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Pastor Benny Hinn Confronts False Teacher Joel Osteen Publicly. This is how you expose a false teacher! Watch this!
BENNY HINN CONFRONTS JOEL OSTEEN & OPRAH Larry King - YouTube
Benny Hinn in his own words. Perhaps the Bible scholars here might find some really REALLY strange interpretations of the scriptures.
God uses people as HE chooses, both the great, powerful, and wealthy and the humble, poor, and presumably poorly equipped for his purposes. I am taking nothing away from Geisler, who may indeed be a true servant of the Lord, and who the Lord may be using to the fullest of his spiritual gifts, when I say that he may not be the last word as to what any of us are called to believe or do in the service of the Lord.
Question and comment for Chuck and Jeri
Here is the question - I feel as if I have totally missed something here. Why are people lopping Foxfyre's head off? Will someone tell me succinctly what makes you think he/she/they is a false teacher? I'm not seeing it. This is not an idle question - this whole posting series has me scratching my head wondering how it got derailed.
Comment for Chuck:
Chuck, you said a few things to me and I'd like to reply:
You said:
Love someone? Yes. Recognition for someone? No.
When I read that, I thought of the prodigal son story.
The terms of friendship is that relationships are reciprocol or complimentary.
I see. Is that how you found God? You established a reciprocal relationship with Him? Or did he reach for you before you ever even thought about Him? I have always believed that God reached for me and since he did, I open and reach to others - He is my example.
I can say absolutely with strong conviction that the Son is God because he said that he was. So if he is not, then Jesus of Nazareth was delusional and a false prophet himself and faith in him would be of no value to anybody.
Who gets to determine who are the false teachers, the false witnesses, and/or the false prophets? Where do those doing the determining get their authority?
Well, thanks for the passionate reply, Chuck. I sincerely appreciate it. It sounds as if you have worked very hard to achieve what you have achieved and you also sound totally sincere in your commitment to it.
I only have one comment.
Your statement above about you 'can't believe I bought into baloney'? I don't really know anything about Rick Warren, etc. Never read his books; never heard him preach. I would just like you to know that the only thing I am bought into? Is God and His son, Jesus Christ. That's it - he reached for me - a very undeserving person - and has renewed my mind and soul with his light and love. I don't really want to do anything but live in a way that shares that with others. I agree that repentance is a part of that package, but I believe the transformation caused by the Holy Spirit - which does not happen over night - creates the drive for the repentance. "Be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind...."
I'm sorry that stance has created a source of tension for you - but I don't have much else to give people.
I'm willing to address it Fox, if that's ok.. We believe that we get our authority from our Father, and our Savior, Christ. Not to accuse or condemn, but to let others know what we believe will change their life both here and for eternity, and the possibilities the future holds.
We are not to judge or curse those who teach or preach or witness falsely, That is not our job. We are to discern through God's Holy Spirit what is true and what is not, address the false doctrine that leads away from Christ, and expose the person doing it. It makes the teacher/preacher aware of his error (for his sake) and prevents his flock from being lead astray. Rick Warren is a perfect example. He built up a following based on Christ and is now leading them to a new new direction of a concocted "Chrislam." Christians have an obligation to point chrislam out as a corruption and an apostasy.
In other words, we are to scream at the top of our lungs when we see you in danger. It is our obligation to our family, and our service to our Father, through Christ.
Pace, you are leaning on your own understanding. It isn't an individual determining what false prophets may be. God clearly establishes the criteria, for preaching, teaching, and witnessing, and the results of relying on self to try to rewrite what He already knows and has shared.
Do you reinterpret Bach, or Plato, or the Constitution?
As a student of music, yes, Bach MUST be interpreted or it will be played badly. I have taught college level classes on the teachings of Plato and he too absolutely must be interpreted or he will be more misunderstood than he usually is anyway. And my goodness gracious, are you seriously suggesting that the Constitution must not be interpreted?
It is HOW such interpretation is done--the integrity to understand original intent--that is the issue.
Is Bach interpreted in a way to be faithful to HIS intention of how his music should be played? Not as how we might prefer it sound?
Is Plato interpreted as he most likely intended within his culture and experience? Not as what we might think he meant through our eyes?
Is the Constitution interpreted as the Founders intended it as we are informed by the extensive writings and documents they left for us? Not as we might wish it said.
For me the Bible must be approached in the same way. For me, true Bible study is to see through the eyes of those who wrote it. Not what we wish the Bible said but what they actually intended.
But you did not answer my question please. What did I specifically say that compels you to think I am in danger?
Deuteronomy 12:32 “Whatever I command you, be careful to observe it; you shall not add to it nor take away from it.”
Proverbs 30:5-6 “Every word of God is pure; he is a shield to those who put their trust in Him. Do not add to His words, lest He rebuke you, and you be found a liar.”
