On the GOP

[Antares]

Too funny, the Leftwing solution to save the Repub Party is to have it become more like them...yeah...you just can't make this shit up.

 

[The T]

No, not all unions are bad, but all union bosses are corrupt. Well maybe I should say almost all since I don't know them all.

Immie

UNIONS are vehicles for extortion...and have long outlived their usefulness...

depends on where you work.....some places still need it.....the PO for one....

Perhaps, I won't dispute microcosms...I am speaking generally...there are laws now that supercede the need for Unions...

 

[Antares]

Also, the $110.9 million payment to Ed Hanway at Cigna is a little deceptive. You can see the breakdown of his compensation here.

http://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/d...def14a.htm#dy41601_summary_compensation_table

Of that, $28 million was in a pension plan which he built up and will be paid out over time, and deferred compensation of $49 million, which he built up over time. $15 million was in the exercise of stock options that he also built up over time. $14 million is also the exercise of what Cigna calls "SPUs," or Strategic Participating Units, which is also deferred incentive compensation built up over time.

Now, I do think this is excessive, and I do think CEOs are over-paid. However, this is $110.9 million figure is not the firm arbitrarily writing a check to the CEO to go away those enveloped in envy like JoseifB131 would like you to believe.

So, you admit that it's excessive, but gosh darn, if I criticize it without making a bunch of moronic qualifications, I must be a "Marxist". Yeah. That's it. Maybe I'm just a person who sees an immorale act and calls people on it.

Here's the thing, regardless of how he broke it down, here's why he got it.

Beause people like Natline Sarkisyan were denied life saving treatments AFTER they had paid good money for premiums. IN short, they paid into a system and were cheated.

Now, yeah, maybe you have to draw lines, but frankly, the line should not be drawn at, "I might not get my Dressage Horsie if she gets her liver transplant."

immorale

For a spelling Nazi you pretty much suck Joe.

 

[Antares]

Don't know. Less than it is now. It's simply not okay that insurance companies increase their profit margins by denying you the care you've paid for. It's not okay that we can't negotiate drug prices. It's simply not okay that, as a country, we pay the most, but do not have the best outcomes.

What profit margin would you "allow" in education? What profit margin would you "allow" in the Defense of our nation? Not having equal access to our healthcare system kills more Americans every year than terrorists. How much profit should be in saving lives?

you didn't answer my question and asking me questions on other issues ( I don't recognize any analogy here that works either) is a side issue, I didn't bring it up, 1 thing at a time please.

you said-

too much profit built in at every level,

if you cannot or will not quantify that beyond an emotional basis, we cannot have an intelligent conversation.

And I said I didn't know, just not as much as it is now. The health of a nation shouldn't be profit driven in my opinion.

Why isn't health analogous with defense? Aren't you defending against death and disease?

Our healthcare system simply doesn't work. We pay the most so you'd think we have the best outcomes, but we don't. We're talking about something that is a HUGE chunk of our GDP and it isn't working for the consumers or the taxpayers.

Know what would be great for the consumer? A public option available in every state's Exchange...something like...oh...Medicare...with it's super low overhead and no need to advertise every 30 seconds on television. Toss that up there next to some of the other plans and watch prices come down. Mix in the ability for Medicare to negotiate drug prices like the VA does (and the whole frickin' country of Canada) and you have a happier consumer.

Medicare has the highest Claim Denial rate of any of the major carriers.

So you go ahead and run with your silliness.

Denials

 

[Dot Com]

UNIONS are vehicles for extortion...and have long outlived their usefulness...

depends on where you work.....some places still need it.....the PO for one....

Perhaps, I won't dispute microcosms...I am speaking generally...there are laws now that supercede the need for Unions...

enforced by who exactly? Do you think the dept of labor, OSHA, EPA, the EEOC, or SEC regulators are hives of activity during a Repub admin? Surely you jest?

 

[Immanuel]

Too funny, the Leftwing solution to save the Repub Party is to have it become more like them...yeah...you just can't make this shit up.

Yes you can... read the thread it is proof that you can

Immie

 

[The T]

depends on where you work.....some places still need it.....the PO for one....

