So nominee Gorsuch proclaims Roe v. Wade as precedent

[Little-Acorn]

So nominee Gorsuch proclaims Roe v. Wade as precedent


Yup. Then, once he's on the Court, he'll get to decide whether a precedent that violates the Constitution, overrules the Constitution. Or does the Constitution invalidate the precedent?

So, DOES a precedent that violates the Constitution, supersede the Constitution?

For example, if someone kidnaps a black man off the street, puts him in chains, and forces him to work on their farm for no pay and minimum sustenance... and the black man later sues him, it comes to the Supreme Court, and they somehow find the kidnapper innocent...

...does that mean that now anyone who wants to, can practice black slavery? Has the 13th amendment been superseded by the precedent established in the case?

 

[NYcarbineer]

So nominee Gorsuch proclaims Roe v. Wade as precedent


Yup. Then, once he's on the Court, he'll get to decide whether a precedent that violates the Constitution, overrules the Constitution. Or does the Constitution invalidate the precedent?

So, DOES a precedent that violates the Constitution, supersede the Constitution?

For example, if someone kidnaps a black man of the street, puts him in chains, and forces him to work on their farm for no pay and minimum sustenance... and the black man later sues him, it comes to the Supreme Court, and they somehow find the kidnapper innocent...

...does that mean that now anyone who wants to, can practice black slavery? Has the 13th amendment been superseded by the precedent established in the case?

Dred Scott was precedent, and just as beloved and sacred to democrats as Roe v. Wade is.

The Constitution was AMENDED to get rid of Dred Scott.

You want to get rid of Roe, AMEND the Constitution. And hey, good luck with that lol.

 

[NYcarbineer]

[

Killing an adult is not abortion. Stay on track. I am for abortion rights as they presently exist, not for random murders of people already born.

Killing a human is killing a human. Dehumanizing the victim by calling them "Juden" or "Fetus" in no way alters what is done.There are times when we kill humans, but those times MUST be rare, and subject to judicial review.

Killing a fetus is not killing a person, constitutionally. The Constitution affords no rights of personhood to the unborn.

 

[sakinago]

[

Killing an adult is not abortion. Stay on track. I am for abortion rights as they presently exist, not for random murders of people already born.

Killing a human is killing a human. Dehumanizing the victim by calling them "Juden" or "Fetus" in no way alters what is done.There are times when we kill humans, but those times MUST be rare, and subject to judicial review.

Killing a fetus is not killing a person, constitutionally. The Constitution affords no rights of personhood to the unborn.

Not true. Roe v Wade extended the 4th amendment (privacy) to cover abortion (in an act of mental gymnastics) and further contorted itself by stating that states have a say in the potentiality of human life. So yes killing a fetus is killing a person constitutionally, and roe v wade even supports this, under a condition of balance (vaguely left up to states), zero is stated about not affording rights to the unborn, except for the protection potentiality of life granted to the states. But if a husband were to kill his pregnant wife, that's constitutionally a double homicide. What you have stated has zero basis and maybe you should do you're research on Roe V Wade since you're such a big supporter and all, but understand zero about the law.

 

[Little-Acorn]

The Constitution was AMENDED to get rid of Dred Scott.

Because the Constitution did not address the matter in Dred Scott. They amended it so it would.

You want to get rid of Roe, AMEND the Constitution.

So we have one vote for "The precedent supersedes the Constitution". If a modern enslaver of a black man somehow gets it past the Supremes, the everybody can enslave blacks from then on, regardless of what the 13th amendment says.

Anyone else?

 

[Missouri_Mike]

"Judge Neil Gorsuch said Tuesday the controversial Supreme Court decision that legalized abortion is “precedent” and acknowledged the ruling had been reaffirmed “many times.”

Gorsuch, President Trump’s nominee to fill the Supreme Court seat vacated when Justice Antonin Scalia died, does not have much of a history ruling on abortion issues, and the contentious subject was one of the first topics broached during the question-and-answer session of Gorsuch’s confirmation hearing before the Senate Judiciary Committee.

