Should "IQ" Be a Dirty Word?

[JoeMoma]

I believe IQ can be a useful measure of a person's intelligence, but its far from perfect. I would suspect that someone that has difficulty scoring above 85 on most of today's commonly used IQ tests would not fair well in a calculus class.

Perhaps instead of using just one number for IQ, their should be several numbers for measuring various aspects of intelligence.

 

[JoeMoma]

Mensa puts a lot of stock in their IQ test. I tested 113 on their test and 148 on the eighth grade test back in the 70's. High IQ people do well on Jeopardy.

I can't recall names like I used to do when I was young. Sometimes I will try to think of someone's name that I have known for years and I just can't remember it at that time. Sometimes the name will come to me when I have moved on to a completely different mental task.

 

[Asclepias]

Anecdotes don't refute facts.

Facts are just agreed upon conclusions. Doesnt make it the truth which is what intelligent people should be trying to get to.

 

[Paul Essien]

In today's academic climate, anyone using the words "IQ" and "race" in the same sentence is presumed to be a racist.

Thomas Jefferson in 1787: Black have less intelligence, more sex drive, more likely to break the law, less self-control
Whites in 2018 : Blacks have less intelligence, more sex drive, more likely to break the law, less self-control.

White people have been running around trying to prove that black people are stupid for a very long time. Stop acting like this ia new and edgy.

But what if we removed the "race" element completely? What if we examined how kids are doing in comparison with their relative IQ's, ignoring race altogether?

IWhat if "failing" schools are not failing because of the race of the majority of students, but because of the average IQ of the students?

If you look college completion rates for white groups. They range from the lowest from Irish-Americans (at around 21%) with college degrees up to (around 51%) of Russian Americans with college degrees. In between that you’ve got Swedes, English, Scottish, Germans.

Why is it that people who claim that race is some biologically hard-wired and success is related to IQ which is related to biology and race then if that’s true then you'd have to conclude that based on the rank ordering of Europeans that :

1. Russian-Americans are the most intelligent and biologically superior
2. Followed by Scots
3. Followed by English
4. Followed by Swedes
5. Followed by Poles
6. Followed by Germans
7. Followed by the Irish

So the Irish who would be the bottom-feeders of the European community. No ?

If there's enough genetic difference for white people to have different hair color, eye color and different average height, then why not intelligence?

But why don't you ever want to split up the white totals ?

Or don’t you want to theorize on which group of white people are the least intelligent ? Because that’s only used for talking about black people. Right ?

You make foolish observations such as there is one gigantic “White Race” and also believe there is one huge “Black Race” Of course, even the most cursory googling on the subject of African genetic diversity will show you that African peoples have extremely diverse and divergent genetic makeups.

But to you black people are all be guided by the same “dumb gene” or the same “violence gene” or “fast running gene”

It doesn’t matter if black have a variety of different features, different average heights, have reached different levels of civilization, and self-identify as different people.

NO! Blacks are all ONE race, not two, or five, or twenty Black races.

Because in order for your mumbo jumbo to work, it requires a genetically homogenous race of Blacks who all share roughly the same DNA.

I would have more respect for you if you just dropped the pseudo-scientific charade and said,

“We don’t like anybody who doesn’t look like us”

At least that would be true.

Looking at it that way, the focus would be to identify the students in those schools with the greatest potential, and see that they have the opportunity to succeed according the their abilities.

So in that case if IQ is so important and so trustworthy why don't you drive your arguments to it's logical conclusion ? That is why not give all the top positions to those with the highest IQ? Why have elections? Why have job interviews or resumes? Why not have birth licences or sterilization based on IQ?

Until you guys start talking like that and demanding that everything be based on IQ then you don't believe a word your saying because deep down you know that no human being can be baked down to a number.

 

[IM2]

Anecdotes don't refute facts.

But facts do. I've seen such things for about 50 years, so it's long past anecdotal evidence.

 

[Natural Citizen]

Apparently Paul is a well-read mofo.

