Poll: Majority of Democrats and Republicans support Medicare for all

[Lesh]

exactly, what they also forget is that the huge new government agency to administer it would have to be funded.

That agency is already in place

We already HAVE Medicare

 

[Redfish]

exactly, what they also forget is that the huge new government agency to administer it would have to be funded.

That agency is already in place

We already HAVE Medicare

not to handle 330,000,000 people. there would have to be a huge expansion and staffing increase.

 

[JoeB131]

While I agree with your thoughts there is no way that Medicare for all and especially single payer could be payed for by someone else. A conservative estimate was 3.2 Trillion a year for Medicare for all. Single payer would be even higher. That is equal to every penny taken in by taxes last year.

Some have been the mistaken idea that they should get things for free but they do not realize that nothing is free.

I agree. It has to be paid for.

We already spend 19% of our GDP on health care while the rest of the industrialized world with single payer pays anywhere from 8-11%.

Except they cover everyone, they have longer life expectancies and lower infant mortality rates, and bankruptcy due to medical crisis isn't a thing. (As opposed to the US, where 62% of bankruptcies are due to medical crisis.)

 

[Lesh]

A conservative estimate was 3.2 Trillion a year for Medicare for all

Ummm...it's a "conservative" estimate ONLY in that it was an estimate made by a conservative.

a true conservative estimate is 1/3 of that

How expensive would a single-payer system be?

 

[Lesh]

exactly, what they also forget is that the huge new government agency to administer it would have to be funded.

That agency is already in place

We already HAVE Medicare

not to handle 330,000,000 people. there would have to be a huge expansion and staffing increase.

So they wouldn't be creating an agency as you claimed...they would simply expand the existing.

That's something quite different

 

[Redfish]

exactly, what they also forget is that the huge new government agency to administer it would have to be funded.

That agency is already in place

We already HAVE Medicare

not to handle 330,000,000 people. there would have to be a huge expansion and staffing increase.

So they wouldn't be creating an agency as you claimed...they would simply expand the existing.

That's something quite different

well holy shit, excuse me for using the word creating in stead of expanding, holy crap how could I make such an error? My point is valid either way, more government employees would be required as well as more office space, computers, data bases, etc. It would be a huge added expense that WE would have to pay for in taxes and medical care would degrade to something like the VA.

careful what you wish for idiot, it aint free.

 

[Lesh]

well holy shit, excuse me for using the word creating in stead of expanding,

There are major differences in terms of costs...and since we are primarily TALKING about costs...you disqualify yourself by being THAT FUCKING WRONG

 

[Maxdeath]

Medicare for all may BE a bridge too far but the American people certainly want a better healthcare system and that system is not coming from the private sector.

I really think a Medicare Buy In is the way to go...along with Medicare Part D reform regarding big pharma

Were it not for Joe Friggin Lieberman...we would have HAD that.

Once a Medicare buy in is in place...not only would all people be able to buy their own healthcare insurance at a reasonable rate...but employers could ALSO buy into it for their workers.

Medicare operates at a 3% Administrative cost and is much more successful at controlling prices than private insurers. Private insurers operate at 20-30% overhead for Administrative costs and profit

That's trillions of dollars saved right out of the gate

Seems you really do not understand Medicare. A person pays into Medicare by forced payroll deductions which their employer matches. When they reach 65 and are then eligible they again pay each month to have Medicare. Medicare covers only about 80% of any medical bills, there are many things it does not cover, or will cover only a very small portion of the cost. Most if not all people on Medicare cover those problems with private insurance known as Medicare supplements.

My freind that is on Medicare right now pays $125.00 a month for Medicare. The supplemental insurance cost $158.00 a month. He still pays copays on his medicines of $112.00 a month on average.

Rember these costs are after him and his employer paid into the program his whole working life.

Take into account Medicare is said to be bankrupt with in the next fifteen years and your stuck with another "great idea" that is unworkable.

Next consider that as government expands it becomes exponentially inefficient and you will see even more troubles.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

While I agree with your thoughts there is no way that Medicare for all and especially single payer could be payed for by someone else. A conservative estimate was 3.2 Trillion a year for Medicare for all. Single payer would be even higher. That is equal to every penny taken in by taxes last year.

Some have been the mistaken idea that they should get things for free but they do not realize that nothing is free.

I agree. It has to be paid for.

We already spend 19% of our GDP on health care while the rest of the industrialized world with single payer pays anywhere from 8-11%.

Except they cover everyone, they have longer life expectancies and lower infant mortality rates, and bankruptcy due to medical crisis isn't a thing. (As opposed to the US, where 62% of bankruptcies are due to medical crisis.)

