if not evolution

a swirl of dust turned to man? man would've HAD to just appear--like a Star Trek energizer!! how else would be?

It is widely accepted within the scientific community that the very early universe conditions should have generated matter and antimatter in equal amounts. The inability of matter and antimatter to survive each other should have led to a universe with only a bit of each left as the universe expanded. Yet today's universe holds far more matter than antimatter. For reasons no one yet understands, nature ruled out antimatter.

The cosmic evolutionary phase of Creation - the development of space, time, matter and energy from nothing - occurred quickly. It was during this phase that hydrogen and helium were formed from sub-atomic particles.

The stellar evolutionary phase of Creation saw the development of complex stars from the chaotic first elements. The chemical evolutionary phase - the development of all chemical elements from an original two - occurred through supernovas which created and flung the heavier elements across the galaxies (i.e. stardust).

These are the three phases in the evolution of non-living matter. Each phase evolved from a less complex state to a more complex state. During each phase matter had to reach its potential before the next phase could begin as each phase built upon the previous phase. Each phase was pre-destined to occur, because the physical laws existed at the very beginning of Creation.

Which brings us back to Professor Wald. Nobody knows if life made a spontaneous leap from non-living matter to living matter. If it did, it most likely involved long chains of matter in hot and wet conditions. For all anyone knows, God turned non-living matter into living matter. Professor Wald puts it thusly:

"When it comes to the origin of life, we have only two possibilities as to how life arose. One is spontaneous generation arising to evolution; the other is a supernatural creative act of God. There is no third possibility...Spontaneous generation was scientifically disproved one hundred years ago by Louis Pasteur, Spellanzani, Reddy and others. That leads us scientifically to only one possible conclusion -- that life arose as a supernatural creative act of God...I will not accept that philosophically because I do not want to believe in God. Therefore, I choose to believe in that which I know is scientifically impossible, spontaneous generation arising to evolution." - Scientific American, August, 1954.

But regardless whether God provided the spark of life or whether non-living matter spontaneously made the leap to life, evidence clearly shows that the evolution of human intelligence was pre-ordained by the laws of nature the moment the first living cell entered Creation.

Professor Wald recognized that consciousness was what the universe was created for and that is why he said, “Life seems increasingly to be part of the order of nature. We have good reason to believe that we find ourselves in a universe permeated with life, in which life arises inevitably, given enough time, wherever the conditions exist that make it possible.

It is Mind that has composed a physical universe that breeds life, and so eventually evolves creatures that know and create.”

However matter made the leap to life, it is generally accepted that life began as a simple life organism; a single cell. And just like non-living matter before it, life followed a similar pattern of complexification. By evolving from sub-atomic particles to hydrogen and helium - the first two elements - matter evolved from a more simple state to a more advanced state during its cosmic evolutionary phase. Then during the stellar evolutionary phase, matter evolved from a more simple state to a more advanced state when the development of complex stars evolved from the chaotic first elements. Non-living matter reached its potential during the chemical evolutionary phase when all chemical elements evolved from the original two elements from supernovas which created and flung the heavier elements across the galaxies. This is very similar to how life is spread by plants here on earth which must die and let their seed fall to the ground where the seeds of life are spread by the wind. Except in this case it was star dust that was spread. Again this process followed a predictable pattern of evolving from a more simple state, hydrogen and helium, to a more complex state, all of the elements that we see today.

Like non-living matter, life followed this pattern as well, but before we talk about that we need to study the very early time of life in greater detail.

One of the things that sets life apart from inanimate matter is the ability to reproduce itself. When life first burst onto the scene, it rapidly reproduced itself. This is called the expansionary phase. During the expansionary phase slight mutations created just enough diversity to create competition. Eventually the rapid expansion subsides and life found itself in its equilibrium phase. During its equilibrium phase competition promoted further diversification until life reached its potential and make the leap to the next stage. Thereby starting this process all over again.
 
