MW advocates - what are the downsides of minimum wage?

[Lesh]

Bottom line...conservatives do NOT want wages to increase...and that's what is happening.

That is also why we need a minimum wage increase.

It puts upward pressure on wages in general.It would finally force employers to increase wages . In case you haven't noticed...in spite of the economy doing really well and unemployment being really low...wages have NOT increased more than pennies

 

[hadit]

Knowing that you could make almost as much with less effort, however, makes a difference. Many put effort into a career so they can make more. Why would they continue to do so when they know anyone walking in off the street doing any low demand job can earn almost as much?

Your saying that if you’re a type A personality who is up at the crack of dawn, going to work every day, getting ahead…doing all the right things, saying all the right things, contributing big time …. that this type of person will be so offended by someone else making almost as much that they will say, “fuck it” and start shopping for shoes at work on the free internet? I disagree.

If what you said was true, the companies that pay the least would have zero employees because the companies that pay more would be scooping them all up since, from what I’m reading about your posts, people are supposedly hyper sensitive to what is being paid to others. Again. I disagree.

There's a big difference between working extra, getting extra training, and maintaining a certification to earn twice MW and doing all that to just make a dollar or two more. You don't see that?

Each dollar per hour is $2,000 extra dollars per year full time.

So $2.00 more per hour is $4,000 extra dollars per year.

Yes.

Would you honestly do all that just to make a dollar an hour more than MW?

Yes.

Today's situation isn't a guarantee of tomorrow's predicament. If you have the key to open the door to jobs higher up the food chain, you can walk through it. If you don't have that key...well, enjoy your stagnation.

And if you're a poor, badly educated kid who's never learned or had the inclination to think beyond next week, much less next decade?

Sure, smart people will invest in their future, but not everyone has been taught how to do that or why it's important.

Not sure what your point is. Earlier you were defending the Type A go-getter now you seem to be worried about those who are not the Type A go-getter.

To answer you question, we've always had poor, badly eduacated kids who never learned or had the inclination (or learned later in life like I did); a raise in the minimum wage would be good for them, don't you think? It would also be good for our economy since A) ours is a service/consumer economy and B) there will be more money flowing into those areas if there is more disposable income for the consumers.

And if you do it slow enough and keep it low enough that the market can adjust, the problems can be kept to a minimum. What I'm hearing, though, is that so many think we can increase it by 50-100% almost overnight with no negative effects. They don't seem to account for the ripple effect.

 

[rightwinger]

Bottom line...conservatives do NOT want wages to increase...and that's what is happening.

That is also why we need a minimum wage increase.

It puts upward pressure on wages in general.It would finally force employers to increase wages . In case you haven't noticed...in spite of the economy doing really well and unemployment being really low...wages have NOT increased more than pennies

Conservatives want low cost labor as they cut taxes on employers

 

[hadit]

Pennies. It is to laugh. You're raising everyone's wages, not just techs. That means the cashiers, the stockers, and the cleaning service personnel. It all goes up.

Pennies

Look at the number of prescriptions they handle. A couple dollars an hour is nothing on prescriptions that they charge hundreds for

You're not accounting for the other employees in the store, then the employees of the trucking company bringing the pills to the store, then the employees of the pharmaceutical company that makes the drugs. Need I go on? The prices for everything in the store would go up, but Grandma's on a fixed income and now has to choose whether to eat or take her meds.

Now, if you raise the MW slowly and keep it low enough, the market has time to adjust and the pain is only felt by the truly poor and elderly that have no other option.

Now you are getting ridiculous

Trucking companies for pills?

You know how many pills you can get on a truck?

Okay, how do you think the pills get to the store, carrier pigeon?

Remember, a retail pharmacy is just one part of the average drug store. There are a lot of other products in the shelves. But, no matter how many products get to the store, somebody is driving them, whether in a van or a truck. Man, you really don't look at the entire picture, do you?

