Just another tick down on unemployment, ho hum

[danielpalos]

lol. only the right wing would claim, fossil fuels are, "self sustaining".

Only a tiny fraction of the worlds fossil fuel's have been found, and only a tiny fraction of those have been used… Fact
Shale oil has hardly even been touched…

it still won't last forever, and it is dirtier and will be more expensive than fusion (an energy with a future).

But they're available now and we have not even touched the potential, and they are only going to get cleaner. Reliable affordable Renewable energy which I have no problem with is still decades away...

it will still be getting more expensive to reclaim. And, we are making progress with energy efficiency. We simply need better energy infrastructure with improved capacitance.

Slant drilling for oil has made resources that were thought to be unattainable, attainable recently. And new technology to deal with Shale oil is a lot cheaper than ever thought to be.
That's why I say an all of the above strategy is the best...
And Coal is extremely easy to mine in the northern plains… and Fracking is like second nature on how easy it is...

how are the social costs, coming along?

 

[JonKoch]

4.3% - lowest rates since 2001 - pre 9/11

I love it when a Republican President revs up the economy

New jobs were only up 138K

U.S. Adds 138,000 Jobs In May And Unemployment Rate Drops To 4.3%

The problem is people not in the workforce. The same problem Obama had I might add.

View attachment 130558

Bureau of Labor Statistics Data

Yay the unemployment rate is down a tick. It is offset by the higher numbers of people who aren't counted. They just don't count. They didn't count under Obama and they still aren't counted.

We need to start getting those folks opportunities. We need to get them counted again.

MAY 2012

Demographics have always played a big role in the rise and fall of the labor force. Between 1960 and 2000, the labor force in the United States surged from 59 percent to a peak of 67.3 percent. That was largely due to the fact that more women were entering the labor force while improvements in health and information technology allowed Americans to work more years.

But since 2000, the labor force rate has been steadily declining as the baby-boom generation has been retiring. Because of this, the Federal Reserve Bank of Chicago expects the labor force participation rate to be lower in 2020 than it is today, regardless of how well the economy does.

In a March report titled "Dispelling an Urban Legend," Dean Maki, an economist at Barclays Capital, found that demographics accounted for a majority of the drop in the participation rate since 2002

WAPO

The incredible shrinking labor force

 

[JonKoch]

But that was from 2013. And even then they were talking about their worst errors being around 57,000 jobs, a far cry from the 100,000 the last 2 months. And they were becoming more accurate, as time goes on, according to the article, an NBC contributor.

You know what I find odd is adp reported an additional 100,000 the last 2 months above the official report. They have been known to be a little different from the official in the past, but that is more than a little. Some states under reporting, maybe?

4.3% - lowest rates since 2001 - pre 9/11

I love it when a Republican President revs up the economy

New jobs were only up 138K

U.S. Adds 138,000 Jobs In May And Unemployment Rate Drops To 4.3%

ADP has almost always over reported


"With official jobs data seen as a key economic metric, no wonder other agencies second-guess them. But 'guess' is about right"

How good is ADP at forecasting the monthly BLS jobs reports? | Harry J Enten

Yes, they changed methods, they got better, BUT the last 2 months might be trending back to their past "guessing". BLS looks about 3 months back to "correct" the original numbers, both up and down

Again, the hiring trend is a 83 straight month correction after 8 years of Dubya/GOP "job creator" policies lost 600,000+ jobs in 8 years

 

[JonKoch]

Trump has created some part time burger flipping jobs

Nothing to celebrate

Coal mining up 17-19 percent... six-figure incomes

Yes, mines are beginning to open up, including a new one in Pennsylvania. But that doesn't reverse the overall decline of the coal mining industry from its glory days.

The coal mines that are opening up produce a special kind of coal used in steelmaking and are opening largely because of events unrelated to federal policy, experts say. The market for the kind of coal used in electricity — the biggest use for coal — remains down relative to where it was several years ago.
FACT CHECK: Is President Trump Correct That Coal Mines Are Opening?

The U.S. now has about 51,000 coal mining jobs, a far cry from the 89,400 positions counted by the Bureau of Labor Statistics at the end of 2011.

400 coal mining jobs created in May

Trump has promised to revive the coal industry, but his economic advisor says that doesn't make much sense

• Trump advisor Gary Cohn said natural gas is "such a cleaner fuel" than coal.

The president's chief economic advisor is casting doubt on the future of U.S. coal, saying it "doesn't really make that much sense anymore as a feedstock," directly contradicting President Donald Trump's repeated promises to revive the struggling coal industry.

