Putting the Catholic Church in my rear view window...

[zaangalewa]

... Then tell me why the Catholic Church is one of the richest institutions on earth ...

Because cathedrals cost a lot of money, what we are able to pay because we are more than 2/3rd of all Christians on this planet.

 

[ding]

But Jesus died for our sins, didn't he? So that bill should be paid already.

What bill? Adam's way pointed to one direction for living life. Jesus' way pointed to another direction of living life. Neither Adam nor Jesus is living our life, we are. Just like Adam and Jesus we need to choose a direction.

Did Jesus die on the cross for our sins, yes or no.

No. He died because of our sins.

Jesus died, because god loves all mankind (=every single human being) more than anything else.

Jesus sacrificed Himself because of sin.

 

[Taz]

So Jesus died for our sins, so now we can sin all we want because that bill is paid.

No. With Jesus we have the second model. Paul spoke of Adam being the first model of how mankind might live, choosing disobedience over obedience. Jesus is the second, choosing obedience over disobedience. "Sinning all we want" takes us back to Adam, not forward with Jesus.

But Jesus died for our sins, didn't he? So that bill should be paid already.

Actually he died because of our sins.

We hadn't been born yet to sin.

What difference does that make?

Everyone who has ever sinned or will ever sin orchestrated the death of Christ. While it may be convenient to believe Christ died for your sins, the correct way of looking at it is that Christ died because of your sins.

It’s illogical to say that I’m responsible for something that happened 2000 years ago.

Not from the Catholic viewpoint it isn't. From the Catholic viewpoint everything was created through and for Christ. That you refuse to share in His suffering and refuse to accept your blame for His suffering is one of the things keeping you from progressing into the best version of yourself. So the only one you are hurting is you. Have at it.

You're a Catholic, hmmm... It's way too stupid to say I'm responsible for something that happened 2000 years ago, unless you're saying that it was in one of my past lives, which you're not.
So you believe in all the fairy tales in the Bible, and they aren't allegorical to you. lol.

 

[Taz]

I believe the sanctity of marriage is predicated on the splitting of spirit into it's male and female halves. That there is only spirit. That spirit contains the essence of femininity and masculinity. And that male and female halves only exist apart in the material world. That marriage is the joining of the two halves that were split apart. Maybe if more people understood this there would be less bad marriages in the first place.

I agree - but nevertheless grey are all theories. I am a so called "remarried Catholic". To leave my first wife was necessary, the divorce unevitable - and to find my second wife was a wonder. She had been in a very similiar situation than I had been and so we did not need many words to understand each other, although we are both chatterboxes.

I make no judgments either way.

¿Judgement?

Yes.

I don't know what kind of answer this is - but the "discussion" within the Catholic Church about "remarriage" is anyway one of the most stupid irreal discussions the world ever had seen. I am a so called "remarried Catholic". And what anyone in the world thinks about me or anyone else, who is remarried, is for me personally without any relevance for anything. Everything what Catholics and others discuss in this direction is in my eyes only a stupid nonsense, which helps no one. Sure is it good to be married "forever" = until the partner dies. But philosophically is for example to die and to live the same. Within life we are surrounded from death. And in general exists by the way no one, who is really a "remarried Catholic", because the Catholic Church marries no one, who was once married. "Remarriage" exists only because people think it's the same to be politically married for a community of people (accepted to be married from other people) and to be spiritually married in the eyes of god (accepted to be married from our father in heaven). You can see this difference by the way very clear in the father of the Lord Joseph, who decided with the help of god to marry Mary and not to take care that Mary was pregnant from someone else - what was not compatible with the rules in his time and place of history.

Did you remarry with a guy this time?

No problems, Nazi? What about to live the next two weeks without alcohol and drugs?

I don't drink or do drugs, that shit is for kikes.

And whatelse is the background for your totally stupid, absurde and agressive, senseless behavior?

I love Jews. Really.

 

[Taz]

But Jesus died for our sins, didn't he? So that bill should be paid already.

What bill? Adam's way pointed to one direction for living life. Jesus' way pointed to another direction of living life. Neither Adam nor Jesus is living our life, we are. Just like Adam and Jesus we need to choose a direction.

Did Jesus die on the cross for our sins, yes or no.

No. He died because of our sins.

Jesus died, because god loves all mankind (=every single human being) more than anything else.

Jesus sacrificed Himself because of sin.

No, Jesus was caught and nailed to wood for subversion.

