Why Are Conservatives So Resentful Of Americans With Good Jobs?

[Gadawg73]

Man, you really hate poor people, don't you?

Define "poor".

 

[Gadawg73]

This wasn't Gibson's first offense... They had been illegally importing wood for years. Wood harvestd from endangered forests that India is trying to protect.

If India is trying to protect that wood how the hell does it end up 10,000 from where it grows?

Because operations like Gibson illegally import it. Do try to keep up.

NO, because Indians ARE SELLING IT.

 

[JoeB131]

If India is trying to protect that wood how the hell does it end up 10,000 from where it grows?

Because operations like Gibson illegally import it. Do try to keep up.

NO, because Indians ARE SELLING IT.

except that this particular wood got around Indian Export officials, which is why they filed a complaint with our government.

Gibson admitted fault and paid the fine, why are you still arguing this.

Oh. Right. Gummit Baaaaad.

 

[Liberal]

Hmm, for some reason the site will not let me quote your double quotes, it just deletes them.

Can't really pull them apart, you may think I am wrong and I think you are wrong. (pretty simple)

Bottom line is supply side does have to do with shipping jobs over seas.. Supply side may be effective without the option to send jobs overseas being virtually uninhibited.

Again, labor savings virtually NEVER make up for shipping costs. So the reasons for offshoring have little to do with labor.

So by your mark, jobs never get sent overseas.

Or it's only because of "regulations"... You have never owned a business have you?

Cheap labor and being able to piggy back existing production floors (IE, not having to buy equipment) are the real factors. Not just regulations. (LOL)

The "deal they could not refuse" was an escape from predatory EPA regulatory costs. The USA has banished electronic manufacturing. The use of lead and arsenic in PCB and IC fabrication created a cash cow for the federal government who sucked the lifeblood out. Labor had zilch to do with it. China would not engage in the level of extortion the U.S. government engages in.

The RoHS act (EU) has been unanimously accepted and embraced by China, Japan and Taiwan (before America). All products manufactured are RoHS complaint and moving forward to Halogen free as well. There hasn't been lead in a single white good since 2005, in addition there has not been lead in a single "gadget" (phone, computer etc.) since late 2007. Most of the pressure came from abroad (EU), basically the rest of the world did not want to use our products with lead in them, Asia conformed because they were building OUR products.

The only entity that still requires leaded products is the US military (tin whiskers cause A and S failure rate issues).

There are no violations or fines for using lead in a production line domestically, in fact, the drive to remove lead based production came from the need for uniformity within the production industry. Tin/lead based solder alloys have issues bonding with RoHS compliant (non hazardous) components and vice versa. RoHS compliant solder needs high temps vs leaded solder, etc..

Labor has part to with the jobs going overseas (saying otherwise is a blatant lie), see, contract manufacturers in China (Foxconn, Walsin, Kinpo, Kaifa etc.) have a massive trained CHEAP workforce combined with domestic based, even on-site (Walsin) production of the components used. They are highly advantaged when it comes to labor and component costs, which they secure through cheap labor and high volume raw material contracts.

Shipping of electronic devices is nothing. Aside from that, most big manufacturers (specifically Foxconn/Hon Hai) arrange virtually cost free shipping for their biggest accounts.

That isn't the motivator, EPA regulation is - driven by the left.

Sure, makes perfect sense since shipping cost was only 400% of labor savings...

(There's a reason you work the docks, and not in management.....)

I sure don't work the docks..

But, keep telling yourself that... It makes you look nice and ignorant.

Right, if I can save $1 per part on labor, and it only costs me $4 for shipping, I'll jump at the chance....

See above.

Yup, proof... You don't own a business..

 

[Uncensored2008]

Hmm, for some reason the site will not let me quote your double quotes, it just deletes them.

Can't really pull them apart, you may think I am wrong and I think you are wrong. (pretty simple)

Bottom line is supply side does have to do with shipping jobs over seas.. Supply side may be effective without the option to send jobs overseas being virtually uninhibited.

