If you use the term "crap policies"...

[The T]

My understanding of econ 101 is dead on. You are missing the point. If an employer stops providing health insurance, and doesn't give his employees a raise, he is A) lowering their wages and B) increasing his profits.

That would presuppose that YOU understand why businesses exist in the first place...and it isn't just to provide jobs...idiot. Your wealth envy is just major stupidity and typical of Marxists such as yourself.
It is none of government's business what contract a business and their employees enter into if it is legal, and mutual on behalf of both parties.

Point is? Government needs to keep it's nose out of it and trying to control it in order to steal private property to give to others that are either too stupid, or didn't take advantage of education...and chose poor paths in life and exercising their liberty.

They instead rely on Government to give it to them. It's downright intellectual laziness on YOUR part. And YOU support the government seizing private property. ADMIT IT.

Son? You suck at this. YOU are an enemy to liberty.

You need to move to Somalia. There is is no government there. You'll love it, for the few days you continue to live.

Anarchy is not what our founding fathers envisioned. The radicals are you teabagger terrorists who say you love America, it's just all those fucking AmericANS you have no use for.

^IDIOT

"Government, like fire, is a dangerous servant and a fearful master."~George Washington

"That government is best that governs least."~ Thomas Jefferson

I subscribe to it...YOU however do not. Thank you for bolstering my point. YOU have once again uncloaked yourself.

Somolia indeed. IDIOT.

 

[daveman]

He didn't lie to me. I am keeping the plan I have. Thanks to my wife's employer and the insurance company we use through them. They have both decided to maintain the plan with a very minimal rate increase.

As it turns out, the statement he made while selling this plan did not hold true for everyone. That, to a person with limited ability or desire to see things in proper perspective, is SIMPLY the President LYING to the American people. No circumstances need be discussed! That's it. End of story! We win!!!!We told yiu so!

He lied to millions of people, and he knew it was a lie when he said it.

But don't you DARE criticize him for it.

 

[daveman]

One that confounds good and evil is an enemy to good.
Edmund Burke

One that sucks Obama's ass is an Obama ass-suck.

Dave

 

[The T]

And the Republicans let this happen to themselves. At least the TEA party members have introduced a spine back into the party...

No one ever accused terrorists of not having a 'spine'.

I have. Islamic terrorists are chickenshits.

Of course, you mean TEA Party members, so you're just repeating your programmed talking points again, thus validating the OP.

Like fingers into a glove these idiots just can't help but try them on...Good form, Dave.

 

[Bfgrn]

That would presuppose that YOU understand why businesses exist in the first place...and it isn't just to provide jobs...idiot. Your wealth envy is just major stupidity and typical of Marxists such as yourself.
It is none of government's business what contract a business and their employees enter into if it is legal, and mutual on behalf of both parties.

Point is? Government needs to keep it's nose out of it and trying to control it in order to steal private property to give to others that are either too stupid, or didn't take advantage of education...and chose poor paths in life and exercising their liberty.

They instead rely on Government to give it to them. It's downright intellectual laziness on YOUR part. And YOU support the government seizing private property. ADMIT IT.

Son? You suck at this. YOU are an enemy to liberty.

You need to move to Somalia. There is is no government there. You'll love it, for the few days you continue to live.

Anarchy is not what our founding fathers envisioned. The radicals are you teabagger terrorists who say you love America, it's just all those fucking AmericANS you have no use for.

Employers in the US were never under the obligation to offer healthcare insurance until now. We never were close to being an anarchist country because private enterprise didn't offer health insurance. Horrible analogy.

What you tea-bag terrorists and right wing extremist libertarians need to do is educate yourself. Our founding fathers were NOT laissez-faire capitalists. They were FAR from it.

Our founding fathers did not subscribe to Adam Smith's 'invisible hand'. They believed in very heavy regulations and restrictions on corporations. They were men who held ethics as the most important attribute. They viewed being paid by the American people for their services as a privilege not a right. And they had no problem closing down any corporation that swindled the people, and holding owners and stockholder personally liable for any harm to the people they caused.

