The Fair Tax Primer

[martybegan]

But now your plan puts it right in front of people. The government becomes your sugar daddy explicitly.

I think you're not completely off-base. The idea of the government controlling what is an acceptable amount of money for a "minimal" or "basic" standard of living turns my stomach. And the idea of the government sending me a check every month like a permission slip to buy food does as well.

Relative to what we have going on now though? Some distorted amalgam of convoluted and complicated laws whereby the government will preemptively take some amount of your money and hold onto it for you? That's worse. So from a relative standpoint, it's a reluctant improvement.

From there, the idea of taxing consumption rather than income... i love it. Rather than government directly stealing your labor from you, you're in more control of just how much tax you pay in relation to just how much you want to enjoy the fruits of your labor.

I agree as well, but I don't have G5000's deathwish on any exemptions for certain low cost nessasary items.

The corruption of exemptions would not stop at "low cost necessary items". Just look at the $1.4 trillion of exemptions, deductions, and credits there are now!

What you have always failed to comprehend is that every exemption must be offset either by higher tax rates or by borrowing. Exemptions are therefore theft. Wealth redistribution.

So...ZERO exemptions. That is the greater good.

No, they are not "theft". They may not be fair to you, but "theft" implies it's the government's money in the first place.

Once again you show you are an OCD idiot.

Yes, they are theft because they drive up tax rates on EVERYONE. We all pay higher taxes out of our own pockets to offset those tax expenditures. That makes them theft.

Tax expenditures are a massive wealth transfer scheme.

You just can't accept the simple fact that we all pay higher taxes so some people can pay less. So you lie to yourself.

You are a THEFT enabler.

This is Econ 101.

That assumes that spending is fixed.

here's a solution, spend less.

it's comical you see a few exemptions as a bigger threat then everyone getting a government check every month.

People will come to think of it as government providing for them "free money" which is much worse than not paying taxes on a freaking twinkie.

 

[martybegan]

I think making everyone dependent on a government check every month is far worse, and far worse than the current situation.

Everyone is already dependent on the government. They are dependent on the government for their child tax credit, their mortgage insurance deduction, their employer sponsored health insurance tax exemption, and so on and so on and so on.

They are dependent to the tune of $1.4 trillion of gifts every year!

But now your plan puts it right in front of people. The government becomes your sugar daddy explicitly.

That's the definition of transparency!

A great many of the people on this forum have demonstrated they are incredibly ignorant of just how dependent on the government they are. Including yourself!

And things were going so nice until you had to go to your smug fuckhole mode.

It's transparent in a bad way. But as you do with anything Trump, you get fixated and go asshole.

Fuck you.

Thank you for proving my point about how dependent you are on the government.

All it proves is you can't be civil for more than 5 posts before you become a poseur degenerate fucktard.

 

[g5000]

Basic math.

Two entities with identical incomes should be paying identical taxes.

However, one entity receives a deduction. That requires the other entity to pay more tax to offset the other entity's deduction.

The first entity is leeching off the second.

This is the system we currently have in America. Entities earning identical incomes are paying radically different taxes. We are plagued with leeches.

ECON 101.

 

[martybegan]

Basic math.

Two entities with identical incomes should be paying identical taxes.

However, one entity receives a deduction. That requires the other entity to pay more tax to offset the other entity's deduction.

The first entity is leeching off the second.

This is the system we currently have in America. Entities earning identical incomes are paying radically different taxes. We are plagued with leeches.

ECON 101.

it's not leeching. Stop saying that.

And I noticed you tried to dodge by not quoting me, you fucking cowardly hack.

 

[g5000]

I think you're not completely off-base. The idea of the government controlling what is an acceptable amount of money for a "minimal" or "basic" standard of living turns my stomach. And the idea of the government sending me a check every month like a permission slip to buy food does as well.

Relative to what we have going on now though? Some distorted amalgam of convoluted and complicated laws whereby the government will preemptively take some amount of your money and hold onto it for you? That's worse. So from a relative standpoint, it's a reluctant improvement.

