IT WAS INEVITABLE: Speech control moves from the campus to the workplace

[JoeB131]

As I've already said, multiple times, this tiny story is about much more than a business setting.

I'm having a difficult time getting folks to just be honest.

When it comes to freedom of expression, I think I'll side with these folks:

You keep claiming this, but you have yet to provide evidence. So kids didn't want Ann Coulter's hate on their campus. Good for them. Fox News won't even put Ann Coulter on TV anymore. Most news papers and websites won't run her column. Why should the Berkeley kids be held to a higher standard than Fox News?

 

[pknopp]

In this clip, President Obama patiently explains to college students why they should allow others to express their opinions without fear of retribution.

I only wish the illiberal, authoritarian Regressive Left would take this message to heart in every other context. It's at the very heart of REAL liberalism.

That's great but has nothing to do with a work setting.

 

[Mac1958]

In this clip, President Obama patiently explains to college students why they should allow others to express their opinions without fear of retribution.

I only wish the illiberal, authoritarian Regressive Left would take this message to heart in every other context. It's at the very heart of REAL liberalism.

That's great but has nothing to do with a work setting.

Actually, it has to do with the big picture. A much bigger picture.

I keep saying this, I've given several examples, and you keep ignoring it.

As I tell the Trumpsters, I'm tired of asymmetrical conversations.
.

 

[pknopp]

In this clip, President Obama patiently explains to college students why they should allow others to express their opinions without fear of retribution.

I only wish the illiberal, authoritarian Regressive Left would take this message to heart in every other context. It's at the very heart of REAL liberalism.

That's great but has nothing to do with a work setting.

Actually, it has to do with the big picture. A much bigger picture.

I keep saying this, I've given several examples, and you keep ignoring it.

As I tell the Trumpsters, I'm tired of asymmetrical conversations.
.

You are generally better than this.

 

[Mac1958]

In this clip, President Obama patiently explains to college students why they should allow others to express their opinions without fear of retribution.

I only wish the illiberal, authoritarian Regressive Left would take this message to heart in every other context. It's at the very heart of REAL liberalism.

That's great but has nothing to do with a work setting.

Actually, it has to do with the big picture. A much bigger picture.

I keep saying this, I've given several examples, and you keep ignoring it.

As I tell the Trumpsters, I'm tired of asymmetrical conversations.
.

You are generally better than this.

Yes, when I agree with you.

I know that game, too.
.

 

[NewsVine_Mariyam]

Tell me, exactly what did you think when Ann Coulter's campus talks were shut down?

Ann Coulter does not exist in my world. What is it about her that makes you think she should?

Clumsy dodge noted.

Good.
,

It's not a dodge, I'm not really sure who she is and I didn't Google her.

So since I'm unaware of her existence how can I have an opinion on something that I wasn't aware happened by someone whom I don't know exists. And don't get me wrong, I've seen her name before I just have no idea who she is nor have I ever had any reason to look her up.

 

[pknopp]

In this clip, President Obama patiently explains to college students why they should allow others to express their opinions without fear of retribution.

I only wish the illiberal, authoritarian Regressive Left would take this message to heart in every other context. It's at the very heart of REAL liberalism.

That's great but has nothing to do with a work setting.

Actually, it has to do with the big picture. A much bigger picture.

I keep saying this, I've given several examples, and you keep ignoring it.

As I tell the Trumpsters, I'm tired of asymmetrical conversations.
.

You are generally better than this.

Yes, when I agree with you.

I know that game, too.
.

Calling people a "Trumpster" simply because they disagree with you is juvenile.

 

[Mac1958]

In this clip, President Obama patiently explains to college students why they should allow others to express their opinions without fear of retribution.

I only wish the illiberal, authoritarian Regressive Left would take this message to heart in every other context. It's at the very heart of REAL liberalism.

That's great but has nothing to do with a work setting.

Actually, it has to do with the big picture. A much bigger picture.

I keep saying this, I've given several examples, and you keep ignoring it.

As I tell the Trumpsters, I'm tired of asymmetrical conversations.
.

You are generally better than this.

Yes, when I agree with you.

I know that game, too.
.

Calling people a "Trumpster" simply because they disagree with you is juvenile.

I don't call them Trumpsters simply because they disagree with me.

You just made that up.

I'm learning here that you're not very honest.

Okay, got it.
.

 

[pknopp]

That's great but has nothing to do with a work setting.

Actually, it has to do with the big picture. A much bigger picture.

I keep saying this, I've given several examples, and you keep ignoring it.

As I tell the Trumpsters, I'm tired of asymmetrical conversations.
.

You are generally better than this.

Yes, when I agree with you.

I know that game, too.
.

Calling people a "Trumpster" simply because they disagree with you is juvenile.

I don't call them Trumpsters simply because they disagree with me.

