Predict how long before????

[bigrebnc1775]

Well, let's see...the USA is a wee bit bigger than New Zealand and has a "few" more people, just a few, idiot.

aannndddd?? I'm sure there a point in there somewhere, and I'm sure you don't know what it is...

The point is if New Zealand had near the number of people as the U.S. does your murder rate would be close to what the U.S. is.

 

[Dr Grump]

The one who fears the most is the one who wants gun control.

I go the other way. Those who want their guns are the ones who live in fear...

gun control people must live in fear or people using their rights to carry a gun wouldn't bother them and make them feel uncomfortable.

Well, you can exercise those rights....nobody is saying you can't.

As I said, this more comes down to what sort of society you want to live in. You want one awash with guns. That is fine. But at the end of the day, I dunno about you, but I didn't sit there going "Oh, my GOD! I can't believe what happened in Aurora!!!" I just thought, yep, another mass shooting in a country awash with guns.

Now, the Norway shooting, that was a surprise and it did shock me. Not only the shooting itself, but the scale of it.

Ditto Port Arthur, Hungerford, Aromoana and Dunblane....

 

[GoneBezerk]

Scum like you first can't count.

Also, you're an idiot constantly comparing the USA to these peon countries in the little corners of the planet, especially "lilly white" countries.

Most gun crimes in this country are done by blacks and hispanics....please tell us the population of blacks and hispanics in New Zealand, come on asswipe.

Well, let's see...the USA is a wee bit bigger than New Zealand and has a "few" more people, just a few, idiot.

aannndddd?? I'm sure there a point in there somewhere, and I'm sure you don't know what it is...

 

[Dr Grump]

Well, let's see...the USA is a wee bit bigger than New Zealand and has a "few" more people, just a few, idiot.

aannndddd?? I'm sure there a point in there somewhere, and I'm sure you don't know what it is...

The point is if New Zealand had near the number of people as the U.S. does your murder rate would be close to what the U.S. is.

No it wouldn't. To do the correlation, you can compare per capita. For example, the stat site listed said that NZ had 10 homicides per year via guns. The US 9369. NZ has 4.4 million people. That means there is one firearm death per 440,000 people. On the other hand the US has 1 firearm death per 34,408 people. And that is only firearms homicides...not taking any other into account....That, by a rough guesstimate suggests I am 13-14 times more likely to be shot and killed in the US than I am in NZ.....

 

[Dr Grump]

Scum like you first can't count.

Also, you're an idiot constantly comparing the USA to these peon countries in the little corners of the planet, especially "lilly white" countries.

Most gun crimes in this country are done by blacks and hispanics....please tell us the population of blacks and hispanics in New Zealand, come on asswipe.

Well, let's see...the USA is a wee bit bigger than New Zealand and has a "few" more people, just a few, idiot.

aannndddd?? I'm sure there a point in there somewhere, and I'm sure you don't know what it is...

Maori only make up 12 percent of our population but are way over represented in every negative stat there is including incarceration rates and crime stats...How many Maori live in the US?

See, you ask a dumb arse question you get a dumb arse and irrelevent answer....That's like saying if I take all the yellow M&Ms out of my M&M packet there will be no yellow M&Ms. To which I say "And?"...

 

[GoneBezerk]

The USA has more black people than New Zealand has people.

So...if black people in the USA account for the majority of violent crimes here, that should give you a fucking clue about comparing New Zealand with the USA in terms of crimes/guns.

The same can be said about hispanics in this country out-numbering all the people in New Zealand and more hispanics are probably involved in gun crimes here than all the people in New Zealand.

So idiot, if we ship a million blacks and hispanics to New Zealand, odds are their crime rate will go UP.

Scum like you first can't count.

Also, you're an idiot constantly comparing the USA to these peon countries in the little corners of the planet, especially "lilly white" countries.

Most gun crimes in this country are done by blacks and hispanics....please tell us the population of blacks and hispanics in New Zealand, come on asswipe.

aannndddd?? I'm sure there a point in there somewhere, and I'm sure you don't know what it is...

