Is this a fair representative of Christianity?

[featherlite]

Ravi whats your avatar? At first I thought it was a feathered hat, then I thought hairy enchilada

 

[Ravi]

It shows that people make assumptions upon appearances

Ok.

 

[koshergrl]

Seems to me the MINORITY of you have managed to change the foundations of the US. Why is it that groups strive to be considered a minority and therefore demand special status? Why strive to be part of a group? Given you don't believe in God you can stop reading here...God made each and every person ever created with unique DNA and fingerprints. We were made to be individuals each given unique talents (graces) no one else has that are exactly the same so with that said every person could claim to be a minority by man's definition.

Jesus taught lessons, those who chose not to receive what he said didn't benefit from the teaching. He didn't grab their arms and plead with them to do so. He even spoke in parable about the word being taken by various means but some disregarded that and stayed with it. He spoke of these people because there were hecklers in the crowd but it didn't deter his message. If you choose to not believe things that is your business but telling others they are wrong for it and doing your best to pull them away from their understanding is not your place. In fact go to the middle east and give it a go. I do not wait in anticipation of your story to be told by your hand

And this country was not formed to dissolve religion and spiritual freedom which is what it has turned into from the activists of a MINORITY. Seems to me those beliefs of a MINORITY have become something claimed to now be a majority. It is this minority that stole the truth and twisted it to their own understanding. Did you know that the capital building of the US served as a church building? This is the foundational blocks this country was built upon. The educational system centered around the fact that people wanted children to be able to read and write so they could study their bibles. I think you best rethink putting down the intents of this country until you learn its blocks of foundation
WallBuilders - Issues and Articles - Church in the U.S. Capitol

The country was founded by Deists. Many of them thought Christianity an abomination on humanity and they said so.

Regarding the minority, do you mean..."what you do to the least of these my brothers you do also to me".

Jesus doesn't mince words, but kristians certainly pick and choose which ones they follow.

Not this nonsense again..

 

[presonorek]

Seems to me the MINORITY of you have managed to change the foundations of the US. Why is it that groups strive to be considered a minority and therefore demand special status? Why strive to be part of a group? Given you don't believe in God you can stop reading here...God made each and every person ever created with unique DNA and fingerprints. We were made to be individuals each given unique talents (graces) no one else has that are exactly the same so with that said every person could claim to be a minority by man's definition.

Jesus taught lessons, those who chose not to receive what he said didn't benefit from the teaching. He didn't grab their arms and plead with them to do so. He even spoke in parable about the word being taken by various means but some disregarded that and stayed with it. He spoke of these people because there were hecklers in the crowd but it didn't deter his message. If you choose to not believe things that is your business but telling others they are wrong for it and doing your best to pull them away from their understanding is not your place. In fact go to the middle east and give it a go. I do not wait in anticipation of your story to be told by your hand

And this country was not formed to dissolve religion and spiritual freedom which is what it has turned into from the activists of a MINORITY. Seems to me those beliefs of a MINORITY have become something claimed to now be a majority. It is this minority that stole the truth and twisted it to their own understanding. Did you know that the capital building of the US served as a church building? This is the foundational blocks this country was built upon. The educational system centered around the fact that people wanted children to be able to read and write so they could study their bibles. I think you best rethink putting down the intents of this country until you learn its blocks of foundation
WallBuilders - Issues and Articles - Church in the U.S. Capitol

The country was founded by Deists. Many of them thought Christianity an abomination on humanity and they said so.

Regarding the minority, do you mean..."what you do to the least of these my brothers you do also to me".

Jesus doesn't mince words, but kristians certainly pick and choose which ones they follow.

Not this nonsense again..

Yep. It is getting all kinds of nonsensical up in here. Put on your hard hat and your pj's and get ready for it.

 

[presonorek]

Which would be evidence science logic proof

A thought cannot be proven to exist but we have thoughts all of the time. A feeling cannot be proven to exist but we have feelings all the time.

The bulk of our lives are experienced through thoughts and feelings . The majority of your life cannot be proven. You really limit your understanding of humanity when you focus on science, proof, logic and evidence. Humanity is 99+ % unproven thoughts and feelings.

Poor fellow. You have intentionally chosen to understand very little about life.

 

[presonorek]

I just bought the book anyways. It was $0.01 + $3.99 shipping. It should be a good use of $4.00.

