The War on Journalism

[Coyote]

Supporting or reporting?

I wrote supporting.

Rap Sheet: ***603** Acts of Media-Approved Violence and Harassment Against Trump Supporters | Breitbart

I would disagree because I am not seeing “media approval” despite Brietbart’s claims.

witholding reporting of these crimes is media approval.

How is it being "withheld"?

 

[Coyote]

Was Tommy murdered? Was he abducted from another country? Are you saying journalists should not be bound by any laws?

He was jailed for reporting.

Your desire to dodge this, is good. It shows that on some level, you know this is a huge problem for your war mongering on this issue.

Actually no, that wasn’t why he was jailed (here is a hint for you, what he was reporting had been and was being reported).

I'm well aware of the lame ass excuses of the government for jailing the reporter.


I'm sure the Saudi Government has a reason or two for their actions too. YOu going to swallow them without question too?

So far they haven’t offered up any.

Robinson is still alive, unharmed, “reporting”....and you ignore the fact that what he reported was already reported...and those folks didn’t get put in jail.

1. They know that you won't give them the save blind gullibility that you give your fellow lefties. Which was my point, of course.

2. Oh, so that he was eventually released from prison makes it ok? Cool. So, if Trump imprisons some reporters, just for a few weeks, and then releases them, you going to give him a pass too?

You claim he was jailed because of what he was reporting on. However what he was "reporting" on has been in the media for much of the prior year and was still in the media when he claimed to be singled out. Explain how then how no other journalists were arrested for reporting on the same material. Perhaps there is more to it then he claims (speaking of blind gullibility"...

It might also be helpful to define what IS a journalist because journalism and free speech are two different issues and not every person who speaks up about something is a journalist. (That is not to say that free speech isn't an important right or that it too isn't being targeted by many of the same regimes).


What is journalism? Definition and meaning of the craft

What is journalism?

Journalism is the activity of gathering, assessing, creating, and presenting news and information. It is also the product of these activities.

Journalism can be distinguished from other activities and products by certain identifiable characteristics and practices. These elements not only separate journalism from other forms of communication, they are what make it indispensable to democratic societies. History reveals that the more democratic a society, the more news and information it tends to have.

What makes journalism different than other forms of communication?

The world, and especially the online world, is awash in communication.

The vast majority of this communication, however, is not news and especially not journalism. Almost 70 percent of email traffic is spam, according to web security company Symantec. In 2012, there were an average of 175 million tweets each day. But almost all – 99% — consisted of “pointless babble,” according to researchers at Carnegie Mellon University.

While journalism occupies a much smaller space than the talk, entertainment, opinion, assertion, advertising and propaganda that dominate the media universe, it is nevertheless perceived as being more valuable than most of the “stuff out there.”

That value flows from its purpose, to provide people with verified information they can use to make better decisions, and its practices, the most important of which is a systematic process – a discipline of verification – that journalists use to find not just the facts, but also the “truth about the facts.”

Link talks also about bias, objectivity etc. confronting journalism today. Main point is - just because someone has a microphone or a keyboard or camera does not mean he or she is a journalist.

 

[Aba Incieni]

Belief is one thing, facts are another. Either way I don’t see how it has anything to do with the attacks on journalistic freedom.

There is no such thing as journalistic freedom in KSA or Turkey.

In Theologies............Freedom is do as we say or we will kill you.............

Kurds understand that well.............Turkey gets their rocks off killing them and consider them second hand citizens.........

SA is another brutal gov't who rule with a iron fist.........pretty normal for the middle east.

Oh, they're free to write what they will.

But if they do they'll be chopped up and boxed into tiny pieces.

According to the Patriot Act, on the say so of the folks in charge here? It's the same here.

We only have the illusion that things are different.

Just b/c we don't hear about it, doesn't mean it doesn't happen.
Black activist jailed for his Facebook posts speaks out about secret FBI surveillance

Just look at social media censorship for freedom of journalism.

 

[EvilCat Breath]

So far, there is no proof of anything.

 

[Pogo]

Belief is one thing, facts are another. Either way I don’t see how it has anything to do with the attacks on journalistic freedom.

There is no such thing as journalistic freedom in KSA or Turkey.

In Theologies............Freedom is do as we say or we will kill you.............

Kurds understand that well.............Turkey gets their rocks off killing them and consider them second hand citizens.........

SA is another brutal gov't who rule with a iron fist.........pretty normal for the middle east.

Oh, they're free to write what they will.

But if they do they'll be chopped up and boxed into tiny pieces.

According to the Patriot Act, on the say so of the folks in charge here? It's the same here.

We only have the illusion that things are different.

Just b/c we don't hear about it, doesn't mean it doesn't happen.
Black activist jailed for his Facebook posts speaks out about secret FBI surveillance

Just look at social media censorship for freedom of journalism.

