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When did evangelical Christians denounce Pat Robertson. I missed it.
When did evangelical Christians denounce Pat Robertson. I missed it.
How about a truce? The United States was founded by people that were Christians. Good Christians.
They, as good Christians had a positive influence on all of American society.
However, they all agreed that their religion had no influence and place in government.
There, we have it. Every one knows that is fact.
How about a truce? The United States was founded by people that were Christians. Good Christians.
They, as good Christians had a positive influence on all of American society.
However, they all agreed that their religion had no influence and place in government.
There, we have it. Every one knows that is fact.
Actually, not everyone does know that is fact because it's not. They wanted government to have no effect on religion, not vice versa.
How about a truce? The United States was founded by people that were Christians. Good Christians.
They, as good Christians had a positive influence on all of American society.
However, they all agreed that their religion had no influence and place in government.
There, we have it. Every one knows that is fact.
Actually, not everyone does know that is fact because it's not. They wanted government to have no effect on religion, not vice versa.
What a lovely thought....what does it have to do with the Price of Turnips?Fighting Tyranny under any mask or disguise, is what it is. Pay attention, do what you can. Action brings the players into consciousness. Bring specific grievance into light.
Sort of like you firing a 12 gauge into a crowd because somebody said something you didn't like. Takes care of one problem, but creates more than it solves. You want to tackle injustice, be surgical, it beats being blind folded. Collateral damage creates more than it solves. Stick to the truth, limit to the truth. There were allot of things going on in the world during the times of which you speak.
Pat Robertson has always been an idiot. He was trashed by Evangelical Christians when he said this, something you would point out if you were honest.Someone skipped on their medications again today? Let's double the Thorazine. You are hallucinating a bit.Don't forget to check under your bed and in your closet.
here's a little known fact for ya
in the summer of 2001 (before 9/11)
I was watching pat robertson (tis well to know what tunes the devil is playing)
and he said;
"we (evangelical christians) have MORE in common with evangelical muslims than we do with liberal or moderate christians"
Truce? Dream on ...they'd rather die than agree to any part of Christianity in our nation's conception. What is so odd is that we all seem to agree that Christianity was intentionally left out of our government for reasons that we have extensively discussed...to death actually. And it seems like we all have the same idea that God, Jesus and the holy grail were purposefully left out of the constitution to protect religious freedom or the freedom to ignore religion altogether if that's your choosing. Where we seem to be locked up is on the fact that these men were indeed, by self proclamation, Christian in their faith. So while the grand ol' America may not have been born out of Christianity...there would appear, from all the links provided here that support the notion, that Christianity and the acknowledgment of Christ as the Son of God, did indeed guide these men in their endeavor to form a more perfect union as ONE NATION....UNDER GOD
How about a truce? The United States was founded by people that were Christians. Good Christians.
They, as good Christians had a positive influence on all of American society.
However, they all agreed that their religion had no influence and place in government.
There, we have it. Every one knows that is fact.
You claim that 4 founding fathers that signed the constitution out of 39 were Deists and say that most of them were Diests? How do you make the jump to say this is most?
I went through your links you provided and many of them were just providing evidence that the US was not founded as a Christian nation. The fact still remains that most of the founding fathers were Christian, and because of this Christianity had a significant influence on the founding of the United States.
The one link you did provide took cherry-picked quotes from only 5 of the founding fathers. Yes, Franklin on your list was a Diest, however, you cannot claim the others were just because of the cherry-picked quotes in the link you provided. We should look at the full context of why they said those things and look to the other things they have said or written. Like Jefferson, I think many of them saw through the hypocrisy of the established European Christian churches and wanted to return to the basic teachings of Christ. You asked for a quote from Jefferson. Here it is and it proves my point:
Jefferson's Religious Beliefs - Thomas Jefferson EncyclopediaI am a Christian, in the only sense in which he (Jesus) wished any one to be; sincerely attached to his doctrines, in preference to all others.
Here are some quotes from Franklin:
Deism : The Colonial Williamsburg Official History SiteFranklin, whose life almost spanned the eighteenth century, mutated from defining himself as a deist to saying that deism had perverted his friends. In his forties, Franklin commended the excellency of the Christian religion above all others ancient and modern. As a senior citizen at the Constitutional Convention in Philadelphia, he suggested in vain that the participants pray for Gods guidance. The longer I live, he said, the more convincing proofs I see of this truth, that God governs the affairs of men.
No, I claim of the four founding fathers you said were Deists, three of them claimed otherwise, and the last does not meet your definition of a Deist. Please note that this puts the burden of proof on you, not me, because I have demonstrated that you are wrong about them from their own words and actions. Until you address the demonstrated fact that you are misinformed you cannot expect me, or anyone else, to accept your claim that most of the Founders were Deists, and not Christians.
