What human cost is acceptable in controling illegal immigration?

[Flopper]

Can you explain what is cruel about it?

That's one of the first things Trump did. But if your boat is sinking, you can't expect to get anywhere by bailing out the water with a pail unless you fix the hole first.

Democrats are stopping any and all efforts to manually secure the border. Blame them.

Funny thing is, she says, "Fund more judges to speed up hearings and deportations", like it's some brilliant alternative she's come up with that no one else saw, because her leftism makes her so superior and more compassionate, but HER OWN DAMNED LINK said that that's the cornerstone of the program she's bitching about. If she had bothered to read more than the headline before shouting, "Eureka! Something else I can hate Trump for!" she would know that.

Sorry, I never claimed credit for that, it's been in the news. You need get to out more. Meanwhile, please feel to extol the virtues of ripping babies from the arms of their mothers in hour effort to "stop" illegal immigration. A pity you can't put all that energy into stopping rape and murder and child abuse. Oops. You support child abuse don't you? Never mind then. Your warped priorities will hopefuly be just another page in our countries book of shame in a few years.

On the second offense it is a felony..........and those get put into prison with some very bad people.........Let's put the children into prison with drug traffickers and Human Traffickers.

In the Omnibus they only gave Trump half what he requested for more beds.
They also weren't so nice on implementing E-Verify............didn't give enough for more judges but more judges for immigration courts did happen..........

Everything some have complained about here was proposed.................

Want more beds and speedy trials.............how about voting to fund it.

Sure. But I sure as hell won't vote for tearing children from their families. Strange but - that wasn't necessary before. Nor was it the policy. Now suddenly, it must be done. And folks pretend it's for the good of the children. I say bullshit on that. Not when there are other accommodations for families.

Obama hadn't advertised the fact that we would let illegals with children get a free pass before.

Human trafficking and child smuggling has become epidemic. And it's because of people like you.

Parents bring their kids to America seeking protection for their family from violence and poverty is not human trafficking.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Funny thing is, she says, "Fund more judges to speed up hearings and deportations", like it's some brilliant alternative she's come up with that no one else saw, because her leftism makes her so superior and more compassionate, but HER OWN DAMNED LINK said that that's the cornerstone of the program she's bitching about. If she had bothered to read more than the headline before shouting, "Eureka! Something else I can hate Trump for!" she would know that.

Sorry, I never claimed credit for that, it's been in the news. You need get to out more. Meanwhile, please feel to extol the virtues of ripping babies from the arms of their mothers in hour effort to "stop" illegal immigration. A pity you can't put all that energy into stopping rape and murder and child abuse. Oops. You support child abuse don't you? Never mind then. Your warped priorities will hopefuly be just another page in our countries book of shame in a few years.

On the second offense it is a felony..........and those get put into prison with some very bad people.........Let's put the children into prison with drug traffickers and Human Traffickers.

In the Omnibus they only gave Trump half what he requested for more beds.
They also weren't so nice on implementing E-Verify............didn't give enough for more judges but more judges for immigration courts did happen..........

Everything some have complained about here was proposed.................

Want more beds and speedy trials.............how about voting to fund it.

Sure. But I sure as hell won't vote for tearing children from their families. Strange but - that wasn't necessary before. Nor was it the policy. Now suddenly, it must be done. And folks pretend it's for the good of the children. I say bullshit on that. Not when there are other accommodations for families.

Obama hadn't advertised the fact that we would let illegals with children get a free pass before.

Human trafficking and child smuggling has become epidemic. And it's because of people like you.

Parent bring their kids to America seeking protection for their family from violence and poverty is not human trafficking.

So again I ask, if they bring illegal narcotics with them, is that not drug trafficking?

 

[pismoe]

third worlders should learn to build decent societies Flopper .

As long as they have a place to flock to, these countries are nothing but breeding grounds for future US troubles.

Our country didn't come effortlessly either. We had to fight a lot of wars, sometimes killing each other. Freedom is something that costs a lot of lives. It's about time people in these countries start fighting for themselves, otherwise in 100 years, they will still be coming here.

Most of us have never had to.

