We should all be greatful for socialism/liberalism

[Skull Pilot]

Didn't you just say that it's undesirable for people to use violence instead of negotiating?

But I suppose you think violence is OK if it's end is something you want right?

Lol I never said that it was okay for those protests to become violent. Obviously those Union members should be held accountable. My point is, how is this relevant to my thread? How does it counter the overall point of my thread?

Hey you brought up violence instead of negotiations not me so maybe you should ask yourself that question

Lol and you unexplicably brought up Union protests becoming violent. What am I supposed to do with that information?

So I gave you an example of something you brought up and you can't handle it?

Lol an example that does nothing to counter the logic of the ideas I am discussing.

Of course it does

You seem to think that the whole union thing which you praise was some sort of peaceful negotiation.
It wasn't by any stretch.

And other than the fact that you like many of your ilk seem to have no idea what socialism is isn't helping your so called argument

 

[MisterBeale]

 

[Billy000]

Lol I never said that it was okay for those protests to become violent. Obviously those Union members should be held accountable. My point is, how is this relevant to my thread? How does it counter the overall point of my thread?

Hey you brought up violence instead of negotiations not me so maybe you should ask yourself that question

Lol and you unexplicably brought up Union protests becoming violent. What am I supposed to do with that information?

So I gave you an example of something you brought up and you can't handle it?

Lol an example that does nothing to counter the logic of the ideas I am discussing.

Of course it does

You seem to think that the whole union thing which you praise was some sort of peaceful negotiation.
It wasn't by any stretch.

And other than the fact that you like many of your ilk seem to have no idea what socialism is isn't helping your so called argument

Lol we both know I never said the union negotiation was peaceful.

 

[Militants]

Thinks Bernie are stronger hope for Democration than Hillary maybe strong enough.

 

[Skull Pilot]

Here's the thing

Laws establishing certain societal safety nets is not socialism. No matter what the right or the left says.

History has shown that of all the varying types of societal/ political theories out there that at least until now that one with capitalism as its core has been the most successful.

IMO Communism can work in small societies of say up to 1000 people

Libertarianism can work in slightly larger societies say of several thousands

Capitalism has worked in a large sale but honestly I think we are approaching the point where it will start losing its edge because we are introducing billions of people across many countries and it will inevitably break down somewhere

Socialism is capable of handling large scales mainly because the government can centralize so well and has an endless supply of money it can borrow or tax but socialism inevitably grinds people under its boot heel of the large scale bureaucracy needed to manage it

 

[Skull Pilot]

Hey you brought up violence instead of negotiations not me so maybe you should ask yourself that question

Lol and you unexplicably brought up Union protests becoming violent. What am I supposed to do with that information?

So I gave you an example of something you brought up and you can't handle it?

Lol an example that does nothing to counter the logic of the ideas I am discussing.

Of course it does

You seem to think that the whole union thing which you praise was some sort of peaceful negotiation.
It wasn't by any stretch.

And other than the fact that you like many of your ilk seem to have no idea what socialism is isn't helping your so called argument

Lol we both know I never said the union negotiation was peaceful.

Whatever

 

[gipper]

Careful

The op is really talking about Modern Liberalism

Socialism deals with corporate ownership by the workers. In other words, private ownership such as houses an cars, is still present, but business are in a form of shard ownership by the laborers.

State capitalism is ownership by the State. In its weakest forms, the state can own some businesses, investments and other properties. In its strongest form, Private property ownership is disallowed--all property, businesses and what have you are owned by the state.

All nations practice some form of State Capitalism. So called "Communist" nations usually take State Capitalism to the extreme.

P.S.
1. The late 20th century has proven many socialist and communist philosophers incorrect. You can not obtain socialism through revolution and State capitalism. The concentration of power is to great to "redistribute" power/property rights back among the individuals as required in Socialism. In fact, the seizing of wealth from the rich is not even a requirement of Socialism.

2. Revolution is not necessary to achieve a nearly pure Socialist system. 'in fact, many of the tools of the Free market system, such as ownership through stocks an bonds, can recreate any company into a socialized company!

3. Socialism does not resolve the so-called "economic inequality" problem. Modern Liberalism is the only known ideology that is directly focused on the issue.