Maori only make up 12 percent of our population but are way over represented in every negative stat there is including incarceration rates and crime stats...How many Maori live in the US?

See, you ask a dumb arse question you get a dumb arse and irrelevent answer....That's like saying if I take all the yellow M&Ms out of my M&M packet there will be no yellow M&Ms. To which I say "And?"...

 

[midcan5]

Why is well regulated not the operative word?

"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

The New Republic
A Case for Gun Control
2nd Amendment Bearing Arms - U.S. Constitution - Findlaw
Death by the Barrel | Harvard Magazine Sep-Oct 2004
GunCite-Gun Control-International Homicide and Suicide Rates
Fairbanks Daily News-Miner - The voice of Interior Alaska since 1903

'A proposal for rational gun control' A Case for Gun Control

.

 

[Full-Auto]

Why is well regulated not the operative word?

"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

The New Republic
A Case for Gun Control
2nd Amendment Bearing Arms - U.S. Constitution - Findlaw
Death by the Barrel | Harvard Magazine Sep-Oct 2004
GunCite-Gun Control-International Homicide and Suicide Rates
Fairbanks Daily News-Miner - The voice of Interior Alaska since 1903

'A proposal for rational gun control'
A Case for Gun Control

Thats once formed.

Jesus, were you able to read in school............

 

[GuyPinestra]

Scum like you first can't count.

Also, you're an idiot constantly comparing the USA to these peon countries in the little corners of the planet, especially "lilly white" countries.

Most gun crimes in this country are done by blacks and hispanics....please tell us the population of blacks and hispanics in New Zealand, come on asswipe.

Well, let's see...the USA is a wee bit bigger than New Zealand and has a "few" more people, just a few, idiot.

aannndddd?? I'm sure there a point in there somewhere, and I'm sure you don't know what it is...

Here GB, you might need these...

 

[GuyPinestra]

aannndddd?? I'm sure there a point in there somewhere, and I'm sure you don't know what it is...

The point is if New Zealand had near the number of people as the U.S. does your murder rate would be close to what the U.S. is.

No it wouldn't. To do the correlation, you can compare per capita. For example, the stat site listed said that NZ had 10 homicides per year via guns. The US 9369. NZ has 4.4 million people. That means there is one firearm death per 440,000 people. On the other hand the US has 1 firearm death per 34,408 people. And that is only firearms homicides...not taking any other into account....That, by a rough guesstimate suggests I am 13-14 times more likely to be shot and killed in the US than I am in NZ.....

And yet 3X more likely to be assaulted... Strange, that...

 

[GoneBezerk]

So scumbag, if he used his science background to build bombs to blow up the entire movie theater killing more people....who would you blame?

His college? Home Depot? Wal Mart?

Why is well regulated not the operative word?

"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

The New Republic
A Case for Gun Control
2nd Amendment Bearing Arms - U.S. Constitution - Findlaw
Death by the Barrel | Harvard Magazine Sep-Oct 2004
GunCite-Gun Control-International Homicide and Suicide Rates
Fairbanks Daily News-Miner - The voice of Interior Alaska since 1903

'A proposal for rational gun control' A Case for Gun Control

.

 

[Dr Grump]

The point is if New Zealand had near the number of people as the U.S. does your murder rate would be close to what the U.S. is.

No it wouldn't. To do the correlation, you can compare per capita. For example, the stat site listed said that NZ had 10 homicides per year via guns. The US 9369. NZ has 4.4 million people. That means there is one firearm death per 440,000 people. On the other hand the US has 1 firearm death per 34,408 people. And that is only firearms homicides...not taking any other into account....That, by a rough guesstimate suggests I am 13-14 times more likely to be shot and killed in the US than I am in NZ.....

And yet 3X more likely to be assaulted... Strange, that...

And 13 times more likely to get shot in the US...funny that..