No, you're simply ignorant. You engage in demagoguery and spew shit about an economic system you have no grasp of, but are instructed to hate by Thinkprogress and other leftist hate sites.

I'm dealing in fact, you're dealing in partisan bullshit.

So by your mark, jobs never get sent overseas.

L: Kids don't like peas because they're green
R: No, kids eat green popsickles and green apple candy all the time, there must be another reason.
L: So by your mark, kids love peas.

Logical fallacy is the closest a leftist gets to logic.

Or it's only because of "regulations"... You have never owned a business have you?

ROFL

Another leftist who hates the market but is a multi-billionaire business owner. Funny, since every leftist is the owner of dozens of successful businesses (just ask them on the internet!) why is it that business owners oppose socialism?

Cheap labor and being able to piggy back existing production floors (IE, not having to buy equipment) are the real factors. Not just regulations. (LOL)

Oh, so that's the secret to success? Takt time, scrap reduction, efficiency of motion, shadow boarding, none of these have any impact?

I mean, to be really profitable, you want lots of equipment failures and as much rework and scrap as possible, due to poorly trained and paid workers.

Yep, you're a right genius - you should teach lean classes.

Serious question: have you ever actually had a job? I mean one that someone would pay you for? You're 14 and in love with Obama, right?

The RoHS act (EU) has been unanimously accepted and embraced by China, Japan and Taiwan (before America). All products manufactured are RoHS complaint and moving forward to Halogen free as well. There hasn't been lead in a single white good since 2005, in addition there has not been lead in a single "gadget" (phone, computer etc.) since late 2007. Most of the pressure came from abroad (EU), basically the rest of the world did not want to use our products with lead in them, Asia conformed because they were building OUR products.

As with pretty much everything you post, you're full of shit.

{ScienceDaily (July 26, 2010) — It's been said that the typical mobile phone contains roughly half of all elements found on the Periodic Table. One of the most problematic substances used in phones and other electronics is lead. }

An alchemist’s dream: Lead-free electronics

The only entity that still requires leaded products is the US military (tin whiskers cause A and S failure rate issues).

There are no violations or fines for using lead in a production line domestically, in fact, the drive to remove lead based production came from the need for uniformity within the production industry. Tin/lead based solder alloys have issues bonding with RoHS compliant (non hazardous) components and vice versa. RoHS compliant solder needs high temps vs leaded solder, etc..

{WASHINGTON, DC, May 22, 2007 (Water Tech) � The District of Columbia Water and Sewer Authority (WASA) will pay a $10,000 fine for reporting inaccurate lead sampling data required by the US Environmental Protection Agency (EPA), a May 22 EPA press release reported.}

DC utility to pay EPA lead fine | 2nd 2 None Water Filters

Wow, you're just a fount of misinformation.

Labor has part to with the jobs going overseas (saying otherwise is a blatant lie), see, contract manufacturers in China (Foxconn, Walsin, Kinpo, Kaifa etc.) have a massive trained CHEAP workforce combined with domestic based, even on-site (Walsin) production of the components used. They are highly advantaged when it comes to labor and component costs, which they secure through cheap labor and high volume raw material contracts.

No manufacturing concern would relocate purely based on labor. Since labor is generally less than 20% of the cost of manufactured goods, there is little incentive to seek relief purely on labor.

Typically what we see is exactly what Apple has done with FoxConn. Apple did not relocate anything - they simply stopped manufacturing. FoxConn was an existing concern that Apple contracted to make components. A classic "buy/make" decision. A host of reasons drive buy/make decisions. Compliance costs are often one of the top concerns.

Shipping of electronic devices is nothing.

Well, that's good to know. I'll let Vax Global know that I will no longer pay any shipping costs because a troll on an internet message board told me that shipping is free.

No doubt they will comply.

Aside from that, most big manufacturers (specifically Foxconn/Hon Hai) arrange virtually cost free shipping for their biggest accounts.

