House GOP: mandate Ultrasounds before abortions

[JoeMoma]

You don't need an MRI to perform brain surgery either, but they give doctors and patients a better understanding of the situation and can predict possible complications.

Non-sequitur. The baby is being aborted, dude. There is no scientific or medical reason for it to have an ultrasound.

Really, where did you get your medical degree? Like I said, up to date imaging can give the patient and doctor information that is not otherwise available and can prevent unexpected complications. You can deny it all day but that won't make it true.

I don't need a medical degree to understand the motive behind this bill, and it has nothing to do with providing a valuable medical tool that can prevent further complications, and everything to do with making the cost prohibitive and trying to influence the mother into NOT having the abortion. Again, the baby is going to be aborted. It doesn't need an ultrasound.

All gynecologist have ultrasound machines, it's not cost prohibitive, they use them all the time for diagnostic reasons. You just don't want mothers to see a reason not to kill their child.

It adds an unnecessary cost to an already expensive procedure. But hey, at least you are now being honest as to exactly why you think they should have this test. You want them to have it not for any medically valid reason, since there is no medically valid reason for performing this procedure on a fetus that is going to be aborted. You want to force them to have the procedure to try to make them change their minds on whether or not to have the abortion. Even if it worked, it is not your place to do that. All decisions with regard to a woman's health is the woman's decision (and hers alone) in consultation with her doctor.

And it still will be, even with the ultrasound. Are you afraid that a lot of women will change their minds after seeing that baby inside?

 

[Political Junky]

Really, where did you get your medical degree? Like I said, up to date imaging can give the patient and doctor information that is not otherwise available and can prevent unexpected complications. You can deny it all day but that won't make it true.

I don't need a medical degree to understand the motive behind this bill, and it has nothing to do with providing a valuable medical tool that can prevent further complications, and everything to do with making the cost prohibitive and trying to influence the mother into NOT having the abortion. Again, the baby is going to be aborted. It doesn't need an ultrasound.

All gynecologist have ultrasound machines, it's not cost prohibitive, they use them all the time for diagnostic reasons. You just don't want mothers to see a reason not to kill their child.

It adds an unnecessary cost to an already expensive procedure. But hey, at least you are now being honest as to exactly why you think they should have this test. You want them to have it not for any medically valid reason, since there is no medically valid reason for performing this procedure on a fetus that is going to be aborted. You want to force them to have the procedure to try to make them change their minds on whether or not to have the abortion. Even if it worked, it is not your place to do that. All decisions with regard to a woman's health is the woman's decision (and hers alone) in consultation with her doctor.

The decision is the womans, I just want her to have all the information available to make an informed decision, not just have the abortionist propaganda ringing in he ears. After all isn't information the basis for informed consent?

Again, there is no medical reason to perform an ultrasound on a fetus that is going to be aborted. Requiring an unnecessary procedure interferes with the doctor/patient relationship (which is what you republicans want, in this case), and adds nothing of medical value. The fetus doesn't need it. The mother doesn't need it. It is unethical to require an unnecessary procedure.

It's punishing the woman, just making it more difficult.

 

[HenryBHough]

Aw shucks.....a woman who doesn't have an ultrasound and have a printout made of the results will have NO pictures of her child to brag on. Unless she decides maybe aborting isn't such a great hobby after all.

 

[JoeMoma]

Really, where did you get your medical degree? Like I said, up to date imaging can give the patient and doctor information that is not otherwise available and can prevent unexpected complications. You can deny it all day but that won't make it true.

I don't need a medical degree to understand the motive behind this bill, and it has nothing to do with providing a valuable medical tool that can prevent further complications, and everything to do with making the cost prohibitive and trying to influence the mother into NOT having the abortion. Again, the baby is going to be aborted. It doesn't need an ultrasound.

All gynecologist have ultrasound machines, it's not cost prohibitive, they use them all the time for diagnostic reasons. You just don't want mothers to see a reason not to kill their child.

It adds an unnecessary cost to an already expensive procedure. But hey, at least you are now being honest as to exactly why you think they should have this test. You want them to have it not for any medically valid reason, since there is no medically valid reason for performing this procedure on a fetus that is going to be aborted. You want to force them to have the procedure to try to make them change their minds on whether or not to have the abortion. Even if it worked, it is not your place to do that. All decisions with regard to a woman's health is the woman's decision (and hers alone) in consultation with her doctor.