 

[Taz]

But Jesus died for our sins, didn't he? So that bill should be paid already.

What bill? Adam's way pointed to one direction for living life. Jesus' way pointed to another direction of living life. Neither Adam nor Jesus is living our life, we are. Just like Adam and Jesus we need to choose a direction.

Did Jesus die on the cross for our sins, yes or no.

No. He died because of our sins.

Jesus died, because god loves all mankind (=every single human being) more than anything else.

Is that why god drowned nearly everyone with his flood?

 

[Blues Man]

The pope says birth control is a sin yet how many catholic women use birth control?

Take a look at God's Commandments. Yet how many people break them? What both Commandments and Church point to is the ideal. What we see (or do not see) are those who reach that ideal.

Yeah OK

I know atheists who do a better job of following the 10 commandments than most of the religious people I have ever met

And why do they follow the 10 commandements?

you do realize that most of the 10 Commandments are laws that already existed before the New Testament was written don't you?

Your question answers not my question.

of course it does.

there is nothing original about the 10 commandments

anyone who follows the laws prohibiting murder are also following one of the 10 commandments. There were laws regarding murder before the Old Testament was written. So why is it you think that an unbeliever cannot live a life that is actually aligned with the laws the 10 commandments were based on?

 

[Blues Man]

... Then tell me why the Catholic Church is one of the richest institutions on earth ...

Because cathedrals cost a lot of money, what we are able to pay because we are more than 2/3rd of all Christians on this planet.

so your god requires that ostentatious cathedrals be built?

 

[esalla]

I met someone last night.

It was our first date, but something clicked between us and I think she may be the person I spend the rest of my life with.

But, even if it doesn't end up being her, someone will come along eventually because I'm on three dating services and I'm searching very diligently because I hate being alone.

So, it's time to put the Catholic Church in my rear view window.

Now you can say, get an annulment. The Catholic Church offers that.

But I think it's total bullshit to ask the Catholic Church to say I wasn't really married to a woman I spent thirty years with and is the mother of my three children.

I looked into the Episcopalians.

Being an Episcopalian would be like going to a church that looks Catholic in every way, except the priests don't really care if you even believe in God so long as you put money in the basket.

Or I could just not go to any church on Sunday and work things out just between me and God.

Please don't come on this thread and tell me this isn't really a problem.

It's a problem for me.

I've been Catholic all my life and giving up Catholicism would be worse than giving up my right arm.

Jesus was not a Catholic or Episcopalian. How you live your life and what you believe is what is important, not what you do on Sunday. I was raised a Catholic and stopped going to church a few years after marring a Catholic wife. Jesus still fills my life with power and glory and I can not get lost as he guides my every step. So you might want to focus on being a Christian and not on a church subtitle. I am sure that you already know that there are both Catholics and Episcopalians who will not hold the door for a pregnant woman but as you say know that they are forgiven because they pay off the child molesting priest

 

[Blues Man]

I met someone last night.

It was our first date, but something clicked between us and I think she may be the person I spend the rest of my life with.

But, even if it doesn't end up being her, someone will come along eventually because I'm on three dating services and I'm searching very diligently because I hate being alone.

So, it's time to put the Catholic Church in my rear view window.

Now you can say, get an annulment. The Catholic Church offers that.

But I think it's total bullshit to ask the Catholic Church to say I wasn't really married to a woman I spent thirty years with and is the mother of my three children.

I looked into the Episcopalians.

Being an Episcopalian would be like going to a church that looks Catholic in every way, except the priests don't really care if you even believe in God so long as you put money in the basket.

Or I could just not go to any church on Sunday and work things out just between me and God.

Please don't come on this thread and tell me this isn't really a problem.

It's a problem for me.

I've been Catholic all my life and giving up Catholicism would be worse than giving up my right arm.

Jesus was not a Catholic or Episcopalian. How you live your life and what you believe is what is important, not what you do on Sunday. I was raised a Catholic and stopped going to church a few years after marring a Catholic wife. Jesus still fills my life with power and glory and I can not get lost as he guides my every step. So you might want to focus on being a Christian and not on a church subtitle. I am sure that you already know that there are both Catholics and Episcopalians who will not hold the door for a pregnant woman but as you say know that they are forgiven because they pay off the child molesting priest

exactly my point.

I know atheists that are better Christians than some Christians I know

 

[esalla]

I met someone last night.

It was our first date, but something clicked between us and I think she may be the person I spend the rest of my life with.

