Which Side Are You On?

[daveman]

He'd have to have 2 nickels to rub together first.
I love class envy. The people doing the envy are inveterate losers in life who blame others for their own failings. SO when they complain that so-and-so has built a successful business and that's proof the system is rigged against them they sound like whiners.

"It's not faaaaaaaair!!"

/georgephillip

It's slavery.

Horseshit. Get off your ass and get to work.

 

[daveman]

In which I bitch about incessantly? That doesn't make a bit of sense. Remind me again...why is it you think you're intelligent? Because there's no evidence to support it.

Okay, no poli-sci class. I just found out you're a Deaniac. That explains your disconnect from reality.

I am not here to tell you how intelligent I am, yet you fucktards create this false world and attack it.

I am a liberal anarchist and this bothers Contards.

Anarchists are astoundingly stupid people.

There has never been a successful, large-scale anarchist society. And there never will be. It's simply not workable.

One day you'll grow up and realize this. Maybe. Until then, keep throwing rocks at your protests, kid, although the police will be quick to remind you that property damage is not a valid expression of your personal viewpoints.

 

[georgephillip]

So, you can't name anyone keeping you down.

So it must be your fault.

How is it my fault the richest 1% of Americans control more wealth than the bottom 90%?

Possibly those who control 90% of the wealth also control 90% of the opportunities?

No, they don't. You've had amazing opportunities...but you pissed them away. Now you're old and bitter and you still refuse to take responsibility for your lot in life.

You failed because of you. No one else. Just you.

My poor choices and laziness have played the dominant role in my failures in life.

That doesn't change the fact that the richest 1% and the next richest 9% of Americans each control more assets than the bottom 90% of their countrymen.

That reality makes "equal opportunity" and "equal prosperity" as meaningless as "Change you can Believe in" since economic elites have used their wealth to manipulate, control and exploit those with less money or power for centuries.

And they are poised to make their ascendency permanent.

Apologists like you only increase their chances of success.

 

[daveman]

How is it my fault the richest 1% of Americans control more wealth than the bottom 90%?

Possibly those who control 90% of the wealth also control 90% of the opportunities?

No, they don't. You've had amazing opportunities...but you pissed them away. Now you're old and bitter and you still refuse to take responsibility for your lot in life.

You failed because of you. No one else. Just you.

My poor choices and laziness have played the dominant role in my failures in life.

Congratulations. You've admitted what so many people who share your attitudes can't.

That doesn't change the fact that the richest 1% and the next richest 9% of Americans each control more assets than the bottom 90% of their countrymen.

That reality makes "equal opportunity" and "equal prosperity" as meaningless as "Change you can Believe in" since economic elites have used their wealth to manipulate, control and exploit those with less money or power for centuries.

And they are poised to make their ascendency permanent.

Apologists like you only increase their chances of success.

Oooh, and we were so close to a breakthrough.

Okay, you admit you pissed your life away. So why should somebody else pay for it?

 

[georgephillip]

So, you can't name anyone keeping you down.

So it must be your fault.

Oh how typical...

We're talking about the state of the nation, about macro economics and what is the response?

Attack the messgenger.

You're either a tool or a fool, Dave.

Not my fault you lack the wit to see the point. George is holding himself up as a symptom of what he perceives to be oppression of the poor.

Except he's never been oppressed. He's been lazy, and he's made poor choices. Now he wants other people to pay for his mistakes.

I've yet to see a rational justification for it. All we get is whining about what's fair, as if life were kindergarten.

90% of Americans have been oppressed for at least a generation.

If you're looking for a rational explanation for changing wealth distribution patterns start with Reagan's Revolution:

"Statistics taken from Forbes magazine's annual July survey of America's billionaires expose the true reality. In 1982 there were 13 billionaires, in 1983...15; in 1984...12; in 1985...13; in 1986...26; in 1987...49

"In other words, the number of American billionaires had for many years hovered around 13, then the Reagan administration drastically altered the wealth distribution patterns by introducing tax changes favoring the super rich.

"In 1986 the number of billionaires DOUBLED, and by 1987 the number of billionaires had QUADRUPLED!!

"By 1988 there were 68 individuals or families that each had net wealth in excess of $1,000,000,000.

"By 1989, the number had risen precipitously to 82. And by 1990, the Forbes survey reported the staggering total of 99!!

"This explosion of wealth taking place at the top has occurred and will continue to occur while waves of beggars flood onto the streets, and thousands of farmers lose their farms.