That's money well spent if you really want to understand the mind of the faithful. Now don't misunderstand...being at a higher level does not mean you are "better" than those at a lower level. It just means you understand things in a far different way.

This thread was started about Koshergrl...she is stuck in stage two. I am in stage five, TrinityPower is in four. @Meriwether and @Jake_Starkey are in four of five. It doesn't make us "better" or more "in with God". It just means we understand on a level that Koshergrl can't yet understand. Her mind is not programmed that way. She is walking her path the best way she knows how and so we should not condemn her for that. It's just that her capacity for understanding is at a very low and primitive level. Trying to discuss Biblical history with her, trying to discuss the differences between the Essenes, Ebionites, Pharisees, Marcionites, Sadducees, etc....trying to discuss the complexities of translating from Hebrew to Greek to Latin back to Greek and to English....pfft. It's beyond her comprehension. This is WAY too advanced for her to understand.

She is following according to her capacity for understanding. We should not beat the hell out of her for that because she is trying the only way she knows how. We should pat her on the head and say "you are making a good effort" and just let it be. People like her are not to be taken seriously as representative of the faith. They are to be taken as people who try hard to understand and we should give them credit for their efforts even though they don't grasp the concept.

See what I am getting at?

I don't want to use the word atheist because that simply means a disbelief in God. What puzzles me is that anybody that passes level 2 is not a believer in the divinity of Christ. The books of first John, second John and third John teaches us that these people are anti-Christs. In order to advance to a deeper understanding you have to reject the Bible as truth. This would explain my own personal journey but I am not so sure the average born again evangelical Christian would accept the works of James Fowler as anything other than blasphemy. I'm going to be a good student of Fowler's theory and perhaps start a thread once I understand more.

 

[sealybobo]

Which would be evidence science logic proof

A thought cannot be proven to exist but we have thoughts all of the time. A feeling cannot be proven to exist but we have feelings all the time.

The bulk of our lives are experienced through thoughts and feelings . The majority of your life cannot be proven. You really limit your understanding of humanity when you focus on science, proof, logic and evidence. Humanity is 99+ % unproven thoughts and feelings.

Poor fellow. You have intentionally chosen to understand very little about life.

What makes you believe you're as special as you believe you are. Don't refer to what Paul John George and Ringo said in the bible. Let's say you weren't brainwashed with the Bible or Quran since birth. Tell me other than you happen to be at the top of the food chain on this one particular planet why do you think you are so special that you go to heaven or that a creator cares about you.

Please throw away all the nonsense our elders told us. Give me your factual logical reason why not only is there a creator but that he cares about you anymore than a frog elephant or dog.

Is it a feeling you have? That's called wishful thinking

 

[sealybobo]

I just bought the book anyways. It was $0.01 + $3.99 shipping. It should be a good use of $4.00.

That's money well spent if you really want to understand the mind of the faithful. Now don't misunderstand...being at a higher level does not mean you are "better" than those at a lower level. It just means you understand things in a far different way.

This thread was started about Koshergrl...she is stuck in stage two. I am in stage five, TrinityPower is in four. @Meriwether and @Jake_Starkey are in four of five. It doesn't make us "better" or more "in with God". It just means we understand on a level that Koshergrl can't yet understand. Her mind is not programmed that way. She is walking her path the best way she knows how and so we should not condemn her for that. It's just that her capacity for understanding is at a very low and primitive level. Trying to discuss Biblical history with her, trying to discuss the differences between the Essenes, Ebionites, Pharisees, Marcionites, Sadducees, etc....trying to discuss the complexities of translating from Hebrew to Greek to Latin back to Greek and to English....pfft. It's beyond her comprehension. This is WAY too advanced for her to understand.

She is following according to her capacity for understanding. We should not beat the hell out of her for that because she is trying the only way she knows how. We should pat her on the head and say "you are making a good effort" and just let it be. People like her are not to be taken seriously as representative of the faith. They are to be taken as people who try hard to understand and we should give them credit for their efforts even though they don't grasp the concept.

See what I am getting at?

I don't want to use the word atheist because that simply means a disbelief in God. What puzzles me is that anybody that passes level 2 is not a believer in the divinity of Christ. The books of first John, second John and third John teaches us that these people are anti-Christs. In order to advance to a deeper understanding you have to reject the Bible as truth. This would explain my own personal journey but I am not so sure the average born again evangelical Christian would accept the works of James Fowler as anything other than blasphemy. I'm going to be a good student of Fowler's theory and perhaps start a thread once I understand more.

