SURPRISE!!...better be sitting down...Iran backs out of "Framework" "Deal"

[iamwhatiseem]

Lets see...

Obama proposes a multinational deal with Iran to lift sanctions....Republicans say it is too soft
Iran backs down saying the terms are too harsh.........Republicans now say Obama blew the negotiations

There were no negotiations.
Obama made the announcement right after talks ended that they "had the framework for a deal" that included this and this and that...and Iran officials immediately denied that is what was in agreement.
So...there was NO agreement.
This has been my point all along. Obama never really cared if there was a deal, all he wanted was an excuse to lift the sanctions because Iran said they would not make a deal if sanctions were not immediately lifted the day of the agreement.
They have been very consistent in this statement all along. As well as saying for YEARS that they would not allow inspectors to military sites.
You were fooled again by this administration.
They gave you lip service, and you believed it because you wanted to believe it.

 

[rightwinger]

Lets see...

Obama proposes a multinational deal with Iran to lift sanctions....Republicans say it is too soft
Iran backs down saying the terms are too harsh.........Republicans now say Obama blew the negotiations

There were no negotiations.
Obama made the announcement right after talks ended that they "had the framework for a deal" that included this and this and that...and Iran officials immediately denied that is what was in agreement.
So...there was NO agreement.
This has been my point all along. Obama never really cared if there was a deal, all he wanted was an excuse to lift the sanctions because Iran said they would not make a deal if sanctions were not immediately lifted the day of the agreement.
They have been very consistent in this statement all along. As well as saying for YEARS that they would not allow inspectors to military sites.
You were fooled again by this administration.
They gave you lip service, and you believed it because you wanted to believe it.

Sanctions were not lifted

Republicans play both sides of the fence when they claim the terms are too soft and then blame Obama when Iran claims the terms are too harsh

 

[Care4all]

Lets see...

Obama proposes a multinational deal with Iran to lift sanctions....Republicans say it is too soft
Iran backs down saying the terms are too harsh.........Republicans now say Obama blew the negotiations

There were no negotiations.
Obama made the announcement right after talks ended that they "had the framework for a deal" that included this and this and that...and Iran officials immediately denied that is what was in agreement.
So...there was NO agreement.
This has been my point all along. Obama never really cared if there was a deal, all he wanted was an excuse to lift the sanctions because Iran said they would not make a deal if sanctions were not immediately lifted the day of the agreement.
They have been very consistent in this statement all along. As well as saying for YEARS that they would not allow inspectors to military sites.
You were fooled again by this administration.
They gave you lip service, and you believed it because you wanted to believe it.

Yes, Of COURSE YOU know all the back room skivvy on what went down and all that Obama and Kerry were thinking....sigh.

 

[Care4all]

What is it that makes you guys on the Right tick? Controversy? Negativity? Anti Americanism, or just being sour pusses?

How have you ever succeeded in life with such negativity and animosity in all of you? I wouldn't hire or promote a single person with this kind of hopeless and bitter and hateful outlook....

How have you all not rotted from the inside out yet? Or is this what I have been seeing all along on this board from the right wing....just damaged and rotted and stinky human beings?

I''ll never understand it....

 

[iamwhatiseem]

Sanctions were not lifted

Republicans play both sides of the fence when they claim the terms are too soft and then blame Obama when Iran claims the terms are too harsh

I don't know how many times I have to say this.
I KNOW sanctions have not been lifted. I said, very clearly, that the only reason Iran sat down in the first place was to get them lifted in an agreement - and that happened. I never said, despite claims in this thread repeatedly that they have already been lifted.

 

[BlindBoo]

Is from the OP's link.

I don't care if it came out of his ass. How are these peaceful nuclear facilities "peaceful" may I ask? Do you have your head so far entrenched in your backside to know that you are being played?

Why are you hiding behind what a reporter says? If he says Iran said it, Iran said it.

