Jesus Was A Capitalist

[norwegen]

I mean, yea, you're right.

Still, Jesus did not condemn him. And he was among the elite, as rich rulers tend to be.

Actually, Jesus did condemn Him to hell. He could not do what Jesus demanded of him, thus he was not going to be a part of the kingdom of heaven.

Can you show us where he condemned the rich ruler to hell?

He asked Jesus " “ “Teacher, what good deed must I do to have eternal life?” ...Jesus told him "go, sell what you possess and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, follow me.”

He did not do this, thus he did not have eternal life...which means he is condemn to hell.

Jesus said he was condemned to hell?

According to the bible there are two choice...eternal life in heaven or eternal death in hell. There is no other option given. This young man would did not do what was needed for the former, thus he got the latter.

Unless of course he changed over time, which we will never know.

According to the Bible, the two choices are life and death, or spirit and flesh.

 

[Harpy Eagle]

Actually, Jesus did condemn Him to hell. He could not do what Jesus demanded of him, thus he was not going to be a part of the kingdom of heaven.

Can you show us where he condemned the rich ruler to hell?

He asked Jesus " “ “Teacher, what good deed must I do to have eternal life?” ...Jesus told him "go, sell what you possess and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, follow me.”

He did not do this, thus he did not have eternal life...which means he is condemn to hell.

Jesus said he was condemned to hell?

According to the bible there are two choice...eternal life in heaven or eternal death in hell. There is no other option given. This young man would did not do what was needed for the former, thus he got the latter.

Unless of course he changed over time, which we will never know.

According to the Bible, the two choices are life and death, or spirit and flesh.

And he did not choose life...so where does that leave him?

 

[Harpy Eagle]

Jesus never disavowed the Old Testament.

The faith is Judeo-Christian….not two separate faiths.

The Old Testament laws remain in effect…as per Matthew 5:18 is the eighteenth verse of the fifth chapter of the Gospel of Matthew in the New Testament and is part of the Sermon on the Mount. Jesus has just reported that he came not to destroy the law, but fulfil it. In this verse this claim is reinforced.

Matthew 5:17–18 is a key text for interpreting the Sermon on the Mount and the entire gospel of Matthew:

Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. For truly, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the Law until all is accomplished.

Here Jesus says that not one iota (jot) or dot (tittle) will pass away from the law. These most likely refer to the smallest strokes of the Hebrew alphabet, indicating that the Old Testament is completely trustworthy, even to the smallest detail. This is consistent with Jesus’ attitude elsewhere. Never do we find Jesus disagreeing with Scripture.

Jesus is the end of that law, or its culmination (Rom 10:4). Jesus did not come to fulfill 600 or so edicts committed to animal skins. He fulfilled not Torah – not the law of sin and death – but rather the law of God. That is, to love God and to love others, for the whole law and prophets hang on these two commandments (Mt 7:12; 22:37-40; Gal 5:14). The Law is not rescinded, per se; it takes on a new holy expression of completeness in the Messiah, a higher standard of virtue arrived at not by mandate but at the pleasure of those who would uphold the Father’s commandments.

When Jesus came to fulfill the law, he annulled Torah but not the eternal law of God, not the command to love Him and others. A change in the priesthood necessitates not a new law per se, but a change in the Law (Heb 7:12), and Christ changed the priesthood, being not of the order of Aaron but of Melchizedek, who was not just a high priest but also a king. As Melchizedek was not a Levitical priest, he had no genealogy as such, i.e., no priestly lineage (Heb 7:3). He did not inherit his post; God specially appointed him to the estate, and so his priesthood would remain forever. In the same way, Jesus had no genealogy, his mother being of the tribe of Judah and his father being God. And without his own posterity to inherit the post, he reigns forever as both king and high priest with his people (2 Tm 2:12; Rv 5:10).

"... he annulled Torah..."

Clearly not what it says in Matthew.

The Law and the Prophets were until John. (Luke 16:16)

For hundreds of years, the words of Malachi, the prophet of doom, lay in limbo for the object of their indictment to emerge. At last their time came with John the Baptist, whose message of the kingdom heralded the irrelevance of the Law and the prophets.

So the Ten Commandment don't apply to the New Testament?


Really?

The Holy Spirit is the power of forgiveness and Spirit of truth (Jn 20:22-23; 14:17). He is the power of a divinely inspired ethical standard that ultimately relegated the apostasy of the Jews and the moral relativism of the pagans to the dustbin of history. He is the power of the new age. This power animated within the human psyche a thirst not for vengeance and prestige but for fraternity and charity.