Nor have we lived under the conditions and violence in those countries. In fact many of us have ancestors that came here fleeing those kinds of things.

Sure sounds like a nice story though.

It's not a story. Ever hear of the Civil War?

Just because most of us never had to doesn't mean nobody did. We lost a lot of Americans to create and maintain this great place we call America. But that doesn't mean this great place is open to the world. What you want is never ending immigration until the point these people take over our country and turn it into one of theirs which will happen if we don't have massive restrictions on our borders.

We don't have 12 million illegals here because we did enough, we have them because at times we didn't do anything. It's about time we start.

What you are saying is exactly what was said about every other immigration group - they don't assimilate. Yet they do. I'm tired of the constant (and false) argument that if I oppose certain policies I MUST be for open borders and unrestricted immigration.

I'm not.

------------------------------------- USA has a census population of right around 310 million in 2010 . And thats not counting illegals . Thats enough for the USA no matter what you support or don't support Coyote .

 

[Coyote]

Sorry, I never claimed credit for that, it's been in the news. You need get to out more. Meanwhile, please feel to extol the virtues of ripping babies from the arms of their mothers in hour effort to "stop" illegal immigration. A pity you can't put all that energy into stopping rape and murder and child abuse. Oops. You support child abuse don't you? Never mind then. Your warped priorities will hopefuly be just another page in our countries book of shame in a few years.

On the second offense it is a felony..........and those get put into prison with some very bad people.........Let's put the children into prison with drug traffickers and Human Traffickers.

In the Omnibus they only gave Trump half what he requested for more beds.
They also weren't so nice on implementing E-Verify............didn't give enough for more judges but more judges for immigration courts did happen..........

Everything some have complained about here was proposed.................

Want more beds and speedy trials.............how about voting to fund it.

Sure. But I sure as hell won't vote for tearing children from their families. Strange but - that wasn't necessary before. Nor was it the policy. Now suddenly, it must be done. And folks pretend it's for the good of the children. I say bullshit on that. Not when there are other accommodations for families.

Obama hadn't advertised the fact that we would let illegals with children get a free pass before.

Human trafficking and child smuggling has become epidemic. And it's because of people like you.

Parent bring their kids to America seeking protection for their family from violence and poverty is not human trafficking.

So again I ask, if they bring illegal narcotics with them, is that not drug trafficking?

No.

Drug trafficking involves trade in illegal drugs - cultivation, manufacture, distribution and sale. If they are bringing illegal drugs with them with the intent to distribute and sell, then yes - it is drug trafficking.

Human trafficking involves trade in humans for the purposes of slavery, sexual exploitation or forced labor.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

third worlders should learn to build decent societies Flopper .

As long as they have a place to flock to, these countries are nothing but breeding grounds for future US troubles.

Our country didn't come effortlessly either. We had to fight a lot of wars, sometimes killing each other. Freedom is something that costs a lot of lives. It's about time people in these countries start fighting for themselves, otherwise in 100 years, they will still be coming here.

Most of us have never had to.

Nor have we lived under the conditions and violence in those countries. In fact many of us have ancestors that came here fleeing those kinds of things.

Sure sounds like a nice story though.

It's not a story. Ever hear of the Civil War?

Just because most of us never had to doesn't mean nobody did. We lost a lot of Americans to create and maintain this great place we call America. But that doesn't mean this great place is open to the world. What you want is never ending immigration until the point these people take over our country and turn it into one of theirs which will happen if we don't have massive restrictions on our borders.

We don't have 12 million illegals here because we did enough, we have them because at times we didn't do anything. It's about time we start.

What you are saying is exactly what was said about every other immigration group - they don't assimilate. Yet they do. I'm tired of the constant (and false) argument that if I oppose certain policies I MUST be for open borders and unrestricted immigration.

I'm not.

Oh, sure they assimilate. Why didn't I have to press 1 on my phone to speak our language 20 years ago? Why were signs on the doors in English only 20 years ago and not today? Why do they ask me what language I want my ballot in when I vote; something they never had to ask 20 years ago?

