The Argument for A Wealth Tax

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

How does the debtor find the extra $20

The same way you pay off your mortgage every month.

if there is only $1000 in existence?

Luckily there is more than $1000 in existence.

You just demonstrated a complete lack of understanding.

Unbelievable.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

How does the debtor find the extra $20

The same way you pay off your mortgage every month.

if there is only $1000 in existence?

Luckily there is more than $1000 in existence.

You just demonstrated a complete lack of understanding.

Unbelievable.

I understand that the money supply is larger than $1000......do you?

 

[DandyDonovan]

Interesting idea. It would end a lot of debt and funding issues

Consider

US wealth inequality - top 0.1% worth as much as the bottom 90%

The top 1/10 of one per cent own almost 25% of the nation's wealth

That's the same amount of wealth as the bottom NINETY PER CENT of the county

In that light a 2% wealth tax isn't that outrageous

I haven't checked the numbers but I have read that it could provide 30 trillion dollars over 10 years.


Health care

Education

Green New Deal

SMH

First of all, that wealth was already taxed when it was earned.

Second of all, you could confiscate every single dime that Jeff Bezos is worth, and "redistribute " it to the bottom 10% of earners and within 5 years 90% of them would be flat broke again.

The top 1% have 90% of the wealth because they EARN IT.

Want more, earn more.

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

How does the debtor find the extra $20

The same way you pay off your mortgage every month.

if there is only $1000 in existence?

Luckily there is more than $1000 in existence.

Okay, let's try this again.

There is ZERO money. No money, right?

Then, the Fed/Treasury prints only $1,000. That's all the money. No more. Right? You with me?

Then, Fed loans it to Debtor at 2% APY for 1 years.

There is only $1,000 in existence. Keep that in mind.

The Debtor must repay $1020 ($1,000 in principle and $20 interest).

There is only $1,000 in existence.

Where does the debtor find the extra $20?

There is only $1,000 in existence.
There is only $1,000 in existence.
There is only $1,000 in existence.
There is only $1,000 in existence.

I'll wait.

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

I understand that the money supply is larger than $1000......do you?

I accept you feeble surrender.

 

[bendog]

Aside from the misquote what does this term "monetary system" mean to you? Our monetary system is "fiat," the same as the rest of the developed world's.

Monetary policy is a more accurate term. Thuogh, I do sometimes call it a system myself. I need to stop doing that.

But, yes. Fiat system. Currency is not money. It's currency. To be money, there needs to be a store of value.

The rest of the world is starting to get scared off the dollar now. They depend on it, yes. But that can change.

Therein lies the rub. When the dollar finally does crash, the whole world will go down with it unless they move to something else. The dolalr is almost worthless now, it's been inflated to the point of being almost nothing.

We're seeing some interesting things with the Asian and BRICS banks. And we're starting to see other nations merge in some interesting ways, particularly the satellites they're putting up there. That's where all of the international clearing happens. It's all digital. And I think that's why we're startign to hear all of the silliness abouit a space force, the west isnlt gonna juve wit hthat stuff, they're gonna want to keep an aye on it. .A lot of nations are starting to get their gold reserves in order, too.

Remember all of that government spying everyone was raising hell about a few years ago? Well, what they never talked about in the lamestream media was that the majority of the spying was on the financial clearing of other nations. That's a big deal.

Well the central banks of the world operate more or less on a monetarist policy. So Keynes seems almost quaint, although in ways Reagan's deficits through our current double supply side tax cut despite near zero interest rates .... are Keynesian stimulus. But in 1980 the split in the democrat party that is still playing itself out with single payer v Schultz/Bloomberg came about when Carter opted to raise unemployment to lower inflation.... and Reagan stayed the course in spades. Ted Kennedy preferred wage and price controls.

More recently Bernake uttered notion that if zero interest rates didn't shock us out of deflation, he's just start paying people to borrow money!

At some point our debt may be so Yuuuge that we cannot pay the interest on it, and that would presumably end the dollar as the world's reserve currency.

 

[Lesh]

How does the debtor find the extra $20

The same way you pay off your mortgage every month.

if there is only $1000 in existence?

Luckily there is more than $1000 in existence.

Okay, let's try this again.

