Question for Jehovah's Witnesses

[tyroneweaver]

Hi.

I tried searching your site but I didn't find an answer, how do Jehovah's Witnesses reconcile Isaiah 9:6 to their (or your) being nontrinitarians?

EDIT - If anyone is unfamiliar with Isaiah 9:6, here it is:

Isaiah 9:6
English Standard Version (ESV)
(6)For to us a child is born,
to us a son is given;
and the government shall be upon his shoulder,
and his name shall be called
Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

If you read it correctly---Jesus'--NAME-- will be called those things--it is not saying Jesus himself will be those things. There is a big difference.
Jesus taught--John 17:1-6,26--- the one who sent him( John 5:30-Father) is THE ONLY TRUE GOD.--verse 6 = YHWH(Jehovah) , 26= YHWH( Jehovah)-- (making this reality of what a true follower does--John 4:22-24.

The Bible teaches Jesus is Jehovah. And the Father is Eloheim. Even when Christ was on the cross He called Him Eloi.

Savior

psalms

21 They forgat God their savior, which had done great things in Egypt;

Isaiah

3 For I amthe Lordthy God, the Holy Oneof Israel, thy Saviour: I gave Egyptforthy ransom, Ethiopia and Sebafor thee.

11 I, evenI, amthe Lord; and besideme there isno saviour.

15 Verily thou arta God that hidestthyself, O God of Israel, the Saviour.

2Sam 22.3 The God of my rock; in him will I trust: he ismyshield, and the horn of my salvation, my high-tower, and my refuge, my saviour; thou savest me from violence.

Hosea

4 Yet I amthe Lordthy God from the land of Egypt, and thou shalt know no godbut me: for there isno saviour besideme.

New Testament equivalent.

21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his nameJESUS: for he shall savehis people from their sins.

Luke 1:

47 And my spirit hath rejoicedin God my Saviour.

11 For unto you is bornthis day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord.

John 4.42 And said unto the woman, Now we believe, not because of thy saying: for we have heard him ourselves, and know that this is indeed the Christ, the Saviourof the world.

10 Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.

11 This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner.

12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

Acts 13:23 Of this man’s seedhath God according to his promiseraised unto Israel a Saviour, Jesus:

I Tim 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the commandment of God our Saviour, and Lord Jesus Christ, which isour hope;

Titus 1:4 To Titus, mineown son afterthe common faith: Grace, mercy, andpeace, from God the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ our Saviour.

Titus 3:6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;

1Jn 4:14 And we have seen and do testifythat the Father sentthe Son to bethe Saviour of the world.

Repurchaser:

Is 4314 ¶Thus saith the Lord, your redeemer, the Holy One of Israel; For your sake I have sent to Babylon, and have brought down all their nobles, and the Chaldeans, whose cry is in the ships.

15 I am the Lord, your Holy One, the creator of Israel, your King.

Is 54;5 For thy Maker isthine husband; the Lordof hostsishis name; and thy Redeemerthe Holy One of Israel; The Godof the whole earth shall he be called.

Is 59;20 ¶And the Redeemershall cometo Zion, and unto them that turnfrom transgression in Jacob, saith the Lord.

Is. 41

13 For I the Lord thy God will hold thy right hand, saying unto thee, Fear not; I will help thee.

14 Fear not, thou worm Jacob, and ye men of Israel; I will help thee, saith the Lord, and thy redeemer, the Holy Oneof Israel.

Ps 49

15 But God will redeemmy soul from the power of the grave: for he shall receiveme. Selah.

4 As forour redeemer, the Lordof hosts ishis name, the Holy One of Israel.

26 And I will feed them that oppressthee with their own flesh; and they shall be drunken with their own blood, as with sweet wine: and all flesh shall knowthat I the Lordamthy Saviourand thy Redeemer, the mighty Oneof Jacob.

15 But God will redeemmy soul from the power of the grave: for he shall receiveme. Selah.

Acts 20:28

28 ¶Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the churchof God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.

1Peter 1

18 Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;

19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lambwithout blemish and without spot:

Gal. 3

13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: or it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:

Gal 4:4 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sentforth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,

5 To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons.

Col

14 In whom we have redemption through his blood, eventhe forgiveness of sins:

Judgement:

Ichron 16:33 Then shall the treesof the wood sing out at the presence of the Lord, because he cometh to judgethe earth.

Ps 96;13 Before the Lord: for he cometh, for he cometh to judge the earth: he shall judge the world with righteousness, and the people with his truth.

Psalm 9;7 But the Lordshall endure for ever: he hath prepared his throne for judgment.

Matt16:27 For the Son of manshall come in the gloryof his Father with his angels; and then he shall rewardevery man according to his works.

John 5;22 For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committedall judgmentunto the Son:

2Cor. 5;10 For we must all appear before the judgmentseat of Christ; that every one may receive the things donein his body, accordingto that he hath done, whether it begood or bad.

Acts 10;36 The word which God sent unto the children of Israel, preaching peace by Jesus Christ: (he is Lord of all

37 That word, I say, ye know, which was published throughout all Judæa, and began from Galilee, after the baptism which John preached;

38 How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him.

39 And we are witnesses of all things which he did both in the land of the Jews, and in Jerusalem; whom they slew and hanged on a tree:

40 Him God raised up the third day, and shewed him openly;

41 Not to all the people, but unto witnesses chosen before of God, even to us, who did eat and drink with him after he rose from the dead.

42 And he commanded us to preach unto the people, and to testify that it is he which was ordained of God to be the Judge of quick and

Rom 14:10 But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before thejudgment seat of Christ.

Jude

14 And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,

15 To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him.

2Timothy

1 I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom;

Holy One of Israel

Is 43:15 I amthe Lord, your Holy One, the creator of Israel, your King.

Mk 1:24 Saying, Let usalone; whathave we to do with thee, thou Jesus of Nazareth? art thou come to destroy us? I know thee who thou art, the Holy Oneof God.

Lk 4:34 Saying, Let usalone; what have we to do with thee,thouJesus of Nazareth? art thou come to destroy us? I know thee who thou art; the Holy One of God.

Prepare the Way

Is 40:2 Speak ye comfortably to Jerusalem, and cry unto her, that her warfare is accomplished, that her iniquity is pardoned: for she hath received of the Lord’s hand double for all her sins.

3 ¶The voice of him that crieth in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make straight in the desert a highway for our God.

Mk 1:3 The voiceof one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight.

Lk 1:76 And thou, child, shalt be called the prophet of the Highest: for thou shalt go before the face of the Lord toprepare his ways;

77 To give knowledge of salvation unto his people by the

Creation:

Gen 1:26 ¶And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

7 And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so.

Heb 1:2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

I AM

Ex 3:14 And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you.

Jn8:58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you,Before Abraham was, I am.

59 Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.

Book of Revelations

Rev 1:5 And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,

8 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.

The NWTHS really slaughtered this passage

11 Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea.

17 And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last:

18I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.

Rev 2

8 And unto the angel of the church in Smyrna write; These things saith the first and the last, which was dead, and is alive;

 

[tyroneweaver]

Daniel prophesied Messiah's revealing to the day.

That is a mistake and lie, making you gullible through lack of historical knowledge and refusal in reading specific words as they are written, not as they want to lead you into reading it.

Dan 9
Let's review the Mistake:
The events Daniel is prophecizing already occured before Jesus and the events of the temple you propose occured after Jesus making the correlation impossible even if you avoided history and thought it didn’t occur yet.
Daniel is talking about "an anointed place" and an anointed (King) not THE ANOINTED ONE.
Now to review why these events already occured:

Dan 9: There is a 7-week (49-year) span between the actual destruction of Jerusalem in 586 (beginning the exile and realizing the decree in 538bc to rebuild), and the end of the exile brought about by the arrival of ‘AN’ anointed one not “THE” anointed one . Kings and High Priests were anointed as AN anointed one but not THE anointed one. Thus we must notice the wording is “an anointed one” not “THE” anointed one.

Dan 9:24 says anoint the holy place not an anointed man. Daniel 9:25 says, "from the time the decree to restore and rebuild Jerusalem was issued, until AN annointed one, a ruler, it will be seven weeks". If the decree is indeed sometime around the beginning of the full Exile, 586 b.c.e., then who is the anointed one mentioned? And, GOD already has referred to ruler Cyrus as his Anointed in
Isaiah 45:1: 70 years after the destruction Cyrus rebuilt the Temple in other words it's completion in 516BC
Here's the reference of this ‘70 years’ by the Historian Josephus in Antiquities 11.1.1: Ant. 11.1.1 "In the first year of the reign of Cyrus, which was the seventieth from the day that our people were removed out of their own land into Babylon, God commiserated the captivity and calamity of these poor people, according as he had foretold to them by Jeremiah the prophet, before the destruction of the city, that after they has served Nebuchadnezzar and his posterity, and after they had undergone that SERVITUDE seventy years, he would restore them again to the land of their fathers, and they should build their temple, and enjoy their ancient prosperity; and these things God did afford them."


Daniel 9:26
And after the sixty-two weeks,an anointed one will be cut off,
and there will be nothing to him.
and the people of a ruler who shall come
shall destroy the city and the sanctuary,
and the end of it/him shall be with a flood,,
and, until the end of the war, desolations are decreed.

62 weeks (434 years) leads us to around 152 b.c.e. the time of antiochus desolation and destruction of the temple. The anointed one was the king who was cut off. High Priest Onias III, who was assasinated (cut off) in 171 b.c.e. In 168 b.c.e., the middle of the next "week" of years (171-165 b.c.e.), ruler Antiochus IV (who had Onias killed) pillaged Jerusalem. Antiochus IV matches the "ruler to come",

Now who is the Moshiach?
Dan 12:1-4 says Michael rises to save Israel the same redeemer (HaSheva) who saves
Judah in Jeremiah 23:5-6

Dan CHAPTER TEN Verse 13: But the prince of the kingdom of the Persians resisted me one and twenty days: and behold Michael, one of the chief princes, came to help me, and remained there by the king of the Persians (Cyrus).

**Michael is dealing with Cyrus** thus who is Ezra 1 and Isaiah 44-45 calling LORD(King/head of hosts) AND REDEEMER(HaSheva)?

Verse 20: And the angel said: "Do you know where I came from?" And now will
*Hashev* Lacham Sar Parac"(HaShev fight the prince of Persia).

Verse 21: But I will tell thee what is set down in the scripture of truth: and none is my helper in all these things, but Michael your prince.

1 Ezra 1:1 it was the Lord who stirred up the spirit of Cyrus.
Isaiah 44:24-28 and 45,
the Redeemer (HaSheva)caused Cyrus' heart to change to do the Moshiach roles of delivering the people gathering them, rebuilding the temple etc.
Dan 10 shows this was Michael HaShev who worked on Cyrus' heart doing all the anointed roles, not Jesus.

Check Mate!

The calendar that Daniel was using didn't have 365 1/4 days in it. Your numbers are wrong.

My dog knows more about Sunday School than you know about the KJV

 

[hadit]

Daniel prophesied Messiah's revealing to the day.

That is a mistake and lie, making you gullible through lack of historical knowledge and refusal in reading specific words as they are written, not as they want to lead you into reading it.

Dan 9
Let's review the Mistake:
The events Daniel is prophecizing already occured before Jesus and the events of the temple you propose occured after Jesus making the correlation impossible even if you avoided history and thought it didn’t occur yet.
Daniel is talking about "an anointed place" and an anointed (King) not THE ANOINTED ONE.
Now to review why these events already occured:

Dan 9: There is a 7-week (49-year) span between the actual destruction of Jerusalem in 586 (beginning the exile and realizing the decree in 538bc to rebuild), and the end of the exile brought about by the arrival of ‘AN’ anointed one not “THE” anointed one . Kings and High Priests were anointed as AN anointed one but not THE anointed one. Thus we must notice the wording is “an anointed one” not “THE” anointed one.

