The Truth about Mormons

Mormon Word Association

  • Friendly

    Votes: 74 29.7%
  • Bigoted

    Votes: 25 10.0%
  • Crazy

    Votes: 105 42.2%
  • Christian

    Votes: 45 18.1%

  • Total voters
    249
Okay ... I think I may as well post a fact here as I am bored and about to go to bed. Here is the reason the Joseph Smith 'translating' the book is bull, a cute myth that lead to a once decent christian cult, but still myth.

The English they spoke at the time did NOT sound remotely like that, even in England itself. It had already evolved into something of what we speak today, though without many of the technical terms. If he HAD translated it, the language would have come out more like today than like the original translation of the christian bible from Greek to Old English. But the fact that it was translated to Old English (and poorly) shows that it was not translated but most likely invented. There are other minor facts that aid in this but this is just a boredom post and I don't want to get into it all.

Good, you won't need to go into it. Just listen to this excerpt from Oliver Cowdery. You will see that it is exactly the same type of language used in the Book of Mormon. It is not in the Book of Mormon. It is also not true Old English like you say, but more of a hybrid of old and modern english, like the book of mormon language. It was translated into the most common understanding of the day. see below.
"These are days never to be forgotten—to sit under the sound of a voice dictated by the inspiration of heaven, awakened the utmost gratitude of this bosom! Day after day I continued, uninterrupted, to write from his (Joseph Smith's) mouth, as he translated with the Urim and Thummim, or, as the Nephites would have said, "Interpreters," the history or record called "The Book of Mormon."

To notice, in even few words, the interesting account given by Mormon and his faithful son Moroni, of a people once beloved and favored of heaven, would supersede my present design; I shall therefore defer this to a future period, and, as I said in the introduction, pass more directly to some few incidents immediately connected with the rise of this Church, which may be entertaining to some thousands who have stepped forward amid the frowns of bigots and the calumny of hypocrites, and embraced the Gospel of Christ.

No men, in their sober senses, could translate and write the directions given to the Nephites from the mouth of the Savior, of the precise manner in which men should build up His Church, and especially when corruption had spread an uncertainty over all forms and systems practiced among men, without desiring a privilege of showing the willingness of the heart by being buried in the liquid grave, to answer a "good conscience by the resurrection of Jesus Christ."

After writing the account given of the Savior's ministry to the remnant of the seed of Jacob, upon this continent, it was easy to be seen, as the prophet said would be, that darkness covered the earth and gross darkness the minds of the people. On reflecting further it was easy to be seen, that amid the great strife and noise concerning religion, none had authority from God to administer the ordinances of the Gospel. For the question might be asked, have men authority to administer in the name of Christ, who deny revelations, when His testimony is no less than the spirit of prophecy, and His religion based, built, and sustained by immediate revelations in all ages of the world when He has had a people on earth? If these facts were buried, and carefully concealed by men whose craft would have been in danger if once permitted to shine in the faces of men, they were no longer to us; and we only waited for the commandment to be given, "Arise and be baptized."

This was not long desired before it was realized. The Lord, who is rich in mercy, and ever willing to answer the consistent prayer of the humble, after we had called upon Him in a fervent manner, aside from the abodes of men, condescended to manifest to us His will. On a sudden, as from the midst of eternity, the voice of the Redeemer spake peace to us, while the veil was parted, and the angel of God came down clothed with glory, and delivered the anxiously looked-for message, and the keys of the Gospel of repentance. What joy! what wonder! what amazement! While the world was racked and distracted—while millions were groping as the blind for the wall, and while all men were resting upon uncertainty, as a general mass, our eyes beheld, our ears heard, as in the "blaze of day;" yes, more—above the glitter of the May sunbeam, which then shed its brilliancy over the face of nature! Then his voice, though mild, pierced to the center, and his words, "I am thy fellow-servant," dispelled every fear. We listened, we gazed, we admired! 'Twas the voice of an angel from glory, 'twas a message from the Most High! And as we heard we rejoiced, while His love enkindled upon our souls, and we were wrapped in the vision of the Almighty! Where was room for doubt? Nowhere; uncertainty had fled, doubt had sunk no more to rise, while fiction and deception had fled forever!