From there, the idea of taxing consumption rather than income... i love it. Rather than government directly stealing your labor from you, you're in more control of just how much tax you pay in relation to just how much you want to enjoy the fruits of your labor.

I agree as well, but I don't have G5000's deathwish on any exemptions for certain low cost nessasary items.

The corruption of exemptions would not stop at "low cost necessary items". Just look at the $1.4 trillion of exemptions, deductions, and credits there are now!

What you have always failed to comprehend is that every exemption must be offset either by higher tax rates or by borrowing. Exemptions are therefore theft. Wealth redistribution.

So...ZERO exemptions. That is the greater good.

No, they are not "theft". They may not be fair to you, but "theft" implies it's the government's money in the first place.

Once again you show you are an OCD idiot.

Yes, they are theft because they drive up tax rates on EVERYONE. We all pay higher taxes out of our own pockets to offset those tax expenditures. That makes them theft.

Tax expenditures are a massive wealth transfer scheme.

You just can't accept the simple fact that we all pay higher taxes so some people can pay less. So you lie to yourself.

You are a THEFT enabler.

This is Econ 101.

That assumes that spending is fixed.

here's a solution, spend less.

it's comical you see a few exemptions as a bigger threat then everyone getting a government check every month.

People will come to think of it as government providing for them "free money" which is much worse than not paying taxes on a freaking twinkie.

Cutting spending is great, but has fuck-all to do with tax expenditures.

You are still leeching off others when you take a deduction.

The government has to take in revenue no matter how much it spends. If you are allowed to decrease the amount you pay, someone else has to pay more.

Basic, simple math which escapes you because you don't want to see what a leech you are.

 

[g5000]

Basic math.

Two entities with identical incomes should be paying identical taxes.

However, one entity receives a deduction. That requires the other entity to pay more tax to offset the other entity's deduction.

The first entity is leeching off the second.

This is the system we currently have in America. Entities earning identical incomes are paying radically different taxes. We are plagued with leeches.

ECON 101.

it's not leeching. Stop saying that.

And I noticed you tried to dodge by not quoting me, you fucking cowardly hack.

It is leeching. I am stating a fact. I am not going to stop preaching the truth, leech.

 

[martybegan]

I agree as well, but I don't have G5000's deathwish on any exemptions for certain low cost nessasary items.

The corruption of exemptions would not stop at "low cost necessary items". Just look at the $1.4 trillion of exemptions, deductions, and credits there are now!

What you have always failed to comprehend is that every exemption must be offset either by higher tax rates or by borrowing. Exemptions are therefore theft. Wealth redistribution.

So...ZERO exemptions. That is the greater good.

No, they are not "theft". They may not be fair to you, but "theft" implies it's the government's money in the first place.

Once again you show you are an OCD idiot.

Yes, they are theft because they drive up tax rates on EVERYONE. We all pay higher taxes out of our own pockets to offset those tax expenditures. That makes them theft.

Tax expenditures are a massive wealth transfer scheme.

You just can't accept the simple fact that we all pay higher taxes so some people can pay less. So you lie to yourself.

You are a THEFT enabler.

This is Econ 101.

That assumes that spending is fixed.

here's a solution, spend less.

it's comical you see a few exemptions as a bigger threat then everyone getting a government check every month.

People will come to think of it as government providing for them "free money" which is much worse than not paying taxes on a freaking twinkie.

Cutting spending is great, but has fuck-all to do with tax expenditures.

You are still leeching off others when you take a deduction.

The government has to take in revenue no matter how much it spends. If you are allowed to decrease the amount you pay, someone else has to pay more.

Basic, simple math which escapes you because you don't want to see what a leech you are.

leech leech leech, you are a one trick pony, and it's a bad one.

Getting a check from the government you expect to need every month to make ends meet is basically giving up on the idea of independence.

It's leashing people to the government via a payout.

It's the dumbest fucking idea ever made, you fucking moron.

 

[martybegan]

Basic math.

Two entities with identical incomes should be paying identical taxes.

However, one entity receives a deduction. That requires the other entity to pay more tax to offset the other entity's deduction.

The first entity is leeching off the second.

This is the system we currently have in America. Entities earning identical incomes are paying radically different taxes. We are plagued with leeches.