Unfortunately for this proposed point, antisocial media (calling a medium that condemns people to be immersed in an electronic box "social" is an oxymoron) ------ has no relationship to "journalism". It has only a relationship to "gossip".

"Gossip" has no value. "Gossip" is what got people lynched.

 

[Aba Incieni]

There is no such thing as journalistic freedom in KSA or Turkey.

In Theologies............Freedom is do as we say or we will kill you.............

Kurds understand that well.............Turkey gets their rocks off killing them and consider them second hand citizens.........

SA is another brutal gov't who rule with a iron fist.........pretty normal for the middle east.

Oh, they're free to write what they will.

But if they do they'll be chopped up and boxed into tiny pieces.

According to the Patriot Act, on the say so of the folks in charge here? It's the same here.

We only have the illusion that things are different.

Just b/c we don't hear about it, doesn't mean it doesn't happen.
Black activist jailed for his Facebook posts speaks out about secret FBI surveillance

Just look at social media censorship for freedom of journalism.

Unfortunately for this proposed point, antisocial media (calling a medium that condemns people to be immersed in an electronic box "social" is an oxymoron) ------ has no relationship to "journalism". It has only a relationship to "gossip".

"Gossip" has no value. "Gossip" is what got people lynched.

Alex Jones called.

How did your professional journalists do with their expert predictions and commentaries re: election 2016?

 

[Windparadox]

RSF Index 2018: Hatred of journalism threatens democracies

^^^ best metric one can find.

Add>>>

Mix in>>

wash, rinse, repeat

~S~

`
Corporately owned and controlled media has doomed journalism, particularly, mainstream media.

 

[Coyote]

The media brought this on itself by being biased. I was in it for about 18 years, and I was guilty of it myself. To make it worse, journalists are taught pretty much immediately that theirs is some kind of sacred profession that cannot be challenged or questioned.

But then, as usual, the Right has taken it too far. Challenging & questioning is one thing, and a very positive thing. But assuming that everything is "fake" is another. If they don't like it, it can only be a lie. That's just simplistic and terribly counter-productive.

We have completely lost the capacity for rational, critical thinking, and this is what it looks like: Fucking chaos.
.

I think it comes down to accountability. To me - the credibility of a news organization lies in it's willingness to fact check, to print retractions, corrections or even apologies when necessary and, to show accountability for big bloopers by demoting or firing. Remember when Dan Rather, in his haste to smear President Bush, reported on an uncorroberated unfact-checked letter accusing him of being AWOL? He lost his job and rightfully so. But compare that to the media making Nazi comparisons - whether of Trump's immigration policy or Obama's health care policy. Or - compare that to Fox News' endless coverage of Seth Rich until finally a lawsuit forced them to print a retraction. No heads rolled there. Credibility is something we as individual readers must learn to ascertain for ourselves but that shouldn't lead us to excusing or promoting attacks on journalists or supporting rhetoric calling for it. Journalists offer the only life line to truth in some of these very repressive regimes and they put their lives on line in many of these places. It's like free speech imo - we may not agree with it, but we will fight for their rights to say it or report it. Once we start picking and choosing which viewpoints are acceptable for reporting we enter dangerous territory. As long as we have laws on libel, slander we have some limitations on the most egregious journalistic offenses. As long as the public demands the same accountability from their journalistic sources as they do from their government we have market-imposed accountability. As long as we have media sources covering all spectrums of view - we can be assurred everything will be covered. You think something is biased? Write a letter to the editor, find another source to support etc.

 

[Pogo]

In Theologies............Freedom is do as we say or we will kill you.............

Kurds understand that well.............Turkey gets their rocks off killing them and consider them second hand citizens.........

SA is another brutal gov't who rule with a iron fist.........pretty normal for the middle east.

Oh, they're free to write what they will.

But if they do they'll be chopped up and boxed into tiny pieces.

According to the Patriot Act, on the say so of the folks in charge here? It's the same here.

We only have the illusion that things are different.

Just b/c we don't hear about it, doesn't mean it doesn't happen.
Black activist jailed for his Facebook posts speaks out about secret FBI surveillance

Just look at social media censorship for freedom of journalism.

Unfortunately for this proposed point, antisocial media (calling a medium that condemns people to be immersed in an electronic box "social" is an oxymoron) ------ has no relationship to "journalism". It has only a relationship to "gossip".

"Gossip" has no value. "Gossip" is what got people lynched.

Alex Jones called.

How did your professional journalists do with their expert predictions and commentaries re: election 2016?

Journalism doesn't "predict".

My that was easy.

 

[Aba Incieni]

Oh, they're free to write what they will.