I'm a truck driver and run into a lot of foreigners who are taking American jobs and keeping our wages low. Many of them don't know a word of English, yet they are on the road driving right next to your minivan on our highways with a 75,000 lbs killing machine.

Many of them are not assimilating. They are changing our country instead.

 

[Coyote]

Funny thing is, she says, "Fund more judges to speed up hearings and deportations", like it's some brilliant alternative she's come up with that no one else saw, because her leftism makes her so superior and more compassionate, but HER OWN DAMNED LINK said that that's the cornerstone of the program she's bitching about. If she had bothered to read more than the headline before shouting, "Eureka! Something else I can hate Trump for!" she would know that.

Sorry, I never claimed credit for that, it's been in the news. You need get to out more. Meanwhile, please feel to extol the virtues of ripping babies from the arms of their mothers in hour effort to "stop" illegal immigration. A pity you can't put all that energy into stopping rape and murder and child abuse. Oops. You support child abuse don't you? Never mind then. Your warped priorities will hopefuly be just another page in our countries book of shame in a few years.

On the second offense it is a felony..........and those get put into prison with some very bad people.........Let's put the children into prison with drug traffickers and Human Traffickers.

In the Omnibus they only gave Trump half what he requested for more beds.
They also weren't so nice on implementing E-Verify............didn't give enough for more judges but more judges for immigration courts did happen..........

Everything some have complained about here was proposed.................

Want more beds and speedy trials.............how about voting to fund it.

Sure. But I sure as hell won't vote for tearing children from their families. Strange but - that wasn't necessary before. Nor was it the policy. Now suddenly, it must be done. And folks pretend it's for the good of the children. I say bullshit on that. Not when there are other accommodations for families.

Obama hadn't advertised the fact that we would let illegals with children get a free pass before.

Human trafficking and child smuggling has become epidemic. And it's because of people like you.

Parent bring their kids to America seeking protection for their family from violence and poverty is not human trafficking.

The definition of trafficking is getting stretched to the point of absurd. According to this logic, for example - if a parent smuggled their child into a restaurant that didn't allow children, they would be engaged in human trafficking.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

On the second offense it is a felony..........and those get put into prison with some very bad people.........Let's put the children into prison with drug traffickers and Human Traffickers.

In the Omnibus they only gave Trump half what he requested for more beds.
They also weren't so nice on implementing E-Verify............didn't give enough for more judges but more judges for immigration courts did happen..........

Everything some have complained about here was proposed.................

Want more beds and speedy trials.............how about voting to fund it.

Sure. But I sure as hell won't vote for tearing children from their families. Strange but - that wasn't necessary before. Nor was it the policy. Now suddenly, it must be done. And folks pretend it's for the good of the children. I say bullshit on that. Not when there are other accommodations for families.

Obama hadn't advertised the fact that we would let illegals with children get a free pass before.

Human trafficking and child smuggling has become epidemic. And it's because of people like you.

Parent bring their kids to America seeking protection for their family from violence and poverty is not human trafficking.

So again I ask, if they bring illegal narcotics with them, is that not drug trafficking?

No.

Drug trafficking involves trade in illegal drugs - cultivation, manufacture, distribution and sale. If they are bringing illegal drugs with them with the intent to distribute and sell, then yes - it is drug trafficking.

Human trafficking involves trade in humans for the purposes of slavery, sexual exploitation or forced labor.

So if a foreigner comes here with a pound of heroin, he is not drug trafficking? Yet if he comes here with an illegal kid, he's not human trafficking?

 

[Coyote]

third worlders should learn to build decent societies Flopper .

As long as they have a place to flock to, these countries are nothing but breeding grounds for future US troubles.

Our country didn't come effortlessly either. We had to fight a lot of wars, sometimes killing each other. Freedom is something that costs a lot of lives. It's about time people in these countries start fighting for themselves, otherwise in 100 years, they will still be coming here.

Most of us have never had to.

Nor have we lived under the conditions and violence in those countries. In fact many of us have ancestors that came here fleeing those kinds of things.

Sure sounds like a nice story though.

It's not a story. Ever hear of the Civil War?

