Understanding What Kim Davis' Legal Argument Will Be..

[Montrovant]

Your interpretation of the Bible is not, clearly, one which is universally held, whatever you may claim.

I reiterate, there is no interpretation required of Jude 1 and Roman's 1 and the mandate prescribed therein, "Thou shalt not normalize homosexuality under pain of eternal soul death" [paraphrase to be decided in Court}

The Bible says plainly what it does on that one particular point and punishment. If people choose not to follow such a dire warning in the New Testament of Jesus, then they are not Christians. They may call themselves Christians, but they are not. The question will of course come down to the study of these passages and their plain meaning. I never thought I'd live to see the day when the Bible was given as an exhibit at SCOTUS but I believe to prove the clear intent of a true Christian's mandate, that's what it will come down to.

And yet it seems that millions of people who consider themselves Christians disagree with you about what the Bible has to say on homosexuality. Considering your appalling record of lies, misrepresentations, mistakes, and incorrect claims, why would I believe you know what you are talking about with this? Reading the verses I don't think they say what you claim, although I don't know how they might differ in their original language. They seem to me to be saying that those who commit the listed sins listed are in danger, not someone who allows others to commit those sins. But you go on and continue to think you know what Christianity says and those of us who have read your postings on this board will continue to see that you have very little grasp of anything you rant about.

 

[boilermaker55]

She refuses to do the job she was put into to do, Fire her or she needs to resign.
Simple!
Keep your and anyone else that has a deep religious belief, out of the government to which I belong.
Simple.

Of course she already had a lawyer or a team of them before she went to jail. But there seems to be quite a rukkus and misunderstanding of religion when it comes to how her attorneys will frame their argument. Here is a spot to debate Kim Davis' flaws and how they will weigh in on her arguments at trial(s) and on appeal to the US Supreme Court, probably by about late 2016 or early 2017.

The following comment sparked this topic:

Just saw on TV that she was married FOUR FUCKING TIMES and had TWINS out of wedlock. Is that true? I can smell the hypocrisy.

Yes, she is a sinner. And that's why she is a Christian. It's a requirement to walk through the door of a church. You don't approach Christianity from a perspective of perfection, you approach it saying "I am a flawed being, I'm struggling, I need help". That's how it works.

On the topic of adultery and the famous story in the Bible of the stoning incident with Jesus, he said "let any of you who is without sin cast the first stone". His point was twofold: 1. To save the poor stoning victim and 2. To really seat in the minds of the angry mob that we are all sinners and must not judge; judgment is for God.

That being said, Jude 1 spells out that a Christian (who is also a sinner, remember) must reach out to homosexuals with compassion, "making a difference". But that to promote them as a group mentality into the fabric of any society is STRICTLY FORBIDDEN. This message exists in the New Testament and in Jesus' teachings as I recall, there are very few examples of of him saying "Oh yeah, you know that Old Testament law and the shit that went down then with God casting people into Hell for eternity? Yeah, this one's like that. It's for realsies." Yet that's what we find in Jude 1.

And it makes sense if you understand sociology. When it comes to human behaviors and mimickry in youth, trends have a way of catching fire in any society. And what do we see today after 30 years of nonstop campaigning by LGBT cult to the youth in media? That's right, hordes of "bi-curious" or "gay" youth popping up like a dandelion-epidemic in a lawn that used to be relatively weed free. God's OK with his lawn having occasional dandelions but not the whole lawn being taken over with time. God remembers Ancient Greece and you don't. So he is wiser than you. God remembers Sodom and you don't. So he is wiser than you.

God teaches us to love the sinner but hate the sin. And that's what Jude 1 is all about. Jesus also extended compassion to prostitutes, thieves and lepers. Does that mean that anyone against or refusing to participate in promoting prostitution, robbery or coming down with leprosy is a "hater"? NO! Of course not! So, Kim Davis is in God's favor. The Bible's New Testament isn't all roses and hippy love fest. There are some hard rules and one of the hardest is not to tamper with God's lawn by helping to seed it with weeds. Otherwise the good grass will be choked out and wouldn't have a chance to grow in that enviroment even if it wanted to desperately. THAT is why the punishment for promoting homosexuality using God's sacred vehicle of the family (marriage) is such a pisser for God. And you will get eternity in the slammer if you fail to heed Jude 1's warning.