But if they do they'll be chopped up and boxed into tiny pieces.

According to the Patriot Act, on the say so of the folks in charge here? It's the same here.

We only have the illusion that things are different.

Just b/c we don't hear about it, doesn't mean it doesn't happen.
Black activist jailed for his Facebook posts speaks out about secret FBI surveillance

Just look at social media censorship for freedom of journalism.

Unfortunately for this proposed point, antisocial media (calling a medium that condemns people to be immersed in an electronic box "social" is an oxymoron) ------ has no relationship to "journalism". It has only a relationship to "gossip".

"Gossip" has no value. "Gossip" is what got people lynched.

Alex Jones called.

How did your professional journalists do with their expert predictions and commentaries re: election 2016?

Journalism doesn't "predict".

My that was easy.

Commentaries. You miss that part?

Simple.

 

[Coyote]

RSF Index 2018: Hatred of journalism threatens democracies

^^^ best metric one can find.

Add>>>

Mix in>>

wash, rinse, repeat

~S~

`
Corporately owned and controlled media has doomed journalism, particularly, mainstream media.

That IS a HUGE problem unfortunately - to many media outlets reside in to few owners. The only thing I can see in countering this is that there are many independent outlets still out there...though their integrity, accountability and accuracy are all over the board.

 

[Mac1958]

The media brought this on itself by being biased. I was in it for about 18 years, and I was guilty of it myself. To make it worse, journalists are taught pretty much immediately that theirs is some kind of sacred profession that cannot be challenged or questioned.

But then, as usual, the Right has taken it too far. Challenging & questioning is one thing, and a very positive thing. But assuming that everything is "fake" is another. If they don't like it, it can only be a lie. That's just simplistic and terribly counter-productive.

We have completely lost the capacity for rational, critical thinking, and this is what it looks like: Fucking chaos.
.

I think it comes down to accountability. To me - the credibility of a news organization lies in it's willingness to fact check, to print retractions, corrections or even apologies when necessary and, to show accountability for big bloopers by demoting or firing. Remember when Dan Rather, in his haste to smear President Bush, reported on an uncorroberated unfact-checked letter accusing him of being AWOL? He lost his job and rightfully so. But compare that to the media making Nazi comparisons - whether of Trump's immigration policy or Obama's health care policy. Or - compare that to Fox News' endless coverage of Seth Rich until finally a lawsuit forced them to print a retraction. No heads rolled there. Credibility is something we as individual readers must learn to ascertain for ourselves but that shouldn't lead us to excusing or promoting attacks on journalists or supporting rhetoric calling for it. Journalists offer the only life line to truth in some of these very repressive regimes and they put their lives on line in many of these places. It's like free speech imo - we may not agree with it, but we will fight for their rights to say it or report it. Once we start picking and choosing which viewpoints are acceptable for reporting we enter dangerous territory. As long as we have laws on libel, slander we have some limitations on the most egregious journalistic offenses. As long as the public demands the same accountability from their journalistic sources as they do from their government we have market-imposed accountability. As long as we have media sources covering all spectrums of view - we can be assurred everything will be covered. You think something is biased? Write a letter to the editor, find another source to support etc.

The advent of cable news changed everything, and then the internet turned everything on its freakin' head. There is so much competition now, so little oversight now, and so many under-qualified "journalists" now, that it's nothing more than keyboard anarchy.

And now that the national "news" has essentially split into Left and Right, it will continue to push us apart. Holy crap, we all have our own individual access to REALITY. I've thought a lot about this, I've talked to friends I still have in the business, and I have no idea what fixes this.
.

 

[Dan Stubbs]

The abduction and likely death of Kashoggi. A surprisingly sycophantic attitude from an American President known for cosying to autocrats. It must be “rogue assassins”...or something. Or something.

To abduct a person from a consulate on another nation’s territory...against that nation’s laws, represents a new and much more dangerous assault on journalistic freedom. In fact...I think it is unheard of. And it puts the US in a tricky position. Saudi Arabia is our ally. But a free media and the rights of journalists to report, and to hold their governments responsible has long been an underpinning of American Democracy. We have censored allies before for bad behavior...withheld sales for example.

We are witnessing a demise journalistic freedomof around the world journalists are being threatened, killed and jailed for trying to do their jobs. They depend on bigger more powerful countries to look out for their rights should authoritarian states come down on them.

If we kow tow to the Saudi’s over this, what does that tell other dictators and what does it say to our values?

Big Deal

 

[Pogo]

RSF Index 2018: Hatred of journalism threatens democracies

^^^ best metric one can find.

Add>>>

Mix in>>

wash, rinse, repeat

~S~

`
Corporately owned and controlled media has doomed journalism, particularly, mainstream media.

