The Dangers of Corporations Controlling National Secrets

[Lakhota]

Regardless of one's political persuasion, it's hard to deny that corporations have far too much power. They don't yet have total control of government and military - but they're sure getting closer. Corporate takeover is further facilitated by many former government officials and high-ranking military officers who end up on the payrolls of major corporations (lobbyists and such). I don't foresee this trend reversing in my lifetime. In fact, this trend may never reverse. The military-industrial complex wants perpetual war.

 

[Dugdale_Jukes]

Regardless of one's political persuasion, it's hard to deny that corporations have far too much power. They don't yet have total control of government and military - but they're sure getting closer. Corporate takeover is further facilitated by many former government officials and high-ranking military officers who end up on the payrolls of major corporations (lobbyists and such). I don't foresee this trend reversing in my lifetime. In fact, this trend may never reverse. The military-industrial complex wants perpetual war.

Not sure what planet you are on, but corporations OWN the US government. From the teachers' unions to Exxon, congress is owned lock, stock and barrel by paper entities.

Reagan gave Wall Street (and by extension the corporate clients of major league finance) the keys to the US Treasury when he replaced Volcker with a weak-kneed political hack nobody like Greenspan. In 1980 lobbying was vaguely unsavory. By 1988 little boys and girls wanted to be lobbyists.

 

[Lakhota]

Regardless of one's political persuasion, it's hard to deny that corporations have far too much power. They don't yet have total control of government and military - but they're sure getting closer. Corporate takeover is further facilitated by many former government officials and high-ranking military officers who end up on the payrolls of major corporations (lobbyists and such). I don't foresee this trend reversing in my lifetime. In fact, this trend may never reverse. The military-industrial complex wants perpetual war.

Not sure what planet you are on, but corporations OWN the US government. From the teachers' unions to Exxon, congress is owned lock, stock and barrel by paper entities.

Reagan gave Wall Street (and by extension the corporate clients of major league finance) the keys to the US Treasury when he replaced Volcker with a weak-kneed political hack nobody like Greenspan. In 1980 lobbying was vaguely unsavory. By 1988 little boys and girls wanted to be lobbyists.

1. You may be right, but I'm not yet ready to concede that our government is totally corporate-owned - yet. However, there is no doubt our government is majority-owned by corporations.

2. I also don't believe unions are corporations. I've yet to see one with a ticker symbol and stockholders. Teachers' unions may lobby - but they're nothing compared to the military-industrial complex.

 

[dilloduck]

Regardless of one's political persuasion, it's hard to deny that corporations have far too much power. They don't yet have total control of government and military - but they're sure getting closer. Corporate takeover is further facilitated by many former government officials and high-ranking military officers who end up on the payrolls of major corporations (lobbyists and such). I don't foresee this trend reversing in my lifetime. In fact, this trend may never reverse. The military-industrial complex wants perpetual war.

Obama is giving it to them.

 

[Lakhota]

There are two great centers of unaccountable power in the American political-economic system today — places where decisions that significantly affect large numbers of Americans are made in secret, and are unchecked either by effective democratic oversight or by market competition.

One goes by the name of the “intelligence community” and its epicenter is the National Security Agency within the Defense Department.

The second center of unaccountable power goes by the name of Wall Street and is centered in the largest banks there.

More: The Two Centers of Unaccountable Power in America, and Their Consequences - By Robert Reich

 

[TemplarKormac]

It's pretty obvious that modern corporations have no loyalty to any country. They wish to be self-sovereign, and they are more than halfway to that goal.

It's pretty obvious our government swears no loyalty to it's own people. Just like a corporation.

 

[lynn63]

There are many ex CEO's of major corporations that are now employed by our government. From a corporate point of view - "If you can't beat them, join them"

Corporations learned long ago if they wanted tax laws to change for their benefit, they had to get involved in politics and donate lots of money to future politicians to do their bidding. If they wanted to move overseas, it helps to have the military there to protect them from any trouble that might occur on someone's turf.

So yes, in a sense, our government is working for corporate businesses these days. Greed has made them take a leave of their senses and has sold out the american people in the process. In April of 2013 another mass layoff of 248,000 people according to the U.S. Labor statistics in manufacturing.

This trend is likely to continue until there is nothing left in that industry. 1 in 6 private sector jobs depend on manufacturing that employs a lot of people to stay in business. How long can America survive without any jobs?

 

[georgephillip]

The direction we're headed for in this country is corporate rule. Part of our disappearing job problem is the offshoring and outsourcing. This is done by your beloved corporations that must do everything for profit motive and the American people can go to hell. Where are the jobs going to be for the kids coming of age? We talk a lot about education however if the kids have to compete with the third world wages, they don't have much of a chance at a decent life. Both parties are bought and paid for. Obama has been pushing the trade deals that bush started, Clinton sold us out on Nafta and other giveaways. All for profit of corporations. This is probably irreversible but the republican working stiffs? Bootlicking and bowing down to the major corporations and very, very wealthy class. Me, I'm for some overthrow. Start with the oil industry by nationalizing it and using the profits for we the people. Education, health care etc. Our constant wars for corporate profit that has turned USA into international terrorists? This is what's helping bankrupt us. Stop the wars also if we want a future our upcoming generations.