Of course Christians honor their parents. They do not murder and covet and all the rest. They simply need no edict to tell them these things.

In fact, I would say that with or without Torah or the Ten Commandments, Christians would have transformed the world into its cruciform shape. The Ten Commandments are very much a part of the Christian's law, as they are now written on their hearts.

Yep...if you follow the two given by Jesus the other 8 become redundant...

“You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. 38 This is the great and first commandment. 39 And a second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself.

 

[norwegen]

Jesus is the end of that law, or its culmination (Rom 10:4). Jesus did not come to fulfill 600 or so edicts committed to animal skins. He fulfilled not Torah – not the law of sin and death – but rather the law of God. That is, to love God and to love others, for the whole law and prophets hang on these two commandments (Mt 7:12; 22:37-40; Gal 5:14). The Law is not rescinded, per se; it takes on a new holy expression of completeness in the Messiah, a higher standard of virtue arrived at not by mandate but at the pleasure of those who would uphold the Father’s commandments.

When Jesus came to fulfill the law, he annulled Torah but not the eternal law of God, not the command to love Him and others. A change in the priesthood necessitates not a new law per se, but a change in the Law (Heb 7:12), and Christ changed the priesthood, being not of the order of Aaron but of Melchizedek, who was not just a high priest but also a king. As Melchizedek was not a Levitical priest, he had no genealogy as such, i.e., no priestly lineage (Heb 7:3). He did not inherit his post; God specially appointed him to the estate, and so his priesthood would remain forever. In the same way, Jesus had no genealogy, his mother being of the tribe of Judah and his father being God. And without his own posterity to inherit the post, he reigns forever as both king and high priest with his people (2 Tm 2:12; Rv 5:10).

"... he annulled Torah..."

Clearly not what it says in Matthew.

The Law and the Prophets were until John. (Luke 16:16)

For hundreds of years, the words of Malachi, the prophet of doom, lay in limbo for the object of their indictment to emerge. At last their time came with John the Baptist, whose message of the kingdom heralded the irrelevance of the Law and the prophets.

So the Ten Commandment don't apply to the New Testament?


Really?

The Holy Spirit is the power of forgiveness and Spirit of truth (Jn 20:22-23; 14:17). He is the power of a divinely inspired ethical standard that ultimately relegated the apostasy of the Jews and the moral relativism of the pagans to the dustbin of history. He is the power of the new age. This power animated within the human psyche a thirst not for vengeance and prestige but for fraternity and charity.

Of course Christians honor their parents. They do not murder and covet and all the rest. They simply need no edict to tell them these things.

In fact, I would say that with or without Torah or the Ten Commandments, Christians would have transformed the world into its cruciform shape. The Ten Commandments are very much a part of the Christian's law, as they are now written on their hearts.

Yep...if you follow the two given by Jesus the other 8 become redundant...

“You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. 38 This is the great and first commandment. 39 And a second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself.

What other 8?

 

[Harpy Eagle]

What other 8?

“Remember to keep holy the Sabbath day.”

“Honor thy father and mother.”

“Thou shalt not kill.”

“Thou shalt not commit adultery.”

“Thou shalt not steal.”

“Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor.”

“Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s wife.”

“Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s goods.”

 

[norwegen]

What other 8?

“Remember to keep holy the Sabbath day.”

“Honor thy father and mother.”

“Thou shalt not kill.”

“Thou shalt not commit adultery.”

“Thou shalt not steal.”

“Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor.”

“Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s wife.”

“Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s goods.”

So those two commandments of Jesus replace only the first three of the ten commandments? (Only one God; no idols; no taking His name in vain)

 

[Harpy Eagle]

What other 8?

“Remember to keep holy the Sabbath day.”

“Honor thy father and mother.”

“Thou shalt not kill.”

“Thou shalt not commit adultery.”

“Thou shalt not steal.”

“Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor.”

“Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s wife.”

“Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s goods.”

So those two commandments of Jesus replace only the first three of the ten commandments? (Only one God; no idols; no taking His name in vain)

No, the 2nd one by Jesus replace number 4-10. If you love your neighbor as yourself you will not do any of those things.

And if you love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind you will not do any of the 10.

Thus, these two are all that are needed...really just the first one as it leads to the 2nd one.

 

[norwegen]

What other 8?

“Remember to keep holy the Sabbath day.”

“Honor thy father and mother.”

“Thou shalt not kill.”

“Thou shalt not commit adultery.”

“Thou shalt not steal.”

“Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor.”

“Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s wife.”

“Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s goods.”

So those two commandments of Jesus replace only the first three of the ten commandments? (Only one God; no idols; no taking His name in vain)

No, the 2nd one by Jesus replace number 4-10. If you love your neighbor as yourself you will not do any of those things.

And if you love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind you will not do any of the 10.

Thus, these two are all that are needed...really just the first one as it leads to the 2nd one.

Oh, okay.

 

[ReinyDays]

Let me clear this up for you ...

I'm already clear how confused you are ... Jesus preached a monarchy ... how does this stack up? ... viscounts sitting together sipping tea while watching their two armies annihilate each other for entertainment (and a good way to rid themselves of all their extra serfs) ... the death sentence for being one day late with rent ... farmers delivering their entire crops and then starving to death ... way to go PoliticalChic, episcopalian courts were perfect justice ...

Slavery, serfdom, or death was the way things used to be ... we're trying to move past that ... the Italians voted for the Fascists, the Germans voted for the Nazis ... you demand they shouldn't? ... then it is YOU who are totalitarian ... it is YOU who think to tell the voters of California what to do ... you don't like the liberal politics where you live?, then fucking move to Alabama ... bear all you unwanted children and let them suffer in some sorry-ass excuse of an orphanage ... then bitch about the taxes you pay to feed your abandoned children ... I understand, only the girls have to drop out of high school if they get pregnant, why should we waste tax-payer money educating girls? ... God forbid we make the boys pay child support ...

You seem a person of no power in Real Life ... you come on the internet and gain a little power and wield it like a novice ... someday you'll turn 65-years-old, and you'll be thankful for that $2,000 check every month of SOCIALIZED MONEY ... hypocrite ...

 

[PoliticalChic]

Let me clear this up for you ...

I'm already clear how confused you are ... Jesus preached a monarchy ... how does this stack up? ... viscounts sitting together sipping tea while watching their two armies annihilate each other for entertainment (and a good way to rid themselves of all their extra serfs) ... the death sentence for being one day late with rent ... farmers delivering their entire crops and then starving to death ... way to go PoliticalChic, episcopalian courts were perfect justice ...

Slavery, serfdom, or death was the way things used to be ... we're trying to move past that ... the Italians voted for the Fascists, the Germans voted for the Nazis ... you demand they shouldn't? ... then it is YOU who are totalitarian ... it is YOU who think to tell the voters of California what to do ... you don't like the liberal politics where you live?, then fucking move to Alabama ... bear all you unwanted children and let them suffer in some sorry-ass excuse of an orphanage ... then bitch about the taxes you pay to feed your abandoned children ... I understand, only the girls have to drop out of high school if they get pregnant, why should we waste tax-payer money educating girls? ... God forbid we make the boys pay child support ...

You seem a person of no power in Real Life ... you come on the internet and gain a little power and wield it like a novice ... someday you'll turn 65-years-old, and you'll be thankful for that $2,000 check every month of SOCIALIZED MONEY ... hypocrite ...

Re-post without the vulgarity and you may get a response.

 

[PoliticalChic]

' render onto caesar....'

11. “Progressives like to point out that Jesus said, "Render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and unto God the things that are God's." But that has absolutely nothing to do with high taxes or wealth redistribution.” Op.Cit.



In our day, taxation has become confiscation, and the greatest bar to wealth for the average citizen.


Unless you worship government, the question pertains as to how taxation is to be used.

“The top 1 percent of American earners pay almost 40 percent of all federal income taxes. That's more than the bottom 90 percent pay combined! The top 20 percent of Americans pay almost 90 percent of all federal income taxes. The bottom 50 percent of Americans pay just 3 percent of federal income taxes.”
This April 15, Don’t Fall for the Right’s Favorite Lie About Taxes




If you add up all of the taxes, fees, and fines that the average citizen pays, it will be in the neighborhood of half of one’s earnings. What should it be?


12. Who is to decide what is fair, and what is too much? Some religions suggest tithing, and government demands taxes.

Joseph gathered very much grain: It seems it was customary for Pharaoh to take 10% of the grain in Egypt as a tax. Essentially, Joseph doubled the taxes over the next seven years (Genesis 41:34 mentions one-fifth, that is, 20%).