"It is neither fate nor coincidence that these events are occurring simultaneously.

"Tremendous profits continue to flow into the bank accounts of the super rich even during supposedly poor economic periods.

"Unless facts such as these become 'common knowledge', economic Feudalism will continue to be an integral aspect of the status quo."

Feudalism alias American Capitalism -- Introduction and Overview

 

[daveman]

Oh how typical...

We're talking about the state of the nation, about macro economics and what is the response?

Attack the messgenger.

You're either a tool or a fool, Dave.

Not my fault you lack the wit to see the point. George is holding himself up as a symptom of what he perceives to be oppression of the poor.

Except he's never been oppressed. He's been lazy, and he's made poor choices. Now he wants other people to pay for his mistakes.

I've yet to see a rational justification for it. All we get is whining about what's fair, as if life were kindergarten.

90% of Americans have been oppressed for at least a generation.]

You're partly right, but not in the way you think.

There is a permanent poor class in America. They're paid to be so by Democrats in exchange for votes.

 

[georgephillip]

Yet Democrats and Republicans rely on the richest 1% of Americans to fund their campaigns.

 

[Antiderivative]

Yet Democrats and Republicans rely on the richest 1% of Americans to fund their campaigns.

Special interest lobbying is not a problem to some. In fact, some advocate for it.

 

[daveman]

Yet Democrats and Republicans rely on the richest 1% of Americans to fund their campaigns.

What do you think should be done about this greedy 1%?

 

[Steelplate]

What does it matter what the top 1% have? I don't worry about what they have. I bust my ass for what I can get and what they have doesn't affect me at all. If, for instance, Bill Gates were to have $2B instead of $4B it wouldn't affect my life in anyway. Likewise if he builds that up to $8B it still won't affect what I have at all.

We are responsible for ourselves.

I'll tell you why it matters. Because there is only so many dollars. If the top 1% control the majority of it, then the rest of us have to fight over what's left over. The top 15% in this country(which is about where I sit) control roughly 80% of all monies available. That means 85% of the people in this country are scratching for 20% of the funds.

I know... you don't care because it doesn't affect you.... yet. What if that top 1% want an even bigger percentage and they lobby and bribe even more out of our government to help them? When is it enough? When they have it all and the rest of us are working 80 hours/week and living in Company houses, buying from company stores Like during the Robber/baron days? Because that is what we are fast approaching... and with the "Will work for fishheads" labor force in China and other places, it's even MORE of a game of Holding the working class hostage... we will bend over backwards for them and they know it.

Look, I am not saying that a Socialist government is what we need for our people... that's your side's boogie man used to scare you away from anything that will take power from their Extortionist tactics... Cheap/free education? No way! The Conglomerate wants you $100k in debt to start your life... all the better to keep the pressure on. Health Care? No Way!!! That's their number one tool to keep you under their thumb.

Start a business of your own? Too scary... I got kids and I can't afford the premiums for health care.

Look at everything they are trying to take away... Health Care, Social Security, Minimum wage, etc. Open your damned eyes people... It's an economic coup that they are attempting here. They want it all... if you can't see it, you're blind.

No... we don't need Socialism, we don't need Capitalism... we need a balance of the two.

 

[daveman]

What does it matter what the top 1% have? I don't worry about what they have. I bust my ass for what I can get and what they have doesn't affect me at all. If, for instance, Bill Gates were to have $2B instead of $4B it wouldn't affect my life in anyway. Likewise if he builds that up to $8B it still won't affect what I have at all.

We are responsible for ourselves.

I'll tell you why it matters. Because there is only so many dollars.

See, when you start off immediately with a wrong premise, everything else after can be dismissed.

 

[georgephillip]

Yet Democrats and Republicans rely on the richest 1% of Americans to fund their campaigns.

Special interest lobbying is not a problem to some. In fact, some advocate for it.

Wisconsin has been a pretty good example of that recently.

If the Koch brothers fund Americans for Prosperity in order to obtain favorable government treatment, public school teachers and others would have to organize in order to survive.

When lobbyists actually write the legislation our elected representatives take credit for and vote on is when I think we should reconsider the need for Republicans AND Democrats.

 

[Antiderivative]

Yet Democrats and Republicans rely on the richest 1% of Americans to fund their campaigns.

Special interest lobbying is not a problem to some. In fact, some advocate for it.

Wisconsin has been a pretty good example of that recently.