Dan 9:24 says anoint the holy place not an anointed man. Daniel 9:25 says, "from the time the decree to restore and rebuild Jerusalem was issued, until AN annointed one, a ruler, it will be seven weeks". If the decree is indeed sometime around the beginning of the full Exile, 586 b.c.e., then who is the anointed one mentioned? And, GOD already has referred to ruler Cyrus as his Anointed in
Isaiah 45:1: 70 years after the destruction Cyrus rebuilt the Temple in other words it's completion in 516BC
Here's the reference of this ‘70 years’ by the Historian Josephus in Antiquities 11.1.1: Ant. 11.1.1 "In the first year of the reign of Cyrus, which was the seventieth from the day that our people were removed out of their own land into Babylon, God commiserated the captivity and calamity of these poor people, according as he had foretold to them by Jeremiah the prophet, before the destruction of the city, that after they has served Nebuchadnezzar and his posterity, and after they had undergone that SERVITUDE seventy years, he would restore them again to the land of their fathers, and they should build their temple, and enjoy their ancient prosperity; and these things God did afford them."


Daniel 9:26
And after the sixty-two weeks,an anointed one will be cut off,
and there will be nothing to him.
and the people of a ruler who shall come
shall destroy the city and the sanctuary,
and the end of it/him shall be with a flood,,
and, until the end of the war, desolations are decreed.

62 weeks (434 years) leads us to around 152 b.c.e. the time of antiochus desolation and destruction of the temple. The anointed one was the king who was cut off. High Priest Onias III, who was assasinated (cut off) in 171 b.c.e. In 168 b.c.e., the middle of the next "week" of years (171-165 b.c.e.), ruler Antiochus IV (who had Onias killed) pillaged Jerusalem. Antiochus IV matches the "ruler to come",

Now who is the Moshiach?
Dan 12:1-4 says Michael rises to save Israel the same redeemer (HaSheva) who saves
Judah in Jeremiah 23:5-6

Dan CHAPTER TEN Verse 13: But the prince of the kingdom of the Persians resisted me one and twenty days: and behold Michael, one of the chief princes, came to help me, and remained there by the king of the Persians (Cyrus).

**Michael is dealing with Cyrus** thus who is Ezra 1 and Isaiah 44-45 calling LORD(King/head of hosts) AND REDEEMER(HaSheva)?

Verse 20: And the angel said: "Do you know where I came from?" And now will
*Hashev* Lacham Sar Parac"(HaShev fight the prince of Persia).

Verse 21: But I will tell thee what is set down in the scripture of truth: and none is my helper in all these things, but Michael your prince.

1 Ezra 1:1 it was the Lord who stirred up the spirit of Cyrus.
Isaiah 44:24-28 and 45,
the Redeemer (HaSheva)caused Cyrus' heart to change to do the Moshiach roles of delivering the people gathering them, rebuilding the temple etc.
Dan 10 shows this was Michael HaShev who worked on Cyrus' heart doing all the anointed roles, not Jesus.

Check Mate!

The calendar that Daniel was using didn't have 365 1/4 days in it. Your numbers are wrong.

My dog knows more about Sunday School than you know about the KJV

Than you need to be talking to your dog. I didn't say anything about the KJV.

 

[kjw47]

The gospel of Jesus= John 20:17, Rev 3:12---- How does God have a God and still be only one God in existence?

All of those scriptures reference One who calls Himself the First and the Last. In Isaiah, it is clearly God referring to Himself. In Revelation, it is Jesus referring to Himself. JW's thus are faced with either admitting that Jesus is actually God or a liar. I don't think they want to say either one.

3 speak in revelation--Jehovah, Jesus and John. See rev 1:1-- a Rev given to Jesus by God( did he give it to himself?) Did he sit at his own right hand? Did he pray to himself? = NO --this is the true God= John 4:22-24--and Jesus taught that--John 20:17, Rev 3:12-- as well as Paul-2Cor 1:3, 1Cor 8:6, 1Cor 15:24-28--Peter at 1Peter 1:3, and John at Rev 1:6--- anyone teaching something different are teaching dogmas of men. The true gospel of what was taught is right above--4 witnesses to truth.

Jesus called Himself the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End. God also called Himself that. Jesus called Himself God.

Jesus never called himself God--Your teachers twist what he said. Look at Rev 1:1--a revelation given to Jesus by God--- put God as your right hand--it gives something to your left hand( Jesus) are your hands one? No -- Jesus is not God. He is the son of the true Living God.

In Isaiah, someone identifies Himself as "Israel's King" and "the First and the Last". In fact, I will quote:

“This is what the Lord says
Israel’s King and Redeemer, the Lord Almighty:
I am the first and I am the last;
apart from me there is no God.

Do we all agree that the person speaking identifies Himself as God?

In Revelation, someone also identifies Himself as "The First and the Last". Again, I will quote:

Do not be afraid. I am the First and the Last.18 I am the Living One; I was dead,and now look, I am alive for ever and ever! And I hold the keys of death and Hades.

It is clearly Jesus speaking here, because He was dead and is now alive. Jesus would also not dare to take on Himself one of God's titles if it was not His to take. Thus, it is clear that Jesus is calling Himself God.

Another example? From Exodus:

14 God said to Moses, “I am who I am. This is what you are to say to the Israelites: ‘I am has sent me to you.’”

And from John:

“Very truly I tell you,” Jesus answered, “before Abraham was born, I am!” 59 At this, they picked up stones to stone him, but Jesus hid himself, slipping away from the temple grounds.

Why would they want to stone Him? He took for Himself one of God's titles.

Yet another? From Mark:

When Jesus saw their faith, he said to the paralyzed man, “Son, your sins are forgiven.”

6 Now some teachers of the law were sitting there, thinking to themselves, 7 “Why does this fellow talk like that? He’s blaspheming! Who can forgive sins but God alone?” 8 Immediately Jesus knew in his spirit that this was what they were thinking in their hearts, and he said to them, “Why are you thinking these things? 9 Which is easier: to say to this paralyzed man, ‘Your sins are forgiven,’ or to say, ‘Get up, take your mat and walk’? 10 But I want you to know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins.”

There are many places where Jesus claims to be God. You can disagree with Him, but that's what He says.

YHWH(Jehovah) spoke in the ot. YHWH(Jehovah) gave Jesus everything he has, he taught him everything, he shares, honor and glory with Jesus--Jesus taught he can do 0 of his own( John 5:30)--it works like this--Acts 2:22--Gods power goes through Jesus. Only YHWH(Jehovah) is the almighty.

 

[kjw47]

Hi.

I tried searching your site but I didn't find an answer, how do Jehovah's Witnesses reconcile Isaiah 9:6 to their (or your) being nontrinitarians?

EDIT - If anyone is unfamiliar with Isaiah 9:6, here it is:

Isaiah 9:6
English Standard Version (ESV)
(6)For to us a child is born,
to us a son is given;
and the government shall be upon his shoulder,
and his name shall be called
Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

If you read it correctly---Jesus'--NAME-- will be called those things--it is not saying Jesus himself will be those things. There is a big difference.
Jesus taught--John 17:1-6,26--- the one who sent him( John 5:30-Father) is THE ONLY TRUE GOD.--verse 6 = YHWH(Jehovah) , 26= YHWH( Jehovah)-- (making this reality of what a true follower does--John 4:22-24.

The Bible teaches Jesus is Jehovah. And the Father is Eloheim. Even when Christ was on the cross He called Him Eloi.

Savior

psalms

21 They forgat God their savior, which had done great things in Egypt;

Isaiah

3 For I amthe Lordthy God, the Holy Oneof Israel, thy Saviour: I gave Egyptforthy ransom, Ethiopia and Sebafor thee.

11 I, evenI, amthe Lord; and besideme there isno saviour.

15 Verily thou arta God that hidestthyself, O God of Israel, the Saviour.

2Sam 22.3 The God of my rock; in him will I trust: he ismyshield, and the horn of my salvation, my high-tower, and my refuge, my saviour; thou savest me from violence.

Hosea

4 Yet I amthe Lordthy God from the land of Egypt, and thou shalt know no godbut me: for there isno saviour besideme.

New Testament equivalent.

21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his nameJESUS: for he shall savehis people from their sins.

Luke 1:

47 And my spirit hath rejoicedin God my Saviour.

11 For unto you is bornthis day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord.

John 4.42 And said unto the woman, Now we believe, not because of thy saying: for we have heard him ourselves, and know that this is indeed the Christ, the Saviourof the world.

10 Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.

11 This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner.

12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

Acts 13:23 Of this man’s seedhath God according to his promiseraised unto Israel a Saviour, Jesus:

I Tim 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the commandment of God our Saviour, and Lord Jesus Christ, which isour hope;

Titus 1:4 To Titus, mineown son afterthe common faith: Grace, mercy, andpeace, from God the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ our Saviour.

Titus 3:6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;

1Jn 4:14 And we have seen and do testifythat the Father sentthe Son to bethe Saviour of the world.

Repurchaser:

Is 4314 ¶Thus saith the Lord, your redeemer, the Holy One of Israel; For your sake I have sent to Babylon, and have brought down all their nobles, and the Chaldeans, whose cry is in the ships.

15 I am the Lord, your Holy One, the creator of Israel, your King.

Is 54;5 For thy Maker isthine husband; the Lordof hostsishis name; and thy Redeemerthe Holy One of Israel; The Godof the whole earth shall he be called.

Is 59;20 ¶And the Redeemershall cometo Zion, and unto them that turnfrom transgression in Jacob, saith the Lord.

Is. 41

13 For I the Lord thy God will hold thy right hand, saying unto thee, Fear not; I will help thee.

14 Fear not, thou worm Jacob, and ye men of Israel; I will help thee, saith the Lord, and thy redeemer, the Holy Oneof Israel.

Ps 49

15 But God will redeemmy soul from the power of the grave: for he shall receiveme. Selah.

4 As forour redeemer, the Lordof hosts ishis name, the Holy One of Israel.

26 And I will feed them that oppressthee with their own flesh; and they shall be drunken with their own blood, as with sweet wine: and all flesh shall knowthat I the Lordamthy Saviourand thy Redeemer, the mighty Oneof Jacob.

15 But God will redeemmy soul from the power of the grave: for he shall receiveme. Selah.

Acts 20:28

28 ¶Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the churchof God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.

1Peter 1

18 Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;

19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lambwithout blemish and without spot:

Gal. 3

13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: or it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:

Gal 4:4 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sentforth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,

5 To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons.

Col

14 In whom we have redemption through his blood, eventhe forgiveness of sins:

Judgement:

Ichron 16:33 Then shall the treesof the wood sing out at the presence of the Lord, because he cometh to judgethe earth.

Ps 96;13 Before the Lord: for he cometh, for he cometh to judge the earth: he shall judge the world with righteousness, and the people with his truth.

Psalm 9;7 But the Lordshall endure for ever: he hath prepared his throne for judgment.

Matt16:27 For the Son of manshall come in the gloryof his Father with his angels; and then he shall rewardevery man according to his works.

John 5;22 For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committedall judgmentunto the Son:

2Cor. 5;10 For we must all appear before the judgmentseat of Christ; that every one may receive the things donein his body, accordingto that he hath done, whether it begood or bad.