But, even if it doesn't end up being her, someone will come along eventually because I'm on three dating services and I'm searching very diligently because I hate being alone.

So, it's time to put the Catholic Church in my rear view window.

Now you can say, get an annulment. The Catholic Church offers that.

But I think it's total bullshit to ask the Catholic Church to say I wasn't really married to a woman I spent thirty years with and is the mother of my three children.

I looked into the Episcopalians.

Being an Episcopalian would be like going to a church that looks Catholic in every way, except the priests don't really care if you even believe in God so long as you put money in the basket.

Or I could just not go to any church on Sunday and work things out just between me and God.

Please don't come on this thread and tell me this isn't really a problem.

It's a problem for me.

I've been Catholic all my life and giving up Catholicism would be worse than giving up my right arm.

Jesus was not a Catholic or Episcopalian. How you live your life and what you believe is what is important, not what you do on Sunday. I was raised a Catholic and stopped going to church a few years after marring a Catholic wife. Jesus still fills my life with power and glory and I can not get lost as he guides my every step. So you might want to focus on being a Christian and not on a church subtitle. I am sure that you already know that there are both Catholics and Episcopalians who will not hold the door for a pregnant woman but as you say know that they are forgiven because they pay off the child molesting priest

exactly my point.

I know atheists that are better Christians than some Christians I know

While that is true the atheist that you know believe that they are the result of pond scum mutating as Darwin speculated without ever having seen the genius of how DNA works

No joy in being an atheist pond scum

 

[Blues Man]

I met someone last night.

It was our first date, but something clicked between us and I think she may be the person I spend the rest of my life with.

But, even if it doesn't end up being her, someone will come along eventually because I'm on three dating services and I'm searching very diligently because I hate being alone.

So, it's time to put the Catholic Church in my rear view window.

Now you can say, get an annulment. The Catholic Church offers that.

But I think it's total bullshit to ask the Catholic Church to say I wasn't really married to a woman I spent thirty years with and is the mother of my three children.

I looked into the Episcopalians.

Being an Episcopalian would be like going to a church that looks Catholic in every way, except the priests don't really care if you even believe in God so long as you put money in the basket.

Or I could just not go to any church on Sunday and work things out just between me and God.

Please don't come on this thread and tell me this isn't really a problem.

It's a problem for me.

I've been Catholic all my life and giving up Catholicism would be worse than giving up my right arm.

Jesus was not a Catholic or Episcopalian. How you live your life and what you believe is what is important, not what you do on Sunday. I was raised a Catholic and stopped going to church a few years after marring a Catholic wife. Jesus still fills my life with power and glory and I can not get lost as he guides my every step. So you might want to focus on being a Christian and not on a church subtitle. I am sure that you already know that there are both Catholics and Episcopalians who will not hold the door for a pregnant woman but as you say know that they are forgiven because they pay off the child molesting priest

exactly my point.

I know atheists that are better Christians than some Christians I know

While that is true the atheist that you know believe that they are the result of pond scum mutating as Darwin speculated without ever having seen the genius of how DNA works

No joy in being an atheist pond scum

I don't know any pond scum.

I do know quite a few wonderful people though.

And you like to assume a lot don't you?

A person that does not believe in some all powerful mystical being is not necessarily an evolutionist.

Many people think how we got here isn't that important and all that matters is how they behave while they are here.

Some people can admit they don't know or understand and don't feel the need to make up magical beings in order to provide answers

 

[Meriweather]

No I am speaking a a person who was a searcher. I looked into Christianity and some other religions and found them all wanting. And in all honesty it was the people in those churches I had a hard time abiding. I saw so much hypocrisy that I could not abide.

So tell me why does the bible speak of eternal rewards and endless punishment if not to sway people by fear and greed?

and i never said they tried to be better. It is my conclusion that the person who chooses to live a good life with no expectation of salvation, an eternal life in heaven or whatever is a better person than one who does.

Two thoughts: How much time did you spend on your search? Unless you spent at least a decade on each religion, it again speaks of merely scratching the surface. As our superior, I bow to your judgement that we are all hypocrites.

The Bible speaks of choice and what one can expect as the result of one's choice. The results begin in the here and now and extend into eternity. They should come as no surprise to anyone as each person is well aware of his/her day-to-day choices.

Each faith's promise is to teach a way of life that has lasting results. Fear and greed have little to do with most denominations as the focus is on an everlasting way of life. Fear and greed are at best short-term.

Yes, we know how you judge: We bad, you good.