So, any lawyer coming forward saying "she's an adulterer! How can she object?!!" is flat out of line. Kim Davis isn't the Bible. Kim Davis is a flawed sinning Christian doing her level best to abide by the Bible in this particular instance. She has read the warnings in Jude 1, presumably. So she knows she must choose between eternal peril or jail. She has chosen wisely. But the people who put her in jail have not chosen wisely. They will be judged twice. Once here on earth in the dank and dusty courtooms. And a second time as they foolishly try to enter the Pearly Gates.

The 1st Amendment of the Constitution protects the exercise of religion. It does so not for a building or a group of people, but for an individual following a known and accepted faith (not a cult). The differences between a sublime religion and a cult are determined by society, not one judge or a small panel of them. Christians were who founded our country. And it's going to be a long day in court for an attorney trying to argue how a Johnny-Come-Lately deviant sex cult has a "right" to force a Christian to their knees to bow at a new rainbow colored altar.

The 9th Amendment of the Constitution says that no law may come along and dilute the potency of the 1st Amendment. So Ms. Davis can use the 9th to drive a big fat nail in the wall and hang her 1st Amendment hat on it. "Public Accomodation" must and will take a back seat to the 1st Amendment. Public accomodation is a brand new concept of forcing people to go along with in this case, behaviors they object to.

There was a flawed premise at the very start of all this. And it was/is "behaviors = race". A waffling group of deviant sex behaviors who don't even understand themselves completely, cannot dictate to our nation's sublime stalwart religion since day one (Christians) that they will now have to essentially tear out sections of the Bible and burn them as newly-irrelevant.

 

[bendog]

She refuses to do the job she was put into to do, Fire her or she needs to resign.
Simple!
Keep your and anyone else that has a deep religious belief, out of the government to which I belong.
Simple.

Of course she already had a lawyer or a team of them before she went to jail. But there seems to be quite a rukkus and misunderstanding of religion when it comes to how her attorneys will frame their argument. Here is a spot to debate Kim Davis' flaws and how they will weigh in on her arguments at trial(s) and on appeal to the US Supreme Court, probably by about late 2016 or early 2017.

The following comment sparked this topic:

Just saw on TV that she was married FOUR FUCKING TIMES and had TWINS out of wedlock. Is that true? I can smell the hypocrisy.

Yes, she is a sinner. And that's why she is a Christian. It's a requirement to walk through the door of a church. You don't approach Christianity from a perspective of perfection, you approach it saying "I am a flawed being, I'm struggling, I need help". That's how it works.

On the topic of adultery and the famous story in the Bible of the stoning incident with Jesus, he said "let any of you who is without sin cast the first stone". His point was twofold: 1. To save the poor stoning victim and 2. To really seat in the minds of the angry mob that we are all sinners and must not judge; judgment is for God.

That being said, Jude 1 spells out that a Christian (who is also a sinner, remember) must reach out to homosexuals with compassion, "making a difference". But that to promote them as a group mentality into the fabric of any society is STRICTLY FORBIDDEN. This message exists in the New Testament and in Jesus' teachings as I recall, there are very few examples of of him saying "Oh yeah, you know that Old Testament law and the shit that went down then with God casting people into Hell for eternity? Yeah, this one's like that. It's for realsies." Yet that's what we find in Jude 1.

And it makes sense if you understand sociology. When it comes to human behaviors and mimickry in youth, trends have a way of catching fire in any society. And what do we see today after 30 years of nonstop campaigning by LGBT cult to the youth in media? That's right, hordes of "bi-curious" or "gay" youth popping up like a dandelion-epidemic in a lawn that used to be relatively weed free. God's OK with his lawn having occasional dandelions but not the whole lawn being taken over with time. God remembers Ancient Greece and you don't. So he is wiser than you. God remembers Sodom and you don't. So he is wiser than you.