Perhaps, I won't dispute microcosms...I am speaking generally...there are laws now that supercede the need for Unions...

enforced by who exactly? Do you think the dept of labor, OSHA, EPA, the EEOC, or SEC regulators are hives of activity during a Repub admin? Surely you jest?

WHY does Gubmint need to be involved exactly? YOU either stay employed by your talent/expertise...or get let go. That simple.

Big Gubmint goon/cheerleader are you?

 

[Seawytch]

you said there was "too much profit built in at every level" , now, its there should be no profit.....you could have just said so 3 posts ago, or maybe its becasue you've been given proof the mantra of 'insane profits' or "doctors would rather cut off legs for $50,000 than take care of a diabetic" ( thank you Mr. President) is inarguably false.....

I don't need you to tell me what the health care costs are here, or prosing silly emotionally charged questions, your posts are all over the place, I asked you a question, thx for the answer after multiple attempts, even if its a contradiction to your original remark.

Health Care

Why Our Health Care Lets Prices Run Wild

from your first link.......

Doctors and hospitals practice “defensive medicine,” critics charge, ordering extraneous tests and procedures to protect themselves in the event of malpractice claims. This leads to overuse of the health care system.

whose fault is that?.....

A number of states have enacted Tort reform and limit malpractice suits. Has it reduced costs in those states?

 

[Toro]

Also, the $110.9 million payment to Ed Hanway at Cigna is a little deceptive. You can see the breakdown of his compensation here.

http://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/d...def14a.htm#dy41601_summary_compensation_table

Of that, $28 million was in a pension plan which he built up and will be paid out over time, and deferred compensation of $49 million, which he built up over time. $15 million was in the exercise of stock options that he also built up over time. $14 million is also the exercise of what Cigna calls "SPUs," or Strategic Participating Units, which is also deferred incentive compensation built up over time.

Now, I do think this is excessive, and I do think CEOs are over-paid. However, this is $110.9 million figure is not the firm arbitrarily writing a check to the CEO to go away those enveloped in envy like JoseifB131 would like you to believe.

So, you admit that it's excessive, but gosh darn, if I criticize it without making a bunch of moronic qualifications, I must be a "Marxist". Yeah. That's it. Maybe I'm just a person who sees an immorale act and calls people on it.

Here's the thing, regardless of how he broke it down, here's why he got it.

Beause people like Natline Sarkisyan were denied life saving treatments AFTER they had paid good money for premiums. IN short, they paid into a system and were cheated.

Now, yeah, maybe you have to draw lines, but frankly, the line should not be drawn at, "I might not get my Dressage Horsie if she gets her liver transplant."

No, you're a Marxist because you think capitalism is treason and evil, investing is parasitic, offshoring is treason and CEOs who do it should be hung, the 1% is the enemy, all wealth is stolen, and there should be an equal division of wealth.

Did I forget anything?

If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck ...

 

[dblack]

Here's the thing, regardless of how he broke it down, here's why he got it.

Beause people like Natline Sarkisyan were denied life saving treatments AFTER they had paid good money for premiums. IN short, they paid into a system and were cheated.

This rationalization is stunning in its sheer hypocrisy. The solution to deal with insurance companies ripping people off is to force everyone to buy insurance???

 

[JoeB131]

Also, the $110.9 million payment to Ed Hanway at Cigna is a little deceptive. You can see the breakdown of his compensation here.

http://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/d...def14a.htm#dy41601_summary_compensation_table

Of that, $28 million was in a pension plan which he built up and will be paid out over time, and deferred compensation of $49 million, which he built up over time. $15 million was in the exercise of stock options that he also built up over time. $14 million is also the exercise of what Cigna calls "SPUs," or Strategic Participating Units, which is also deferred incentive compensation built up over time.

Now, I do think this is excessive, and I do think CEOs are over-paid. However, this is $110.9 million figure is not the firm arbitrarily writing a check to the CEO to go away those enveloped in envy like JoseifB131 would like you to believe.

So, you admit that it's excessive, but gosh darn, if I criticize it without making a bunch of moronic qualifications, I must be a "Marxist". Yeah. That's it. Maybe I'm just a person who sees an immorale act and calls people on it.