Acts 10;36 The word which God sent unto the children of Israel, preaching peace by Jesus Christ: (he is Lord of all

37 That word, I say, ye know, which was published throughout all Judæa, and began from Galilee, after the baptism which John preached;

38 How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him.

39 And we are witnesses of all things which he did both in the land of the Jews, and in Jerusalem; whom they slew and hanged on a tree:

40 Him God raised up the third day, and shewed him openly;

41 Not to all the people, but unto witnesses chosen before of God, even to us, who did eat and drink with him after he rose from the dead.

42 And he commanded us to preach unto the people, and to testify that it is he which was ordained of God to be the Judge of quick and

Rom 14:10 But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before thejudgment seat of Christ.

Jude

14 And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,

15 To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him.

2Timothy

1 I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom;

Holy One of Israel

Is 43:15 I amthe Lord, your Holy One, the creator of Israel, your King.

Mk 1:24 Saying, Let usalone; whathave we to do with thee, thou Jesus of Nazareth? art thou come to destroy us? I know thee who thou art, the Holy Oneof God.

Lk 4:34 Saying, Let usalone; what have we to do with thee,thouJesus of Nazareth? art thou come to destroy us? I know thee who thou art; the Holy One of God.

Prepare the Way

Is 40:2 Speak ye comfortably to Jerusalem, and cry unto her, that her warfare is accomplished, that her iniquity is pardoned: for she hath received of the Lord’s hand double for all her sins.

3 ¶The voice of him that crieth in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make straight in the desert a highway for our God.

Mk 1:3 The voiceof one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight.

Lk 1:76 And thou, child, shalt be called the prophet of the Highest: for thou shalt go before the face of the Lord toprepare his ways;

77 To give knowledge of salvation unto his people by the

Creation:

Gen 1:26 ¶And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

7 And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so.

Heb 1:2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

I AM

Ex 3:14 And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you.

Jn8:58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you,Before Abraham was, I am.

59 Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.

Book of Revelations

Rev 1:5 And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,

8 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.

The NWTHS really slaughtered this passage

11 Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea.

17 And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last:

18I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.

Rev 2

8 And unto the angel of the church in Smyrna write; These things saith the first and the last, which was dead, and is alive;

YHWH( Jehovah) is the savior-- he does it through Jesus--the same way he parted the red sea through Moses--Moses couldn't do it--Jehovah did. It works the same with Jesus--only YHWH( Jehovah) has the power-- ( last line Lords prayer--The KINGDOM, POWER, and GLORY all belong to the Father.

 

[hadit]

All of those scriptures reference One who calls Himself the First and the Last. In Isaiah, it is clearly God referring to Himself. In Revelation, it is Jesus referring to Himself. JW's thus are faced with either admitting that Jesus is actually God or a liar. I don't think they want to say either one.

3 speak in revelation--Jehovah, Jesus and John. See rev 1:1-- a Rev given to Jesus by God( did he give it to himself?) Did he sit at his own right hand? Did he pray to himself? = NO --this is the true God= John 4:22-24--and Jesus taught that--John 20:17, Rev 3:12-- as well as Paul-2Cor 1:3, 1Cor 8:6, 1Cor 15:24-28--Peter at 1Peter 1:3, and John at Rev 1:6--- anyone teaching something different are teaching dogmas of men. The true gospel of what was taught is right above--4 witnesses to truth.

Jesus called Himself the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End. God also called Himself that. Jesus called Himself God.

Jesus never called himself God--Your teachers twist what he said. Look at Rev 1:1--a revelation given to Jesus by God--- put God as your right hand--it gives something to your left hand( Jesus) are your hands one? No -- Jesus is not God. He is the son of the true Living God.

In Isaiah, someone identifies Himself as "Israel's King" and "the First and the Last". In fact, I will quote:

“This is what the Lord says
Israel’s King and Redeemer, the Lord Almighty:
I am the first and I am the last;
apart from me there is no God.

Do we all agree that the person speaking identifies Himself as God?

In Revelation, someone also identifies Himself as "The First and the Last". Again, I will quote:

Do not be afraid. I am the First and the Last.18 I am the Living One; I was dead,and now look, I am alive for ever and ever! And I hold the keys of death and Hades.

It is clearly Jesus speaking here, because He was dead and is now alive. Jesus would also not dare to take on Himself one of God's titles if it was not His to take. Thus, it is clear that Jesus is calling Himself God.

Another example? From Exodus:

14 God said to Moses, “I am who I am. This is what you are to say to the Israelites: ‘I am has sent me to you.’”

And from John:

“Very truly I tell you,” Jesus answered, “before Abraham was born, I am!” 59 At this, they picked up stones to stone him, but Jesus hid himself, slipping away from the temple grounds.

Why would they want to stone Him? He took for Himself one of God's titles.

Yet another? From Mark:

When Jesus saw their faith, he said to the paralyzed man, “Son, your sins are forgiven.”

6 Now some teachers of the law were sitting there, thinking to themselves, 7 “Why does this fellow talk like that? He’s blaspheming! Who can forgive sins but God alone?” 8 Immediately Jesus knew in his spirit that this was what they were thinking in their hearts, and he said to them, “Why are you thinking these things? 9 Which is easier: to say to this paralyzed man, ‘Your sins are forgiven,’ or to say, ‘Get up, take your mat and walk’? 10 But I want you to know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins.”

There are many places where Jesus claims to be God. You can disagree with Him, but that's what He says.

YHWH(Jehovah) spoke in the ot. YHWH(Jehovah) gave Jesus everything he has, he taught him everything, he shares, honor and glory with Jesus--Jesus taught he can do 0 of his own( John 5:30)--it works like this--Acts 2:22--Gods power goes through Jesus. Only YHWH(Jehovah) is the almighty.

Throughout Scripture it is clear that Jesus is God, as I have shown. Jesus SET ASIDE His authority to become one of us. From Phillipians:

5 In your relationships with one another, have the same mindset as Christ Jesus: Who, being in very nature God, did not consider equality with God something to be used to his own advantage; rather, he made himself nothing by taking the very nature of a servant, being made in human likeness.

Jesus embraced humanity, literally becoming one of us and submitting Himself to God's authority. He is still God.

 

[hadit]

Hi.

I tried searching your site but I didn't find an answer, how do Jehovah's Witnesses reconcile Isaiah 9:6 to their (or your) being nontrinitarians?

EDIT - If anyone is unfamiliar with Isaiah 9:6, here it is:

Isaiah 9:6
English Standard Version (ESV)
(6)For to us a child is born,
to us a son is given;
and the government shall be upon his shoulder,
and his name shall be called
Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

If you read it correctly---Jesus'--NAME-- will be called those things--it is not saying Jesus himself will be those things. There is a big difference.
Jesus taught--John 17:1-6,26--- the one who sent him( John 5:30-Father) is THE ONLY TRUE GOD.--verse 6 = YHWH(Jehovah) , 26= YHWH( Jehovah)-- (making this reality of what a true follower does--John 4:22-24.

The Bible teaches Jesus is Jehovah. And the Father is Eloheim. Even when Christ was on the cross He called Him Eloi.

Savior

psalms

21 They forgat God their savior, which had done great things in Egypt;

Isaiah

3 For I amthe Lordthy God, the Holy Oneof Israel, thy Saviour: I gave Egyptforthy ransom, Ethiopia and Sebafor thee.

11 I, evenI, amthe Lord; and besideme there isno saviour.

15 Verily thou arta God that hidestthyself, O God of Israel, the Saviour.

2Sam 22.3 The God of my rock; in him will I trust: he ismyshield, and the horn of my salvation, my high-tower, and my refuge, my saviour; thou savest me from violence.

Hosea

4 Yet I amthe Lordthy God from the land of Egypt, and thou shalt know no godbut me: for there isno saviour besideme.

New Testament equivalent.

21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his nameJESUS: for he shall savehis people from their sins.

Luke 1:

47 And my spirit hath rejoicedin God my Saviour.

11 For unto you is bornthis day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord.

John 4.42 And said unto the woman, Now we believe, not because of thy saying: for we have heard him ourselves, and know that this is indeed the Christ, the Saviourof the world.

10 Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.

11 This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner.

12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

Acts 13:23 Of this man’s seedhath God according to his promiseraised unto Israel a Saviour, Jesus:

I Tim 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the commandment of God our Saviour, and Lord Jesus Christ, which isour hope;

Titus 1:4 To Titus, mineown son afterthe common faith: Grace, mercy, andpeace, from God the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ our Saviour.

Titus 3:6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;

1Jn 4:14 And we have seen and do testifythat the Father sentthe Son to bethe Saviour of the world.

Repurchaser:

Is 4314 ¶Thus saith the Lord, your redeemer, the Holy One of Israel; For your sake I have sent to Babylon, and have brought down all their nobles, and the Chaldeans, whose cry is in the ships.

15 I am the Lord, your Holy One, the creator of Israel, your King.

Is 54;5 For thy Maker isthine husband; the Lordof hostsishis name; and thy Redeemerthe Holy One of Israel; The Godof the whole earth shall he be called.

Is 59;20 ¶And the Redeemershall cometo Zion, and unto them that turnfrom transgression in Jacob, saith the Lord.

Is. 41

13 For I the Lord thy God will hold thy right hand, saying unto thee, Fear not; I will help thee.

14 Fear not, thou worm Jacob, and ye men of Israel; I will help thee, saith the Lord, and thy redeemer, the Holy Oneof Israel.

Ps 49

15 But God will redeemmy soul from the power of the grave: for he shall receiveme. Selah.

4 As forour redeemer, the Lordof hosts ishis name, the Holy One of Israel.

26 And I will feed them that oppressthee with their own flesh; and they shall be drunken with their own blood, as with sweet wine: and all flesh shall knowthat I the Lordamthy Saviourand thy Redeemer, the mighty Oneof Jacob.

15 But God will redeemmy soul from the power of the grave: for he shall receiveme. Selah.

Acts 20:28

28 ¶Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the churchof God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.

1Peter 1

18 Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;

19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lambwithout blemish and without spot:

Gal. 3

13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: or it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:

Gal 4:4 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sentforth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,

5 To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons.

Col

14 In whom we have redemption through his blood, eventhe forgiveness of sins:

Judgement:

Ichron 16:33 Then shall the treesof the wood sing out at the presence of the Lord, because he cometh to judgethe earth.

Ps 96;13 Before the Lord: for he cometh, for he cometh to judge the earth: he shall judge the world with righteousness, and the people with his truth.

Psalm 9;7 But the Lordshall endure for ever: he hath prepared his throne for judgment.

Matt16:27 For the Son of manshall come in the gloryof his Father with his angels; and then he shall rewardevery man according to his works.

John 5;22 For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committedall judgmentunto the Son:

2Cor. 5;10 For we must all appear before the judgmentseat of Christ; that every one may receive the things donein his body, accordingto that he hath done, whether it begood or bad.

Acts 10;36 The word which God sent unto the children of Israel, preaching peace by Jesus Christ: (he is Lord of all

37 That word, I say, ye know, which was published throughout all Judæa, and began from Galilee, after the baptism which John preached;

38 How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him.

39 And we are witnesses of all things which he did both in the land of the Jews, and in Jerusalem; whom they slew and hanged on a tree:

40 Him God raised up the third day, and shewed him openly;

41 Not to all the people, but unto witnesses chosen before of God, even to us, who did eat and drink with him after he rose from the dead.

42 And he commanded us to preach unto the people, and to testify that it is he which was ordained of God to be the Judge of quick and

Rom 14:10 But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before thejudgment seat of Christ.

Jude

14 And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,

15 To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him.

2Timothy

1 I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom;

Holy One of Israel

Is 43:15 I amthe Lord, your Holy One, the creator of Israel, your King.