That poor cashier adds nothing to the cost of those products

Back to drugs. With one pill going for up to a $100. Do you think paying the guy who stuffs the bottle $2 an hour more will cripple drug companies?

I've already noted that you don't see the whole picture, and you're proving me right again. Why do you think only one guy is going to get a raise? First, there are a bunch of people at the drug company who will get a raise, so up go their prices. Then you have their raw material suppliers who will raise their prices. Then you have the transporters who move everything around. They're going to raise their prices, especially if they have unions whose pay scales are tied to the MW. Then you have the middle man who runs the warehouse that stores the meds until they get distributed to the stores. Then there's the store itself who now has to pay their people more. Now guess who ends up paying all those extra costs? Yup, Grandma on a fixed income. You can raise the MW if you do it slowly enough and keep it low enough that the market can adjust. Doubling it overnight is a bad idea.

You really need a broader perspective.

 

[rightwinger]

Your saying that if you’re a type A personality who is up at the crack of dawn, going to work every day, getting ahead…doing all the right things, saying all the right things, contributing big time …. that this type of person will be so offended by someone else making almost as much that they will say, “fuck it” and start shopping for shoes at work on the free internet? I disagree.

If what you said was true, the companies that pay the least would have zero employees because the companies that pay more would be scooping them all up since, from what I’m reading about your posts, people are supposedly hyper sensitive to what is being paid to others. Again. I disagree.

There's a big difference between working extra, getting extra training, and maintaining a certification to earn twice MW and doing all that to just make a dollar or two more. You don't see that?

Each dollar per hour is $2,000 extra dollars per year full time.

So $2.00 more per hour is $4,000 extra dollars per year.

Yes.

Would you honestly do all that just to make a dollar an hour more than MW?

Yes.

Today's situation isn't a guarantee of tomorrow's predicament. If you have the key to open the door to jobs higher up the food chain, you can walk through it. If you don't have that key...well, enjoy your stagnation.

And if you're a poor, badly educated kid who's never learned or had the inclination to think beyond next week, much less next decade?

Sure, smart people will invest in their future, but not everyone has been taught how to do that or why it's important.

Not sure what your point is. Earlier you were defending the Type A go-getter now you seem to be worried about those who are not the Type A go-getter.

To answer you question, we've always had poor, badly eduacated kids who never learned or had the inclination (or learned later in life like I did); a raise in the minimum wage would be good for them, don't you think? It would also be good for our economy since A) ours is a service/consumer economy and B) there will be more money flowing into those areas if there is more disposable income for the consumers.

And if you do it slow enough and keep it low enough that the market can adjust, the problems can be kept to a minimum. What I'm hearing, though, is that so many think we can increase it by 50-100% almost overnight with no negative effects. They don't seem to account for the ripple effect.

We have ignored the wage for a decade and then complain when it is time to catch up

 

[hadit]

Bottom line...conservatives do NOT want wages to increase...and that's what is happening.

That is also why we need a minimum wage increase.

It puts upward pressure on wages in general.It would finally force employers to increase wages . In case you haven't noticed...in spite of the economy doing really well and unemployment being really low...wages have NOT increased more than pennies

There's no problem with higher wages as long as you understand that you can't raise them too high too fast without negative consequences.

 

[hadit]

Bottom line...conservatives do NOT want wages to increase...and that's what is happening.

That is also why we need a minimum wage increase.

It puts upward pressure on wages in general.It would finally force employers to increase wages . In case you haven't noticed...in spite of the economy doing really well and unemployment being really low...wages have NOT increased more than pennies

Conservatives want low cost labor as they cut taxes on employers

Bull.

 

[rightwinger]

During and after the recession of 2008 we told employees to suck it up..... we can’t afford wage increases
Now that the economy is booming those wages have not recovered

 

[rightwinger]

Bottom line...conservatives do NOT want wages to increase...and that's what is happening.

