The United States IS a Christian Nation

[AllieBaba]

Communities are made up of individuals, and those individuals have a right to determine what is on their public lands. The rest of your post is nonsense and irrelevant.

 

[Pyrite]

Communities are made up of individuals, and those individuals have a right to determine what is on their public lands. The rest of your post is nonsense and irrelevant.

So if a "community" decided that it wanted a giant statue of a black man being hung from a tree outside of their courthouse, then in your opinion that would be right and proper?

 

[AllieBaba]

A community in the US wouldn't decide that. At any rate, it would be illegal.

But the 10 commandments are a far cry from such a thing.

 

[JBeukema]

Communities are made up of individuals, and those individuals have a right to determine what is on their public lands. The rest of your post is nonsense and irrelevant.

replace 'communities' with 'governments' to see how foolish that is

 

[AllieBaba]

First amendment pertinent data:

"Congress shall make no law respecting the establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise therof; or abridging the freedom of speech clause...."

 

[AllieBaba]

Communities are made up of individuals, and those individuals have a right to determine what is on their public lands. The rest of your post is nonsense and irrelevant.

replace 'communities' with 'governments' to see how foolish that is

It's not foolish a bit.

 

[Pyrite]

A community in the US wouldn't decide that.

There are communities in the US you don't have experience with, then.

At any rate, it would be illegal.

Yes, it would.

But the 10 commandments are a far cry from such a thing.

No, they are not. Commandments one through four are as follows:

ONE: 'You shall have no other gods before Me.'

TWO: 'You shall not make for yourself a carved image--any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.'

THREE: 'You shall not take the name of the LORD your God in vain.'

FOUR: 'Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy.'

These are religious laws. A hindu, for instance, who saw these at a courthouse would have reason to fear being judged not based on whether he had committed the crime in question, but on which god or gods he worships.

 

[AllieBaba]

I've seen quite a few communities, and I know very well there is no community in the US who wants to put up a statue of a man being hanged in front of their courthouse.

And I know what the commandments are. Having them on the lawn in front of the courthouse, or in a city park, or anywhere else, in no way jeopardizes those of other faiths.

 

[JBeukema]

yes, it does, for it tells the world they enter not a court of law, but a court of religion

 

[Pyrite]

I've seen quite a few communities, and I know very well there is no community in the US who wants to put up a statue of a man being hanged in front of their courthouse.

And I know what the commandments are. Having them on the lawn in front of the courthouse, or in a city park, or anywhere else, in no way jeopardizes those of other faiths.

I think it does. I think seeing a statue commanding you to hold a God that is not yours above your gods, when attending to a matter of justice, would make you feel jeopardized. Are you going to argue that it doesn't, or just state it as fact?

 

[Richard-H]

Let me straighten this out once and for all:

Now read my lips:



AMERICA IS NOT AND NEVER HAS BEEN A CHRISTIAN NATION!

As a matter of fact:

WESTERN CIVILIZATION IS NOT AND NEVER HAS BEEN A CHRISTIAN CULTURE!

We are a culture derived from pagans, may of whom have evolved into satanists. (An offshoot of the really bitter anti-Judeo Christian pagans).

Though a tiny minority of our society are REALLY Christians, the vast majority only fake being Christian in order to get over on everyone else in a huge ongoing cultural con game.

Everyone pretends to have Judeo Christian values and have perverted those values in countless ways in order to appear to be Judeo Christian, but THEY AIN"T. IT IS A FRAUD!

The most perverse example (excepting 'ole Adolf, who claimed to be a Christian), is the endless notion of the American Government being a 'Christian Government'. THEOCRATS!

The term 'Christian Government' is a complete OXYMORON. You Cannot be a Christian and believe that government and religion should in any way be combined. It is heresy to a true Christian. (These morons ought to try actually READING THE GOSPELS and finding out what Christianity is about).

To a true Christian governement and religion must be absolutely separate. Any other belief is a direct contradiction of the teachings of Jesus.

Period. That's all there is to it!

Note: Hitting on hookers though was apparently O.K. by Jesus.

Let me straigthen this out once and for all.

Read my lips:

YOUR WORD FOR IT MEANS NOTHING. WHO THE HELL ARE YOU THAT WE'RE SUPPOSED TO JUST TAKE YOUR WORD FOR ANYTHING? YOU SAYING SO SETTLES NOTHING EXCEPT THAT YOU'RE AN ARROGANT DIPWAD.

Now that that's settled, produce some evidence to back up your shit, or sit down and shut up.

