Obama proposes tax hikes on wealthy, Capital Gains tax hikes that will likely backfire as usual

[Skylar]

You really dont understand how finance works, do you?
Hint: Companies raise money through stock offerings as well as bond offerings. When investors buy a company's stock they are providing liquidity and a market that the company may use to raise additional funds.

Uh-huh. And when was the last time Microsoft make a stock offering? You're not buying from Microsoft. You're buying from another speculator. Your speculation adds nothing to the economy. It does nothing. It generates no service. It enhances nothing. It improves nothing. Its practically and intrinsically worthless. As all you're doing is taking money from the last speculator who guessed wrong. Or giving money to the next speculator who guessed right.

Why then would this useless increase that doesn't benefit the economy in any meaningful way nor the company that issued the stock be taxed at a lower rate than the fruits of genuine labor? Where something is actually built, where value is actually added, where a service is actually provided, where the economy is actually grown?

There is no reason. Actual labor benefits the economy to a far greater extent than endless stock speculation. As such, capital gains should be taxed at at least the the level of real labor. If not higher. This massive tax loophole for the rich is pointless and serves no valid purpose.

Labor is nothing but a commodity.

People sell their labor to the company that will pay the most for their particular skill set.

Labor actually does shit. It can dig a ditch. It can build a house. It can make a product. It can provide a service.

Shaving fractions of pennies off several times a second in minute fluctuations of stock value doesn't do a thing. It provides no service. It makes nothing. It improves nothing. It adds to the economy in no meaningful way.

Why then would we give this uselessness a massive tax break while holding labor that genuinely builds something at a higher rate? It boggles the mind.

Okay, I can see you lack the cognitive ability to have this discussion. If you can't even grasp the role of capital in the function of expanding business.

Good bye.

Oh, I recognize the value of capital in expanding business. But stock speculation doesn't benefit the company that issues the stock. Remember....You're not buying stock from microsoft. You're buying it from another speculator. And the increase doesn't actually provide any service. Don't produce any goods. Doesn't do....anything.

Why would we offer such a massive discount to money transfers between speculators while charging those that conduct actual labor that make real good and provides real services a higher rate?

There is no reason. Its just fucking stupid.....rewarding useless increases that produce nothing. While penalizing useful labor that actually expands the economy.

 

[Skull Pilot]

You really dont understand how finance works, do you?
Hint: Companies raise money through stock offerings as well as bond offerings. When investors buy a company's stock they are providing liquidity and a market that the company may use to raise additional funds.

Uh-huh. And when was the last time Microsoft make a stock offering? You're not buying from Microsoft. You're buying from another speculator. Your speculation adds nothing to the economy. It does nothing. It generates no service. It enhances nothing. It improves nothing. Its practically and intrinsically worthless. As all you're doing is taking money from the last speculator who guessed wrong. Or giving money to the next speculator who guessed right.

Why then would this useless increase that doesn't benefit the economy in any meaningful way nor the company that issued the stock be taxed at a lower rate than the fruits of genuine labor? Where something is actually built, where value is actually added, where a service is actually provided, where the economy is actually grown?

There is no reason. Actual labor benefits the economy to a far greater extent than endless stock speculation. As such, capital gains should be taxed at at least the the level of real labor. If not higher. This massive tax loophole for the rich is pointless and serves no valid purpose.

Labor is nothing but a commodity.

People sell their labor to the company that will pay the most for their particular skill set.

Labor actually does shit. It can dig a ditch. It can build a house. It can make a product. It can provide a service.

Shaving fractions of pennies off several times a second in minute fluctuations of stock value doesn't do a thing. It provides no service. It makes nothing. It improves nothing. It adds to the economy in no meaningful way.

Why then would we give this uselessness a massive tax break while holding labor that genuinely builds something at a higher rate? It boggles the mind.

You do realize that the vast majority of people who invest do not play the market as you describe don't you?

Most people buy and hold stocks and do not day trade.

If you want to push for meaningful tax reform then you should be pushing for a change in the taxation of retirement savings.

The gains in a retirement account are taxed as regular income and people are forced to take minimum distributions so as to increase the tax revenue of the government.

Taxing the gains in retirement accounts at a lower capital gains rate will return far more money to the middle class than your Robin Hood strategy. Abolishing the required minimum distribution mandates would allow people to actually leave money to their progeny.

While stealing a few pennies from the rich to give to the poor so they can spend it may sound romantic it will do nothing to improve the middle class in comparison to real tax reform

 

[Mac1958]

.

