The rise of fascism, nationalism and populism today

[Iceweasel]

Tariffs and personally interfering with business decisions of companies IS protectionism.

By interfering you mean offering tax relief like every state and city does? Tariffs are appropriate if they put tariffs on us, tit for tat. That's how the big boys play.

But we aren't talking about tit for tat.

Rightwing has traditionally been largely government hands off free trade.

It isn't free trade if they put tariffs on us and we don't on them. Your vocabulary doesn't match dictionary terms. A market can only be "free" if the teams are on the same playing field. And I haven't seen the left do anything but make it worse.

Trump is not talking about putting tariffs on goods in response to their tariffs.

Yes he is. He is also talking about US companies leaving, which amounts to the same thing.

 

[Iceweasel]

You mean like gun owners are registered?

Guns are tools. Not people. We register cars after all. And we register property.

Cars are registered for tax purposes. Guns aren't taxed...they are registered to KNOW who owns them.

Cars are only taxed states with personal property taxes, but not in others. They're registered in all states plus you need a license to drive.

Wrong. I can buy my neighbor's car and never register it, nothing illegal there. If I want to drive it, different story.

I never understood that argument. Like, how ignorant does one have to be to compare driving to gun ownership?

To libs it's just another thing to control and get state permission for.

 

[Coyote]

IMO, one of the atrocities of WWII is that we closed our doors to German Jews begging to flee Hitler. So they were exterminated; we could have helped. It's true they weren't American citizens, so apparently you don't care, but I DO. You see what is happening in Aleppo and Mosul. Picture living in it. You've maybe seen what living conditions are like in the refugee camps for families, sometimes for years. So yes, I am bitching that Trump is in favor of closing our doors because of "national security." It is EXACTLY the same excuse we used to keep out the Jews. Should there be a registry of Muslims "for security reasons?" That is what we did in order to collect the Japanese and send them to prison camps. We confiscated their property, their businesses, everything. AND THEY WERE BORN HERE.
I wish you were right, TN, but I don't know what makes you think "it won't happen here." Listen to the people around you. America's done it's share of shit hole stuff, and we are more than capable of doing it again.

Completely different circumstances. You are assuming a HUGE threat would have to happen for POTUS to get that kind of power. Have you ever heard of separation of powers?
We shouldn't register citizens, of course not.
One could never convince me that emotion is better suited to run a country, ESPECIALLY its safety of 320M people than actual safety and logical thought.

But that is exactly what is happening now isn't it?

For example, look at relative risk. The risk of being injured or killed in an Islamic terrorist incident is so low as to be riiculous. You are more likely to be hit by lightening, killed by a drunk driver, or shot in random violence. Yet instead of evaluating and reacting to real risk, we react to percieved risk and call on our politiicans to base their policies on that. That is exactly what Trump is doing.

It's a risk we have the ability to not let happen

You mean like we can reduce the risk of death by gun violence through enacting stricter gun laws? .... but I don't see you calling for that.

So you want to trash the COTUS?
Do you not hear yourself? You are talking about taking away rights and support taking away rights in the same thread

Actually. No. I'm not.

I'm pointing out a way of dealing with risks that would be deemed unacceptable by the person I'm responding to. A person who is ok with removing rights.

Now in reality - all rights have limits. Free speech, religion, arms - all have reasonable limits imposed on them. Is anyone calling for the internment of gun owners? How about complete gun confiscation? (maybe a fringe)

 

[Coyote]

Tariffs and personally interfering with business decisions of companies IS protectionism.

By interfering you mean offering tax relief like every state and city does? Tariffs are appropriate if they put tariffs on us, tit for tat. That's how the big boys play.

But we aren't talking about tit for tat.

Rightwing has traditionally been largely government hands off free trade.

It isn't free trade if they put tariffs on us and we don't on them. Your vocabulary doesn't match dictionary terms. A market can only be "free" if the teams are on the same playing field. And I haven't seen the left do anything but make it worse.

Trump is not talking about putting tariffs on goods in response to their tariffs.

Yes he is. He is also talking about US companies leaving, which amounts to the same thing.

No it isn't. They are still US companies.

 

[TNHarley]

Completely different circumstances. You are assuming a HUGE threat would have to happen for POTUS to get that kind of power. Have you ever heard of separation of powers?
We shouldn't register citizens, of course not.
One could never convince me that emotion is better suited to run a country, ESPECIALLY its safety of 320M people than actual safety and logical thought.

