Minimal Facts Approach Proves Jesus is God

[Parture]

Almost all scholars who do their peer review journal or accredited work on the resurrection of Jesus, whether they are believers or not, concede some facts can be gleaned from the Scriptures. One of those irrefutable facts is that Paul definitely wrote 1 Cor. 15, Gal. 1 & 2. In these 3 chapters he does the follow:

• said he spent 15 days with Peter, and also time with John and James and they had nothing to add unto him about what he knew of Jesus;
• he recounts the gospel message that Jesus died for us and rose from the dead to save us;
• various appearances of Jesus resurrected are given by the Apostles;
• Paul gives his own eyewitness account of seeing Jesus alive from the dead with others present with him;
• unless one accepts Christ for salvation to be redeemed and receive eternal life, you are going to Hell.

Since nobody is able these past 2000 years found a naturalistic explanation to account for the eyewitness testimony of the Apostles in various group settings, we know Jesus is God, salvation is through Him alone, and nothing exists that exists without Him having created it. For example, group hallucinations are impossible, people don't willingly die for what they know is a lie, and swoon theory would not convince anyone Jesus was the risen Messiah all tattered and torn, scourged down to the bone, and holes in his hands and feet unable to walk.

Jesus wants to save you but will not force His love on you, so He gives you the free choice and wants to be with those who love Him. Nobody knows all the wonderful things God had planed for those who love Him. He returns not for the unregenerate but for the sake of the elect. This world would be destroyed if Jesus does not return. And He returns long before there would be massive radiation fallout on the planet, because He wants a planet where His overcomers reign over the nations (Jude 14,15; Rev. 2.26,27; 20.4-6) on a healthy planet.

Praise the Lord! Amen.

12 Historical Facts - Gary Habermas

 

[hobelim]

Since nobody is able these past 2000 years found a naturalistic explanation to account for the eyewitness testimony of the Apostles in various group settings, we know Jesus is God, salvation is through Him alone, and nothing exists that exists without Him having created it. For example, group hallucinations are impossible, people don't willingly die for what they know is a lie, and swoon theory would not convince anyone Jesus was the risen Messiah all tattered and torn, scourged down to the bone, and holes in his hands and feet unable to walk.

If someone gave you a sound naturalistic explanation that has never been heard before would account for every miracle according to the eyewitness testimony of the Apostles that conforms to reality and proves that Jesus was just a man, would you accept it?

Yes, no, maybe?

Pick a miracle, any miracle, and I will show you what really happened.

then you can decide.......

 

[Luddly Neddite]

According to the Bible Jesus was born in Bethlehem in Palestine.

A country where people are called Mohammed, Abdul, Mounir, Aziz, Ahmed, Farid, Omar, Youssouf, Mouloud, etc.

He managed to find 12 friends called John, Peter, Paul, Phillip, Mark, Thomas, Luke, Mathew, Andrew and Simon ...

-----Who all drank wine............


That's what I call a miracle!

 

[Parture]

If someone gave you a sound naturalistic explanation that has never been heard before would account for every miracle according to the eyewitness testimony of the Apostles that conforms to reality and proves that Jesus was just a man, would you accept it?

Yes, no, maybe?

Pick a miracle, any miracle, and I will show you what really happened.

then you can decide.......

Yes of course. Christians are evidentialists. My response is the same response Paul gave in 1 Cor. 15.

Would you give your life to Christ if your attempt at a naturalistic explanation fails? It goes both ways.

You would need to find a viable naturalistic explanation to account for the eyewitness testimony of the Apostles.

 

[Parture]

According to the Bible Jesus was born in Bethlehem in Palestine.

A country where people are called Mohammed, Abdul, Mounir, Aziz, Ahmed, Farid, Omar, Youssouf, Mouloud, etc.

He managed to find 12 friends called John, Peter, Paul, Phillip, Mark, Thomas, Luke, Mathew, Andrew and Simon ...

-----Who all drank wine............


That's what I call a miracle!

People were not called that in Bethlehem. You're confused. Nice try but you just made yourself look more stupid than you already are.