I play lip service to stats unless I know how they were reported, and what methods were used....otherwise I find them interesting for shits and giggles and to shoot the breeze....

I have never worried about walking down a street in most parts of NZ. And those that I have walked down that are dodgy, I've never felt I was going to shot or killed...

 

[jillian]

Who cares what a military style weapon is? Any weapon this is a full auto designed to shoot and kill people. There ya go - and that includes an Ak47, M16 Tec-9 or whatever...

The problem is, this argument to me isn't about being pedantic about legal definitions, although that is part of it. It is what sort of society you want to live in. Uber right-wingers in the US want a society armed to the teeth. Fine. Then you get incidents like Thurs night/Fri morning. That is the quid pro quo....

Your first error is in not reading/comprehending the info presented in this thread. AK's and Tech 9's are semi-auto, meaning it takes another trigger pull to fire another bullet. I don't own any M-16's, I believe full auto weapons are already restricted.

As for the kind of society I want to live in, I would say that I certainly DON'T want to live in one where law-abiding citizens have to walk around in fear of criminals who don't give a shit about the laws to begin with.

If memory serves, an AK can be converted to full auto

That aside, I get that. If I lived in a society where you are in constant fear of the other guy, I too would want to be armed...

Miller and Heller, however, do not support your contentions, Guy; you, like bigrebnc, simply make assertions that are not support in the context of the decisions. You can't play with those who are informed and knowledgeable about the subject.

Why?

You twist the facts to your pre-determined philosophy instead of the philosophy to the facts, like any true American who can think and who loves the country.

I posted the summary of Heller, not Henry, several pages back. I'm not doing it again. If either of you are too stupid to find it I can't be held responsible.

Dumbass.

I posted the summary, it affirms the 'common use' language of Miller. If you want to dispute that, make a point based on the ruling. Your opinion counts for shit.

Heller is the law. That doesn't make it a well-decided case. And if you look at breyer's dissent, he raises many questions, all relevant, that Scalia ignored in his decision -- in his great rush to give us the finger before a democratic president was inaugurated into office.

And that is the truth about Heller.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

No it wouldn't. To do the correlation, you can compare per capita. For example, the stat site listed said that NZ had 10 homicides per year via guns. The US 9369. NZ has 4.4 million people. That means there is one firearm death per 440,000 people. On the other hand the US has 1 firearm death per 34,408 people. And that is only firearms homicides...not taking any other into account....That, by a rough guesstimate suggests I am 13-14 times more likely to be shot and killed in the US than I am in NZ.....

And yet 3X more likely to be assaulted... Strange, that...

And 13 times more likely to get shot in the US...funny that..

I play lip service to stats unless I know how they were reported, and what methods were used....otherwise I find them interesting for shits and giggles and to shoot the breeze....

I have never worried about walking down a street in most parts of NZ. And those that I have walked down that are dodgy, I've never felt I was going to shot or killed...

2 times more likely if you're a woman in New Zealand to be raped compared to the U.S. and thew suicide rate is also much higher in New Zealand than in the U.S.

 

[Dr Grump]

And yet 3X more likely to be assaulted... Strange, that...

And 13 times more likely to get shot in the US...funny that..

I play lip service to stats unless I know how they were reported, and what methods were used....otherwise I find them interesting for shits and giggles and to shoot the breeze....

I have never worried about walking down a street in most parts of NZ. And those that I have walked down that are dodgy, I've never felt I was going to shot or killed...

2 times more likely if you're a woman in New Zealand to be raped compared to the U.S. and thew suicide rate is also much higher in New Zealand than in the U.S.

Three times more likely, according to those stats posted by Guy. But again, NZ has a high reportage rate. And these days, they usually call it sexual assault, not rape. What's the difference you say? Well, back when I was growing up, rape constituted having sex with somebody against their will. These days it covers a whole gambit of things from pinching a girl's arse to full on rape...The way out stats work, it does get confusing as to what is what. I liked the old way of reporting because to me having an unlawful sexual connection is a lot more serious that pinching a strangers' arse (although that shouldn't be tolerated either).

