Obama proposes $1B for science, math teachers

[g5000]

We can improve our education by eliminating the US Department of Education and criminalizing the UFT

I love how you guys keep crying for this and yet never explain how it would help.

Lemmings.

Eliminating the Dept of Ed would put control of education back into the hands of local officials who know local education needs better.

Eliminating the power of teachers unions to prevent principals from getting rid of shitty teachers would improve teacher quality.

Neither concept is hard to grasp, and have been explained many times. Just because you don't listen does not mean it has not been explained.

 

[emptystep]

Completely agree. Any changes to Public Education will take time and we'd get more bang for the buck focusing on Adult Training right now.

As an adult you are the only one responsible for your improvement, education or whatever...

State or local funded education of minors, I don't think you will get any opposition to.. but any government funding of adult education or payment for education (or loans for education) is complete bullshit.. you want something as an adult, sacrifice, earn, and pay for it yourself.. no matter how 'hard' you think it is to do so

Single mom with two kids who is on food stamps and welfare, but wants to get a career and move up but needs some help, your advice is "Fuck you. Work harder. Oh, and we're cutting your food stamps and welfare."

Personally feelings aside of how large an ass you are, this is economically speaking, the dumbest approach you could possibly take.

I will try to keep these type posts to a minimum but Dave makes a point that he is a vet. The military is a near perfect welfare state. Ironic isn't it?

 

[Sinjorri]

As an adult you are the only one responsible for your improvement, education or whatever...

State or local funded education of minors, I don't think you will get any opposition to.. but any government funding of adult education or payment for education (or loans for education) is complete bullshit.. you want something as an adult, sacrifice, earn, and pay for it yourself.. no matter how 'hard' you think it is to do so

Single mom with two kids who is on food stamps and welfare, but wants to get a career and move up but needs some help, your advice is "Fuck you. Work harder. Oh, and we're cutting your food stamps and welfare."

Personally feelings aside of how large an ass you are, this is economically speaking, the dumbest approach you could possibly take.

I will try to keep these type posts to a minimum but Dave makes a point that he is a vet. The military is a near perfect welfare state. Ironic isn't it?

are u saying soliders dont perform jobs for their pay?

 

[g5000]

Single mom with two kids who is on food stamps and welfare...

There's the root of the problem right there.

Eliminate the causes of single parenthood, and a whole boatload of other problems clear themselves up automatically and we save ourselves trillions of taxpayer dollars.

 

[Steelplate]

A program that would "reward" teachers with an extra twenty grand is begging for disaster. That kind of moola ensures the competition will be strictly political and not merit-based. Many a principal is going to get love long time from the contestants.

Perhaps we should do away with basket weaving and advanced movie watching and start teaching Critical Thinking courses. Based on the posts I see on this forum, our country is in desperate need of such classes.

yeah...I know...all conservatives are able to think critically about is government...but only the part of government that has a (D) behind their name. Why don't you turn your highly developed critical thinking skills on to the financial sector, corporate America and Conservative "news"outlets that make the claim that they are the only ones who aren't telling lies and that everyone else is because they are Commies in disguise that want to ruin America.

That's what crab ks me the fuck up about you morons....it's right there in front of your face and still you don't see the propaganda machine. I'll give them credit...it's a hell of a PR/marketing campaign that the conglomerate has going on...but then again...they do market research and know exactly how gullible people are and what buttons to push.

 

[auditor0007]

All we have been doing is throwing money at education and yet we fall further and further behind other countries.

Seems to me it's about time we stop throwing good money after bad at teachers etc and try something new.

With this I will agree. Money in itself is not the answer to the problems we face with public education. This is one area I would be more than happy to see the feds remove themselves from and allow the states to deal with it on their own. Just cut the entire Dept of Education. We're paying $70 to $100 billion per year for it, and none of that money goes to teaching any child anything.

 

[Steelplate]

Single mom with two kids who is on food stamps and welfare, but wants to get a career and move up but needs some help, your advice is "Fuck you. Work harder. Oh, and we're cutting your food stamps and welfare."

Personally feelings aside of how large an ass you are, this is economically speaking, the dumbest approach you could possibly take.

I will try to keep these type posts to a minimum but Dave makes a point that he is a vet. The military is a near perfect welfare state. Ironic isn't it?

are u saying soliders dont perform jobs for their pay?

why not? they are public sector employees too. You guys seem to think public sector employees are the bane of society...let's lump them in too.