Just because most of us never had to doesn't mean nobody did. We lost a lot of Americans to create and maintain this great place we call America. But that doesn't mean this great place is open to the world. What you want is never ending immigration until the point these people take over our country and turn it into one of theirs which will happen if we don't have massive restrictions on our borders.

We don't have 12 million illegals here because we did enough, we have them because at times we didn't do anything. It's about time we start.

What you are saying is exactly what was said about every other immigration group - they don't assimilate. Yet they do. I'm tired of the constant (and false) argument that if I oppose certain policies I MUST be for open borders and unrestricted immigration.

I'm not.

Oh, sure they assimilate. Why didn't I have to press 1 on my phone to speak our language 20 years ago? Why were signs on the doors in English only 20 years ago and not today? Why do they ask me what language I want my ballot in when I vote; something they never had to ask 20 years ago?

I'm a truck driver and run into a lot of foreigners who are taking American jobs and keeping our wages low. Many of them don't know a word of English, yet they are on the road driving right next to your minivan on our highways with a 75,000 lbs killing machine.

Many of them are not assimilating. They are changing our country instead.

Yes, they eventually assimilate. There were foreign language newspapers, signs, stores etc in immigrant enclaves. Chinatown, the Yiddish of the East European Jews, Japanese, Italians. There is no evidence that immigrants today assimilate any less than immigrants yesterday and the arguments made back then were exactly the same.

 

[Coyote]

Sure. But I sure as hell won't vote for tearing children from their families. Strange but - that wasn't necessary before. Nor was it the policy. Now suddenly, it must be done. And folks pretend it's for the good of the children. I say bullshit on that. Not when there are other accommodations for families.

Obama hadn't advertised the fact that we would let illegals with children get a free pass before.

Human trafficking and child smuggling has become epidemic. And it's because of people like you.

Parent bring their kids to America seeking protection for their family from violence and poverty is not human trafficking.

So again I ask, if they bring illegal narcotics with them, is that not drug trafficking?

No.

Drug trafficking involves trade in illegal drugs - cultivation, manufacture, distribution and sale. If they are bringing illegal drugs with them with the intent to distribute and sell, then yes - it is drug trafficking.

Human trafficking involves trade in humans for the purposes of slavery, sexual exploitation or forced labor.

So if a foreigner comes here with a pound of heroin, he is not drug trafficking? Yet if he comes here with an illegal kid, he's not human trafficking?

If he is coming in with a pound of heroin do you honestly think it's for his own personal use? I can assure you the DEA will not think so. He is trafficking.

If a foreigner comes in with a kid chances are very high it is his/her kid, but immigration authorities are trained to spot possible human trafficking. You don't just assume every family is a trafficker and rip away their kids. Honestly this kind of argument is nothing more then a cover to justify this policy. They aren't seriously worried about traffickers. Sessions and Trump specifically stated WHY they are doing it, to act as a deterrant to illegal immigrants (including legal asylum speakers). It's not about trafficking - that's just a feel-good claim to support a horrible policy.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Obama hadn't advertised the fact that we would let illegals with children get a free pass before.

Human trafficking and child smuggling has become epidemic. And it's because of people like you.

Parent bring their kids to America seeking protection for their family from violence and poverty is not human trafficking.

So again I ask, if they bring illegal narcotics with them, is that not drug trafficking?

No.

Drug trafficking involves trade in illegal drugs - cultivation, manufacture, distribution and sale. If they are bringing illegal drugs with them with the intent to distribute and sell, then yes - it is drug trafficking.

Human trafficking involves trade in humans for the purposes of slavery, sexual exploitation or forced labor.

So if a foreigner comes here with a pound of heroin, he is not drug trafficking? Yet if he comes here with an illegal kid, he's not human trafficking?

If he is coming in with a pound of heroin do you honestly think it's for his own personal use? I can assure you the DEA will not think so. He is trafficking.

If a foreigner comes in with a kid chances are very high it is his/her kid, but immigration authorities are trained to spot possible human trafficking. You don't just assume every family is a trafficker and rip away their kids. Honestly this kind of argument is nothing more then a cover to justify this policy. They aren't seriously worried about traffickers. Sessions and Trump specifically stated WHY they are doing it, to act as a deterrant to illegal immigrants (including legal asylum speakers). It's not about trafficking - that's just a feel-good claim to support a horrible policy.