Yep, our suicide rate is a national shame...just like your homicide rate I guess...

 

[GuyPinestra]

And 13 times more likely to get shot in the US...funny that..

I play lip service to stats unless I know how they were reported, and what methods were used....otherwise I find them interesting for shits and giggles and to shoot the breeze....

I have never worried about walking down a street in most parts of NZ. And those that I have walked down that are dodgy, I've never felt I was going to shot or killed...

2 times more likely if you're a woman in New Zealand to be raped compared to the U.S. and thew suicide rate is also much higher in New Zealand than in the U.S.

Three times more likely, according to those stats posted by Guy. But again, NZ has a high reportage rate. And these days, they usually call it sexual assault, not rape. What's the difference you say? Well, back when I was growing up, rape constituted having sex with somebody against their will. These days it covers a whole gambit of things from pinching a girl's arse to full on rape...The way out stats work, it does get confusing as to what is what. I liked the old way of reporting because to me having an unlawful sexual connection is a lot more serious that pinching a strangers' arse (although that shouldn't be tolerated either).

Yep, our suicide rate is a national shame...just like your homicide rate I guess...

I was actually going to compare homicide rates, but the only stats I found on that site were gun related. Nothing about beatings or stabbings. I heard you guys are having an epidemic of knife attacks...

 

[bigrebnc1775]

And 13 times more likely to get shot in the US...funny that..

I play lip service to stats unless I know how they were reported, and what methods were used....otherwise I find them interesting for shits and giggles and to shoot the breeze....

I have never worried about walking down a street in most parts of NZ. And those that I have walked down that are dodgy, I've never felt I was going to shot or killed...

2 times more likely if you're a woman in New Zealand to be raped compared to the U.S. and thew suicide rate is also much higher in New Zealand than in the U.S.

Three times more likely, according to those stats posted by Guy. But again, NZ has a high reportage rate. And these days, they usually call it sexual assault, not rape. What's the difference you say? Well, back when I was growing up, rape constituted having sex with somebody against their will. These days it covers a whole gambit of things from pinching a girl's arse to full on rape...The way out stats work, it does get confusing as to what is what. I liked the old way of reporting because to me having an unlawful sexual connection is a lot more serious that pinching a strangers' arse (although that shouldn't be tolerated either).

Yep, our suicide rate is a national shame...just like your homicide rate I guess...

oh and you are 39times more of a chance being a victim of a crime in New Zealand than in the U.S.

 

[GuyPinestra]

2 times more likely if you're a woman in New Zealand to be raped compared to the U.S. and thew suicide rate is also much higher in New Zealand than in the U.S.

Three times more likely, according to those stats posted by Guy. But again, NZ has a high reportage rate. And these days, they usually call it sexual assault, not rape. What's the difference you say? Well, back when I was growing up, rape constituted having sex with somebody against their will. These days it covers a whole gambit of things from pinching a girl's arse to full on rape...The way out stats work, it does get confusing as to what is what. I liked the old way of reporting because to me having an unlawful sexual connection is a lot more serious that pinching a strangers' arse (although that shouldn't be tolerated either).

Yep, our suicide rate is a national shame...just like your homicide rate I guess...

oh and you are 39times more of a chance being a victim of a crime in New Zealand than in the U.S.

Actually that's wrong, Reb. It's 29% to 21%, so their odds of being a crime victim are 25% higher...

 

[JakeStarkey]

Gun related? Why would we ever be more interested in that than anything else?

You yammer and stammer, and we laugh.

I was actually going to compare homicide rates, but the only stats I found on that site were gun related. Nothing about beatings or stabbings. I heard you guys are having an epidemic of knife attacks...

 

[Dr Grump]

I heard you guys are having an epidemic of knife attacks...

Apparently so...according to the media...Unsure about the stats to back it up though...