 

[Sinjorri]

A program that would "reward" teachers with an extra twenty grand is begging for disaster. That kind of moola ensures the competition will be strictly political and not merit-based. Many a principal is going to get love long time from the contestants.

Perhaps we should do away with basket weaving and advanced movie watching and start teaching Critical Thinking courses. Based on the posts I see on this forum, our country is in desperate need of such classes.

yeah...I know...all conservatives are able to think critically about is government...but only the part of government that has a (D) behind their name. Why don't you turn your highly developed critical thinking skills on to the financial sector, corporate America and Conservative "news"outlets that make the claim that they are the only ones who aren't telling lies and that everyone else is because they are Commies in disguise that want to ruin America.

That's what crab ks me the fuck up about you morons....it's right there in front of your face and still you don't see the propaganda machine. I'll give them credit...it's a hell of a PR/marketing campaign that the conglomerate has going on...but then again...they do market research and know exactly how gullible people are and what buttons to push.

id read more of ur posts, but the insults keep proving my point.
now just because conservatives think different we're morons? Come on grow up, its a discussion, none of us are going to change much , we can vote, some of us can do it dead too, but other than that and burning down congress, are hte insults going to prove ur anymore right when all Obama might be thinking is "im buying more votes" I think we can all agree the politicians dont care what we think. Let the anger flow away.

 

[DontBeStupid]

because they LOVE the benefits and i dont know where u are seeing this but so many libs want to be teachers here in NJ becas u cant be fired.


And i did not put words in ur mouth, read and try to comprehend firing someone is a form of punishment, ive never been fired but seeing some being fired ive never heard the words, im not punishing u for firing u but i have to compliment u another way? Sorry firing is a form of punishment. the ulitimate form. Ive never seen anyone fired as a way of being promoted either.

Should any other occupation not punish workers in fear of not getting new workers?

wait a freaking second...do you have statistics and testimonials to back that assertion up? or are you just projecting your own feelings? teachers teach because it's a noble profession, they have an aptitude for it, they are intelligent and want to pass that knowledge on to the next generation, hell....maybe it's even the summers off that attracts them.....but to assign the idea that they want to be teachers because they can't be fired as their motivation is dubious at best.

but hey....you're apparently a conservative... prejudice and vitriol replaces fact all the time with you guys.

no i have something better, s traight from their freaking mouths, look up the programs and schools that give out teaching education or certs they are thru the roof. Young adults who are just getting into college know teachers are hard to fire, tenure is now at 3 years and the benefits of not working summer, holidays, weekends or anything other days off attrachs a lot of people.

had many a friends who went that route because they figured it was eaiser and guaranteed. for some they were right, for others not so much.

You should just stop talking. You clearly don't understand this topic.

A tenured teacher can be fired. They just can't be fired for any random reason, like, oh, we want to bring in a younger teacher so we can cut their pay.

They don't work summers and don't get paid for it. They also don't get paid for holidays and weekends, even though they work holidays and weekends. That's actually illegal.

 

[Sinjorri]

I will try to keep these type posts to a minimum but Dave makes a point that he is a vet. The military is a near perfect welfare state. Ironic isn't it?

are u saying soliders dont perform jobs for their pay?

why not? they are public sector employees too. You guys seem to think public sector employees are the bane of society...let's lump them in too.

im trying to figure out the welfare system remark. One is performing a hazardous job and if they eat for free off the governements dime im willing to spend on that. They have to give up holidays away from family, im willing to spend on that, some cant intermix with civilized life, im okay with that, give them the money.

I dont think he meant it as an insult, i just wanted to know the correlation.

 

[Sinjorri]

wait a freaking second...do you have statistics and testimonials to back that assertion up? or are you just projecting your own feelings? teachers teach because it's a noble profession, they have an aptitude for it, they are intelligent and want to pass that knowledge on to the next generation, hell....maybe it's even the summers off that attracts them.....but to assign the idea that they want to be teachers because they can't be fired as their motivation is dubious at best.

but hey....you're apparently a conservative... prejudice and vitriol replaces fact all the time with you guys.

no i have something better, s traight from their freaking mouths, look up the programs and schools that give out teaching education or certs they are thru the roof. Young adults who are just getting into college know teachers are hard to fire, tenure is now at 3 years and the benefits of not working summer, holidays, weekends or anything other days off attrachs a lot of people.

had many a friends who went that route because they figured it was eaiser and guaranteed. for some they were right, for others not so much.