But that is exactly what is happening now isn't it?

For example, look at relative risk. The risk of being injured or killed in an Islamic terrorist incident is so low as to be riiculous. You are more likely to be hit by lightening, killed by a drunk driver, or shot in random violence. Yet instead of evaluating and reacting to real risk, we react to percieved risk and call on our politiicans to base their policies on that. That is exactly what Trump is doing.

It's a risk we have the ability to not let happen

You mean like we can reduce the risk of death by gun violence through enacting stricter gun laws? .... but I don't see you calling for that.

So you want to trash the COTUS?
Do you not hear yourself? You are talking about taking away rights and support taking away rights in the same thread

Actually. No. I'm not.

I'm pointing out a way of dealing with risks that would be deemed unacceptable by the person I'm responding to. A person who is ok with removing rights.

Now in reality - all rights have limits. Free speech, religion, arms - all have reasonable limits imposed on them. Is anyone calling for the internment of gun owners? How about complete gun confiscation? (maybe a fringe)

Lol whatever. You compared driving a car to guns a minute ago.

 

[BlackSand]

If ever a president wanted to change America to another system, FDR is probably the president that could have done it, and the Great Depression was the opportune time to do it.
When FDR died, we had won the war with fascism, and Truman became the president.

Well it isn't like I suggested FDR didn't try ... I mean he copied parts of Mussolini's plan.
Fascism just kind of has to walk hand in hand with an elite class that assumes everyone is stupid enough to fall for the eye candy ... Along with a public which pretty much meets that expectation.

.

 

[Coyote]

Some of you are using an economic model to poo poo the OP's concerns about the growing sentiment among some, including Trump supporters, of taking away SOME PEOPLE'S human rights. Economics -- such as socialism, communism -- has NOTHING to do with the nationalistic, populist movement of fascism. Of course Mussolini and Hitler had to take over their country's economies in order to build the huge war machines necessary to carry out their missions of domination. Saying we aren't heading down that road is silly. We are at least at the head of the path and discussing it. Many are helping in taking control of the media, as well, with their arguments that no media can be trusted.
Muslim Americans being registered? On some days, according to Trump, Muslims from terrorist-compromised countries being SUSPENDED from entering the US? We did put Japanese Americans in fucking prison camps, people--wake up! People who had not done one, single wrong thing. We stopped German Jews from entering this country at the same time, afraid they might be "spies." We know what happened to all of them.
It is those of you who think all the above is fine that worry me. Since you aren't Muslim or a refugee, you could care less. But it COULD be you and when you take the rights of one group of citizens, you open the door to taking the rights of others, including yours. Ask the ghosts of the millions of Germans and Italians killed by their leaders during the fascist years. They said No. They died.
We are flirting with it. Don't spout about communism or that it can't be because Hitler was a socialist. THAT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH IT. Focus on the concerns.

So you are bitching about taking the American rights of foreigners away from them? LMAO
Its pretty silly to compare halting immigration for national security to the atrocities of WW2.
Muslim registry will never happen. THIS IS AMERICA. They took over more than economies, they took over the government.
ATTENTION : It aint gonna happen. Not to mention we have hundreds of millions of gun owners. And luckily, we will continue to have gun owners.
You people really think hundreds of employees are gonna sign away their jobs and the future of the country because some guy said they anted him to? Give me a break.

IMO, one of the atrocities of WWII is that we closed our doors to German Jews begging to flee Hitler. So they were exterminated; we could have helped. It's true they weren't American citizens, so apparently you don't care, but I DO. You see what is happening in Aleppo and Mosul. Picture living in it. You've maybe seen what living conditions are like in the refugee camps for families, sometimes for years. So yes, I am bitching that Trump is in favor of closing our doors because of "national security." It is EXACTLY the same excuse we used to keep out the Jews. Should there be a registry of Muslims "for security reasons?" That is what we did in order to collect the Japanese and send them to prison camps. We confiscated their property, their businesses, everything. AND THEY WERE BORN HERE.
I wish you were right, TN, but I don't know what makes you think "it won't happen here." Listen to the people around you. America's done it's share of shit hole stuff, and we are more than capable of doing it again.