That 20% figure appears again in the relationship of colonists to North America, and the English crown "....colonists were free to retain all the profits and fruits of their labor save for the crown's 20 percent share of any gold and silver discovered." "Freedom Just Around the Corner: A New American History: 1585-1828," by Walter A. McDougall, p.33



“If the Leftist is interested in a more ‘fair’ redistribution of wealth, let him vote for lower taxes, and then he can distribute his now larger share of his wealth to the lesser compensated folks.”
David Mamet


We don't have any Caesar.....just a Democrat Party that claims their office holders are not just Caesar....but god......that's what they called Hussein Obama........
...and they believe they can take as much as they want.....they've said exactly that.

 

[ReinyDays]

Re-post without the vulgarity and you may get a response.

Damn ... a handful of swear words is all it takes ... good to know ...

 

[PoliticalChic]

Re-post without the vulgarity and you may get a response.

Damn ... a handful of swear words is all it takes ... good to know ...

Time for you to grow up.....or, long past the time.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Garnering immense wealth is a sin. Rich men may very well not enter the kingdom of heaven.

Now for your remediation....


13. “Yes, Jesus spoke of the difficulty for a rich man to enter Heaven, but not because having money is evil. It's not money; rather, it is the love of money, the New Testament tells us, that leads to evil. Jesus was warning us not to put acquisition of money and material possessions above our spiritual and moral lives.” Prager U, Op. Cit.


14. Listen for the echo in Republican Coolidge’s speech about business and money: Often misquoted as ‘The business of America is business,” he really said:

“... After all, the chief business of the American people is business. They are profoundly concerned with producing, buying, selling, investing and prospering in the world. I am strongly of opinion that the great majority of people will always find these are moving impulses of our life. …

Wealth is the product of industry, ambition, character and untiring effort. In all experience, the accumulation of wealth means the multiplication of schools, the increase of knowledge, the dissemination of intelligence, the encouragement of science, the broadening of outlook, the expansion of liberties, the widening of culture.

Of course, the accumulation of wealth cannot be justified as the chief end of existence. But we are compelled to recognize it as a means to well-nigh every desirable achievement. So long as wealth is made the means and not the end, we need not greatly fear it.” January 17, 1925 Given before the American Society of Newspaper Editors

Exactly the point the Bible made.


Coolidge’s understanding of the nexus of money and religion is far more accurate than that of Bernie Sanders, or any Democrat.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Conservatives…the Founders….knew the benefits of the free market….capitalism….because they were believers, religious men.

And the proof that they were correct is that Americans are the most generous and charitable folks on earth…conservatives far more than Liberals.

"The wealthiest 1.4 percent of Americans are responsible for 86 percent of the charitable donations made at death," said the survey conducted by Public Opinion research.


15. “Jesus advises us to be of "generous spirit" – to show kindness, to assist the widow and the orphan. But He clearly means this to be our responsibility, not the government's.

Consider Jesus's Good Samaritan story. A traveler comes upon a man at the side of a road. The man had been beaten and robbed and left half-dead. What did the traveler, the Good Samaritan, do? He helps the unfortunate man on the spot, with his own resources.
Ask yourself: To help the poor, would Jesus prefer that you give your money freely to the Salvation Army, for example, or have it taxed by politicians to fund a welfare bureaucracy?”
Was Jesus a Socialist?


There are only two descriptions of the above plan of action....socialism or capitalism.
Which applies to Jesus' message?

 

[luchitociencia]

Let me clear this up for you ...

I'm already clear how confused you are ... Jesus preached a monarchy ... how does this stack up? ... viscounts sitting together sipping tea while watching their two armies annihilate each other for entertainment (and a good way to rid themselves of all their extra serfs) ... the death sentence for being one day late with rent ... farmers delivering their entire crops and then starving to death ... way to go PoliticalChic, episcopalian courts were perfect justice ...

Slavery, serfdom, or death was the way things used to be ... we're trying to move past that ... the Italians voted for the Fascists, the Germans voted for the Nazis ... you demand they shouldn't? ... then it is YOU who are totalitarian ... it is YOU who think to tell the voters of California what to do ... you don't like the liberal politics where you live?, then fucking move to Alabama ... bear all you unwanted children and let them suffer in some sorry-ass excuse of an orphanage ... then bitch about the taxes you pay to feed your abandoned children ... I understand, only the girls have to drop out of high school if they get pregnant, why should we waste tax-payer money educating girls? ... God forbid we make the boys pay child support ...

You seem a person of no power in Real Life ... you come on the internet and gain a little power and wield it like a novice ... someday you'll turn 65-years-old, and you'll be thankful for that $2,000 check every month of SOCIALIZED MONEY ... hypocrite ...

You are correct that Jesus preached a monarchy, and monarchy is what will rule when the messiah comes back.