ECON 101.

it's not leeching. Stop saying that.

And I noticed you tried to dodge by not quoting me, you fucking cowardly hack.

It is leeching. I am stating a fact. I am not going to stop preaching the truth, leech.

The only leeching going on is whatever is sucking out the ability to think from your brain, you TDS suffering splooge.

 

[g5000]

Basic math.

Two entities with identical incomes should be paying identical taxes.

However, one entity receives a deduction. That requires the other entity to pay more tax to offset the other entity's deduction.

The first entity is leeching off the second.

This is the system we currently have in America. Entities earning identical incomes are paying radically different taxes. We are plagued with leeches.

ECON 101.

it's not leeching. Stop saying that.

And I noticed you tried to dodge by not quoting me, you fucking cowardly hack.

It is leeching. I am stating a fact. I am not going to stop preaching the truth, leech.

The only leeching going on is whatever is sucking out the ability to think from your brain, you TDS suffering splooge.

You can't even make a coherent argument. The sum total of your intellect is to shout, "Nuh uh!"


Let's see if you are dumb enought to call Devin Nunes a libtard liar blah blah blah...

Here is Nunes explaining that every credit, deduction, and exemption is paid for by raising tax rates on everyone: No tax reform without border adjustment tax, Rep. Nunes says

"If people wanted to drop the corporate rate from 35 to say 33, 32, maybe 30, we could probably do it. But if you go back to several years that we looked at doing just that, the goal was to get to 25 percent, and by the time every lobbyist, every special interest group in town, representing every major corporation in this country, the tax rate was automatically all the way back above 30 by the time you put everybody's special loophole in."


Read that a hundred times if that is how much it takes for you to comprehend it.

I know you won't.

Nunes sits on the House Ways and Means Committee. That's the committee responsible for taxation.

Nunes clearly states that every deduction, exemption, and credit is paid for by raising tax rates on everyone. That's why I call them government gifts, because they are. They are theft from someone else's pocket.

Leeching.

 

[martybegan]

Basic math.

Two entities with identical incomes should be paying identical taxes.

However, one entity receives a deduction. That requires the other entity to pay more tax to offset the other entity's deduction.

The first entity is leeching off the second.

This is the system we currently have in America. Entities earning identical incomes are paying radically different taxes. We are plagued with leeches.

ECON 101.

it's not leeching. Stop saying that.

And I noticed you tried to dodge by not quoting me, you fucking cowardly hack.

It is leeching. I am stating a fact. I am not going to stop preaching the truth, leech.

The only leeching going on is whatever is sucking out the ability to think from your brain, you TDS suffering splooge.

Let's see if you are dumb enought to call Devin Nunes a libtard liar blah blah blah...

Here is Nunes explaining that every credit, deduction, and exemption is paid for by raising tax rates on everyone: No tax reform without border adjustment tax, Rep. Nunes says

"If people wanted to drop the corporate rate from 35 to say 33, 32, maybe 30, we could probably do it. But if you go back to several years that we looked at doing just that, the goal was to get to 25 percent, and by the time every lobbyist, every special interest group in town, representing every major corporation in this country, the tax rate was automatically all the way back above 30 by the time you put everybody's special loophole in."


Read that a hundred times if that is how much it takes for you to comprehend it.

I know you won't.

Nunes sits on the House Ways and Means Committee. That's the committee responsible for taxation.

Nunes clearly states that every deduction, exemption, and credit is paid for by raising tax rates on everyone. That's why I call them government gifts, because they are. They are theft from someone else's pocket.

Leeching.

What he is saying is everyone gets deductions, and some of them he doesn't like. blah blah blah.

Not theft. stop being such a melodramatic ninny.

And the sad thing is that i agree with you on the concept of consumption based taxation rather than income based, but you are such a thick headed idiot that you can't even take that and then rant over the implementation of it.

 

[g5000]

The Fair Tax introduces transparency.