Here's the thing, regardless of how he broke it down, here's why he got it.

Beause people like Natline Sarkisyan were denied life saving treatments AFTER they had paid good money for premiums. IN short, they paid into a system and were cheated.

Now, yeah, maybe you have to draw lines, but frankly, the line should not be drawn at, "I might not get my Dressage Horsie if she gets her liver transplant."

immorale

For a spelling Nazi you pretty much suck Joe.

Your inability to refute the argument is duly noted.

 

[Antares]

So, you admit that it's excessive, but gosh darn, if I criticize it without making a bunch of moronic qualifications, I must be a "Marxist". Yeah. That's it. Maybe I'm just a person who sees an immorale act and calls people on it.

Here's the thing, regardless of how he broke it down, here's why he got it.

Beause people like Natline Sarkisyan were denied life saving treatments AFTER they had paid good money for premiums. IN short, they paid into a system and were cheated.

Now, yeah, maybe you have to draw lines, but frankly, the line should not be drawn at, "I might not get my Dressage Horsie if she gets her liver transplant."

immorale

For a spelling Nazi you pretty much suck Joe.

You're inability to refute the argument is duly noted.

Poor Joe.....

 

[Dot Com]

Also, the $110.9 million payment to Ed Hanway at Cigna is a little deceptive. You can see the breakdown of his compensation here.

http://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/d...def14a.htm#dy41601_summary_compensation_table

Of that, $28 million was in a pension plan which he built up and will be paid out over time, and deferred compensation of $49 million, which he built up over time. $15 million was in the exercise of stock options that he also built up over time. $14 million is also the exercise of what Cigna calls "SPUs," or Strategic Participating Units, which is also deferred incentive compensation built up over time.

Now, I do think this is excessive, and I do think CEOs are over-paid. However, this is $110.9 million figure is not the firm arbitrarily writing a check to the CEO to go away those enveloped in envy like JoseifB131 would like you to believe.

So, you admit that it's excessive, but gosh darn, if I criticize it without making a bunch of moronic qualifications, I must be a "Marxist". Yeah. That's it. Maybe I'm just a person who sees an immorale act and calls people on it.

Here's the thing, regardless of how he broke it down, here's why he got it.

Beause people like Natline Sarkisyan were denied life saving treatments AFTER they had paid good money for premiums. IN short, they paid into a system and were cheated.

Now, yeah, maybe you have to draw lines, but frankly, the line should not be drawn at, "I might not get my Dressage Horsie if she gets her liver transplant."

No, you're a Marxist because you think capitalism is treason and evil, investing is parasitic, offshoring is treason and CEOs who do it should be hung, the 1% is the enemy, all wealth is stolen, and there should be an equal division of wealth.

Did I forget anything?

If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck ...

what do you think about the German model of CEO compensation & their req't that line workers also get a seat at the board table?

BTW- do you REALLY think we have capitalism as opposed to corporate cronyism & outright theivery/fraud by some in banking. I was going to say "commercial" banking but that isn't req'd as Graham (R) Leach (R) Bliley (R) repealed the "wall of seperation" w/ their bill.

 

[JoeB131]

[

No, you're a Marxist because you think capitalism is treason and evil, investing is parasitic, offshoring is treason and CEOs who do it should be hung, the 1% is the enemy, all wealth is stolen, and there should be an equal division of wealth.

Did I forget anything?

If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck ...

"and he's bigoted against Mormons, too.... waaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhh".

Because, hey, if you are going to whine about everything that offended your precious little sensibilities over the last two years, you can't leave that out.



How is offshoring NOT treason?

How is the 1% not the enemy? They certainly aren't my friends, therefore they must be the enemy.

Incidently,I think there should a FAIR distribution of wealth. So do most Americans. What saves you guys is people don't realize how skewed the numbers are.

 

[Toro]

[

No, you're a Marxist because you think capitalism is treason and evil, investing is parasitic, offshoring is treason and CEOs who do it should be hung, the 1% is the enemy, all wealth is stolen, and there should be an equal division of wealth.