The decision is the womans, I just want her to have all the information available to make an informed decision, not just have the abortionist propaganda ringing in he ears. After all isn't information the basis for informed consent?

Again, there is no medical reason to perform an ultrasound on a fetus that is going to be aborted. Requiring an unnecessary procedure interferes with the doctor/patient relationship (which is what you republicans want, in this case), and adds nothing of medical value. The fetus doesn't need it. The mother doesn't need it. It is unethical to require an unnecessary procedure.

Actually, if it convinces the mother to carry the fetus to term, then the fetus definitely does need it.

 

[Borillar]

Lets see. The sick , infirm ,old and unborn should be killed because it wastes money that cam be spend defending cop killers, terrorists, and baby rapists. This is how twisted the mind of a liberal is.

I think it's you that are pretty twisted. The sick and infirm? the right says "let him die". The old on SS? Bunch of leeches and moochers according to the right. Abortion? Nobody "wants" abortion. It becomes necessary. And public money isn't used for abortion. Hyde amendment and all. What public money is being used to defend cop killers, terrorists, and baby rapists? Public money is spent to prosecute these people. If they can't afford attorneys, they get crappy public defenders that rarely win cases.

 

[JoeMoma]

I don't need a medical degree to understand the motive behind this bill, and it has nothing to do with providing a valuable medical tool that can prevent further complications, and everything to do with making the cost prohibitive and trying to influence the mother into NOT having the abortion. Again, the baby is going to be aborted. It doesn't need an ultrasound.

All gynecologist have ultrasound machines, it's not cost prohibitive, they use them all the time for diagnostic reasons. You just don't want mothers to see a reason not to kill their child.

It adds an unnecessary cost to an already expensive procedure. But hey, at least you are now being honest as to exactly why you think they should have this test. You want them to have it not for any medically valid reason, since there is no medically valid reason for performing this procedure on a fetus that is going to be aborted. You want to force them to have the procedure to try to make them change their minds on whether or not to have the abortion. Even if it worked, it is not your place to do that. All decisions with regard to a woman's health is the woman's decision (and hers alone) in consultation with her doctor.

The decision is the womans, I just want her to have all the information available to make an informed decision, not just have the abortionist propaganda ringing in he ears. After all isn't information the basis for informed consent?

Again, there is no medical reason to perform an ultrasound on a fetus that is going to be aborted. Requiring an unnecessary procedure interferes with the doctor/patient relationship (which is what you republicans want, in this case), and adds nothing of medical value. The fetus doesn't need it. The mother doesn't need it. It is unethical to require an unnecessary procedure.

It's punishing the woman, just making it more difficult.

Perhaps making the decision to end a human life should be (more) difficult.

 

[orogenicman]

Non-sequitur. The baby is being aborted, dude. There is no scientific or medical reason for it to have an ultrasound.

Really, where did you get your medical degree? Like I said, up to date imaging can give the patient and doctor information that is not otherwise available and can prevent unexpected complications. You can deny it all day but that won't make it true.

I don't need a medical degree to understand the motive behind this bill, and it has nothing to do with providing a valuable medical tool that can prevent further complications, and everything to do with making the cost prohibitive and trying to influence the mother into NOT having the abortion. Again, the baby is going to be aborted. It doesn't need an ultrasound.

All gynecologist have ultrasound machines, it's not cost prohibitive, they use them all the time for diagnostic reasons. You just don't want mothers to see a reason not to kill their child.

It adds an unnecessary cost to an already expensive procedure. But hey, at least you are now being honest as to exactly why you think they should have this test. You want them to have it not for any medically valid reason, since there is no medically valid reason for performing this procedure on a fetus that is going to be aborted. You want to force them to have the procedure to try to make them change their minds on whether or not to have the abortion. Even if it worked, it is not your place to do that. All decisions with regard to a woman's health is the woman's decision (and hers alone) in consultation with her doctor.

And it still will be, even with the ultrasound. Are you afraid that a lot of women will change their minds after seeing that baby inside.

You are supporting a requirement that doctors perform an unnecessary procedure on their patients. That is highly unethical.

 

[HenryBHough]

Perhaps making the decision to end a human life should be (more) difficult.

All too easy for Our Kenyan Emperor to decide to send in the drones to kill innocent children along with alleged bad guys. So, I guess, no official reason to complicate things concerned with killing just one person.