Under our current system, our politicians are paid big bucks to sneak all kinds of gifts into the tax code which allows special interest to pay less tax. There are only two ways to offset these gifts to the leeches:

1) Increase tax rates on everyone

2) Borrow

Our government does both. It raises tax rates and borrows heavily from our enemies, at interest. All to accommodate the $1.4 trillion a tax expenditures.


With the Fair Tax, you get a lot more transparency.

 

[g5000]

Basic math.

Two entities with identical incomes should be paying identical taxes.

However, one entity receives a deduction. That requires the other entity to pay more tax to offset the other entity's deduction.

The first entity is leeching off the second.

This is the system we currently have in America. Entities earning identical incomes are paying radically different taxes. We are plagued with leeches.

ECON 101.

it's not leeching. Stop saying that.

And I noticed you tried to dodge by not quoting me, you fucking cowardly hack.

It is leeching. I am stating a fact. I am not going to stop preaching the truth, leech.

The only leeching going on is whatever is sucking out the ability to think from your brain, you TDS suffering splooge.

Let's see if you are dumb enought to call Devin Nunes a libtard liar blah blah blah...

Here is Nunes explaining that every credit, deduction, and exemption is paid for by raising tax rates on everyone: No tax reform without border adjustment tax, Rep. Nunes says

"If people wanted to drop the corporate rate from 35 to say 33, 32, maybe 30, we could probably do it. But if you go back to several years that we looked at doing just that, the goal was to get to 25 percent, and by the time every lobbyist, every special interest group in town, representing every major corporation in this country, the tax rate was automatically all the way back above 30 by the time you put everybody's special loophole in."


Read that a hundred times if that is how much it takes for you to comprehend it.

I know you won't.

Nunes sits on the House Ways and Means Committee. That's the committee responsible for taxation.

Nunes clearly states that every deduction, exemption, and credit is paid for by raising tax rates on everyone. That's why I call them government gifts, because they are. They are theft from someone else's pocket.

Leeching.

What he is saying is everyone gets deductions, and some of them he doesn't like. blah blah blah.

Not theft. stop being such a melodramatic ninny.

And the sad thing is that i agree with you on the concept of consumption based taxation rather than income based, but you are such a thick headed idiot that you can't even take that and then rant over the implementation of it.

Wrong. Nunes states quite plainly, leech, that tax expenditures require raising everyone's tax rates in order to offset those gifts.

Everyone has to pay higher taxes. Period.

They are theft. Pure and simple.

 

[Wyatt earp]

First cut BLOATED government spending then we can talk about taxes.

Start with the Pentagon.

Raise the Social Security and Medicare eligibility age to 70, and index the age to 9 percent of the population going forward.

Right, a 70 year old granny can stand all day on a factory floor. Hopefully she will die before she collects one dime of the social security and medicare benefits she was forced to purchase. Hell lets raise the age to 80.

That's the point of social security, it was not meant to be a retirement program for everyone..when it started the average age of death was under 65 years old

 

[NightFox]

Basic math.

Two entities with identical incomes should be paying identical taxes.

However, one entity receives a deduction. That requires the other entity to pay more tax to offset the other entity's deduction.

The first entity is leeching off the second.

This is the system we currently have in America. Entities earning identical incomes are paying radically different taxes. We are plagued with leeches.

ECON 101.

it's not leeching. Stop saying that.

And I noticed you tried to dodge by not quoting me, you fucking cowardly hack.

It is leeching. I am stating a fact. I am not going to stop preaching the truth, leech.

The only leeching going on is whatever is sucking out the ability to think from your brain, you TDS suffering splooge.

You can't even make a coherent argument. The sum total of your intellect is to shout, "Nuh uh!"


Let's see if you are dumb enought to call Devin Nunes a libtard liar blah blah blah...

Here is Nunes explaining that every credit, deduction, and exemption is paid for by raising tax rates on everyone: No tax reform without border adjustment tax, Rep. Nunes says

"If people wanted to drop the corporate rate from 35 to say 33, 32, maybe 30, we could probably do it. But if you go back to several years that we looked at doing just that, the goal was to get to 25 percent, and by the time every lobbyist, every special interest group in town, representing every major corporation in this country, the tax rate was automatically all the way back above 30 by the time you put everybody's special loophole in."