Completely different circumstances. You are assuming a HUGE threat would have to happen for POTUS to get that kind of power. Have you ever heard of separation of powers?
We shouldn't register citizens, of course not.
One could never convince me that emotion is better suited to run a country, ESPECIALLY its safety of 320M people than actual safety and logical thought.

But that is exactly what is happening now isn't it?

For example, look at relative risk. The risk of being injured or killed in an Islamic terrorist incident is so low as to be riiculous. You are more likely to be hit by lightening, killed by a drunk driver, or shot in random violence. Yet instead of evaluating and reacting to real risk, we react to percieved risk and call on our politiicans to base their policies on that. That is exactly what Trump is doing.

All it takes is one. Not to mention the whole point is so the number DOESNT go up.
Do you understand that there are millions of people that would LOVE to slit your throat? Blow up your local school?

You mean like the guy that shot up Sandy Hook?

 

[owebo]

So you are bitching about taking the American rights of foreigners away from them? LMAO
Its pretty silly to compare halting immigration for national security to the atrocities of WW2.
Muslim registry will never happen. THIS IS AMERICA. They took over more than economies, they took over the government.
ATTENTION : It aint gonna happen. Not to mention we have hundreds of millions of gun owners. And luckily, we will continue to have gun owners.
You people really think hundreds of employees are gonna sign away their jobs and the future of the country because some guy said they anted him to? Give me a break.

IMO, one of the atrocities of WWII is that we closed our doors to German Jews begging to flee Hitler. So they were exterminated; we could have helped. It's true they weren't American citizens, so apparently you don't care, but I DO. You see what is happening in Aleppo and Mosul. Picture living in it. You've maybe seen what living conditions are like in the refugee camps for families, sometimes for years. So yes, I am bitching that Trump is in favor of closing our doors because of "national security." It is EXACTLY the same excuse we used to keep out the Jews. Should there be a registry of Muslims "for security reasons?" That is what we did in order to collect the Japanese and send them to prison camps. We confiscated their property, their businesses, everything. AND THEY WERE BORN HERE.
I wish you were right, TN, but I don't know what makes you think "it won't happen here." Listen to the people around you. America's done it's share of shit hole stuff, and we are more than capable of doing it again.

Completely different circumstances. You are assuming a HUGE threat would have to happen for POTUS to get that kind of power. Have you ever heard of separation of powers?
We shouldn't register citizens, of course not.
One could never convince me that emotion is better suited to run a country, ESPECIALLY its safety of 320M people than actual safety and logical thought.

But that is exactly what is happening now isn't it?

For example, look at relative risk. The risk of being injured or killed in an Islamic terrorist incident is so low as to be riiculous. You are more likely to be hit by lightening, killed by a drunk driver, or shot in random violence. Yet instead of evaluating and reacting to real risk, we react to percieved risk and call on our politiicans to base their policies on that. That is exactly what Trump is doing.

It's a risk we have the ability to not let happen

You mean like we can reduce the risk of death by gun violence through enacting stricter gun laws? .... but I don't see you calling for that.

So, do you have a plan for criminals to obey these laws you desire?

 

[owebo]

So you are bitching about taking the American rights of foreigners away from them? LMAO
Its pretty silly to compare halting immigration for national security to the atrocities of WW2.
Muslim registry will never happen. THIS IS AMERICA. They took over more than economies, they took over the government.
ATTENTION : It aint gonna happen. Not to mention we have hundreds of millions of gun owners. And luckily, we will continue to have gun owners.
You people really think hundreds of employees are gonna sign away their jobs and the future of the country because some guy said they anted him to? Give me a break.

IMO, one of the atrocities of WWII is that we closed our doors to German Jews begging to flee Hitler. So they were exterminated; we could have helped. It's true they weren't American citizens, so apparently you don't care, but I DO. You see what is happening in Aleppo and Mosul. Picture living in it. You've maybe seen what living conditions are like in the refugee camps for families, sometimes for years. So yes, I am bitching that Trump is in favor of closing our doors because of "national security." It is EXACTLY the same excuse we used to keep out the Jews. Should there be a registry of Muslims "for security reasons?" That is what we did in order to collect the Japanese and send them to prison camps. We confiscated their property, their businesses, everything. AND THEY WERE BORN HERE.
I wish you were right, TN, but I don't know what makes you think "it won't happen here." Listen to the people around you. America's done it's share of shit hole stuff, and we are more than capable of doing it again.