Nothing is "cost free," only leftist live in a world where fuel and massive ships have no cost.

What is the FOB for iPhone and iPad products from FoxConn? (might explain the "free" shipping.)

I sure don't work the docks..

But, keep telling yourself that... It makes you look nice and ignorant.

I know, you're a gazillionaire - all leftists are..

See above.

Yup, proof... You don't own a business..

Lol - the 14 year old speaks..

 

[Gadawg73]

Because operations like Gibson illegally import it. Do try to keep up.

NO, because Indians ARE SELLING IT.

except that this particular wood got around Indian Export officials, which is why they filed a complaint with our government.

Gibson admitted fault and paid the fine, why are you still arguing this.

Oh. Right. Gummit Baaaaad.

Paying a fine is no admission of any guilt.
Cost of doing business.

 

[JoeB131]

NO, because Indians ARE SELLING IT.

except that this particular wood got around Indian Export officials, which is why they filed a complaint with our government.

Gibson admitted fault and paid the fine, why are you still arguing this.

Oh. Right. Gummit Baaaaad.

Paying a fine is no admission of any guilt.
Cost of doing business.

Or they realized their case was bullshit. Paying a fine after whining for a year of the injustice of it all is kind of gutless.

 

[Gadawg73]

except that this particular wood got around Indian Export officials, which is why they filed a complaint with our government.

Gibson admitted fault and paid the fine, why are you still arguing this.

Oh. Right. Gummit Baaaaad.

Paying a fine is no admission of any guilt.
Cost of doing business.

Or they realized their case was bullshit. Paying a fine after whining for a year of the injustice of it all is kind of gutless.

They stood up in court and fought for their rights and what they believed in.
Something you would know nothing about.

 

[bripat9643]

Gibson should leave the country. Take the US government advice and move to Madagascar.

As long as they pay a huge tariff to get their shit back in this country...

But here's the point.

Gibson Guitar acknowledges exotic wood violation

Gibson admitted they were wrong and paid the fine. Why are you still arguing a point they aren't even trying to make anymore?

Oh, that's right. Gummit Bad.

Wrong. Gibson only "acknowledged" that it wasn't going to fight the government regulators. The admission was no different in character than the "confessions" signed by inmates in the Lubyanka prison on Moscow during the reign of Stalin.

 

[bripat9643]

except that this particular wood got around Indian Export officials, which is why they filed a complaint with our government.

Gibson admitted fault and paid the fine, why are you still arguing this.

Oh. Right. Gummit Baaaaad.

Paying a fine is no admission of any guilt.
Cost of doing business.

Or they realized their case was bullshit. Paying a fine after whining for a year of the injustice of it all is kind of gutless.

So anyone who pays a fine to the government is guilty of "gutless?" The government never prosecutes anyone unjustly? Heinrich Himmler would have had a place for you in the S.S.

 

[bripat9643]

Man, you really hate poor people, don't you?

You hate all the people that work at Gibson.

 

[Uncensored2008]

You hate all the people that work at Gibson.

You added two words too many; should have stopped with "you hate all the people that work." Comrade Joe could live with that!

 

[Jarlaxle]

The question should be why are the moochers so resentful of those that have earned more than they have.

Usually, because those who've earned too much stole it....

This is pretty much the way the left thinks. If you EARNED too much, by hard work, overtime, inventing, creating, then you actually STOLE what you have from someone who doesn't work, doesn't invent and doesn't create! It's called the entitlement mentality. You never earned it, you stole it from the rightful owner who didn't work for it but is entitled anyway.

And the Oscar goes to....

The worst actor because the good actor would have otherwise stolen the award.

Saying that Joe "thinks" in ANY way is giving him too much credit. His avatar is perfect: he is as dumb as a bag of hammers.