I didn't ask anyone to take my word for it, you FLAMING IDIOT, I suggested that people who CLAIM to be CHRISTIANS ought to READ THE GOSPELS and FIND OUT WHAT IT MEANS to be a CHRISTIAN.

Did you ever hear:

"Give to Ceasar what is Ceasar's and to God what is God's"

Are you too fucking stupid to grasp the meaning?

Do you have any knowledge of European history?

Or are you just an ignorant

 

[Cecilie1200]

Let me straighten this out once and for all:

Now read my lips:



AMERICA IS NOT AND NEVER HAS BEEN A CHRISTIAN NATION!

As a matter of fact:

WESTERN CIVILIZATION IS NOT AND NEVER HAS BEEN A CHRISTIAN CULTURE!

We are a culture derived from pagans, may of whom have evolved into satanists. (An offshoot of the really bitter anti-Judeo Christian pagans).

Though a tiny minority of our society are REALLY Christians, the vast majority only fake being Christian in order to get over on everyone else in a huge ongoing cultural con game.

Everyone pretends to have Judeo Christian values and have perverted those values in countless ways in order to appear to be Judeo Christian, but THEY AIN"T. IT IS A FRAUD!

The most perverse example (excepting 'ole Adolf, who claimed to be a Christian), is the endless notion of the American Government being a 'Christian Government'. THEOCRATS!

The term 'Christian Government' is a complete OXYMORON. You Cannot be a Christian and believe that government and religion should in any way be combined. It is heresy to a true Christian. (These morons ought to try actually READING THE GOSPELS and finding out what Christianity is about).

To a true Christian governement and religion must be absolutely separate. Any other belief is a direct contradiction of the teachings of Jesus.

Period. That's all there is to it!

Note: Hitting on hookers though was apparently O.K. by Jesus.

Let me straigthen this out once and for all.

Read my lips:

YOUR WORD FOR IT MEANS NOTHING. WHO THE HELL ARE YOU THAT WE'RE SUPPOSED TO JUST TAKE YOUR WORD FOR ANYTHING? YOU SAYING SO SETTLES NOTHING EXCEPT THAT YOU'RE AN ARROGANT DIPWAD.

Now that that's settled, produce some evidence to back up your shit, or sit down and shut up.

I didn't ask anyone to take my word for it, you FLAMING IDIOT, I suggested that people who CLAIM to be CHRISTIANS ought to READ THE GOSPELS and FIND OUT WHAT IT MEANS to be a CHRISTIAN.

Well, I'd return the "compliment", except you're not bright enough to be flickering, let alone flaming. "Let me straighten this out" and "read my lips", followed by pure, unadulterated, unsupported opinion is asking us to take your word and nothing else for it. i repeat, who the hell are you that we should take your word for the sky being blue, let alone any of the other incredible horseshit spewing from your keyboard? And if you don't understand English enough to figure out your own frigging imbecilic posts, you sure the hell don't need to be insulting anyone else's intelligence.

And while we're at it, who the hell are you to be telling Christians what it really means to be a Christian? Judging by the aforementioned horseshit, I'm not seeing a lot of qualifications from you - aside from an ego so inflamed you can see it from space - to allow you to tell ANYONE to find out ANYTHING.

[Did you ever hear:

"Give to Ceasar what is Ceasar's and to God what is God's"

Are you too fucking stupid to grasp the meaning?

Do you have any knowledge of European history?

Or are you just an ignorant

Well, I realize that I don't shoot out unrelated one-liners apropos of nothing and try to pretend that they're argument-killing zingers. I'll just have to leave "obscurity equals brilliance" to you and stick to writing posts that actually make sense.

Good luck to you and the three brain cells huddling together for warmth between your ears.

 

[foggedinn]

And slavery in biblical times was a world different from slavery as Americans understand it. Slaves had rights, including the right to own property. And Jews were told to release them every so many years. (7?)

Your post refers to bond servants, not slaves. Israelites were not allowed to hold other Israelites as slaves, though they could hold them as bond servants. The normal term of bonded servitude was seven years unless a Jubilee year fell within that seven year period.

Your right about there being very formal rules and restrictions about how bond servants could be treated. They also had to be set up economically when released. An ancient form of a 401(k) plan.

There were such things as slaves in scripture.

 

[JBeukema]

I think it does. I think seeing a statue commanding you to hold a God that is not yours above your gods, when attending to a matter of justice, would make you feel jeopardized. Are you going to argue that it doesn't, or just state it as fact?

or the insistence that they take an oath on a 'bible'

 

[LOki]

Communities are made up of individuals, . . .