 

[orogenicman]

All gynecologist have ultrasound machines, it's not cost prohibitive, they use them all the time for diagnostic reasons. You just don't want mothers to see a reason not to kill their child.

It adds an unnecessary cost to an already expensive procedure. But hey, at least you are now being honest as to exactly why you think they should have this test. You want them to have it not for any medically valid reason, since there is no medically valid reason for performing this procedure on a fetus that is going to be aborted. You want to force them to have the procedure to try to make them change their minds on whether or not to have the abortion. Even if it worked, it is not your place to do that. All decisions with regard to a woman's health is the woman's decision (and hers alone) in consultation with her doctor.

The decision is the womans, I just want her to have all the information available to make an informed decision, not just have the abortionist propaganda ringing in he ears. After all isn't information the basis for informed consent?

Again, there is no medical reason to perform an ultrasound on a fetus that is going to be aborted. Requiring an unnecessary procedure interferes with the doctor/patient relationship (which is what you republicans want, in this case), and adds nothing of medical value. The fetus doesn't need it. The mother doesn't need it. It is unethical to require an unnecessary procedure.

It's punishing the woman, just making it more difficult.

Perhaps making the decision to end a human life should be (more) difficult.

What makes you think it isn't already? Can you read the mind of a pregnant woman contemplating abortion?

 

[OKTexas]

Really, where did you get your medical degree? Like I said, up to date imaging can give the patient and doctor information that is not otherwise available and can prevent unexpected complications. You can deny it all day but that won't make it true.

I don't need a medical degree to understand the motive behind this bill, and it has nothing to do with providing a valuable medical tool that can prevent further complications, and everything to do with making the cost prohibitive and trying to influence the mother into NOT having the abortion. Again, the baby is going to be aborted. It doesn't need an ultrasound.

All gynecologist have ultrasound machines, it's not cost prohibitive, they use them all the time for diagnostic reasons. You just don't want mothers to see a reason not to kill their child.

It adds an unnecessary cost to an already expensive procedure. But hey, at least you are now being honest as to exactly why you think they should have this test. You want them to have it not for any medically valid reason, since there is no medically valid reason for performing this procedure on a fetus that is going to be aborted. You want to force them to have the procedure to try to make them change their minds on whether or not to have the abortion. Even if it worked, it is not your place to do that. All decisions with regard to a woman's health is the woman's decision (and hers alone) in consultation with her doctor.

The decision is the womans, I just want her to have all the information available to make an informed decision, not just have the abortionist propaganda ringing in he ears. After all isn't information the basis for informed consent?

Again, there is no medical reason to perform an ultrasound on a fetus that is going to be aborted. Requiring an unnecessary procedure interferes with the doctor/patient relationship (which is what you republicans want, in this case), and adds nothing of medical value. The fetus doesn't need it. The mother doesn't need it. It is unethical to require an unnecessary procedure.

How about actually answering my question. Otherwise I'm done.

 

[orogenicman]

Perhaps making the decision to end a human life should be (more) difficult.

All too easy for Our Kenyan Emperor to decide to send in the drones to kill innocent children along with alleged bad guys. So, I guess, no official reason to complicate things concerned with killing just one person.

No doubt, for your next trick, you will perform a river dance in baseball cleats.

 

[Missouri_Mike]

Bill Frist, the Republican Senate majority leader in 2005 and a transplant surgeon, said it was clear to him that Ms. Schiavo responded to external stimuli, a pronouncement based on his having seen a videotape of her?

An autopsy on Terri Schiavo, the severely brain damaged woman whose death sparked an intense debate over a person's right-to-die, showed that her brain was severely "atrophied," weighed less than half of what it should have, and that no treatment could have reversed the damage.

Amazing to me how quick you people are to kill off defenseless life forms. Yet this is your platform right? Kill off anything not born or not able to defend itself and you are all in.

Who decided she had a right to die, you? Did she have a right or did you think she had a duty to die? How many unborn children have chosen the right to die?

Odd how Republicans are so pro-life right up until the fetus is born. After that, 'fuck 'em'.

The same age old dumb ass lefty reply we always get. So if a child isn't guaranteed cradle to grave care it should be killed. Fine, so what income level should we place on people in order for them to have children? Obviously life doesn't mean shit to you but welfare does so let's stop poor people from having kids.