I don't see any poison pills. The basis step-up elimination upon death was a bit of a surprise.

It won't go anywhere, of course, not with this Congress.

I assume this plan is really for the 2016 elections, right?

New Oxfam report says half of global wealth held by the 1 Business The Guardian

.

 

[Darkwind]

You really dont understand how finance works, do you?
Hint: Companies raise money through stock offerings as well as bond offerings. When investors buy a company's stock they are providing liquidity and a market that the company may use to raise additional funds.

Uh-huh. And when was the last time Microsoft make a stock offering? You're not buying from Microsoft. You're buying from another speculator. Your speculation adds nothing to the economy. It does nothing. It generates no service. It enhances nothing. It improves nothing. Its practically and intrinsically worthless. As all you're doing is taking money from the last speculator who guessed wrong. Or giving money to the next speculator who guessed right.

Why then would this useless increase that doesn't benefit the economy in any meaningful way nor the company that issued the stock be taxed at a lower rate than the fruits of genuine labor? Where something is actually built, where value is actually added, where a service is actually provided, where the economy is actually grown?

There is no reason. Actual labor benefits the economy to a far greater extent than endless stock speculation. As such, capital gains should be taxed at at least the the level of real labor. If not higher. This massive tax loophole for the rich is pointless and serves no valid purpose.

Labor is nothing but a commodity.

People sell their labor to the company that will pay the most for their particular skill set.

Labor actually does shit. It can dig a ditch. It can build a house. It can make a product. It can provide a service.

Shaving fractions of pennies off several times a second in minute fluctuations of stock value doesn't do a thing. It provides no service. It makes nothing. It improves nothing. It adds to the economy in no meaningful way.

Why then would we give this uselessness a massive tax break while holding labor that genuinely builds something at a higher rate? It boggles the mind.

You do realize that the vast majority of people who invest do not play the market as you describe don't you?

Most people buy and hold stocks and do not day trade.

If you want to push for meaningful tax reform then you should be pushing for a change in the taxation of retirement savings.

The gains in a retirement account are taxed as regular income and people are forced to take minimum distributions so as to increase the tax revenue of the government.

Taxing the gains in retirement accounts at a lower capital gains rate will return far more money to the middle class than your Robin Hood strategy. Abolishing the required minimum distribution mandates would allow people to actually leave money to their progeny.

While stealing a few pennies from the rich to give to the poor so they can spend it may sound romantic it will do nothing to improve the middle class in comparison to real tax reform

You're wasting your time. He doesn't even understand what stocks are to a company and why they are offered up to investors, nor how they benefit business, jobs, and the economy.

 

[Freewill]

"Obama proposes tax hikes on wealthy, Capital Gains tax hikes that will likely backfire as usual"

No more unwarranted than tax cuts for the wealthy, which have in fact consistently backfired.

Tax revenue is at a all time high, how is that backfiring? The stock market is at all times highs, at times. How does that indicate backfire?

 

[hortysir]

So we should tax profits from investment made with after-tax income to the point so as to discourage such investment



sounds great

Lets say you buy Microsoft stock off the market, it increases in value and you make a profit.

How has your 'investiment' helped the economy? What good have you provided? What service? How have you increased the economy or meaningfully add to it in any way?

You haven't. You've take money from fellow investors who speculated that the price would go down.

Labor is a different story. When you work, you build business, you make goods. You provide services. You increase GDP in a meaningful way. It makes absolutely no sense that activity that directly and immediately benefits the economy would be taxed a rate higher than stock speculation.

Well, if your standard is the strength of the economy. If your standard making sure the rich have an enormous loopholes to avoid paying taxes, it makes perfect sense.

I've already worked and helped the economy. I paid my taxes on that income.
Now I want to take some of what I'm allowed to keep and invest it in hopes of a profit.
How does that help the economy? I'll take those evil capital gains and either invest more or buy some goods.....disposable income is a good thing

 

[hortysir]

You really dont understand how finance works, do you?
Hint: Companies raise money through stock offerings as well as bond offerings. When investors buy a company's stock they are providing liquidity and a market that the company may use to raise additional funds.

Uh-huh. And when was the last time Microsoft make a stock offering? You're not buying from Microsoft. You're buying from another speculator. Your speculation adds nothing to the economy. It does nothing. It generates no service. It enhances nothing. It improves nothing. Its practically and intrinsically worthless. As all you're doing is taking money from the last speculator who guessed wrong. Or giving money to the next speculator who guessed right.