Reading the bible one understands the time of Salomon, a king who acquired richness for "the government". When he died, the rest of the heads of the tribes came and ask Salomon's son to relief the taxes because they paid too much taxes and had no voice in the government (taxation without representation) and the answer given by the new king was adding more taxes. This is what caused the division of the kingdom of Israel into two smaller kingdoms.

The monarchies in history have been capitalists, the feudalism- which grew together with the king- decided to have their cut from power and created the Senate in Rome, centuries later the Magna Carta in England to protect the church and give judicial privileges to the barons and pay less taxes to the crown, and so forth.

Socialism is an important part in the democratic government in order to protect working populations, you just mentioned with the retirement check, plus all the social services for low income people, handicap and more.

In times of Jesus, for a survival of the widow, the orphan, the handicap, the only way was by charity from others, the kings never created programs for them. The kingdoms were to accumulate wealth to establish a dynasty, to pay the army, etc.

In modern times. only nations from Europe like the US, have a socialist system which provide benefits for the needed. If you go to South America, these kind of programs do not exist, and the rate of criminality is high, and robberies is the most common. You are washing your car, and you enter to your house to pick up the wax. you come out to the street, and somebody already took your bucket, the soap container, the rugs, if you take a while the water hose will also vanish, you have no idea how bad is for poor people to survive that stealing is the only way to make some money for food.

Then, capitalism system in the US and countries from Europe is in appearance similar to the capitalism in third world countries, but this is only an illusion. Even when, yes, there is a retirement plan like Social Security, in those countries you are fired and 35 years old, and chances to be hired again are very low. This is why in the past the population in those countries was very attracted to the socialist and communist style of government.

Take Cuba as an example, The people over there had no color TV, and neither lots of technology in their homes, but they had the best health care insurance, thousands times better than Obamacare and FREE. In the 80's people just asked to the city town center for construction materials and these were given for free so they can build their own house. A complete different system of government.

In reality the capitalist, socialist, and even communist systems can't survive alone, somehow they participate in conjunction with the main economical system of the country.

And something very interesting: Before WWII, Germany with Hitler in power, made the best economical trades with several countries of the world, were the payments made by the Germans for raw material were the most generous. Later came England and with threats of boycott against those other countries, caused the end of those economical transactions. This calls for recognition that Hitlers economical system was very good when England did their best to stop it. And this happened before the war.

The countries have adopted the different systems available to meet the worldwide economy, and if Jesus comes one day, according to the bible will be the imposition of the monarchy again. The world will become more "socialist" due to a change in the world. Right before the return of Jesus the entire world will suffer of severe catastrophes. The dollars in your pockets won't have any value.

 

[edthecynic]

Jesus never disavowed the Old Testament.

Psalms 137: 9 Happy shall he be, that taketh and dasheth thy little ones against the stones.

 

[playtime]

God does not have blonde hair nor blue eye and Jesus was not created in the image of God, Jesus is God and was not created.

you prove yourself a moron once again.

Thanks for your opinion

It is not an opinion, the Bible tells us Jesus is God and that he always existed, Jesus was not created if you believe the bible that is.

Tell that to the hundreds of thousands of churches across America that display the image of God as a white man with blue eyes and blond hair.. go away troll.. anything else?

There are no images of God.

View attachment 309631 Go to any church in America this is the image you will see. God bless you

^^^ i call bs

 

[playtime]

You reacting at the image of Jesus is racist..we forgive you

there are no images of Jesus.

the bible describes jesus as having hair 'white as wool & skin of bronze' . & chances are very low he even had blue eyes.

what passage is that?

revelation 1:14

That is talking about how Jesus will appear at the 2nd coming, not what he looked like prior to His return to Heaven. Unless of course your agreement is that eyes were as a flame of fire and his feet like unto fine brass and he walked around with 7 stars in his right hand and a sword in his mouth.

alrighty ... however he sure isn't blonde & blue eyed. nor did he have long hair.

Ha of course he was,, He was created in the image of God and how he saw a real Americans. he was created in the image of God and how he saw a real Americans

^^^ proof you are a troll. for sooooooooooo many reasons....

 

[playtime]

I guess my pastor has a much different take on the Bible as he speaks to the evils of greed found in America among other things.

He's wrong, I'm right.

Never forget that.

wow................... & here i thought you were just a run of the mill rw nutter - but now i see that you are uber cray cray. i will take that into CONsideration from now on whenever we cross paths on this here little piece of the interwebs.