 

[ding]

So Jesus died for our sins, so now we can sin all we want because that bill is paid.

No. With Jesus we have the second model. Paul spoke of Adam being the first model of how mankind might live, choosing disobedience over obedience. Jesus is the second, choosing obedience over disobedience. "Sinning all we want" takes us back to Adam, not forward with Jesus.

But Jesus died for our sins, didn't he? So that bill should be paid already.

Actually he died because of our sins.

We hadn't been born yet to sin.

What difference does that make?

Everyone who has ever sinned or will ever sin orchestrated the death of Christ. While it may be convenient to believe Christ died for your sins, the correct way of looking at it is that Christ died because of your sins.

It’s illogical to say that I’m responsible for something that happened 2000 years ago.

Not from the Catholic viewpoint it isn't. From the Catholic viewpoint everything was created through and for Christ. That you refuse to share in His suffering and refuse to accept your blame for His suffering is one of the things keeping you from progressing into the best version of yourself. So the only one you are hurting is you. Have at it.

You're a Catholic, hmmm... It's way too stupid to say I'm responsible for something that happened 2000 years ago, unless you're saying that it was in one of my past lives, which you're not.
So you believe in all the fairy tales in the Bible, and they aren't allegorical to you. lol.

Not a good Catholic I accept accountability for Christ's death and share in His suffering. What you decide to do is on you.

It's because you see the allegorical accounts of ancient man as fairy instead of answers to the origin questions, historical events and wisdom that you miss out on knowledge, Taz. Feel free to keep seeing them as fairy tales. I couldn't care less,, it only hurts you and those you love.

 

[ding]

I believe the sanctity of marriage is predicated on the splitting of spirit into it's male and female halves. That there is only spirit. That spirit contains the essence of femininity and masculinity. And that male and female halves only exist apart in the material world. That marriage is the joining of the two halves that were split apart. Maybe if more people understood this there would be less bad marriages in the first place.

I agree - but nevertheless grey are all theories. I am a so called "remarried Catholic". To leave my first wife was necessary, the divorce unevitable - and to find my second wife was a wonder. She had been in a very similiar situation than I had been and so we did not need many words to understand each other, although we are both chatterboxes.

I make no judgments either way.

¿Judgement?

Yes.

I don't know what kind of answer this is - but the "discussion" within the Catholic Church about "remarriage" is anyway one of the most stupid irreal discussions the world ever had seen. I am a so called "remarried Catholic". And what anyone in the world thinks about me or anyone else, who is remarried, is for me personally without any relevance for anything. Everything what Catholics and others discuss in this direction is in my eyes only a stupid nonsense, which helps no one. Sure is it good to be married "forever" = until the partner dies. But philosophically is for example to die and to live the same. Within life we are surrounded from death. And in general exists by the way no one, who is really a "remarried Catholic", because the Catholic Church marries no one, who was once married. "Remarriage" exists only because people think it's the same to be politically married for a community of people (accepted to be married from other people) and to be spiritually married in the eyes of god (accepted to be married from our father in heaven). You can see this difference by the way very clear in the father of the Lord Joseph, who decided with the help of god to marry Mary and not to take care that Mary was pregnant from someone else - what was not compatible with the rules in his time and place of history.

Did you remarry with a guy this time?

No problems, Nazi? What about to live the next two weeks without alcohol and drugs?

I don't drink or do drugs, that shit is for kikes.

And whatelse is the background for your totally stupid, absurde and agressive, senseless behavior?

I love Jews. Really.

What you intend for evil, God is using for good.

 

[ding]

But Jesus died for our sins, didn't he? So that bill should be paid already.

What bill? Adam's way pointed to one direction for living life. Jesus' way pointed to another direction of living life. Neither Adam nor Jesus is living our life, we are. Just like Adam and Jesus we need to choose a direction.

Did Jesus die on the cross for our sins, yes or no.

No. He died because of our sins.

Jesus died, because god loves all mankind (=every single human being) more than anything else.

Jesus sacrificed Himself because of sin.

No, Jesus was caught and nailed to wood for subversion.

If that's how you need to see it, go for it, Taz.

 

[ding]

But Jesus died for our sins, didn't he? So that bill should be paid already.

What bill? Adam's way pointed to one direction for living life. Jesus' way pointed to another direction of living life. Neither Adam nor Jesus is living our life, we are. Just like Adam and Jesus we need to choose a direction.

Did Jesus die on the cross for our sins, yes or no.

No. He died because of our sins.