So Carlos Dobkin, Amy Finkelstein, Raymond Kluender and Matthew J. Notowidigdo did what’s called an “event study.” Instead of looking at bankruptcies to see how many involved medical bills, they started with the illness, and asked how much more likely people were to declare bankruptcy after they got sick. That’s a much better way to tease out causation than asking whether someone who just went through a financially ruinous divorce also owed his or her dermatologist thousands of dollars.

The answer they came up with will surprise even critics of Warren et al.: The fraction of bankruptcies caused by medical events is just 4 percent. And even among those bankruptcies, it seems that medical bills may be less of a problem than the other things associated with an illness, such as lost labor income.

Opinion | The truth about medical bankruptcies

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

What they were honest about is the cost of malpractice insurance and how it affects the cost of healthcare. It was also honest about how much our physicians make compared to the rest of the world. You get what you pay for.

Because of what our physicians make, we attract the best from around the world. Trust me, I'm a patient at the world renown Cleveland Clinic. When you go to their downtown main campus, you are the one that feels like the foreigner.

So ray is at a clinic all the time, and he wonders why his boss dropped health insurance.

"Because that mean old negro in the white house made him!"

Where you are a patient at has nothing to do with insurance. Should I quit going to the facility I've attended my entire life because of insurance or Communists?

 

[Redfish]

well holy shit, excuse me for using the word creating in stead of expanding,

There are major differences in terms of costs...and since we are primarily TALKING about costs...you disqualify yourself by being THAT FUCKING WRONG

so providing medicare for 330 million people wont cost much more than providing it to 15 million? really? can you explain how that would work?

your use of insults and crude language proves that you are unable to participate in civil discussion of any issue, so please go away and find a kids forum to play on, you contribute nothing here.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

And all the hospitals and clinics would go bankrupt because Medicare refuses to pay for anything and reimbursements are pennies.

There are all kinds of tweaks that can be made. One would be a whole new cottage industry of entry-level preventive and diagnostic walk-in clinics.

We would definitely have to increase and re-construct reimbursement schedules.

We just have to THINK a little bit. But that appears to be a lost art.

So here comes real Single Payer.
.

Single payer would be just like Commie Care. It never addressed the problems of cost.

If we are to make any change, we can't do it the Democrat way and say "Here, somebody else pay for it."

The first step is to analyze how costs got so out of control in the first place, make a list of them, then execute each problem one at a time.

Now, this would take some guts to actually call problems, problems, particularly on the Democrat side which caused most of them. So until we can get to that point, everything else is fruitless.

The problem for the GOP is that it completely whiffed.

We were told for eight years that the GOP had a better plan. Turns out that was a lie.

So if we end up with Single Payer, the GOP will have paved the way.

They can't blame the Democrats for that.
.

They had much better plans. The problem was that the various plans were much better than Obamacare but could not gather enough Republican support for one plan to ram it through Congress like the Dimocrats did. There were enough people who disagreed with each version proposed that no plan could get enough support. If the Dims wanted to do something they could have sided with any one of the plans, but refused, because that left the whole plan in limbo, just where they wanted it!

What where the plans? Where are they?

Selling across state lines. Grouping small employers. What else?

Where were the plans? Were they secret?
.

I cannot help it if you are stupid. Look for yourself, dumbass! Look at the vote in Congress where McCain killed the attempt to rid ourselves of Obamacare. Stop being a libtard!

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

simply need to push for deregulation, let ins co's compete across borders.

Ah, that one.

The GOP told us for EIGHT YEARS that they had a better plan. They laughed at those of us who questioned it. Then, when they had all the power, they couldn't do it.

They know that deregulation and competing across borders wouldn't come close to fixing this, and they ran scared.

You folks brought this on yourself. Here it comes, you'll be responsible for it.
.

Because fucking John McCain killed the bill in the Senate, the only obstacle to passing a new healthcare law.

Huh?

And what was this new healthcare law, precisely?
.

Stop playing stupid! You do it too well!

Can't you answer the question?
.

You are apparently too stupid or were asleep during that time period. Look for yourself. I retired from teaching because of morons like you that are too lazy to learn.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

You people never learn, do you?

Since you refuse to look at links, allow me to post the meat and potatoes of what happened last time "government" found all kinds of savings:

You see, the problem was Mrs. Clinton assumed that big corporations would act decently.

What should have happened. THE MINUTE we saw that's what the Pharma execs were up to, they should have been arrested and thrown in a cell with THIS GUY

View attachment 214417

And a jar of vaseline.

This is the big mistake we keep making with these assholes. "Hey, maybe we should nationalize health care"

"No, no, don't do that, we'll be good!"

"Well, okay, then."

"SUCKERS!!!!"

Keep in mind, these are people who profit off of human suffering. These are people who never find a cure for cancer, but they will find a pill that makes your old dick hard for hours, because that'll sell like hotcakes.

