Official USMB Mafia Game #8: Gremlins, Goblins, and Ghouls! (Oh my!)

[House]

I'd suggest reading the SK like a night vig with one way communication.

If the comply with town's consensus on who to vig, cute them. If not, lynch them.

 

[House]

Cute = cure.

 

[House]

Reading = treating

 

[CaféAuLait]

Message to the sk: If you happen to want to join town, don't use your NK because that would ultimately undermine your own win con in the long run.

I'm not sure that's true. Until the sk is cured his or her win condition is still killing anyone. And he or she could kill the scum at night.

I tend to think the serial killer outing his or herself on the hope to get cured only helps scum. Because they won't have him or her nk them and then they can kill him so we lost any advantage there is to the town

I see the SK being alive or not turned benefitting scum- Less people they all have to NK and the quicker we lose. Why would scum want to kill the SK after he or she turned, they revert to VT, right? So its just a townie then, right? They no longer possess killing abilities, or am I wrong? In my head I have been treating the SK like the usurper from last game- but this one is deadly. So in my estimation, they would want to kinda work with scum until they thought they could win the game, then start killing those they pegged as scum.

If the SK claimed and aske to be cured and the Psych cured them, they'd be confirmed town and you saw how deadly to scum confirmed town can be to scum in game 5 if they are left alive. Also, the SK is a huge threat to scum-they can kill scum at night as well as town. So scum would not want to work with them and that's why obvious SK hunting is considered a scumtell.

Oh, I was not arguing he or she should not want to be cured, and be conftown, I was thinking having the SK alive would be dangerous- since we will lose two a night, because it seemed Avatar seemed to say it would help scum for him or her to not turn. Unless I misunderstood avatars argument.

 

[House]

@mod: Does the shrink's target get notified of an action on them and by whom if it fails?

If so, the shrink shouldn't act unless they are sure.

 

[House]

Message to the sk: If you happen to want to join town, don't use your NK because that would ultimately undermine your own win con in the long run.

I'm not sure that's true. Until the sk is cured his or her win condition is still killing anyone. And he or she could kill the scum at night.

I tend to think the serial killer outing his or herself on the hope to get cured only helps scum. Because they won't have him or her nk them and then they can kill him so we lost any advantage there is to the town

I see the SK being alive or not turned benefitting scum- Less people they all have to NK and the quicker we lose. Why would scum want to kill the SK after he or she turned, they revert to VT, right? So its just a townie then, right? They no longer possess killing abilities, or am I wrong? In my head I have been treating the SK like the usurper from last game- but this one is deadly. So in my estimation, they would want to kinda work with scum until they thought they could win the game, then start killing those they pegged as scum.

If the SK claimed and aske to be cured and the Psych cured them, they'd be confirmed town and you saw how deadly to scum confirmed town can be to scum in game 5 if they are left alive. Also, the SK is a huge threat to scum-they can kill scum at night as well as town. So scum would not want to work with them and that's why obvious SK hunting is considered a scumtell.

Oh, I was not arguing he or she should not want to be cured, and be conftown, I was thinking having the SK alive would be dangerous- since we will lose two a night, because it seemed Avatar seemed to say it would help scum for him or her to not turn. Unless I misunderstood avatars argument.

Avatar is scum. Disregard him.

 

[Avatar4321]

Message to the sk: If you happen to want to join town, don't use your NK because that would ultimately undermine your own win con in the long run.

I'm not sure that's true. Until the sk is cured his or her win condition is still killing anyone. And he or she could kill the scum at night.

I tend to think the serial killer outing his or herself on the hope to get cured only helps scum. Because they won't have him or her nk them and then they can kill him so we lost any advantage there is to the town

I see the SK being alive or not turned benefitting scum- Less people they all have to NK and the quicker we lose. Why would scum want to kill the SK after he or she turned, they revert to VT, right? So its just a townie then, right? They no longer possess killing abilities, or am I wrong? In my head I have been treating the SK like the usurper from last game- but this one is deadly. So in my estimation, they would want to kinda work with scum until they thought they could win the game, then start killing those they pegged as scum.

SK can kill scum, and scum can't stand to lose as many as town.

SK is a threat to scum.

Okay, I get that. But the SK mission is to kill them and us. So when he or she targets their scum choices at first, but is wrong- We still take the hit until they get it right. And if I recall our psychologist only works on odd nights, this mean unless the SK hits scum or the scum hit the SK- we lose two off the bat night 1.