God teaches us to love the sinner but hate the sin. And that's what Jude 1 is all about. Jesus also extended compassion to prostitutes, thieves and lepers. Does that mean that anyone against or refusing to participate in promoting prostitution, robbery or coming down with leprosy is a "hater"? NO! Of course not! So, Kim Davis is in God's favor. The Bible's New Testament isn't all roses and hippy love fest. There are some hard rules and one of the hardest is not to tamper with God's lawn by helping to seed it with weeds. Otherwise the good grass will be choked out and wouldn't have a chance to grow in that enviroment even if it wanted to desperately. THAT is why the punishment for promoting homosexuality using God's sacred vehicle of the family (marriage) is such a pisser for God. And you will get eternity in the slammer if you fail to heed Jude 1's warning.

So, any lawyer coming forward saying "she's an adulterer! How can she object?!!" is flat out of line. Kim Davis isn't the Bible. Kim Davis is a flawed sinning Christian doing her level best to abide by the Bible in this particular instance. She has read the warnings in Jude 1, presumably. So she knows she must choose between eternal peril or jail. She has chosen wisely. But the people who put her in jail have not chosen wisely. They will be judged twice. Once here on earth in the dank and dusty courtooms. And a second time as they foolishly try to enter the Pearly Gates.

The 1st Amendment of the Constitution protects the exercise of religion. It does so not for a building or a group of people, but for an individual following a known and accepted faith (not a cult). The differences between a sublime religion and a cult are determined by society, not one judge or a small panel of them. Christians were who founded our country. And it's going to be a long day in court for an attorney trying to argue how a Johnny-Come-Lately deviant sex cult has a "right" to force a Christian to their knees to bow at a new rainbow colored altar.

The 9th Amendment of the Constitution says that no law may come along and dilute the potency of the 1st Amendment. So Ms. Davis can use the 9th to drive a big fat nail in the wall and hang her 1st Amendment hat on it. "Public Accomodation" must and will take a back seat to the 1st Amendment. Public accomodation is a brand new concept of forcing people to go along with in this case, behaviors they object to.

There was a flawed premise at the very start of all this. And it was/is "behaviors = race". A waffling group of deviant sex behaviors who don't even understand themselves completely, cannot dictate to our nation's sublime stalwart religion since day one (Christians) that they will now have to essentially tear out sections of the Bible and burn them as newly-irrelevant.

I dunno. Apparently she cannot be fired, only impeached or defeated in an election. If her deputies can issue valid licenses and will, the I don't see the issue of impeachment. But, then I didn't see the case for impeachment of slick, since his perjury about sex had no affect on his performance (-: or ability to carry out his job duties. And, while I'm sure glad I don't live in her neck of the woods, her constituents may elect her again.

 

[JoeB131]

Well that's why I posted the excerpts from Jude 1 and Romans 1 so you can see there is no interpretation necessary. The commands are plain upon their face, reiterated twice (at least) in the New Testament and featured as the number one concern of the Gospel of Jude and accounts of Romans. Jude 1, Romans 1..."thou shalt not normalize homosexuality...under pain of eternal soul death". There's no interpretation needed.

guy, there are a whole bunch of shit in the Bible that is "really clear on its face" and "not subject to interpretation".

We don't sell our daughters into slavery like the bible says.
We don't stone them if they aren't virgins on their wedding nights.
We don't stone them for wearing pants.
We don't stone them for getting tattoos.
We don't stone them for working on the Sabbath.

God didn't change, we did. We decided that really, what kind of sex other people were having really wasn't anyone else's business.

 

[Silhouette]

We don't sell our daughters into slavery like the bible says.
We don't stone them if they aren't virgins on their wedding nights.
We don't stone them for wearing pants.
We don't stone them for getting tattoos.
We don't stone them for working on the Sabbath.