The Bible says that man was made from dust. Science tells us that we are made from star dust. Seems pretty consistent to me.
 
a swirl of dust turned to man? man would've HAD to just appear--like a Star Trek energizer!! how else would be?

It is widely accepted within the scientific community that the very early universe conditions should have generated matter and antimatter in equal amounts. The inability of matter and antimatter to survive each other should have led to a universe with only a bit of each left as the universe expanded. Yet today's universe holds far more matter than antimatter. For reasons no one yet understands, nature ruled out antimatter.

The cosmic evolutionary phase of Creation - the development of space, time, matter and energy from nothing - occurred quickly. It was during this phase that hydrogen and helium were formed from sub-atomic particles.

The stellar evolutionary phase of Creation saw the development of complex stars from the chaotic first elements. The chemical evolutionary phase - the development of all chemical elements from an original two - occurred through supernovas which created and flung the heavier elements across the galaxies (i.e. stardust).

These are the three phases in the evolution of non-living matter. Each phase evolved from a less complex state to a more complex state. During each phase matter had to reach its potential before the next phase could begin as each phase built upon the previous phase. Each phase was pre-destined to occur, because the physical laws existed at the very beginning of Creation.

Which brings us back to Professor Wald. Nobody knows if life made a spontaneous leap from non-living matter to living matter. If it did, it most likely involved long chains of matter in hot and wet conditions. For all anyone knows, God turned non-living matter into living matter. Professor Wald puts it thusly:

"When it comes to the origin of life, we have only two possibilities as to how life arose. One is spontaneous generation arising to evolution; the other is a supernatural creative act of God. There is no third possibility...Spontaneous generation was scientifically disproved one hundred years ago by Louis Pasteur, Spellanzani, Reddy and others. That leads us scientifically to only one possible conclusion -- that life arose as a supernatural creative act of God...I will not accept that philosophically because I do not want to believe in God. Therefore, I choose to believe in that which I know is scientifically impossible, spontaneous generation arising to evolution." - Scientific American, August, 1954.

But regardless whether God provided the spark of life or whether non-living matter spontaneously made the leap to life, evidence clearly shows that the evolution of human intelligence was pre-ordained by the laws of nature the moment the first living cell entered Creation.

Professor Wald recognized that consciousness was what the universe was created for and that is why he said, “Life seems increasingly to be part of the order of nature. We have good reason to believe that we find ourselves in a universe permeated with life, in which life arises inevitably, given enough time, wherever the conditions exist that make it possible.

It is Mind that has composed a physical universe that breeds life, and so eventually evolves creatures that know and create.”

However matter made the leap to life, it is generally accepted that life began as a simple life organism; a single cell. And just like non-living matter before it, life followed a similar pattern of complexification. By evolving from sub-atomic particles to hydrogen and helium - the first two elements - matter evolved from a more simple state to a more advanced state during its cosmic evolutionary phase. Then during the stellar evolutionary phase, matter evolved from a more simple state to a more advanced state when the development of complex stars evolved from the chaotic first elements. Non-living matter reached its potential during the chemical evolutionary phase when all chemical elements evolved from the original two elements from supernovas which created and flung the heavier elements across the galaxies. This is very similar to how life is spread by plants here on earth which must die and let their seed fall to the ground where the seeds of life are spread by the wind. Except in this case it was star dust that was spread. Again this process followed a predictable pattern of evolving from a more simple state, hydrogen and helium, to a more complex state, all of the elements that we see today.

Like non-living matter, life followed this pattern as well, but before we talk about that we need to study the very early time of life in greater detail.