Mk 1:24 Saying, Let usalone; whathave we to do with thee, thou Jesus of Nazareth? art thou come to destroy us? I know thee who thou art, the Holy Oneof God.

Lk 4:34 Saying, Let usalone; what have we to do with thee,thouJesus of Nazareth? art thou come to destroy us? I know thee who thou art; the Holy One of God.

Prepare the Way

Is 40:2 Speak ye comfortably to Jerusalem, and cry unto her, that her warfare is accomplished, that her iniquity is pardoned: for she hath received of the Lord’s hand double for all her sins.

3 ¶The voice of him that crieth in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make straight in the desert a highway for our God.

Mk 1:3 The voiceof one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight.

Lk 1:76 And thou, child, shalt be called the prophet of the Highest: for thou shalt go before the face of the Lord toprepare his ways;

77 To give knowledge of salvation unto his people by the

Creation:

Gen 1:26 ¶And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

7 And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so.

Heb 1:2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

I AM

Ex 3:14 And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you.

Jn8:58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you,Before Abraham was, I am.

59 Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.

Book of Revelations

Rev 1:5 And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,

8 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.

The NWTHS really slaughtered this passage

11 Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea.

17 And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last:

18I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.

Rev 2

8 And unto the angel of the church in Smyrna write; These things saith the first and the last, which was dead, and is alive;

YHWH( Jehovah) is the savior-- he does it through Jesus--the same way he parted the red sea through Moses--Moses couldn't do it--Jehovah did. It works the same with Jesus--only YHWH( Jehovah) has the power-- ( last line Lords prayer--The KINGDOM, POWER, and GLORY all belong to the Father.

Who, then is the First and the Last?

 

[kjw47]

3 speak in revelation--Jehovah, Jesus and John. See rev 1:1-- a Rev given to Jesus by God( did he give it to himself?) Did he sit at his own right hand? Did he pray to himself? = NO --this is the true God= John 4:22-24--and Jesus taught that--John 20:17, Rev 3:12-- as well as Paul-2Cor 1:3, 1Cor 8:6, 1Cor 15:24-28--Peter at 1Peter 1:3, and John at Rev 1:6--- anyone teaching something different are teaching dogmas of men. The true gospel of what was taught is right above--4 witnesses to truth.

Jesus called Himself the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End. God also called Himself that. Jesus called Himself God.

Jesus never called himself God--Your teachers twist what he said. Look at Rev 1:1--a revelation given to Jesus by God--- put God as your right hand--it gives something to your left hand( Jesus) are your hands one? No -- Jesus is not God. He is the son of the true Living God.

In Isaiah, someone identifies Himself as "Israel's King" and "the First and the Last". In fact, I will quote:

“This is what the Lord says
Israel’s King and Redeemer, the Lord Almighty:
I am the first and I am the last;
apart from me there is no God.

Do we all agree that the person speaking identifies Himself as God?

In Revelation, someone also identifies Himself as "The First and the Last". Again, I will quote:

Do not be afraid. I am the First and the Last.18 I am the Living One; I was dead,and now look, I am alive for ever and ever! And I hold the keys of death and Hades.

It is clearly Jesus speaking here, because He was dead and is now alive. Jesus would also not dare to take on Himself one of God's titles if it was not His to take. Thus, it is clear that Jesus is calling Himself God.

Another example? From Exodus:

14 God said to Moses, “I am who I am. This is what you are to say to the Israelites: ‘I am has sent me to you.’”

And from John:

“Very truly I tell you,” Jesus answered, “before Abraham was born, I am!” 59 At this, they picked up stones to stone him, but Jesus hid himself, slipping away from the temple grounds.

Why would they want to stone Him? He took for Himself one of God's titles.

Yet another? From Mark:

When Jesus saw their faith, he said to the paralyzed man, “Son, your sins are forgiven.”

6 Now some teachers of the law were sitting there, thinking to themselves, 7 “Why does this fellow talk like that? He’s blaspheming! Who can forgive sins but God alone?” 8 Immediately Jesus knew in his spirit that this was what they were thinking in their hearts, and he said to them, “Why are you thinking these things? 9 Which is easier: to say to this paralyzed man, ‘Your sins are forgiven,’ or to say, ‘Get up, take your mat and walk’? 10 But I want you to know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins.”

There are many places where Jesus claims to be God. You can disagree with Him, but that's what He says.

YHWH(Jehovah) spoke in the ot. YHWH(Jehovah) gave Jesus everything he has, he taught him everything, he shares, honor and glory with Jesus--Jesus taught he can do 0 of his own( John 5:30)--it works like this--Acts 2:22--Gods power goes through Jesus. Only YHWH(Jehovah) is the almighty.

Throughout Scripture it is clear that Jesus is God, as I have shown. Jesus SET ASIDE His authority to become one of us. From Phillipians:

5 In your relationships with one another, have the same mindset as Christ Jesus: Who, being in very nature God, did not consider equality with God something to be used to his own advantage; rather, he made himself nothing by taking the very nature of a servant, being made in human likeness.

Jesus embraced humanity, literally becoming one of us and submitting Himself to God's authority. He is still God.

Then please explain how God has a God--because Jesus does--John 20:17( in the flesh) --- (rev 3:12--while in heaven as a spirit)---And Why after he hands back the kingdom to his God and Father that Jesus subjects himself, forever 1Cor 15:24-28)

 

[kjw47]

Hi.

I tried searching your site but I didn't find an answer, how do Jehovah's Witnesses reconcile Isaiah 9:6 to their (or your) being nontrinitarians?

EDIT - If anyone is unfamiliar with Isaiah 9:6, here it is:

Isaiah 9:6
English Standard Version (ESV)
(6)For to us a child is born,
to us a son is given;
and the government shall be upon his shoulder,
and his name shall be called
Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

If you read it correctly---Jesus'--NAME-- will be called those things--it is not saying Jesus himself will be those things. There is a big difference.
Jesus taught--John 17:1-6,26--- the one who sent him( John 5:30-Father) is THE ONLY TRUE GOD.--verse 6 = YHWH(Jehovah) , 26= YHWH( Jehovah)-- (making this reality of what a true follower does--John 4:22-24.

The Bible teaches Jesus is Jehovah. And the Father is Eloheim. Even when Christ was on the cross He called Him Eloi.

Savior

psalms

21 They forgat God their savior, which had done great things in Egypt;

Isaiah

3 For I amthe Lordthy God, the Holy Oneof Israel, thy Saviour: I gave Egyptforthy ransom, Ethiopia and Sebafor thee.

11 I, evenI, amthe Lord; and besideme there isno saviour.

15 Verily thou arta God that hidestthyself, O God of Israel, the Saviour.

2Sam 22.3 The God of my rock; in him will I trust: he ismyshield, and the horn of my salvation, my high-tower, and my refuge, my saviour; thou savest me from violence.

Hosea

4 Yet I amthe Lordthy God from the land of Egypt, and thou shalt know no godbut me: for there isno saviour besideme.

New Testament equivalent.

21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his nameJESUS: for he shall savehis people from their sins.

Luke 1:

47 And my spirit hath rejoicedin God my Saviour.

11 For unto you is bornthis day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord.

John 4.42 And said unto the woman, Now we believe, not because of thy saying: for we have heard him ourselves, and know that this is indeed the Christ, the Saviourof the world.

10 Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.

11 This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner.

12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

Acts 13:23 Of this man’s seedhath God according to his promiseraised unto Israel a Saviour, Jesus:

I Tim 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the commandment of God our Saviour, and Lord Jesus Christ, which isour hope;

Titus 1:4 To Titus, mineown son afterthe common faith: Grace, mercy, andpeace, from God the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ our Saviour.

Titus 3:6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;

1Jn 4:14 And we have seen and do testifythat the Father sentthe Son to bethe Saviour of the world.

Repurchaser:

Is 4314 ¶Thus saith the Lord, your redeemer, the Holy One of Israel; For your sake I have sent to Babylon, and have brought down all their nobles, and the Chaldeans, whose cry is in the ships.

15 I am the Lord, your Holy One, the creator of Israel, your King.

Is 54;5 For thy Maker isthine husband; the Lordof hostsishis name; and thy Redeemerthe Holy One of Israel; The Godof the whole earth shall he be called.

Is 59;20 ¶And the Redeemershall cometo Zion, and unto them that turnfrom transgression in Jacob, saith the Lord.

Is. 41

13 For I the Lord thy God will hold thy right hand, saying unto thee, Fear not; I will help thee.

14 Fear not, thou worm Jacob, and ye men of Israel; I will help thee, saith the Lord, and thy redeemer, the Holy Oneof Israel.

Ps 49

15 But God will redeemmy soul from the power of the grave: for he shall receiveme. Selah.

4 As forour redeemer, the Lordof hosts ishis name, the Holy One of Israel.

26 And I will feed them that oppressthee with their own flesh; and they shall be drunken with their own blood, as with sweet wine: and all flesh shall knowthat I the Lordamthy Saviourand thy Redeemer, the mighty Oneof Jacob.

15 But God will redeemmy soul from the power of the grave: for he shall receiveme. Selah.

Acts 20:28

28 ¶Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the churchof God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.

1Peter 1

18 Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;

19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lambwithout blemish and without spot:

Gal. 3

13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: or it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:

Gal 4:4 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sentforth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,

5 To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons.

Col

14 In whom we have redemption through his blood, eventhe forgiveness of sins:

Judgement:

Ichron 16:33 Then shall the treesof the wood sing out at the presence of the Lord, because he cometh to judgethe earth.

Ps 96;13 Before the Lord: for he cometh, for he cometh to judge the earth: he shall judge the world with righteousness, and the people with his truth.

Psalm 9;7 But the Lordshall endure for ever: he hath prepared his throne for judgment.

Matt16:27 For the Son of manshall come in the gloryof his Father with his angels; and then he shall rewardevery man according to his works.

John 5;22 For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committedall judgmentunto the Son:

2Cor. 5;10 For we must all appear before the judgmentseat of Christ; that every one may receive the things donein his body, accordingto that he hath done, whether it begood or bad.

Acts 10;36 The word which God sent unto the children of Israel, preaching peace by Jesus Christ: (he is Lord of all

37 That word, I say, ye know, which was published throughout all Judæa, and began from Galilee, after the baptism which John preached;

38 How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him.

39 And we are witnesses of all things which he did both in the land of the Jews, and in Jerusalem; whom they slew and hanged on a tree:

40 Him God raised up the third day, and shewed him openly;

41 Not to all the people, but unto witnesses chosen before of God, even to us, who did eat and drink with him after he rose from the dead.

42 And he commanded us to preach unto the people, and to testify that it is he which was ordained of God to be the Judge of quick and

Rom 14:10 But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before thejudgment seat of Christ.

Jude

14 And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,

15 To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him.

2Timothy

1 I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom;

Holy One of Israel

Is 43:15 I amthe Lord, your Holy One, the creator of Israel, your King.

Mk 1:24 Saying, Let usalone; whathave we to do with thee, thou Jesus of Nazareth? art thou come to destroy us? I know thee who thou art, the Holy Oneof God.

Lk 4:34 Saying, Let usalone; what have we to do with thee,thouJesus of Nazareth? art thou come to destroy us? I know thee who thou art; the Holy One of God.

Prepare the Way

Is 40:2 Speak ye comfortably to Jerusalem, and cry unto her, that her warfare is accomplished, that her iniquity is pardoned: for she hath received of the Lord’s hand double for all her sins.

3 ¶The voice of him that crieth in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make straight in the desert a highway for our God.

Mk 1:3 The voiceof one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight.