Actually what I read is that Trump and Sessions are denying it has anything to do with being a deterrent.

So let's say a foreigner tries to get into this country with an ounce of heroin. You don't think he'll be arrested and sentenced?

If you are bringing a child into this country illegally, that is against our laws just like if you bring in any amount of recreation narcotics into this country.

 

[Coyote]

Parent bring their kids to America seeking protection for their family from violence and poverty is not human trafficking.

So again I ask, if they bring illegal narcotics with them, is that not drug trafficking?

No.

Drug trafficking involves trade in illegal drugs - cultivation, manufacture, distribution and sale. If they are bringing illegal drugs with them with the intent to distribute and sell, then yes - it is drug trafficking.

Human trafficking involves trade in humans for the purposes of slavery, sexual exploitation or forced labor.

So if a foreigner comes here with a pound of heroin, he is not drug trafficking? Yet if he comes here with an illegal kid, he's not human trafficking?

If he is coming in with a pound of heroin do you honestly think it's for his own personal use? I can assure you the DEA will not think so. He is trafficking.

If a foreigner comes in with a kid chances are very high it is his/her kid, but immigration authorities are trained to spot possible human trafficking. You don't just assume every family is a trafficker and rip away their kids. Honestly this kind of argument is nothing more then a cover to justify this policy. They aren't seriously worried about traffickers. Sessions and Trump specifically stated WHY they are doing it, to act as a deterrant to illegal immigrants (including legal asylum speakers). It's not about trafficking - that's just a feel-good claim to support a horrible policy.

Actually what I read is that Trump and Sessions are denying it has anything to do with being a deterrent.

So let's say a foreigner tries to get into this country with an ounce of heroin. You don't think he'll be arrested and sentenced?

If you are bringing a child into this country illegally, that is against our laws just like if you bring in any amount of recreation narcotics into this country.

How the Trump Administration Got Comfortable Separating Immigrant Kids from Their Parents

Two months into Donald Trump’s Presidency, John Kelly, then the Secretary of Homeland Security, publicly confirmed that his department was considering separating immigrant parents from their children at the border, as a way of discouraging families from crossing illegally.​

They openly said that was their intent. Now they are lying about it?

Bringing YOUR child into the country illegally is not the same as human trafficking. That's like arguing that jaywalking is the same as murder.

And likewise, with the heroin - yes, you will be arrested for bringing in an ounce of heroin, but you will not be charged with drug trafficking. No one is saying you would not be arrested for possession. You are trying to confuse the terms.

 

[Flopper]

third worlders should learn to build decent societies Flopper .

It's easy to sit in relative luxury and peace and pontificate on why the Third World doesn't fix it's on problems. If you spend all of your time avoiding starvation and keeping a roof over the head of your family there is no time to build a decent society.

We never built a decent society we inherited it from immigrants that came here from all over the world to grow and prosper in the richest nation on earth.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

So again I ask, if they bring illegal narcotics with them, is that not drug trafficking?

No.

Drug trafficking involves trade in illegal drugs - cultivation, manufacture, distribution and sale. If they are bringing illegal drugs with them with the intent to distribute and sell, then yes - it is drug trafficking.

Human trafficking involves trade in humans for the purposes of slavery, sexual exploitation or forced labor.

So if a foreigner comes here with a pound of heroin, he is not drug trafficking? Yet if he comes here with an illegal kid, he's not human trafficking?

If he is coming in with a pound of heroin do you honestly think it's for his own personal use? I can assure you the DEA will not think so. He is trafficking.

If a foreigner comes in with a kid chances are very high it is his/her kid, but immigration authorities are trained to spot possible human trafficking. You don't just assume every family is a trafficker and rip away their kids. Honestly this kind of argument is nothing more then a cover to justify this policy. They aren't seriously worried about traffickers. Sessions and Trump specifically stated WHY they are doing it, to act as a deterrant to illegal immigrants (including legal asylum speakers). It's not about trafficking - that's just a feel-good claim to support a horrible policy.