You should just stop talking. You clearly don't understand this topic.

A tenured teacher can be fired. They just can't be fired for any random reason, like, oh, we want to bring in a younger teacher so we can cut their pay.

They don't work summers and don't get paid for it. They also don't get paid for holidays and weekends, even though they work holidays and weekends. That's actually illegal.

this argument again, yes teachers are the only ones who work on their offdays, many office people looking to get ahead never work either, ive never seen my sister bring her laptop home from work to keep working yes yes yes its only teachers.

look up how hard it is to fire a tenured teacher, u really dont have a clue.

and ive talked to many a teachers and even they are seeing the light, it irks them some work hard and some dont, it irks them that they have passsing students and some just pass students. But u know u know all the rest of us are here to learn from u how dare we think for ourselves.

 

[emptystep]

Single mom with two kids who is on food stamps and welfare, but wants to get a career and move up but needs some help, your advice is "Fuck you. Work harder. Oh, and we're cutting your food stamps and welfare."

Personally feelings aside of how large an ass you are, this is economically speaking, the dumbest approach you could possibly take.

I will try to keep these type posts to a minimum but Dave makes a point that he is a vet. The military is a near perfect welfare state. Ironic isn't it?

are u saying soliders dont perform jobs for their pay?

No. 'Welfare' is the wrong word. What I mean is that the military is not a capitistic model, kind of like school grants. The government believes in protecting the country so it pays soldiers. The government believes education is good so it gives grants. Same principle. Right? A different principle is raise cattle for market.

 

[DontBeStupid]

Eliminating the Dept of Ed would put control of education back into the hands of local officials who know local education needs better.

And this would reduce class size how? Are you honestly suggesting that local officials are NOT reducing class sizes and are NOT hiring more teachers because of Federal rules from the Dept of Education? What are those rules then?

Eliminating the power of teachers unions to prevent principals from getting rid of shitty teachers would improve teacher quality.

How? If you and I are teachers and you're shitty and get fired, how does that make me better? How does me now having to teach your students in addition to mine help me teach better?

Neither concept is hard to grasp, and have been explained many times. Just because you don't listen does not mean it has not been explained.

It's never been explained. You guys keep claiming it, but then never explain the steps. Your logic is like this:

1. Class size is too big.
2. Give more local control.
3.
4. Smaller class sizes accomplished.

How does having more local control translate to more teachers and smaller classes?

 

[Sinjorri]

I will try to keep these type posts to a minimum but Dave makes a point that he is a vet. The military is a near perfect welfare state. Ironic isn't it?

are u saying soliders dont perform jobs for their pay?

No. 'Welfare' is the wrong word. What I mean is that the military is not a capitistic model, kind of like school grants. The government believes in protecting the country so it pays soldiers. The government believes education is good so it gives grants. Same principle. Right? A different principle is raise cattle for market.

okay thank u. appreciate the clarification. I can see ur point, but its evolved to it, a good evolution but there are incentives for the military stuff, and its hard not to learn when ur teacher is packing when ur in military classes. But i see the correlation now. good point.

 

[Sinjorri]

Eliminating the Dept of Ed would put control of education back into the hands of local officials who know local education needs better.

And this would reduce class size how? Are you honestly suggesting that local officials are NOT reducing class sizes and are NOT hiring more teachers because of Federal rules from the Dept of Education? What are those rules then?

Eliminating the power of teachers unions to prevent principals from getting rid of shitty teachers would improve teacher quality.

How? If you and I are teachers and you're shitty and get fired, how does that make me better? How does me now having to teach your students in addition to mine help me teach better?

Neither concept is hard to grasp, and have been explained many times. Just because you don't listen does not mean it has not been explained.

It's never been explained. You guys keep claiming it, but then never explain the steps. Your logic is like this:

1. Class size is too big.
2. Give more local control.
3.
4. Smaller class sizes accomplished.

How does having more local control translate to more teachers and smaller classes?

yes i know in jersey when schools get to crowded the kids are shipped to other towns for education.

 

[DiamondDave]

Completely agree. Any changes to Public Education will take time and we'd get more bang for the buck focusing on Adult Training right now.

As an adult you are the only one responsible for your improvement, education or whatever...