God didn't change, we did. We decided that really, what kind of sex other people were having really wasn't anyone else's business.

Old or New testament? Venial or mortal sin? Death is not as bad a punishment as eternal soul death. Might want to brush up on the heirarchy of sin and get back to the conversation more enlightened.. Normalizing homosexuality is one of the worst sins a Christian can commit. So if they have to commit that sin because of secular law, then Christianity no longer exists.

Gay marriage and the 1st Amendment rights of Christians cannot exist in the same universe. It's like matter and anti-matter coming together. BOOM.

 

[Where_r_my_Keys]

Just a wonderful post and let me just say: YA NAILED IT!

There are some hard rules and one of the hardest is not to tamper with God's lawn by helping to seed it with weeds... .

That point stood out for me.

Because, Jesus made his position clear, where it came to children, noting that those who harm children would be better off tying a millstone around their neck (Gilligan a Millstone is a HUGE round rock that grind seeds into dusty mush... they weigh in by the ton.) and toss it into the sea. And the Degenerate Cult is about NOTHING except the sexual pursuit of children.

Subsequently, there is a major reckoning coming and the cult of the Left (the manifestation of evil) has got HELL to pay, when it comes.

 

[Where_r_my_Keys]

We don't sell our daughters into slavery like the bible says.
We don't stone them if they aren't virgins on their wedding nights.
We don't stone them for wearing pants.
We don't stone them for getting tattoos.
We don't stone them for working on the Sabbath.

Yeah... and we're not Jews living 5000 years ago, either. And since those rules were SPECIFICALLY, ENTIRELY, WHOLLY, EXCLUSIVELY set for those Jews... there's no reason why 'we' would be subject to those rules.

Now, if God told us to start doing so, "WE" would. But, the thing is, God's more likely to set those rules on us, for Leftists... . And won't THAT be a wonderful day for all of "US".

 

[SwimExpert]

Gay marriage and the 1st Amendment rights of Christians cannot exist in the same universe.

Fucking psychotic....

 

[Where_r_my_Keys]

Gay marriage and the 1st Amendment rights of Christians cannot exist in the same universe.

Fucking psychotic....

Oh! Now THAT is a wonderful concession to the standing point!

Your concession is duly noted and summarily accepted.

Reader, do ya see how easy it is to defeat the Left in debate?

The key to such is found in two fundamental elements:

1- Find a Leftist.

2- Get them to speak.

 

[SwimExpert]

Gay marriage and the 1st Amendment rights of Christians cannot exist in the same universe.

Fucking psychotic....

Oh! Now THAT is a wonderful concession to the standing point!

Your concession is duly noted and summarily accepted.

Reader, do ya see how easy it is to defeat the Left in debate?

The key to such is found in two fundamental elements:

1- Find a Leftist.

2- Get them to speak.

Kids, this is your brain on drugs. Any questions?

 

[JoeB131]

Old or New testament? Venial or mortal sin? Death is not as bad a punishment as eternal soul death. Might want to brush up on the heirarchy of sin and get back to the conversation more enlightened.. Normalizing homosexuality is one of the worst sins a Christian can commit. So if they have to commit that sin because of secular law, then Christianity no longer exists.

Gay marriage and the 1st Amendment rights of Christians cannot exist in the same universe. It's like matter and anti-matter coming together. BOOM.

Guy, I don't waste a lot of time on the heirarchy of fairy stories.

There is no God, there is no heaven, there is no hell, there is no devil, and there is no "sin".

But if you really, really think there is, and you think you can't do the job were were elected or hired to do because of it, you have a solution.

Quit and find something to do for a living that doesn't offend your sensibilities.

Frankly, A God who would make someone gay and then torture them for all eternity for it is a complete cocksucker and not worthy of anyone's worship.

The Bible God is a sociopath you'd never want in your life as a friend, why would you want him in your life as a God.

 

[JoeB131]

Yeah... and we're not Jews living 5000 years ago, either. And since those rules were SPECIFICALLY, ENTIRELY, WHOLLY, EXCLUSIVELY set for those Jews... there's no reason why 'we' would be subject to those rules.