Actually what I read is that Trump and Sessions are denying it has anything to do with being a deterrent.

So let's say a foreigner tries to get into this country with an ounce of heroin. You don't think he'll be arrested and sentenced?

If you are bringing a child into this country illegally, that is against our laws just like if you bring in any amount of recreation narcotics into this country.

How the Trump Administration Got Comfortable Separating Immigrant Kids from Their Parents

Two months into Donald Trump’s Presidency, John Kelly, then the Secretary of Homeland Security, publicly confirmed that his department was considering separating immigrant parents from their children at the border, as a way of discouraging families from crossing illegally.​

They openly said that was their intent. Now they are lying about it?

Bringing YOUR child into the country illegally is not the same as human trafficking. That's like arguing that jaywalking is the same as murder.

And likewise, with the heroin - yes, you will be arrested for bringing in an ounce of heroin, but you will not be charged with drug trafficking. No one is saying you would not be arrested for possession. You are trying to confuse the terms.

From your article:

Hamilton told us that over the next few days we’d need to generate paperwork laying out everything we could do to deter immigrants from coming to the U.S. illegally,” a person who attended the meeting told me.

He said, she said, but nothing that is outlined in policy.

As for the similarities between bringing in heroin or children, both are illegal. We have no idea what you brought the heroin in for like we have no idea what you brought the children here for. What we do know is that you're not supposed to do either so they are removed from your possession.

As great as this country is, we have enough of our own problems. We have race problems, violence problems, medical care problems, debt problems. And we will solve our problems without foreigners. We will work on our problems without you, and you work on your problems without us. But don't bring your problems here and then complain how we handle them. We didn't want your problems in the first place. You forced your problems onto us.

And if these people don't like the way we handle the problems they brought us, the solution is simple: don't bring us anymore of your problems.

 

[Flopper]

Sorry, I never claimed credit for that, it's been in the news. You need get to out more. Meanwhile, please feel to extol the virtues of ripping babies from the arms of their mothers in hour effort to "stop" illegal immigration. A pity you can't put all that energy into stopping rape and murder and child abuse. Oops. You support child abuse don't you? Never mind then. Your warped priorities will hopefuly be just another page in our countries book of shame in a few years.

On the second offense it is a felony..........and those get put into prison with some very bad people.........Let's put the children into prison with drug traffickers and Human Traffickers.

In the Omnibus they only gave Trump half what he requested for more beds.
They also weren't so nice on implementing E-Verify............didn't give enough for more judges but more judges for immigration courts did happen..........

Everything some have complained about here was proposed.................

Want more beds and speedy trials.............how about voting to fund it.

Sure. But I sure as hell won't vote for tearing children from their families. Strange but - that wasn't necessary before. Nor was it the policy. Now suddenly, it must be done. And folks pretend it's for the good of the children. I say bullshit on that. Not when there are other accommodations for families.

Obama hadn't advertised the fact that we would let illegals with children get a free pass before.

Human trafficking and child smuggling has become epidemic. And it's because of people like you.

Parent bring their kids to America seeking protection for their family from violence and poverty is not human trafficking.

So again I ask, if they bring illegal narcotics with them, is that not drug trafficking?

It’s not drug trafficking, but fears of gang violence at home and poverty that brings most illegal immigrants to the settle in the US. Drug traffickers have little interest in living the US. They run drugs across the boarder and return to Central and South America where they can live like kings. They are not part of 11 million undocumented immigrants in America.

Data on immigrants and crime are incomplete, but a range of studies show there is no evidence immigrants commit more crimes than native-born Americans. In fact, first-generation immigrants are predisposed to lower crime rates than native-born Americans. (The Center for Immigration Studies, which advocates for restrictive immigration laws, has a detailed report showing the shortfalls of immigrant crime data.)

It is true that many undocumented immigrants seek employment in less that legal enterprises but that is not because of their past are the fact they are in America but rather because they are undocumented which limits job and educational opportunities as well the opportunity to assimilate into American society.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

On the second offense it is a felony..........and those get put into prison with some very bad people.........Let's put the children into prison with drug traffickers and Human Traffickers.