But, dear brother, think, further think for a moment, what joy filled our hearts, and with what surprise we must have bowed (for who would not have bowed the knee for such a blessing?) when we received under his hand the Holy Priesthood as he said:

"Upon you my fellow servants, in the name of Messiah, I confer the Priesthood of Aaron, which holds the keys of the ministering of angels, and of the Gospel of repentance, and of baptism by immersion for the remission of sins; and this shall never be taken again from the earth, until the sons of Levi do offer again an offering unto the Lord in righteousness."

I shall not attempt to paint to you the feelings of this heart, nor the majestic beauty and glory which surrounded us on this occasion; but you will believe me when I say, that earth, nor men, with the eloquence of time, cannot begin to clothe language in as interesting and sublime a manner as this holy personage. No; nor has this earth power to give the joy, to bestow the peace, or comprehend the wisdom which was contained in each sentence as they were delivered by the power of the Holy Spirit! Man may deceive his fellow-men, deception may follow deception, and the children of the wicked one may have power to seduce the foolish and untaught, till naught but fiction feeds the many, and the fruit of falsehood carries in its current the giddy to the grave; but one touch with the finger of his love, yes, one ray of glory from the upper world, or one word from the mouth of the Savior, from the bosom of eternity, strikes it all into insignificance, and blots it forever from the mind. The assurance that we were in the presence of an angel, the certainty that we heard the voice of Jesus, and the truth unsullied, as it flowed from a pure personage, dictated by the will of God, is to me past description, and I shall ever look upon this expression of the Savior's goodness with wonder and thanksgiving while I am permitted to tarry; and in those mansions where perfection dwells and sin never comes, I hope to adore in that day which shall never cease."
 
You poor, poor, brainwashed young man. Evidence demands a verdict, and so much has been presented to you, but you still want to cling to your church founder's, and prophet's "thus sayeth's".

People on this forum have given you valid questions, and also presented valid evidences, but you refuse to consider any of it. You are here for one reason only, and you are attempting web style missions on this board. That's allowed.

Secondly, your online name "Truthspeaker", leaves no room for discussion. The name also exudes big letter "P"/"Pride". Obviously you "think" you have the truth, and have discarded thousands of years of Christian historical evidence, and totally smacked God's attribute of omnipotence squarely in His face with the "corrupted bible" doctrine. As the "humble" Paul said, if we don't believe in the Gospel, we are to be most pitied, as we have gone on and on, for naught.

Secondly, in the realm of works. Works is a bi-product of salvation, and that is exactly what James meant. He was not talking to non-Christians/Mormons/JW's, but Christians when he said that if you have true faith, it will reveal "works" as a result of true salvation. There are many works in the world done by a myriad of religious followers, and even secular/agnostic/atheistic folks, but they aren't the "Jame's" "works".

James knew, as all the apostles and disciples knew, that the H.Spirit, came and regenerated the dead or fallen spirit of humans, upon their willful belief by faith in Christ as the only Lord and Saviour of their lives. The H. Spirit was the seal or evidence sent/given from God, that one was "saved". Afterwards that "saved" individual should start to produce, "fruit" or "works" in accordance with the fruit of the Spirit of God. Love(King James-Charity), patience, long suffering, Joy, peace, mercy, etc....

Sure, a Mormon can think him or herself into thinking they have the "truth" if they want to live a life with their collective heads buried in the ostrich holes of the LDS church's edicts of exclusivity, and protectors of the "real uncorrupted truth".

Sadly, Mormons want true Christians and non-Christians whom them attempt to evangelize to be "open minded" and thus consider their side or "truth".

Is it a true(open mindedness) for the Mormon, such as "Truth Speaker"? Absolutely not! He or she is told to ignore any and all attempts by non-LDS to persuade them with any and all possible statements, as they are misleading, and will only cause confusion, and possibly upset their "Testimony" and conviction to the LDS faith/church.

