The 'Dangerous' Faith of President Bush

[CSM]

I know their names; do you know the name of the person first lady Laura Bush killed? It happened when she was just 17.

Getting back to Mrs. Tucker

It seems that she was taking pleasure in sinning; she was high and looking to get more drugs to satisfy her pleasure of the flesh. She also took pleasure in the killings that night, she got a orgasim from it.
Other people have admitted that there is pleasure in killing, a member of a tank crew in the first gulf war stated the reason he had to get out of the army was because he got a high from the killing, and he felt that he had to get away from it before it over took him.
The true point of this argument is to get the holly rollers to admit, the true nature of man. The nature they deny on the one hand, but take part in one the other hand along with the rest of the secular society.
There can be no good without evil, no ying without yang.
Think about this, we will talk more about it later.

The guys name was Michael Douglas. happened in Midland Tx, in 1963.

 

[Zhukov]

The true point of this argument is to get the holly rollers to admit, the true nature of man. The nature they deny on the one hand, but take part in one the other hand

I think you have the wrong group of people in mind. The religious right no all about the 'true nature of man.' That's why the beholden-to-none liberal secularists worry them so.

And that's why they advocate the execution of murderers.

Is providing quotes about how much the psychopath enjoyed their murderous activities supposed to make me regret they were put to death? Now there's an interesting strategy.

As far as your comparison of a murderer to one of our soldiers, well that's just low and disrespectful, and I don't even see the point you were trying to make, or if making a point was even your aim.

Notice however, that unlike the murderer the soldier felt remorse.

Do you know why?

Because our soldiers aren't murderers.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Actually, the only one's I see pointing out the next "enemy of society" are the religious right-wingnuts who give Christianity, and religion in general, a bad name.

As for the hope of Christ's return, you should be careful what you wish for. I don't hink he would be amused with what y'all have done to His Word.

Who are we right wingers pointing at? All I see is libs badmouthing christians, baselessly.

you claim a faith in jesus is "not logical". Yet you have faith in authoritarian government and income redistribution though it's effects have been verified: economies shrink, genocide begins. That's the long and short of it. Your steadfast leftistness seems at the very least illogical, and at the worst, a combination of cynicism, self-loathing, and immorality.

 

[Bullypulpit]

Who are we right wingers pointing at? All I see is libs badmouthing christians, baselessly.

you claim a faith in jesus is "not logical". Yet you have faith in authoritarian government and income redistribution though it's effects have been verified: economies shrink, genocide begins. That's the long and short of it. Your steadfast leftistness seems at the very least illogical, and at the worst, a combination of cynicism, self-loathing, and immorality.

I don't know where you draw your conlusion...From the nether regions of your bowels perhaps? But they are as incorrect as they are irrational.

 

[dmp]

I don't know where you draw your conlusion...From the nether regions of your bowels perhaps? But they are as incorrect as they are irrational.

This is the equivalent of "Nuh-uh!!"

:-/

 

[rtwngAvngr]

I don't know where you draw your conlusion...From the nether regions of your bowels perhaps? But they are as incorrect as they are irrational.

Lah hoo zuh err

 

[relaxing909]

And you!

Cat got your tongue? Or do you give up?

sorry i do have a life

what am i?

i believe there is something out there.. some kind of higher force.. energy.

but i don't believe the christian god is 'THE' god over all.

 

[Avatar4321]

sorry i do have a life

what am i?

i believe there is something out there.. some kind of higher force.. energy.

but i don't believe the christian god is 'THE' god over all.

And how did you determine that?

 

[White knight]

The religious right no all about the 'true nature of man.'

And that's why they advocate the execution of murderers

.
Yes I think the pope was celebrating in his own words 'the culture of death' in America and asking the U.S. to increase the executions, and get rid of more sinners.. And Mr. P. Robertson was strongly advocating the execution of Mrs. Tucker.

Is providing quotes about how much the psychopath enjoyed their murderous activities supposed to make me regret they were put to death?

Don't try to read into anything, they were giving testimony to true human nature. The side the church would tell you does not exist in man, but only in sinners.
Just like when you talk out of one side of you mouth and say killing is wrong, then other side you say when the church supports killing it is good.

Notice however, that unlike the murderer the soldier felt remorse.

No, He did not, and that is what scared him, and why he got out.

 

[Zhukov]

.
Yes I think the pope was

The pope is a fool.

And Mr. P. Robertson

Worse than the pope.

Don't try to read into anything, they were giving testimony to true human nature. The side the church would tell you does not exist in man, but only in sinners.

Christians believe all human beings are sinners.

Just like when you talk out of one side of you mouth and say killing is wrong, then other side you say when the church supports killing it is good.