There is ZERO money. No money, right?

Then, the Fed/Treasury prints only $1,000. That's all the money. No more. Right? You with me?

Then, Fed loans it to Debtor at 2% APY for 1 years.

There is only $1,000 in existence. Keep that in mind.

The Debtor must repay $1020 ($1,000 in principle and $20 interest).

There is only $1,000 in existence.

Where does the debtor find the extra $20?

There is only $1,000 in existence.
There is only $1,000 in existence.
There is only $1,000 in existence.
There is only $1,000 in existence.

I'll wait.

What do you think inflation is?

And what happens to that $1000 once it's repaid?

It goes away. RIght back to the ether it came from but in the meantime...whoever borrowed that money was able to USE it to build or create or whatever

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

Well the central banks of the world operate more or less on a monetarist policy. So Keynes seems almost quaint, although in ways Reagan's deficits through our current double supply side tax cut despite near zero interest rates .... are Keynesian stimulus.

I agree. Reagan was probably the clearest example of a Keynesian. That's one of the reasons why I hated him.

 

[bendog]

I understand that the money supply is larger than $1000......do you?

I accept you feeble surrender.

You've proven that unless the money supply rises at least as much as interest rates, the economy will shrink (recession) because people will not borrow money.

 

[martybegan]

Interesting idea. It would end a lot of debt and funding issues

Consider

US wealth inequality - top 0.1% worth as much as the bottom 90%

The top 1/10 of one per cent own almost 25% of the nation's wealth

That's the same amount of wealth as the bottom NINETY PER CENT of the county

In that light a 2% wealth tax isn't that outrageous

I haven't checked the numbers but I have read that it could provide 30 trillion dollars over 10 years.


Health care

Education

Green New Deal

The argument against.

1) it's stupid
2) it would lead to massive needs for liquidation of fixed assets in some cases, which requires buyers, who would also probably be trying to liquidate assets
3) It's Unconstitutional at the Federal level.

1. Thanks for your stupid opinion

2. For a two per cent tax?

3.on what basis? States already tax wealth (property taxes)

Also, say a person owns $500 million is assets, that's another $10 million in taxes, above their income taxes, property taxes, and other taxes. that means they have to have $10 million in liquid assets they don't use for anything else, or now they have to sell something to raise that money.

Now create a market where many people have to sell assets to pay the tax, where will you find anyone to buy them?

What happens today if you owe ten million dollars and don't pay it. Why the government confiscates it. Hell, they can take that shit right out of your bank account.

If it's only income tax you should be able to cover it with, i don't know, your income.

Wealth taxes can require liquidation of hard assets. Now property taxes can have the same issue but they are usually much less than 1%-3% of everything someone owns.

They are just property, not furnishings, vehicles, art, investment holdings, etc.

 

[Lesh]

Second of all, you could confiscate every single dime that Jeff Bezos is worth, and "redistribute " it to the bottom 10% of earners and within 5 years 90% of them would be flat broke again.

RIght...because the poor are poor because they;re lazy and stupid. Sure

First of all, that wealth was already taxed when it was earned.

Income gets taxed numerous times. Property taxes are paid with money that has been taxed as income...sales taxes and excise taxes as well.

What's your stupid point?

 

[Lesh]

I understand that the money supply is larger than $1000......do you?

I accept you feeble surrender.

You've proven that unless the money supply rises at least as much as interest rates, the economy will shrink (recession) because people will not borrow money.

And therin is how the system works

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

What do you think inflation is?

And what happens to that $1000 once it's repaid?

It goes away. RIght back to the ether it came from but in the meantime...whoever borrowed that money was able to USE it to build or create or whatever

Yes. That is the simplest way to describe the transaction.

Why charge interest via a Fed?

Why not SPEND it into circulation and have it build or create or whatever?

Why the interest and who benefits from said interest, and why should they benefit from said interest when they have provided or contributed ZERO value?

 

[DandyDonovan]

Second of all, you could confiscate every single dime that Jeff Bezos is worth, and "redistribute " it to the bottom 10% of earners and within 5 years 90% of them would be flat broke again.

RIght...because the poor are poor because they;re lazy and stupid. Sure

First of all, that wealth was already taxed when it was earned.