Read that a hundred times if that is how much it takes for you to comprehend it.

I know you won't.

Nunes sits on the House Ways and Means Committee. That's the committee responsible for taxation.

Nunes clearly states that every deduction, exemption, and credit is paid for by raising tax rates on everyone. That's why I call them government gifts, because they are. They are theft from someone else's pocket.

Leeching.

The problem you have is that you insist on using that idiotic phrase "tax expenditure" which is a complete oxymoron instead of just calling it what it is, tax FAVORITISM.

IMHO if you stop parroting politicians and their apparatchiks I suspect you'll be more effective in getting your points across.

 

[g5000]

Basic math.

Two entities with identical incomes should be paying identical taxes.

However, one entity receives a deduction. That requires the other entity to pay more tax to offset the other entity's deduction.

The first entity is leeching off the second.

This is the system we currently have in America. Entities earning identical incomes are paying radically different taxes. We are plagued with leeches.

ECON 101.

it's not leeching. Stop saying that.

And I noticed you tried to dodge by not quoting me, you fucking cowardly hack.

It is leeching. I am stating a fact. I am not going to stop preaching the truth, leech.

The only leeching going on is whatever is sucking out the ability to think from your brain, you TDS suffering splooge.

You can't even make a coherent argument. The sum total of your intellect is to shout, "Nuh uh!"


Let's see if you are dumb enought to call Devin Nunes a libtard liar blah blah blah...

Here is Nunes explaining that every credit, deduction, and exemption is paid for by raising tax rates on everyone: No tax reform without border adjustment tax, Rep. Nunes says

"If people wanted to drop the corporate rate from 35 to say 33, 32, maybe 30, we could probably do it. But if you go back to several years that we looked at doing just that, the goal was to get to 25 percent, and by the time every lobbyist, every special interest group in town, representing every major corporation in this country, the tax rate was automatically all the way back above 30 by the time you put everybody's special loophole in."


Read that a hundred times if that is how much it takes for you to comprehend it.

I know you won't.

Nunes sits on the House Ways and Means Committee. That's the committee responsible for taxation.

Nunes clearly states that every deduction, exemption, and credit is paid for by raising tax rates on everyone. That's why I call them government gifts, because they are. They are theft from someone else's pocket.

Leeching.

The problem you have is that you insist on using that idiotic phrase "tax expenditure" which is a complete oxymoron instead of just calling it what it is, tax FAVORITISM.

IMHO if you stop parroting politicians and their apparatchiks I suspect you'll be more effective in getting your points across.

I use the correct technical term for them. It's not a political term, it is an economics term.

"Favoritism" is a political term.

Facts are facts. Sometimes facts have to shoved down the throats of the leeches who defend this mad scheme.

 

[martybegan]

The Fair Tax introduces transparency.

Under our current system, our politicians are paid big bucks to sneak all kinds of gifts into the tax code which allows special interest to pay less tax. There are only two ways to offset these gifts to the leeches:

1) Increase tax rates on everyone

2) Borrow

Our government does both. It raises tax rates and borrows heavily from our enemies, at interest. All to accommodate the $1.4 trillion a tax expenditures.


With the Fair Tax, you get a lot more transparency.

And you replace it with a government check to every person that then allows government to control them even more.

No. Thank. You.

 

[martybegan]

it's not leeching. Stop saying that.

And I noticed you tried to dodge by not quoting me, you fucking cowardly hack.

It is leeching. I am stating a fact. I am not going to stop preaching the truth, leech.

The only leeching going on is whatever is sucking out the ability to think from your brain, you TDS suffering splooge.

Let's see if you are dumb enought to call Devin Nunes a libtard liar blah blah blah...

Here is Nunes explaining that every credit, deduction, and exemption is paid for by raising tax rates on everyone: No tax reform without border adjustment tax, Rep. Nunes says

"If people wanted to drop the corporate rate from 35 to say 33, 32, maybe 30, we could probably do it. But if you go back to several years that we looked at doing just that, the goal was to get to 25 percent, and by the time every lobbyist, every special interest group in town, representing every major corporation in this country, the tax rate was automatically all the way back above 30 by the time you put everybody's special loophole in."