People in the 3rd grade are easy to brainwash. Humans are still gullible and ripe for the picking well into our 20s. A lot of people in their 20s discover God or athiesm at that time. We ask a lot of questions in our 20s. Usually people are either born into a religion or find one when they are young adults. Fewer and fewer are swallowing religion but it does still happen.

I believe the athiesm effect is happening and less people are buying religion and that's good because religion is a way they control the sheep.

 

[presonorek]

Which would be evidence science logic proof

A thought cannot be proven to exist but we have thoughts all of the time. A feeling cannot be proven to exist but we have feelings all the time.

The bulk of our lives are experienced through thoughts and feelings . The majority of your life cannot be proven. You really limit your understanding of humanity when you focus on science, proof, logic and evidence. Humanity is 99+ % unproven thoughts and feelings.

Poor fellow. You have intentionally chosen to understand very little about life.

What makes you believe you're as special as you believe you are. Don't refer to what Paul John George and Ringo said in the bible. Let's say you weren't brainwashed with the Bible or Quran since birth. Tell me other than you happen to be at the top of the food chain on this one particular planet why do you think you are so special that you go to heaven or that a creator cares about you.

Please throw away all the nonsense our elders told us. Give me your factual logical reason why not only is there a creator but that he cares about you anymore than a frog elephant or dog.

Is it a feeling you have? That's called wishful thinking

If I understand James Fowler's theory then one has to become an atheist before advancing to the higher levels of their faith.

I haven't read "Stages of Faith" yet. It sounds like Fowler believes that the most effective and fulfilled Christians are in fact atheist or at least non-believers masquerading as Christians.

When I read the book I will share more. I'll invite Blue Phantom and Sealybobo to the discussion. It would probably be an interesting conversation at least for ten minutes or so.

 

[presonorek]

Which would be evidence science logic proof

A thought cannot be proven to exist but we have thoughts all of the time. A feeling cannot be proven to exist but we have feelings all the time.

The bulk of our lives are experienced through thoughts and feelings . The majority of your life cannot be proven. You really limit your understanding of humanity when you focus on science, proof, logic and evidence. Humanity is 99+ % unproven thoughts and feelings.

Poor fellow. You have intentionally chosen to understand very little about life.

What makes you believe you're as special as you believe you are. Don't refer to what Paul John George and Ringo said in the bible. Let's say you weren't brainwashed with the Bible or Quran since birth. Tell me other than you happen to be at the top of the food chain on this one particular planet why do you think you are so special that you go to heaven or that a creator cares about you.

Please throw away all the nonsense our elders told us. Give me your factual logical reason why not only is there a creator but that he cares about you anymore than a frog elephant or dog.

Is it a feeling you have? That's called wishful thinking

No offense but your comments have nothing to do with what I said about thoughts and feelings. You went off on an irrelevant tangent. Don't do that. I know that you are better than that.

A thought cannot be seen or proven. A feeling cannot be seen or proven. Focusing on factual logical reasoning only addresses less than 0.1% of our life experiences. Why would you ignore the remaining 99.9% of life that is experienced through unproven feelings and thoughts? Just because thought thoughts and feelings can't be proven through factual logical reasoning doesn't mean that thoughts and feelings are irrelevant. They are very relevant.

This has nothing to do with the Bible or the Qu'ran. I know that thoughts and feelings exists simply by living.

 

[UllysesS.Archer]

You're trying to say a sacrament defines Christianity?

No. I was talking about this part:

"Nope. You don't. Now go sit down, you piece of shit. You need to look up words before you presume to tell people what they mean.

You people do need to die."

I included the entire post to include context.

Oh, so you're butt hurt. Carry on

Seriously, I laughed so hard, I peed my pants.

 

[sealybobo]

Which would be evidence science logic proof

A thought cannot be proven to exist but we have thoughts all of the time. A feeling cannot be proven to exist but we have feelings all the time.

The bulk of our lives are experienced through thoughts and feelings . The majority of your life cannot be proven. You really limit your understanding of humanity when you focus on science, proof, logic and evidence. Humanity is 99+ % unproven thoughts and feelings.

