Obligation to "society"

[rightwinger]

Contribute what?

Money, time, labor

So I'm supposed to give my time and labor to "society" for free?

You have a moral obligation to the society and a legal one

Your moral obligation is met through charity, participating in your community, volunteer work, community projects
Your legal obligation is met through taxes

For some, the moral obligation is ignored and taxes are their only contribution. For others, they are not expected to contribute taxes but do fulfill their moral obligation to their community

 

[Skull Pilot]

Money, time, labor

So I'm supposed to give my time and labor to "society" for free?

You have a moral obligation to the society and a legal one

Your moral obligation is met through charity, participating in your community, volunteer work, community projects
Your legal obligation is met through taxes

For some, the moral obligation is ignored and taxes are their only contribution. For others, they are not expected to contribute taxes but do fulfill their moral obligation to their community

Charity begins at home.

And your morality is not to be forced on others.

 

[Sallow]

"Society" doesn't even exist, in the corporeal sense...I cannot borrow from you a bucket of "society", with the promise that I'll pay you back with a barrel of it at the end of the month...It is a fiction, a straw man....As such, it is completely subjective.

Anyone telling you that you have any debt/obligation to that which does not exist is a thug and a tyrant.

Feel free to leave..or continue to leech off of it..while braying about it's "evils".

Piss up a rope, commie.

You first anachisto!

 

[editec]

I have been hearing a lot from the sheep lately that we have some sort of obligation to society as a whole.

Well do we really?

I am forced to pay taxes far over the actual value of government services I receive isn't that enough?

What else am I obligated to do for "society"?

Am I responsible for the safety of other peoples' children?
Am I responsible for the bills and livelihood of other people?

Just what does this obligation entail?

Shouldn't it be enough that I live my life without impeding anyone else from doing the same?

Your obligation is merely to obey the laws of the land.

 

[rightwinger]

So I'm supposed to give my time and labor to "society" for free?

You have a moral obligation to the society and a legal one

Your moral obligation is met through charity, participating in your community, volunteer work, community projects
Your legal obligation is met through taxes

For some, the moral obligation is ignored and taxes are their only contribution. For others, they are not expected to contribute taxes but do fulfill their moral obligation to their community

Charity begins at home.

And your morality is not to be forced on others.

Yes charity does begin at home and is supplemented by the charity of our society

I'm afraid morality is forced on you. Whether you agree or not, your tax dollars will be used to help the homeless, the handicapped, the aged.....it is what societies do

 

[Sallow]

I have been hearing a lot from the sheep lately that we have some sort of obligation to society as a whole.

Well do we really?

I am forced to pay taxes far over the actual value of government services I receive isn't that enough?

What else am I obligated to do for "society"?

Am I responsible for the safety of other peoples' children?
Am I responsible for the bills and livelihood of other people?

Just what does this obligation entail?

Shouldn't it be enough that I live my life without impeding anyone else from doing the same?

It's in the Constitution.

You live in a country you had no hand in starting..and have no "obligation" to continue living in if you find the conditions that reprehensible.

You can find a land bereft of civilization, and start over.

Or..if you are feeling the need for bloody revolution, you can do that too. Be warned, however, that the latter has dire consequences, even for those who are successful.

Where in the consitution does it say people who make money have to support people who don't, can't, or won't?

In the preamble:

We the people of the United States, in order to form a more perfect union, establish justice, insure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

And if that's not enough it's in the powers of congress:

The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes, duties, imposts and excises, to pay the debts and provide for the common defense and general welfare of the United States; but all duties, imposts and excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;

And it's peppered with all sorts of services and ways to pay for them.

Give it a read.

 

[Skull Pilot]

You have a moral obligation to the society and a legal one

Your moral obligation is met through charity, participating in your community, volunteer work, community projects
Your legal obligation is met through taxes

For some, the moral obligation is ignored and taxes are their only contribution. For others, they are not expected to contribute taxes but do fulfill their moral obligation to their community

Charity begins at home.

And your morality is not to be forced on others.

