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The fact that fascism attacked minorities and communism supported minorities makes no difference?
Genocide arose out of Marx's master-theory of history -- feudalism giving place inevitably to capitalism, capitalism to socialism. The lesser races of Europe -- Basques, Serbs, Bretons and others -- being sunk in feudalism, were counter-revolutionary; having failed to develop a bourgeoisie, they would be two steps behind in the historical process. Engels dismissed them as left-overs and ethnic trash (Voelkerabfall), and called for their extinction.
Wear a helmet, falling off your tricycle left you concussedI largely agree with you in these posts Discom, but then you say "bottom up" and "populist"...WTF.....do you not agree that Hitler got his start as an agent for German military intelligence? Hardly bottom-up,.....Now I can see why you could say he appealed to the populace but that defines almost all politicians to a certain extent, and would be a misuse of the word populist.There are no legitimate historians anywhere who would concur with your alleged view. Fascism and Nazism were right wing, ultra conservative, bottom up, populist movements. End of story. There never was any actual controversy on this point.....never could have been.see, that is where you fail because the truth...and facts...."doesn't care about (your) superficial interpretations..."They seem not to understand that history doesn't care about their superficial interpretations.
To a certain extent political definitions will always be distorted.
Communism for example at its base seems to indicate rule by the commune, i.e. small, limited government.
So Communism = Conservatism
So to pull a Jonah Goldberg, Communism = ConservatismDoes. Not. Compute.Communism for example at its base seems to indicate rule by the commune, i.e. small, limited government.
So Communism = Conservatism
Wear a helmet, falling off your tricycle left you concussedI largely agree with you in these posts Discom, but then you say "bottom up" and "populist"...WTF.....do you not agree that Hitler got his start as an agent for German military intelligence? Hardly bottom-up,.....Now I can see why you could say he appealed to the populace but that defines almost all politicians to a certain extent, and would be a misuse of the word populist.There are no legitimate historians anywhere who would concur with your alleged view. Fascism and Nazism were right wing, ultra conservative, bottom up, populist movements. End of story. There never was any actual controversy on this point.....never could have been.see, that is where you fail because the truth...and facts...."doesn't care about (your) superficial interpretations..."They seem not to understand that history doesn't care about their superficial interpretations.
To a certain extent political definitions will always be distorted.
Communism for example at its base seems to indicate rule by the commune, i.e. small, limited government.
So Communism = ConservatismSo to pull a Jonah Goldberg, Communism = ConservatismDoes. Not. Compute.Communism for example at its base seems to indicate rule by the commune, i.e. small, limited government.
So Communism = Conservatism
The left often tries to deny left-wing crimes by claiming the Soviet Union wasn't socialist and that Stalin was a right-winger. I see it all the time in this forum. They call the Russian system "state capitalism." Any time you see that you're watching a left-winger who's trying to excuse the crimes of communism.
The fact that fascism attacked minorities and communism supported minorities makes no difference?
again....I will post what marx and engels thought of "minorities" too far behind the historical curve to ever be able to achieve communism ....
Genocide arose out of Marx's master-theory of history -- feudalism giving place inevitably to capitalism, capitalism to socialism. The lesser races of Europe -- Basques, Serbs, Bretons and others -- being sunk in feudalism, were counter-revolutionary; having failed to develop a bourgeoisie, they would be two steps behind in the historical process. Engels dismissed them as left-overs and ethnic trash (Voelkerabfall), and called for their extinction.
So even this argument is a loser.....communism attacked and murdered all sorts of minorities....they just selected different minorities to murder than the nazis....that's all...
I don't understand why anti communism means that they are anti socialist to you guys....that seems to be a hang up for you....you need to understand that international socialism isn't the only kind of socialism and that the national socialists are socialists...they just hated the nationals socialists....one, because they didn't care about the people of other countries being a part of their socialism, unlike the internationalists, and two, hitler didn't like the international socialists because many of them were jews...in name only and not belief or practice and for some reason he hated Jews....
If th left were, as you so laughably claim, seeking to whitewash the left by dumping Hitler - why do they not dump Stalin, who was arguably worse?
Because for some reason people still believe that communism is a harmless idea....you have idiots who wear che t-shirts, you have celebrities who visit and vomit out praise of castro....
The communists did not have their mass murder shown to the world the way the nazis did...we have historical sites that keep the nazi genocide from being hidden....you don't have the same with communism....
You also have western intellectuals who still support communism...and downplay and ignore the fact that communism killed more people in more countries than the nazis did...and yet you have communists with store fronts in the U.S., who openly march in public...as they recently did in ferguson, and at teacher union rally's...
The left wants socialism...and they have done their best to hide the crimes of leftists...but hitlers crimes were too open and obvious to hide....so they deal with the nazi crimes...by putting them on their enemies.....
If th left were, as you so laughably claim, seeking to whitewash the left by dumping Hitler - why do they not dump Stalin, who was arguably worse?
Because for some reason people still believe that communism is a harmless idea....you have idiots who wear che t-shirts, you have celebrities who visit and vomit out praise of castro....
The communists did not have their mass murder shown to the world the way the nazis did...we have historical sites that keep the nazi genocide from being hidden....you don't have the same with communism....
You also have western intellectuals who still support communism...and downplay and ignore the fact that communism killed more people in more countries than the nazis did...and yet you have communists with store fronts in the U.S., who openly march in public...as they recently did in ferguson, and at teacher union rally's...