4. Modern Liberalism focus on the redistribution of some power/property in order to correct the inequality found in Free market systems . How to do this in a justified manner is the core problem of Modern Liberalism. Regulations, social security an the welfare state are purely Liberal/Modern Liberal constructs.

5. The mixing of the definitions of Socialism, State Capitalism, Liberalism and Modern Liberalism is more the results of propaganda by right wingers to scare the population off from practicing any of the concepts.

In the end, there is always the practice of State Capitalism to some level. Socialism is not really a solution to economic woes. Modern Liberalism, if practiced, should be carefully monitored and highly criticized whenever exercised.

I agree with your post. However the problem is Modern Liberalism or Socialism if you like, has been a failure. That is apparent when one looks at conditions in our country. This does not mean that ALL modern liberal policies imposed on the nation the past 70-80 years are failures. But looking at the big issues, one can only conclude it is a terrible failure....

...20 trillion in debt and rising, huge unfunded liabilities, nearly 100 million Americans not working, income inequality is as high today as ever, big corps and big gov colluding for their own benefit, justice applied very unevenly, open borders allowing masses of illiterate people in causing stress on welfare programs and public services nationwide, infrastructure declining, education declining.....

 

[kaz]

If Big Business had its way In the early to mid 20th century...

There would be no "days off" for low level employees.

There would be no overtime pay.

There would be no minimum wage

If it wasn't for socialism...

We would have no military, police, firefighters...hell the list goes on and on.

Today is Thank a Socialist Day...

Let the rest of us do our part and educate Republicans on What Socialism really means.

Lord praise the government, source of all tidings great and small!

Does the Kool-aid give you an actual buzz or is it more of a numbing sensation?

You know I'm right.

Um ... I know you're right that people are nothing and we can't negotiate our own best deals, government solves our problems for us? Actually, I know you're wrong. Government makes every situation they get involved with worse

Without some basic level of law and order, people could use violence instead of negotiation to get what they want.

There you go again. In defending ubiquitous government, you choose to defend that which even a small government libertarian suppports. Yes, I support basic law and order. You argued for socialism, not a police department and courts that I support too

 

[billyerock1991]

If Big Business had its way In the early to mid 20th century...

There would be no "days off" for low level employees.

There would be no overtime pay.

There would be no minimum wage

We need liberal/progressive ideas.

If it wasn't for socialism...

We would have no military, police, firefighters...hell the list goes on and on.

Today is Thank a Socialist Day...

Let the rest of us do our part and educate Republicans on What Socialism really means.

heres the problem republicans are single minded ... when they see the word socialism they think this
a political and economic theory of social organization that advocates that the means of production, distribution, and exchange should be owned or regulated by the community as a whole....

for some reason they miss the word democrat/liberal socialism

1. a socialist system of government achieved by democratic means.

what does that mean republicans have a problem understanding the difference...
heres the difference
socialism states that the government makes the decision on how products and distribution is made ...
in a democratic socialism we the people vote on how we want something done ...say for instance college paid by the tax payer... health care paid by the tax payer ..we vote on it ... if we win the we get it done.... if we lose won't don't get it... nothing is forced on you unless you lose the vote just like it is now...... the only difference is how we pick it to be paid for

 

[kaz]

If Big Business had its way In the early to mid 20th century...

There would be no "days off" for low level employees.

There would be no overtime pay.

There would be no minimum wage

If it wasn't for socialism...

We would have no military, police, firefighters...hell the list goes on and on.

Today is Thank a Socialist Day...

Let the rest of us do our part and educate Republicans on What Socialism really means.

Lord praise the government, source of all tidings great and small!

Does the Kool-aid give you an actual buzz or is it more of a numbing sensation?

You know I'm right.

Um ... I know you're right that people are nothing and we can't negotiate our own best deals, government solves our problems for us? Actually, I know you're wrong. Government makes every situation they get involved with worse

Without some basic level of law and order, people could use violence instead of negotiation to get what they want.

You think all those Union protests of the past that you are so fond of weren't violent?

You don't need to go to "the past," just look at leftists in "Occupy Wall Street," at G-8 Summits, ...

 

[kaz]

If Big Business had its way In the early to mid 20th century...