"Confusion" in a person that is in bondage to a cult, is the beginning of "FREEDOM"! What it means is that their constructed paradym of belief is actually crumbling, not because of untruths, but because in their conscience, and sub-conscience, their foundations of belief are being eroded and that's uncomfortable, and scarey. What do they do under these circumstances........Three possiblities: Flee = Get off the forum and make oneself "gone" and run to the protection of the church/cult.
Fight back = They will continue to ignore or refute any and all offerings of alternative possiblities as attacks against them personally, and basically, adhere to a form of denial and prideful superiority. Best Scenario = They will start to question both their elders, and will do independent study starting with a simple, honest prayer, "Lord Jesus, I'm not sure what to believe right now. I've been in the church so long, my brothers, sisters, parents, and generations have been members. I've heard things from non-LDS that make me wonder, but also make me feel very insecure, and fearful. I'm worried about how my relatives and friends will treat me if I were to consider an alternative belief to LDS. I've seen what happens to LDS members who have left the fold, and it isn't pretty, what the church and it's members do to them. Lord Jesus, I'm scared to do independent study, without the bias, or pre-conditions of my elders/church, but just my own inquirey. Please give me the strength to do this, and protect me from the wiles and deceptions of the enemy of my soul, and his fallen angels. In Jesus Name I pray, Amen(So Be It!) :)

If the true God is the LDS God, then your independent, and I mean independent study and prayerful, and honest wonderings will be for naught. If on the other hand the God of Mormonism is not the true God, you will have one big surprise in your life, and it will be the most freeing surprise you'll ever experience in your soul and most deep inner man! When the Holy Spirit of God comes to reside, He will make all things known and will show you the difference between actual truth and actual falsehood.

One important condition though. You come to the biblical God in prayer, not as a "Truthspeaker", but as a sinner, in need of salvation, or new life/eternal in and through the crucified, buried, and ressurrected Christ, and on Son of the only God and Father/Creator of all things. That a big heapful, but if you trully have the courage, you will receive the Spirit of God, as your Counselor, who will open up God's scripture and discern for you the will of God for your life, and also bestow upon you the many "fruits" of the Spirit to both serve and abide in His wonderful life eternally.

If you take the faithful plunge, I guarantee you, "Truthspeaker" that you'll change your moniker to
"Humblespeaker" from thence onward in your life.
 
Yet another person who didn't read my post about the difference between the two martyrdoms. You don't have to die without resistance to be a martyr. I already said no ones martyrdom was equal to Christs. I am proud of the fact that Joseph took a few of his brother's murderers with him. I don't think anyone really thinks there is anything wrong with that.


I read your post but I found this interesting

Joseph Smith "I am going like a lamb to the slaughter"... (Doctrine and Covenants, 135:4).

I guess he meant to say - I am going like a lamb to the slaughter with a gun and kill some people before I am killed.

Sounds like a true prophet of god doesn’t it?
 
There are a myriad of authors in the N.T. that were eye witnesses to Jesus' life, and witnessed His transfiguration, and distinctly heard God tell them that "This is My Son....."

John in his first verses of his book called "John" says distinctly that the Word became flesh, and that He was Jesus, and the Word was God. Just read the 1st chapter of John. John spent 3 years with Jesus, and witnessed his ressurrected life, and also his death and burial too.

Luke records in Acts, that several hundred people witnessed Jesus and also witnessed His ascension.

Does the bible have to be written last week to be valid?

Omnipotence, my friend. We have a God who has full control over his message line to mankind. He didn't need J.S. Jr. to amend alleged corrupted translations. If that was the case, then our Creator is most weak, and ill prepared to care for us at all. ;)

What you have is a group of people supposedly claiming this. There isn't even evidence that John and Luke even existed. Hell, even if they did exist, you can bet your bottom dollar their names were not John or Luke. If the people who wrote the bible can't even get that part right, what else is wrong with the good book..:cool:
 
There are so many "holes" in your belief system, but you just pridefully smirk and really don't see yourselves as persecuted, but as holders of the "truth" handed down from a man who totally failed the tests of a true prophet of God.

Didn't your 'saviour' say those without sin cast the first stone? you have the audacity to questions ones beliefs when your own have more holes in them than a block of Swiss cheese. Like a typcial Christian zealot, yours is the truth, while everybody else's beliefs are false...can you say hypocrite...

Some day, you'll have to really ponder what you've been promoting, and how real and validated what you espouse trully is.

Ditto you....


Mormons need to repent of their sins just like any other human being, and totally fall on the mercy and grace of the Lord Jesus Christ. The Christ who is of the Triune Godhead, not the Christ that once was a mere man like yourself, and became a god or saviour.