 

[hobelim]

If someone gave you a sound naturalistic explanation that has never been heard before would account for every miracle according to the eyewitness testimony of the Apostles that conforms to reality and proves that Jesus was just a man, would you accept it?

Yes, no, maybe?

Pick a miracle, any miracle, and I will show you what really happened.

then you can decide.......

Yes of course. Christians are evidentialists. My response is the same response Paul gave in 1 Cor. 15.

Would you give your life to Christ if your attempt at a naturalistic explanation fails? It goes both ways.

You would need to find a viable naturalistic explanation to account for the eyewitness testimony of the Apostles.

Yes, it goes both ways. Good point.

But I don't need to find what I already have.

Pick a miracle, any miracle, and I will show you what really happened.

 

[Parture]

Yes, it goes both ways. Good point.

But I don't need to find what I already have.

Pick a miracle, any miracle, and I will show you what really happened.

I don't need to find eternal life because it was already given to me (John 3.17).

I already gave you a miracle - the resurrection of Jesus proving He is God.

What you have already is what you inherited from the fall of Adam, you sin nature, which eternally separates you from God unless you receive Christ. God can have no fellowship with a sinner.

 

[Vandalshandle]

I've been going through my Bible, but I can't find the radiation part.......

 

[hobelim]

I already gave you a miracle - the resurrection of Jesus proving He is God.

With only one fact as a constraint on the subject, can't get more minimal than that, - everything recorded by the Apostles supposedly happened on earth - one can easily dismiss any interpretation that contradicts reality as we know it and cannot be the truth which always leaves just one possible rational explanation.

In this instance the only possible truth that conforms to reality is that every single eyewitness account of Jesus being seen and heard after the crucifixion was the eyewitness account of what was seen and heard in a dream.

To the Apostles who were raised to believe that God communicates to men through dreams and visions, seeing Jesus in a dream after he was killed would have convinced them that Jesus survived physical death and was in the realm of God. It did not convince them that he was God . You might believe that but that's just plain silly. There never was a time when a human being was God or became God either before during or after their human existence and dead people do not spook their friends by wearing disguises, eating fish, and popping in and out of reality on earth after they are killed. Seeing and speaking with Jesus in dreams gave them all the proof they needed that Jesus who told them he was returning to God was in the eternal realm of God, and received the promised reward for the righteous.

Believing that they too would have a place in the realm of God if they maintained allegiance to what Jesus taught them until the end is what gave them the faith to endure their own imminent suffering and death..

simple. No suspension of disbelief required.

What you have already is what you inherited from the fall of Adam, you sin nature, which eternally separates you from God unless you receive Christ. God can have no fellowship with a sinner.

Ugh...

Let me give you some advice. The less sanctimonious you are the less embarrassed you will be..

 

[Parture]

I've been going through my Bible, but I can't find the radiation part.......

[Rev 8:7, 9-11 KJV] 7 The first angel sounded, and there followed hail and fire mingled with blood, and they were cast upon the earth: and the third part of trees was burnt up, and all green grass was burnt up. ... 9 And the third part of the creatures which were in the sea, and had life, died; and the third part of the ships were destroyed. 10 And the third angel sounded, and there fell a great star from heaven, burning as it were a lamp, and it fell upon the third part of the rivers, and upon the fountains of waters; 11 And the name of the star is called Wormwood: and the third part of the waters became wormwood; and many men died of the waters, because they were made bitter.

[Rev 17:16 KJV] 16 And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast, these shall hate the whore, and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire.

The whore, of course with her purple tassels, is the Roman Catholic Church that makes drunk the nations with the wine of the wrath of her fornications so Rev. 17.16 says a nuclear bomb will blow up the Vatican.

Basically in the first half of the 7 year Tribulation religious Rome will be destroyed according to Revelation 17. Then in the 2nd half of the 7 year Tribulation political Rome will be destroyed, that being, of course, the European Union that is centered on that 7 hilled city. The European Union is the Revived Roman Empire. It has more GDP than USA.

Enjoy.

 

[Vandalshandle]

"Rev. 17.16 says a nuclear bomb will blow up the Vatican."

I think that you have a different version of the Bible than I have.....

 

[Parture]

eyewitness account of what was seen and heard in a dream. There never was a time when a human being was God or became God either before during or after their human existence.