Did I forget anything?

If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck ...

"and he's bigoted against Mormons, too.... waaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhh".

Because, hey, if you are going to whine about everything that offended your precious little sensibilities over the last two years, you can't leave that out.



How is offshoring NOT treason?

How is the 1% not the enemy? They certainly aren't my friends, therefore they must be the enemy.

Incidently,I think there should a FAIR distribution of wealth. So do most Americans. What saves you guys is people don't realize how skewed the numbers are.

^^^^^^

And dude, go see a shrink about your anger issues. Seriously.

 

[Toro]

So, you admit that it's excessive, but gosh darn, if I criticize it without making a bunch of moronic qualifications, I must be a "Marxist". Yeah. That's it. Maybe I'm just a person who sees an immorale act and calls people on it.

Here's the thing, regardless of how he broke it down, here's why he got it.

Beause people like Natline Sarkisyan were denied life saving treatments AFTER they had paid good money for premiums. IN short, they paid into a system and were cheated.

Now, yeah, maybe you have to draw lines, but frankly, the line should not be drawn at, "I might not get my Dressage Horsie if she gets her liver transplant."

No, you're a Marxist because you think capitalism is treason and evil, investing is parasitic, offshoring is treason and CEOs who do it should be hung, the 1% is the enemy, all wealth is stolen, and there should be an equal division of wealth.

Did I forget anything?

If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck ...

what do you think about the German model of CEO compensation & their req't that line workers also get a seat at the board table?

BTW- do you REALLY think we have capitalism as opposed to corporate cronyism & outright theivery/fraud by some in banking. I was going to say "commercial" banking but that isn't req'd as Graham (R) Leach (R) Bliley (R) repealed the "wall of seperation" w/ their bill.

I prefer the Scandinavian model where shareholders dominate the boards and are on the compensation committee.

American corporate governance sucks.

 

[JoeB131]

[

I prefer the Scandinavian model where shareholders dominate the boards and are on the compensation committee.

American corporate governance sucks.

Unless I criticize it, in which case it's A-O-K by you.

"Waaaaah, he hates Mormons!!!!"

 

[JoeB131]

[

And dude, go see a shrink about your anger issues. Seriously.

Guy, I'm the nicest person in the world. You talk to anyone who knows me IRL, they'll tell you what a nice guy I am.

They know I have strong political opinions, so they tend to avoid that subject with me. (And that was the case when I was on the right. Don't do anything by half measures.)

But if you are on my shitlist, you probably did something to deserve it.

You know, like belong to a cult started by pedophiles or wrecked the American economy. You know, some really shitty behavior.

 

[Harry Dresden]

UNIONS are vehicles for extortion...and have long outlived their usefulness...

depends on where you work.....some places still need it.....the PO for one....

Perhaps, I won't dispute microcosms...I am speaking generally...there are laws now that supercede the need for Unions...

your right....but if the company does what they can to skirt around them,you are kinda stuck..........and OSHA and The Dept of Labor and the PO are all fellow Federal offices.....if there is a complaint and one of them call the PO to inquire about it.....the PO tells them we are looking in to it.....oh ok,well then talk to you later.....this will go on and on UNTIL the UNIONS start making some noise....then it gets taken care of....

 

[Dot Com]

[

No, you're a Marxist because you think capitalism is treason and evil, investing is parasitic, offshoring is treason and CEOs who do it should be hung, the 1% is the enemy, all wealth is stolen, and there should be an equal division of wealth.

Did I forget anything?

If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck ...

"and he's bigoted against Mormons, too.... waaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhh".

Because, hey, if you are going to whine about everything that offended your precious little sensibilities over the last two years, you can't leave that out.



How is offshoring NOT treason?

How is the 1% not the enemy? They certainly aren't my friends, therefore they must be the enemy.

Incidently,I think there should a FAIR distribution of wealth. So do most Americans. What saves you guys is people don't realize how skewed the numbers are.

good point. This is from my Krugman thread:

His 2 1/2 min closing argument here:

Paul Krugman - C-SPAN Video Library

what the wealth distribution is
what people think it is
what people would like it to be