Poor fellow. You have intentionally chosen to understand very little about life.

What makes you believe you're as special as you believe you are. Don't refer to what Paul John George and Ringo said in the bible. Let's say you weren't brainwashed with the Bible or Quran since birth. Tell me other than you happen to be at the top of the food chain on this one particular planet why do you think you are so special that you go to heaven or that a creator cares about you.

Please throw away all the nonsense our elders told us. Give me your factual logical reason why not only is there a creator but that he cares about you anymore than a frog elephant or dog.

Is it a feeling you have? That's called wishful thinking

No offense but your comments have nothing to do with what I said about thoughts and feelings. You went off on an irrelevant tangent. Don't do that. I know that you are better than that.

A thought cannot be seen or proven. A feeling cannot be seen or proven. Focusing on factual logical reasoning only addresses less than 0.1% of our life experiences. Why would you ignore the remaining 99.9% of life that is experienced through unproven feelings and thoughts? Just because thought a and feelings can be proven through factual logical reasoning doesn't mean that thoughts and feelings are irrelevant. They are very relevant.

This has nothing to do with the Bible or the Qu'ran. I know that thoughts and feelings exists simply by living.

And just like a computer or frog when you turn off the power what happens?

 

[presonorek]

Which would be evidence science logic proof

A thought cannot be proven to exist but we have thoughts all of the time. A feeling cannot be proven to exist but we have feelings all the time.

The bulk of our lives are experienced through thoughts and feelings . The majority of your life cannot be proven. You really limit your understanding of humanity when you focus on science, proof, logic and evidence. Humanity is 99+ % unproven thoughts and feelings.

Poor fellow. You have intentionally chosen to understand very little about life.

What makes you believe you're as special as you believe you are. Don't refer to what Paul John George and Ringo said in the bible. Let's say you weren't brainwashed with the Bible or Quran since birth. Tell me other than you happen to be at the top of the food chain on this one particular planet why do you think you are so special that you go to heaven or that a creator cares about you.

Please throw away all the nonsense our elders told us. Give me your factual logical reason why not only is there a creator but that he cares about you anymore than a frog elephant or dog.

Is it a feeling you have? That's called wishful thinking

No offense but your comments have nothing to do with what I said about thoughts and feelings. You went off on an irrelevant tangent. Don't do that. I know that you are better than that.

A thought cannot be seen or proven. A feeling cannot be seen or proven. Focusing on factual logical reasoning only addresses less than 0.1% of our life experiences. Why would you ignore the remaining 99.9% of life that is experienced through unproven feelings and thoughts? Just because thought a and feelings can be proven through factual logical reasoning doesn't mean that thoughts and feelings are irrelevant. They are very relevant.

This has nothing to do with the Bible or the Qu'ran. I know that thoughts and feelings exists simply by living.

And just like a computer or frog when you turn off the power what happens?

I think that we are discussing two or three different things. You don't appear to be addressing anything that I have said. What post # from this thread are you referencing?

The human quits thinking and quits feeling. I don't know what that has to do with anything I said.

 

[sealybobo]

Which would be evidence science logic proof

A thought cannot be proven to exist but we have thoughts all of the time. A feeling cannot be proven to exist but we have feelings all the time.

The bulk of our lives are experienced through thoughts and feelings . The majority of your life cannot be proven. You really limit your understanding of humanity when you focus on science, proof, logic and evidence. Humanity is 99+ % unproven thoughts and feelings.

Poor fellow. You have intentionally chosen to understand very little about life.

What makes you believe you're as special as you believe you are. Don't refer to what Paul John George and Ringo said in the bible. Let's say you weren't brainwashed with the Bible or Quran since birth. Tell me other than you happen to be at the top of the food chain on this one particular planet why do you think you are so special that you go to heaven or that a creator cares about you.

Please throw away all the nonsense our elders told us. Give me your factual logical reason why not only is there a creator but that he cares about you anymore than a frog elephant or dog.

Is it a feeling you have? That's called wishful thinking

If I understand James Fowler's theory then one has to become an atheist before advancing to the higher levels of their faith.

I haven't read "Stages of Faith" yet. It sounds like Fowler believes that the most effective and fulfilled Christians are in fact atheist or at least non-believers masquerading as Christians.