One of the things that sets life apart from inanimate matter is the ability to reproduce itself. When life first burst onto the scene, it rapidly reproduced itself. This is called the expansionary phase. During the expansionary phase slight mutations created just enough diversity to create competition. Eventually the rapid expansion subsides and life found itself in its equilibrium phase. During its equilibrium phase competition promoted further diversification until life reached its potential and make the leap to the next stage. Thereby starting this process all over again.
interesting, good reading, ..good points
1954?
 
another aspect is if god created man, why is the human body so imperfect?
Are you arguing that since man is not perfect there can be no God? Why?
no, I'm saying that it would not make sense for god to make man with the many physical problems man has by creation and not evolution
--not to mention the mental ones

why do we have problems with wisdom teeth? if not evolution, then why?
conjoined babies!! ?
etc
Why not?

How do you know that getting to experience the full spectrum doesn't make us better people?
so you are saying god did create man through creation, with human body faults?
 
if you don't believe in evolution, then you must believe a fully formed man just appeared/etc?
is this correct?

Not “just appeared “ but created by God.
I'm not trying to be a jerk---but what actually happened?
a swirl of dust turned to man? man would've HAD to just appear--like a Star Trek energizer!! how else would be?
god did it with clay, piece by piece?
what is your idea/belief??

I’m not saying it’s my belief, I just knew the answer to your question.
so the answer is a man just appeared--created by god?
with blood, muscles, teeth, etc.
no matter how long it took---the man must've just ''appeared''...?
 
another aspect is if god created man, why is the human body so imperfect?
Are you arguing that since man is not perfect there can be no God? Why?
no, I'm saying that it would not make sense for god to make man with the many physical problems man has by creation and not evolution
--not to mention the mental ones

why do we have problems with wisdom teeth? if not evolution, then why?
conjoined babies!! ?
etc
Why not?

How do you know that getting to experience the full spectrum doesn't make us better people?
so you are saying god did create man through creation, with human body faults?
No. I am saying God gave man a precious and rare gift.
 
a swirl of dust turned to man? man would've HAD to just appear--like a Star Trek energizer!! how else would be?

It is widely accepted within the scientific community that the very early universe conditions should have generated matter and antimatter in equal amounts. The inability of matter and antimatter to survive each other should have led to a universe with only a bit of each left as the universe expanded. Yet today's universe holds far more matter than antimatter. For reasons no one yet understands, nature ruled out antimatter.

The cosmic evolutionary phase of Creation - the development of space, time, matter and energy from nothing - occurred quickly. It was during this phase that hydrogen and helium were formed from sub-atomic particles.

The stellar evolutionary phase of Creation saw the development of complex stars from the chaotic first elements. The chemical evolutionary phase - the development of all chemical elements from an original two - occurred through supernovas which created and flung the heavier elements across the galaxies (i.e. stardust).

These are the three phases in the evolution of non-living matter. Each phase evolved from a less complex state to a more complex state. During each phase matter had to reach its potential before the next phase could begin as each phase built upon the previous phase. Each phase was pre-destined to occur, because the physical laws existed at the very beginning of Creation.

Which brings us back to Professor Wald. Nobody knows if life made a spontaneous leap from non-living matter to living matter. If it did, it most likely involved long chains of matter in hot and wet conditions. For all anyone knows, God turned non-living matter into living matter. Professor Wald puts it thusly:

"When it comes to the origin of life, we have only two possibilities as to how life arose. One is spontaneous generation arising to evolution; the other is a supernatural creative act of God. There is no third possibility...Spontaneous generation was scientifically disproved one hundred years ago by Louis Pasteur, Spellanzani, Reddy and others. That leads us scientifically to only one possible conclusion -- that life arose as a supernatural creative act of God...I will not accept that philosophically because I do not want to believe in God. Therefore, I choose to believe in that which I know is scientifically impossible, spontaneous generation arising to evolution." - Scientific American, August, 1954.

But regardless whether God provided the spark of life or whether non-living matter spontaneously made the leap to life, evidence clearly shows that the evolution of human intelligence was pre-ordained by the laws of nature the moment the first living cell entered Creation.

Professor Wald recognized that consciousness was what the universe was created for and that is why he said, “Life seems increasingly to be part of the order of nature. We have good reason to believe that we find ourselves in a universe permeated with life, in which life arises inevitably, given enough time, wherever the conditions exist that make it possible.