Read that a hundred times if that is how much it takes for you to comprehend it.

I know you won't.

Nunes sits on the House Ways and Means Committee. That's the committee responsible for taxation.

Nunes clearly states that every deduction, exemption, and credit is paid for by raising tax rates on everyone. That's why I call them government gifts, because they are. They are theft from someone else's pocket.

Leeching.

What he is saying is everyone gets deductions, and some of them he doesn't like. blah blah blah.

Not theft. stop being such a melodramatic ninny.

And the sad thing is that i agree with you on the concept of consumption based taxation rather than income based, but you are such a thick headed idiot that you can't even take that and then rant over the implementation of it.

Wrong. Nunes states quite plainly, leech, that tax expenditures require raising everyone's tax rates in order to offset those gifts.

Everyone has to pay higher taxes. Period.

They are theft. Pure and simple.

Since everyone gets some form of deduction, it usually balances out.

and again, government checks bad.

 

[g5000]

The Fair Tax introduces transparency.

Under our current system, our politicians are paid big bucks to sneak all kinds of gifts into the tax code which allows special interest to pay less tax. There are only two ways to offset these gifts to the leeches:

1) Increase tax rates on everyone

2) Borrow

Our government does both. It raises tax rates and borrows heavily from our enemies, at interest. All to accommodate the $1.4 trillion a tax expenditures.


With the Fair Tax, you get a lot more transparency.

And you replace it with a government check to every person that then allows government to control them even more.

No. Thank. You.

It's replaced with a prebate which mitigates the regressive nature of a sales tax.

In exchange, EVERYONE has skin in the game. As I explained several times in this topic already, this will also mitigate excessive spending, because if people demand more spending they have to pay the bill out of their own pockets.

We currently exist in a scheme whereby you get a deduction which someone else has to make up for with higher taxes.

 

[Skull Pilot]

My only issue with the Fair Tax is the "prebate" thing.

It seems silly to charge a higher rate of a tax only to have to incur the cost if giving every single person in the country a check every month

We already have high tax rates and massive borrowing to cover the $1.4 trillion of tax expenditures each year.

So your objection is demonstrating an ignorance of a much worse situation which already exists.

My objection is charging a higher rate of sales tax then incurring the expense of sending every single person in the country a check every month is fucking stupid just lower the rate and eliminate all the extra paperwork and expenses

 

[g5000]

It is leeching. I am stating a fact. I am not going to stop preaching the truth, leech.

The only leeching going on is whatever is sucking out the ability to think from your brain, you TDS suffering splooge.

Let's see if you are dumb enought to call Devin Nunes a libtard liar blah blah blah...

Here is Nunes explaining that every credit, deduction, and exemption is paid for by raising tax rates on everyone: No tax reform without border adjustment tax, Rep. Nunes says

"If people wanted to drop the corporate rate from 35 to say 33, 32, maybe 30, we could probably do it. But if you go back to several years that we looked at doing just that, the goal was to get to 25 percent, and by the time every lobbyist, every special interest group in town, representing every major corporation in this country, the tax rate was automatically all the way back above 30 by the time you put everybody's special loophole in."


Read that a hundred times if that is how much it takes for you to comprehend it.

I know you won't.

Nunes sits on the House Ways and Means Committee. That's the committee responsible for taxation.

Nunes clearly states that every deduction, exemption, and credit is paid for by raising tax rates on everyone. That's why I call them government gifts, because they are. They are theft from someone else's pocket.

Leeching.

What he is saying is everyone gets deductions, and some of them he doesn't like. blah blah blah.

Not theft. stop being such a melodramatic ninny.

And the sad thing is that i agree with you on the concept of consumption based taxation rather than income based, but you are such a thick headed idiot that you can't even take that and then rant over the implementation of it.

Wrong. Nunes states quite plainly, leech, that tax expenditures require raising everyone's tax rates in order to offset those gifts.

Everyone has to pay higher taxes. Period.

They are theft. Pure and simple.

Since everyone gets some form of deduction, it usually balances out.

No, that is not true at all. Not even close to being true.