Early laws regulating corporations in America

*Corporations were required to have a clear purpose, to be fulfilled but not exceeded.

*Corporations’ licenses to do business were revocable by the state legislature if they exceeded or did not fulfill their chartered purpose(s).

*The state legislature could revoke a corporation’s charter if it misbehaved.

*The act of incorporation did not relieve corporate management or stockholders/owners of responsibility or liability for corporate acts.

*As a matter of course, corporation officers, directors, or agents couldn’t break the law and avoid punishment by claiming they were “just doing their job” when committing crimes but instead could be held criminally liable for violating the law.

*Directors of the corporation were required to come from among stockholders.

*Corporations had to have their headquarters and meetings in the state where their principal place of business was located.

*Corporation charters were granted for a specific period of time, such as twenty or thirty years (instead of being granted “in perpetuity,” as is now the practice).

*Corporations were prohibited from owning stock in other corporations, to prevent them from extending their power inappropriately.

*Corporations’ real estate holdings were limited to what was necessary to carry out their specific purpose(s).

*Corporations were prohibited from making any political contributions, direct or indirect.

*Corporations were prohibited from making charitable or civic donations outside of their specific purposes.

*State legislatures could set the rates that some monopoly corporations could charge for their products or services.

*All corporation records and documents were open to the legislature or the state attorney general.

The Early Role of Corporations in America

The Legacy of the Founding Parents

 

[RandallFlagg]

...you prove that you're unable to think for yourself.

From the AP today - Saturday

The Associated Press on Saturday said at least 3.5 million Americans will lose their current health plans because of President Barack Obama’s signature health care program and released a chart showing a state-by-state breakdown.

“Millions of Americans who buy their own health insurance are being informed that their policies will no longer be offered starting in the new year because they do not meet the higher standards of the Affordable Care Act,” the AP said. “The actual number of people receiving the notices is unclear, with data unavailable in half the states.”


Here is the AP’s chart, breaking down the numbers state-by-state:

Alabama 90,000
Alaska 5,300
Arizona State not tracking
Arkansas State not tracking
California 900,000
Colorado Not available
Connecticut Not available
Delaware Not available
District of Columbia 21,300
Florida 330,000
Georgia 400,000
Hawaii State not tracking
Idaho 105,000
Illinois Not available
Indiana 108,000
Iowa 1,000
Kansas State not tracking
Kentucky 130,000
Louisiana 10,000
Maine Existing plans automatically switched
Maryland Not available
Massachusetts Not available
Michigan 225,000
Minnesota 140,000
Mississippi 600
Missouri State not tracking
Montana State not tracking
Nebraska State not tracking
Nevada State not tracking
New Hampshire 20,000
New Jersey 150,000
New Mexico 26,000
New York 100,000
North Carolina 160,000
North Dakota State not tracking
Ohio State not tracking
Oklahoma None (notification deadline extended)
Oregon 150,000
Pennsylvania 215,000-250,000
Rhode Island Existing plans automatically switched
South Carolina State not tracking
South Dakota State not tracking
Tennessee State not tracking
Texas State not tracking
Utah State not tracking
Vermont Not available
Virginia State not tracking
Washington 290,000
West Virginia State not tracking
Wisconsin State not tracking
Wyoming 3,200

According to the AP, the numbers used in the chart reflect “reporting by AP staffers in each state and the District of Columbia, as of Friday.”

A report published by NBC News earlier this week said the Obama administration knew for at least three years that millions of Americans would not be able to keep their current health plans under the Affordable Care Act.

Keep in mind that these are privately owned policies from individuals who carry all the cost on their own. This is NOT Employers dropping their employee policies. That will hit the fan NEXT year.

So, as I understand it, in an effort to "insure 18 million uninsured Americans" we have (thus far) added (by this report with less than 50% of states responding) 3.5 million MORE Americans with, probably another 10-30 million more americans coming once American business begins canceling their work-force policies. All this to be "socially just" for the less than 1% of the population that was too stupid to have health insurance.