There would be no "days off" for low level employees.

There would be no overtime pay.

There would be no minimum wage

If it wasn't for socialism...

We would have no military, police, firefighters...hell the list goes on and on.

Today is Thank a Socialist Day...

Let the rest of us do our part and educate Republicans on What Socialism really means.

liberalism does not equate to socialism. and i understand what you're saying but the wingers aren't smart enough to understand we've had a mixed economic system forever.

but i hear ya.

True. I'm a liberal, you're a socialist. Liberals want freedom from government making our choices for us, you demand they do it. There is nothing we have in common

 

[kaz]

Lord praise the government, source of all tidings great and small!

Does the Kool-aid give you an actual buzz or is it more of a numbing sensation?

You know I'm right.

Um ... I know you're right that people are nothing and we can't negotiate our own best deals, government solves our problems for us? Actually, I know you're wrong. Government makes every situation they get involved with worse

Without some basic level of law and order, people could use violence instead of negotiation to get what they want.

You think all those Union protests of the past that you are so fond of weren't violent?

Lol people are people. What difference does it make if it happened at Union protests? How does that possibly devalue the need for law and order?

Exactly, the Trump protesters should be prosecuted for assault

 

[Billy000]

If Big Business had its way In the early to mid 20th century...

There would be no "days off" for low level employees.

There would be no overtime pay.

There would be no minimum wage

If it wasn't for socialism...

We would have no military, police, firefighters...hell the list goes on and on.

Today is Thank a Socialist Day...

Let the rest of us do our part and educate Republicans on What Socialism really means.

Lord praise the government, source of all tidings great and small!

Does the Kool-aid give you an actual buzz or is it more of a numbing sensation?

You know I'm right.

Um ... I know you're right that people are nothing and we can't negotiate our own best deals, government solves our problems for us? Actually, I know you're wrong. Government makes every situation they get involved with worse

Without some basic level of law and order, people could use violence instead of negotiation to get what they want.

There you go again. In defending ubiquitous government, you choose to defend that which even a small government libertarian suppports. Yes, I support basic law and order. You argued for socialism, not a police department and courts that I support too

Lol Christ man any program funded by tax payers is SOCIALISM.

 

[billyerock1991]

Lol I never said that it was okay for those protests to become violent. Obviously those Union members should be held accountable. My point is, how is this relevant to my thread? How does it counter the overall point of my thread?

Hey you brought up violence instead of negotiations not me so maybe you should ask yourself that question

Lol and you unexplicably brought up Union protests becoming violent. What am I supposed to do with that information?

So I gave you an example of something you brought up and you can't handle it?

Lol an example that does nothing to counter the logic of the ideas I am discussing.

Of course it does

You seem to think that the whole union thing which you praise was some sort of peaceful negotiation.
It wasn't by any stretch.

And other than the fact that you like many of your ilk seem to have no idea what socialism is isn't helping your so called argument

it is you who doesn't know the difference between democratic socialism and socialism

 

[billyerock1991]

Lord praise the government, source of all tidings great and small!

Does the Kool-aid give you an actual buzz or is it more of a numbing sensation?

You know I'm right.

Um ... I know you're right that people are nothing and we can't negotiate our own best deals, government solves our problems for us? Actually, I know you're wrong. Government makes every situation they get involved with worse

Without some basic level of law and order, people could use violence instead of negotiation to get what they want.

There you go again. In defending ubiquitous government, you choose to defend that which even a small government libertarian suppports. Yes, I support basic law and order. You argued for socialism, not a police department and courts that I support too

Lol Christ man any program funded by tax payers is SOCIALISM.

he does make you laugh... some time I feel sorry for Kaz... how can one person be so stupid... he hasn't any idea the difference between democratic socialism and socialism it self... he thinks if we become a democratic socialistic county we will be like the USSR,which by they way no longer exist but thats what he thinks...
he thinks social security is a government paid program ... poor KAZ some day he'll look back and think, "was I this stupid"

 

[billyerock1991]

If Big Business had its way In the early to mid 20th century...

There would be no "days off" for low level employees.

There would be no overtime pay.

There would be no minimum wage

If it wasn't for socialism...

We would have no military, police, firefighters...hell the list goes on and on.