 

[rightwinger]

We need to require IQ tests for our presidents

And if Trump scores higher than Obama will you accept it or reject it and claim the test is racist?

If Trump scores higher than Hillary would you accept it or proclaim the test is sexist?

My point?

Someone with a high IQ but with no commonsense is still a idiot because with all that intelligence they lack the sense to apply it to daily life...

Of course I will

Let’s have him take a Mensa test and find out how big his brain is

 

[22lcidw]

In today's academic climate, anyone using the words "IQ" and "race" in the same sentence is presumed to be a racist.

Thomas Jefferson in 1787: Black have less intelligence, more sex drive, more likely to break the law, less self-control
Whites in 2018 : Blacks have less intelligence, more sex drive, more likely to break the law, less self-control.

White people have been running around trying to prove that black people are stupid for a very long time. Stop acting like this ia new and edgy.

But what if we removed the "race" element completely? What if we examined how kids are doing in comparison with their relative IQ's, ignoring race altogether?

IWhat if "failing" schools are not failing because of the race of the majority of students, but because of the average IQ of the students?

If you look college completion rates for white groups. They range from the lowest from Irish-Americans (at around 21%) with college degrees up to (around 51%) of Russian Americans with college degrees. In between that you’ve got Swedes, English, Scottish, Germans.

Why is it that people who claim that race is some biologically hard-wired and success is related to IQ which is related to biology and race then if that’s true then you'd have to conclude that based on the rank ordering of Europeans that :

1. Russian-Americans are the most intelligent and biologically superior
2. Followed by Scots
3. Followed by English
4. Followed by Swedes
5. Followed by Poles
6. Followed by Germans
7. Followed by the Irish

So the Irish who would be the bottom-feeders of the European community. No ?

But why don't guys like you make that argument ? Why don't you ever want to spilt up the white totals ?

White people are less genetically diverse than Black people. They have genetic variance but why aren't those genetic differences are somehow never linked to intelligence ?

If there's enough genetic difference for white people to have different hair color, eye color and different average height, then why not intelligence?

Or don’t you want to theorize on which group of white people are the least intelligent ? Because that’s only used for talking about black people. Right ?

You make foolish observations such as there is one gigantic “White Race” and also believe there is one huge “Black Race” Of course, even the most cursory googling on the subject of African genetic diversity will show you that African peoples have extremely diverse and divergent genetic makeups.

But to you black people are all be guided by the same “dumb gene” or the same “violence gene” or “fast running gene”

It doesn’t matter if black have a variety of different features, different average heights, have reached different levels of civilization, and self-identify as different people.

NO! Blacks are all ONE race, not two, or five, or twenty Black races.

Because in order for your mumbo jumbo to work, it requires a genetically homogenous race of Blacks who all share roughly the same DNA.

I would have more respect for you if you just dropped the pseudo-scientific charade and said,

“We don’t like anybody who doesn’t look like us”

At least that would be true.

Looking at it that way, the focus would be to identify the students in those schools with the greatest potential, and see that they have the opportunity to succeed according the their abilities.

So in that case if IQ is so important and so trustworthy why don't you drive your arguments to it's logical conclusion ? That is why not give all the top positions to those with the highest IQ? Why have elections? Why have job interviews or resumes? Why not have birth licences or sterilization based on IQ?

If you can type this, then maybe you can be an inventor, an industrial giant, a tech giant, a business whizz and more. I am just a middle level person but know enough that the best of the best is needed to create tens of millions of jobs. Our culture has spent tens of trillions of dollars to uplift people. It is not without trying. The rules are from progressive socialist politicians. Greatness can come from the basement or garage or small apartment room. I do believe in what you say some spout. But it is not that many. However I do believe that to many of us all make excuses for our actions and are not held to task for it. I have kept no person down. And frankly have had assists by some including African Americans. We all need to appreciate that more. And maybe we all need to be more responsible in our ways. We will not survive with tens of millions of social justice people. That is the easy part.

 

[Paul Essien]

If you can type this, then maybe you can be an inventor, an industrial giant, a tech giant, a business whizz and more.