Why then would this useless increase that doesn't benefit the economy in any meaningful way nor the company that issued the stock be taxed at a lower rate than the fruits of genuine labor? Where something is actually built, where value is actually added, where a service is actually provided, where the economy is actually grown?

There is no reason. Actual labor benefits the economy to a far greater extent than endless stock speculation. As such, capital gains should be taxed at at least the the level of real labor. If not higher. This massive tax loophole for the rich is pointless and serves no valid purpose.

It really isn't necessary to tax everything

 

[The Rabbi]

You really dont understand how finance works, do you?
Hint: Companies raise money through stock offerings as well as bond offerings. When investors buy a company's stock they are providing liquidity and a market that the company may use to raise additional funds.

Uh-huh. And when was the last time Microsoft make a stock offering? You're not buying from Microsoft. You're buying from another speculator. Your speculation adds nothing to the economy. It does nothing. It generates no service. It enhances nothing. It improves nothing. Its practically and intrinsically worthless. As all you're doing is taking money from the last speculator who guessed wrong. Or giving money to the next speculator who guessed right.

Why then would this useless increase that doesn't benefit the economy in any meaningful way nor the company that issued the stock be taxed at a lower rate than the fruits of genuine labor? Where something is actually built, where value is actually added, where a service is actually provided, where the economy is actually grown?

There is no reason. Actual labor benefits the economy to a far greater extent than endless stock speculation. As such, capital gains should be taxed at at least the the level of real labor. If not higher. This massive tax loophole for the rich is pointless and serves no valid purpose.

Oy. ANother ignoramus.
If there is no market for a company's stock they are shut out of raising money. That's finance. I am sorry you dont understand it.

Unless you're buying directly from microsoft, you're not adding a penny to that company's coffers. Nor does your selling your stock for more than you paid for it benefit Microsoft in any way. Nor does you losing money on the stock. Your increase makes nothing, it provides no service, makes no good, nor benefits the economy in any meaningful way

Why then would we give you a massive tax break and a loophole you could fly a plane through for such useless increase.....while charging a higher rate for people that are actually working, building businesses, making products and providing services that meaningfully benefit the economy?

There is no reason. If anything, capital gains should be taxed at a rate higher than the increases of meaningful labor. Or at the very least, taxed as regular income, as we did under Reagan.

I see my explanation didnt quite penetrate.
Without a market for a company's stock there is no way for the company to raise funds. Traders make that market and allow liquidity.

 

[The Rabbi]

You really dont understand how finance works, do you?
Hint: Companies raise money through stock offerings as well as bond offerings. When investors buy a company's stock they are providing liquidity and a market that the company may use to raise additional funds.

Uh-huh. And when was the last time Microsoft make a stock offering? You're not buying from Microsoft. You're buying from another speculator. Your speculation adds nothing to the economy. It does nothing. It generates no service. It enhances nothing. It improves nothing. Its practically and intrinsically worthless. As all you're doing is taking money from the last speculator who guessed wrong. Or giving money to the next speculator who guessed right.

Why then would this useless increase that doesn't benefit the economy in any meaningful way nor the company that issued the stock be taxed at a lower rate than the fruits of genuine labor? Where something is actually built, where value is actually added, where a service is actually provided, where the economy is actually grown?

There is no reason. Actual labor benefits the economy to a far greater extent than endless stock speculation. As such, capital gains should be taxed at at least the the level of real labor. If not higher. This massive tax loophole for the rich is pointless and serves no valid purpose.

Labor is nothing but a commodity.

People sell their labor to the company that will pay the most for their particular skill set.

Labor actually does shit. It can dig a ditch. It can build a house. It can make a product. It can provide a service.

Shaving fractions of pennies off several times a second in minute fluctuations of stock value doesn't do a thing. It provides no service. It makes nothing. It improves nothing. It adds to the economy in no meaningful way.

Why then would we give this uselessness a massive tax break while holding labor that genuinely builds something at a higher rate? It boggles the mind.

Labor cannot do anything without a plan, tools and materials.
We have tons of labor available in the inner cities. Why arent they doing anythign?

 

[BlindBoo]

Long term capital gains should be tax as income just like capital gains.

 

[zeke]

He doesn't even understand what stocks are to a company and why they are offered up to investors, nor how they benefit business, jobs, and the economy.

I take it you believe that if you call a stock broker today to purchase 5000 dollars of Microsoft stock, you think the stock broker will order those shares directly from Microsoft?

Nah, you can't believe that. You present yourself as some sort of savvy investor. Not some stupid ass like the rabbit.