Unlike his boss, Trump economic advisor Cohn isn't a fan of coal

National Salary Data

A Coal Mine Worker earns an average wage of $23.04 per hour.

Coal Mine Worker Salary



The World’s Deadliest Profession: Coal Miners (#7)

 

[JonKoch]

Trump has created some part time burger flipping jobs

Nothing to celebrate

Coal mining up 17-19 percent... six-figure incomes

I may be able to establish a petty cash fund for canary options, in the near future.

14,000 Idle Wind Turbines a Testament to Failed Energy Policies

Most of the wind turbines built in North and South Dakota over the last few years have been sitting idol or have been torn down due to inefficiency…

Clean energy employs "more than half a million Californians. That’s nearly ten times more the number of coal mining jobs that exist in the entire nation."
Claim: CA has more clean energy jobs than nation's coal jobs

Solar Employs More People In U.S. Electricity Generation Than Oil, Coal And Gas Combined

Solar Employs More People In U.S. Electricity Generation Than Oil, Coal And Gas Combined

 

[Rustic]

Only a tiny fraction of the worlds fossil fuel's have been found, and only a tiny fraction of those have been used… Fact
Shale oil has hardly even been touched…

it still won't last forever, and it is dirtier and will be more expensive than fusion (an energy with a future).

But they're available now and we have not even touched the potential, and they are only going to get cleaner. Reliable affordable Renewable energy which I have no problem with is still decades away...

it will still be getting more expensive to reclaim. And, we are making progress with energy efficiency. We simply need better energy infrastructure with improved capacitance.

Slant drilling for oil has made resources that were thought to be unattainable, attainable recently. And new technology to deal with Shale oil is a lot cheaper than ever thought to be.
That's why I say an all of the above strategy is the best...
And Coal is extremely easy to mine in the northern plains… and Fracking is like second nature on how easy it is...

how are the social costs, coming along?

Socialism always brings the worst out of people… Fact

 

[Rustic]

Trump has created some part time burger flipping jobs

Nothing to celebrate

Coal mining up 17-19 percent... six-figure incomes

Yes, mines are beginning to open up, including a new one in Pennsylvania. But that doesn't reverse the overall decline of the coal mining industry from its glory days.

The coal mines that are opening up produce a special kind of coal used in steelmaking and are opening largely because of events unrelated to federal policy, experts say. The market for the kind of coal used in electricity — the biggest use for coal — remains down relative to where it was several years ago.
FACT CHECK: Is President Trump Correct That Coal Mines Are Opening?

The U.S. now has about 51,000 coal mining jobs, a far cry from the 89,400 positions counted by the Bureau of Labor Statistics at the end of 2011.

400 coal mining jobs created in May

Trump has promised to revive the coal industry, but his economic advisor says that doesn't make much sense

• Trump advisor Gary Cohn said natural gas is "such a cleaner fuel" than coal.

The president's chief economic advisor is casting doubt on the future of U.S. coal, saying it "doesn't really make that much sense anymore as a feedstock," directly contradicting President Donald Trump's repeated promises to revive the struggling coal industry.

Unlike his boss, Trump economic advisor Cohn isn't a fan of coal

National Salary Data

A Coal Mine Worker earns an average wage of $23.04 per hour.

Coal Mine Worker Salary



The World’s Deadliest Profession: Coal Miners (#7)

First of all most of the coal mining in the country is done open pit style in the northern plains, it poses nearly no danger to the workers.
Without fossil fuels the northern plains would be a waste land… Fact

 

[Rustic]

Trump has created some part time burger flipping jobs

Nothing to celebrate

Coal mining up 17-19 percent... six-figure incomes

I may be able to establish a petty cash fund for canary options, in the near future.

14,000 Idle Wind Turbines a Testament to Failed Energy Policies

Most of the wind turbines built in North and South Dakota over the last few years have been sitting idol or have been torn down due to inefficiency…

Clean energy employs "more than half a million Californians. That’s nearly ten times more the number of coal mining jobs that exist in the entire nation."
Claim: CA has more clean energy jobs than nation's coal jobs

Solar Employs More People In U.S. Electricity Generation Than Oil, Coal And Gas Combined

Solar Employs More People In U.S. Electricity Generation Than Oil, Coal And Gas Combined

In the northern plains here the electric grid is run by coal fired power plants, a short distance from where the coal is mined.
Like I said I have no problem with renewable energy, but reliable affordable renewable energy is decades away. We have nothing to lose by exploiting fossil fuel's here in the northern plains

 

[Rustic]

Only a tiny fraction of the worlds fossil fuel's have been found, and only a tiny fraction of those have been used… Fact
Shale oil has hardly even been touched…

it still won't last forever, and it is dirtier and will be more expensive than fusion (an energy with a future).

