Roe is just the latest example of all-or-nothing politics

[Big Bend Texas]

Oops, sorry, looks like you need to brush up on your civics. It is, indeed, a constitutionally protected, unenumerated right. Get as mad as you like. It is what it is.

Flawed logic, if killing the unborn is protected under the 9th Amendment then so is killing anyone else that is inconvenient or a burden on society.

It's an utterly asinine argument.

 

[Big Bend Texas]

Sorry, reality doesn't give a shit what you believe.

Reality is that it's not a protected right or won't be once the final draft is published.

 

[Big Bend Texas]

Actually, it has been a right for the last 50 years... now it will a victimless crime no one will prosecute...



Then you should arrest women for not only abortions, but for miscarriages.

Every child killed by abortion is a victim. If not, then you could not be prosecuted for and convicted of murder if you kill or injure a pregnant woman resulting in the death of her unborn child.

 

[Big Bend Texas]

Actually, it has been a right for the last 50 years... now it will a victimless crime no one will prosecute...



Then you should arrest women for not only abortions, but for miscarriages.

Miscarriage is they natural end to an inviable pregnancy.

Unless you can show a woman intentionally caused it there would be nothing to charge her for or with.

 

[Big Bend Texas]

Gosnell was the result of TRYING to regulate the fringes. PA had one of the more restrictive abortion laws, and the women who went to Gosnell went to Planned Parenthood and legitimate providers first, and were told they couldn't get legal abortions under PA law.

The problem with Gosnell is not just that he performed illegal abortions, it was that he performed otherwise legal ones with dirty instruments and bad procedures. He was also dealing drugs out of his clinic. The problem was his patients were poor people, paying a pittance because they didn't have insurance or coverage, and they got exactly what they paid for.

And after all that... they had little to show for it. The original 100 fetuses he was charged with was whittled down to 7, then down to 4 before it went to a jury, and they only found him guilty of 3. Then they had to cut a sentencing deal with him before he appealed his case to someone who could actually read a law book.

You are of course badly misrepresenting the entire case and it's outcome.

On May 13, 2013, the jury reported that they were deadlocked on two counts.[121] After returning to deliberations, the jury convicted Gosnell of three counts of murder, one count of involuntary manslaughter, and over 200 lesser counts including infanticide and racketeering.[122] He was found not guilty on one of the counts of murder.[123][124] The murder charges Gosnell was convicted of concerned babies referred to as Baby Boy A (also known as Baby Abrams and as Adam), Baby C and Baby D.[125][126]

On May 14, 2013, Gosnell struck a deal with prosecutors in which he agreed to waive all his appeal rights regarding his conviction on the day earlier. In exchange, prosecutors allowed Gosnell to be sentenced to life in prison without the possibility of parole.[127] The following day, Gosnell was sentenced to three life terms.[128]

He took a plea deal for life x3 to avoid an all but certain verdict of death.

Is conduct was so egregious and so thoroughly proven his attorney didn't even put on a defense because it would have only made things worse.

He did his job though and got the best possible outcome for his client which is what defense attorneys are charged to do.

Fortunately at his age the taxpayers won't be stuck with his bills for too long.

 

[j-mac]

Actually, it has been a right for the last 50 years... now it will a victimless crime no one will prosecute...



Then you should arrest women for not only abortions, but for miscarriages.

Depends….if the woman intentionally caused the miscarriage then maybe.

 

[JoeB131]

Gosnell was even incarnate and a fucking serial killer.

PA's laws were not very restrictive at all but they did include a ban on late term abortion.

Which is why those women went to Gosnell. They wanted late abortions (there's no such thing as a late term abortion. If a pregnancy is brought to term, that's a birth, not an abortion) and Gosnell is the only one who would perform them.

And when we say, "late', we mean 20-24 weeks, not the full 36 weeks a pregnancy takes.

 

[JoeB131]

Every child killed by abortion is a victim. If not, then you could not be prosecuted for and convicted of murder if you kill or injure a pregnant woman resulting in the death of her unborn child.

Those laws are kind of stupid, and they've already been used to go after women for having miscarriages.