Completely different circumstances. You are assuming a HUGE threat would have to happen for POTUS to get that kind of power. Have you ever heard of separation of powers?
We shouldn't register citizens, of course not.
One could never convince me that emotion is better suited to run a country, ESPECIALLY its safety of 320M people than actual safety and logical thought.

But that is exactly what is happening now isn't it?

For example, look at relative risk. The risk of being injured or killed in an Islamic terrorist incident is so low as to be riiculous. You are more likely to be hit by lightening, killed by a drunk driver, or shot in random violence. Yet instead of evaluating and reacting to real risk, we react to percieved risk and call on our politiicans to base their policies on that. That is exactly what Trump is doing.

All it takes is one. Not to mention the whole point is so the number DOESNT go up.
Do you understand that there are millions of people that would LOVE to slit your throat? Blow up your local school?

You mean like the guy that shot up Sandy Hook?

The criminal who stole a gun?

 

[TNHarley]

So you are bitching about taking the American rights of foreigners away from them? LMAO
Its pretty silly to compare halting immigration for national security to the atrocities of WW2.
Muslim registry will never happen. THIS IS AMERICA. They took over more than economies, they took over the government.
ATTENTION : It aint gonna happen. Not to mention we have hundreds of millions of gun owners. And luckily, we will continue to have gun owners.
You people really think hundreds of employees are gonna sign away their jobs and the future of the country because some guy said they anted him to? Give me a break.

IMO, one of the atrocities of WWII is that we closed our doors to German Jews begging to flee Hitler. So they were exterminated; we could have helped. It's true they weren't American citizens, so apparently you don't care, but I DO. You see what is happening in Aleppo and Mosul. Picture living in it. You've maybe seen what living conditions are like in the refugee camps for families, sometimes for years. So yes, I am bitching that Trump is in favor of closing our doors because of "national security." It is EXACTLY the same excuse we used to keep out the Jews. Should there be a registry of Muslims "for security reasons?" That is what we did in order to collect the Japanese and send them to prison camps. We confiscated their property, their businesses, everything. AND THEY WERE BORN HERE.
I wish you were right, TN, but I don't know what makes you think "it won't happen here." Listen to the people around you. America's done it's share of shit hole stuff, and we are more than capable of doing it again.

Completely different circumstances. You are assuming a HUGE threat would have to happen for POTUS to get that kind of power. Have you ever heard of separation of powers?
We shouldn't register citizens, of course not.
One could never convince me that emotion is better suited to run a country, ESPECIALLY its safety of 320M people than actual safety and logical thought.

But that is exactly what is happening now isn't it?

For example, look at relative risk. The risk of being injured or killed in an Islamic terrorist incident is so low as to be riiculous. You are more likely to be hit by lightening, killed by a drunk driver, or shot in random violence. Yet instead of evaluating and reacting to real risk, we react to percieved risk and call on our politiicans to base their policies on that. That is exactly what Trump is doing.

All it takes is one. Not to mention the whole point is so the number DOESNT go up.
Do you understand that there are millions of people that would LOVE to slit your throat? Blow up your local school?

You mean like the guy that shot up Sandy Hook?

Yes, it is completely logical to bring up a crazy person in this. Thanks.

 

[OldLady]

Some of you are using an economic model to poo poo the OP's concerns about the growing sentiment among some, including Trump supporters, of taking away SOME PEOPLE'S human rights. Economics -- such as socialism, communism -- has NOTHING to do with the nationalistic, populist movement of fascism. Of course Mussolini and Hitler had to take over their country's economies in order to build the huge war machines necessary to carry out their missions of domination. Saying we aren't heading down that road is silly. We are at least at the head of the path and discussing it. Many are helping in taking control of the media, as well, with their arguments that no media can be trusted.
Muslim Americans being registered? On some days, according to Trump, Muslims from terrorist-compromised countries being SUSPENDED from entering the US? We did put Japanese Americans in fucking prison camps, people--wake up! People who had not done one, single wrong thing. We stopped German Jews from entering this country at the same time, afraid they might be "spies." We know what happened to all of them.
It is those of you who think all the above is fine that worry me. Since you aren't Muslim or a refugee, you could care less. But it COULD be you and when you take the rights of one group of citizens, you open the door to taking the rights of others, including yours. Ask the ghosts of the millions of Germans and Italians killed by their leaders during the fascist years. They said No. They died.
We are flirting with it. Don't spout about communism or that it can't be because Hitler was a socialist. THAT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH IT. Focus on the concerns.