The era, the conditions under which it was said are irrelevant. <That's a history lesson. God's word is the same yesterday and today and tomorrow.1 Cor. 4:6 “that you may learn in us not to think beyond what is written, that none of you may be puffed up on behalf of one against the other.”
I can say absolutely with strong conviction that the Son is God because he said that he was. So if he is not, then Jesus of Nazareth was delusional and a false prophet himself and faith in him would be of no value to anybody.
Who gets to determine who are the false teachers, the false witnesses, and/or the false prophets? Where do those doing the determining get their authority?
I suppose it would be to much to ask, if JC had rather been Chosen by God as an example - for his being a sinless man than the Biblical interpretation, would he still not have been a Prophet by his own right irregardless his delusions and by the sacrifice he willingly made on the Cross on behalf of the wishes of the Almighty ?
I don't really know anything about Rick Warren, etc. Never read his books; never heard him preach. I would just like you to know that the only thing I am bought into? Is God and His son, Jesus Christ.
Pastor Benny Hinn Confronts False Teacher Joel Osteen Publicly. This is how you expose a false teacher! Watch this!
BENNY HINN CONFRONTS JOEL OSTEEN & OPRAH Larry King - YouTube
Benny Hinn in his own words. Perhaps the Bible scholars here might find some really REALLY strange interpretations of the scriptures.
Just remember your words:
God uses people as HE chooses, both the great, powerful, and wealthy and the humble, poor, and presumably poorly equipped for his purposes. I am taking nothing away from Geisler, who may indeed be a true servant of the Lord, and who the Lord may be using to the fullest of his spiritual gifts, when I say that he may not be the last word as to what any of us are called to believe or do in the service of the Lord.
http://www.usmessageboard.com/relig...-teachers-faith-and-reason-3.html#post7934222
I believe some people are put there for a reason. Some people are an aid to faith.
I'm willing to address it Fox, if that's ok.. We believe that we get our authority from our Father, and our Savior, Christ. Not to accuse or condemn, but to let others know what we believe will change their life both here and for eternity, and the possibilities the future holds.
We are not to judge or curse those who teach or preach or witness falsely, That is not our job. We are to discern through God's Holy Spirit what is true and what is not, address the false doctrine that leads away from Christ, and expose the person doing it. It makes the teacher/preacher aware of his error (for his sake) and prevents his flock from being lead astray. Rick Warren is a perfect example. He built up a following based on Christ and is now leading them to a new new direction of a concocted "Chrislam." Christians have an obligation to point chrislam out as a corruption and an apostasy.
In other words, we are to scream at the top of our lungs when we see you in danger. It is our obligation to our family, and our service to our Father, through Christ.
Pace, you are leaning on your own understanding. It isn't an individual determining what false prophets may be. God clearly establishes the criteria, for preaching, teaching, and witnessing, and the results of relying on self to try to rewrite what He already knows and has shared.
Do you reinterpret Bach, or Plato, or the Constitution?
As a student of music, yes, Bach MUST be interpreted or it will be played badly. I have taught college level classes on the teachings of Plato and he too absolutely must be interpreted or he will be more misunderstood than he usually is anyway. And my goodness gracious, are you seriously suggesting that the Constitution must not be interpreted?
It is HOW such interpretation is done--the integrity to understand original intent--that is the issue.
Is Bach interpreted in a way to be faithful to HIS intention of how his music should be played? Not as how we might prefer it sound?
Is Plato interpreted as he most likely intended within his culture and experience? Not as what we might think he meant through our eyes?
Is the Constitution interpreted as the Founders intended it as we are informed by the extensive writings and documents they left for us? Not as we might wish it said.
For me the Bible must be approached in the same way. For me, true Bible study is to see through the eyes of those who wrote it. Not what we wish the Bible said but what they actually intended.
But you did not answer my question please. What did I specifically say that compels you to think I am in danger?
Regardless of how it's done what you end up with is Bach according to Foxfyre, Plato according to Foxfyre, and a Constitution according to Foxfyre. Then there's what Plato meant according to teacher Bob, and Frank, and Connie..... Your credentials are nice, but I'd kind of like to hear what Plato thought. Did Bach know how badly he sounded before you and other critics were born? What if Connie's a little tone deaf? Is her interpretation valid just because she studied Bach? Would Bach think so?
Why would you look to a creation of God's for insight when you have the Creator? If you are looking through their eyes, you aren't looking through the Holy Spirit's eyes, and He was the one guiding their steps, and the one that guided the formation of the Bible. If the author's eyes were on Christ, why would yours be on Timothy's? And not even on what Timothy said, but what you think Timothy meant when he said............
God said not to add to or take away from what the Bible says. Eve interpreted what God said while chatting with Satan. By adding 6 little words, her interpretation of what God meant regarding the tree, got us all kicked out of Eden. Her interpretation was wrong, and costly.