Purvi Patel - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Bei Bei Shuai - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Miscarriage is they natural end to an inviable pregnancy.

Unless you can show a woman intentionally caused it there would be nothing to charge her for or with.

Okay, so how do you tell the difference between a miscarriage (which by the way, is called a "spontaneous abortion" in medical terms)

You are of course badly misrepresenting the entire case and it's outcome.

The case was a farce. They didn't need to go after him for the fetuses because his maiming of a full grown women, his injury of other patients through incompetence, and his drug dealing was already enough to put him away for life.

He took a plea deal for life x3 to avoid an all but certain verdict of death.

Is conduct was so egregious and so thoroughly proven his attorney didn't even put on a defense because it would have only made things worse.

He did his job though and got the best possible outcome for his client which is what defense attorneys are charged to do.

Fortunately at his age the taxpayers won't be stuck with his bills for too long.

First, the chances of his being executed were about NIL. Even if the jury had found for death, PA hasn't executed anyone since 1999, and they only executed three people since the DP was restored in 1976.

Actually, he started out with being charged with 100 counts of homicide and his lawyer got that down to three. That's some damned good lawyering. The reality was, they already had him dead to rights on the woman he killed AND all the drugs he was dealing, so getting an extra three life sentences for killing Globbies was kind of meaningless. So prosecutors rushed in to make sure their sentence didn't get challenged, and he elected not to go through years of appeals.

It was a lot of effort for nothing, other than for a few anti-choice fanatics to waive a bloody banner their stupid policies caused to start with.

 

[JoeB131]

Depends….if the woman intentionally caused the miscarriage then maybe.

Thanks for proving my point, Anger Issues.

 

[Mac1958]

And there ya go. It's come to this.

The GOP, 2022.

 

[SassyIrishLass]

Roe vs Wade overturned: the loony left loses their minds.... I'm doing a happy dance

 

[j-mac]

And there ya go. It's come to this.

The GOP, 2022.

What’s that mean? Explain yourself.

 

[j-mac]

What’s that mean? Explain yourself.

So just a drive by from Mac1958….coward.

 

[JoeB131]

What’s that mean? Explain yourself.

I think what he means is that you guys are incapable of rational debate. Actually, he thinks both sides are incapable of rational debate, because he thinks his opinions are so much wiser and smarter than everyone else's.

At least he got rid of that Forward Party banner that looked like a horror movie poster.

 

[JoeB131]

Roe vs Wade overturned: the loony left loses their minds.... I'm doing a happy dance

Be careful what you wish for, Fat Irish Sow.

You've just declared 40 million women who've had abortions to be murderers. I don't think they are going to take kindly to that.

 

[lantern2814]

Be careful what you wish for, Fat Irish Sow.

You've just declared 40 million women who've had abortions to be murderers. I don't think they are going to take kindly to that.

No job Joe showing his misogynistic views again. Those murderers won’t get off their asses long enough to do anything constructive like vote. Just to destroy things and threaten people because they think nobody will push back. Boy are you in for a surprise....

 

[j-mac]

I think what he means is that you guys are incapable of rational debate. Actually, he thinks both sides are incapable of rational debate, because he thinks his opinions are so much wiser and smarter than everyone else's.

At least he got rid of that Forward Party banner that looked like a horror movie poster.

Well, he’s a douche….I am fully capable of rational debate, but he won’t/can’t do that….

he’s a detriment to this boards mission, and should be banned.

 

[JoeB131]

Well, he’s a douche….I am fully capable of rational debate, but he won’t/can’t do that….

he’s a detriment to this boards mission, and should be banned.

Well, no, you really aren't if you think calling someone a pedo-rapist is a legimate response to the observation that miscarriages would be criminalized under your crazy interpretation of fetal rights.

Again... even without the court overturning the law, we are already there.