If the Koch brothers fund Americans for Prosperity in order to obtain favorable government treatment, public school teachers and others would have to organize in order to survive.

When lobbyists actually write the legislation our elected representatives take credit for and vote on is when I think we should reconsider the need for Republicans AND Democrats.

The Koch brothers fabricated a crisis in order of personal gain.

Truly disturbing.

 

[georgephillip]

Yet Democrats and Republicans rely on the richest 1% of Americans to fund their campaigns.

What do you think should be done about this greedy 1%?

Special tax brackets for millionaires and billionaires.
Reinstate inheritance taxes at the levels they existed at in the 1950s.
Tax all unearned income at the same levels as wages and salaries.
Modest financial transaction tax.
And special tax breaks for makers of guillotines???????

I would also think seriously about how to tax war into extinction.

 

[daveman]

Yet Democrats and Republicans rely on the richest 1% of Americans to fund their campaigns.

What do you think should be done about this greedy 1%?

Special tax brackets for millionaires and billionaires.
Reinstate inheritance taxes at the levels they existed at in the 1950s.
Tax all unearned income at the same levels as wages and salaries.
Modest financial transaction tax.
And special tax breaks for makers of guillotines???????

I would also think seriously about how to tax war into extinction.

So, nothing realistic.

Thanks for playing!

 

[Steelplate]

I'll tell you why it matters. Because there is only so many dollars.

See, when you start off immediately with a wrong premise, everything else after can be dismissed.

Yeah... it's just growing on trees, isn't it? You're an idiot... what, you want them to print more? I thought you Shiite Republicans were against that sort of thing?

 

[daveman]

I'll tell you why it matters. Because there is only so many dollars.

See, when you start off immediately with a wrong premise, everything else after can be dismissed.

Yeah... it's just growing on trees, isn't it? You're an idiot... what, you want them to print more? I thought you Shiite Republicans were against that sort of thing?

U.S. Gross Domestic Product (GDP) Over Time - Supporting Evidence

Funny -- looks like wealth increases over time.

Guess you're wrong.

 

[georgephillip]

Special interest lobbying is not a problem to some. In fact, some advocate for it.

Wisconsin has been a pretty good example of that recently.

If the Koch brothers fund Americans for Prosperity in order to obtain favorable government treatment, public school teachers and others would have to organize in order to survive.

When lobbyists actually write the legislation our elected representatives take credit for and vote on is when I think we should reconsider the need for Republicans AND Democrats.

The Koch brothers fabricated a crisis in order of personal gain.

Truly disturbing.

Although Charles and David own businesses that actually produce useful products as opposed to CDOs and CDSs they must have noticed how Wall Street has just managed to extort trillions of taxpayer dollars AFTER nearly collapsing the global economy, and, so far, no one has gone to prison.

When I think about how our wealth has become concentrated in fewer and fewer hands over the past 40 years, I don't feel so bad about not being around in 2051.

Some of the rich only understand one word, and that is MORE.

Since they seldom associate with anyone outside their own economic class, more than a few of them will not understand the price their greed extracts from society until the cell door CLANGS shut behind them.

And then they will feel victimized.

 

[georgephillip]

See, when you start off immediately with a wrong premise, everything else after can be dismissed.

Yeah... it's just growing on trees, isn't it? You're an idiot... what, you want them to print more? I thought you Shiite Republicans were against that sort of thing?

U.S. Gross Domestic Product (GDP) Over Time - Supporting Evidence

Funny -- looks like wealth increases over time.

Guess you're wrong.

"Although precise data is not available, the total household wealth in the world has been estimated at $125 trillion (USD 1.25 x1012) in year 2000[citation needed] 90% of this wealth is produced by people in North America, Europe, and high-income Asian countries, and 1% of adults are estimated to hold 40% of world wealth, a number which falls to 32% when adjusted for purchasing power parity.[4]"

Funnier how it winds up in fewer and fewer hands over time.

Wealth - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[georgephillip]

What do you think should be done about this greedy 1%?

Special tax brackets for millionaires and billionaires.
Reinstate inheritance taxes at the levels they existed at in the 1950s.
Tax all unearned income at the same levels as wages and salaries.
Modest financial transaction tax.
And special tax breaks for makers of guillotines???????

I would also think seriously about how to tax war into extinction.

So, nothing realistic.

Thanks for playing!

Does this mean you're not available to test my first guillotine?

You'll never forget the experience.