Income gets taxed numerous times. Property taxes are paid with money that has been taxed as income...sales taxes and excise taxes as well.

What's your stupid point?

Oh I see, so your argument is "well the government already taxes the fuck out of us multiple times on the same money, so who cares if they do it one more time"

Please lecture me more about stupid points.

 

[Natural Citizen]

I understand that the money supply is larger than $1000......do you?

I accept you feeble surrender.

Ha. I'll answer for the Toddster.

If you borrow the very first dollar in existence and you promise to pay it back plus another dollar's worth of interest, where do you get the second dollar to pay the interest?

The answer is that you have to borrow that dollar into existence and promise to pay it back with interest as well. So, now there are 2 dollars in existence, but you now owe 4. And so on, and so on, and so on, and so on. It keeps happening over and over and over again. The result is that there is never enough 'currency' to pay the debt. There is always more debt in the system than there is 'currency' in existence to pay the debt. Therefore the entire system is impossible. It is finite. It will come to an end one day.

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

I understand that the money supply is larger than $1000......do you?

I accept you feeble surrender.

You've proven that unless the money supply rises at least as much as interest rates, the economy will shrink (recession) because people will not borrow money.

And therin is how the system works

And, therein is the fraud.

 

[Lesh]

Wealth taxes can require liquidation of hard assets

Yea and? If your networth is over 10 million I'm sure you can liquidate enough to cover 2% without starving.

And what happens to that asset after liquidation? Does it disappear? No? Someone else uses it to grow the economy?

Oh..

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

Ha. I'll answer for the Toddster.

If you borrow the very first dollar in existence and you promise to pay it back plus another dollar's worth of interest, where do you get the second dollar to pay the interest?

The answer is that you have to borrow that dollar into existence and promise to pay it back with interest as well. So, now there are 2 dollars in existence, but you now owe 4. And so on, and so on, and so on, and so on. It keeps happening over and over and over again. The result is that there is never enough 'currency' to pay the debt. There is always more debt in the system than there is 'currency' in existence to pay the debt. Therefore the entire system is impossible. It is finite. It will come to an end one day.

I will add that the entire system is a complete fraud.

 

[Lesh]

I understand that the money supply is larger than $1000......do you?

I accept you feeble surrender.

Ha. I'll answer for the Toddster.

If you borrow the very first dollar in existence and you promise to pay it back plus another dollar's worth of interest, where do you get the second dollar to pay the interest?

The answer is that you have to borrow that dollar into existence and promise to pay it back with interest as well. So, now there are 2 dollars in existence, but you now owe 4. And so on, and so on, and so on, and so on. It keeps happening over and over and over again. The result is that there is never enough 'currency' to pay the debt. There is always more debt in the system than there is 'currency' in existence to pay the debt. Therefore the entire system is impossible. It is finite. It will come to an end one day.

You either do not understand or you intentionally exaggerated.

You talk about 100% interest compounded when the reality is a fraction of that

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

How does the debtor find the extra $20

The same way you pay off your mortgage every month.

if there is only $1000 in existence?

Luckily there is more than $1000 in existence.

Okay, let's try this again.

There is ZERO money. No money, right?

Then, the Fed/Treasury prints only $1,000. That's all the money. No more. Right? You with me?

Then, Fed loans it to Debtor at 2% APY for 1 years.

There is only $1,000 in existence. Keep that in mind.

The Debtor must repay $1020 ($1,000 in principle and $20 interest).

There is only $1,000 in existence.

Where does the debtor find the extra $20?

There is only $1,000 in existence.
There is only $1,000 in existence.
There is only $1,000 in existence.
There is only $1,000 in existence.

I'll wait.

There is ZERO money. No money, right?

Wrong.

Then, the Fed/Treasury prints only $1,000. That's all the money. No more. Right? You with me?

Still wrong.

Then, Fed loans it to Debtor at 2% APY for 1 years.

You're not allowed to borrow from the Fed.

There is only $1,000 in existence. Keep that in mind.

Still wrong. Keep that in mind.

The Debtor must repay $1020 ($1,000 in principle and $20 interest).​

Okay.
​

There is only $1,000 in existence. ​

Are you under the impression that the Fed is the only entity that can create money?

I'll wait.

​