Call me a kook, call me a conspiracy theorist, I honestly don't give the slightest damn. But many genocidal regimes have used "peace" as a means to annihilate millions of innocent people. You will never get me to believe Iran's nuclear program is for "peaceful purposes." These people are dangerous.

LOL. You're being played by the voices inside your own head.

 

[BlindBoo]

So how did America gain it's Independence?

France came to our rescue.

 

[Coyote]

If the deal is rejected, no sanctions are lifted.

There was no "deal"...what about can you guys not understand?
Obama promised to begin lifting sanctions this summer...even though no concrete deal was made.
You wait and see...some sanctions will be lifted without Iran lifting a finger.
Guarentee it.

The lifting of sanctions was contingent on a deal being agreed upon.

 

[Spare_change]

So what do we lose?

We offered a way out of sanctions and they blew it

We are in the same situation we were before

.... but 9 months later, and 9 months closer to them having a nuclear weapon.

so we should have gone to war 9 months ago??? Is that what you are implying?

Actually, what I'm implying is that the current administration has absolutely no perception of the reality of the Middle East.

In addition to negotiating with them, we should have tightened sanctions 9 months ago. The additional pain may have had an impact ... instead, we coddled them, let them make fools of us.

Nobody suggested war .. but then, nobody should be taking the option off the table. Without the credible threat of retaliation, we have no leverage.

In short - the Obama team pretty much fucked this one up just about every way imaginable.

I do love, however, the on-off mentality of the left .... either we give in, or we go to war. Y'all need to wake up and realize the world is gray.

 

[Derideo_Te]

A significant portion of the sanctions have already been lifted,

 

[Spare_change]

so we should have gone to war 9 months ago??? Is that what you are implying?

Talking nicely to them hasn't worked thus far. Most powerful military force on the planet sits on its ass, while Iran gets ready to wipe Israel off the map (figuratively speaking).

Liberals like you don't give a damn about Israel do you? Answer me honestly.

Boy, that was an answer to my question????? Not!!!

I support Israel over Iran, any day of the week....So stop your bull CRAP....

I don't support the US sending our fathers and sons and husbands to their possible deaths for another nation....our founding fathers felt the same way...and only if Iran becomes a threat to the USA, should US Citizens be sent to die.

I DO NOT, IN ANY WAY SUPPORT PREEMPTIVE WAR....the Bush Doctrine....it goes against everything our founders stood for.

If Iran becomes a real threat to Israel, and tries to attack Israel, then Israel should blow them up to smithereens.

I do like your black-white view of the world. IF Iran becomes a real threat to Israel? If? ..... Amazing.

We have the capability to save a million lives, and you don't think we should. Instead, we should sit on our ass and do nothing. Amazing.

We have the capability to establish an influence in a critical portion of the world, and you don't think we should. I guess your great-great grandfather probably felt the same about California and Texas. Amazing.

 

[Spare_change]

I support Israel over Iran, any day of the week....So stop your bull CRAP..

If you aren't willing to go to war to protect an ally, you are no ally. All you are saying is "I'll be over here cheering you on" while an entire offensive line comes barreling towards them. You don't support Israel. You are begging for its destruction with this farce you call a "framework" deal. Not all problems can be solved through peaceful methods. You can't give them a bouquet of roses and hope to win them over.

I DO NOT, IN ANY WAY SUPPORT PREEMPTIVE WAR....the Bush Doctrine....it goes against everything our founders stood for.

So how did America gain it's Independence? By negotiating with the King of England? No, America kicked his ass, with guns and cannons, not just a pens and papers.

If Iran becomes a real threat to Israel, and tries to attack Israel, then Israel should blow them up to smithereens.

Even as advanced as Israel's military is, it can't fight off everyone who tries to kill them. This cut and run crap is old.

Gosh, I wish I was as brave as you!

I support Israel over Iran, any day of the week....So stop your bull CRAP..