The fact is that Jefferson claimed to be a Christian. The fact that he also believed that the Bible and the teachings of Christendom perverted the teachings of Jesus does not negate that claim, except in the minds of people who refuse to accept that any understanding of the Bible that their's is permissible. You have now proven yourself to be a religious fanatic who thinks that they have the sole right to interpret God's will and the Bible in order to define tho is, and is not, worthy of acceptance of God. Maybe you should join your soulmate Neubarth and condemn everyone who thinks for themselves to Hell.
You have earned my contempt.
Bullshit. Your argument is the usual, stupid blah, blah, blah. Our laws and morals have always been based on Judeo-Christian beliefs. Until 92, anyway.
No they have not...in fact many of our laws, our bill of rights, our other amendments fly in the face of Judeo-Christian beliefs.
much of what the christians woud enact as laws are
a. unconstitutional and
b. BAD, EVIL!
the 10 commandments, for example, are mostly unconstitutional
and christian laws like anti-homosexual or anti-wiccan are both unconstitutional AND bad.
I know that many of our deviously deceptive conservative friends on this board INSIST that
a. evangelical christians don't exist and
b. they would NEVER EVER criminalize wiccans or homosexuals or atheists..
but
they either lie to themselves
or just lie to us
or both
I have no doubt that should people like GLENN BECK and BILL OREILLY ever achieve enough influence to help get evangelical christians elected to enough political and judicial
positions the round-up of homosexuals, wiccans, atheists, (liberals? feminists? democrats?)
woud be item number 2 on the agenda...
rounding up "the abortionists" and the women who have had abortions would be item number 1
and then
as hero-to-conservaytives newt gingrich said....
"we must change the laws of the land to reflect our christian religious beliefs and then see to it that they can NEVER be changed again"
talk about tyrannical theocracy
ok cons
time for you to tell us how we are paranoid and that right wing evangelicals don't actually exist....
cons......
so deranged....
right wing evangelical are EVERYWHERE (on tv, in the media, on the radio)
and cons INSIST they don't exist!
meanwhile
there is NO evidence of a god....
but god they believe in.....!
I thank the gods that I don't believe in that I am NOT a loony tune conservative
When did evangelical Christians denounce Pat Robertson. I missed it.
Why on earth does it matter?
It matters just as much as when the world's muslims don't condemn Al Q...enough, I guess.
You claim that 4 founding fathers that signed the constitution out of 39 were Deists and say that most of them were Diests? How do you make the jump to say this is most?
I went through your links you provided and many of them were just providing evidence that the US was not founded as a Christian nation. The fact still remains that most of the founding fathers were Christian, and because of this Christianity had a significant influence on the founding of the United States.
The one link you did provide took cherry-picked quotes from only 5 of the founding fathers. Yes, Franklin on your list was a Diest, however, you cannot claim the others were just because of the cherry-picked quotes in the link you provided. We should look at the full context of why they said those things and look to the other things they have said or written. Like Jefferson, I think many of them saw through the hypocrisy of the established European Christian churches and wanted to return to the basic teachings of Christ. You asked for a quote from Jefferson. Here it is and it proves my point:
Jefferson's Religious Beliefs - Thomas Jefferson Encyclopedia
Here are some quotes from Franklin:
Deism : The Colonial Williamsburg Official History Site
No, I claim of the four founding fathers you said were Deists, three of them claimed otherwise, and the last does not meet your definition of a Deist. Please note that this puts the burden of proof on you, not me, because I have demonstrated that you are wrong about them from their own words and actions. Until you address the demonstrated fact that you are misinformed you cannot expect me, or anyone else, to accept your claim that most of the Founders were Deists, and not Christians.
The fact is that Jefferson claimed to be a Christian. The fact that he also believed that the Bible and the teachings of Christendom perverted the teachings of Jesus does not negate that claim, except in the minds of people who refuse to accept that any understanding of the Bible that their's is permissible. You have now proven yourself to be a religious fanatic who thinks that they have the sole right to interpret God's will and the Bible in order to define tho is, and is not, worthy of acceptance of God. Maybe you should join your soulmate Neubarth and condemn everyone who thinks for themselves to Hell.
You have earned my contempt.
Please re-read my post. It was in response to SkyDancer. I actually agree with your position.
No they have not...in fact many of our laws, our bill of rights, our other amendments fly in the face of Judeo-Christian beliefs.
much of what the christians woud enact as laws are
a. unconstitutional and
b. BAD, EVIL!
the 10 commandments, for example, are mostly unconstitutional
and christian laws like anti-homosexual or anti-wiccan are both unconstitutional AND bad.