Jesus died, because god loves all mankind (=every single human being) more than anything else.

Is that why god drowned nearly everyone with his flood?

You read for confirmation of bias, Taz. What could possibly go wrong with that?

 

[Taz]

So Jesus died for our sins, so now we can sin all we want because that bill is paid.

No. With Jesus we have the second model. Paul spoke of Adam being the first model of how mankind might live, choosing disobedience over obedience. Jesus is the second, choosing obedience over disobedience. "Sinning all we want" takes us back to Adam, not forward with Jesus.

But Jesus died for our sins, didn't he? So that bill should be paid already.

Actually he died because of our sins.

We hadn't been born yet to sin.

What difference does that make?

Everyone who has ever sinned or will ever sin orchestrated the death of Christ. While it may be convenient to believe Christ died for your sins, the correct way of looking at it is that Christ died because of your sins.

It’s illogical to say that I’m responsible for something that happened 2000 years ago.

Not from the Catholic viewpoint it isn't. From the Catholic viewpoint everything was created through and for Christ. That you refuse to share in His suffering and refuse to accept your blame for His suffering is one of the things keeping you from progressing into the best version of yourself. So the only one you are hurting is you. Have at it.

You're a Catholic, hmmm... It's way too stupid to say I'm responsible for something that happened 2000 years ago, unless you're saying that it was in one of my past lives, which you're not.
So you believe in all the fairy tales in the Bible, and they aren't allegorical to you. lol.

Not a good Catholic I accept accountability for Christ's death and share in His suffering. What you decide to do is on you.

It's because you see the allegorical accounts of ancient man as fairy instead of answers to the origin questions, historical events and wisdom that you miss out on knowledge, Taz. Feel free to keep seeing them as fairy tales. I couldn't care less,, it only hurts you and those you love.

The Catholic church thinks the flood actually happened. So either you do to, or your a faker/liar.

 

[Taz]

But Jesus died for our sins, didn't he? So that bill should be paid already.

What bill? Adam's way pointed to one direction for living life. Jesus' way pointed to another direction of living life. Neither Adam nor Jesus is living our life, we are. Just like Adam and Jesus we need to choose a direction.

Did Jesus die on the cross for our sins, yes or no.

No. He died because of our sins.

Jesus died, because god loves all mankind (=every single human being) more than anything else.

Is that why god drowned nearly everyone with his flood?

You read for confirmation of bias, Taz. What could possibly go wrong with that?

Too bad your church agrees with me.

 

[Taz]

I believe the sanctity of marriage is predicated on the splitting of spirit into it's male and female halves. That there is only spirit. That spirit contains the essence of femininity and masculinity. And that male and female halves only exist apart in the material world. That marriage is the joining of the two halves that were split apart. Maybe if more people understood this there would be less bad marriages in the first place.

I agree - but nevertheless grey are all theories. I am a so called "remarried Catholic". To leave my first wife was necessary, the divorce unevitable - and to find my second wife was a wonder. She had been in a very similiar situation than I had been and so we did not need many words to understand each other, although we are both chatterboxes.

I make no judgments either way.

¿Judgement?

Yes.

I don't know what kind of answer this is - but the "discussion" within the Catholic Church about "remarriage" is anyway one of the most stupid irreal discussions the world ever had seen. I am a so called "remarried Catholic". And what anyone in the world thinks about me or anyone else, who is remarried, is for me personally without any relevance for anything. Everything what Catholics and others discuss in this direction is in my eyes only a stupid nonsense, which helps no one. Sure is it good to be married "forever" = until the partner dies. But philosophically is for example to die and to live the same. Within life we are surrounded from death. And in general exists by the way no one, who is really a "remarried Catholic", because the Catholic Church marries no one, who was once married. "Remarriage" exists only because people think it's the same to be politically married for a community of people (accepted to be married from other people) and to be spiritually married in the eyes of god (accepted to be married from our father in heaven). You can see this difference by the way very clear in the father of the Lord Joseph, who decided with the help of god to marry Mary and not to take care that Mary was pregnant from someone else - what was not compatible with the rules in his time and place of history.

Did you remarry with a guy this time?

No problems, Nazi? What about to live the next two weeks without alcohol and drugs?

I don't drink or do drugs, that shit is for kikes.

And whatelse is the background for your totally stupid, absurde and agressive, senseless behavior?

I love Jews. Really.

What you intend for evil, God is using for good.

Just having a little fun with zaan, he's such an idiot, lol.