Stop prothelysing windbag. I have more chance of going to heaven if a god truly existed. You're the type of person Jesus was preaching against - a sanctimoneous Know it All who proports to be the seer of truth. You would have disgusted Jesus....
 
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What you have is a group of people supposedly claiming this. There isn't even evidence that John and Luke even existed. Hell, even if they did exist, you can bet your bottom dollar their names were not John or Luke. If the people who wrote the bible can't even get that part right, what else is wrong with the good book..:cool:

While I grant that the original versions of the text could possibly be right in many of their legends and myths, each time it is copied by human hands (we just don't have the originals anyway) it gets changed. Since each book was written in a different region and most in different languages even if the original texts existed somewhere you would have to master many languages (almost all of them) from those time periods to read it. This is the reason their names are written that way, just translations. Even today we see prejudisms in names given, so they would be changed to something that "doesn't offend or offer any truth".
 
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Well Grump, maybe I am a religious zealot. Because I have zeal and passion for my religion. At least I don't condemn others to hell. If I weren't religious I would certainly think as you do and be disgusted with 8 ball's refusal to deal with my posts by launching new attacks without substance or backups.
I can make sense till I am blue in the face, but 8 ball has been behind the 8 ball ever since I showed him he was wrong in everyone of his feeble little attacks. he just switches to something new and get shut down and refuses to accept his losses without backing up his dogma.
His comebacks are "Your brainwashed." and "when you do independant study, you will understand."

You may not agree with what I write, but no one can say that I haven't done my own independant study. I think it is quite clear that I have formed who I am through personal prayer and study.

I didn't start this thread to prove my religion better than someone elses. I only wanted to clarify the truth about what we believe and hopefully stem the tide of misunderstanding and prejudice against us. But alas, some have taken this forum as an opportunity to attack me rather than question me. Those who attack me are inviting themselves to be exposed as nothing more than angry anti-mormons without substance and full of prejudice.

Please can anyone bring up just 1 instance where I have not satisfactorily answered their questions? Some have said that I refuse to acknowledge their points and am blindly following my leaders like a robot? At the risk of repeating myself for the HUNDREDTH time: SHOW ME WHERE I DIDN'T DISPUTE ANY AND ALL ATTACKS LEVIED AGAINST MY CHURCH.
show me where I didn't respond to a question. I have done my due diligence. It is irresponsible to ignore my answers because you don't like them. You are free to disagree but at least you will know exactly where you disagree with us.
 
Well Grump, maybe I am a religious zealot. Because I have zeal and passion for my religion. At least I don't condemn others to hell. If I weren't religious I would certainly think as you do and be disgusted with 8 ball's refusal to deal with my posts by launching new attacks without substance or backups.
I can make sense till I am blue in the face, but 8 ball has been behind the 8 ball ever since I showed him he was wrong in everyone of his feeble little attacks. he just switches to something new and get shut down and refuses to accept his losses without backing up his dogma.
His comebacks are "Your brainwashed." and "when you do independant study, you will understand."

You may not agree with what I write, but no one can say that I haven't done my own independant study. I think it is quite clear that I have formed who I am through personal prayer and study.

I didn't start this thread to prove my religion better than someone elses. I only wanted to clarify the truth about what we believe and hopefully stem the tide of misunderstanding and prejudice against us. But alas, some have taken this forum as an opportunity to attack me rather than question me. Those who attack me are inviting themselves to be exposed as nothing more than angry anti-mormons without substance and full of prejudice.

Please can anyone bring up just 1 instance where I have not satisfactorily answered their questions? Some have said that I refuse to acknowledge their points and am blindly following my leaders like a robot? At the risk of repeating myself for the HUNDREDTH time: SHOW ME WHERE I DIDN'T DISPUTE ANY AND ALL ATTACKS LEVIED AGAINST MY CHURCH.
show me where I didn't respond to a question. I have done my due diligence. It is irresponsible to ignore my answers because you don't like them. You are free to disagree but at least you will know exactly where you disagree with us.
 
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I read your post but I found this interesting

Joseph Smith "I am going like a lamb to the slaughter"... (Doctrine and Covenants, 135:4).

I guess he meant to say - I am going like a lamb to the slaughter with a gun and kill some people before I am killed.

Sounds like a true prophet of god doesn’t it?