Lk 1:76 And thou, child, shalt be called the prophet of the Highest: for thou shalt go before the face of the Lord toprepare his ways;

77 To give knowledge of salvation unto his people by the

Creation:

Gen 1:26 ¶And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

7 And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so.

Heb 1:2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

I AM

Ex 3:14 And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you.

Jn8:58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you,Before Abraham was, I am.

59 Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.

Book of Revelations

Rev 1:5 And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,

8 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.

The NWTHS really slaughtered this passage

11 Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea.

17 And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last:

18I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.

Rev 2

8 And unto the angel of the church in Smyrna write; These things saith the first and the last, which was dead, and is alive;

YHWH( Jehovah) is the savior-- he does it through Jesus--the same way he parted the red sea through Moses--Moses couldn't do it--Jehovah did. It works the same with Jesus--only YHWH( Jehovah) has the power-- ( last line Lords prayer--The KINGDOM, POWER, and GLORY all belong to the Father.

Who, then is the First and the Last?

Both are in certain things.

 

[hadit]

Jesus called Himself the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End. God also called Himself that. Jesus called Himself God.

Jesus never called himself God--Your teachers twist what he said. Look at Rev 1:1--a revelation given to Jesus by God--- put God as your right hand--it gives something to your left hand( Jesus) are your hands one? No -- Jesus is not God. He is the son of the true Living God.

In Isaiah, someone identifies Himself as "Israel's King" and "the First and the Last". In fact, I will quote:

“This is what the Lord says
Israel’s King and Redeemer, the Lord Almighty:
I am the first and I am the last;
apart from me there is no God.

Do we all agree that the person speaking identifies Himself as God?

In Revelation, someone also identifies Himself as "The First and the Last". Again, I will quote:

Do not be afraid. I am the First and the Last.18 I am the Living One; I was dead,and now look, I am alive for ever and ever! And I hold the keys of death and Hades.

It is clearly Jesus speaking here, because He was dead and is now alive. Jesus would also not dare to take on Himself one of God's titles if it was not His to take. Thus, it is clear that Jesus is calling Himself God.

Another example? From Exodus:

14 God said to Moses, “I am who I am. This is what you are to say to the Israelites: ‘I am has sent me to you.’”

And from John:

“Very truly I tell you,” Jesus answered, “before Abraham was born, I am!” 59 At this, they picked up stones to stone him, but Jesus hid himself, slipping away from the temple grounds.

Why would they want to stone Him? He took for Himself one of God's titles.

Yet another? From Mark:

When Jesus saw their faith, he said to the paralyzed man, “Son, your sins are forgiven.”

6 Now some teachers of the law were sitting there, thinking to themselves, 7 “Why does this fellow talk like that? He’s blaspheming! Who can forgive sins but God alone?” 8 Immediately Jesus knew in his spirit that this was what they were thinking in their hearts, and he said to them, “Why are you thinking these things? 9 Which is easier: to say to this paralyzed man, ‘Your sins are forgiven,’ or to say, ‘Get up, take your mat and walk’? 10 But I want you to know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins.”

There are many places where Jesus claims to be God. You can disagree with Him, but that's what He says.

YHWH(Jehovah) spoke in the ot. YHWH(Jehovah) gave Jesus everything he has, he taught him everything, he shares, honor and glory with Jesus--Jesus taught he can do 0 of his own( John 5:30)--it works like this--Acts 2:22--Gods power goes through Jesus. Only YHWH(Jehovah) is the almighty.

Throughout Scripture it is clear that Jesus is God, as I have shown. Jesus SET ASIDE His authority to become one of us. From Phillipians:

5 In your relationships with one another, have the same mindset as Christ Jesus: Who, being in very nature God, did not consider equality with God something to be used to his own advantage; rather, he made himself nothing by taking the very nature of a servant, being made in human likeness.

Jesus embraced humanity, literally becoming one of us and submitting Himself to God's authority. He is still God.

Then please explain how God has a God--because Jesus does--John 20:17( in the flesh) --- (rev 3:12--while in heaven as a spirit)---And Why after he hands back the kingdom to his God and Father that Jesus subjects himself, forever 1Cor 15:24-28)

Did you not see where He set aside His authority and humbled Himself to become one of us?

 

[hadit]

Hi.

I tried searching your site but I didn't find an answer, how do Jehovah's Witnesses reconcile Isaiah 9:6 to their (or your) being nontrinitarians?

EDIT - If anyone is unfamiliar with Isaiah 9:6, here it is:

Isaiah 9:6
English Standard Version (ESV)
(6)For to us a child is born,
to us a son is given;
and the government shall be upon his shoulder,
and his name shall be called
Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

If you read it correctly---Jesus'--NAME-- will be called those things--it is not saying Jesus himself will be those things. There is a big difference.
Jesus taught--John 17:1-6,26--- the one who sent him( John 5:30-Father) is THE ONLY TRUE GOD.--verse 6 = YHWH(Jehovah) , 26= YHWH( Jehovah)-- (making this reality of what a true follower does--John 4:22-24.

The Bible teaches Jesus is Jehovah. And the Father is Eloheim. Even when Christ was on the cross He called Him Eloi.

Savior

psalms

21 They forgat God their savior, which had done great things in Egypt;

Isaiah

3 For I amthe Lordthy God, the Holy Oneof Israel, thy Saviour: I gave Egyptforthy ransom, Ethiopia and Sebafor thee.

11 I, evenI, amthe Lord; and besideme there isno saviour.

15 Verily thou arta God that hidestthyself, O God of Israel, the Saviour.

2Sam 22.3 The God of my rock; in him will I trust: he ismyshield, and the horn of my salvation, my high-tower, and my refuge, my saviour; thou savest me from violence.

Hosea

4 Yet I amthe Lordthy God from the land of Egypt, and thou shalt know no godbut me: for there isno saviour besideme.

New Testament equivalent.

21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his nameJESUS: for he shall savehis people from their sins.

Luke 1:

47 And my spirit hath rejoicedin God my Saviour.

11 For unto you is bornthis day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord.

John 4.42 And said unto the woman, Now we believe, not because of thy saying: for we have heard him ourselves, and know that this is indeed the Christ, the Saviourof the world.

10 Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.

11 This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner.

12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

Acts 13:23 Of this man’s seedhath God according to his promiseraised unto Israel a Saviour, Jesus:

I Tim 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the commandment of God our Saviour, and Lord Jesus Christ, which isour hope;

Titus 1:4 To Titus, mineown son afterthe common faith: Grace, mercy, andpeace, from God the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ our Saviour.

Titus 3:6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;

1Jn 4:14 And we have seen and do testifythat the Father sentthe Son to bethe Saviour of the world.

Repurchaser:

Is 4314 ¶Thus saith the Lord, your redeemer, the Holy One of Israel; For your sake I have sent to Babylon, and have brought down all their nobles, and the Chaldeans, whose cry is in the ships.

15 I am the Lord, your Holy One, the creator of Israel, your King.

Is 54;5 For thy Maker isthine husband; the Lordof hostsishis name; and thy Redeemerthe Holy One of Israel; The Godof the whole earth shall he be called.

Is 59;20 ¶And the Redeemershall cometo Zion, and unto them that turnfrom transgression in Jacob, saith the Lord.

Is. 41

13 For I the Lord thy God will hold thy right hand, saying unto thee, Fear not; I will help thee.

14 Fear not, thou worm Jacob, and ye men of Israel; I will help thee, saith the Lord, and thy redeemer, the Holy Oneof Israel.

Ps 49

15 But God will redeemmy soul from the power of the grave: for he shall receiveme. Selah.

4 As forour redeemer, the Lordof hosts ishis name, the Holy One of Israel.

26 And I will feed them that oppressthee with their own flesh; and they shall be drunken with their own blood, as with sweet wine: and all flesh shall knowthat I the Lordamthy Saviourand thy Redeemer, the mighty Oneof Jacob.

15 But God will redeemmy soul from the power of the grave: for he shall receiveme. Selah.

Acts 20:28

28 ¶Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the churchof God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.

1Peter 1

18 Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;

19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lambwithout blemish and without spot:

Gal. 3

13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: or it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:

Gal 4:4 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sentforth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,

5 To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons.

Col

14 In whom we have redemption through his blood, eventhe forgiveness of sins:

Judgement:

Ichron 16:33 Then shall the treesof the wood sing out at the presence of the Lord, because he cometh to judgethe earth.

Ps 96;13 Before the Lord: for he cometh, for he cometh to judge the earth: he shall judge the world with righteousness, and the people with his truth.

Psalm 9;7 But the Lordshall endure for ever: he hath prepared his throne for judgment.

Matt16:27 For the Son of manshall come in the gloryof his Father with his angels; and then he shall rewardevery man according to his works.

John 5;22 For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committedall judgmentunto the Son:

2Cor. 5;10 For we must all appear before the judgmentseat of Christ; that every one may receive the things donein his body, accordingto that he hath done, whether it begood or bad.

Acts 10;36 The word which God sent unto the children of Israel, preaching peace by Jesus Christ: (he is Lord of all

37 That word, I say, ye know, which was published throughout all Judæa, and began from Galilee, after the baptism which John preached;

38 How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him.

39 And we are witnesses of all things which he did both in the land of the Jews, and in Jerusalem; whom they slew and hanged on a tree:

40 Him God raised up the third day, and shewed him openly;

41 Not to all the people, but unto witnesses chosen before of God, even to us, who did eat and drink with him after he rose from the dead.

42 And he commanded us to preach unto the people, and to testify that it is he which was ordained of God to be the Judge of quick and

Rom 14:10 But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before thejudgment seat of Christ.

Jude

14 And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,

15 To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him.

2Timothy

1 I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom;

Holy One of Israel

Is 43:15 I amthe Lord, your Holy One, the creator of Israel, your King.

Mk 1:24 Saying, Let usalone; whathave we to do with thee, thou Jesus of Nazareth? art thou come to destroy us? I know thee who thou art, the Holy Oneof God.

Lk 4:34 Saying, Let usalone; what have we to do with thee,thouJesus of Nazareth? art thou come to destroy us? I know thee who thou art; the Holy One of God.

Prepare the Way

Is 40:2 Speak ye comfortably to Jerusalem, and cry unto her, that her warfare is accomplished, that her iniquity is pardoned: for she hath received of the Lord’s hand double for all her sins.

3 ¶The voice of him that crieth in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make straight in the desert a highway for our God.

Mk 1:3 The voiceof one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight.

Lk 1:76 And thou, child, shalt be called the prophet of the Highest: for thou shalt go before the face of the Lord toprepare his ways;

77 To give knowledge of salvation unto his people by the

Creation:

Gen 1:26 ¶And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

7 And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so.

Heb 1:2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

I AM

Ex 3:14 And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you.

Jn8:58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you,Before Abraham was, I am.

59 Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.

Book of Revelations

Rev 1:5 And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,

8 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.

The NWTHS really slaughtered this passage

11 Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea.

17 And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last:

18I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.

Rev 2

8 And unto the angel of the church in Smyrna write; These things saith the first and the last, which was dead, and is alive;

YHWH( Jehovah) is the savior-- he does it through Jesus--the same way he parted the red sea through Moses--Moses couldn't do it--Jehovah did. It works the same with Jesus--only YHWH( Jehovah) has the power-- ( last line Lords prayer--The KINGDOM, POWER, and GLORY all belong to the Father.

Who, then is the First and the Last?

Both are in certain things.

That does not make sense. Jesus would not take on Himself one of God's titles if He is not worthy of it. There can only be one First and Last. Also, who has the power to forgive sin, other than God Himself?