If you aren't willing to go to war to protect an ally, you are no ally. All you are saying is "I'll be over here cheering you on" while an entire offensive line comes barreling towards them. You don't support Israel. You are begging for its destruction with this farce you call a "framework" deal. Not all problems can be solved through peaceful methods. You can't give them a bouquet of roses and hope to win them over.

I DO NOT, IN ANY WAY SUPPORT PREEMPTIVE WAR....the Bush Doctrine....it goes against everything our founders stood for.

So how did America gain it's Independence? By negotiating with the King of England? No, America kicked his ass, with guns and cannons, not just a pens and papers.

If Iran becomes a real threat to Israel, and tries to attack Israel, then Israel should blow them up to smithereens.

Even as advanced as Israel's military is, it can't fight off everyone who tries to kill them. This cut and run crap is old.

Gosh, I wish I was as brave as you!

It has nothing to do with bravery --- it has to do with the commitment to your fellow man. Some, apparently, are so self centered that they are willing to allow millions to die in a nuclear holocaust than take a positive step forward.

 

[Spare_change]

Wa

I don't support the US sending our fathers and sons and husbands to their possible deaths for another nation....our founding fathers felt the same way...and only if Iran becomes a threat to the USA, should US Citizens be sent to die.

Spare me you heartstrings arguments, Care. I had a father who served in Iraq in Desert Storm. He knew what he was getting himself into. As do all the fathers and sons who go to do battle with the enemy, with some of them fighting side by side. You don't mind if cops (fathers, sons, etc) risk their lives and die in the line of duty, but hey, soldiers are a different matter, aren't they?

You rely on one for your protection; taking them for granted, while worrying about the welfare of the other whom defends this country and your freedom. What good is a military if all they do is nothing military? Why have an army if we are afraid to use them, hmm? How much do you value your freedom?

Why light a fire in the cold if you are afraid to kindle it? You would much rather freeze to death than be warmed by the fire.

So when are you joining up? Nice to be so casual about peoples lives from your grandmothers basement.

Way out of line ... you need to grow up just a touch.

 

[Spare_change]

Lets see...

Obama proposes a multinational deal with Iran to lift sanctions....Republicans say it is too soft
Iran backs down saying the terms are too harsh.........Republicans now say Obama blew the negotiations

There were no negotiations.
Obama made the announcement right after talks ended that they "had the framework for a deal" that included this and this and that...and Iran officials immediately denied that is what was in agreement.
So...there was NO agreement.
This has been my point all along. Obama never really cared if there was a deal, all he wanted was an excuse to lift the sanctions because Iran said they would not make a deal if sanctions were not immediately lifted the day of the agreement.
They have been very consistent in this statement all along. As well as saying for YEARS that they would not allow inspectors to military sites.
You were fooled again by this administration.
They gave you lip service, and you believed it because you wanted to believe it.

Sanctions were not lifted

Republicans play both sides of the fence when they claim the terms are too soft and then blame Obama when Iran claims the terms are too harsh

Ahhhhhh ... ignorance is such bliss, isn't it?

 

[Coyote]

so we should have gone to war 9 months ago??? Is that what you are implying?

Talking nicely to them hasn't worked thus far. Most powerful military force on the planet sits on its ass, while Iran gets ready to wipe Israel off the map (figuratively speaking).

Liberals like you don't give a damn about Israel do you? Answer me honestly.

Boy, that was an answer to my question????? Not!!!

I support Israel over Iran, any day of the week....So stop your bull CRAP....

I don't support the US sending our fathers and sons and husbands to their possible deaths for another nation....our founding fathers felt the same way...and only if Iran becomes a threat to the USA, should US Citizens be sent to die.

I DO NOT, IN ANY WAY SUPPORT PREEMPTIVE WAR....the Bush Doctrine....it goes against everything our founders stood for.

If Iran becomes a real threat to Israel, and tries to attack Israel, then Israel should blow them up to smithereens.