I'm fine with SK taking out Avatar. He might think twice about advocating SK hunting in the future.

so you want the serial killer to kill a townie? Odd considering you were asking him to confess to be cured.

maybe you are the serial killer and this is all a ruse to deflect attention

 

[House]

I'm not sure that's true. Until the sk is cured his or her win condition is still killing anyone. And he or she could kill the scum at night.

I tend to think the serial killer outing his or herself on the hope to get cured only helps scum. Because they won't have him or her nk them and then they can kill him so we lost any advantage there is to the town

I see the SK being alive or not turned benefitting scum- Less people they all have to NK and the quicker we lose. Why would scum want to kill the SK after he or she turned, they revert to VT, right? So its just a townie then, right? They no longer possess killing abilities, or am I wrong? In my head I have been treating the SK like the usurper from last game- but this one is deadly. So in my estimation, they would want to kinda work with scum until they thought they could win the game, then start killing those they pegged as scum.

SK can kill scum, and scum can't stand to lose as many as town.

SK is a threat to scum.

Okay, I get that. But the SK mission is to kill them and us. So when he or she targets their scum choices at first, but is wrong- We still take the hit until they get it right. And if I recall our psychologist only works on odd nights, this mean unless the SK hits scum or the scum hit the SK- we lose two off the bat night 1.

I'm fine with SK taking out Avatar. He might think twice about advocating SK hunting in the future.

so you want the serial killer to kill a townie? Odd considering you were asking him to confess to be cured.

maybe you are the serial killer and this is all a ruse to deflect attention

I rest my case.

 

[House]

I'm not sure that's true. Until the sk is cured his or her win condition is still killing anyone. And he or she could kill the scum at night.

I tend to think the serial killer outing his or herself on the hope to get cured only helps scum. Because they won't have him or her nk them and then they can kill him so we lost any advantage there is to the town

I see the SK being alive or not turned benefitting scum- Less people they all have to NK and the quicker we lose. Why would scum want to kill the SK after he or she turned, they revert to VT, right? So its just a townie then, right? They no longer possess killing abilities, or am I wrong? In my head I have been treating the SK like the usurper from last game- but this one is deadly. So in my estimation, they would want to kinda work with scum until they thought they could win the game, then start killing those they pegged as scum.

SK can kill scum, and scum can't stand to lose as many as town.

SK is a threat to scum.

Okay, I get that. But the SK mission is to kill them and us. So when he or she targets their scum choices at first, but is wrong- We still take the hit until they get it right. And if I recall our psychologist only works on odd nights, this mean unless the SK hits scum or the scum hit the SK- we lose two off the bat night 1.

I'm fine with SK taking out Avatar. He might think twice about advocating SK hunting in the future.

so you want the serial killer to kill a townie? Odd considering you were asking him to confess to be cured.

maybe you are the serial killer and this is all a ruse to deflect attention

If you truly believed that, your post would have included a vote, as much of a hard-on as you have for the sk.

You want to paint me as lynch bait and hope others start the wagon, leaving your hands clean.

Scum.

 

[Wolfsister77]

Message to the sk: If you happen to want to join town, don't use your NK because that would ultimately undermine your own win con in the long run.

I'm not sure that's true. Until the sk is cured his or her win condition is still killing anyone. And he or she could kill the scum at night.

I tend to think the serial killer outing his or herself on the hope to get cured only helps scum. Because they won't have him or her nk them and then they can kill him so we lost any advantage there is to the town

I see the SK being alive or not turned benefitting scum- Less people they all have to NK and the quicker we lose. Why would scum want to kill the SK after he or she turned, they revert to VT, right? So its just a townie then, right? They no longer possess killing abilities, or am I wrong? In my head I have been treating the SK like the usurper from last game- but this one is deadly. So in my estimation, they would want to kinda work with scum until they thought they could win the game, then start killing those they pegged as scum.

If the SK claimed and aske to be cured and the Psych cured them, they'd be confirmed town and you saw how deadly to scum confirmed town can be to scum in game 5 if they are left alive. Also, the SK is a huge threat to scum-they can kill scum at night as well as town. So scum would not want to work with them and that's why obvious SK hunting is considered a scumtell.

Oh, I was not arguing he or she should not want to be cured, and be conftown, I was thinking having the SK alive would be dangerous- since we will lose two a night, because it seemed Avatar seemed to say it would help scum for him or her to not turn. Unless I misunderstood avatars argument.

I had to read his response a couple times and you are right. He seems to think the SK not turning helps scum. It most assuredly does not help scum. SK can kill scum if not turned. What threat are they to scum cured? They are a VT at that point. And the Psych becomes VT also.