 

[kjw47]

Jesus never called himself God--Your teachers twist what he said. Look at Rev 1:1--a revelation given to Jesus by God--- put God as your right hand--it gives something to your left hand( Jesus) are your hands one? No -- Jesus is not God. He is the son of the true Living God.

In Isaiah, someone identifies Himself as "Israel's King" and "the First and the Last". In fact, I will quote:

“This is what the Lord says
Israel’s King and Redeemer, the Lord Almighty:
I am the first and I am the last;
apart from me there is no God.

Do we all agree that the person speaking identifies Himself as God?

In Revelation, someone also identifies Himself as "The First and the Last". Again, I will quote:

Do not be afraid. I am the First and the Last.18 I am the Living One; I was dead,and now look, I am alive for ever and ever! And I hold the keys of death and Hades.

It is clearly Jesus speaking here, because He was dead and is now alive. Jesus would also not dare to take on Himself one of God's titles if it was not His to take. Thus, it is clear that Jesus is calling Himself God.

Another example? From Exodus:

14 God said to Moses, “I am who I am. This is what you are to say to the Israelites: ‘I am has sent me to you.’”

And from John:

“Very truly I tell you,” Jesus answered, “before Abraham was born, I am!” 59 At this, they picked up stones to stone him, but Jesus hid himself, slipping away from the temple grounds.

Why would they want to stone Him? He took for Himself one of God's titles.

Yet another? From Mark:

When Jesus saw their faith, he said to the paralyzed man, “Son, your sins are forgiven.”

6 Now some teachers of the law were sitting there, thinking to themselves, 7 “Why does this fellow talk like that? He’s blaspheming! Who can forgive sins but God alone?” 8 Immediately Jesus knew in his spirit that this was what they were thinking in their hearts, and he said to them, “Why are you thinking these things? 9 Which is easier: to say to this paralyzed man, ‘Your sins are forgiven,’ or to say, ‘Get up, take your mat and walk’? 10 But I want you to know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins.”

There are many places where Jesus claims to be God. You can disagree with Him, but that's what He says.

YHWH(Jehovah) spoke in the ot. YHWH(Jehovah) gave Jesus everything he has, he taught him everything, he shares, honor and glory with Jesus--Jesus taught he can do 0 of his own( John 5:30)--it works like this--Acts 2:22--Gods power goes through Jesus. Only YHWH(Jehovah) is the almighty.

Throughout Scripture it is clear that Jesus is God, as I have shown. Jesus SET ASIDE His authority to become one of us. From Phillipians:

5 In your relationships with one another, have the same mindset as Christ Jesus: Who, being in very nature God, did not consider equality with God something to be used to his own advantage; rather, he made himself nothing by taking the very nature of a servant, being made in human likeness.

Jesus embraced humanity, literally becoming one of us and submitting Himself to God's authority. He is still God.

Then please explain how God has a God--because Jesus does--John 20:17( in the flesh) --- (rev 3:12--while in heaven as a spirit)---And Why after he hands back the kingdom to his God and Father that Jesus subjects himself, forever 1Cor 15:24-28)

Did you not see where He set aside His authority and humbled Himself to become one of us?

Yes he was prince of all angels, he became lower than the angels( mortal) Hebrews 2:7)--- he died and paid the wages of sin he did not owe( the ransom sacrifice)And received- a 1000 year kingship and a bride of Christ( little flock-Luke 12:32) = 144,000)
You see the ot clearly teaches--God is king of eternity---If Jesus were that God, he could not be appointed to a kingship( Dan 7:13-15) he already would be king. But not only is he appointed, he must hand it back to his God as well( 1Cor 15:24-28)--- so how does God have a God, yet there only be one God?

 

[kjw47]

If you read it correctly---Jesus'--NAME-- will be called those things--it is not saying Jesus himself will be those things. There is a big difference.
Jesus taught--John 17:1-6,26--- the one who sent him( John 5:30-Father) is THE ONLY TRUE GOD.--verse 6 = YHWH(Jehovah) , 26= YHWH( Jehovah)-- (making this reality of what a true follower does--John 4:22-24.

The Bible teaches Jesus is Jehovah. And the Father is Eloheim. Even when Christ was on the cross He called Him Eloi.

Savior

psalms

21 They forgat God their savior, which had done great things in Egypt;

Isaiah

3 For I amthe Lordthy God, the Holy Oneof Israel, thy Saviour: I gave Egyptforthy ransom, Ethiopia and Sebafor thee.

11 I, evenI, amthe Lord; and besideme there isno saviour.

15 Verily thou arta God that hidestthyself, O God of Israel, the Saviour.

2Sam 22.3 The God of my rock; in him will I trust: he ismyshield, and the horn of my salvation, my high-tower, and my refuge, my saviour; thou savest me from violence.

Hosea

4 Yet I amthe Lordthy God from the land of Egypt, and thou shalt know no godbut me: for there isno saviour besideme.

New Testament equivalent.

21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his nameJESUS: for he shall savehis people from their sins.

Luke 1:

47 And my spirit hath rejoicedin God my Saviour.

11 For unto you is bornthis day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord.

John 4.42 And said unto the woman, Now we believe, not because of thy saying: for we have heard him ourselves, and know that this is indeed the Christ, the Saviourof the world.

10 Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.

11 This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner.

12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

Acts 13:23 Of this man’s seedhath God according to his promiseraised unto Israel a Saviour, Jesus:

I Tim 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the commandment of God our Saviour, and Lord Jesus Christ, which isour hope;

Titus 1:4 To Titus, mineown son afterthe common faith: Grace, mercy, andpeace, from God the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ our Saviour.

Titus 3:6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;

1Jn 4:14 And we have seen and do testifythat the Father sentthe Son to bethe Saviour of the world.

Repurchaser:

Is 4314 ¶Thus saith the Lord, your redeemer, the Holy One of Israel; For your sake I have sent to Babylon, and have brought down all their nobles, and the Chaldeans, whose cry is in the ships.

15 I am the Lord, your Holy One, the creator of Israel, your King.

Is 54;5 For thy Maker isthine husband; the Lordof hostsishis name; and thy Redeemerthe Holy One of Israel; The Godof the whole earth shall he be called.

Is 59;20 ¶And the Redeemershall cometo Zion, and unto them that turnfrom transgression in Jacob, saith the Lord.

Is. 41

13 For I the Lord thy God will hold thy right hand, saying unto thee, Fear not; I will help thee.

14 Fear not, thou worm Jacob, and ye men of Israel; I will help thee, saith the Lord, and thy redeemer, the Holy Oneof Israel.

Ps 49

15 But God will redeemmy soul from the power of the grave: for he shall receiveme. Selah.

4 As forour redeemer, the Lordof hosts ishis name, the Holy One of Israel.

26 And I will feed them that oppressthee with their own flesh; and they shall be drunken with their own blood, as with sweet wine: and all flesh shall knowthat I the Lordamthy Saviourand thy Redeemer, the mighty Oneof Jacob.

15 But God will redeemmy soul from the power of the grave: for he shall receiveme. Selah.

Acts 20:28

28 ¶Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the churchof God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.

1Peter 1

18 Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;

19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lambwithout blemish and without spot:

Gal. 3

13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: or it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:

Gal 4:4 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sentforth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,

5 To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons.

Col

14 In whom we have redemption through his blood, eventhe forgiveness of sins:

Judgement:

Ichron 16:33 Then shall the treesof the wood sing out at the presence of the Lord, because he cometh to judgethe earth.

Ps 96;13 Before the Lord: for he cometh, for he cometh to judge the earth: he shall judge the world with righteousness, and the people with his truth.

Psalm 9;7 But the Lordshall endure for ever: he hath prepared his throne for judgment.

Matt16:27 For the Son of manshall come in the gloryof his Father with his angels; and then he shall rewardevery man according to his works.

John 5;22 For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committedall judgmentunto the Son:

2Cor. 5;10 For we must all appear before the judgmentseat of Christ; that every one may receive the things donein his body, accordingto that he hath done, whether it begood or bad.

Acts 10;36 The word which God sent unto the children of Israel, preaching peace by Jesus Christ: (he is Lord of all

37 That word, I say, ye know, which was published throughout all Judæa, and began from Galilee, after the baptism which John preached;

38 How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him.

39 And we are witnesses of all things which he did both in the land of the Jews, and in Jerusalem; whom they slew and hanged on a tree:

40 Him God raised up the third day, and shewed him openly;

41 Not to all the people, but unto witnesses chosen before of God, even to us, who did eat and drink with him after he rose from the dead.

42 And he commanded us to preach unto the people, and to testify that it is he which was ordained of God to be the Judge of quick and

Rom 14:10 But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before thejudgment seat of Christ.

Jude

14 And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,

15 To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him.

2Timothy

1 I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom;

Holy One of Israel

Is 43:15 I amthe Lord, your Holy One, the creator of Israel, your King.

Mk 1:24 Saying, Let usalone; whathave we to do with thee, thou Jesus of Nazareth? art thou come to destroy us? I know thee who thou art, the Holy Oneof God.

Lk 4:34 Saying, Let usalone; what have we to do with thee,thouJesus of Nazareth? art thou come to destroy us? I know thee who thou art; the Holy One of God.

Prepare the Way

Is 40:2 Speak ye comfortably to Jerusalem, and cry unto her, that her warfare is accomplished, that her iniquity is pardoned: for she hath received of the Lord’s hand double for all her sins.

3 ¶The voice of him that crieth in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make straight in the desert a highway for our God.

Mk 1:3 The voiceof one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight.

Lk 1:76 And thou, child, shalt be called the prophet of the Highest: for thou shalt go before the face of the Lord toprepare his ways;

77 To give knowledge of salvation unto his people by the

Creation:

Gen 1:26 ¶And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

7 And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so.

Heb 1:2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

I AM

Ex 3:14 And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you.

Jn8:58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you,Before Abraham was, I am.

59 Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.

Book of Revelations

Rev 1:5 And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,

8 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.

The NWTHS really slaughtered this passage

11 Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea.

17 And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last:

18I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.

Rev 2

8 And unto the angel of the church in Smyrna write; These things saith the first and the last, which was dead, and is alive;

YHWH( Jehovah) is the savior-- he does it through Jesus--the same way he parted the red sea through Moses--Moses couldn't do it--Jehovah did. It works the same with Jesus--only YHWH( Jehovah) has the power-- ( last line Lords prayer--The KINGDOM, POWER, and GLORY all belong to the Father.

Who, then is the First and the Last?

Both are in certain things.

That does not make sense. Jesus would not take on Himself one of God's titles if He is not worthy of it. There can only be one First and Last. Also, who has the power to forgive sin, other than God Himself?

Jesus has the power like this--Acts 2:22--Gods power goes through Jesus--- it is not Jesus' power( John 5:30)--His God lets him forgive sin.
Jesus was the first and last directly created by the hand of God--all other things were created through Jesus( Gods master worker) Prov 8-- the first and last to be appointed king of Gods kingdom. etc.
YHWH( Jehovah) is the first and last true living God.

 

[tyroneweaver]

Hi.

I tried searching your site but I didn't find an answer, how do Jehovah's Witnesses reconcile Isaiah 9:6 to their (or your) being nontrinitarians?

EDIT - If anyone is unfamiliar with Isaiah 9:6, here it is:

Isaiah 9:6
English Standard Version (ESV)
(6)For to us a child is born,
to us a son is given;
and the government shall be upon his shoulder,
and his name shall be called
Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

If you read it correctly---Jesus'--NAME-- will be called those things--it is not saying Jesus himself will be those things. There is a big difference.
Jesus taught--John 17:1-6,26--- the one who sent him( John 5:30-Father) is THE ONLY TRUE GOD.--verse 6 = YHWH(Jehovah) , 26= YHWH( Jehovah)-- (making this reality of what a true follower does--John 4:22-24.