In the Omnibus they only gave Trump half what he requested for more beds.
They also weren't so nice on implementing E-Verify............didn't give enough for more judges but more judges for immigration courts did happen..........

Everything some have complained about here was proposed.................

Want more beds and speedy trials.............how about voting to fund it.

Sure. But I sure as hell won't vote for tearing children from their families. Strange but - that wasn't necessary before. Nor was it the policy. Now suddenly, it must be done. And folks pretend it's for the good of the children. I say bullshit on that. Not when there are other accommodations for families.

Obama hadn't advertised the fact that we would let illegals with children get a free pass before.

Human trafficking and child smuggling has become epidemic. And it's because of people like you.

Parent bring their kids to America seeking protection for their family from violence and poverty is not human trafficking.

So again I ask, if they bring illegal narcotics with them, is that not drug trafficking?

It’s not drug trafficking, but fears of gang violence at home and poverty that brings most illegal immigrants to the settle in the US. Drug traffickers have little interest in living the US. They run drugs across the boarder and return to Central and South America where they can live like kings. They are not part of 11 million undocumented immigrants in America.

Data on immigrants and crime are incomplete, but a range of studies show there is no evidence immigrants commit more crimes than native-born Americans. In fact, first-generation immigrants are predisposed to lower crime rates than native-born Americans. (The Center for Immigration Studies, which advocates for restrictive immigration laws, has a detailed report showing the shortfalls of immigrant crime data.)

It is true that many undocumented immigrants seek employment in less that legal enterprises but that is not because of their past are the fact they are in America but rather because they are undocumented which limits job and educational opportunities as well the opportunity to assimilate into American society.

Illegal immigrants responsible for almost three-fourths of federal drug possession sentences in 2014

Report: Illegals Committed 600,000 Crimes in Texas in 6 Yrs

Illegals commit crimes at double the rate of native-born: Study

 

[protectionist]

Entering the country illegally is a misdeamener. You realize that don't you?

1. Not if it's a second offense or more. Those are felonies punishable by 2 YEARS imprisonment, for each offense.

2. We could ask the question >> if an American couple are arrested for some white collar misdemeanor, and are sentenced to 6 months in a federal prison, and they have a 1 year old child, should that kid should be in their prison cell with them, for that 6 months time ? (so as to prevent their separation ?)

 

[protectionist]

Fifty years ago, my step father got a second DUI, which was a felony in our state. In Protectionist's world, the whole family would have served time. Separately, of course.

I don't know how you managed to come up with that very oddball notion. I'm one of the ones who see separation of family members as the ordinary procedure.

It's the liberals demanding togetherness, that would fit the scenario you describe.

 

[Flopper]

Sure. But I sure as hell won't vote for tearing children from their families. Strange but - that wasn't necessary before. Nor was it the policy. Now suddenly, it must be done. And folks pretend it's for the good of the children. I say bullshit on that. Not when there are other accommodations for families.

Obama hadn't advertised the fact that we would let illegals with children get a free pass before.

Human trafficking and child smuggling has become epidemic. And it's because of people like you.

Parent bring their kids to America seeking protection for their family from violence and poverty is not human trafficking.

So again I ask, if they bring illegal narcotics with them, is that not drug trafficking?

It’s not drug trafficking, but fears of gang violence at home and poverty that brings most illegal immigrants to the settle in the US. Drug traffickers have little interest in living the US. They run drugs across the boarder and return to Central and South America where they can live like kings. They are not part of 11 million undocumented immigrants in America.

Data on immigrants and crime are incomplete, but a range of studies show there is no evidence immigrants commit more crimes than native-born Americans. In fact, first-generation immigrants are predisposed to lower crime rates than native-born Americans. (The Center for Immigration Studies, which advocates for restrictive immigration laws, has a detailed report showing the shortfalls of immigrant crime data.)

It is true that many undocumented immigrants seek employment in less that legal enterprises but that is not because of their past are the fact they are in America but rather because they are undocumented which limits job and educational opportunities as well the opportunity to assimilate into American society.