That is also why we need a minimum wage increase.

It puts upward pressure on wages in general.It would finally force employers to increase wages . In case you haven't noticed...in spite of the economy doing really well and unemployment being really low...wages have NOT increased more than pennies

Conservatives want low cost labor as they cut taxes on employers

Bull.

Show any bills they have passed that favor labor

 

[hadit]

There's a big difference between working extra, getting extra training, and maintaining a certification to earn twice MW and doing all that to just make a dollar or two more. You don't see that?

Each dollar per hour is $2,000 extra dollars per year full time.

So $2.00 more per hour is $4,000 extra dollars per year.

Yes.

Would you honestly do all that just to make a dollar an hour more than MW?

Yes.

Today's situation isn't a guarantee of tomorrow's predicament. If you have the key to open the door to jobs higher up the food chain, you can walk through it. If you don't have that key...well, enjoy your stagnation.

And if you're a poor, badly educated kid who's never learned or had the inclination to think beyond next week, much less next decade?

Sure, smart people will invest in their future, but not everyone has been taught how to do that or why it's important.

Not sure what your point is. Earlier you were defending the Type A go-getter now you seem to be worried about those who are not the Type A go-getter.

To answer you question, we've always had poor, badly eduacated kids who never learned or had the inclination (or learned later in life like I did); a raise in the minimum wage would be good for them, don't you think? It would also be good for our economy since A) ours is a service/consumer economy and B) there will be more money flowing into those areas if there is more disposable income for the consumers.

And if you do it slow enough and keep it low enough that the market can adjust, the problems can be kept to a minimum. What I'm hearing, though, is that so many think we can increase it by 50-100% almost overnight with no negative effects. They don't seem to account for the ripple effect.

We have ignored the wage for a decade and then complain when it is time to catch up

So raise it, but don't pretend you can set it arbitrarily high with no ill effects.

 

[hadit]

Bottom line...conservatives do NOT want wages to increase...and that's what is happening.

That is also why we need a minimum wage increase.

It puts upward pressure on wages in general.It would finally force employers to increase wages . In case you haven't noticed...in spite of the economy doing really well and unemployment being really low...wages have NOT increased more than pennies

Conservatives want low cost labor as they cut taxes on employers

Bull.

Show any bills they have passed that favor labor

Low taxes benefit labor. Fewer unnecessary regulations benefit labor.

 

[rightwinger]

Each dollar per hour is $2,000 extra dollars per year full time.

So $2.00 more per hour is $4,000 extra dollars per year.

Yes.

Yes.

Today's situation isn't a guarantee of tomorrow's predicament. If you have the key to open the door to jobs higher up the food chain, you can walk through it. If you don't have that key...well, enjoy your stagnation.

And if you're a poor, badly educated kid who's never learned or had the inclination to think beyond next week, much less next decade?

Sure, smart people will invest in their future, but not everyone has been taught how to do that or why it's important.

Not sure what your point is. Earlier you were defending the Type A go-getter now you seem to be worried about those who are not the Type A go-getter.

To answer you question, we've always had poor, badly eduacated kids who never learned or had the inclination (or learned later in life like I did); a raise in the minimum wage would be good for them, don't you think? It would also be good for our economy since A) ours is a service/consumer economy and B) there will be more money flowing into those areas if there is more disposable income for the consumers.

And if you do it slow enough and keep it low enough that the market can adjust, the problems can be kept to a minimum. What I'm hearing, though, is that so many think we can increase it by 50-100% almost overnight with no negative effects. They don't seem to account for the ripple effect.

We have ignored the wage for a decade and then complain when it is time to catch up

So raise it, but don't pretend you can set it arbitrarily high with no ill effects.

There were Ill effects on workers when wages were frozen for s decade. Nobody seemed to care

 

[candycorn]

Your saying that if you’re a type A personality who is up at the crack of dawn, going to work every day, getting ahead…doing all the right things, saying all the right things, contributing big time …. that this type of person will be so offended by someone else making almost as much that they will say, “fuck it” and start shopping for shoes at work on the free internet? I disagree.