Sounds like a plan to me! Way to go Barry!!

 

[daveman]

No one ever accused terrorists of not having a 'spine'.

And what 'terrorists' do you speak of? The people that revere the Constitution? Liberty? Freedom? Shed the shackles of government control? THOSE terrorists?

Seems to me YOU have it backwards, and ARE one. YOU support those that seek total control and DENY liberty.

Seek help.

The pea brain T's idea of 'liberty'...

 

[The T]

...you prove that you're unable to think for yourself.

From the AP today - Saturday

The Associated Press on Saturday said at least 3.5 million Americans will lose their current health plans because of President Barack Obama’s signature health care program and released a chart showing a state-by-state breakdown.

“Millions of Americans who buy their own health insurance are being informed that their policies will no longer be offered starting in the new year because they do not meet the higher standards of the Affordable Care Act,” the AP said. “The actual number of people receiving the notices is unclear, with data unavailable in half the states.”


Here is the AP’s chart, breaking down the numbers state-by-state:

Alabama 90,000
Alaska 5,300
Arizona State not tracking
Arkansas State not tracking
California 900,000
Colorado Not available
Connecticut Not available
Delaware Not available
District of Columbia 21,300
Florida 330,000
Georgia 400,000
Hawaii State not tracking
Idaho 105,000
Illinois Not available
Indiana 108,000
Iowa 1,000
Kansas State not tracking
Kentucky 130,000
Louisiana 10,000
Maine Existing plans automatically switched
Maryland Not available
Massachusetts Not available
Michigan 225,000
Minnesota 140,000
Mississippi 600
Missouri State not tracking
Montana State not tracking
Nebraska State not tracking
Nevada State not tracking
New Hampshire 20,000
New Jersey 150,000
New Mexico 26,000
New York 100,000
North Carolina 160,000
North Dakota State not tracking
Ohio State not tracking
Oklahoma None (notification deadline extended)
Oregon 150,000
Pennsylvania 215,000-250,000
Rhode Island Existing plans automatically switched
South Carolina State not tracking
South Dakota State not tracking
Tennessee State not tracking
Texas State not tracking
Utah State not tracking
Vermont Not available
Virginia State not tracking
Washington 290,000
West Virginia State not tracking
Wisconsin State not tracking
Wyoming 3,200

According to the AP, the numbers used in the chart reflect “reporting by AP staffers in each state and the District of Columbia, as of Friday.”

A report published by NBC News earlier this week said the Obama administration knew for at least three years that millions of Americans would not be able to keep their current health plans under the Affordable Care Act.

Keep in mind that these are privately owned policies from individuals who carry all the cost on their own. This is NOT Employers dropping their employee policies. That will hit the fan NEXT year.

So, as I understand it, in an effort to "insure 18 million uninsured Americans" we have (thus far) added (by this report with less than 50% of states responding) 3.5 million MORE Americans with, probably another 10-30 million more americans coming once American business begins canceling their work-force policies. All this to be "socially just" for the less than 1% of the population that was too stupid to have health insurance.

Sounds like a plan to me! Way to go Barry!!

AND in a mostly PART-TIME economy...Obama's new 'NORMAL'.

 

[RandallFlagg]

From the AP today - Saturday

The Associated Press on Saturday said at least 3.5 million Americans will lose their current health plans because of President Barack Obama’s signature health care program and released a chart showing a state-by-state breakdown.

“Millions of Americans who buy their own health insurance are being informed that their policies will no longer be offered starting in the new year because they do not meet the higher standards of the Affordable Care Act,” the AP said. “The actual number of people receiving the notices is unclear, with data unavailable in half the states.”