The Bible teaches Jesus is Jehovah. And the Father is Eloheim. Even when Christ was on the cross He called Him Eloi.

Savior

psalms

21 They forgat God their savior, which had done great things in Egypt;

Isaiah

3 For I amthe Lordthy God, the Holy Oneof Israel, thy Saviour: I gave Egyptforthy ransom, Ethiopia and Sebafor thee.

11 I, evenI, amthe Lord; and besideme there isno saviour.

15 Verily thou arta God that hidestthyself, O God of Israel, the Saviour.

2Sam 22.3 The God of my rock; in him will I trust: he ismyshield, and the horn of my salvation, my high-tower, and my refuge, my saviour; thou savest me from violence.

Hosea

4 Yet I amthe Lordthy God from the land of Egypt, and thou shalt know no godbut me: for there isno saviour besideme.

New Testament equivalent.

21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his nameJESUS: for he shall savehis people from their sins.

Luke 1:

47 And my spirit hath rejoicedin God my Saviour.

11 For unto you is bornthis day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord.

John 4.42 And said unto the woman, Now we believe, not because of thy saying: for we have heard him ourselves, and know that this is indeed the Christ, the Saviourof the world.

10 Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.

11 This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner.

12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

Acts 13:23 Of this man’s seedhath God according to his promiseraised unto Israel a Saviour, Jesus:

I Tim 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the commandment of God our Saviour, and Lord Jesus Christ, which isour hope;

Titus 1:4 To Titus, mineown son afterthe common faith: Grace, mercy, andpeace, from God the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ our Saviour.

Titus 3:6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;

1Jn 4:14 And we have seen and do testifythat the Father sentthe Son to bethe Saviour of the world.

Repurchaser:

Is 4314 ¶Thus saith the Lord, your redeemer, the Holy One of Israel; For your sake I have sent to Babylon, and have brought down all their nobles, and the Chaldeans, whose cry is in the ships.

15 I am the Lord, your Holy One, the creator of Israel, your King.

Is 54;5 For thy Maker isthine husband; the Lordof hostsishis name; and thy Redeemerthe Holy One of Israel; The Godof the whole earth shall he be called.

Is 59;20 ¶And the Redeemershall cometo Zion, and unto them that turnfrom transgression in Jacob, saith the Lord.

Is. 41

13 For I the Lord thy God will hold thy right hand, saying unto thee, Fear not; I will help thee.

14 Fear not, thou worm Jacob, and ye men of Israel; I will help thee, saith the Lord, and thy redeemer, the Holy Oneof Israel.

Ps 49

15 But God will redeemmy soul from the power of the grave: for he shall receiveme. Selah.

4 As forour redeemer, the Lordof hosts ishis name, the Holy One of Israel.

26 And I will feed them that oppressthee with their own flesh; and they shall be drunken with their own blood, as with sweet wine: and all flesh shall knowthat I the Lordamthy Saviourand thy Redeemer, the mighty Oneof Jacob.

15 But God will redeemmy soul from the power of the grave: for he shall receiveme. Selah.

Acts 20:28

28 ¶Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the churchof God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.

1Peter 1

18 Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;

19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lambwithout blemish and without spot:

Gal. 3

13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: or it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:

Gal 4:4 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sentforth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,

5 To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons.

Col

14 In whom we have redemption through his blood, eventhe forgiveness of sins:

Judgement:

Ichron 16:33 Then shall the treesof the wood sing out at the presence of the Lord, because he cometh to judgethe earth.

Ps 96;13 Before the Lord: for he cometh, for he cometh to judge the earth: he shall judge the world with righteousness, and the people with his truth.

Psalm 9;7 But the Lordshall endure for ever: he hath prepared his throne for judgment.

Matt16:27 For the Son of manshall come in the gloryof his Father with his angels; and then he shall rewardevery man according to his works.

John 5;22 For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committedall judgmentunto the Son:

2Cor. 5;10 For we must all appear before the judgmentseat of Christ; that every one may receive the things donein his body, accordingto that he hath done, whether it begood or bad.

Acts 10;36 The word which God sent unto the children of Israel, preaching peace by Jesus Christ: (he is Lord of all

37 That word, I say, ye know, which was published throughout all Judæa, and began from Galilee, after the baptism which John preached;

38 How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him.

39 And we are witnesses of all things which he did both in the land of the Jews, and in Jerusalem; whom they slew and hanged on a tree:

40 Him God raised up the third day, and shewed him openly;

41 Not to all the people, but unto witnesses chosen before of God, even to us, who did eat and drink with him after he rose from the dead.

42 And he commanded us to preach unto the people, and to testify that it is he which was ordained of God to be the Judge of quick and

Rom 14:10 But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before thejudgment seat of Christ.

Jude

14 And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,

15 To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him.

2Timothy

1 I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom;

Holy One of Israel

Is 43:15 I amthe Lord, your Holy One, the creator of Israel, your King.

Mk 1:24 Saying, Let usalone; whathave we to do with thee, thou Jesus of Nazareth? art thou come to destroy us? I know thee who thou art, the Holy Oneof God.

Lk 4:34 Saying, Let usalone; what have we to do with thee,thouJesus of Nazareth? art thou come to destroy us? I know thee who thou art; the Holy One of God.

Prepare the Way

Is 40:2 Speak ye comfortably to Jerusalem, and cry unto her, that her warfare is accomplished, that her iniquity is pardoned: for she hath received of the Lord’s hand double for all her sins.

3 ¶The voice of him that crieth in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make straight in the desert a highway for our God.

Mk 1:3 The voiceof one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight.

Lk 1:76 And thou, child, shalt be called the prophet of the Highest: for thou shalt go before the face of the Lord toprepare his ways;

77 To give knowledge of salvation unto his people by the

Creation:

Gen 1:26 ¶And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

7 And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so.

Heb 1:2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

I AM

Ex 3:14 And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you.

Jn8:58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you,Before Abraham was, I am.

59 Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.

Book of Revelations

Rev 1:5 And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,

8 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.

The NWTHS really slaughtered this passage

11 Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea.

17 And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last:

18I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.

Rev 2

8 And unto the angel of the church in Smyrna write; These things saith the first and the last, which was dead, and is alive;

YHWH( Jehovah) is the savior-- he does it through Jesus--the same way he parted the red sea through Moses--Moses couldn't do it--Jehovah did. It works the same with Jesus--only YHWH( Jehovah) has the power-- ( last line Lords prayer--The KINGDOM, POWER, and GLORY all belong to the Father.

Simple Question:
Did Jehovah die?

 

[HaShev]

then who is the first and last?

Zoroaster predating the text is being plagiarised using those words.
The John Apochrypha admits they borrowed a lot from Zoroastrianism.

By the way, you can ask your nemesis Tyrone why he keeps using my name with verses he chooses.

Is 4314 ¶Thus saith the Lord, your (HaSheva)" redeemer", the Holy One of Israel; For your sake I have sent to Babylon, and have brought down all their nobles, and the Chaldeans, whose cry is in the ships.
15 I am the Lord, your Holy One, the creator of Israel, your King.
Is 54; 5 For thy Maker is thine husband; the Lordof hosts (Michael is the head of hosts in Judaic and Islamic tradition)ishis name; and thy Redeemer(HaSheva)the Holy One of Israel; The Godof the whole earth shall he be called.
Is 59; 20 ¶And the Redeemer(HaSheva)shall cometo Zion, and unto them that turnfrom transgression in Jacob, saith the Lord.


It's clear Lord means King even stating so in those verses. THY (GOD) CREATOR does not assume THE CREATOR which is not an anthropromorphic concept of Creation-Creator.
They would know ths stuff if they had the Mikdash and not the Vatican teaching them the "way things are".

 

[HaShev]

Also ask them to reconcile Isaiah 44:6 and 48:12 with Revelation 1:17, 2:8 and 22:13 and their insistence that Jesus is not God.

The gospel of Jesus= John 20:17, Rev 3:12---- How does God have a God and still be only one God in existence?

All of those scriptures reference One who calls Himself the First and the Last. In Isaiah, it is clearly God referring to Himself. In Revelation, it is Jesus referring to Himself. JW's thus are faced with either admitting that Jesus is actually God or a liar. I don't think they want to say either one.

3 speak in revelation--Jehovah, Jesus and John. See rev 1:1-- a Rev given to Jesus by God( did he give it to himself?) Did he sit at his own right hand? Did he pray to himself? = NO --this is the true God= John 4:22-24--and Jesus taught that--John 20:17, Rev 3:12-- as well as Paul-2Cor 1:3, 1Cor 8:6, 1Cor 15:24-28--Peter at 1Peter 1:3, and John at Rev 1:6--- anyone teaching something different are teaching dogmas of men. The true gospel of what was taught is right above--4 witnesses to truth.

Jesus called Himself the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End. God also called Himself that. Jesus called Himself God.

Jesus never called himself God--Your teachers twist what he said. Look at Rev 1:1--a revelation given to Jesus by God--- put God as your right hand--it gives something to your left hand( Jesus) are your hands one? No -- Jesus is not God. He is the son of the true Living God.

But he's also not son of man try using all of Rev 1.
Rev 1:13 he's " like unto"(likeness to-emulating-impostering) son of man.

 

[hadit]

In Isaiah, someone identifies Himself as "Israel's King" and "the First and the Last". In fact, I will quote:
Do we all agree that the person speaking identifies Himself as God?

In Revelation, someone also identifies Himself as "The First and the Last". Again, I will quote:
It is clearly Jesus speaking here, because He was dead and is now alive. Jesus would also not dare to take on Himself one of God's titles if it was not His to take. Thus, it is clear that Jesus is calling Himself God.

Another example? From Exodus: And from John: Why would they want to stone Him? He took for Himself one of God's titles.

Yet another? From Mark: There are many places where Jesus claims to be God. You can disagree with Him, but that's what He says.

YHWH(Jehovah) spoke in the ot. YHWH(Jehovah) gave Jesus everything he has, he taught him everything, he shares, honor and glory with Jesus--Jesus taught he can do 0 of his own( John 5:30)--it works like this--Acts 2:22--Gods power goes through Jesus. Only YHWH(Jehovah) is the almighty.

Throughout Scripture it is clear that Jesus is God, as I have shown. Jesus SET ASIDE His authority to become one of us. From Phillipians:

5 In your relationships with one another, have the same mindset as Christ Jesus: Who, being in very nature God, did not consider equality with God something to be used to his own advantage; rather, he made himself nothing by taking the very nature of a servant, being made in human likeness.

Jesus embraced humanity, literally becoming one of us and submitting Himself to God's authority. He is still God.

Then please explain how God has a God--because Jesus does--John 20:17( in the flesh) --- (rev 3:12--while in heaven as a spirit)---And Why after he hands back the kingdom to his God and Father that Jesus subjects himself, forever 1Cor 15:24-28)

Did you not see where He set aside His authority and humbled Himself to become one of us?

Yes he was prince of all angels, he became lower than the angels( mortal) Hebrews 2:7)--- he died and paid the wages of sin he did not owe( the ransom sacrifice)And received- a 1000 year kingship and a bride of Christ( little flock-Luke 12:32) = 144,000)
You see the ot clearly teaches--God is king of eternity---If Jesus were that God, he could not be appointed to a kingship( Dan 7:13-15) he already would be king. But not only is he appointed, he must hand it back to his God as well( 1Cor 15:24-28)--- so how does God have a God, yet there only be one God?

How many times must I repeat it? Jesus set aside His authority and submitted to God, just as we all must do. Otherwise He could hardly be one of us, could He?