About half the world’s 7 billion people live on less than $2.50 a day.

Buying a computer or being an inventor or business whizz to them would be like you trying to buy a Bugatti Veyron. Access to knowledge and education on this planet is very limited.

It might seem widely available because you were born in the USA so that’s all you know but if you were born in rural Burma or rural Angola you’d find your options for learning and bettering yourself to be extremely limited.

There is virtually no social mobility in many countries. You're either born into wealth through luck or you are born into the majority of impoverished people and will remain stuck there for life.

The thing is, the west was once the same way. Ignorance prevailed for the unwashed masses, wealth and knowledge were extremely concentrated and there was no social mobility. Even as late as the 1800s, life in America wasn’t much different than it would be in many places Latin America today.

People got little or no education because their parents needed to put the kids to work. There were no social services so people had large families as their security. There was a corrupt upper class (The Gilded Age) that exploited the unwashed poor. A much greater percentage of the population depended on subsistence farming.

Educational embetterment was extremely limited if not non-existent for anyone but the elite. The west came out of this period before others and you will eventually see it in the poorer parts of the world at some point.

Our culture has spent tens of trillions of dollars to uplift people. It is not without trying.

Whites have spent trillions trying on maintaing the system of white supremacy more like

Greatness can come from the basement or garage or small apartment room.

Donald Trump inherited a couple hundred million dollars worth of assets from his daddy. Mark Zuckerberg attended two of the most expensive and prestigious schools in the USA (Harvard, Phillips Exeter Academy). His success was due to his parents bank account and a bit a luck but had little to do with his intelligence and hard work.

That's how it works. Sure as you say "Greatness can come from the basement or garage or small apartment room" because that happens in spite of the system, not because of it.

Everyone from Bill Gates to Warren Buffett needed a substantial amount of money to start up their companies.

Take the average drug dealer born in the ghetto.The same type of person that has the personality and skills to run a criminal entrepreneurship can easily run a legal one, but many will never have the opportunity that will allow them to earn the credentials necessary to do so.

 

[Tommy Tainant]

Dont know what my IQ is. Never took a test and am suspicious of those who see it as some sort of affirmation. Its all bollox.

 

[Slyhunter]

Dont know what my IQ is. Never took a test and am suspicious of those who see it as some sort of affirmation. Its all bollox.

148 IQ, doesn't pay the rent. Type 85 wpm nobody cares. Stuff they do care about I don't have.

 

[Godboy]

The problem, I think, is that normally when one sees IQ and race spoken of together, it is to denigrate a race(s) based on IQ scores.

Of course, IQ is not a strong measurement of intelligence (something which tends to be vaguely defined, at best). A person can get a different score on IQ tests for a variety of reasons: mood, physical health, education levels, etc. IQ tests are really more a measurement of certain abilities. There's also the "Flynn effect," which another poster provided a link for in another thread: basically, IQs have been rising (in the US and other nations) at a rate which seems too fast to be accounted for simply by genetic changes.

Just what IQ tests actually measure, how accurate they are with whatever it is they actually measure, and even just what constitutes intelligence are all subjects still only somewhat understood or very much open to debate. Trying to draw conclusions about race from testing which has such issues is problematic, at best.

One thing we can be sure of is that IQ tests only test the depth of your assimilation into the culture conducting the tests.

Then why do asians score so high on western created IQ tests? Sorry, but black people are dumb because they dont value education and hard work. Your culture is your problem.

 

[Slyhunter]

The problem, I think, is that normally when one sees IQ and race spoken of together, it is to denigrate a race(s) based on IQ scores.

Of course, IQ is not a strong measurement of intelligence (something which tends to be vaguely defined, at best). A person can get a different score on IQ tests for a variety of reasons: mood, physical health, education levels, etc. IQ tests are really more a measurement of certain abilities. There's also the "Flynn effect," which another poster provided a link for in another thread: basically, IQs have been rising (in the US and other nations) at a rate which seems too fast to be accounted for simply by genetic changes.

