Should the Social Security and Medicare Age be Raised

[FA_Q2]

Exactly.

It can be a special class of IRA that the individual owns

What is funny is that this has been said on this thread a dozen times.

ALL plans include the same rules as SS has now essentially. The only difference is that money would be put into real assets rather than ones created out of thin air for the government to move that money to the general fund.

 

[woodwork201]

Make it mandatory like it is now.

The same amount of money is taken out and put into an account the person owns

It would be more like a mandatory IRA.

When the government gets involved, everything goes bad so even mandatory 12.4 percent private savings would get ripped off by corporations gaming the government mandate... BUT.. Even with the ripoffs that are sure to happen, simply having competition for where you'll put your 12.4 percent will drive far greater results than Social Security could ever provide.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

When the government gets involved, everything goes bad so even mandatory 12.4 percent private savings would get ripped off by corporations gaming the government mandate... BUT.. Even with the ripoffs that are sure to happen, simply having competition for where you'll put your 12.4 percent will drive far greater results than Social Security could ever provide.

Given the seriousness of the program, I would think a very high penalty would be in place for any employer ripping off the system, or at least I hope there would be. A $20,000 fine and up to ten years in prison should do it.

Unfortunately we would need government to oversee the program since the only reason we have SS in the first place is to protect the irresponsible people that wouldn't save a dime for their retirement.

 

[Blues Man]

You really can't withdraw from your IRA without penalty until you reach the age of 59 1/2. At that point you can withdraw without a penalty and even have no ceiling as to how much you can contribute to your IRA.

The government doctor I had to see to continue working told me I was too Fd up to work any longer so I applied for disability. So I checked into using my IRA because of the horror stories I heard about trying to get on disability which could take months and even years. Luckily they approved me in four months without a personal interview, medical examinations or tests by their doctors and I still haven't withdrawn from my IRA. It's my hope I don't have to use it as I can leave it to my family when I die unless the cancer disables me from being a landlord any longer in the next couple of years.

I understand the rules of the current IRA

I suggested a modified version be used if it were to replace Social Security.

In all honesty if people did put 12.4% of their income into a balanced portfolio they might find that they have the ability to retire early, especially if they saved an addition 10% in another vehicle there is no reason then to say they should be forced to put off early retirement because of some arbitrary rule that they only have access to their money at age 60

 

[Blues Man]

When the government gets involved, everything goes bad so even mandatory 12.4 percent private savings would get ripped off by corporations gaming the government mandate... BUT.. Even with the ripoffs that are sure to happen, simply having competition for where you'll put your 12.4 percent will drive far greater results than Social Security could ever provide.

I could say the government is already ripping people off by the enormity of lost opportunity costs alone.

 

[gipper]

You really can't withdraw from your IRA without penalty until you reach the age of 59 1/2. At that point you can withdraw without a penalty and even have no ceiling as to how much you can contribute to your IRA.

The government doctor I had to see to continue working told me I was too Fd up to work any longer so I applied for disability. So I checked into using my IRA because of the horror stories I heard about trying to get on disability which could take months and even years. Luckily they approved me in four months without a personal interview, medical examinations or tests by their doctors and I still haven't withdrawn from my IRA. It's my hope I don't have to use it as I can leave it to my family when I die unless the cancer disables me from being a landlord any longer in the next couple of years.

Wait just a minute conboy! That’s socialism!!! Give all that money back NOW!

 

[Lesh]

When the government gets involved, everything goes bad so even mandatory 12.4 percent private savings would get ripped off by corporations gaming the government mandate... BUT.. Even with the ripoffs that are sure to happen, simply having competition for where you'll put your 12.4 percent will drive far greater results than Social Security could ever provide.

Yea...and we can use the Chile model that worked so well.

Oh wait...no that was an abject failure

 

[Lesh]

I understand the rules of the current IRA

I suggested a modified version be used if it were to replace Social Security.

In all honesty if people did put 12.4% of their income into a balanced portfolio they might find that they have the ability to retire early, especially if they saved an addition 10% in another vehicle there is no reason then to say they should be forced to put off early retirement because of some arbitrary rule that they only have access to their money at age 60

That "12.4" is a fantasy to start with

Employers are mandated to contribute half of that into Social Security.

There's no way in hell they would voluntarily contribute that if they didn't have to

 

[Blues Man]

That "12.4" is a fantasy to start with

Employers are mandated to contribute half of that into Social Security.

There's no way in hell they would voluntarily contribute that if they didn't have to

No it isn't. It's what everyone already has taken from them to fund the imaginary SS trust fund already.

You really need to work on your reading comprehension.

Employers withhold 6.2% of everyone's pay and they contribute an addition 6.2% for SS.

You never had that money to begin with so where it goes will not in any way effect your net paycheck.

 

[Likkmee]

I recommend raising it to 119....so they can have one good year left

 

[Blues Man]

Yea...and we can use the Chile model that worked so well.

Oh wait...no that was an abject failure

Once again Chile is a 3rd world backwater with whose government is even more corrupt than ours

It's the worst comparison in every way

 

[Likkmee]

That "12.4" is a fantasy to start with

Employers are mandated to contribute half of that into Social Security.

There's no way in hell they would voluntarily contribute that if they didn't have to

AMEN. It costs me 23% per month and I hold 8 % of theirs
Love me some illegals for big projects. Bajo de mesa.

 

[Blues Man]

AMEN. It costs me 23% per month and I hold 8 % of theirs
Love me some illegals for big projects. Bajo de mesa.

You already have6.2% taken out of your pay it's part of your FICA taxes and your employer matches it

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Wait just a minute conboy! That’s socialism!!! Give all that money back NOW!

Why would I? I was forced to pay into the system so I'm taking what's mine.

If you get into an auto accident but were always against the state forcing you to be covered, do you pay for the accident yourself of do you call your insurance company to handle it?

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

I understand the rules of the current IRA

I suggested a modified version be used if it were to replace Social Security.

In all honesty if people did put 12.4% of their income into a balanced portfolio they might find that they have the ability to retire early, especially if they saved an addition 10% in another vehicle there is no reason then to say they should be forced to put off early retirement because of some arbitrary rule that they only have access to their money at age 60

Absolutely. I mean if you start working at the age of 18, by the time you hit 60 you'd probably have a million bucks or more which is more than enough to live on. Like that friend of mine that hit the lottery. He put a million in a growth fund that netted him $1,000 a week. He was only collecting the interest.

 

[gipper]

Why would I? I was forced to pay into the system so I'm taking what's mine.

If you get into an auto accident but were always against the state forcing you to be covered, do you pay for the accident yourself of do you call your insurance company to handle it?

You dirty commie!

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

You dirty commie!

The only thing that's commie about it is not giving us a choice and forcing us into paying for these programs. Collecting from them after paying all your life is not commie, it's common sense.

 

[Likkmee]

You already have6.2% taken out of your pay it's part of your FICA taxes and your employer matches it

I dont live in The Corporation
My guy makes a grand for ex., he gives a $90 cut to the govt (pension-burial). I pay a $230 fee to them.
That covers future disability,full health (with scrips) and sick days

 

[gipper]

The only thing that's commie about it is not giving us a choice and forcing us into paying for these programs. Collecting from them after paying all your life is not commie, it's common sense.

Give it back! Or you a commie!

 

[Lesh]

The only thing that's commie about it is not giving us a choice and forcing us into paying for these programs. Collecting from them after paying all your life is not commie, it's common sense.

Yea...you got yours...fuck anyone who comes after you right?