“Roe v. Wade, decided in 1973, is a precedent of the United States Supreme Court, it has been reaffirmed…and all of the other factors that go into analyzing precedent have to be considered,” Gorsuch told Sen. Chuck Grassley, R-Iowa. “…A good judge will consider it as precedent of the United States Supreme Court, worthy as treatment of precedent like any other.”

Sen. Dianne Feinstein, the first Democrat to question Gorsuch, immediately followed up, citing the importance of the issue since, she said, President Trump “said he would appoint someone who would overturn Roe.”

“Once a case is settled, that adds to the determinacy of the law,” Gorsuch told Feinstein, clarifying his position on precedent. “What was once a hotly-contested issue is no longer a hotly-contested issue. We move forward.”


Feinstein asked if Gorsuch considered Roe v. Wade “super precedent” – a decision that cannot be overturned.

“It has been reaffirmed many times, I can say that,” Gorsuch answered."

Gorsuch to Feinstein: Abortion ruling is 'precedent'

Sounds like another resounding defeat for the anti-abortion lobby.

Providing we can believe him...


See what I mean when I say liberalism almost always wins in the long run?

Somebody better go look up what precedent means. In this case yes RvW is precedent. As were many laws right up until they changed. Five of nine SC judges can make a new precedent with a single ruling throwing out the old precedent.

lol, so there's one vote for the idea that Gorsuch is simply being deceitful or dishonest in his characterization of Roe.

He was perfectly honest. RvW is the precedent right now. One case he get's to vote on could change that.

 

[Tom Horn]

Do you really think this world would be better off today with 1.5 billion (since 1980) unwanted souls on the planet, in addition to the 7 billion+ who are already crowding the place up and overtaxing the resources?

Do you think it's just a coincidence that since Roe in 1973 and almost 60 million unwanted/unviable pregnancies terminated consequent to it, the crime rate in the US has steadily fallen?

You don't believe in abortion - don't get one. You think your God is against abortion - you're not going to get one or pay for one so it's all good, you're in like Flynn with your God.

Stay the fuck out of everybody else's uteri - it's none of your damned business!

You Stalinists should be scooped up and have your brains vacuumed out....that's what you're doing to babies who can't escape from the abortionists. You've murdered TEN TIMES more Americans than Hitler did Jews....that's twice the population of Canada. You obviously weren't aborted because you're alive.....do you ever wonder how close your mother came to murdering you?

 

[Little-Acorn]

Do you think it's just a coincidence that since Roe in 1973 and almost 60 million unwanted/unviable pregnancies terminated consequent to it, the crime rate in the US has steadily fallen?

Maybe not.

Not all children follow in their parents' footsteps... but many do. Most of the people who support the Roe decision are Democrats, so there's a good chance that most of the aborted babies would have become Democrats too... but now they never will. Since Democrats tend to support lawbreaking and twisting the law and the courts to let criminals off, thus encouraging crime, it makes sense that killing off 60 million potential Democrats would result in a falling crime rate.

Thank you for pointing this out.

 

[sakinago]

Do you really think this world would be better off today with 1.5 billion (since 1980) unwanted souls on the planet, in addition to the 7 billion+ who are already crowding the place up and overtaxing the resources?

Do you think it's just a coincidence that since Roe in 1973 and almost 60 million unwanted/unviable pregnancies terminated consequent to it, the crime rate in the US has steadily fallen?

You don't believe in abortion - don't get one. You think your God is against abortion - you're not going to get one or pay for one so it's all good, you're in like Flynn with your God.

Stay the fuck out of everybody else's uteri - it's none of your damned business!

You Stalinists should be scooped up and have your brains vacuumed out....that's what you're doing to babies who can't escape from your abortionists. You've murdered TEN TIMES more Americans than Hitler did Jews....that's twice the population of Canada. You obviously weren't aborted because you're alive.....do you ever wonder how close your mother came to murdering you?