It is Mind that has composed a physical universe that breeds life, and so eventually evolves creatures that know and create.”

However matter made the leap to life, it is generally accepted that life began as a simple life organism; a single cell. And just like non-living matter before it, life followed a similar pattern of complexification. By evolving from sub-atomic particles to hydrogen and helium - the first two elements - matter evolved from a more simple state to a more advanced state during its cosmic evolutionary phase. Then during the stellar evolutionary phase, matter evolved from a more simple state to a more advanced state when the development of complex stars evolved from the chaotic first elements. Non-living matter reached its potential during the chemical evolutionary phase when all chemical elements evolved from the original two elements from supernovas which created and flung the heavier elements across the galaxies. This is very similar to how life is spread by plants here on earth which must die and let their seed fall to the ground where the seeds of life are spread by the wind. Except in this case it was star dust that was spread. Again this process followed a predictable pattern of evolving from a more simple state, hydrogen and helium, to a more complex state, all of the elements that we see today.

Like non-living matter, life followed this pattern as well, but before we talk about that we need to study the very early time of life in greater detail.

One of the things that sets life apart from inanimate matter is the ability to reproduce itself. When life first burst onto the scene, it rapidly reproduced itself. This is called the expansionary phase. During the expansionary phase slight mutations created just enough diversity to create competition. Eventually the rapid expansion subsides and life found itself in its equilibrium phase. During its equilibrium phase competition promoted further diversification until life reached its potential and make the leap to the next stage. Thereby starting this process all over again.
interesting, good reading, ..good points
1954?
Yes, he wrote the part about spontaneous generation not be possible in 1954.

He wrote the part about consciousness was what the universe was created for in 1984.
 
another aspect is if god created man, why is the human body so imperfect?
Are you arguing that since man is not perfect there can be no God? Why?
no, I'm saying that it would not make sense for god to make man with the many physical problems man has by creation and not evolution
--not to mention the mental ones

why do we have problems with wisdom teeth? if not evolution, then why?
conjoined babies!! ?
etc
Why not?

How do you know that getting to experience the full spectrum doesn't make us better people?
so you are saying god did create man through creation, with human body faults?

Nope. No body faults, no aging, no pain in child birth, no disease, no death, no thorns in the garden. < God's Plan.
All of those things were reversed when Adam, in order to stay with Eve, turned over dominion of the earth and everything in it to Satan. < Adam's plan
Every bad thing that happens on this earth can be directly attributed to Satan. <Satan's Plan.
Redeeming earth and everything in it. < Christ's Plan.
Maranatha, Lord. Maranatha.
 
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The more I learn about evolution, the more I’m convinced it was the workings of God.

Beautiful, simple, unstoppable.

How does letting random adaptations work over billions of years equate to one or more gods?

Nature routinely finds suboptimal solutions that various gods would never choose. Nature is constrained by contingent history, gods are not. The consequences of the difference are obvious and compelling.

Furthermore the harshness of Natural Selection -- all the mass extinctions, the ugliness of competition, all of that contradicts the notion of "Beautiful, simple, unstoppable" gods directing the natural world.

Less Disney and more Darwin generally provides a more realistic assessment of the objective state of nature.
 
If you believe in evolution, do you believe a single celled creature just appeared to get the ball rolling?
there is the possibility god created man through evolution--yes?
Sure. There is also the possibility that the Great Spaghetti Monster created man, Or Zeus, or Odin, or Shiva, or any of a thousand other mythological deities. Do you discount any of them?
Thanks for your input, troll.
there is the possibility god created man through evolution--yes?
Sure. There is also the possibility that the Great Spaghetti Monster created man, Or Zeus, or Odin, or Shiva, or any of a thousand other mythological deities. Do you discount any of them?
I personally don't believe in a god--as most others do
I believe evolution as the cause of humankind
You believe or know?
as stated in another post--evolution seems much more logical and feasible than a fully formed man just 'appearing'/etc
and I've yet to hear a scientific theory from creationist--at least the evolutionists have a theory
Evolution is not a theory. It is a hypothesis. I trust you recognize the difference. Evolution does not qualify as a theory because it cannot be disproven. There are no scientific experiments that can be conducted on it. There is no scientific evidence to back it up.