You just made that up.

I'm learning here that you're not very honest.

Okay, got it.
.

You used a poor example to make a point on. You can't even explain what kind of speech you are concerned about ending in the case you posted. It's what happens when you are looking for monsters around every corner.

 

[Mac1958]

Actually, it has to do with the big picture. A much bigger picture.

I keep saying this, I've given several examples, and you keep ignoring it.

As I tell the Trumpsters, I'm tired of asymmetrical conversations.
.

You are generally better than this.

Yes, when I agree with you.

I know that game, too.
.

Calling people a "Trumpster" simply because they disagree with you is juvenile.

I don't call them Trumpsters simply because they disagree with me.

You just made that up.

I'm learning here that you're not very honest.

Okay, got it.
.

You used a poor example to make a point on. You can't even explain what kind of speech you are concerned about ending in the case you posted. It's what happens when you are looking for monsters around every corner.

Super duper.

Are you done now?
.

 

[JoeB131]

Actually, it has to do with the big picture. A much bigger picture.

I keep saying this, I've given several examples, and you keep ignoring it.

As I tell the Trumpsters, I'm tired of asymmetrical conversations.

You can't use other faulty analogies to prove your faulty analogy.

So let's review. Technology that doesn't exist yet is being developed to track group participation in meetings. Even though the technology doesn't exist yet and no company has expressed a desire for it, Vichy Mac is ABSOLUTELY CONVINCED it will be yet another assault on White Male Privilege by tracking how many times a white boss talked over a woman or a person of color in a meeting.

And what does he use as "proof" of this trend? That college kids don't want racists and Islamophobes on their campuses.

 

[The Original Tree]

Not difficult to imagine future conversations with the Human Resource department:

HR: We notice that in your meeting yesterday on distribution from our Newark hub, you only allowed Tammy to speak for 7 total minutes, while Dave was allowed to speak for 10 total minutes.

Manager: Well yes, Dave has a bit more experience with Newark, and had more valuable and pertinent input.

HR: From now on, we want you to make sure that Tammy gets equal time in all meetings regarding distribution from our Newark hub. We do not want her feeling that her opinions are of less importance than other meeting participants.

Manager: This is ridiculous. I'm not going to hold a stopwatch to people when they're speaking just to please Alexa. I run my meetings in a way that I know is most effective and most efficient. I'm trying to run my department here.

HR: If you don't allow proper time for Tammy, you will written up. Three write-ups are cause for immediate termination.

You think I'm kidding, gang?
.

Nope this is what is coming. Only that is just the start of it.

 

[The Original Tree]

Actually, it has to do with the big picture. A much bigger picture.

I keep saying this, I've given several examples, and you keep ignoring it.

As I tell the Trumpsters, I'm tired of asymmetrical conversations.

You can't use other faulty analogies to prove your faulty analogy.

So let's review. Technology that doesn't exist yet is being developed to track group participation in meetings. Even though the technology doesn't exist yet and no company has expressed a desire for it, Vichy Mac is ABSOLUTELY CONVINCED it will be yet another assault on White Male Privilege by tracking how many times a white boss talked over a woman or a person of color in a meeting.

And what does he use as "proof" of this trend? That college kids don't want racists and Islamophobes on their campuses.

I hate to tell you this, but I have a SMART Anti-Harassment Training this month. This is a real thing that is coming.

 

[Olde Europe]

Since this place is being increasingly dominated by trolling, let's try to wrap this up, shall we? Here is what I see:

There is research on a gadget that is supposed to help under-performing teams to work together better. It's being funded, in part, by the U.S. army. Whatever the researchers come up with, the gadget will monitor speech and, probably, other sign signs / non-verbal utterances to do with group dynamics, and, based on analyses of the data collected in the process, recommendations for team improvement might be developed.

Now, the OP article identifies one cause of lacking team performance in that a set of voices routinely isn't heard, and that would be women's. Quite obviously, relegating women (etc.) to the sidelines would be a well-to-do white males' privilege since times immemorial. Anyone who has been in more than a handful of team sessions, and at least semi-conscious, has seen how that was playing out.

While the OP runs on "all voices must be heard", you will not find a single utterance raising concerns over the routinely sidelined voices. It so happens I find that scurrilous, and it appears to indicate that, rather than to defend freedom of speech, it all aims at defending well-to-do white males' privileges.

There is another aspect that should be noted: Freedom of speech, as is endlessly repeated, stands at the core of (real) liberalism. That may well be true, and it is a cause worthy of being defended. What's wrong about the OP's argument isn't so much defending that freedom, as it is to set it absolute (just as the gun nuts set the 2nd Amendment absolute). Liberalism, like every ideology with some complexity and wide-spread appeal, has to incorporate and reconcile a broad set of aims and principles, some of which may be competing, or even hard to reconcile. In the case of liberalism, freedom of speech might contradict the efforts to provide a more welcoming and supporting environment for groups on the lower rungs of society, and that comes at a cost to the privileges of well-to-do white males and their traditional dominance.