I know that many of our deviously deceptive conservative friends on this board INSIST that
a. evangelical christians don't exist and
b. they would NEVER EVER criminalize wiccans or homosexuals or atheists..
but
they either lie to themselves
or just lie to us
or both
I have no doubt that should people like GLENN BECK and BILL OREILLY ever achieve enough influence to help get evangelical christians elected to enough political and judicial
positions the round-up of homosexuals, wiccans, atheists, (liberals? feminists? democrats?)
woud be item number 2 on the agenda...
rounding up "the abortionists" and the women who have had abortions would be item number 1
and then
as hero-to-conservaytives newt gingrich said....
"we must change the laws of the land to reflect our christian religious beliefs and then see to it that they can NEVER be changed again"
talk about tyrannical theocracy
ok cons
time for you to tell us how we are paranoid and that right wing evangelicals don't actually exist....
cons......
so deranged....
right wing evangelical are EVERYWHERE (on tv, in the media, on the radio)
and cons INSIST they don't exist!
meanwhile
there is NO evidence of a god....
but god they believe in.....!
I thank the gods that I don't believe in that I am NOT a loony tune conservative
Answer this...
Whose opinion should we listen to in order to make the laws (within the Constitutional framework of course) in this country....?
An Atheist's opinion?
An Agnostic's opinion?
An Anglican's opinion?
A Baptist's opinion?
Catholic's opinion?
Confucian's opinion?
Deist's opinion?
Evangelical's opinion?
and so forth...you get the idea...
The "Christian victim mentality" is a direct product of the anti-Christian agenda growing within our country
Name me one law that is designed to punish Christians?
Show me where saying Merry Christmas is banned by law.
I never said saying Merry Christmas is banned by LAW...secularists are pushing the banning of Merry Christmas by making complaints and pushing their "political correctness" crap...substituting "happy holidays", etc.
The ACLU is a secular organization which is spearheading much of the anti-Christian shennanigans....are you aware of this?
No they have not...in fact many of our laws, our bill of rights, our other amendments fly in the face of Judeo-Christian beliefs.
much of what the christians woud enact as laws are
a. unconstitutional and
b. BAD, EVIL!
the 10 commandments, for example, are mostly unconstitutional
and christian laws like anti-homosexual or anti-wiccan are both unconstitutional AND bad.
I know that many of our deviously deceptive conservative friends on this board INSIST that
a. evangelical christians don't exist and
b. they would NEVER EVER criminalize wiccans or homosexuals or atheists..
but
they either lie to themselves
or just lie to us
or both
I have no doubt that should people like GLENN BECK and BILL OREILLY ever achieve enough influence to help get evangelical christians elected to enough political and judicial
positions the round-up of homosexuals, wiccans, atheists, (liberals? feminists? democrats?)
woud be item number 2 on the agenda...
rounding up "the abortionists" and the women who have had abortions would be item number 1
and then
as hero-to-conservaytives newt gingrich said....
"we must change the laws of the land to reflect our christian religious beliefs and then see to it that they can NEVER be changed again"
talk about tyrannical theocracy
ok cons
time for you to tell us how we are paranoid and that right wing evangelicals don't actually exist....
cons......
so deranged....
right wing evangelical are EVERYWHERE (on tv, in the media, on the radio)
and cons INSIST they don't exist!
meanwhile
there is NO evidence of a god....
but god they believe in.....!
I thank the gods that I don't believe in that I am NOT a loony tune conservative
Answer this...
Whose opinion should we listen to in order to make the laws (within the Constitutional framework of course) in this country....?
An Atheist's opinion?
An Agnostic's opinion?
An Anglican's opinion?
A Baptist's opinion?
Catholic's opinion?
Confucian's opinion?
Deist's opinion?
Evangelical's opinion?
and so forth...you get the idea...
Why on earth does it matter?
It matters just as much as when the world's muslims don't condemn Al Q...enough, I guess.
Evangelical Christians don't denouce Robertson because he's doing nothing to hurt people, he's not calling for anybody's death, he isn't funding the killing of innocents or recruiting innocents to kill themselves in the commission of murder, and he doesn't violate human rights.
Pretty simple.
Why on earth does it matter?
It matters just as much as when the world's muslims don't condemn Al Q...enough, I guess.
Evangelical Christians don't denouce Robertson because he's doing nothing to hurt people, he's not calling for anybody's death, he isn't funding the killing of innocents or recruiting innocents to kill themselves in the commission of murder, and he doesn't violate human rights.
Pretty simple.