Murder is wrong. Murder. That's why which ever commandment it is does not accurately translate into "Thou shalt not kill." The correct translation is "Do not murder." There's a big difference between cold blooded murder and killing the enemy for your country, and people more knowledgeable than me concerning biblical text could explain to you why murderers are killed (not murdered), killing in self-defense is not forbidden, and it's all perfectly alright according the christian dogma.

Besides I never said "when the church supports killing it is good." I never made any judgement about it at all. You implied that not pardoning death row inmates was some how contrary to the President's faith yet you've failed to explain exactly why that is. All you did was make some silly comments about the pope and Pat Robertson.

No, He did not, and that is what scared him, and why he got out.

He enjoyed it, and that caused him sufficient personal anguish to quit? Sounds like remorse to me. You can be scared and exhilirated, as I'm sure most serial killers are their first time. The anecdote you provide indicates a different kind of fear. It suggests to me shame and remorse on his part.

I think I saw that show too though. Small guy with a mustache and glasses?

 

[White knight]

I have a hard time understanding how people claim to be true followers of Christ, but do not adhere to what they claim to be following.

Would Christ advocate killing for any reason or participating in a process like the Romans had, of a judgment followed by a execution?

One of the most notable problems I have with Bush was his get tuff on crime stance during his run for Texas governor.
Crime in Texas was on the decline, but his strategists choose to make it a campaign issue. The reason for this was to appeal to a base that he had already courted for his fathers run to the White House.
This get tough on crime (sinners) helped him to gain the support of the evangelicals. He chooses to make homosexuality as a rally cry, again appealing to the views and fears (emotions) of the moral majority.
As governor of Texas, there were more people executed in his state then any another state, during this time. The reason this was news worthy was that other state governors were holding off on carrying our executions, because of the new research and science of DNA.
States were starting to learn through DNA testing that many of the inmates who were executed were innocent.
So most Governors were holding off, until the dust settled on these new findings and new policy could be put into place to make sure that a innocent person was not executed when DNA evidence was available.
Not G.W.
Was he thinking about his Born Again Christian values and what it meant to him? Or was he thinking about appealing to his new Evangelical, moral majority base who liked his get tuff on sinners stance?
This man sought refuge in the Texas Air National Guard during the Vietnam War, but he has no problem making life or death decisions where others are concerned. Even when allowing a little extra time, for the DNA issue to resolved.

 

[ajwps]

I have a hard time understanding how people claim to be true followers of Christ, but do not adhere to what they claim to be following.

Would Christ advocate killing for any reason or participating in a process like the Romans had, of a judgment followed by a execution?

You ask if Jesus Christ would advocate killing or 'slaying' for any reason or participating in same.

Luke 19

26 For I say unto you, That unto every one which hath shall be given; and from him that hath not, even that he hath shall be taken away from him.
27 But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me.

 

[Bonnie]

Many people make the mistake of thinking because Jesus says if someone strikes you turn the other cheek, to mean he was a doormat. The real meaning behind that is turning the other cheek towards your enemy is an insult to them, and a form of retaliation.

 

[trobinett]

Many people make the mistake of thinking because Jesus says if someone strikes you turn the other cheek, to mean he was a doormat. The real meaning behind that is turning the other cheek towards your enemy is an insult to them, and a form of retaliation.

Thank you bonnie, I`ve tried for years to understand the meaning of that saying"turn the other cheek", but just couldn`t get my brain around it.

Your explanation covers it.

Good for ya.

 

[ajwps]

Many people make the mistake of thinking because Jesus says if someone strikes you turn the other cheek, to mean he was a doormat. The real meaning behind that is turning the other cheek towards your enemy is an insult to them, and a form of retaliation.

Bonnie

Are you referring to the fact that turning the other cheek in the time of Jesus really was meant as an insult instead of the Ghandi syndrome? The Iraqis thought that by slapping someone with the bottom of your shoe was a great insult to them. Is that similar to Jesus' turning the other cheek?

Non-violent reaction to attack was the Mahatma's theory of winning a battle as it would cause the human nature of people to realize that they were hitting or killing people lining up to their deaths.

How do you explain the Luke passage in which Jesus asks for his enemies to be brought before him so that they can be slain in front of him?

 

[Bonnie]

Bonnie

Are you referring to the fact that turning the other cheek in the time of Jesus really was meant as an insult instead of the Ghandi syndrome? The Iraqis thought that by slapping someone with the bottom of your shoe was a great insult to them. Is that similar to Jesus' turning the other cheek?

Non-violent reaction to attack was the Mahatma's theory of winning a battle as it would cause the human nature of people to realize that they were hitting or killing people lining up to their deaths.

How do you explain the Luke passage in which Jesus asks for his enemies to be brought before him so that they can be slain in front of him?

I believe it is similar, but Im not sure, and I think the intent of Jesus was to show that it's great to be peaceful, but he also does not intend for us to be like sheep to the slaughter. Reg the Luke passage Ill need to read it and seeit in it's full context before I state my opinion.