 

[Jarlaxle]

You might ask Gibson Guitar about the definition of importing raw materials and exporting finished goods. Men with guns from the govt didn't like the way Gibson was doing that. And Congress had essentially protected the jobs of Indian workers with their regulations on guitar materials. Glad you gave me a chance to show SPECIFICALLY where regulation IS the problem. (Other than attempting to wipe out the entire hand-crafted toy industry in this country --- as displayed in my footer)..

But you are ALMOST correct about where we are. It's not the "thieving elite" that are surviving the best. Where are all the companies that makes more than 15% profit in a year? It's also "non-thieving" folk like me that stay globally competitive by helping to build innovative new products for the market. Stuff that the rest of the world NEEDS.

The realization should be that if our workforce resembles a 3rd world nation, we will become a 3rd world nation.

The Global poverty rate has been cut in half in just 20 years or so. WITHOUT stimulus or forced redistribution. And if the US is not up to the challenge of PROMOTING our workers into higher skilled and more FLEXIBLE careers --- you WILL see a decline in the standard of living..

Yawn... guy, you keep defending a bad system.

Gibson broke the law. Not seeing a problem with what was done to them.

No, actually, Gibson broke NO laws, they are the victim of a politically-motivated witch hunt.

 

[JoeB131]

You might ask Gibson Guitar about the definition of importing raw materials and exporting finished goods. Men with guns from the govt didn't like the way Gibson was doing that. And Congress had essentially protected the jobs of Indian workers with their regulations on guitar materials. Glad you gave me a chance to show SPECIFICALLY where regulation IS the problem. (Other than attempting to wipe out the entire hand-crafted toy industry in this country --- as displayed in my footer)..

But you are ALMOST correct about where we are. It's not the "thieving elite" that are surviving the best. Where are all the companies that makes more than 15% profit in a year? It's also "non-thieving" folk like me that stay globally competitive by helping to build innovative new products for the market. Stuff that the rest of the world NEEDS.

The realization should be that if our workforce resembles a 3rd world nation, we will become a 3rd world nation.

The Global poverty rate has been cut in half in just 20 years or so. WITHOUT stimulus or forced redistribution. And if the US is not up to the challenge of PROMOTING our workers into higher skilled and more FLEXIBLE careers --- you WILL see a decline in the standard of living..

Yawn... guy, you keep defending a bad system.

Gibson broke the law. Not seeing a problem with what was done to them.

No, actually, Gibson broke NO laws, they are the victim of a politically-motivated witch hunt.

Gibson paid the fine and forfeited the material. That's an admission of guilt as far as I'm concerned.

And if they got on someone's radar because of politics, double dumb ass on them.

 

[Uncensored2008]

Gibson paid the fine and forfeited the material. That's an admission of guilt as far as I'm concerned.

And if they got on someone's radar because of politics, double dumb ass on them.

As far as you're concerned, all private business should be outlawed.

Gibson was clear that there was no wrong doing, but the cost of litigation with a predatory Federal Government was prohibitive.

 

[flacaltenn]

Yawn... guy, you keep defending a bad system.

Gibson broke the law. Not seeing a problem with what was done to them.

No, actually, Gibson broke NO laws, they are the victim of a politically-motivated witch hunt.

Gibson paid the fine and forfeited the material. That's an admission of guilt as far as I'm concerned.

And if they got on someone's radar because of politics, double dumb ass on them.

You weren't reading carefully. The government latter GAVE THEM the Indian Material BACK!!!!!!!!! That's an admission that the stuff WAS NOT illegal --- just a poor reading of the INDIAN laws for export...

 

[JoeB131]

Gibson paid the fine and forfeited the material. That's an admission of guilt as far as I'm concerned.

And if they got on someone's radar because of politics, double dumb ass on them.

As far as you're concerned, all private business should be outlawed.

Gibson was clear that there was no wrong doing, but the cost of litigation with a predatory Federal Government was prohibitive.

I'm sure if they wanted to start a legal defense fund they'd have gotten millions for the fight.

But they knew they were as guilty as shit, and they settled.

 

[JoeB131]

No, actually, Gibson broke NO laws, they are the victim of a politically-motivated witch hunt.