Dreams don't fit the profile because group dreams are impossible just as group hallucinations are impossible according to the DM-5 Psychology Manual.

Your argument against Jesus being God is that God can never be a man, but that is obviously just your opinion and would contradiction His resurrection as only God can resurrect Himself. Since God created the universe, He can manifest Himself as fully God and fully man in the likeness of flesh. Jesus was the fullness of the Godhead bodily.

You wouldn't want the ransom to be paid by anyone other than God because only God is sinless.

As for 2nd generation Apostles who personally knew John, Paul, Peter, such as Polycarp and Clement of Rome, they were imparted the eyewitness testimony of the original eyewitness Apostles seeing Jesus alive from the dead in various group settings. Just as Paul spent time with Peter, James and John who imparted their eyewitness testimony to Paul. And thus, the first churches were setup on the resurrection appearances.

So all your points fail. Now you can give your life to Christ if you are sincere and genuine.

 

[Parture]

"Rev. 17.16 says a nuclear bomb will blow up the Vatican."

I think that you have a different version of the Bible than I have.....

All Bible versions have Rev. 17.16 saying a nuclear bomb will blow up the Vatican as this is the only description that fits that will burn up that 7 hilled city which currently sits today at nearly 3 million people.

 

[Vandalshandle]

"Rev. 17.16 says a nuclear bomb will blow up the Vatican."

I think that you have a different version of the Bible than I have.....

All Bible versions have Rev. 17.16 saying a nuclear bomb will blow up the Vatican as this is the only description that fits.

This is going to be a pretty damned big shock to the Pope!

 

[Parture]

This is going to be a pretty damned big shock to the Pope!

He will likely be killed in the explosion. The Pope is not a Christian.

 

[Luddly Neddite]

According to the Bible Jesus was born in Bethlehem in Palestine.

A country where people are called Mohammed, Abdul, Mounir, Aziz, Ahmed, Farid, Omar, Youssouf, Mouloud, etc.

He managed to find 12 friends called John, Peter, Paul, Phillip, Mark, Thomas, Luke, Mathew, Andrew and Simon ...

-----Who all drank wine............


That's what I call a miracle!

People were not called that in Bethlehem. You're confused. Nice try but you just made yourself look more stupid than you already are.

List of biblical names - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

List of major biblical figures - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

Could you point out the verse where your god told you to call people "stupid" and its an acceptable form of proselytizing?

Thanks.

 

[Luddly Neddite]

"Rev. 17.16 says a nuclear bomb will blow up the Vatican."

I think that you have a different version of the Bible than I have.....

Not only did I not know they had nukes in those days, I didn't even know the Vatican existed back then.

I think we should take immediate action to save the art work.

 

[Luddly Neddite]

This is going to be a pretty damned big shock to the Pope!

He will likely be killed in the explosion. The Pope is not a Christian.

You're not a christian so why do you care?

 

[Parture]

According to the Bible Jesus was born in Bethlehem in Palestine.

A country where people are called Mohammed, Abdul, Mounir, Aziz, Ahmed, Farid, Omar, Youssouf, Mouloud, etc.

He managed to find 12 friends called John, Peter, Paul, Phillip, Mark, Thomas, Luke, Mathew, Andrew and Simon ...

-----Who all drank wine............


That's what I call a miracle!

People were not called that in Bethlehem. You're confused. Nice try but you just made yourself look more stupid than you already are.

List of biblical names - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

List of major biblical figures - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

Could you point out the verse where your god told you to call people "stupid" and its an acceptable form of proselytizing?

Thanks.

There are comparable terms in the Bible identify someone as stupid such as yourself.

 

[Parture]

"Rev. 17.16 says a nuclear bomb will blow up the Vatican."

I think that you have a different version of the Bible than I have.....

Not only did I not know they had nukes in those days, I didn't even know the Vatican existed back then.

I think we should take immediate action to save the art work.

They didn't have nukes in those days, that's the point. You have the same version, you just misread it.

Revelation is the future. Just like the Thyatira church period (Rev. 3) was in the future representing the earl Roman Catholic system before it warped itself into the great harlot in Rev. 17.