Yes charity does begin at home and is supplemented by the charity of our society

I'm afraid morality is forced on you. Whether you agree or not, your tax dollars will be used to help the homeless, the handicapped, the aged.....it is what societies do

So then I have no obligation past the legal one.

 

[Sallow]

I have been hearing a lot from the sheep lately that we have some sort of obligation to society as a whole.

Well do we really?

I am forced to pay taxes far over the actual value of government services I receive isn't that enough?

What else am I obligated to do for "society"?

Am I responsible for the safety of other peoples' children?
Am I responsible for the bills and livelihood of other people?

Just what does this obligation entail?

Shouldn't it be enough that I live my life without impeding anyone else from doing the same?

It's in the Constitution.

You live in a country you had no hand in starting..and have no "obligation" to continue living in if you find the conditions that reprehensible.

You can find a land bereft of civilization, and start over.

Or..if you are feeling the need for bloody revolution, you can do that too. Be warned, however, that the latter has dire consequences, even for those who are successful.

so as long as we are following the constitution to the letter of the law, lets have the left back off its attacks on guns and religion.

Sure.

So long as the right keep them out of the public sphere.

Think you can stop shooting kids in the face and shoving religion up everyone's wazoo?

 

[Sallow]

The best example of what you propose is a pioneer leaving a city and going out into the wilderness to scratch out an existence without any help. You hunt, fish, grow crops and hope to feed your family

Strange thing about those pioneers is they could not wait to become states. They needed the protection from Indians, they were limited to how much they could succeed. You need a way to sell your goods. Once railroads came in there was a way to send crops and beef to the population centers for profit.

Without a society you can achieve little more than subsistence farming. With a society, your economic capabilities are boundless

Says you.

Problem being that there are nearly 7 billion people who quite probably have nearly 7 billion different descriptions as to what constitutes this "society" thingy.

I know, I know...Maybe they should just all buy islands too, huh?

Nope.

Just the ones who hate society.

 

[Skull Pilot]

It's in the Constitution.

You live in a country you had no hand in starting..and have no "obligation" to continue living in if you find the conditions that reprehensible.

You can find a land bereft of civilization, and start over.

Or..if you are feeling the need for bloody revolution, you can do that too. Be warned, however, that the latter has dire consequences, even for those who are successful.

so as long as we are following the constitution to the letter of the law, lets have the left back off its attacks on guns and religion.

Sure.

So long as the right keep them out of the public sphere.

Think you can stop shooting kids in the face and shoving religion up everyone's wazoo?

So now you have to prove that every mass shooting was committed by the so called "right" or your argument isn't worth a pile of shit.

 

[Sallow]

Where in the consitution does it say people who make money have to support people who don't, can't, or won't?

Article I, Section 8 -- The Congress shall have the power to .... levy taxes, duties and imposts .... etc etc from your pocket. and then again in Amendment 16, the Income Tax.

The Congress in all this infinite (or possibly, though not tangibly, finite) power has decided you don't really get to know what your money goes to. So, we can't answer the latter part of your question, suffice it to say that, it does.

Right...But those taxes described in article 1, Section 8, were for the purpose of providing the various de jure federal functions described elsewhere in the Constitution...Not as a mechanism to take resources from one group of individuals, and use them to feather the nests of politically favored groups and/or individuals.

“I cannot undertake to lay my finger on that article of the Constitution which granted a right to Congress of expending, on objects of benevolence, the money of their constituents.”
~James Madison

Ah..you're a fan of Madison eh?

We are free today substantially but the day will come when our Republic will be an impossibility. It will be impossibility because wealth will be concentrated in the hands of a few. A republic cannot stand upon bayonets, and when that day comes, when the wealth of the nation will be in the hands of a few, then we must rely upon the wisdom of the best elements in the country to readjust the laws of the nation to the changed conditions.
James Madison.