So you are bitching about taking the American rights of foreigners away from them? LMAO
Its pretty silly to compare halting immigration for national security to the atrocities of WW2.
Muslim registry will never happen. THIS IS AMERICA. They took over more than economies, they took over the government.
ATTENTION : It aint gonna happen. Not to mention we have hundreds of millions of gun owners. And luckily, we will continue to have gun owners.
You people really think hundreds of employees are gonna sign away their jobs and the future of the country because some guy said they anted him to? Give me a break.

IMO, one of the atrocities of WWII is that we closed our doors to German Jews begging to flee Hitler. So they were exterminated; we could have helped. It's true they weren't American citizens, so apparently you don't care, but I DO. You see what is happening in Aleppo and Mosul. Picture living in it. You've maybe seen what living conditions are like in the refugee camps for families, sometimes for years. So yes, I am bitching that Trump is in favor of closing our doors because of "national security." It is EXACTLY the same excuse we used to keep out the Jews. Should there be a registry of Muslims "for security reasons?" That is what we did in order to collect the Japanese and send them to prison camps. We confiscated their property, their businesses, everything. AND THEY WERE BORN HERE.
I wish you were right, TN, but I don't know what makes you think "it won't happen here." Listen to the people around you. America's done it's share of shit hole stuff, and we are more than capable of doing it again.

Completely different circumstances. You are assuming a HUGE threat would have to happen for POTUS to get that kind of power. Have you ever heard of separation of powers?
We shouldn't register citizens, of course not.
One could never convince me that emotion is better suited to run a country, ESPECIALLY its safety of 320M people than actual safety and logical thought.

It's not "emotion," TN, it is one of our core values and traditions, to welcome people to our free country from other lands. The circumstances are not different at all. America is threatened, has been at war for fifteen solid years against radical Islam/ISIS. We are doing exactly what we did before. Or we will, if we don't put on the brakes. Do you think Trump's administration and a Republican dominated Congress, Senate and soon to be majority conservative Supreme Court will not have its way in these matters? Really?

 

[Coyote]

IMO, one of the atrocities of WWII is that we closed our doors to German Jews begging to flee Hitler. So they were exterminated; we could have helped. It's true they weren't American citizens, so apparently you don't care, but I DO. You see what is happening in Aleppo and Mosul. Picture living in it. You've maybe seen what living conditions are like in the refugee camps for families, sometimes for years. So yes, I am bitching that Trump is in favor of closing our doors because of "national security." It is EXACTLY the same excuse we used to keep out the Jews. Should there be a registry of Muslims "for security reasons?" That is what we did in order to collect the Japanese and send them to prison camps. We confiscated their property, their businesses, everything. AND THEY WERE BORN HERE.
I wish you were right, TN, but I don't know what makes you think "it won't happen here." Listen to the people around you. America's done it's share of shit hole stuff, and we are more than capable of doing it again.

Completely different circumstances. You are assuming a HUGE threat would have to happen for POTUS to get that kind of power. Have you ever heard of separation of powers?
We shouldn't register citizens, of course not.
One could never convince me that emotion is better suited to run a country, ESPECIALLY its safety of 320M people than actual safety and logical thought.

But that is exactly what is happening now isn't it?

For example, look at relative risk. The risk of being injured or killed in an Islamic terrorist incident is so low as to be riiculous. You are more likely to be hit by lightening, killed by a drunk driver, or shot in random violence. Yet instead of evaluating and reacting to real risk, we react to percieved risk and call on our politiicans to base their policies on that. That is exactly what Trump is doing.

It's a risk we have the ability to not let happen

You mean like we can reduce the risk of death by gun violence through enacting stricter gun laws? .... but I don't see you calling for that.

So, do you have a plan for criminals to obey these laws you desire?

I'm not calling for any laws. I'm pointing out the hypocrisy in your statements. You're perfectly happy to remove someone ELSE'S rights, as long as no one touches YOURS.