Again, THE EUROPEANS HAVE FIGURED THIS OUT.

I'm sorry you don't understand the simple concept that nobody can sell a product at a loss. Even as a liberal, you should be able to understand that.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Medicare for all may BE a bridge too far but the American people certainly want a better healthcare system and that system is not coming from the private sector.

I really think a Medicare Buy In is the way to go...along with Medicare Part D reform regarding big pharma

Were it not for Joe Friggin Lieberman...we would have HAD that.

Once a Medicare buy in is in place...not only would all people be able to buy their own healthcare insurance at a reasonable rate...but employers could ALSO buy into it for their workers.

Medicare operates at a 3% Administrative cost and is much more successful at controlling prices than private insurers. Private insurers operate at 20-30% overhead for Administrative costs and profit

That's trillions of dollars saved right out of the gate

They control costs by fixing prices. That doesn't work. The current private insurance companies are covering all of the costs that Medicare will not reimburse. Without them, doctors and hospitals will just refuse Medicare patients and people will be dying in the streets.

 

[BlueGin]

well holy shit, excuse me for using the word creating in stead of expanding,

There are major differences in terms of costs...and since we are primarily TALKING about costs...you disqualify yourself by being THAT FUCKING WRONG

so providing medicare for 330 million people wont cost much more than providing it to 15 million? really? can you explain how that would work?

your use of insults and crude language proves that you are unable to participate in civil discussion of any issue, so please go away and find a kids forum to play on, you contribute nothing here.

That's because it is a sock. And the goal is to troll.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

exactly, what they also forget is that the huge new government agency to administer it would have to be funded.

That agency is already in place

We already HAVE Medicare

So those same people can run a system 20 times larger than they currently do at no increased costs? How old are you, 12? 13? You suck at math and have no concept of logic.

 

[Mac1958]

Ah, that one.

The GOP told us for EIGHT YEARS that they had a better plan. They laughed at those of us who questioned it. Then, when they had all the power, they couldn't do it.

They know that deregulation and competing across borders wouldn't come close to fixing this, and they ran scared.

You folks brought this on yourself. Here it comes, you'll be responsible for it.
.

Because fucking John McCain killed the bill in the Senate, the only obstacle to passing a new healthcare law.

Huh?

And what was this new healthcare law, precisely?
.

Stop playing stupid! You do it too well!

Can't you answer the question?
.

You are apparently too stupid or were asleep during that time period. Look for yourself. I retired from teaching because of morons like you that are too lazy to learn.

You keep calling me "stupid", yet you can't point to the Republican health care plan.

You're lying, just like the Republicans did for eight years when they promised us they had a better plan.

Maybe back away from the radio for a few months. Learn to think for yourself for a change. You can do it.
.

 

[debbiedowner]

Absolutely. My father is 87 now, and he's had his share of ailments and surgeries. He is pretty much in the middle politically. He used to lean right until the Democrats scared the hell out of him saying what the Republicans wanted to take away from him. In any case, he tells me how much Medicare pays on his behalf, and it's less than 2/3. Some of his surgeries were six figures as well.

you think Cigna is going to pay for an 87 year old with chronic health problems?

Translation....

Majority of democrats and republicans don't understand how this will destroy healthcare in this country...

Much like Gun control, every other country has single payer... every other country is doing far better in the important metrics.

You have heard of Cigna AARP? Yes?

No but I have heard of UHC and AARP.

 

[debbiedowner]

Under Medicare the Doc did routine blood test on Dad & discovered his red blood-cells were extremely low. They called saying take him to ER right away for blood transfusion. So we did & they looked him over, admitted him & gave him 4 pints over 2 days. Took him to a specialist who found colon cancer causing blood loss. Scheduled surgery for a few days later. 2 days later he was out farming, riding 4 wheeler when he got hit by a car traveling 60/mph. That scalped his head, broke his neck in 2 places, broke his back, pelvis, knee, arm & lots of road rash,

Medicare has been covering all this just fine. He has had great care & getting excellent rehab. We are all amazed he survived all this at 79-80 yrs old. Even more amazing, is they cured his cancer, sowed his scalp back on, mended bones, have him up & walking in rehab 6 hours a day. He will be out in a couple weeks & back to normal in a few months. Medicare is great coverage! Cheapo insurance would be flying their executives by helicopters to their jets, yachts & paradise islands to hide money while Dad died!

Medicare gives patients between 5/9 short term bed days and 5/9 long term bed days per year...usually 5 because the ACA cut the days allowed. After that you must sign over your life time reserve days...and when they are gone they are gone for good. The suplemental plans you pay for give you a few more. Medicare does not reimburse many tests or drugs because they deem them as an over diagnosis or not medically nescessary. They also don't pay for walkers,wheelchairs or other supplies.

You don't know what the hell you're talking about.