Just what IQ tests actually measure, how accurate they are with whatever it is they actually measure, and even just what constitutes intelligence are all subjects still only somewhat understood or very much open to debate. Trying to draw conclusions about race from testing which has such issues is problematic, at best.

One thing we can be sure of is that IQ tests only test the depth of your assimilation into the culture conducting the tests.

Then why do asians score so high on western created IQ tests? Sorry, but black people are dumb because they dont value education and hard work. Your culture is your problem.

The blacks who do good in school, achieve careers after school are called Uncle Toms. They insult their success stories.

 

[Asclepias]

The problem, I think, is that normally when one sees IQ and race spoken of together, it is to denigrate a race(s) based on IQ scores.

Of course, IQ is not a strong measurement of intelligence (something which tends to be vaguely defined, at best). A person can get a different score on IQ tests for a variety of reasons: mood, physical health, education levels, etc. IQ tests are really more a measurement of certain abilities. There's also the "Flynn effect," which another poster provided a link for in another thread: basically, IQs have been rising (in the US and other nations) at a rate which seems too fast to be accounted for simply by genetic changes.

Just what IQ tests actually measure, how accurate they are with whatever it is they actually measure, and even just what constitutes intelligence are all subjects still only somewhat understood or very much open to debate. Trying to draw conclusions about race from testing which has such issues is problematic, at best.

One thing we can be sure of is that IQ tests only test the depth of your assimilation into the culture conducting the tests.

Then why do asians score so high on western created IQ tests? Sorry, but black people are dumb because they dont value education and hard work. Your culture is your problem.

The same reason I do. Its like using your white voice.

 

[Godboy]

Lets make something clear. IQ tests don't mean shit.

That doesnt hold much weight when you come from the group that scores the lowest. Sorry, but you people dont have high enough IQs to judge the test.

 

[Asclepias]

The problem, I think, is that normally when one sees IQ and race spoken of together, it is to denigrate a race(s) based on IQ scores.

Of course, IQ is not a strong measurement of intelligence (something which tends to be vaguely defined, at best). A person can get a different score on IQ tests for a variety of reasons: mood, physical health, education levels, etc. IQ tests are really more a measurement of certain abilities. There's also the "Flynn effect," which another poster provided a link for in another thread: basically, IQs have been rising (in the US and other nations) at a rate which seems too fast to be accounted for simply by genetic changes.

Just what IQ tests actually measure, how accurate they are with whatever it is they actually measure, and even just what constitutes intelligence are all subjects still only somewhat understood or very much open to debate. Trying to draw conclusions about race from testing which has such issues is problematic, at best.

One thing we can be sure of is that IQ tests only test the depth of your assimilation into the culture conducting the tests.

Then why do asians score so high on western created IQ tests? Sorry, but black people are dumb because they dont value education and hard work. Your culture is your problem.

The blacks who do good in school, achieve careers after school are called Uncle Toms. They insult their success stories.

No one has ever called me an uncle tom and I am way more successful than most whites. Even when I lived in the hood they called me Malcolm X.

 

[Meathead]

The problem, I think, is that normally when one sees IQ and race spoken of together, it is to denigrate a race(s) based on IQ scores.

Of course, IQ is not a strong measurement of intelligence (something which tends to be vaguely defined, at best). A person can get a different score on IQ tests for a variety of reasons: mood, physical health, education levels, etc. IQ tests are really more a measurement of certain abilities. There's also the "Flynn effect," which another poster provided a link for in another thread: basically, IQs have been rising (in the US and other nations) at a rate which seems too fast to be accounted for simply by genetic changes.

Just what IQ tests actually measure, how accurate they are with whatever it is they actually measure, and even just what constitutes intelligence are all subjects still only somewhat understood or very much open to debate. Trying to draw conclusions about race from testing which has such issues is problematic, at best.

One thing we can be sure of is that IQ tests only test the depth of your assimilation into the culture conducting the tests.

Then why do asians score so high on western created IQ tests? Sorry, but black people are dumb because they dont value education and hard work. Your culture is your problem.

The blacks who do good in school, achieve careers after school are called Uncle Toms. They insult their success stories.