Here is the AP’s chart, breaking down the numbers state-by-state:

Alabama 90,000
Alaska 5,300
Arizona State not tracking
Arkansas State not tracking
California 900,000
Colorado Not available
Connecticut Not available
Delaware Not available
District of Columbia 21,300
Florida 330,000
Georgia 400,000
Hawaii State not tracking
Idaho 105,000
Illinois Not available
Indiana 108,000
Iowa 1,000
Kansas State not tracking
Kentucky 130,000
Louisiana 10,000
Maine Existing plans automatically switched
Maryland Not available
Massachusetts Not available
Michigan 225,000
Minnesota 140,000
Mississippi 600
Missouri State not tracking
Montana State not tracking
Nebraska State not tracking
Nevada State not tracking
New Hampshire 20,000
New Jersey 150,000
New Mexico 26,000
New York 100,000
North Carolina 160,000
North Dakota State not tracking
Ohio State not tracking
Oklahoma None (notification deadline extended)
Oregon 150,000
Pennsylvania 215,000-250,000
Rhode Island Existing plans automatically switched
South Carolina State not tracking
South Dakota State not tracking
Tennessee State not tracking
Texas State not tracking
Utah State not tracking
Vermont Not available
Virginia State not tracking
Washington 290,000
West Virginia State not tracking
Wisconsin State not tracking
Wyoming 3,200

According to the AP, the numbers used in the chart reflect “reporting by AP staffers in each state and the District of Columbia, as of Friday.”

A report published by NBC News earlier this week said the Obama administration knew for at least three years that millions of Americans would not be able to keep their current health plans under the Affordable Care Act.

Keep in mind that these are privately owned policies from individuals who carry all the cost on their own. This is NOT Employers dropping their employee policies. That will hit the fan NEXT year.

So, as I understand it, in an effort to "insure 18 million uninsured Americans" we have (thus far) added (by this report with less than 50% of states responding) 3.5 million MORE Americans with, probably another 10-30 million more americans coming once American business begins canceling their work-force policies. All this to be "socially just" for the less than 1% of the population that was too stupid to have health insurance.

Sounds like a plan to me! Way to go Barry!!

AND in a mostly PART-TIME economy...Obama's new 'NORMAL'.

God, I didn't think it was possible for one group of people (the communist democrats) to screw up something so badly, so quickly. Thank God, they will soon be out of office.

 

[daveman]

IF you really were a businessman, which you are NOT, this would be econ 101. The health insurance you 'say' you are paying for is really wages deducted from that employee's value you are NOT paying, and getting a tax break.

No. I'm paying through a group plan through several businesses. A portion of the healthcare expenditure is deductible. However, aca has deemed that the coverage isn't sufficient so I'll be ending coverage for my employees and dropping the number of hours they will be able to work. Now, they're going to have to go to the exchanges, pay higher premiums, higher deductibles. Everybody loses.

You are full of shit. Hey scum bag, what happens to the money you CLAIM YOU are contributing to your employee's health insurance. If it goes in YOUR pocket you just cut your employee's wages. Piece of shit right wing scum.

You sure an emotional little thing, aren't you?

 

[The T]

So, as I understand it, in an effort to "insure 18 million uninsured Americans" we have (thus far) added (by this report with less than 50% of states responding) 3.5 million MORE Americans with, probably another 10-30 million more americans coming once American business begins canceling their work-force policies. All this to be "socially just" for the less than 1% of the population that was too stupid to have health insurance.

Sounds like a plan to me! Way to go Barry!!

AND in a mostly PART-TIME economy...Obama's new 'NORMAL'.

God, I didn't think it was possible for one group of people (the communist democrats) to screw up something so badly, so quickly. Thank God, they will soon be out of office.

They can't escape this debacle...no matter what words they use, change...to try to deny what they've done to millions. They will suffer retribution at the ballot box. They OWN this.

 

[RandallFlagg]

AND in a mostly PART-TIME economy...Obama's new 'NORMAL'.

God, I didn't think it was possible for one group of people (the communist democrats) to screw up something so badly, so quickly. Thank God, they will soon be out of office.

They can't escape this debacle...no matter what words they use, change...to try to deny what they've done to millions. They will suffer retribution at the ballot box. They OWN this.