A. Something Stalin would want to do

B. They're operating on the non sequitur line recently pushed by the Netflix show orange is the new black, the non sequitur being that babies have been aborted, crime has dropped, therefore abortions led to less crime. Even if this were a true correlation it comes from strictly an end justifies the means mentality (which the correlation isn't). This logic is saying it's more beneficial to abort potentially criminal humans than actually address the root problem. From their same logic (let me preface this by saying this is not my own). Since around 30% of the African Americans population commit crimes, it would be beneficial to society to abort more babies of African Americans, and thus lower crime. Which is right in line with the founder of Planned Parenthoods line of thinking, Margaret Sanger, who was one of the most racist c-words in our history, who wanted to sterilize blacks and anyone else she deemed inferior. Her main target was blacks though. Anyway we see her spirit live on in New York where more black babies were aborted than were were born. It really is sad.

 

[BoSoxGal]

Do you really think this world would be better off today with 1.5 billion (since 1980) unwanted souls on the planet, in addition to the 7 billion+ who are already crowding the place up and overtaxing the resources?

Do you think it's just a coincidence that since Roe in 1973 and almost 60 million unwanted/unviable pregnancies terminated consequent to it, the crime rate in the US has steadily fallen?

You don't believe in abortion - don't get one. You think your God is against abortion - you're not going to get one or pay for one so it's all good, you're in like Flynn with your God.

Stay the fuck out of everybody else's uteri - it's none of your damned business!

You Stalinists should be scooped up and have your brains vacuumed out....that's what you're doing to babies who can't escape from the abortionists. You've murdered TEN TIMES more Americans than Hitler did Jews....that's twice the population of Canada. You obviously weren't aborted because you're alive.....do you ever wonder how close your mother came to murdering you?

Actually, if my older sister hadn't died of SIDS at six weeks of age, I'd have been aborted - because the pregnancy after me was terminated. They only wanted 2 kids. When it became clear that the pill was no longer working for my mother, she got an IUD.

It's no skin off my nose considering the possibility that I might have been aborted. I would just have never been. It's not like I would have been sentient at the time of my being vacuumed out. If fetuses have souls, mine would have gone straight to heaven. Except I'd have known nothing of religious fairy tales.

I really can't grasp the fairy tale world view of people who think fetuses are cognizant or equal in personhood to a born human. Bizarre. I'm sure you eat sentient beings on a weekly basis and think nothing of it.

 

[sakinago]

Do you really think this world would be better off today with 1.5 billion (since 1980) unwanted souls on the planet, in addition to the 7 billion+ who are already crowding the place up and overtaxing the resources?

Do you think it's just a coincidence that since Roe in 1973 and almost 60 million unwanted/unviable pregnancies terminated consequent to it, the crime rate in the US has steadily fallen?

You don't believe in abortion - don't get one. You think your God is against abortion - you're not going to get one or pay for one so it's all good, you're in like Flynn with your God.

Stay the fuck out of everybody else's uteri - it's none of your damned business!

You Stalinists should be scooped up and have your brains vacuumed out....that's what you're doing to babies who can't escape from the abortionists. You've murdered TEN TIMES more Americans than Hitler did Jews....that's twice the population of Canada. You obviously weren't aborted because you're alive.....do you ever wonder how close your mother came to murdering you?

Actually, if my older sister hadn't died of SIDS at six weeks of age, I'd have been aborted - because the pregnancy after me was terminated. They only wanted 2 kids. When it became clear that the pill was no longer working for my mother, she got an IUD.

It's no skin off my nose considering the possibility that I might have been aborted. I would just have never been. It's not like I would have been sentient at the time of my being vacuumed out. If fetuses have souls, mine would have gone straight to heaven. Except I'd have known nothing of religious fairy tales.

I really can't grasp the fairy tale world view of people who think fetuses are cognizant or equal in personhood to a born human. Bizarre. I'm sure you eat sentient beings on a weekly basis and think nothing of it.

It's bizarre to think that a different stage of life warrants termination in certain situations. Or that we claim lack of such an abstract concept (and not at all legally defined) as "personhood" for this. It's further bizarre to think we'd never terminate someone deemed brain dead when a doctor gives them over a 90% chance of recovery. It's further bizarre that we'd terminate an individual has their own heart beat we'd actually terminate someone who had over a 90% chance of recovery.