When I read the book I will share more. I'll invite Blue Phantom and Sealybobo to the discussion. It would probably be an interesting conversation at least for ten minutes or so.

Once you realize every religion made up stories of when God visited their ancestors, you are only left with the fact you can't imagine it any other way.

Sure something might have created the universe but you can't even prove that. Now you're going to have to explain why you believe it cares about you or that your soul is more special than a monkey tiger or tortoises. Keep in mind that when man came up with the arguments you're going to make they thought the earth was the center of the universe, we were stationary and everything revolved around us.

In fact we know now there are billions of other planets in the universe many of which probably have life and the only reason we don't know of them is because we are too small to get there or see them.

Point is, what reasons do you have for believing what you believe if you are not referring to any of the organized religions stories?

 

[presonorek]

Which would be evidence science logic proof

A thought cannot be proven to exist but we have thoughts all of the time. A feeling cannot be proven to exist but we have feelings all the time.

The bulk of our lives are experienced through thoughts and feelings . The majority of your life cannot be proven. You really limit your understanding of humanity when you focus on science, proof, logic and evidence. Humanity is 99+ % unproven thoughts and feelings.

Poor fellow. You have intentionally chosen to understand very little about life.

What makes you believe you're as special as you believe you are. Don't refer to what Paul John George and Ringo said in the bible. Let's say you weren't brainwashed with the Bible or Quran since birth. Tell me other than you happen to be at the top of the food chain on this one particular planet why do you think you are so special that you go to heaven or that a creator cares about you.

Please throw away all the nonsense our elders told us. Give me your factual logical reason why not only is there a creator but that he cares about you anymore than a frog elephant or dog.

Is it a feeling you have? That's called wishful thinking

If I understand James Fowler's theory then one has to become an atheist before advancing to the higher levels of their faith.

I haven't read "Stages of Faith" yet. It sounds like Fowler believes that the most effective and fulfilled Christians are in fact atheist or at least non-believers masquerading as Christians.

When I read the book I will share more. I'll invite Blue Phantom and Sealybobo to the discussion. It would probably be an interesting conversation at least for ten minutes or so.

Once you realize every religion made up stories of when God visited their ancestors, you are only left with the fact you can't imagine it any other way.

Sure something might have created the universe but you can't even prove that. Now you're going to have to explain why you believe it cares about you or that your soul is more special than a monkey tiger or tortoises. Keep in mind that when man came up with the arguments you're going to make they thought the earth was the center of the universe, we were stationary and everything revolved around us.

In fact we know now there are billions of other planets in the universe many of which probably have life and the only reason we don't know of them is because we are too small to get there or see them.

Point is, what reasons do you have for believing what you believe if you are not referring to any of the organized religions stories?

I don't believe them. Why do you make that assumption? Post #205 said nothing about any organised religion.

 

[sealybobo]

Which would be evidence science logic proof

A thought cannot be proven to exist but we have thoughts all of the time. A feeling cannot be proven to exist but we have feelings all the time.

The bulk of our lives are experienced through thoughts and feelings . The majority of your life cannot be proven. You really limit your understanding of humanity when you focus on science, proof, logic and evidence. Humanity is 99+ % unproven thoughts and feelings.

Poor fellow. You have intentionally chosen to understand very little about life.

What makes you believe you're as special as you believe you are. Don't refer to what Paul John George and Ringo said in the bible. Let's say you weren't brainwashed with the Bible or Quran since birth. Tell me other than you happen to be at the top of the food chain on this one particular planet why do you think you are so special that you go to heaven or that a creator cares about you.

Please throw away all the nonsense our elders told us. Give me your factual logical reason why not only is there a creator but that he cares about you anymore than a frog elephant or dog.

Is it a feeling you have? That's called wishful thinking

No offense but your comments have nothing to do with what I said about thoughts and feelings. You went off on an irrelevant tangent. Don't do that. I know that you are better than that.

A thought cannot be seen or proven. A feeling cannot be seen or proven. Focusing on factual logical reasoning only addresses less than 0.1% of our life experiences. Why would you ignore the remaining 99.9% of life that is experienced through unproven feelings and thoughts? Just because thought a and feelings can be proven through factual logical reasoning doesn't mean that thoughts and feelings are irrelevant. They are very relevant.

This has nothing to do with the Bible or the Qu'ran. I know that thoughts and feelings exists simply by living.