Where do corporations come from?
Here's one possibility:

"It wasn't until the early twentieth century that courts and lawyers designed a new socioeconomic system. It was never done by legislation. It was done mostly by courts and lawyers and the power they could exercise over individual states. New Jersey was the first state to offer corporations any right they wanted..."

"Then the courts and the corporate lawyers came along and created a whole new body of doctrine which gave corporations authority and power that they never had before. If you look at the background of it, it's the same background that led to fascism and Bolshevism.

"A lot of it was supported by people called progressives, for these reasons: They said, individual rights are gone. We are in a period of corporatization of power, consolidation of power, centralization. That's supposed to be good if you're a progressive, like a Marxist-Leninist.

"Out of that same background came three major things: fascism, Bolshevism, and corporate tyranny."

Education is Ignorance, by Noam Chomsky (Excerpted from Class Warfare)

Noam Chomsky is your brilliant insight on finding yourself as an inmate in a surveillance state??? We have 12 MAJOR scandals and revelations this week regarding your IMMEDIATE civil rights and you're worried about Bolshevism and corporate tyranny..

NO -- You're not gonna spin this or change the topic on these things. Nope. No Sir.. Aint gonna work...

I'm pretty clear on the Fourth Amendment and its significance to our civil rights:

"The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.[1]"

I wonder if you are equally aware it is private for-profit corporations who are responsible for the "12 MAJOR scandals and revelations this week regarding (our) IMMEDIATE civil rights"?

 

[flacaltenn]

This thread no longer has any link to the OP.. It's off the rails bitchin' about Capitalism and Free Markets while your rights burn in hell.

I see that all the poo slinging monkeys are here.. Have a ball comrades...

If you want to read COGENT INTELLIGIENT replies to this OP question.. Go look up my thread...

"Civil Libertarians Need Not Apply"...

 

[georgephillip]

Regardless of one's political persuasion, it's hard to deny that corporations have far too much power. They don't yet have total control of government and military - but they're sure getting closer. Corporate takeover is further facilitated by many former government officials and high-ranking military officers who end up on the payrolls of major corporations (lobbyists and such). I don't foresee this trend reversing in my lifetime. In fact, this trend may never reverse. The military-industrial complex wants perpetual war.

I think it's guaranteed the trend will continue throughout all of our lives as long as we continue "choosing" our Representatives and Senators on the basis of Democrat or Republican. There is a multitude of third party candidates ranging from far right to lefty socialists already appearing on most ballots, and should millions of US voters decide to FLUSH hundreds of incumbents from DC in a single news cycle, Hope and Change won't be just an advertising slogan.

 

[Lakhota]

Regardless of one's political persuasion, it's hard to deny that corporations have far too much power. They don't yet have total control of government and military - but they're sure getting closer. Corporate takeover is further facilitated by many former government officials and high-ranking military officers who end up on the payrolls of major corporations (lobbyists and such). I don't foresee this trend reversing in my lifetime. In fact, this trend may never reverse. The military-industrial complex wants perpetual war.

I think it's guaranteed the trend will continue throughout all of our lives as long as we continue "choosing" our Representatives and Senators on the basis of Democrat or Republican. There is a multitude of third party candidates ranging from far right to lefty socialists already appearing on most ballots, and should millions of US voters decide to FLUSH hundreds of incumbents from DC in a single news cycle, Hope and Change won't be just an advertising slogan.

Agreed. I'm 66 - so I'll never live to see the change - if it ever changes.

 

[boilermaker55]

You see what people like TemplarKormac don't quite get is that corporations own this country. They try to pretend this is the best place ever for free enterprise but look at some of the legislation passed over the last few decades.
It is all about corporate welfare, which the right thinks does not exist.
But they sure believe in the Old Jewish book of fairy tales.
One day they will know how they are living in a plutocratic society.

The privatized national security apparatus isn’t just wasteful—it’s contrary to the founding principles of our democratic republic.

It's time to completely end the privatization of national security.

Business Week recently pointed out that 99 percent of Booze Allen Hamilton's revenues come from government contracts.

Why would we pay a CEO millions, stockholders tens of millions, and workers a small fortune when the same work could and should be done by civil servants?

Even worse, our privatized national security apparatus isn’t just wasteful; it’s contrary to the founding principles of our democratic republic.

Governments can be made accountable, transparent, and responsive to “We the People.” In fact, that's the core idea of our Constitution.

On the other hand corporations, by and large, are accountable only to profits.They’re opaque, and don't give a damn about “We the People,” except for the people who run them.

There once was a time, before Reagan put us on a privatization binge, when our national security was run by our government and answerable to “We the People.”

However, ever since the Reagan Revolution, our political class has been obsessed with the idea that since government can’t do anything right, private companies should take over most of our commons, even, in this case, the commons of our national security.