 

[Zhukov]

Was he thinking about his Born Again Christian values and what it meant to him?

Listen, you can talk about executions in Texas, and the Air National Guard all you want, and go on and on and on, but all you're saying in effect is the President is not a real Christian because of 'such and such'.

I'm no Christian, so if you want to explain to me exactly how the President is a bad one, you're going to have to provide some specific examples (I'm talking about text and pronouncements) to make your case.

So he didn't pardon people a jury sent to death row, why does that make him a bad Christian?

So he served in the Texas Air National guard, why does that make him a bad Christian?

You're not really offering anything substantive. You're just complaining about actions of this President you don't happen to agree with, and trying to make those actions seem hypocritical. Yet you have presented nothing concrete.

 

[ajwps]

Listen, you can talk about executions in Texas, and the Air National Guard all you want, and go on and on and on, but all you're saying in effect is the President is not a real Christian because of 'such and such'.

I'm no Christian, so if you want to explain to me exactly how the President is a bad one, you're going to have to provide some specific examples (I'm talking about text and pronouncements) to make your case.

So he didn't pardon people a jury sent to death row, why does that make him a bad Christian?

So he served in the Texas Air National guard, why does that make him a bad Christian?

You're not really offering anything substantive. You're just complaining about actions of this President you don't happen to agree with, and trying to make those actions seem hypocritical. Yet you have presented nothing concrete.

Zukov if I'm not mistaken, born-again Christians are forgiven only after they meet their just end on earth. There is no foregiveness for sins committed during your life but for Christians, it is up to Jesus to forgive those who come before him in his realm.

Most everyone who is about to die for their murderous sins on earth suddenly find that they are born-again. But those condemned to death for taking the lives of others must pay for their deeds by a society which needs to protect others from suffering and death from so-called born again Chrisitans.

 

[White knight]

So he didn't pardon people a jury sent to death row, why does that make him a bad Christian?

So he served in the Texas Air National guard, why does that make him a bad Christian?

I believe the topic had to do with the president’s faith, or religious values.

A blind man could see how this relates to questions of morality and a persons values.

As it was noted in the press at the time, DNA testing was proving that innocent men were being executed; most State Governors had put a moratorium on carry out executions.
This seemed like the moral and right thing to do, if you can prevent an innocent man from being executed, why not hold off and see if the new discovery could prove his guilt or innocence.
G.W. did not think that way. He bucked the trend, why? Was he thinking about one of the issues that helped him gain popular support from the bible toting, moral majority? His get-tough stance against crime and homosexuals, which won him the governorship.


As far as the National Guard issue is concerned, the real question is so he chose to hide out in the Air National Guard why does that make him a bad Christian?

Again it’s a question of moral character that keeps popping up with this man.

This was a time when the nation needed young men to fight in a war. Some men may have been against the war, but were drafted and accepted their fate, others volunteered to serve, G.W. Bush chose to serve State side, back home with the women. In having family privilege invoked for him, he was safe from the draft because he managed to get ahead of the line, in others words he but his ass before all the other people who wanted to get in the ANG and avoid the draft. It’s a simple question of moral character.

 

[Zhukov]

I believe the topic had to do with the president’s faith, or religious values.

Yes, and again you haven't explained how his actions and his faith are contradictory.

Was he thinking about one of the issues that helped him gain popular support from the bible toting, moral majority? His get-tough stance against crime and homosexuals, which won him the governorship.

Get tough on homosexuals?

Concerning crime, he couldn't possibly really believe any of that now could he?

Some men may have been against the war, but were drafted and accepted their fate, others volunteered to serve, G.W. Bush chose to serve State side

And the majority had nothing to do with the war whatsoever. So he volunteered for the ANG because it was possible he might be drafted? At least he didn't flee the country.

You know flying jets isn't exactly safe.

Now, doing some very preliminary calculations, total US deaths in Vietnam were of the order of 50,000 out of a total of 2.6 million who served, or roughly 2%.

...

So, 5,250 pilots and 70 deaths means a death rate of: 1.3%.
Jeez. The lousy damn coward. He went and hid in a unit, one which had active service members actually in Vietnam, one where the death rate in training and peacetime from accident alone was damn nearly the same as active service in Vietnam for all troops. Sheesh.

http://timworstall.typepad.com/timworstall/2004/08/bush_and_the_f1.html

Of course, you still aren't explaing what any of that has to do with his faith.

Zukov if I'm not mistaken, born-again Christians are forgiven only after they meet their just end on earth

I have no idea. I'm honestly asking for a specific example of how the President's actions contradict his faith, because I am not versed in the matter. WK isn't helping

But those condemned to death for taking the lives of others must pay for their deeds by a society which needs to protect others from suffering and death from so-called born again Chrisitans.

I've read this like five times and I'm still not entirely sure what it is you are trying to say.