The left wants socialism...and they have done their best to hide the crimes of leftists...but hitlers crimes were too open and obvious to hide....so they deal with the nazi crimes...by putting them on their enemies.....
Seriously?
I haven't seen a Che T-shirt for 20 years.
At the same time, religious traditions among the Jewish population were suppressed. In August 1919 Jewish properties, including synagogues, were seized and many Jewish communities were dissolved. The anti-religious laws against all expressions of religion and religious education were being taken out on all religious groups, including the Jewish communities. Many Rabbis and other religious officials were forced to resign from their posts under the threat of violent persecution. This type of persecution continued on into the 1920s.[3]
In March 1919, Vladimir Lenin delivered a speech "On Anti-Jewish Pogroms"[4] in a gramophone recording. Lenin sought to explain the phenomenon of antisemitism in Marxist terms. According to Lenin, antisemitism was an "attempt to divert the hatred of the workers and peasants from the exploiters toward the Jews." Lenin and the Bolshevik Party strongly condemned the antisemiticpogroms which were perpetrated by the White Army during the Russian Civil War, while the White forces were openly identifying the Bolshevik regime with Jews.[5][6][7]
At the same time, Lenin wrote in his project of a directive for the Communist Party "The policies on the Ukraine" in autumn of 1919:[8]
“ Jews and city dwellers on the Ukraine must be taken by hedgehog-skin gauntlets,[9] sent to fight on front lines and should never be allowed on any administrative positions (except a negligible percentage, in exceptional cases, and under [our] class control)
After Stalin's death, Soviet premier Nikita Khrushchev criticized Stalin and initiated De-Stalinization. But he did not view Stalin's anti-Jewish policies as "monstrous acts" or "rude violations of the basic Leninist principles of the nationality policy of the Soviet state."
Joseph Stalin emerged as leader of the Soviet Union following a power struggle with Leon Trotsky following the death of Lenin. Stalin has been accused of resorting to antisemitism in some of his arguments against Trotsky, who was Jewish.
Those who knew Stalin, such as Khrushchev, suggest that Stalin had long harbored negative sentiments toward Jews that had manifested themselves before the 1917 Revolution[10]As early as 1907, Stalin wrote a letter differentiating between a "Jewish faction" and a "true Russian faction" in Bolshevism.[10][11] Stalin's secretary Boris Bazhanov stated that Stalin made crude antisemitic outbursts even before Lenin's death.[10][12]
It's also possible that Stalin's attitudes towards Trotsky, a Russian Jew, may have influenced his views of Jews in general. Stalin adopted antisemitic policies which were reinforced with his anti-Westernism.[13][note 1] Since antisemitism was associated with Nazi Germany and was officially condemned by the Soviet system, the Soviet Union and other communist states used the cover-term "anti-Zionism" for their antisemitic policies. Antisemitism, as historian, Orientalist and anthropologist Raphael Patai and geneticist Jennifer Patai Wing put it in their book The Myth of the Jewish Race, was "couched in the language of opposition to Zionism".[2]
No...aushwitz didn't kill 25 million people....Stalin the socialist did....or 75 million people....Mao the socialist did....or 1/3 the population...pol pot the socialist did.....
Bill - I do not know a single person anywhere in the world who thinks communism is 'harmless'.
There's little question that Jones was an avowed communist.
In a Nov. 2, 2005, profile of Jones in the East Bay Express , an alternative weekly in Berkeley, Calif., Jones said his life hit a turning point in the spring of 1992 when he was swept up in mass arrests while protesting the acquittal of police officers accused of beating Rodney King.
Although the charges against Jones were dropped, Jones said that while in jail, "I met all these young radical people of color — I mean really radical, communists and anarchists. And it was, like, 'This is what I need to be a part of.' I spent the next 10 years of my life working with a lot of those people I met in jail, trying to be a revolutionary."
"In the months that followed," the Express article said, "he let go of any lingering thoughts that he might fit in with the status quo. 'I was a rowdy nationalist on April 28th, and then the verdicts came down on April 29th,' he said. 'By August, I was a communist.'"
In 1994, the story states, Jones formed a socialist collective called Standing Together to Organize a Revolutionary Movement, or STORM.
Who on this thread believes that communism is a harmless idea. Let's see the names....anyone want to come forward and put their hand up - please do so.If th left were, as you so laughably claim, seeking to whitewash the left by dumping Hitler - why do they not dump Stalin, who was arguably worse?
Because for some reason people still believe that communism is a harmless idea....you have idiots who wear che t-shirts, you have celebrities who visit and vomit out praise of castro....
The communists did not have their mass murder shown to the world the way the nazis did...we have historical sites that keep the nazi genocide from being hidden....you don't have the same with communism....
You also have western intellectuals who still support communism...and downplay and ignore the fact that communism killed more people in more countries than the nazis did...and yet you have communists with store fronts in the U.S., who openly march in public...as they recently did in ferguson, and at teacher union rally's...
The left wants socialism...and they have done their best to hide the crimes of leftists...but hitlers crimes were too open and obvious to hide....so they deal with the nazi crimes...by putting them on their enemies.....
The died under socialist regimes....in Germany, Russia, China, Cambodia, Cuba....socialism kills....in large numbers...
"Who on this thread believes that communism is a harmless idea
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