 

[Coyote]

IMO, one of the atrocities of WWII is that we closed our doors to German Jews begging to flee Hitler. So they were exterminated; we could have helped. It's true they weren't American citizens, so apparently you don't care, but I DO. You see what is happening in Aleppo and Mosul. Picture living in it. You've maybe seen what living conditions are like in the refugee camps for families, sometimes for years. So yes, I am bitching that Trump is in favor of closing our doors because of "national security." It is EXACTLY the same excuse we used to keep out the Jews. Should there be a registry of Muslims "for security reasons?" That is what we did in order to collect the Japanese and send them to prison camps. We confiscated their property, their businesses, everything. AND THEY WERE BORN HERE.
I wish you were right, TN, but I don't know what makes you think "it won't happen here." Listen to the people around you. America's done it's share of shit hole stuff, and we are more than capable of doing it again.

Completely different circumstances. You are assuming a HUGE threat would have to happen for POTUS to get that kind of power. Have you ever heard of separation of powers?
We shouldn't register citizens, of course not.
One could never convince me that emotion is better suited to run a country, ESPECIALLY its safety of 320M people than actual safety and logical thought.

But that is exactly what is happening now isn't it?

For example, look at relative risk. The risk of being injured or killed in an Islamic terrorist incident is so low as to be riiculous. You are more likely to be hit by lightening, killed by a drunk driver, or shot in random violence. Yet instead of evaluating and reacting to real risk, we react to percieved risk and call on our politiicans to base their policies on that. That is exactly what Trump is doing.

All it takes is one. Not to mention the whole point is so the number DOESNT go up.
Do you understand that there are millions of people that would LOVE to slit your throat? Blow up your local school?

You mean like the guy that shot up Sandy Hook?

Yes, it is completely logical to bring up a crazy person in this. Thanks.

There's a lot of crazy terrorists too.

 

[TNHarley]

Some of you are using an economic model to poo poo the OP's concerns about the growing sentiment among some, including Trump supporters, of taking away SOME PEOPLE'S human rights. Economics -- such as socialism, communism -- has NOTHING to do with the nationalistic, populist movement of fascism. Of course Mussolini and Hitler had to take over their country's economies in order to build the huge war machines necessary to carry out their missions of domination. Saying we aren't heading down that road is silly. We are at least at the head of the path and discussing it. Many are helping in taking control of the media, as well, with their arguments that no media can be trusted.
Muslim Americans being registered? On some days, according to Trump, Muslims from terrorist-compromised countries being SUSPENDED from entering the US? We did put Japanese Americans in fucking prison camps, people--wake up! People who had not done one, single wrong thing. We stopped German Jews from entering this country at the same time, afraid they might be "spies." We know what happened to all of them.
It is those of you who think all the above is fine that worry me. Since you aren't Muslim or a refugee, you could care less. But it COULD be you and when you take the rights of one group of citizens, you open the door to taking the rights of others, including yours. Ask the ghosts of the millions of Germans and Italians killed by their leaders during the fascist years. They said No. They died.
We are flirting with it. Don't spout about communism or that it can't be because Hitler was a socialist. THAT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH IT. Focus on the concerns.

So you are bitching about taking the American rights of foreigners away from them? LMAO
Its pretty silly to compare halting immigration for national security to the atrocities of WW2.
Muslim registry will never happen. THIS IS AMERICA. They took over more than economies, they took over the government.
ATTENTION : It aint gonna happen. Not to mention we have hundreds of millions of gun owners. And luckily, we will continue to have gun owners.
You people really think hundreds of employees are gonna sign away their jobs and the future of the country because some guy said they anted him to? Give me a break.

IMO, one of the atrocities of WWII is that we closed our doors to German Jews begging to flee Hitler. So they were exterminated; we could have helped. It's true they weren't American citizens, so apparently you don't care, but I DO. You see what is happening in Aleppo and Mosul. Picture living in it. You've maybe seen what living conditions are like in the refugee camps for families, sometimes for years. So yes, I am bitching that Trump is in favor of closing our doors because of "national security." It is EXACTLY the same excuse we used to keep out the Jews. Should there be a registry of Muslims "for security reasons?" That is what we did in order to collect the Japanese and send them to prison camps. We confiscated their property, their businesses, everything. AND THEY WERE BORN HERE.
I wish you were right, TN, but I don't know what makes you think "it won't happen here." Listen to the people around you. America's done it's share of shit hole stuff, and we are more than capable of doing it again.