Jeez, another person who doesn't read my previous posts. For the 12th time it seems,
You don't have to be a passive resistor to be a martyr. The phrase lamb to the slaughter doesn't have to be completely literal. Lamb to the slaughter is meant more to say that he had no chance to survive, which he didn't. three bullets wouldn't be enough to stop 180 men if they all got in a conga-line and let Joseph try to shoot through all of them.
he also didn't have wool for his skin, or hoofs and didn't go "baaa".

go back a few pages and read Joseph's prophecy on the civil war and you tell me it doesn't sound like a prophet. Oh yeah, since I posted that prophecy, oddly enough no one has peeped a word about it, because they can't find a single thing to say to discredit it. Hmmmm. counfounded again? Sounds like a prophet to me!
 
go back a few pages and read Joseph's prophecy on the civil war and you tell me it doesn't sound like a prophet. Oh yeah, since I posted that prophecy, oddly enough no one has peeped a word about it, because they can't find a single thing to say to discredit it. Hmmmm. counfounded again? Sounds like a prophet to me!


Here is something about the civil war -

Changing World Chapter 14

Conclusion
The prophecy concerning the Mormons being driven to the Rocky Mountains and the one concerning the Civil War are considered Joseph Smith's most important prophecies. These are used to try to prove that he was a prophet of God. In the chapter dealing with changes in Joseph's history we demonstrate that the prophecy concerning the Rocky Mountains is a forgery which was written after Joseph Smith's death. In this chapter we have shown that the prophecy about the Civil War came because of the rebellion of South Carolina in 1832, and that it contains inaccuracies which tend to invalidate it. In addition to this, the Mormon leaders have suppressed part of Joseph Smith's diary which tended to discredit the revelation.
 
Here is something about the civil war -

Changing World Chapter 14

Conclusion
The prophecy concerning the Mormons being driven to the Rocky Mountains and the one concerning the Civil War are considered Joseph Smith's most important prophecies. These are used to try to prove that he was a prophet of God. In the chapter dealing with changes in Joseph's history we demonstrate that the prophecy concerning the Rocky Mountains is a forgery which was written after Joseph Smith's death. In this chapter we have shown that the prophecy about the Civil War came because of the rebellion of South Carolina in 1832, and that it contains inaccuracies which tend to invalidate it. In addition to this, the Mormon leaders have suppressed part of Joseph Smith's diary which tended to discredit the revelation.

That is a pretty lame attempt to discredit Joseph's Prophecy. It jumps through all these hoops to say Joseph just was a good guesser. And so what if it wasn't published until after he died. It doesn't matter. Look you can think what you want about Joseph, I am not here to convince you that what I believe is right. I am simply stating why I believe what I do.
The Prophecy itself also contains other things which have not happened yet. For example it was not necessary for war to be poured out "all nations" at the beginning of the civil war. It merely meant the inauguration of all these things happening leading up to the second coming of Christ. It contains prophecies beyond just the civil war and a few things have yet to be fulfilled. But the fact that the slaves would "rise up against their masters, and be marshalled and disciplined for war." was pretty compelling, especially if you ever saw the movie Glory. Also pretty compelling that the south actually did call upon the nation of Great Britain. If it wasn't a true prophecy then he is irrefutably the best guesser of all time.
There is always an argument against anything, and so I am not here to argue my religion. I will defend it if attacked, but I repeat, I only want to clarify misconceptions about our faith.
 
Truthspeaker

Well the way I see it Joseph Smith was either a con man or a prophet. Looks like arguments can be made in support of or against Joseph Smith. Either way I thank you for answering questions about your religion.
 
Truthspeaker

Well the way I see it Joseph Smith was either a con man or a prophet. Looks like arguments can be made in support of or against Joseph Smith. Either way I thank you for answering questions about your religion.

thank you for your wonderful reply. That is exactly what I hope everyone thinks about Joseph. He was either a con man or a prophet. People will draw their own conclusions. I have drawn mine. What I say is that no one will really know unless they get a confirmation from God through prayer. Unless that comes, then people will decide which argument makes more sense to them in order to form their opinions about Joseph Smith. But all this does fulfill another prophechy spoken by the angel Moroni in Joseph Smith History chapter 1 verse 33"...and that my name should be had for good and evil among all nations, kindreds, and tongues, or that it should be both good and evil spoken of among all people” (JSH 1:33).
 