State or local funded education of minors, I don't think you will get any opposition to.. but any government funding of adult education or payment for education (or loans for education) is complete bullshit.. you want something as an adult, sacrifice, earn, and pay for it yourself.. no matter how 'hard' you think it is to do so

Single mom with two kids who is on food stamps and welfare, but wants to get a career and move up but needs some help, your advice is "Fuck you. Work harder. Oh, and we're cutting your food stamps and welfare."

Personally feelings aside of how large an ass you are, this is economically speaking, the dumbest approach you could possibly take.

Her decisions, efforts, circumstances led her to where she is.. or the same for anyone in whatever situation... AS AN ADULT, YOU ARE THE ONLY ONE RESPONSIBLE FOR YOU... sorry Charlie, that comes with being a fucking adult... government does not exist to do it for you, nor is anyone else forcibly responsible for your upkeep or you getting adult education that you want...

Now... applying to PRIVATE scholarship funds, applying to charities, choosing an employer who would reimburse education or provide assistance for certification, or anything else along those lines.. all well and good.. but as an ADULT, you are not OWED it

 

[DiamondDave]

As an adult you are the only one responsible for your improvement, education or whatever...

State or local funded education of minors, I don't think you will get any opposition to.. but any government funding of adult education or payment for education (or loans for education) is complete bullshit.. you want something as an adult, sacrifice, earn, and pay for it yourself.. no matter how 'hard' you think it is to do so

Single mom with two kids who is on food stamps and welfare, but wants to get a career and move up but needs some help, your advice is "Fuck you. Work harder. Oh, and we're cutting your food stamps and welfare."

Personally feelings aside of how large an ass you are, this is economically speaking, the dumbest approach you could possibly take.

I will try to keep these type posts to a minimum but Dave makes a point that he is a vet. The military is a near perfect welfare state. Ironic isn't it?

Welfare?? You trying to assert that I did not work for any compensation I got, or any benefit I got??

Dream on, asshole...

I worked more in my service time that you ever will in your entire fucking life

 

[Jackson]

All we have been doing is throwing money at education and yet we fall further and further behind other countries.

Seems to me it's about time we stop throwing good money after bad at teachers etc and try something new.

Like rewarding teachers for producing results. No student should be allowed to pass a single grade without meeting the standards.

And that doesn't cost taxpayers a penny.

 

[Sinjorri]

As an adult you are the only one responsible for your improvement, education or whatever...

State or local funded education of minors, I don't think you will get any opposition to.. but any government funding of adult education or payment for education (or loans for education) is complete bullshit.. you want something as an adult, sacrifice, earn, and pay for it yourself.. no matter how 'hard' you think it is to do so

Single mom with two kids who is on food stamps and welfare, but wants to get a career and move up but needs some help, your advice is "Fuck you. Work harder. Oh, and we're cutting your food stamps and welfare."

Personally feelings aside of how large an ass you are, this is economically speaking, the dumbest approach you could possibly take.

Her decisions, efforts, circumstances led her to where she is.. or the same for anyone in whatever situation... AS AN ADULT, YOU ARE THE ONLY ONE RESPONSIBLE FOR YOU... sorry Charlie, that comes with being a fucking adult... government does not exist to do it for you, nor is anyone else forcibly responsible for your upkeep or you getting adult education that you want...

Now... applying to PRIVATE scholarship funds, applying to charities, choosing an employer who would reimburse education or provide assistance for certification, or anything else along those lines.. all well and good.. but as an ADULT, you are not OWED it

this is where i get into this argument, why should kids try hard if the government is going to say "be a moron in school when u get out and want to improve we'll pay your way" No i am tired of this and im tired of helping the kids who dont want to achieve and dont want to get better. I feel sorry for all the kids who try hard and get some place and the government says "we ll only help the victims of the schools" Sorry not buying it.

 

[Sinjorri]

Single mom with two kids who is on food stamps and welfare, but wants to get a career and move up but needs some help, your advice is "Fuck you. Work harder. Oh, and we're cutting your food stamps and welfare."

Personally feelings aside of how large an ass you are, this is economically speaking, the dumbest approach you could possibly take.

I will try to keep these type posts to a minimum but Dave makes a point that he is a vet. The military is a near perfect welfare state. Ironic isn't it?

Welfare?? You trying to assert that I did not work for any compensation I got, or any benefit I got??

Dream on, asshole...

I worked more in my service time that you ever will in your entire fucking life

they made a clarification.