No one has ever called me an uncle tom and I am way more successful than most whites. Even when I lived in the hood they called me Malcolm X.

Sure Asslips. They called you Malcom X. Sometimes you're too funny.

 

[Slyhunter]

The problem, I think, is that normally when one sees IQ and race spoken of together, it is to denigrate a race(s) based on IQ scores.

Of course, IQ is not a strong measurement of intelligence (something which tends to be vaguely defined, at best). A person can get a different score on IQ tests for a variety of reasons: mood, physical health, education levels, etc. IQ tests are really more a measurement of certain abilities. There's also the "Flynn effect," which another poster provided a link for in another thread: basically, IQs have been rising (in the US and other nations) at a rate which seems too fast to be accounted for simply by genetic changes.

Just what IQ tests actually measure, how accurate they are with whatever it is they actually measure, and even just what constitutes intelligence are all subjects still only somewhat understood or very much open to debate. Trying to draw conclusions about race from testing which has such issues is problematic, at best.

One thing we can be sure of is that IQ tests only test the depth of your assimilation into the culture conducting the tests.

Then why do asians score so high on western created IQ tests? Sorry, but black people are dumb because they dont value education and hard work. Your culture is your problem.

The blacks who do good in school, achieve careers after school are called Uncle Toms. They insult their success stories.

No one has ever called me an uncle tom and I am way more successful than most whites. Even when I lived in the hood they called me Malcolm X.

Clarence Thomas, the HUD Secretary; Carson, Collin Powell for example. Shit even Juan on Fox used to be on PBS is belittled and he's a full fledge token Liberal on Fox.

 

[Godboy]

The problem, I think, is that normally when one sees IQ and race spoken of together, it is to denigrate a race(s) based on IQ scores.

Of course, IQ is not a strong measurement of intelligence (something which tends to be vaguely defined, at best). A person can get a different score on IQ tests for a variety of reasons: mood, physical health, education levels, etc. IQ tests are really more a measurement of certain abilities. There's also the "Flynn effect," which another poster provided a link for in another thread: basically, IQs have been rising (in the US and other nations) at a rate which seems too fast to be accounted for simply by genetic changes.

Just what IQ tests actually measure, how accurate they are with whatever it is they actually measure, and even just what constitutes intelligence are all subjects still only somewhat understood or very much open to debate. Trying to draw conclusions about race from testing which has such issues is problematic, at best.

One thing we can be sure of is that IQ tests only test the depth of your assimilation into the culture conducting the tests.

Then why do asians score so high on western created IQ tests? Sorry, but black people are dumb because they dont value education and hard work. Your culture is your problem.

The same reason I do. Its like using your white voice.

What kind of answer is that? You are contradicting your previously stated position. You obvously have a low IQ.

 

[Godboy]

The problem, I think, is that normally when one sees IQ and race spoken of together, it is to denigrate a race(s) based on IQ scores.

Of course, IQ is not a strong measurement of intelligence (something which tends to be vaguely defined, at best). A person can get a different score on IQ tests for a variety of reasons: mood, physical health, education levels, etc. IQ tests are really more a measurement of certain abilities. There's also the "Flynn effect," which another poster provided a link for in another thread: basically, IQs have been rising (in the US and other nations) at a rate which seems too fast to be accounted for simply by genetic changes.

Just what IQ tests actually measure, how accurate they are with whatever it is they actually measure, and even just what constitutes intelligence are all subjects still only somewhat understood or very much open to debate. Trying to draw conclusions about race from testing which has such issues is problematic, at best.

One thing we can be sure of is that IQ tests only test the depth of your assimilation into the culture conducting the tests.

Then why do asians score so high on western created IQ tests? Sorry, but black people are dumb because they dont value education and hard work. Your culture is your problem.

The blacks who do good in school, achieve careers after school are called Uncle Toms. They insult their success stories.

No one has ever called me an uncle tom and I am way more successful than most whites. Even when I lived in the hood they called me Malcolm X.

^ Uncle Tom pretending to be something he isnt.