It's also bizarre for one to cite the fact that they don't remember anything as an infant or their very early years , as justification for terminating anything else that falls in the same criteria.

 

[candycorn]

I listened to much of the hearings today. I didn't hear a lot I disagreed with frankly. If I'm a right winger, I'm a bit concerned.

 

[BoSoxGal]

A 9-12 week FETUS is not anything close to an infant or toddler. It's a blob of cells that is barely recognizable as a future infant. It has no sentience. It is in no way equivalent to a born person.

If it did have sentience, it would likely feel gratitude at skipping the part where it has to live in a world full of stupid, mean, racist and murderous humans before getting to the sweet release of death.

You'd think all the religious freaks would be ok with fetus souls going straight to heaven.

 

[BoSoxGal]

I listened to much of the hearings today. I didn't hear a lot I disagreed with frankly. If I'm a right winger, I'm a bit concerned.

Maybe that's because Gorsuch said basically nothing.

 

[Tom Horn]

Actually, if my older sister hadn't died of SIDS at six weeks of age, I'd have been aborted - because the pregnancy after me was terminated. They only wanted 2 kids. When it became clear that the pill was no longer working for my mother, she got an IUD.

It's no skin off my nose considering the possibility that I might have been aborted. I would just have never been. It's not like I would have been sentient at the time of my being vacuumed out. If fetuses have souls, mine would have gone straight to heaven. Except I'd have known nothing of religious fairy tales.

I really can't grasp the fairy tale world view of people who think fetuses are cognizant or equal in personhood to a born human. Bizarre. I'm sure you eat sentient beings on a weekly basis and think nothing of it.

No, you'd have experienced hideous pain having your skull pierced with surgical scissors and then having your brain ripped away from your spinal cord. Just because the baby can't scream doesn't mean it doesn't experience the ghastly torture you're so tolerant of. And how can there be a "heaven" for you if you don't believe in "religious fairy tales"? Once again we see your Stalinist dogma cold as ice to a defenseless baby's suffering. And then it's organs are sold by wine-swilling merchants to the highest bidder. I sure hope you're not around small children....you have no conscience and therefore have no soul.

 

[BoSoxGal]

It's not a baby and doesn't have a fully developed brain OR skull at that stage. You clearly don't know even basic biology. No wonder you have such ignorant reactionary views. Sad.

And I was being facetious about the heaven thing. Heaven is a bullshit fairytale.

You are a bit slow, ain't ya?

 

[Tom Horn]

It's not a baby and doesn't have a fully developed brain OR skull at that stage. You clearly don't know even basic biology. No wonder you have such ignorant reactionary views. Sad.

It's disgraceful that you call yourself a BoSox fan....Baseball is American and you're anything but an American....you should be shipped off to Cuba or Venezuela.

 

[yiostheoy]

I listened to much of the hearings today. I didn't hear a lot I disagreed with frankly. If I'm a right winger, I'm a bit concerned.

candycorn you need to remember that Gorsuch has been coached about what to say.

Job #1 is get confirmed.

Ergo nothing that he says is probably true. It just sounds good for now.

 

[yiostheoy]

[

Killing an adult is not abortion. Stay on track. I am for abortion rights as they presently exist, not for random murders of people already born.

Killing a human is killing a human. Dehumanizing the victim by calling them "Juden" or "Fetus" in no way alters what is done.There are times when we kill humans, but those times MUST be rare, and subject to judicial review.

Killing a fetus is not killing a person, constitutionally. The Constitution affords no rights of personhood to the unborn.

Nor to women or Negroes.

It took further amendments to accomplish all that.

 

[Borillar]

[

Killing an adult is not abortion. Stay on track. I am for abortion rights as they presently exist, not for random murders of people already born.

Killing a human is killing a human. Dehumanizing the victim by calling them "Juden" or "Fetus" in no way alters what is done.There are times when we kill humans, but those times MUST be rare, and subject to judicial review.

Killing a fetus is not killing a person, constitutionally. The Constitution affords no rights of personhood to the unborn.

Nor to women or Negroes.

It took further amendments to accomplish all that.

Well, pass an amendment then. Good luck with that.