And that’s created an entire industry of companies like Booz Allen Hamilton, where NSA leaker Edward Snowden worked, reaping millions in profits every year to manage and lobby for an ever-expanding and ever-more-profitable national security industry.

Privatization enthusiasts praise contractors as efficient and responsible purveyors of public service, but corporations, by virtue of being corporations, are incompatible with the functions of representative government.

At its core, a republic requires accountability.

We entrust to our public officials the power to act in our interest.

If they violate that trust, we expect them to either face punishment or resign from their duties.

After all, they serve us, not stockholders or CEOs.

More: The Dangers of Corporations Controlling National Secrets | Alternet - By Thom Hartmann

I trust our imperfect government to act in our best interests more than corporations. President Dwight "Ike" Eisenhower warned us.

Eisenhower's Military-Industry Complex Warning, 50 Years Later : NPR

 

[georgephillip]

Regardless of one's political persuasion, it's hard to deny that corporations have far too much power. They don't yet have total control of government and military - but they're sure getting closer. Corporate takeover is further facilitated by many former government officials and high-ranking military officers who end up on the payrolls of major corporations (lobbyists and such). I don't foresee this trend reversing in my lifetime. In fact, this trend may never reverse. The military-industrial complex wants perpetual war.

I think it's guaranteed the trend will continue throughout all of our lives as long as we continue "choosing" our Representatives and Senators on the basis of Democrat or Republican. There is a multitude of third party candidates ranging from far right to lefty socialists already appearing on most ballots, and should millions of US voters decide to FLUSH hundreds of incumbents from DC in a single news cycle, Hope and Change won't be just an advertising slogan.

Agreed. I'm 66 - so I'll never live to see the change - if it ever changes.

I will turn 66 by Labor Day, and we both could live long enough to see hundreds of Republicans AND Democrats FLUSHED from the US Congress in a single news cycle in November of 2014. The tool we are communicating with right now makes that possible; all that's lacking is the will.

 

[Lakhota]

Here is a sobering quote by Abe Lincoln:

“I see in the near future a crisis approaching that unnerves me and causes me to tremble for the safety of my country. . . . corporations have been enthroned and an era of corruption in high places will follow, and the money power of the country will endeavor to prolong its reign by working upon the prejudices of the people until all wealth is aggregated in a few hands and the Republic is destroyed.”

—U.S. President Abraham Lincoln, Nov. 21, 1864
(letter to Col. William F. Elkins)​

More: What Lincoln Forsaw: Corporations "Enthroned" and Re-Writing the Laws Defining Their Existence

 

[bripat9643]

They are better friends than liberals are.

What has a liberal ever done for me aside from loot me and enslave me?

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Everybody knows that.

 

[bripat9643]

Here is a sobering quote by Abe Lincoln:

“I see in the near future a crisis approaching that unnerves me and causes me to tremble for the safety of my country. . . . corporations have been enthroned and an era of corruption in high places will follow, and the money power of the country will endeavor to prolong its reign by working upon the prejudices of the people until all wealth is aggregated in a few hands and the Republic is destroyed.”

—U.S. President Abraham Lincoln, Nov. 21, 1864
(letter to Col. William F. Elkins)​

More: What Lincoln Forsaw: Corporations "Enthroned" and Re-Writing the Laws Defining Their Existence

Why would anyone take advice like that from Lincoln, the only dictator this country has ever had?

 

[bripat9643]

Agreed. I'm 66 - so I'll never live to see the change - if it ever changes.

I will turn 66 by Labor Day, and we both could live long enough to see hundreds of Republicans AND Democrats FLUSHED from the US Congress in a single news cycle in November of 2014. The tool we are communicating with right now makes that possible; all that's lacking is the will.[/QUOTE]

It isn't going to happen. Get used to it.

 

[bripat9643]

You see what people like TemplarKormac don't quite get is that corporations own this country. They try to pretend this is the best place ever for free enterprise but look at some of the legislation passed over the last few decades.
It is all about corporate welfare, which the right thinks does not exist.
But they sure believe in the Old Jewish book of fairy tales.
One day they will know how they are living in a plutocratic society.

Corporate welfare is all the result of legislation supported by the left, like ethanol mandates.

 

[bripat9643]

I think it's guaranteed the trend will continue throughout all of our lives as long as we continue "choosing" our Representatives and Senators on the basis of Democrat or Republican. There is a multitude of third party candidates ranging from far right to lefty socialists already appearing on most ballots, and should millions of US voters decide to FLUSH hundreds of incumbents from DC in a single news cycle, Hope and Change won't be just an advertising slogan.

There aren't many people in this country willing to vote for the Communist party, so your dream will never come to pass.

 

[bripat9643]

I'm pretty clear on the Fourth Amendment and its significance to our civil rights:

"The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.[1]"

I wonder if you are equally aware it is private for-profit corporations who are responsible for the "12 MAJOR scandals and revelations this week regarding (our) IMMEDIATE civil rights"?

Wrong, the government is responsible. Government is the institution violating our rights, not corporations.