If what you said was true, the companies that pay the least would have zero employees because the companies that pay more would be scooping them all up since, from what I’m reading about your posts, people are supposedly hyper sensitive to what is being paid to others. Again. I disagree.

There's a big difference between working extra, getting extra training, and maintaining a certification to earn twice MW and doing all that to just make a dollar or two more. You don't see that?

Each dollar per hour is $2,000 extra dollars per year full time.

So $2.00 more per hour is $4,000 extra dollars per year.

Yes.

Would you honestly do all that just to make a dollar an hour more than MW?

Yes.

Today's situation isn't a guarantee of tomorrow's predicament. If you have the key to open the door to jobs higher up the food chain, you can walk through it. If you don't have that key...well, enjoy your stagnation.

And if you're a poor, badly educated kid who's never learned or had the inclination to think beyond next week, much less next decade?

Sure, smart people will invest in their future, but not everyone has been taught how to do that or why it's important.

Not sure what your point is. Earlier you were defending the Type A go-getter now you seem to be worried about those who are not the Type A go-getter.

To answer you question, we've always had poor, badly eduacated kids who never learned or had the inclination (or learned later in life like I did); a raise in the minimum wage would be good for them, don't you think? It would also be good for our economy since A) ours is a service/consumer economy and B) there will be more money flowing into those areas if there is more disposable income for the consumers.

And if you do it slow enough and keep it low enough that the market can adjust, the problems can be kept to a minimum. What I'm hearing, though, is that so many think we can increase it by 50-100% almost overnight with no negative effects. They don't seem to account for the ripple effect.

That double it overnight nonsense is a Sandersesque pie in the sky bullshit.

 

[rightwinger]

Bottom line...conservatives do NOT want wages to increase...and that's what is happening.

That is also why we need a minimum wage increase.

It puts upward pressure on wages in general.It would finally force employers to increase wages . In case you haven't noticed...in spite of the economy doing really well and unemployment being really low...wages have NOT increased more than pennies

Conservatives want low cost labor as they cut taxes on employers

Bull.

Show any bills they have passed that favor labor

Low taxes benefit labor. Fewer unnecessary regulations benefit labor.

Bull

Social programs such as education and healthcare benefit labor

Slashing taxes mean you can’t find them

Those regulations protect the rights of labor

 

[candycorn]

Each dollar per hour is $2,000 extra dollars per year full time.

So $2.00 more per hour is $4,000 extra dollars per year.

Yes.

Yes.

Today's situation isn't a guarantee of tomorrow's predicament. If you have the key to open the door to jobs higher up the food chain, you can walk through it. If you don't have that key...well, enjoy your stagnation.

And if you're a poor, badly educated kid who's never learned or had the inclination to think beyond next week, much less next decade?

Sure, smart people will invest in their future, but not everyone has been taught how to do that or why it's important.

Not sure what your point is. Earlier you were defending the Type A go-getter now you seem to be worried about those who are not the Type A go-getter.

To answer you question, we've always had poor, badly eduacated kids who never learned or had the inclination (or learned later in life like I did); a raise in the minimum wage would be good for them, don't you think? It would also be good for our economy since A) ours is a service/consumer economy and B) there will be more money flowing into those areas if there is more disposable income for the consumers.

And if you do it slow enough and keep it low enough that the market can adjust, the problems can be kept to a minimum. What I'm hearing, though, is that so many think we can increase it by 50-100% almost overnight with no negative effects. They don't seem to account for the ripple effect.

We have ignored the wage for a decade and then complain when it is time to catch up

So raise it, but don't pretend you can set it arbitrarily high with no ill effects.

I say to $10.00 per hour over 3 years or so.

 

[Lesh]

Low taxes benefit labor. Fewer unnecessary regulations benefit labor.