But they're available now and we have not even touched the potential, and they are only going to get cleaner. Reliable affordable Renewable energy which I have no problem with is still decades away...

it will still be getting more expensive to reclaim. And, we are making progress with energy efficiency. We simply need better energy infrastructure with improved capacitance.

Slant drilling for oil has made resources that were thought to be unattainable, attainable recently. And new technology to deal with Shale oil is a lot cheaper than ever thought to be.
That's why I say an all of the above strategy is the best...
And Coal is extremely easy to mine in the northern plains… and Fracking is like second nature on how easy it is...

how are the social costs, coming along?

Socialism is much like meth to the Indian nations, it's an addiction once it gets it's poison into the population it's all but impossible to get rid of, and it very well may be impossible.
Getting free shit from other people paying For it has a cumulative affect... it's called laziness

 

[JonKoch]

how many of those are retired, children, physically or mentally unable to work, or just don't want to work?
figures don't lie, but liars figure.

Nope, during Obama we were told they all dropped out of the workforce because they were discouraged.

"We have 93 million people out of work. They look for jobs, they give up, and all of a sudden, statistically, they're considered employed."

- Donald J Trump Aug. 28, 2015, On Point With Sarah Palin

geez, grow up. the 93 million number does not include retired, children, sick, and lazy.

the real numbers, used by both obozo and Trump have the current rate at about 4.5%. You were happy with that calculation under Obama, but now it isn't correct? I get it, you are a disingenuous partisan hack.

The Cheeto

Nov 4, 2016

"Over 14 million have left the workforce since Obama came into office, bringing the total not working to 94 million."

Donald Trump called Friday's jobs report "terrible" and a "disaster," even though unemployment fell and job gains were solid. (this was when in october we added 161,000 jobs cupcake)

Trump's big jobs claim explained in 250 words

 

[JonKoch]

Trump has created some part time burger flipping jobs

Nothing to celebrate

Coal mining up 17-19 percent... six-figure incomes

I may be able to establish a petty cash fund for canary options, in the near future.

14,000 Idle Wind Turbines a Testament to Failed Energy Policies

Most of the wind turbines built in North and South Dakota over the last few years have been sitting idol or have been torn down due to inefficiency…

Clean energy employs "more than half a million Californians. That’s nearly ten times more the number of coal mining jobs that exist in the entire nation."
Claim: CA has more clean energy jobs than nation's coal jobs

Solar Employs More People In U.S. Electricity Generation Than Oil, Coal And Gas Combined

Solar Employs More People In U.S. Electricity Generation Than Oil, Coal And Gas Combined

In the northern plains here the electric grid is run by coal fired power plants, a short distance from where the coal is mined.
Like I said I have no problem with renewable energy, but reliable affordable renewable energy is decades away. We have nothing to lose by exploiting fossil fuel's here in the northern plains

Wyoming Bill Would All But Outlaw Clean Energy by Preventing Utilities From Using It
Wyoming bill would all but outlaw clean energy, by forbidding utilities from using it


Wind energy makes up nearly 10% of all Wyoming electricity
Wind energy makes up nearly 10% of all Wyoming electricity

 

[Rustic]

Trump has created some part time burger flipping jobs

Nothing to celebrate

Coal mining up 17-19 percent... six-figure incomes

I may be able to establish a petty cash fund for canary options, in the near future.

14,000 Idle Wind Turbines a Testament to Failed Energy Policies

Most of the wind turbines built in North and South Dakota over the last few years have been sitting idol or have been torn down due to inefficiency…

Clean energy employs "more than half a million Californians. That’s nearly ten times more the number of coal mining jobs that exist in the entire nation."
Claim: CA has more clean energy jobs than nation's coal jobs

Solar Employs More People In U.S. Electricity Generation Than Oil, Coal And Gas Combined

Solar Employs More People In U.S. Electricity Generation Than Oil, Coal And Gas Combined

GUNDERSON: Some basic facts about wind energy

 

[JonKoch]

sink more costs, baby, sink more costs into fossil fuels; i am hoping to establish a petty cash fund, to learn how to short-sell.

An all of the above strategy is best... we have nothing to lose up here by exploiting fossil fuels. All of our power for our grid in the northern plains comes from coal fired power plants. It's here so we might as well use it. Plus it pays damn good to work in the fossil fuel industry. And guess what? Roughnecks/coal miners Buy lots of firearms and ammo....

the opportunity cost is a Manhattan Project for fusion (an energy with a future).

Up here we prefer to be self-sustaining for power needs… lol

with fossil fuels? lol.