 

[JoeMoma]

It adds an unnecessary cost to an already expensive procedure. But hey, at least you are now being honest as to exactly why you think they should have this test. You want them to have it not for any medically valid reason, since there is no medically valid reason for performing this procedure on a fetus that is going to be aborted. You want to force them to have the procedure to try to make them change their minds on whether or not to have the abortion. Even if it worked, it is not your place to do that. All decisions with regard to a woman's health is the woman's decision (and hers alone) in consultation with her doctor.

The decision is the womans, I just want her to have all the information available to make an informed decision, not just have the abortionist propaganda ringing in he ears. After all isn't information the basis for informed consent?

Again, there is no medical reason to perform an ultrasound on a fetus that is going to be aborted. Requiring an unnecessary procedure interferes with the doctor/patient relationship (which is what you republicans want, in this case), and adds nothing of medical value. The fetus doesn't need it. The mother doesn't need it. It is unethical to require an unnecessary procedure.

It's punishing the woman, just making it more difficult.

Perhaps making the decision to end a human life should be (more) difficult.

What makes you think it isn't already? Can you read the mind of a pregnant woman contemplating abortion?

If a woman thinks with the mentality of many of the proabortion posters on this thread, then it is as easy as deciding to eat a twinkly.

 

[orogenicman]

I don't need a medical degree to understand the motive behind this bill, and it has nothing to do with providing a valuable medical tool that can prevent further complications, and everything to do with making the cost prohibitive and trying to influence the mother into NOT having the abortion. Again, the baby is going to be aborted. It doesn't need an ultrasound.

All gynecologist have ultrasound machines, it's not cost prohibitive, they use them all the time for diagnostic reasons. You just don't want mothers to see a reason not to kill their child.

It adds an unnecessary cost to an already expensive procedure. But hey, at least you are now being honest as to exactly why you think they should have this test. You want them to have it not for any medically valid reason, since there is no medically valid reason for performing this procedure on a fetus that is going to be aborted. You want to force them to have the procedure to try to make them change their minds on whether or not to have the abortion. Even if it worked, it is not your place to do that. All decisions with regard to a woman's health is the woman's decision (and hers alone) in consultation with her doctor.

The decision is the womans, I just want her to have all the information available to make an informed decision, not just have the abortionist propaganda ringing in he ears. After all isn't information the basis for informed consent?

Again, there is no medical reason to perform an ultrasound on a fetus that is going to be aborted. Requiring an unnecessary procedure interferes with the doctor/patient relationship (which is what you republicans want, in this case), and adds nothing of medical value. The fetus doesn't need it. The mother doesn't need it. It is unethical to require an unnecessary procedure.

How about actually answering my question. Otherwise I'm done.

Again, it is unethical to require a doctor to perform an unnecessary procedure on a patient. Full stop. If my response means you are done, then you are done. Have a good day.

 

[Missouri_Mike]

I don't need a medical degree to understand the motive behind this bill, and it has nothing to do with providing a valuable medical tool that can prevent further complications, and everything to do with making the cost prohibitive and trying to influence the mother into NOT having the abortion. Again, the baby is going to be aborted. It doesn't need an ultrasound.

All gynecologist have ultrasound machines, it's not cost prohibitive, they use them all the time for diagnostic reasons. You just don't want mothers to see a reason not to kill their child.

It adds an unnecessary cost to an already expensive procedure. But hey, at least you are now being honest as to exactly why you think they should have this test. You want them to have it not for any medically valid reason, since there is no medically valid reason for performing this procedure on a fetus that is going to be aborted. You want to force them to have the procedure to try to make them change their minds on whether or not to have the abortion. Even if it worked, it is not your place to do that. All decisions with regard to a woman's health is the woman's decision (and hers alone) in consultation with her doctor.

The decision is the womans, I just want her to have all the information available to make an informed decision, not just have the abortionist propaganda ringing in he ears. After all isn't information the basis for informed consent?

Again, there is no medical reason to perform an ultrasound on a fetus that is going to be aborted. Requiring an unnecessary procedure interferes with the doctor/patient relationship (which is what you republicans want, in this case), and adds nothing of medical value. The fetus doesn't need it. The mother doesn't need it. It is unethical to require an unnecessary procedure.

It's punishing the woman, just making it more difficult.

We sure wouldn't want to make killing someone a difficult decision would we. Hide the facts and take the pressure off.