Bullshit. Decent wages benefit labor. Regulations that protect workers at work and in the fucking supermarket benefit labor

 

[rightwinger]

There's a big difference between working extra, getting extra training, and maintaining a certification to earn twice MW and doing all that to just make a dollar or two more. You don't see that?

Each dollar per hour is $2,000 extra dollars per year full time.

So $2.00 more per hour is $4,000 extra dollars per year.

Yes.

Would you honestly do all that just to make a dollar an hour more than MW?

Yes.

Today's situation isn't a guarantee of tomorrow's predicament. If you have the key to open the door to jobs higher up the food chain, you can walk through it. If you don't have that key...well, enjoy your stagnation.

And if you're a poor, badly educated kid who's never learned or had the inclination to think beyond next week, much less next decade?

Sure, smart people will invest in their future, but not everyone has been taught how to do that or why it's important.

Not sure what your point is. Earlier you were defending the Type A go-getter now you seem to be worried about those who are not the Type A go-getter.

To answer you question, we've always had poor, badly eduacated kids who never learned or had the inclination (or learned later in life like I did); a raise in the minimum wage would be good for them, don't you think? It would also be good for our economy since A) ours is a service/consumer economy and B) there will be more money flowing into those areas if there is more disposable income for the consumers.

And if you do it slow enough and keep it low enough that the market can adjust, the problems can be kept to a minimum. What I'm hearing, though, is that so many think we can increase it by 50-100% almost overnight with no negative effects. They don't seem to account for the ripple effect.

That double it overnight nonsense is a Sandersesque pie in the sky bullshit.

Republicans won’t even raise it a dollar

 

[rightwinger]

And if you're a poor, badly educated kid who's never learned or had the inclination to think beyond next week, much less next decade?

Sure, smart people will invest in their future, but not everyone has been taught how to do that or why it's important.

Not sure what your point is. Earlier you were defending the Type A go-getter now you seem to be worried about those who are not the Type A go-getter.

To answer you question, we've always had poor, badly eduacated kids who never learned or had the inclination (or learned later in life like I did); a raise in the minimum wage would be good for them, don't you think? It would also be good for our economy since A) ours is a service/consumer economy and B) there will be more money flowing into those areas if there is more disposable income for the consumers.

And if you do it slow enough and keep it low enough that the market can adjust, the problems can be kept to a minimum. What I'm hearing, though, is that so many think we can increase it by 50-100% almost overnight with no negative effects. They don't seem to account for the ripple effect.

We have ignored the wage for a decade and then complain when it is time to catch up

So raise it, but don't pretend you can set it arbitrarily high with no ill effects.

I say to $10.00 per hour over 3 years or so.

Too little too late
$15 over three years

 

[candycorn]

Not sure what your point is. Earlier you were defending the Type A go-getter now you seem to be worried about those who are not the Type A go-getter.

To answer you question, we've always had poor, badly eduacated kids who never learned or had the inclination (or learned later in life like I did); a raise in the minimum wage would be good for them, don't you think? It would also be good for our economy since A) ours is a service/consumer economy and B) there will be more money flowing into those areas if there is more disposable income for the consumers.

And if you do it slow enough and keep it low enough that the market can adjust, the problems can be kept to a minimum. What I'm hearing, though, is that so many think we can increase it by 50-100% almost overnight with no negative effects. They don't seem to account for the ripple effect.

We have ignored the wage for a decade and then complain when it is time to catch up

So raise it, but don't pretend you can set it arbitrarily high with no ill effects.

I say to $10.00 per hour over 3 years or so.

Too little too late

A 30 percent raise or 10% or so per year is about 3-5X what the normal raise MW workers get. Beats getting poked in the eye with a sharp stick.

 

[Lesh]

I say to $10.00 per hour over 3 years or so.

$12 would put it were it was (adjusted for inflation) FIFTY years ago