Bingo!

I would call this self sustaining energy… LOL

And you'd be considered an idiot

 

[JonKoch]

Trump has created some part time burger flipping jobs

Nothing to celebrate

Coal mining up 17-19 percent... six-figure incomes

I may be able to establish a petty cash fund for canary options, in the near future.

14,000 Idle Wind Turbines a Testament to Failed Energy Policies

Most of the wind turbines built in North and South Dakota over the last few years have been sitting idol or have been torn down due to inefficiency…

Clean energy employs "more than half a million Californians. That’s nearly ten times more the number of coal mining jobs that exist in the entire nation."
Claim: CA has more clean energy jobs than nation's coal jobs

Solar Employs More People In U.S. Electricity Generation Than Oil, Coal And Gas Combined

Solar Employs More People In U.S. Electricity Generation Than Oil, Coal And Gas Combined

GUNDERSON: Some basic facts about wind energy

Opinion? lol


Today, more than 100 countries worldwide have developed commercial wind farms. The wind sector provides around 3.5% of the world's generation capacity

• Wind provides roughly 30% of generation capacity in Denmark.
• Wind provides over 45% of generation capacity in four major German states and roughly 11% nationally.
• Wind generation capacity in some provinces in Spain reaches close to 100%.
• In South Australia wind has provided more than 46% of total generation
• 
  
• Wind Energy's International Success
  
• .

 

[Rustic]

Coal mining up 17-19 percent... six-figure incomes

I may be able to establish a petty cash fund for canary options, in the near future.

14,000 Idle Wind Turbines a Testament to Failed Energy Policies

Most of the wind turbines built in North and South Dakota over the last few years have been sitting idol or have been torn down due to inefficiency…

Clean energy employs "more than half a million Californians. That’s nearly ten times more the number of coal mining jobs that exist in the entire nation."
Claim: CA has more clean energy jobs than nation's coal jobs

Solar Employs More People In U.S. Electricity Generation Than Oil, Coal And Gas Combined

Solar Employs More People In U.S. Electricity Generation Than Oil, Coal And Gas Combined

In the northern plains here the electric grid is run by coal fired power plants, a short distance from where the coal is mined.
Like I said I have no problem with renewable energy, but reliable affordable renewable energy is decades away. We have nothing to lose by exploiting fossil fuel's here in the northern plains

Wyoming Bill Would All But Outlaw Clean Energy by Preventing Utilities From Using It
Wyoming bill would all but outlaw clean energy, by forbidding utilities from using it


Wind energy makes up nearly 10% of all Wyoming electricity
Wind energy makes up nearly 10% of all Wyoming electricity

Like I said I'm all for an all of the above strategy, most of the wind turbines in the northern plains have been abandoned or just don't work or lost all of their efficiency.
Anyway, the northern plains are not an ideal place for wind energy, solar is far ahead of wind As being a viable energy source.

We have not even touched the tip of the iceberg of the available fossil fuel's under the northern plains...

 

[leftwinger]

A lot of older workers (55-62) were removed from workforce since 2009. Maybe one member of household is still working? They downsized? Homeless? Live in a car? I see it out there.

I don't know how those are counted into discouraged worker bucket?

No one answered as being part of this "household unemployment" on-going survey? I suppose the numbers are as close as BLS can get. I know a few "discouraged" workers. No one has ever surveyed any of them. Most of them let go in 2009. They are trying to hang on to SS at age 62. Others have sold homes and moved on to cheaper (those who could move easily).

 

[Rustic]

Coal mining up 17-19 percent... six-figure incomes

I may be able to establish a petty cash fund for canary options, in the near future.

14,000 Idle Wind Turbines a Testament to Failed Energy Policies

Most of the wind turbines built in North and South Dakota over the last few years have been sitting idol or have been torn down due to inefficiency…

Clean energy employs "more than half a million Californians. That’s nearly ten times more the number of coal mining jobs that exist in the entire nation."
Claim: CA has more clean energy jobs than nation's coal jobs

Solar Employs More People In U.S. Electricity Generation Than Oil, Coal And Gas Combined

Solar Employs More People In U.S. Electricity Generation Than Oil, Coal And Gas Combined

GUNDERSON: Some basic facts about wind energy

Opinion? lol


Today, more than 100 countries worldwide have developed commercial wind farms. The wind sector provides around 3.5% of the world's generation capacity

• Wind provides roughly 30% of generation capacity in Denmark.
• Wind provides over 45% of generation capacity in four major German states and roughly 11% nationally.
• Wind generation capacity in some provinces in Spain reaches close to 100%.
• In South Australia wind has provided more than 46% of total generation
• 
  
• Wind Energy's International Success
  
• .