Today is Thank a Socialist Day...

Let the rest of us do our part and educate Republicans on What Socialism really means.

liberalism does not equate to socialism. and i understand what you're saying but the wingers aren't smart enough to understand we've had a mixed economic system forever.

but i hear ya.

True. I'm a liberal, you're a socialist. Liberals want freedom from government making our choices for us, you demand they do it. There is nothing we have in common

can you tell us what government choices have our government taken from us

 

[jillian]

If Big Business had its way In the early to mid 20th century...

There would be no "days off" for low level employees.

There would be no overtime pay.

There would be no minimum wage

If it wasn't for socialism...

We would have no military, police, firefighters...hell the list goes on and on.

Today is Thank a Socialist Day...

Let the rest of us do our part and educate Republicans on What Socialism really means.

liberalism does not equate to socialism. and i understand what you're saying but the wingers aren't smart enough to understand we've had a mixed economic system forever.

but i hear ya.

True. I'm a liberal, you're a socialist. Liberals want freedom from government making our choices for us, you demand they do it. There is nothing we have in common

can you tell us what government choices have our government taken from us

they have to serve blacks and gays.

it makes them sad

 

[Dale Smith]

If Big Business had its way In the early to mid 20th century...

There would be no "days off" for low level employees.

There would be no overtime pay.

There would be no minimum wage

If it wasn't for socialism...

We would have no military, police, firefighters, or health regulations...hell the list goes on and on.

Today is Thank a Socialist Day...

Let the rest of us do our part and educate Republicans on What Socialism really means.

USA.INC is the majority shareholder in every Fortune 500 corporation and their subsidiaries. You might want to do a little legwork on the CAFRs (Comprehension Annual Financial Report) while USA.INC pleads poverty and claim they need to raise taxes while cutting back on services, they are actually sitting on 60 TRILLION dollars in wealth. So if socialism is "da gubermint" owning corporations? Congrats to you.....we made it.

Lol you do know that any government expense is meant to be paid for with taxes right? Even before Bush and Obama's crazy defense spending, we would have faced a deficit black hole without corporate taxes. Of course, you also must take into account the EFFECTIVE tax rate on corporations which is 12%. Many corporations pay 0% in federal taxes per year because of loopholes.

Your lack of understanding on how things REALLY work totally astounds me. Why would major corporations pay taxes when the majority shareholders is USA.INC?That would affect THEIR bottom line. You have no clue about the Federal Reserve Central bankers and how they own this friggin' country. They laugh at stupid fucks like you....seriously.

 

[billyerock1991]

If Big Business had its way In the early to mid 20th century...

There would be no "days off" for low level employees.

There would be no overtime pay.

There would be no minimum wage

If it wasn't for socialism...

We would have no military, police, firefighters...hell the list goes on and on.

Today is Thank a Socialist Day...

Let the rest of us do our part and educate Republicans on What Socialism really means.

liberalism does not equate to socialism. and i understand what you're saying but the wingers aren't smart enough to understand we've had a mixed economic system forever.

but i hear ya.

True. I'm a liberal, you're a socialist. Liberals want freedom from government making our choices for us, you demand they do it. There is nothing we have in common

can you tell us what government choices have our government taken from us

they have to serve blacks and gays.

it makes them sad

this is true, so does this make our government a socialist government

 

[Dale Smith]

If Big Business had its way In the early to mid 20th century...

There would be no "days off" for low level employees.

There would be no overtime pay.

There would be no minimum wage

If it wasn't for socialism...

We would have no military, police, firefighters...hell the list goes on and on.

Today is Thank a Socialist Day...

Let the rest of us do our part and educate Republicans on What Socialism really means.

liberalism does not equate to socialism. and i understand what you're saying but the wingers aren't smart enough to understand we've had a mixed economic system forever.

but i hear ya.

True. I'm a liberal, you're a socialist. Liberals want freedom from government making our choices for us, you demand they do it. There is nothing we have in common

can you tell us what government choices have our government taken from us

they have to serve blacks and gays.

it makes them sad

When you have no argument, play the race and queer card........it's what a good littler liberal does when they haven't the foggiest clue on how the system really works. Ignorance is their bestest friend.