Yes.

. . . and those individuals have a right to determine what is on their public lands.

Wrong.

The rest of your post is nonsense and irrelevant.

Wrong.

 

[LOki]

A community in the US wouldn't decide that.

This is what "irrelevent" is.

At any rate, it would be illegal.

This is relevent, but probably not for the reasons you think.

But the 10 commandments are a far cry from such a thing.

Wrong. It is wrong to assert that a community has a right to erect a "giant statue of a black man being hung from a tree outside of their courthouse" for the exact same reasons it is wrong to assert that a community has a right to erect a monument to the 10 Commandments on the Courthouse lawn.

 

[LOki]

And I know what the commandments are. Having them on the lawn in front of the courthouse, or in a city park, or anywhere else, in no way jeopardizes those of other faiths.

Then you are aware that any governement effort to make firm or stable, to introduce and cause to grow and multiply, to bring into existence, to put on a firm basis, to put into a favorable position, to gain full recognition or acceptance of, or to make a national or state institution of the first four Commandments of the Judaeo/Muslim/Christian God, directly violates the First Amendment to the US Constitution.

Consider yourself dismissed.

 

[editec]

And slavery in biblical times was a world different from slavery as Americans understand it. Slaves had rights, including the right to own property. And Jews were told to release them every so many years. (7?)

Depends, Allie.

Slaves of the State and Temple

Slaves of the establishment institutions of temple and palace were mainly prisoners of war (Num 31:25-47; Josh 9:23), they were used in building projects and other more regular duties alongside other laborers (1 Kgs 9:21).
There was a kind of semi-slavery where a group of people owed a certain amount of labor, but otherwise lived as free people. This seems to have been what happened to the Gibeonites in (Josh 9:23).
Subject peoples often became slaves in this sense (2 Sam 8:2, 14; 1 Chron 18:2, 6, 13).
Household slaves

Debt was the main factor in transforming a peasant farmer or artisan into a slave (Ex 22:2; 2 Kgs 4:1) - though poverty that did not involve debt to the new master might also cause people to sell themselves as slaves (Lev 25:39).

In theory such slaves in Israel returned to free status at jubilee, however they could choose to remain in the household of the master (Ex 21:5-6; Dt 15:16-17). In practice as Jer 34:8ff. clearly shows this by no means always occured. Though the king and people agreed to release their slaves nevertheless they reneged!

Biblical and Near-Eastern attitudes to slavery


Ancient Near-Eastern treaties and collections of laws suggest that a slave was primarily viewed as property.

The laws deal with compensation for third parties hurt by the slave's actions. The treaties provide for mutual extradition of runaway slaves.
In Israel, escaped slaves were to be given asylum (Dt 23:15-16).

However, slaves were still seen as property (Ex 21:32; Lev 25:46). The master's rights were limited and the slave's interests protected. Although severe beating was allowed (Ex 21:20), excessive force was punished, by the slave being set free (Ex 21:26-27). Sabbath rest applied to slaves as to free people (Ex 20:10; Dt 5:14).

Hebrew debt-slaves were to serve for a 6 year term only (Ex 21:2; Dt 15:12; but cf. Jer 34:14ff.) and freed slaves were to receive gifts (Dt 15:14). Slaves were also to be freed in the Jubilee Year (Lev 25:13, 40) though this passage refers to particular circumstances.

source

 

[Care4all]

And I know what the commandments are. Having them on the lawn in front of the courthouse, or in a city park, or anywhere else, in no way jeopardizes those of other faiths.

Then you are aware that any governement effort to make firm or stable, to introduce and cause to grow and multiply, to bring into existence, to put on a firm basis, to put into a favorable position, to gain full recognition or acceptance of, or to make a national or state institution of the first four Commandments of the Judaeo/Muslim/Christian God, directly violates the First Amendment to the US Constitution.

Consider yourself dismissed.

So to you, a stone with an engraving on it makes an establishment of religion?

hahahahahahaha! now that's pretty funny....

 

[YWN666]

Our communities have the right to adorn their public places with whatever they desire. THAT'S freedom of speech. If they want to have a representation of the 10 commandments, which are, after all, the backbone of a civilized society, so be it. They have that right. You have the right to propose something different. And that's the end of it.

Your freedom of speech ends when it encroaches on the rights of others. Besides, isn't it enough to have the right to erect a 2 ton 10 commandment monument on your own front lawn?? Why does it need to be on government property?