I do like your black-white view of the world. IF Iran becomes a real threat to Israel? If? ..... Amazing.

Yes. "If".

We have the capability to save a million lives, and you don't think we should. Instead, we should sit on our ass and do nothing. Amazing.

What million lives need saving?

The Syrians in the wake of ISIS?
Iraqi civilians, after we mucked up their state?
The Congolese, in the wake of a decades long civil war?

We have the capability to establish an influence in a critical portion of the world, and you don't think we should. I guess your great-great grandfather probably felt the same about California and Texas. Amazing.

"Pre-emptive" war gave us today's Iraq. Is this the "influence" you wish to establish?

 

[IlarMeilyr]

Iraqis were not doing all that well under Saddam's regime, frankly. Rape rooms. Torture rooms. Random executions. Gassing his own people. Invading other lands (i.e., war) which causes lots of death to his own people, too.

 

[Coyote]

Iraqis were not doing all that well under Saddam's regime, frankly. Rape rooms. Torture rooms. Random executions. Gassing his own people. Invading other lands (i.e., war) which causes lots of death to his own people, too.

True. But honestly - is what you see there today, or in the years of sectarian civil war - better than what they had under Saddam?

 

[IlarMeilyr]

Iraqis were not doing all that well under Saddam's regime, frankly. Rape rooms. Torture rooms. Random executions. Gassing his own people. Invading other lands (i.e., war) which causes lots of death to his own people, too.

True. But honestly - is what you see there today, or in the years of sectarian civil war - better than what they had under Saddam?

Honestly. It might be. Tough to compare when lots of what Saddam's regime did was done in such secrecy.

 

[Spare_change]

so we should have gone to war 9 months ago??? Is that what you are implying?

Talking nicely to them hasn't worked thus far. Most powerful military force on the planet sits on its ass, while Iran gets ready to wipe Israel off the map (figuratively speaking).

Liberals like you don't give a damn about Israel do you? Answer me honestly.

Boy, that was an answer to my question????? Not!!!

I support Israel over Iran, any day of the week....So stop your bull CRAP....

I don't support the US sending our fathers and sons and husbands to their possible deaths for another nation....our founding fathers felt the same way...and only if Iran becomes a threat to the USA, should US Citizens be sent to die.

I DO NOT, IN ANY WAY SUPPORT PREEMPTIVE WAR....the Bush Doctrine....it goes against everything our founders stood for.

If Iran becomes a real threat to Israel, and tries to attack Israel, then Israel should blow them up to smithereens.

I do like your black-white view of the world. IF Iran becomes a real threat to Israel? If? ..... Amazing.

Yes. "If".

We have the capability to save a million lives, and you don't think we should. Instead, we should sit on our ass and do nothing. Amazing.

What million lives need saving?

The Syrians in the wake of ISIS?
Iraqi civilians, after we mucked up their state?
The Congolese, in the wake of a decades long civil war?

We have the capability to establish an influence in a critical portion of the world, and you don't think we should. I guess your great-great grandfather probably felt the same about California and Texas. Amazing.

"Pre-emptive" war gave us today's Iraq. Is this the "influence" you wish to establish?

First --- do you have any doubt that millions will die if Iran secures the bomb? We - and only we - have the capability to stop that. If we don't, then we deserve their blood on our hands.

Second - the failure of our political leaders to do what is right and just should not be used as justification for not doing it again.

Third - The 'pre-emptive' war did NOT give us today's Iraq. The failure of the current administration to properly execute the end game of the war is what gave us today's Iraq.

 

[Spare_change]

Iraqis were not doing all that well under Saddam's regime, frankly. Rape rooms. Torture rooms. Random executions. Gassing his own people. Invading other lands (i.e., war) which causes lots of death to his own people, too.

True. But honestly - is what you see there today, or in the years of sectarian civil war - better than what they had under Saddam?

Not particularly --- and the blame for that has to lay at the feet of the current administration.