Like I said I have no problem with renewable energy, but reliable affordable renewable energy is decades away. Why not use what we know works? We have nothing to lose by Exploiting fossil fuels up here in the northern plains.
Fossil fuels is the only thing the northern plains have to offer anyways…

 

[JonKoch]

Nope, during Obama we were told they all dropped out of the workforce because they were discouraged.

"We have 93 million people out of work. They look for jobs, they give up, and all of a sudden, statistically, they're considered employed."

- Donald J Trump Aug. 28, 2015, On Point With Sarah Palin

geez, grow up. the 93 million number does not include retired, children, sick, and lazy.

the real numbers, used by both obozo and Trump have the current rate at about 4.5%. You were happy with that calculation under Obama, but now it isn't correct? I get it, you are a disingenuous partisan hack.

The 4.5 percent number is a hoax perpetrated by the department of labor
Even Trump will tell you that

The REAL unemployment rate is 53 percent

unemployed people are people who are looking for work but cannot find any. retired people are not unemployed, neither are children, the sick, or the perpetually lazy.

You are making a fool of yourself on this thread, but you are very good at that.

Not according to our President

He has taught us not to trust the BLS statistics because they are doctored. Trump has indicated that he prefers we use the raw employment numbers to evaluate the economy

In this case, Trumps numbers are 170 million unemployed or 53%

A disgrace, a national disgrace......believe me

the national disgrace was 8 years of incompetence and lying under Obama.

 

[pinqy]

OK. Tell me how anyone knows whether or not this guy is looking for work? For 52 weeks or more the UI have washed their hands of him. No more bi-weekly payments. No more tracking. No bi-weekly forms to submit, nothing. They don't contact him and He CANNOT contact them. No internet forms to fill out. He is simply living with no income. There were millions of these, out of work in 2009..........found no new work.......ran out of benefits........fall off the books.

Completely irrelevant to the UE rate.

Please don't tell me about some GOVT phone sample to generate this Unemployment figure. It is nonsense. Personally, I have not answered the landline since 1999 unless I know who it is or expecting a call. Hillary was supposed to get 400 EV also based on landline polls.

The Census Bureau divides each state into Primary Sample Units (roughly county size). These sample units are sorted into strata where all the PSUs in the strata are similar. Many strata only have one PSU in them. One PSU is randomly selected from each stratum, and then more random selection until there's a list of around 70,000 addresses. Some addresses are just wrong (it's now a business or a parking lot, or no one lives there, and some people refuse to participate etc.) But there are about 60,000 usable households each month

Once an address is selected, a Census agent personally visits the house (letters are sent first to warn and explain) and conducts the interview. Once selected, an address is in the survey for 4 months, out for 8 months, and back in for 4 months and then out for good. After the initial interview, the rest of the time can be done over the phone if the household prefers. When the household comes back into the survey after its 8 months out, the first new interview is also a personal visit.

So no, it's not a landline poll, it's not random digit dialing, it's a very carefully scientifically designed survey.

Is there ANY PERSON reading this that has ever been on this tracking list? I worked many years. Never knew one person who had any letter, interview, visits? over months. Sounds really good. Hard to believe it is true or they actually do as they say? Put me in the skeptical column.

Technical Documentation (CPS)
Www.census.gov/cps
So all that documentation and details and hundreds of people at census and bls, but you think it's more likely they just make up the numbers?

Note: I once did an internet search and they claimed it was Phone survey of 1000 (qty?) households. I did this since I had been on USMB, so recently. I am not doing it again.

then you misread or misunderstood.

 

[Rustic]

geez, grow up. the 93 million number does not include retired, children, sick, and lazy.

the real numbers, used by both obozo and Trump have the current rate at about 4.5%. You were happy with that calculation under Obama, but now it isn't correct? I get it, you are a disingenuous partisan hack.

The 4.5 percent number is a hoax perpetrated by the department of labor
Even Trump will tell you that

The REAL unemployment rate is 53 percent

unemployed people are people who are looking for work but cannot find any. retired people are not unemployed, neither are children, the sick, or the perpetually lazy.

You are making a fool of yourself on this thread, but you are very good at that.

Not according to our President

He has taught us not to trust the BLS statistics because they are doctored. Trump has indicated that he prefers we use the raw employment numbers to evaluate the economy

In this case, Trumps numbers are 170 million unemployed or 53%

A disgrace, a national disgrace......believe me

the national disgrace was 8 years of incompetence and lying under Obama.

Obama's policies only hurt "red state" areas. Renewable energy sources do not translate in red state areas