Illegal immigrants responsible for almost three-fourths of federal drug possession sentences in 2014

Report: Illegals Committed 600,000 Crimes in Texas in 6 Yrs

Illegals commit crimes at double the rate of native-born: Study

You're picking age groups, states and time frames to support your contention plus the fact that every illegal immigrant is guilty of a crime just by being here.

 

[Andylusion]

third worlders should learn to build decent societies Flopper .

As long as they have a place to flock to, these countries are nothing but breeding grounds for future US troubles.

Our country didn't come effortlessly either. We had to fight a lot of wars, sometimes killing each other. Freedom is something that costs a lot of lives. It's about time people in these countries start fighting for themselves, otherwise in 100 years, they will still be coming here.

Most of us have never had to.

Nor have we lived under the conditions and violence in those countries. In fact many of us have ancestors that came here fleeing those kinds of things.

Sure sounds like a nice story though.

It's not a story. Ever hear of the Civil War?

Just because most of us never had to doesn't mean nobody did. We lost a lot of Americans to create and maintain this great place we call America. But that doesn't mean this great place is open to the world. What you want is never ending immigration until the point these people take over our country and turn it into one of theirs which will happen if we don't have massive restrictions on our borders.

We don't have 12 million illegals here because we did enough, we have them because at times we didn't do anything. It's about time we start.

What you are saying is exactly what was said about every other immigration group - they don't assimilate. Yet they do. I'm tired of the constant (and false) argument that if I oppose certain policies I MUST be for open borders and unrestricted immigration.

I'm not.

Oh, sure they assimilate. Why didn't I have to press 1 on my phone to speak our language 20 years ago? Why were signs on the doors in English only 20 years ago and not today? Why do they ask me what language I want my ballot in when I vote; something they never had to ask 20 years ago?

I'm a truck driver and run into a lot of foreigners who are taking American jobs and keeping our wages low. Many of them don't know a word of English, yet they are on the road driving right next to your minivan on our highways with a 75,000 lbs killing machine.

Many of them are not assimilating. They are changing our country instead.

On this I actually agree with Ray.

If you immigrate to Germany, you are required.... REQUIRED.... to learn German. It's not an option. You must do it.

If you go to Denmark, you are required to learn how to swim with co-eds. It's not an option. You must do it.

Why? Because in Germany they speak German, and you need to learn German to be a productive useful citizen that is not a burden on the country. Because in Denmark, there are waterways everywhere, and in order to both be able to save yourself, and your fellow citizens, no matter what gender you are, or they are, you need to know how to swim and save people.

I mention both of these, because both of these countries have deported immigrants who refused to learn German, or learn how to swim with co-eds.

There was some Muslim women that went to Denmark with her family, but refused to learn how to swim. They shipped her butt back to where she came from, and rightly so. There was a Muslim man who refused to learn German because Arabic is all he needed. They shipped his butt back to where he came from.

So where I differ from the right-wingers on here, is that I have no problem at all, with immigrants coming to this country. I find most of the immigrants, with some exceptions, to be wonderful people that I love coming here, and I am particular to Christian immigrants.

However, where I agree with the right-wing completely and if it were up to me, I'd have it be required by law, is that they MUST INTEGRATE. They must learn English, they must learn US customs. They need to learn to how to take a bath. They need to learn how to speak and read properly.

This is one of the very few areas, that I actually support Federal programs for it. Generally I'm against all Federal programs, but I would be supportive of a program for teaching basic American etiquette, and American language. (meaning American English).

You want to come here? Great! Fantastic. Come on in, but you dump your culture that you came from, and you adapt to American Culture. None of this multi-cultural crap that hasn't worked for the last 50+ years. You come here, that's wonderful, but you become an American. You don't want to? That's fine. Stay where you are. You can come when you want to be an American.

 

[protectionist]

How's that alligator pond from San Diego to Brownsville that you have been advocating, working out?

Excellent, if they ever get it going. And if they need alligators, we've got plenty here in Florida we're more than happy to donate, for the cause of deterring illegal aliens. You betcha.