And just like a computer or frog when you turn off the power what happens?

I think that we are discussing two or three different things. You don't appear to be addressing anything that I have said. What post # from this thread are you referencing?

The human quits thinking and quits feeling. I don't know what that has to do with anything I said.

I need to first understand what you believe and why. Is your belief based on ignorance? Many theists believe because we can't disprove God. So they believe because no one knows? What sense does that make?

And stop talking about a book you haven't read yet. Lol or can't explain. Ha!

 

[sealybobo]

Which would be evidence science logic proof

A thought cannot be proven to exist but we have thoughts all of the time. A feeling cannot be proven to exist but we have feelings all the time.

The bulk of our lives are experienced through thoughts and feelings . The majority of your life cannot be proven. You really limit your understanding of humanity when you focus on science, proof, logic and evidence. Humanity is 99+ % unproven thoughts and feelings.

Poor fellow. You have intentionally chosen to understand very little about life.

What makes you believe you're as special as you believe you are. Don't refer to what Paul John George and Ringo said in the bible. Let's say you weren't brainwashed with the Bible or Quran since birth. Tell me other than you happen to be at the top of the food chain on this one particular planet why do you think you are so special that you go to heaven or that a creator cares about you.

Please throw away all the nonsense our elders told us. Give me your factual logical reason why not only is there a creator but that he cares about you anymore than a frog elephant or dog.

Is it a feeling you have? That's called wishful thinking

If I understand James Fowler's theory then one has to become an atheist before advancing to the higher levels of their faith.

I haven't read "Stages of Faith" yet. It sounds like Fowler believes that the most effective and fulfilled Christians are in fact atheist or at least non-believers masquerading as Christians.

When I read the book I will share more. I'll invite Blue Phantom and Sealybobo to the discussion. It would probably be an interesting conversation at least for ten minutes or so.

Once you realize every religion made up stories of when God visited their ancestors, you are only left with the fact you can't imagine it any other way.

Sure something might have created the universe but you can't even prove that. Now you're going to have to explain why you believe it cares about you or that your soul is more special than a monkey tiger or tortoises. Keep in mind that when man came up with the arguments you're going to make they thought the earth was the center of the universe, we were stationary and everything revolved around us.

In fact we know now there are billions of other planets in the universe many of which probably have life and the only reason we don't know of them is because we are too small to get there or see them.

Point is, what reasons do you have for believing what you believe if you are not referring to any of the organized religions stories?

I don't believe them. Why do you make that assumption? Post #205 said nothing about any organised religion.

I notice many of you who say that cherry pick. My dad says he doesn't buy organized religion but believes in hell. Well where did he get that from then?

 

[sealybobo]

Which would be evidence science logic proof

A thought cannot be proven to exist but we have thoughts all of the time. A feeling cannot be proven to exist but we have feelings all the time.

The bulk of our lives are experienced through thoughts and feelings . The majority of your life cannot be proven. You really limit your understanding of humanity when you focus on science, proof, logic and evidence. Humanity is 99+ % unproven thoughts and feelings.

Poor fellow. You have intentionally chosen to understand very little about life.

I got a feeling once. I felt like every religion ever invented was made up by a very primitive species on one particular planet in this universe. And I base my feelings after examining all the evidence and coming to a very rational and logical conclusion. I understand human beings are spiritual and that's cool but really it's all wishful thinking.

Certainly Iran should not be a Muslim country and we should never consider ourselves a Christian nation. Two fairytale used to control us. Sometimes to do good sometimes not.

 

[presonorek]

A thought cannot be proven to exist but we have thoughts all of the time. A feeling cannot be proven to exist but we have feelings all the time.

The bulk of our lives are experienced through thoughts and feelings . The majority of your life cannot be proven. You really limit your understanding of humanity when you focus on science, proof, logic and evidence. Humanity is 99+ % unproven thoughts and feelings.

Poor fellow. You have intentionally chosen to understand very little about life.

What makes you believe you're as special as you believe you are. Don't refer to what Paul John George and Ringo said in the bible. Let's say you weren't brainwashed with the Bible or Quran since birth. Tell me other than you happen to be at the top of the food chain on this one particular planet why do you think you are so special that you go to heaven or that a creator cares about you.