Completely different circumstances. You are assuming a HUGE threat would have to happen for POTUS to get that kind of power. Have you ever heard of separation of powers?
We shouldn't register citizens, of course not.
One could never convince me that emotion is better suited to run a country, ESPECIALLY its safety of 320M people than actual safety and logical thought.

It's not "emotion," TN, it is one of our core values and traditions, to welcome people to our free country from other lands. The circumstances are not different at all. America is threatened, has been at war for fifteen solid years against radical Islam/ISIS. We are doing exactly what we did before. Or we will, if we don't put on the brakes. Do you think Trump's administration and a Republican dominated Congress, Senate and soon to be majority conservative Supreme Court will not have its way in these matters? Really?

We cant declare war on a terror group.
Shit happens during war. It is absolutely emotion. Because ANY logical thought would include them abusing Good.

 

[ZZ PUPPS]

Completely different circumstances. You are assuming a HUGE threat would have to happen for POTUS to get that kind of power. Have you ever heard of separation of powers?
We shouldn't register citizens, of course not.
One could never convince me that emotion is better suited to run a country, ESPECIALLY its safety of 320M people than actual safety and logical thought.

But that is exactly what is happening now isn't it?

For example, look at relative risk. The risk of being injured or killed in an Islamic terrorist incident is so low as to be riiculous. You are more likely to be hit by lightening, killed by a drunk driver, or shot in random violence. Yet instead of evaluating and reacting to real risk, we react to percieved risk and call on our politiicans to base their policies on that. That is exactly what Trump is doing.

It's a risk we have the ability to not let happen

You mean like we can reduce the risk of death by gun violence through enacting stricter gun laws? .... but I don't see you calling for that.

So, do you have a plan for criminals to obey these laws you desire?

I'm not calling for any laws. I'm pointing out the hypocrisy in your statements. You're perfectly happy to remove someone ELSE'S rights, as long as no one touches YOURS.

Did you just call him a democrat?

 

[Iceweasel]

Some of you are using an economic model to poo poo the OP's concerns about the growing sentiment among some, including Trump supporters, of taking away SOME PEOPLE'S human rights. Economics -- such as socialism, communism -- has NOTHING to do with the nationalistic, populist movement of fascism. Of course Mussolini and Hitler had to take over their country's economies in order to build the huge war machines necessary to carry out their missions of domination. Saying we aren't heading down that road is silly. We are at least at the head of the path and discussing it. Many are helping in taking control of the media, as well, with their arguments that no media can be trusted.
Muslim Americans being registered? On some days, according to Trump, Muslims from terrorist-compromised countries being SUSPENDED from entering the US? We did put Japanese Americans in fucking prison camps, people--wake up! People who had not done one, single wrong thing. We stopped German Jews from entering this country at the same time, afraid they might be "spies." We know what happened to all of them.
It is those of you who think all the above is fine that worry me. Since you aren't Muslim or a refugee, you could care less. But it COULD be you and when you take the rights of one group of citizens, you open the door to taking the rights of others, including yours. Ask the ghosts of the millions of Germans and Italians killed by their leaders during the fascist years. They said No. They died.
We are flirting with it. Don't spout about communism or that it can't be because Hitler was a socialist. THAT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH IT. Focus on the concerns.

So you are bitching about taking the American rights of foreigners away from them? LMAO
Its pretty silly to compare halting immigration for national security to the atrocities of WW2.
Muslim registry will never happen. THIS IS AMERICA. They took over more than economies, they took over the government.
ATTENTION : It aint gonna happen. Not to mention we have hundreds of millions of gun owners. And luckily, we will continue to have gun owners.
You people really think hundreds of employees are gonna sign away their jobs and the future of the country because some guy said they anted him to? Give me a break.