Something else we should be hunting is the vampire. Scum will want to find and recruit that persona and if they do, if the SK is still alive, town is screwed. Almost as screwed as they would be if the JOAT died. Another thing I'm surprised by is there isn't a back-up JOAT to take over the remainder of the abilities if the original dies.

Yeah, you are also right about the Psych only working odd nights. So at the end of the day, we should put up who we want the Psych to target, who we want the Cop or Dr. to target and hope for the best.

 

[House]

Scum will be more likely to kill the psych target and less likely to kill the doc target.

The only way to do it safely would be to both protect and cure the same person

 

[Grandma]

I had to read his response a couple times and you are right. He seems to think the SK not turning helps scum. It most assuredly does not help scum. SK can kill scum if not turned. What threat are they to scum cured? They are a VT at that point. And the Psych becomes VT also.

Something else we should be hunting is the vampire. Scum will want to find and recruit that persona and if they do, if the SK is still alive, town is screwed. Almost as screwed as they would be if the JOAT died. Another thing I'm surprised by is there isn't a back-up JOAT to take over the remainder of the abilities if the original dies.

Yeah, you are also right about the Psych only working odd nights. So at the end of the day, we should put up who we want the Psych to target, who we want the Cop or Dr. to target and hope for the best.

Okay. The Shrink is basically a Vanilla Townie anyway - all he/she can do PR-wise is convert the SK.

With the SK as SK there will be 2 kills each Night, unless Scum get lucky and kill the SK or the SK gets VERY lucky and kills both Scum over 2 Nights. Most likely it'll be Townies that end up dead.

With the SK as converted Townie, Town has an extra expendable member AND an extra vote, with the bonus of 1 less kill per Night.

It's possible but not likely that the SK will endgame, so SK as SK is pretty much a suicide role.

I think a claim an conversion are in order.

Also, Wolf, "we should put up who we want the Psych to target, who we want the Cop or Dr. to target and hope for the best" kinda bugs me. I'd like to think that the PRs can decide for themselves in the first place, in the second, "we," at least this early in the Game, includes Scum.

 

[Grandma]

I think a claim and conversion are in order.

 

[Grandma]

Certainly a third Scumteam member is not a good thing for Town, but in the case of the Vampire, it's nearly useless for Scum.

The Vampire has Night Talk in the QT, but no kill powers, and he/she cannot Endgame on his/her own:

If recruited, you will have Night Talk with the Ghouls, and if both Ghouls are lynched, you commit Suicide.
Investigation results on you will always return Town.
Win Condition:
Your win condition depends upon your alignment at the end of the game.
If not targeted for a Night Kill, your alignment and win condition is Town - You win when all threats to the town have been eliminated.
If recruited by the Ghouls, you win when the Ghouls obtain a majority or nothing can prevent this from occuring.

 

[Grandma]

So, Serial Killer, confess and have a much better chance of winning, and everyone focus on finding the 2 ScumGhouls.

AyeCantSeeYou - Are the players notified if the Vampire changes alliances?

 

[House]

Okay, so here is the plan if SK wants to join forces and fight together against scum:

SK claims
Doctor protects SK tonight
Psych cures SK

SK becomes conf town.

Job done.

 

[House]

And I will personally rl lynch anybody that tries to wagon the sk after claiming.

 

[House]

Those who agree with the plan to convert the sk if they claim, please post:

If I am doctor, I will protect the sk.
If I am psyche, I will cure the sk.


Those that don't post: that is a scum claim, as this plan benefits town in a way that scum can't prevent as long as it is done N1.

 

[House]

If I am doctor, I will protect the sk.
If I am psyche, I will cure the sk.

 

[CaféAuLait]

Certainly a third Scumteam member is not a good thing for Town, but in the case of the Vampire, it's nearly useless for Scum.

The Vampire has Night Talk in the QT, but no kill powers, and he/she cannot Endgame on his/her own:

If recruited, you will have Night Talk with the Ghouls, and if both Ghouls are lynched, you commit Suicide.
Investigation results on you will always return Town.
Win Condition:
Your win condition depends upon your alignment at the end of the game.
If not targeted for a Night Kill, your alignment and win condition is Town - You win when all threats to the town have been eliminated.
If recruited by the Ghouls, you win when the Ghouls obtain a majority or nothing can prevent this from occuring.

I am unsure if I see the vampire being totally "useless to scum" TBH, it gives scum one more in numbers to outnumber us for a win and one more person trying to confuse us, wagon and vote for lynches with scum and create havoc and distrust amongst us.