Please throw away all the nonsense our elders told us. Give me your factual logical reason why not only is there a creator but that he cares about you anymore than a frog elephant or dog.

Is it a feeling you have? That's called wishful thinking

No offense but your comments have nothing to do with what I said about thoughts and feelings. You went off on an irrelevant tangent. Don't do that. I know that you are better than that.

A thought cannot be seen or proven. A feeling cannot be seen or proven. Focusing on factual logical reasoning only addresses less than 0.1% of our life experiences. Why would you ignore the remaining 99.9% of life that is experienced through unproven feelings and thoughts? Just because thought a and feelings can be proven through factual logical reasoning doesn't mean that thoughts and feelings are irrelevant. They are very relevant.

This has nothing to do with the Bible or the Qu'ran. I know that thoughts and feelings exists simply by living.

And just like a computer or frog when you turn off the power what happens?

I think that we are discussing two or three different things. You don't appear to be addressing anything that I have said. What post # from this thread are you referencing?

The human quits thinking and quits feeling. I don't know what that has to do with anything I said.

I need to first understand what you believe and why. Is your belief based on ignorance? Many theists believe because we can't disprove God. So they believe because no one knows? What sense does that make?

And stop talking about a book you haven't read yet. Lol or can't explain. Ha!

I was hoping Blue Phantom would chime in about the book. I'm pretty excited about it. I believe that if you pour gasoline into a car then it will make the car operate. That is one belief that I have that is based on ignorance. I have many beliefs that are based on ignorance. I believe that if I type from my computer and press send then people from different parts of the world can read what I say. Nobody has the sufficient time to master all phenomenal aspects of life. We simply have to base most of our beliefs on ignorance.

Why do you demonize an efficient form of survival? A person that has never been burned by a stove bases their belief that a stove will burn you if you touch entirely upon ignorance.

I just don't see the harm in religion or religious organizations. I see a lot of good that comes from them. Even the violent wars and persecution orchestrated in the name of religion can be argued on a case by case basis as a positive thing or a negative thing dependent upon values.

We don't like wars. That is the nature of war. It isn't supposed to be enjoyed or it wouldn't serve its function. I'm not sure why people get so uptight over religion. It seems harmless to me.

 

[presonorek]

A thought cannot be proven to exist but we have thoughts all of the time. A feeling cannot be proven to exist but we have feelings all the time.

The bulk of our lives are experienced through thoughts and feelings . The majority of your life cannot be proven. You really limit your understanding of humanity when you focus on science, proof, logic and evidence. Humanity is 99+ % unproven thoughts and feelings.

Poor fellow. You have intentionally chosen to understand very little about life.

What makes you believe you're as special as you believe you are. Don't refer to what Paul John George and Ringo said in the bible. Let's say you weren't brainwashed with the Bible or Quran since birth. Tell me other than you happen to be at the top of the food chain on this one particular planet why do you think you are so special that you go to heaven or that a creator cares about you.

Please throw away all the nonsense our elders told us. Give me your factual logical reason why not only is there a creator but that he cares about you anymore than a frog elephant or dog.

Is it a feeling you have? That's called wishful thinking

If I understand James Fowler's theory then one has to become an atheist before advancing to the higher levels of their faith.

I haven't read "Stages of Faith" yet. It sounds like Fowler believes that the most effective and fulfilled Christians are in fact atheist or at least non-believers masquerading as Christians.

When I read the book I will share more. I'll invite Blue Phantom and Sealybobo to the discussion. It would probably be an interesting conversation at least for ten minutes or so.

Once you realize every religion made up stories of when God visited their ancestors, you are only left with the fact you can't imagine it any other way.

Sure something might have created the universe but you can't even prove that. Now you're going to have to explain why you believe it cares about you or that your soul is more special than a monkey tiger or tortoises. Keep in mind that when man came up with the arguments you're going to make they thought the earth was the center of the universe, we were stationary and everything revolved around us.

In fact we know now there are billions of other planets in the universe many of which probably have life and the only reason we don't know of them is because we are too small to get there or see them.

Point is, what reasons do you have for believing what you believe if you are not referring to any of the organized religions stories?

I don't believe them. Why do you make that assumption? Post #205 said nothing about any organised religion.

I notice many of you who say that cherry pick. My dad says he doesn't buy organized religion but believes in hell. Well where did he get that from then?

Huston Smith