 

[Oddball]

You have a moral obligation to the society and a legal one

Your moral obligation is met through charity, participating in your community, volunteer work, community projects
Your legal obligation is met through taxes

For some, the moral obligation is ignored and taxes are their only contribution. For others, they are not expected to contribute taxes but do fulfill their moral obligation to their community

Charity begins at home.

And your morality is not to be forced on others.

Yes charity does begin at home and is supplemented by the charity of our society

I'm afraid morality is forced on you. Whether you agree or not, your tax dollars will be used to help the homeless, the handicapped, the aged.....it is what societies do

No, that's what looters and thugs do.

 

[Sallow]

so as long as we are following the constitution to the letter of the law, lets have the left back off its attacks on guns and religion.

Sure.

So long as the right keep them out of the public sphere.

Think you can stop shooting kids in the face and shoving religion up everyone's wazoo?

So now you have to prove that every mass shooting was committed by the so called "right" or your argument isn't worth a pile of shit.

Easy enough.

The NRA is pretty right wing. It keeps guns in the hands of psychos. The psychos shoot kids in the face.

You're welcome.

 

[Skull Pilot]

Sure.

So long as the right keep them out of the public sphere.

Think you can stop shooting kids in the face and shoving religion up everyone's wazoo?

So now you have to prove that every mass shooting was committed by the so called "right" or your argument isn't worth a pile of shit.

Easy enough.

The NRA is pretty right wing. It keeps guns in the hands of psychos. The psychos shoot kids in the face.

You're welcome.

FAIL.

The NRA did not commit any shootings.

 

[rightwinger]

Charity begins at home.

And your morality is not to be forced on others.

Yes charity does begin at home and is supplemented by the charity of our society

I'm afraid morality is forced on you. Whether you agree or not, your tax dollars will be used to help the homeless, the handicapped, the aged.....it is what societies do

So then I have no obligation past the legal one.

Thats the way it works

If you want to just pay taxes and not lift a finger to make your community a better place to live, you are free to do so

 

[rightwinger]

Charity begins at home.

And your morality is not to be forced on others.

Yes charity does begin at home and is supplemented by the charity of our society

I'm afraid morality is forced on you. Whether you agree or not, your tax dollars will be used to help the homeless, the handicapped, the aged.....it is what societies do

No, that's what looters and thugs do.

Yes it is

And when you are besieged by looters and thugs you call on society to protect you

 

[Oddball]

Yes charity does begin at home and is supplemented by the charity of our society

I'm afraid morality is forced on you. Whether you agree or not, your tax dollars will be used to help the homeless, the handicapped, the aged.....it is what societies do

No, that's what looters and thugs do.

Yes it is

And when you are besieged by looters and thugs you call on society to protect you

Not when the looters and thugs are your "society".

But thanks for the left-handed admission that you have the mindset and attitude of looters and thugs.

 

[martybegan]

Yes charity does begin at home and is supplemented by the charity of our society

I'm afraid morality is forced on you. Whether you agree or not, your tax dollars will be used to help the homeless, the handicapped, the aged.....it is what societies do

No, that's what looters and thugs do.

Yes it is

And when you are besieged by looters and thugs you call on society to protect you

And society will be there in 10-12 minutes usually. I prefer to rely on myself, and hopefully an adequate firearm.

 

[rightwinger]

No, that's what looters and thugs do.

Yes it is

And when you are besieged by looters and thugs you call on society to protect you

Not when the looters and thugs are your "society".

But thanks for the left-handed admission that you have the mindset and attitude of looters and thugs.

Ah yes..

The views of a Libertarian anarchist

 

[martybegan]

Yes charity does begin at home and is supplemented by the charity of our society

I'm afraid morality is forced on you. Whether you agree or not, your tax dollars will be used to help the homeless, the handicapped, the aged.....it is what societies do

So then I have no obligation past the legal one.

Thats the way it works

If you want to just pay taxes and not lift a finger to make your community a better place to live, you are free to do so

So its better to use the government to force people to pay for things that probably do not benefit them one bit? Why not ASK people to donate to a cause you believe in instead of using the IRS's gun at thier head to force contributions?

Forced generosity is not generosity at all.