Sorry, but that’s nonsense. Scientific theories start out as hypotheses. A hypothesis is given theory status when either by experiment or many observations (and observations of that hypothesis's predictions) prove to be true. Any hypothesis that attains theory status must also meet some other criteria. It must be able to make testable predictions, and it must be falsifiable. That is, observation or experiment could show that it can be shown to be false (or true).

Now, evolution has a great amount of observational evidence to support it. It also makes predictions (for example, that bacteria and insects can become resistant to anti-biotics or certain insecticides), and these predictions have been observed. Evolution also makes predictions about what we should find in the fossil records, and for the most part these have proven true. The observations support the theory. The Cambrian explosion was explained by a slight modification to the theory, called punctuated equilibrium, which again is supported by the evidence. Not only that, but DNA structures common to different life forms is highly suggestive of the truth of evolution, as evolution would predict exactly that this should be true, and observation and study of DNA structures thus far confirm that prediction.
 
161226182723-president-barack-obama-exlarge-169.jpg


You didn't build that.
Read the context genius.
 
another aspect is if god created man, why is the human body so imperfect?
Are you arguing that since man is not perfect there can be no God? Why?
no, I'm saying that it would not make sense for god to make man with the many physical problems man has by creation and not evolution
--not to mention the mental ones

why do we have problems with wisdom teeth? if not evolution, then why?
conjoined babies!! ?
etc
Why not?

How do you know that getting to experience the full spectrum doesn't make us better people?
so you are saying god did create man through creation, with human body faults?
No. I am saying God gave man a precious and rare gift.

Let’s thank the gods for that blueprint for the cancer cell. Not so rare or precious.
 
Are you arguing that since man is not perfect there can be no God? Why?
no, I'm saying that it would not make sense for god to make man with the many physical problems man has by creation and not evolution
--not to mention the mental ones

why do we have problems with wisdom teeth? if not evolution, then why?
conjoined babies!! ?
etc
Why not?

How do you know that getting to experience the full spectrum doesn't make us better people?
so you are saying god did create man through creation, with human body faults?
No. I am saying God gave man a precious and rare gift.

Let’s thank the gods for that blueprint for the cancer cell. Not so rare or precious.
If you are going to blame God for the bad, don't you think you should credit God for the good.
 
If you believe in evolution, do you believe a single celled creature just appeared to get the ball rolling?
there is the possibility god created man through evolution--yes?
Sure. There is also the possibility that the Great Spaghetti Monster created man, Or Zeus, or Odin, or Shiva, or any of a thousand other mythological deities. Do you discount any of them?
Thanks for your input, troll.
Sure. There is also the possibility that the Great Spaghetti Monster created man, Or Zeus, or Odin, or Shiva, or any of a thousand other mythological deities. Do you discount any of them?
I personally don't believe in a god--as most others do
I believe evolution as the cause of humankind
You believe or know?
as stated in another post--evolution seems much more logical and feasible than a fully formed man just 'appearing'/etc
and I've yet to hear a scientific theory from creationist--at least the evolutionists have a theory
Evolution is not a theory. It is a hypothesis. I trust you recognize the difference. Evolution does not qualify as a theory because it cannot be disproven. There are no scientific experiments that can be conducted on it. There is no scientific evidence to back it up.

Sorry, but that’s nonsense. Scientific theories start out as hypotheses. A hypothesis is given theory status when either by experiment or many observations (and observations of that hypothesis's predictions) prove to be true. Any hypothesis that attains theory status must also meet some other criteria. It must be able to make testable predictions, and it must be falsifiable. That is, observation or experiment could show that it can be shown to be false (or true).