IMO, one of the atrocities of WWII is that we closed our doors to German Jews begging to flee Hitler. So they were exterminated; we could have helped. It's true they weren't American citizens, so apparently you don't care, but I DO. You see what is happening in Aleppo and Mosul. Picture living in it. You've maybe seen what living conditions are like in the refugee camps for families, sometimes for years. So yes, I am bitching that Trump is in favor of closing our doors because of "national security." It is EXACTLY the same excuse we used to keep out the Jews. Should there be a registry of Muslims "for security reasons?" That is what we did in order to collect the Japanese and send them to prison camps. We confiscated their property, their businesses, everything. AND THEY WERE BORN HERE.
I wish you were right, TN, but I don't know what makes you think "it won't happen here." Listen to the people around you. America's done it's share of shit hole stuff, and we are more than capable of doing it again.

Completely different circumstances. You are assuming a HUGE threat would have to happen for POTUS to get that kind of power. Have you ever heard of separation of powers?
We shouldn't register citizens, of course not.
One could never convince me that emotion is better suited to run a country, ESPECIALLY its safety of 320M people than actual safety and logical thought.

But that is exactly what is happening now isn't it?

For example, look at relative risk. The risk of being injured or killed in an Islamic terrorist incident is so low as to be riiculous. You are more likely to be hit by lightening, killed by a drunk driver, or shot in random violence. Yet instead of evaluating and reacting to real risk, we react to percieved risk and call on our politiicans to base their policies on that. That is exactly what Trump is doing.

Tell that to the europeans. Trump lives in reality and is well aware of terrorism here. Downplaying 9/11, Boston Marathon, Florida hightclub, Ft. Hood, San Bernadino and God knows what they managed to stop ...is just bizarre!

 

[owebo]

But that is exactly what is happening now isn't it?

For example, look at relative risk. The risk of being injured or killed in an Islamic terrorist incident is so low as to be riiculous. You are more likely to be hit by lightening, killed by a drunk driver, or shot in random violence. Yet instead of evaluating and reacting to real risk, we react to percieved risk and call on our politiicans to base their policies on that. That is exactly what Trump is doing.

It's a risk we have the ability to not let happen

You mean like we can reduce the risk of death by gun violence through enacting stricter gun laws? .... but I don't see you calling for that.

So, do you have a plan for criminals to obey these laws you desire?

I'm not calling for any laws. I'm pointing out the hypocrisy in your statements. You're perfectly happy to remove someone ELSE'S rights, as long as no one touches YOURS.

Did you just call him a democrat?

He's such a cute snowflake....

 

[ZZ PUPPS]

Eventually something big will happen here, probably a dirty suitcase bomb or a plane flown into a nuclear power plant. What will you liberals say then? Can you say you did all you could to prevent it?

 

[Uncensored2008]

[


You mean like the guy that shot up Sandy Hook?

With an illegal gun that he stole?

Standard Disclaimer: Obviously you're mad and not talking to me at present.

 

[ptbw forever]

Some of you are using an economic model to poo poo the OP's concerns about the growing sentiment among some, including Trump supporters, of taking away SOME PEOPLE'S human rights. Economics -- such as socialism, communism -- has NOTHING to do with the nationalistic, populist movement of fascism. Of course Mussolini and Hitler had to take over their country's economies in order to build the huge war machines necessary to carry out their missions of domination. Saying we aren't heading down that road is silly. We are at least at the head of the path and discussing it. Many are helping in taking control of the media, as well, with their arguments that no media can be trusted.
Muslim Americans being registered? On some days, according to Trump, Muslims from terrorist-compromised countries being SUSPENDED from entering the US? We did put Japanese Americans in fucking prison camps, people--wake up! People who had not done one, single wrong thing. We stopped German Jews from entering this country at the same time, afraid they might be "spies." We know what happened to all of them.
It is those of you who think all the above is fine that worry me. Since you aren't Muslim or a refugee, you could care less. But it COULD be you and when you take the rights of one group of citizens, you open the door to taking the rights of others, including yours. Ask the ghosts of the millions of Germans and Italians killed by their leaders during the fascist years. They said No. They died.
We are flirting with it. Don't spout about communism or that it can't be because Hitler was a socialist. THAT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH IT. Focus on the concerns.

According to that logic the Democrats are 100% fascist and have been for decades.

Christians are treated horribly in this country by the popular culture(Democrats) compared to Muslims , and so have white people who have a sense of worth.

Trump could be an openly anti-Arab bigot who advocates for extreme repression of Muslims beyond anything we ever believed was possible and he still wouldn't hold a candle to what has been done by the media and the education system to Christians and traditional white Americans.