Bei Bei Shuai - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Bei Bei Shuai (Chinese: 帅贝贝) is a Chinese immigrant to the United States who became the subject of international public attention from 2011 to 2013[1][2][3] when the authorities of the state of Indiana charged her with murder and attempted feticide after her suicide attempt allegedly resulted in the death of the fetus with which she was pregnant. The British newspaper The Guardian described Shuai's case as well as those of other women who lose their pregnancies in cases of maternal drug addiction or a suicide attempt, as part of a "creeping criminalisation of pregnancy across America".[4]

Shuai, a Shanghai native, immigrated to the U.S. in the early 2000s with her then-husband. Years later, she entered into an affair with an also married coworker. By late 2010, after her marriage fell apart, she became pregnant by that same man. After their breakup and a severe depression, Shuai attempted suicide by taking rat poison. She survived, but the fetus died on 3 January 2011 – 33 weeks after her conception, ten days after the poisoning and two days after her birth in an emergency cesarean section.[4]

On 14 March 2011, Shuai was charged with the murder and attempted feticide of her child, and was jailed for 435 days.[4] In May 2012, the Indiana Supreme Court declined to dismiss the charges against her, but allowed her release on bail.[5]

Shuai declined a plea deal that would have her plead guilty to the feticide charge (with a sentence of up to 20 years imprisonment) in return for the withdrawal of the murder charge. She faced a trial for murder with a possible sentence of 45 years to life imprisonment. In June, the prosecution filed a motion to admonish her lawyer, Linda Pence, for prejudicing the potential jury pool by conducting a public campaign for the support of her client. This caused alarm among defense lawyers nationwide, one of whom criticized the motion as a possible attempt at intimidation or to prevent Pence from raising money for her client; chief prosecutor Terry Curry denied this.[6]

In 2013 Shuai pled guilty to a misdemeanor charge of criminal recklessness and was released, having been sentenced to time served. Prosecutor Terry Curry said of the law under which she was initially charged for murder: "There was never any intention to monitor pregnancies."[7][8]

 

[j-mac]

Well, no, you really aren't if you think calling someone a pedo-rapist is a legimate response to the observation that miscarriages would be criminalized under your crazy interpretation of fetal rights.

Again... even without the court overturning the law, we are already there.

Bei Bei Shuai - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Bei Bei Shuai (Chinese: 帅贝贝) is a Chinese immigrant to the United States who became the subject of international public attention from 2011 to 2013[1][2][3] when the authorities of the state of Indiana charged her with murder and attempted feticide after her suicide attempt allegedly resulted in the death of the fetus with which she was pregnant. The British newspaper The Guardian described Shuai's case as well as those of other women who lose their pregnancies in cases of maternal drug addiction or a suicide attempt, as part of a "creeping criminalisation of pregnancy across America".[4]

Shuai, a Shanghai native, immigrated to the U.S. in the early 2000s with her then-husband. Years later, she entered into an affair with an also married coworker. By late 2010, after her marriage fell apart, she became pregnant by that same man. After their breakup and a severe depression, Shuai attempted suicide by taking rat poison. She survived, but the fetus died on 3 January 2011 – 33 weeks after her conception, ten days after the poisoning and two days after her birth in an emergency cesarean section.[4]

On 14 March 2011, Shuai was charged with the murder and attempted feticide of her child, and was jailed for 435 days.[4] In May 2012, the Indiana Supreme Court declined to dismiss the charges against her, but allowed her release on bail.[5]

Shuai declined a plea deal that would have her plead guilty to the feticide charge (with a sentence of up to 20 years imprisonment) in return for the withdrawal of the murder charge. She faced a trial for murder with a possible sentence of 45 years to life imprisonment. In June, the prosecution filed a motion to admonish her lawyer, Linda Pence, for prejudicing the potential jury pool by conducting a public campaign for the support of her client. This caused alarm among defense lawyers nationwide, one of whom criticized the motion as a possible attempt at intimidation or to prevent Pence from raising money for her client; chief prosecutor Terry Curry denied this.[6]

In 2013 Shuai pled guilty to a misdemeanor charge of criminal recklessness and was released, having been sentenced to time served. Prosecutor Terry Curry said of the law under which she was initially charged for murder: "There was never any intention to monitor pregnancies."[7][8]

1. I respond in kind. Your stupid little pet names will be met with the truth about you.

2. Sounds like the system worked.

 

[Care4all]

The Federal govrrnment only has authority given to it by the Constitution - all else is delegated to the STATES.

Nope!

9th A

The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.