This is much safer:
Here He tells us why. Our opinions may not be correct:
Proverbs 30:5-6 Every word of God is pure; he is a shield to those who put their trust in Him. Do not add to His words, lest He rebuke you, and you be found a liar.
Here is a man you have your eyes on telling us flat out:
The era, the conditions under which it was said are irrelevant. <That's a history lesson. God's word is the same yesterday and today and tomorrow.1 Cor. 4:6 that you may learn in us not to think beyond what is written, that none of you may be puffed up on behalf of one against the other.
It is our difference of opinions that pits us against one another, not God's word, and differences of opinions that have fractured the Christian church. Dogma is the result.
I missed you asking that question about what danger I think you might be in. I was speaking in general of any sister or brother that a Christian might be worried about. We are our brother's keeper.
God commanded, love thy neighbor as thyself. He did not put any stipulations on it. It would be a selfish God who would command we love only those who reciprocate their love. I interpret the commandment to mean love thy fellow man in the sense we value and appreciate our fellow beings.The terms of friendship is that relationships are reciprocol or complimentary.
I would appreciate your input, FoxFire. Count me in as one who very much enjoys reading your thoughts on these subjects.
¶Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy.
But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;
That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.
For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same?
And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so? (Matthew 5:43-47)
Let he who is without sin, cast the first stone.
God commanded, love thy neighbor as thyself. He did not put any stipulations on it. It would be a selfish God who would command we love only those who reciprocate their love. I interpret the commandment to mean love thy fellow man in the sense we value and appreciate our fellow beings.The terms of friendship is that relationships are reciprocol or complimentary.
I would appreciate your input, FoxFire. Count me in as one who very much enjoys reading your thoughts on these subjects.
You are correct. God didn't put any stipulations on it. In fact, He went even further:
¶Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy.
But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;
That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.
For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same?
And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so? (Matthew 5:43-47)
This commandments is very difficult. But I think love grows when we pray for the other person. So If anyone wants to live this commandment think of the person who is your enemy and you dislike the most in the world. And pray to the Lord that you might feel His love for them.
My humble advice.
While I was reading the posts in this thread a thought occured to me concerning authority. It seems to me that if you have to appeal to the Bible for authority, then by default you are admitting you have no authority from God.
Now this may sound extremely controversial, but as the thought occured to me I knew immediately that it was true. Because those who have been given authority from God have it independent of the scriptures. They will cite the scriptures because the testimony of previously authorized servants of the Lord is sacred and will help in persuading others to a life of edification and discipleship with Jesus Christ. But their authority doesn't come from the scriptures. Quite the opposite, the authority of the scriptures comes from those who have been authorized to teach the word.
Why do we revere the teachings of Moses? Because He told us what the scriptures say? No. It's because the Lord authorized Moses to speak on His behalf. His teachings then became scriptures.
The same with all the Apostles and Prophets. Their writings became scriptures because they were given authority from God. They did not derive their authority from the scriptures.
We are told that the Pharisees strictly followed the scriptures. They would quote their authority for much of what they did. And yet they missed the Lord who called those Prophets they claimed to follow when He was right in front of them. And we are told in the scriptures that what made Jesus unique is "He taught as one having authority not like the scribes and pharisees." And we know the Pharisees appealed to the scriptures.
I fear that many have a danger of making the scriptures a false idol. The Bible is their god instead of the God who inspired the Bible.
Search your hearts and make sure you are true with the Lord.
I can say absolutely with strong conviction that the Son is God because he said that he was. So if he is not, then Jesus of Nazareth was delusional and a false prophet himself and faith in him would be of no value to anybody.
I suppose it would be to much to ask, if JC had rather been Chosen by God as an example - for his being a sinless man than the Biblical interpretation, would he still not have been a Prophet by his own right irregardless his delusions and by the sacrifice he willingly made on the Cross on behalf of the wishes of the Almighty ?
You know, I don't know BW. I long ago chose not to dictate to God how he is required to do anything and believe whatever He chooses to do is possible. But if we stick to what the prophecies inform us, the scriptural eye witness testimonies and what Jesus said about himself, he was God, he was fulfillment of prophecy and the Law. As the man Jesus, he was teacher/rabbi and prophet, he was the perfect Lamb of God who gave his life to cover our sins, he was crucified, died, was buried, he rose again, and he is with us as counselor, in spirit form, forever. So 'chosen by God' is not really an option in my belief.
Jeremiah: ...There is only one way. Not many, Loa. Jesus is the Way, the Truth and the Life and no man comes to the Father except through the Son.
Foxfyre: So 'chosen by God' is not really an option in my belief.
Remittance is accomplished by each individual and may have but one path to follow - but that path has nothing to do with an individual of a previous existence JC - nor does a Spirit necessarily ever need a presence with God as being only a foolish connotation of indulgent worshiping.
.