 

[hadit]

The Bible teaches Jesus is Jehovah. And the Father is Eloheim. Even when Christ was on the cross He called Him Eloi.

Savior

psalms

21 They forgat God their savior, which had done great things in Egypt;

Isaiah

3 For I amthe Lordthy God, the Holy Oneof Israel, thy Saviour: I gave Egyptforthy ransom, Ethiopia and Sebafor thee.

11 I, evenI, amthe Lord; and besideme there isno saviour.

15 Verily thou arta God that hidestthyself, O God of Israel, the Saviour.

2Sam 22.3 The God of my rock; in him will I trust: he ismyshield, and the horn of my salvation, my high-tower, and my refuge, my saviour; thou savest me from violence.

Hosea

4 Yet I amthe Lordthy God from the land of Egypt, and thou shalt know no godbut me: for there isno saviour besideme.

New Testament equivalent.

21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his nameJESUS: for he shall savehis people from their sins.

Luke 1:

47 And my spirit hath rejoicedin God my Saviour.

11 For unto you is bornthis day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord.

John 4.42 And said unto the woman, Now we believe, not because of thy saying: for we have heard him ourselves, and know that this is indeed the Christ, the Saviourof the world.

10 Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.

11 This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner.

12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

Acts 13:23 Of this man’s seedhath God according to his promiseraised unto Israel a Saviour, Jesus:

I Tim 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the commandment of God our Saviour, and Lord Jesus Christ, which isour hope;

Titus 1:4 To Titus, mineown son afterthe common faith: Grace, mercy, andpeace, from God the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ our Saviour.

Titus 3:6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;

1Jn 4:14 And we have seen and do testifythat the Father sentthe Son to bethe Saviour of the world.

Repurchaser:

Is 4314 ¶Thus saith the Lord, your redeemer, the Holy One of Israel; For your sake I have sent to Babylon, and have brought down all their nobles, and the Chaldeans, whose cry is in the ships.

15 I am the Lord, your Holy One, the creator of Israel, your King.

Is 54;5 For thy Maker isthine husband; the Lordof hostsishis name; and thy Redeemerthe Holy One of Israel; The Godof the whole earth shall he be called.

Is 59;20 ¶And the Redeemershall cometo Zion, and unto them that turnfrom transgression in Jacob, saith the Lord.

Is. 41

13 For I the Lord thy God will hold thy right hand, saying unto thee, Fear not; I will help thee.

14 Fear not, thou worm Jacob, and ye men of Israel; I will help thee, saith the Lord, and thy redeemer, the Holy Oneof Israel.

Ps 49

15 But God will redeemmy soul from the power of the grave: for he shall receiveme. Selah.

4 As forour redeemer, the Lordof hosts ishis name, the Holy One of Israel.

26 And I will feed them that oppressthee with their own flesh; and they shall be drunken with their own blood, as with sweet wine: and all flesh shall knowthat I the Lordamthy Saviourand thy Redeemer, the mighty Oneof Jacob.

15 But God will redeemmy soul from the power of the grave: for he shall receiveme. Selah.

Acts 20:28

28 ¶Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the churchof God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.

1Peter 1

18 Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;

19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lambwithout blemish and without spot:

Gal. 3

13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: or it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:

Gal 4:4 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sentforth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,

5 To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons.

Col

14 In whom we have redemption through his blood, eventhe forgiveness of sins:

Judgement:

Ichron 16:33 Then shall the treesof the wood sing out at the presence of the Lord, because he cometh to judgethe earth.

Ps 96;13 Before the Lord: for he cometh, for he cometh to judge the earth: he shall judge the world with righteousness, and the people with his truth.

Psalm 9;7 But the Lordshall endure for ever: he hath prepared his throne for judgment.

Matt16:27 For the Son of manshall come in the gloryof his Father with his angels; and then he shall rewardevery man according to his works.

John 5;22 For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committedall judgmentunto the Son:

2Cor. 5;10 For we must all appear before the judgmentseat of Christ; that every one may receive the things donein his body, accordingto that he hath done, whether it begood or bad.

Acts 10;36 The word which God sent unto the children of Israel, preaching peace by Jesus Christ: (he is Lord of all

37 That word, I say, ye know, which was published throughout all Judæa, and began from Galilee, after the baptism which John preached;

38 How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him.

39 And we are witnesses of all things which he did both in the land of the Jews, and in Jerusalem; whom they slew and hanged on a tree:

40 Him God raised up the third day, and shewed him openly;

41 Not to all the people, but unto witnesses chosen before of God, even to us, who did eat and drink with him after he rose from the dead.

42 And he commanded us to preach unto the people, and to testify that it is he which was ordained of God to be the Judge of quick and

Rom 14:10 But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before thejudgment seat of Christ.

Jude

14 And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,

15 To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him.

2Timothy

1 I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom;

Holy One of Israel

Is 43:15 I amthe Lord, your Holy One, the creator of Israel, your King.

Mk 1:24 Saying, Let usalone; whathave we to do with thee, thou Jesus of Nazareth? art thou come to destroy us? I know thee who thou art, the Holy Oneof God.

Lk 4:34 Saying, Let usalone; what have we to do with thee,thouJesus of Nazareth? art thou come to destroy us? I know thee who thou art; the Holy One of God.

Prepare the Way

Is 40:2 Speak ye comfortably to Jerusalem, and cry unto her, that her warfare is accomplished, that her iniquity is pardoned: for she hath received of the Lord’s hand double for all her sins.

3 ¶The voice of him that crieth in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make straight in the desert a highway for our God.

Mk 1:3 The voiceof one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight.

Lk 1:76 And thou, child, shalt be called the prophet of the Highest: for thou shalt go before the face of the Lord toprepare his ways;

77 To give knowledge of salvation unto his people by the

Creation:

Gen 1:26 ¶And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

7 And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so.

Heb 1:2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

I AM

Ex 3:14 And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you.

Jn8:58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you,Before Abraham was, I am.

59 Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.

Book of Revelations

Rev 1:5 And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,

8 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.

The NWTHS really slaughtered this passage

11 Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea.

17 And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last:

18I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.

Rev 2

8 And unto the angel of the church in Smyrna write; These things saith the first and the last, which was dead, and is alive;

YHWH( Jehovah) is the savior-- he does it through Jesus--the same way he parted the red sea through Moses--Moses couldn't do it--Jehovah did. It works the same with Jesus--only YHWH( Jehovah) has the power-- ( last line Lords prayer--The KINGDOM, POWER, and GLORY all belong to the Father.

Who, then is the First and the Last?

Both are in certain things.

That does not make sense. Jesus would not take on Himself one of God's titles if He is not worthy of it. There can only be one First and Last. Also, who has the power to forgive sin, other than God Himself?

Jesus has the power like this--Acts 2:22--Gods power goes through Jesus--- it is not Jesus' power( John 5:30)--His God lets him forgive sin.
Jesus was the first and last directly created by the hand of God--all other things were created through Jesus( Gods master worker) Prov 8-- the first and last to be appointed king of Gods kingdom. etc.
YHWH( Jehovah) is the first and last true living God.

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God and the Word was God. Jesus was not created.

 

[HaShev]

There are many places where Jesus claims to be God. You can disagree with Him, but that's what He says.

That's why you can't find 1.
However all over is evidence of placing the character over God by you making him your god.
fact Moshiach would be a man not God.
Making him both=story of Lucifer
1-Lucifer would be deemed perfect and a god lifted higher the YHWH.
2-Hebrews 3:1 Wherefore, holy brethren, partakers of a heavenly calling, consider the Apostle and High Priest of our confession, [even] Jesus;
3:2 who was faithful to him that appointed him....(If someone appointed him, then he isn’t God)
The author of Hebrews (now seen as probably not Paul’s style)
confirmed this was a correct translation when he quoted it. (Heb 2:7,9) You made him a little lower than angels; with glory and honor you crowned him, and appointed him over the works of your hands. 9 but we "behold Jesus, who has been made a little lower than angels".
Hebrews 5:6, 5:10, & 6:20 say Jesus is after the Order of Melchizedek (another name for Archangel Michael)

Third person tense using "him"=another.
Matthew 4:10«Then Jesus said to him, «Away with you, Satan! For IT IS WRITTEN,«You shall worship the Lord your God, and "Him" only you shall serve.»

John 5:30 I can of my own self do, nothing.

John 14:12 The works I do, you can do, and greater

John 16:23 You shall ask me for nothing

John 16:26 I do not say that I will pray to the Father for you

John 5:3I If I bear witness about myself, my witness is false

Luke 12:14 Who made me judge or divider over you ?

Mark 12:26 And as for the dead being raised, have you not read in the book of Moses, in the passage about the bush, how God said to him, 'I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob'?
Here Jesus is talking in verse 24-26 he talks about how G-d said to him not saying ‘I said to him’ clearly a distinction that G-d is another person refering to "him" as another.

The "why did you foresake me" speach is as obvious as it gets unless you say he talks to himself.

I can go on all day with verses but it's very clear in the OT.
Numbers 23:19.The Hebrew reads:
lo ish el vichazev u-vein-adam v'yitnechamGod is not a man, nor will he lie, nor is he mortal, nor will he relent.
Jesus was a lie about a mere man who lied and who relented.
Jesus isn't even an actual singular historical figure, none of the christ figures used for his accounts ever claimed to be Creator of Creation.

 

[hadit]

There are many places where Jesus claims to be God. You can disagree with Him, but that's what He says.

That's why you can't find 1.
However all over is evidence of placing the character over God by you making him your god.
fact Moshiach would be a man not God.
Making him both=story of Lucifer
1-Lucifer would be deemed perfect and a god lifted higher the YHWH.
2-Hebrews 3:1 Wherefore, holy brethren, partakers of a heavenly calling, consider the Apostle and High Priest of our confession, [even] Jesus;
3:2 who was faithful to him that appointed him....(If someone appointed him, then he isn’t God)
The author of Hebrews (now seen as probably not Paul’s style)
confirmed this was a correct translation when he quoted it. (Heb 2:7,9) You made him a little lower than angels; with glory and honor you crowned him, and appointed him over the works of your hands. 9 but we "behold Jesus, who has been made a little lower than angels".
Hebrews 5:6, 5:10, & 6:20 say Jesus is after the Order of Melchizedek (another name for Archangel Michael)

Third person tense using "him"=another.
Matthew 4:10«Then Jesus said to him, «Away with you, Satan! For IT IS WRITTEN,«You shall worship the Lord your God, and "Him" only you shall serve.»

John 5:30 I can of my own self do, nothing.

John 14:12 The works I do, you can do, and greater

John 16:23 You shall ask me for nothing

John 16:26 I do not say that I will pray to the Father for you

John 5:3I If I bear witness about myself, my witness is false

Luke 12:14 Who made me judge or divider over you ?

Mark 12:26 And as for the dead being raised, have you not read in the book of Moses, in the passage about the bush, how God said to him, 'I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob'?
Here Jesus is talking in verse 24-26 he talks about how G-d said to him not saying ‘I said to him’ clearly a distinction that G-d is another person refering to "him" as another.

The "why did you foresake me" speach is as obvious as it gets unless you say he talks to himself.

I can go on all day with verses but it's very clear in the OT.
Numbers 23:19.The Hebrew reads:
lo ish el vichazev u-vein-adam v'yitnechamGod is not a man, nor will he lie, nor is he mortal, nor will he relent.
Jesus was a lie about a mere man who lied and who relented.
Jesus isn't even an actual singular historical figure, none of the christ figures used for his accounts ever claimed to be Creator of Creation.

I have shown you where He said He is God. Like I also said, you may disagree with Him, but He made it clear.