Now, if God told us to start doing so, "WE" would. But, the thing is, God's more likely to set those rules on us, for Leftists... . And won't THAT be a wonderful day for all of "US".

No, guy, we don't live by those rules because we aren't barbarians.

It seems to me that God was totally punking the Jews 5000 years ago, imposing the kind of rules where you had to MURDER YOUR OWN CHILDREN for petty offenses. (So much for being "Pro-Life".)

But that's okay, you can SELECTIVELY read the Bible today and choose what laws you want to ignore now.

Fine with me. I ignore all of them. Problem solved.

 

[JoeB131]

Because, Jesus made his position clear, where it came to children, noting that those who harm children would be better off tying a millstone around their neck (Gilligan a Millstone is a HUGE round rock that grind seeds into dusty mush... they weigh in by the ton.) and toss it into the sea. And the Degenerate Cult is about NOTHING except the sexual pursuit of children.

Please point out in the Gospel where Jesus specifically talked about homosexuality.

thanks.

Oh, you won't find them in the Gospels.

 

[Where_r_my_Keys]

Because, Jesus made his position clear, where it came to children, noting that those who harm children would be better off tying a millstone around their neck (Gilligan a Millstone is a HUGE round rock that grind seeds into dusty mush... they weigh in by the ton.) and toss it into the sea. And the Degenerate Cult is about NOTHING except the sexual pursuit of children.

Please point out in the Gospel where Jesus specifically talked about homosexuality.

No problem... Mathew 19, 4-5: “Have you not read that he who created them from the beginning made them male and female", and said, "Therefore a man shall leave his father and his mother and hold fast to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh".

In that, the Christ defined marriage, wherein he inherently defined human sexuality and the inevitable and singularly acceptable expression of such.

It's worth noting that he did not speak to the taking of a goat, horse, dog, cat, child, or some other semblance of receptacle such as a person of the same gender, as an expression of human sexuality... thus such is not a function of human sexuality.

thanks...

You're welcome.

 

[TyroneSlothrop]

Getting a Marriage license under Biblical rule

A man, a nonconsenting woman, and her father. Yes. According to the Law of Moses a female is male property, as are slaves, livestock and children. (See Exodus 20:17, Exodus 21:7.) Her father can give her in marriage or sell her to a slave master. Female consent in the Bible is not a prerequisite for marriage or sex.

 

[Where_r_my_Keys]

Yeah... and we're not Jews living 5000 years ago, either. And since those rules were SPECIFICALLY, ENTIRELY, WHOLLY, EXCLUSIVELY set for those Jews... there's no reason why 'we' would be subject to those rules.

Now, if God told us to start doing so, "WE" would. But, the thing is, God's more likely to set those rules on us, for Leftists... . And won't THAT be a wonderful day for all of "US".

No, ...

False.

 

[TyroneSlothrop]

aha I found the marital loophole
King James 2000 Bible
And if a man sell his daughter to be a maidservant, she shall not go out as the menservants do.

 

[Where_r_my_Keys]

... There is no God, ...

Using this reasoning, then there is no endowment from Nature's God, wherein the individual is endowed by our Creator with rights so certain, as to be self-evident... .

And it is through that feckless drivel that we can know that the individual speaking is NOT an American, as such is the most fundamental of American principle and absent the acceptance of that soundly reasoned tenet, there is no means for a person to claim themselves as an American.

The best odds are that the above would-be 'contributor', is yet another mouthy British socialist posing as a US citizen, demonstrating the Deceit, FRAUD and Ignorance common to the hollow core of the Ideological Left.

 

[Where_r_my_Keys]

The Bible God is a sociopath ...

THIS... from a sociopath.

ROFLMNAO!

You can NOT make this stuff up!

 

[Silhouette]

I can see it now at SCOTUS "your Honors, God is a sociopath; so the 1st Amendment doesn't apply; I rest my case"..