 

[HenryBHough]

How about a woman auditioning for an abortion is allowed to refuse an ultrasound provided she also is then denied anesthesia? After all, pain killers cost money, too.

 

[JoeMoma]

Really, where did you get your medical degree? Like I said, up to date imaging can give the patient and doctor information that is not otherwise available and can prevent unexpected complications. You can deny it all day but that won't make it true.

I don't need a medical degree to understand the motive behind this bill, and it has nothing to do with providing a valuable medical tool that can prevent further complications, and everything to do with making the cost prohibitive and trying to influence the mother into NOT having the abortion. Again, the baby is going to be aborted. It doesn't need an ultrasound.

All gynecologist have ultrasound machines, it's not cost prohibitive, they use them all the time for diagnostic reasons. You just don't want mothers to see a reason not to kill their child.

It adds an unnecessary cost to an already expensive procedure. But hey, at least you are now being honest as to exactly why you think they should have this test. You want them to have it not for any medically valid reason, since there is no medically valid reason for performing this procedure on a fetus that is going to be aborted. You want to force them to have the procedure to try to make them change their minds on whether or not to have the abortion. Even if it worked, it is not your place to do that. All decisions with regard to a woman's health is the woman's decision (and hers alone) in consultation with her doctor.

And it still will be, even with the ultrasound. Are you afraid that a lot of women will change their minds after seeing that baby inside.

You are supporting a requirement that doctors perform an unnecessary procedure on their patients. That is highly unethical.

Present that argument to a person who was not aborted because his mother saw an ultrasound. Don't deny that if this requirement is passed as law that there will not be such people.

 

[orogenicman]

All gynecologist have ultrasound machines, it's not cost prohibitive, they use them all the time for diagnostic reasons. You just don't want mothers to see a reason not to kill their child.

It adds an unnecessary cost to an already expensive procedure. But hey, at least you are now being honest as to exactly why you think they should have this test. You want them to have it not for any medically valid reason, since there is no medically valid reason for performing this procedure on a fetus that is going to be aborted. You want to force them to have the procedure to try to make them change their minds on whether or not to have the abortion. Even if it worked, it is not your place to do that. All decisions with regard to a woman's health is the woman's decision (and hers alone) in consultation with her doctor.

The decision is the womans, I just want her to have all the information available to make an informed decision, not just have the abortionist propaganda ringing in he ears. After all isn't information the basis for informed consent?

Again, there is no medical reason to perform an ultrasound on a fetus that is going to be aborted. Requiring an unnecessary procedure interferes with the doctor/patient relationship (which is what you republicans want, in this case), and adds nothing of medical value. The fetus doesn't need it. The mother doesn't need it. It is unethical to require an unnecessary procedure.

It's punishing the woman, just making it more difficult.

We sure wouldn't want to make killing someone a difficult decision would we. Hide the facts and take the pressure off.

What makes you think it isn't already a difficult decision?

 

[orogenicman]

I don't need a medical degree to understand the motive behind this bill, and it has nothing to do with providing a valuable medical tool that can prevent further complications, and everything to do with making the cost prohibitive and trying to influence the mother into NOT having the abortion. Again, the baby is going to be aborted. It doesn't need an ultrasound.

All gynecologist have ultrasound machines, it's not cost prohibitive, they use them all the time for diagnostic reasons. You just don't want mothers to see a reason not to kill their child.

It adds an unnecessary cost to an already expensive procedure. But hey, at least you are now being honest as to exactly why you think they should have this test. You want them to have it not for any medically valid reason, since there is no medically valid reason for performing this procedure on a fetus that is going to be aborted. You want to force them to have the procedure to try to make them change their minds on whether or not to have the abortion. Even if it worked, it is not your place to do that. All decisions with regard to a woman's health is the woman's decision (and hers alone) in consultation with her doctor.

And it still will be, even with the ultrasound. Are you afraid that a lot of women will change their minds after seeing that baby inside.

You are supporting a requirement that doctors perform an unnecessary procedure on their patients. That is highly unethical.

Present that argument to a person who was not aborted because his mother saw an ultrasound. Don't deny that if this requirement is passed as law that there will not be such people.

Appeal to emotions fallacy. This is all you have? Really?

 

[NYcarbineer]

It's not that complicated. Abortion is a medical procedure. If you can prove beyond a reasonable doubt that an ultrasound is a medical necessity in an abortion, you win.

If you can't, you lose.