Hence the screeching, hence the 1st Amendment absolutism, hence the desperate claims to the moral high-ground, hence the attempts at denigrating and smearing everyone not so "principled". A reasonable argument is to be had as to the merits of that gadget (how about inviting a mediator over for some team sessions?). A reasonable argument is to be had as to the merits of not inviting certain speakers on campus. However, denigrating all those who are concerned about the n-word being re-normalized, about gays being routinely decried as pederasts and depicted as a threat to society, about women being belittled as overly emotional, bleeding, not fit for science or leadership, or cold and calculating in case they do aspire to leadership positions, is not a reasonable argument. It is propaganda and a smear in defense of well-to-do white male privileges. Defending these privileges under a 1st Amendment set absolute while disregarding everything else is not "liberal" - except for simplistic bigots with a cause, or rightarded propagandists aiming at monopolizing the white male vote by rallying them behind a Trumpish sense of being victims "under assault" by the so-called "illiberal left".

 

[WEATHER53]

Coulter has truth speech and not hate speech but libbies hate the truth so thus their confusion and mislabeling

 

[JoeB131]

I hate to tell you this, but I have a SMART Anti-Harassment Training this month. This is a real thing that is coming.

Companies I've been with have been doing anti-harassment training since the 1990's... Not sure why this is a new thing to you.

probably because post Anita Hill, companies are a lot more aware of how much it can cost them to have a cad on the staff.

 

[Dale Smith]

What a tribute to your narcissism and over inflated sense of self. You had nothing to do with my sabbatical.

No, you just spent a whole paragraph whining about me.

Joseph, you were one of the "knows nothing" blowhards that I wanted to get in a parting shot at but my real angst was at the moderator that kept deleting my posts on a thread where I am debunking the CO2 myth that was being stupidly displayed. He kept sending me stupid little notes claiming that I "was off topic" so on this message board, you are not allowed to bring a counter argument but must simply defend the counter of alleged man made carbon filled disaster. As I said to the moderator then, like I said to the ones that whines about about my posts? They got a hefty "GO fuck yourselves".

I destroy you every time we cross paths. You use your condescending "Hey, guy" or "Hey, pal" bullshit before you start flinging it far and wide. I am not your "pal" nor am I "Hey guy" as the euphemistic way of a dipshit like you believing you are going to lay some truth down...…. get it now, you ignorant sack of shit? You know nothing of worth nor do you propose anything of worth. You make a living trying to embellish the experiences of those seeking a better job appear to be more important than they were via a professionally written resume. You are one ignorant sack of shit and you have no real world skills...…..sucks to be you.

 

[JoeB131]

Joseph, you were one of the "knows nothing" blowhards that I wanted to get in a parting shot at but my real angst was at the moderator that kept deleting my posts on a thread where I am debunking the CO2 myth that was being stupidly displayed. He kept sending me stupid little notes claiming that I "was off topic" so on this message board, you are not allowed to bring a counter argument but must simply defend the counter of alleged man made carbon filled disaster. As I said to the moderator then, like I said to the ones that whines about about my posts? They got a hefty "GO fuck yourselves".

Oooh, the Mods are part of the great Lizard Man Conspiracy, too...

I destroy you every time we cross paths.

Naw, buddy. Arguing like you is like playing chess with a pigeon. You knock over the pieces, strut across the board shitting on everything, and act like you've won, but you just prove yourself to be kind of an awful crazy person.

I'm the only one who is actually nice enough to pay any attention to you, but it's more like those people who used to go to mental hospitals to look at the crazies for entertainment.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

I hate to tell you this, but I have a SMART Anti-Harassment Training this month. This is a real thing that is coming.

Because of people like you.

 

[22lcidw]

Actually, it has to do with the big picture. A much bigger picture.

I keep saying this, I've given several examples, and you keep ignoring it.

As I tell the Trumpsters, I'm tired of asymmetrical conversations.

You can't use other faulty analogies to prove your faulty analogy.

So let's review. Technology that doesn't exist yet is being developed to track group participation in meetings. Even though the technology doesn't exist yet and no company has expressed a desire for it, Vichy Mac is ABSOLUTELY CONVINCED it will be yet another assault on White Male Privilege by tracking how many times a white boss talked over a woman or a person of color in a meeting.

And what does he use as "proof" of this trend? That college kids don't want racists and Islamophobes on their campuses.

When this is complete, we all will be walking down streets or out in public without smiling. Everything will bring the thought police to bear and everything will be an infraction against the greater good of the state. Resources will be scarcer and complaints will be an infraction against the greater good of the state. Moving forward will not stop.