You really are a prime example of the quote "ignorance is bliss" Truthspeaker.

You should really seek out the truth and know it before you start to speak of it dude.
 
You really are a prime example of the quote "ignorance is bliss" Truthspeaker.

You should really seek out the truth and know it before you start to speak of it dude.
 
Nice little "Ditty" from N.T. Book Romans Chapter 1.

God's Wrath Against Mankind

18The wrath of God is being revealed from heaven against all the godlessness and wickedness of men who suppress the truth by their wickedness, 19since what may be known about God is plain to them, because God has made it plain to them. 20For since the creation of the world God's invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that men are without excuse.
21For although they knew God, they neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him, but their thinking became futile and their foolish hearts were darkened. 22Although they claimed to be wise, they became fools

Can't make it any clearer than that. Paul sum's it up very clearly.

Man is without excuse. God is and has not shrouded Himself in mystery nor allowed man to have difficulty finding Him. His true identity is found in any motel room in a Gideon bible, or at any Barnes and Nobles, or just about any library or person's home. With that knowledge easily gleened from the bible, plus a contrite, and humbled heart, one can ask and one will receive eternal communion(permanent, eternal, new life) with the true and living God through the attoning death and life of Jesus His Son.

The bible has proven to be accurate to such an incredible extent both archeologically, and historically, and also is validated very strongly via the evidenciary Dead Sea scrolls that were written nearly 2,000 years ago. The odds on our current translations being so very accurate to the 2,000 year old Black sea scrolls, is against all human and normal odds, and is "evidence" that demands a verdict.

In fact the Dead Sea Scrolls, say with sounding uproarious thunder, that God indeed has "protected" or "guarded" His Truth or Word to man since it's inception. The bible's scriptural preservation/accuracy, itself, is evidence of God's miraculous, overseeing of His Truth through the ages.

J.S. Jr. just didn't want to accept biblical scripture in total, and went the humanistic, fleshly route, that met his sinful, humanistic, fleshly desires...........Polygamy, marriage of very young girls to grown adult- perverted men. If J.S. Jr. is a true prophet of God, then God is both fallible, unpredictable, weak, a sexual deviate, and no better or different that the pantheon of gods of the greeks, Romans, Babylonians, and Egyptians....

As Romans Chapter One, succinctly states, "Man is without excuse", and that includes every human being, Mormon, J.W., .......You name 'em.

As Romans states, God has revealed His very existence through His creation; namely the very finite, and mystery of life itself from the uni-cellular to the epitome of cellular, mankind himself.

Man has been given a "will" or "chooser" to say "Yeah" or "Nay" to all things within his realm of senses or God's creation. That goes for the bible's contents too. If man wants to believe that their is a pantheon of gods ruling the universe, or that he, man himself can become a god, he has not been stopped, but has been strongly cautioned via the bible.

The Mormons abide to what they call the "wide road", but the bible says that the "wide" or popular road leads to death and total separation from God(Hell). The bible instead says, "Take the narrow road.", which metaphorically infers that it is not easy, and will not be the popular humanistic, fleshly, choice of those who continue in rebellion, self-love, self agrandizement, and Pride, with a big letter, "P". The narrow road is the "crucified" life of Christ. As Paul clearly said in Galatians 2:20, "I have been crucified with Christ; and it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh, I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me, and delivered Himself up for me." This is not the route of or direction of Mormon doctrine or teaching, but actually the antithesis. Paul's life as a Christian is now totally abiding in the life of Christ, and the life he/Paul now lives is in total surrender, and relationally connected to the deepest degree of his soul. To live or abide in the "crucified" life, is not descriptive of a "picnic" on earth existence, but a life of walking a most painful walk at times, not for the desire to be a martyr, but because the alternative leades to total separation from God's presence for eternity. To abide in Christ/God/the Spirit, is to place all things second before the Almighty! When Jesus said that you must hate your mother, father, brothers, sisters to follow Me, the greek definition of "hate" meant you must love me more or greater than all others, not literal hate as in despising an enemy. Hate, is a very poor translation, but does not take from the very accurate message of scripture.

There are many translations of the bible, and all have their weak and strong points over the others in certain areas of translation. Never the less, they all convey the same message: Christ is God incarnate, God is one, and the only, and not a pantheon of choices.