So which one are you? Stupid or savvy?

 

[The Rabbi]

He doesn't even understand what stocks are to a company and why they are offered up to investors, nor how they benefit business, jobs, and the economy.

I take it you believe that if you call a stock broker today to purchase 5000 dollars of Microsoft stock, you think the stock broker will order those shares directly from Microsoft?

Nah, you can't believe that. You present yourself as some sort of savvy investor. Not some stupid ass like the rabbit.

So which one are you? Stupid or savvy?

There's a reason I have you in Ignore, Zekester.
You're too damn stupid to deal with.

 

[Darkwind]

He doesn't even understand what stocks are to a company and why they are offered up to investors, nor how they benefit business, jobs, and the economy.

I take it you believe that if you call a stock broker today to purchase 5000 dollars of Microsoft stock, you think the stock broker will order those shares directly from Microsoft?

Nah, you can't believe that. You present yourself as some sort of savvy investor. Not some stupid ass like the rabbit.

So which one are you? Stupid or savvy?

You have no idea what I believe, nor do you understand the principle of capitalizing a business and how the value of the business grows.

The shares are still Microsoft, regardless of who you purchase them from.

Now go away unless you have an epiphany on how the world works. You certainly have no clue now.

 

[zeke]

There's a reason I have you in Ignore, Zekester.

Evidently you are too fucking stupid to even put someone on (not in) "ignore". You did just respond to my post you dumb fuck.

 

[zeke]

The shares are still Microsoft, regardless of who you purchase them from.

Now go away unless you have an epiphany on how the world works. You certainly have no clue now.

Nah dude you be the clueless one.

Now the shares may still be Microsoft stock. But if I didn't buy them form Microsoft, they don't get the money you dumb fuck.

 

[zeke]

There's a reason I have you in Ignore, Zekester.
You're too damn stupid to deal with.

Dayum rabbit. With the number of people I read kicking your ass everyday, you will soon have to have most of the liberals on ignore. Poor widdle rabbit. Who you gonna talk to then. Darkwind? Lucky you that he will put up with you. You all won't even have to write anything. Just click "Like" and " agree" every time you all see your names come up.

 

[deltex1]

" I just received an audit on my tax return for 2012 from the IRS. It puzzles me!!!
They are questioning how many dependents I claimed.
I guess it was because of my response to the question: "List all dependents?"
I replied: 12 million illegal immigrants; 3 million crack heads;
42 million unemployed people on food stamps,
2 million people in over 243 prisons;
Half of Mexico ; and 535 persons in the U.S. House and Senate."
1 useless President.
Evidently, this was NOT an acceptable answer.
I KEEP ASKING MYSELF, WHO The Hell DID I MISS?"

 

[Harry Dresden]

Just tighten that belt another notch rich guy...it's for the good of the nation.......

I'm far from rich, but the BS tax regs that the progs want to enact will only screw over the middle class, because they can't escape them. The wealthy can move anywhere they wish. That's the problem.

exactly....not much is going to bother them....

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

And his proposed tax increases on "the wealthy" will probably result in slowing of job growth or even decreases in job production as large employers have less money to spend on wages and personnel, adding to their increased burdens imposed by Obamacare.

Capital gains is on stock speculation. If you say, buy microsoft for 70 and sell it for 100, the increase is taxed at a rate of 15%. Often less than half of the rate that actual income is taxed.

How then would it effect job production?

You do realize that when someone sells something they plan on spending the proceeds right?

 

[Skylar]

And his proposed tax increases on "the wealthy" will probably result in slowing of job growth or even decreases in job production as large employers have less money to spend on wages and personnel, adding to their increased burdens imposed by Obamacare.

Capital gains is on stock speculation. If you say, buy microsoft for 70 and sell it for 100, the increase is taxed at a rate of 15%. Often less than half of the rate that actual income is taxed.

How then would it effect job production?

You do realize that when someone sells something they plan on spending the proceeds right?

The same would be true if you say, sold a good or service. Why then does capital gains enjoy such an inexplicably entitled status with such a dramatically lower rate than that paid for ordinary income? You know....labor that actually produces a good or service rather than simply shifting money around between speculators?

By any logical standard, ordinary income would enjoy that preferred lower tax level as it actually benefits the economy in a meaningful way and produces goods and services. While stock speculation produces nothing, enhances nothing, improves nothing, provides no service, makes no good.

Which is why Obama's plan to cut taxes on ordinary income for the middle class while raising it on capital gains makes so much sense. Its completely reasonable, logical, and actually benefits the economy.