Indeed. I've made the same statement several times on this forum. The democrats have screwed the pooch on this one. The republicans weren't entirely sure how they were going to defeat them in 2014. Not a problem - these democrats have taken the gun from the drawer, loaded it, and shot themselves in the head. Every republican in Congress should thank their democrat counterpart.

 

[The T]

God, I didn't think it was possible for one group of people (the communist democrats) to screw up something so badly, so quickly. Thank God, they will soon be out of office.

They can't escape this debacle...no matter what words they use, change...to try to deny what they've done to millions. They will suffer retribution at the ballot box. They OWN this.

Indeed. I've made the same statement several times on this forum. The democrats have screwed the pooch on this one. The republicans weren't entirely sure how they were going to defeat them in 2014. Not a problem - these democrats have taken the gun from the drawer, loaded it, and shot themselves in the head. Every republican in Congress would thank their democrat counterpart.

The Republicans should just shut up and NOT screw this up for themselves. WE the people will take care of this for them.

 

[The T]

No. I'm paying through a group plan through several businesses. A portion of the healthcare expenditure is deductible. However, aca has deemed that the coverage isn't sufficient so I'll be ending coverage for my employees and dropping the number of hours they will be able to work. Now, they're going to have to go to the exchanges, pay higher premiums, higher deductibles. Everybody loses.

You are full of shit. Hey scum bag, what happens to the money you CLAIM YOU are contributing to your employee's health insurance. If it goes in YOUR pocket you just cut your employee's wages. Piece of shit right wing scum.

You sure an emotional little thing, aren't you?

FUN watching BuFu squirm his way out of his Marxist ways.

 

[daveman]

No. I'm paying through a group plan through several businesses. A portion of the healthcare expenditure is deductible. However, aca has deemed that the coverage isn't sufficient so I'll be ending coverage for my employees and dropping the number of hours they will be able to work. Now, they're going to have to go to the exchanges, pay higher premiums, higher deductibles. Everybody loses.

You are full of shit. Hey scum bag, what happens to the money you CLAIM YOU are contributing to your employee's health insurance. If it goes in YOUR pocket you just cut your employee's wages. Piece of shit right wing scum.

One other thing, your idiot did this, not I. My employees had excellent coverage and never had a problem with our healthcare plan.

Not true. People who don't know you, your employees, or the terms of their coverage say it's all crap.

Right, bfgrn?

 

[The T]

You are full of shit. Hey scum bag, what happens to the money you CLAIM YOU are contributing to your employee's health insurance. If it goes in YOUR pocket you just cut your employee's wages. Piece of shit right wing scum.

One other thing, your idiot did this, not I. My employees had excellent coverage and never had a problem with our healthcare plan.

Not true. People who don't know you, your employees, or the terms of their coverage say it's all crap.

Right, bfgrn?

 

[daveman]

You need to move to Somalia. There is is no government there. You'll love it, for the few days you continue to live.

Anarchy is not what our founding fathers envisioned. The radicals are you teabagger terrorists who say you love America, it's just all those fucking AmericANS you have no use for.

Conservatives don't advocate anarchy. Conservatives advocate limited government as described in the Constitution.

So stop telling that lie.

 

[daveman]

...you prove that you're unable to think for yourself.

From the AP today - Saturday

The AP is a TEA Party mouthpiece!!!

/bfgrn

 

[Bfgrn]

You need to move to Somalia. There is is no government there. You'll love it, for the few days you continue to live.

Anarchy is not what our founding fathers envisioned. The radicals are you teabagger terrorists who say you love America, it's just all those fucking AmericANS you have no use for.

Conservatives don't advocate anarchy. Conservatives advocate limited government as described in the Constitution.

So stop telling that lie.

Our founding fathers heavily regulated business and corporations...NOW what pea brain?

 

[Bfgrn]

...you prove that you're unable to think for yourself.

From the AP today - Saturday

The AP is a TEA Party mouthpiece!!!

/bfgrn

Who is 'emotional' pea brain?

You just hate to get schooled...as usual.