Sadly, Mormonism is trully a man-run, and authored, society at best, with second class citizenship to women epitomizing it's unGodly authorship. Don't let the obsession with Boy Scouting, and all the other "leave to beaver" family life veneer fool you. It is all a result of Mormonism placing works to be saved or pleasing to God, over, abiding by faith in the total work of Christ as the end-all to man's striving to reach, abide, and be at peace with God.

The angel Moroni was either a masterful fiction of J.S. jr.'s mind, or an out and out demonic angel that really did a job on this J.S. Jr.. Just look back at that Roman's chapter 1, quote, and you can see how J.S. Jr. had brought on his own spiritual blindness, by suppressing both the truth for himself and his followers.

This man will face a most harsh judgement in the end times, as he will have the naive, and willing souls of millions of LDS members on his bloody hands and memory for an eternity.

No good Mormon is going to inherit a planet of his own to propagate his human race. Why? Cause being a good Mormon is a travesty before the God of Abraham, Jacob, Isaac, John, Luke, Paul, James, Steven, and every true follower of the one and only Jesus Christ, the Son of God.

Being a good Mormon is ignoring the very evidences of God as He is revealed in the bible, and instead laying all hope on a N.Y. scam artist who had a criminal record in N.Y. and did not fullfill the definition of a martyr by any secular or religious definition. His followers exude pride, and Truthspeaker is propagating lies, and untruths, and if you are a true biblical Christian, confront Truthspeaker with scripture. The truth of the bible is sharper than a two-edged sword, piercing so deep into a man's soul, even to the very "marrow" of his bones, metaphorically.

Truthspeaker probably is an elder or will be one shortly. He is taught that biblical Christians are naive, people lacking the true, "Truth", of namely this cockamaimee story of Joseph Smith's perverted/twisted imaginations, with much help from Lucifer. The very name "Truthspeaker", reveals the very spiritual condition of this LDS missionary. He has the truth.....end of story. Is he hear to discuss life, and beliefs with an open mind. No! He's here for one thing only. He needs another notch on his gun stock; one more convert to add to his bag of converts.

Satan is just sitting back in his easy-chair just lapping-up with joy everytime a biblical Christian is sucked into the LDS church. They won't lose their salvation, but they will live a most miserable life, out of the will of God.

Mormons are to be most pitied, but also to be cautious-of.

Paul said, "Beware of wolves in sheeps clothing!". Truthspeaker is one of those wolves. He has bought hook, line and sinker, into this skewed, manmade madness of fleshly works, and need to legitamize it through avid missionary endeavors. This thread is his mission currently.

Be respectful to him, but be cautious. Behind that smiling exterior is a very lost, but ambition person that must make a quota of converts to earn brownie points with the LDS God; to be a Mormon in good standing. J. Witnesses, go door to door under such angst and worry for their own security, as they try so hard to convince us all that Watch Tower is the way. Their bible has convoluted so many N.T. verses in an endeavor to make Jesus to seem like just another prophet, or lesser being of God's realm.

Realize that the 144,000 people mentioned in Revelations as 12,000 from each of the 12 tribes of Isreal is denied by the J.W.'s and claimed to be their members instead!

Remember, remember, cults devalue, and or lessen, the person of Christ down to just a divinely inspired person, but not God, or Jehovah. J.W.'s won't even call God, "God". More ritualism and fear. Christmas trees and flag waving patriotism is forbidden, as they teach their converts that these are graven idols. Can't remember last time I prayed to the American flag when I put my hand on my heart and pledged allegiance, nor do I remember worshipping that fir tree in our livingroom decorated at Christmas.

Folks, the bible said their will be so many coming through the future centuries saying, "I have the truth" or "I've seen the Christ"..........etc.... and they are all counterfeits, propagated by the Prince of this World............SATAN, and his cohorts, or demonic principalities.

Satan does not want the true Christ to be exaulted by mankind. Satan does not want the crucifixion and ressurrection of Christ to be venerated, and believed by mankind. At Calvary's cross, sin was defeated, Satan was neutered, and man was given access to the Holy of Holies........namely a relationship with their Creator, God Almighty. God didn't offer perpetual sex on a new planet, nor 77 virgins, but the best of all, no more tears, total security, constant communion with our Maker, Joy, and peace everlasting. Something that man cannot author.
 
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