hold .... just a suggestion.

Is this a common practice for you, nitpicking comments you wish to address while ignoring the other points that were made?

From what I've read you haven't a conservative bone in your body. Conservatives believe in individual responsibility, you obviously don't have an opinion on that one way or the other. Not a very conservative POV. Conservatives are for small govt. you haven't shown that you agree with that as a matter of fact you have expressed to opposite.

By the way, giving away other peoples money doesn't make you a charitable person.

 

[nodoginnafight]

Is this a common practice for you, nitpicking comments you wish to address while ignoring the other points that were made?

Do you make it a point to run away from threads when you've been proven wrong. Two outta two today tex - add the "what can we agree on" thread to the ever mounting list.

Look, tex, it's obvious that all you want to do is try to pick a fight. And when you lose that fight you leave and go somewhere else to pick another one. (Where you typically lose again).

Of course when all you can offer is name-calling and making assumptions about people you know absolutely nothing about, you're probably very used to losing arguments by now.

You can argue anyway you choose and you can hold any opinion you choose. But if you are going to go all apoplectic when someone disagrees with you, you are going to remain a bitter and unhappy person.

 

[nodoginnafight]

.............# 5 !

Thanks Yukon. For the most part folks have been discussing the issue respectfully and I really appreciate that. I learn quite a bit when people can discuss things rationally and logically. And I really enjoy that.

 

[nodoginnafight]

Lonestar - I see you finally returned to the "what we can agree to" thread and admitted your mistake. Apology accepted - thank you.

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

[

And, from examples I've stated, you can see they fail at that job. if they can't handle the responsibilities we have already entrusted them with how do you think they can handle even more? To me that is poor judgment. EDIT: Lets take wage war from your list of important issues....they failed to interpret 9/11 intelligence and failed at their Iraq WMD intelligence (at least they gave iraq a govt but look at the expensive, in money and lives, failures in getting there.) OH and afghanistan, yeah thats not going to good right now either.

I think our elected representatives have sometimes made decisions about important issues that I agree with and sometimes they make decisions that I disagree with. But whether I agree or not, it is still their job. I don't advocate abolishing government because they've made some decisions I don't like.

I totally understand and respect that stance. The current groups of Dems and Reps in the house and senate have just been way too much of a dissapointment to me for me to get past it and trust them to do their job. If they all get booted out I might trust the next group to do things in a smart and effective manner, if they show me they are capable.

I Just cant get past all the failures of our last 2 congresses and president and Obama's track record so far isn't long enough for me to decide if I trust him with this or not, i'm leaning toward not but not quite there.


As far as respectable posts....they happen sometimes and i like that you pointed it out. Rep coming your way

 

[nodoginnafight]

The current groups of Dems and Reps in the house and senate have just been way too much of a dissapointment to me for me to get past it and trust them to do their job. If they all get booted out I might trust the next group to do things in a smart and effective manner, if they show me they are capable.

I Just cant get past all the failures of our last 2 congresses and president and Obama's track record so far isn't long enough for me to decide if I trust him with this or not, i'm leaning toward not but not quite there. As far as respectable posts....they happen sometimes and i like that you pointed it out. Rep coming your way

I can certainly understand that. (And thanks)

 

[nodoginnafight]

If they all get booted out I might trust the next group to do things in a smart and effective manner, if they show me they are capable.

The problem with getting that done is that so many people who say, "throw the bums out" are reffering to politicians who represent other people. So many people think, "My guy is OK, but the rest of those fools all stink."

So few incumbents wind up getting tossed.

It's a pain, but elected representatives are elected by and represent local areas. And those folks have every right to elect whoever they want.

 

[Yukon]

I feel sorry for Americans. They pay outrageous health insurance premiums and yet they are denied care at the whim of the HMO reps. How sad.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

Is this a common practice for you, nitpicking comments you wish to address while ignoring the other points that were made?

Do you make it a point to run away from threads when you've been proven wrong. Two outta two today tex - add the "what can we agree on" thread to the ever mounting list.

Look, tex, it's obvious that all you want to do is try to pick a fight. And when you lose that fight you leave and go somewhere else to pick another one. (Where you typically lose again).

Of course when all you can offer is name-calling and making assumptions about people you know absolutely nothing about, you're probably very used to losing arguments by now.

You can argue anyway you choose and you can hold any opinion you choose. But if you are going to go all apoplectic when someone disagrees with you, you are going to remain a bitter and unhappy person.

Run away? What the fuck are you talking about? No one is running away, especially me.

You have a point then make it, if not, then shut the fuck up!

The fact that I have a job to do and can't spend every second responding to your asinine arguments doesn't mean I'm running away.

You do know what a job is don't you?

If I recall right, you were the one that conceded.

 

[nodoginnafight]

I feel sorry for Americans. They pay outrageous health insurance premiums and yet they are denied care at the whim of the HMO reps. How sad.

I do have serious problems with accountants making medical decisions as well. But I also think that fear of malpractice suits can prompt doctors to order a lot of extra tests that may seem unecessary.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

Lonestar - I see you finally returned to the "what we can agree to" thread and admitted your mistake. Apology accepted - thank you.

Trust your kind to make shit up. Fact is you conceded and I accepted your concession.

Just for grins, show me where I aoplogized.

 

[Ringel05]

I am wondering how the posters here feel about healthcare. Do you think:
1) The current system is fine - no need to try to fix what isn't broken.
2) The current system is fine, but a few minor tweaks may be in order.
3) The current system is OK, but we need to make some significant improvements.
4) The current system has major flaws that require major fixes.
5) The current system is totally shot - we should throw it out and start all over with a entirely new set of goals and an entirely different system.
6) Some other viewpoint (please explain)

and furthermore, what elements are the most important to you:
A) Cost
B) Availability of care
C) Quality of care
D) Portability and continuous coverage
E) Preventative care

And finally, are there other aspects of the issue not addressed above that you think are vital parts of a successful healthcare program?

In the spirit of full disclosure, may answers are:
3) The current system is OK, but we need to make some significant improvements. And while I think A-E are ALL important I rank them in this order: B, C, A, E, D.

Somewhere between two, three and four (some aspects need minor adjustments, some need major adjustments and some definitly need to be revamped).
C,A,B,E & D

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

If they all get booted out I might trust the next group to do things in a smart and effective manner, if they show me they are capable.

The problem with getting that done is that so many people who say, "throw the bums out" are reffering to politicians who represent other people. So many people think, "My guy is OK, but the rest of those fools all stink."

So few incumbents wind up getting tossed.

It's a pain, but elected representatives are elected by and represent local areas. And those folks have every right to elect whoever they want.

I was JUST saying that to my co-worker.

Most people's mindset is "My guy is cool, everyone else's suck"

my representatives are non-representing But my state loves the Kennedy family and Kerry sounds close enough to kennedy for most voters