Now, evolution has a great amount of observational evidence to support it. It also makes predictions (for example, that bacteria and insects can become resistant to anti-biotics or certain insecticides), and these predictions have been observed. Evolution also makes predictions about what we should find in the fossil records, and for the most part these have proven true. The observations support the theory. The Cambrian explosion was explained by a slight modification to the theory, called punctuated equilibrium, which again is supported by the evidence. Not only that, but DNA structures common to different life forms is highly suggestive of the truth of evolution, as evolution would predict exactly that this should be true, and observation and study of DNA structures thus far confirm that prediction.
Ok but how did the first living cell come about?
 
The more I learn about evolution, the more I’m convinced it was the workings of God.

Beautiful, simple, unstoppable.

How does letting random adaptations work over billions of years equate to one or more gods?

Nature routinely finds suboptimal solutions that various gods would never choose. Nature is constrained by contingent history, gods are not. The consequences of the difference are obvious and compelling.

Furthermore the harshness of Natural Selection -- all the mass extinctions, the ugliness of competition, all of that contradicts the notion of "Beautiful, simple, unstoppable" gods directing the natural world.

Less Disney and more Darwin generally provides a more realistic assessment of the objective state of nature.
No doubt that the universe is a pretty inhospitable environment for life. If the Sahara desert represents all the matter in the universe, all the life in the universe would be represented by a single grain of sand. That's how rare life is.

So if these conditions are what are required for beings that know and create to arise, why blame God at all for how inhospitable the universe is for the living.
 
another aspect is if god created man, why is the human body so imperfect?
Are you arguing that since man is not perfect there can be no God? Why?
no, I'm saying that it would not make sense for god to make man with the many physical problems man has by creation and not evolution
--not to mention the mental ones

why do we have problems with wisdom teeth? if not evolution, then why?
conjoined babies!! ?
etc
Why not?

How do you know that getting to experience the full spectrum doesn't make us better people?
so you are saying god did create man through creation, with human body faults?
No. I am saying God gave man a precious and rare gift.
than why does man have many faults, if god created man?
 
Are you arguing that since man is not perfect there can be no God? Why?
no, I'm saying that it would not make sense for god to make man with the many physical problems man has by creation and not evolution
--not to mention the mental ones

why do we have problems with wisdom teeth? if not evolution, then why?
conjoined babies!! ?
etc
Why not?

How do you know that getting to experience the full spectrum doesn't make us better people?
so you are saying god did create man through creation, with human body faults?
No. I am saying God gave man a precious and rare gift.
than why does man have many faults, if god created man?
I'm glad you asked. Because that is what is required for man to make the next leap in consciousness. It's all very Darwinian.
 
no, I'm saying that it would not make sense for god to make man with the many physical problems man has by creation and not evolution
--not to mention the mental ones

why do we have problems with wisdom teeth? if not evolution, then why?
conjoined babies!! ?
etc
Why not?

How do you know that getting to experience the full spectrum doesn't make us better people?
so you are saying god did create man through creation, with human body faults?
No. I am saying God gave man a precious and rare gift.

Let’s thank the gods for that blueprint for the cancer cell. Not so rare or precious.
If you are going to blame God for the bad, don't you think you should credit God for the good.

Assigning attributes to the gods such as "good" and "bad" puts the theist is quite a predicament.

The classic argument against the proposed attributes of gods (the omni's) show that the triune characteristics define a god that cannot possibly exist. One cannot be all good, all powerful and all knowing in any logical sense, at least not within the strictures of our present existence. The fact that there is suffering, death, and evil (if one is compelled to believe in things such as good and evil as concepts that exist as realities and not simply as human conventions), establishes that the gods, if they are to have created all, has allowed such things to exist in the first place. This is not consistent with omnibenvolence. If a thing is all good, then by definition there can be nothing evil about it; certainly it is incapable of creating anything that in and of itself can be considered evil.
 

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