True dat. I would describe it as commercial media, for that's where the incentive comes from regardless how many tentacles its owner grows. When the objective is to sell eyeballs to the advertiser, the sub-objective of reporting the news gets shoved way to the back of the bus.

News (on TV) is an expensive proposition. Lots of staff needed to run around the world who need transportation and communication and coordinators and editors to make it happen. Those Huntley-Brinkley evening reports that were the early model were always loss leaders subsidized by the mindless sitcoms that followed them, and they were done so that the stations could satisfy the FCC's requirement that they be rendering a public service.

Enter Rupert Murdoch, a gossip tabloid magnate, into the fray building a cable channel that was a gossip tabloid on video using politicians as its celebrities, and that thirst for eyeballs got satisfied by the salacious, at the expense of journalistic ethics. They could sit talking heads in a single studio talking about the news rather than actually going out to report it, always discussing the personal (politicians) rather than the abstract (policy). That's how you build gossip. And that's IMHO where the dam burst.

Once consolidation enters that picture -- at the same time -- you get EnormoCorp not only owning news channels and TV stations to parrot them but you own book publishers to get interviewed on your TV stations, you own movie production houses to make those books into movies, you own newspapers and magazines and in time websites and "social" media to lubricate the whole thing, and you even own record companies to dictate what the music is on the radio stations you own including the soundtrack to your movie based on your book that you splashed in your magazines and your newspapers and your TV stations and your billboards.

That's power.

But it ain't journalism.

 

[Aba Incieni]

There is no "war on journalism" in the US. People are free to write what they will without being chopped to pieces.

 

[Aba Incieni]

There is no "war on journalism" in the US. People are free to write what they will without being chopped to pieces.

 

[Windparadox]

That IS a HUGE problem unfortunately - to many media outlets reside in to few owners. The only thing I can see in countering this is that there are many independent outlets still out there...though their integrity, accountability and accuracy are all over the board.

`
Except for local news, weather and sports and national events (such as a hurricane) I watch absolutely no cable/TV news. It's been that way over 9 years now. All my news is from the net and from multiple sources. I have no single source of news I "go to." I have a Bachelor's degree in journalism, with emphasis on investigative reporting. It's not what I do full time but I do independent contract work, most of which does not involve google or the internet.

 

[Pogo]

According to the Patriot Act, on the say so of the folks in charge here? It's the same here.

We only have the illusion that things are different.

Just b/c we don't hear about it, doesn't mean it doesn't happen.
Black activist jailed for his Facebook posts speaks out about secret FBI surveillance

Just look at social media censorship for freedom of journalism.

Unfortunately for this proposed point, antisocial media (calling a medium that condemns people to be immersed in an electronic box "social" is an oxymoron) ------ has no relationship to "journalism". It has only a relationship to "gossip".

"Gossip" has no value. "Gossip" is what got people lynched.

Alex Jones called.

How did your professional journalists do with their expert predictions and commentaries re: election 2016?

Journalism doesn't "predict".

My that was easy.

Commentaries. You miss that part?

Simple.

You are correct, I did skip over that. Let me rephrase then.
Journalism doesn't "predict" nor does it "comment".

My that was even easier.

 

[Aba Incieni]

Just look at social media censorship for freedom of journalism.

Unfortunately for this proposed point, antisocial media (calling a medium that condemns people to be immersed in an electronic box "social" is an oxymoron) ------ has no relationship to "journalism". It has only a relationship to "gossip".

"Gossip" has no value. "Gossip" is what got people lynched.

Alex Jones called.

How did your professional journalists do with their expert predictions and commentaries re: election 2016?

Journalism doesn't "predict".

My that was easy.

Commentaries. You miss that part?

Simple.

You are correct, I did skip over that. Let me rephrase then.
Journalism doesn't "predict" nor does it "comment".

My that was even easier.

So we're journalists because we write. No war.

Fini.

 

[caddo kid]

Republicans do NOT care about the 'free press'

Republicans have demonstrated the only thing they care about is MONEY.

Republicans have no humanity, no morality, and no soul.

Republicans can all go to Hell AFAIC.

We care about a responsible press.

That MONEY you disdain, it provides entitlements among other things.

Where is your humanity, morality and soul on saying, "Republicans can all go to Hell AFAIC?

You are already in Hell, why would I visit you?

The problem is who decides what is or isn’t a “responsible” press? Should criticism of the ruling government be labeled irresponsible? We have courts and laws to address libel and slander.

I can count on one hand the number of times the press went after Obama. I can also count on one hand the number of days the press didn't attack Trump.

In case you didn't notice, BECAUSE YOU DID NOT, Trump was attacking the free press during the campaign.

Trump has been attacking the free press EVER SINCE he announced his candidacy back in 2015.

Where were you then? On Uranus?