Gibson paid the fine and forfeited the material. That's an admission of guilt as far as I'm concerned.

And if they got on someone's radar because of politics, double dumb ass on them.

You weren't reading carefully. The government latter GAVE THEM the Indian Material BACK!!!!!!!!! That's an admission that the stuff WAS NOT illegal --- just a poor reading of the INDIAN laws for export...

Gibson Guitar settles with feds over illegal imports - Aug. 6, 2012

The company also will withdraw its claims to the $262,000 worth of exotic woods seized by federal authorities, said the Department of Justice.

 

[Liberal]

No, you're simply ignorant. You engage in demagoguery and spew shit about an economic system you have no grasp of, but are instructed to hate by Thinkprogress and other leftist hate sites.

I have total grasp of our economic system, you just refuse to accept the truth... One day you will get it.

I'm dealing in fact, you're dealing in partisan bullshit.

No facts from you, misguided understanding of supply side (proven).. You got that in spades.

L: Kids don't like peas because they're green
R: No, kids eat green popsickles and green apple candy all the time, there must be another reason.
L: So by your mark, kids love peas.

Logical fallacy is the closest a leftist gets to logic.

Actually the point was made to illustrate that your point was.. A bit short on anything, really.

If you want to extrapolate everything to the extreme we'll never get all this work done.

Another leftist who hates the market but is a multi-billionaire business owner. Funny, since every leftist is the owner of dozens of successful businesses (just ask them on the internet!) why is it that business owners oppose socialism?

Once again, you make a fool out of yourself.. Good job.

I am not a multi-billionaire, however I do own one business and part own another.

I am not a socialist, in regards to business, as evident this whole time I never once mentioned socialism, but you keep bringing it up.. I am in favor of destroying our massive jobs exodus to China, via regulations.

Oh, so that's the secret to success? Takt time, scrap reduction, efficiency of motion, shadow boarding, none of these have any impact?

I mean, to be really profitable, you want lots of equipment failures and as much rework and scrap as possible, due to poorly trained and paid workers.

Yep, you're a right genius - you should teach lean classes.

All of these things matter, never said they didn't.. China does it better through volume. Plain and simple, but, I do not expect you to understand anything simple.

I have been in several production facilities in Taiwan, the Pick/Place, Wave Solder machines and capillary bonders (and such) that require trained work are manned by well trained people, these facilities are clean and very well managed.. The cheap labor comes in the manual production, hand insertion, gluing, cable assemblies and the like.

They don't fuck around.

Serious question: have you ever actually had a job? I mean one that someone would pay you for? You're 14 and in love with Obama, right?

14? I am not the one accusing someone of never having a job..

You still get recess?

As with pretty much everything you post, you're full of shit.

{ScienceDaily (July 26, 2010) — It's been said that the typical mobile phone contains roughly half of all elements found on the Periodic Table. One of the most problematic substances used in phones and other electronics is lead. }

An alchemist’s dream: Lead-free electronics

Oh well.. That was what the RoHS directive claimed. I am telling you right now, if it has lead in it, it's not getting sold in the EU.

So my guess would be that most phones are RoHS complaint, last time I was in Prague everyone had one taped to their head.

{WASHINGTON, DC, May 22, 2007 (Water Tech) � The District of Columbia Water and Sewer Authority (WASA) will pay a $10,000 fine for reporting inaccurate lead sampling data required by the US Environmental Protection Agency (EPA), a May 22 EPA press release reported.}

DC utility to pay EPA lead fine | 2nd 2 None Water Filters

Wow, you're just a fount of misinformation.

No, that link you posted was not relevant to my point. Where did I say anything about drinking water.. We were talking about production lines.

"There are no violations or fines for using lead in a production line domestically, in fact, the drive to remove lead based production came from the need for uniformity within the production industry. Tin/lead based solder alloys have issues bonding with RoHS compliant (non hazardous) components and vice versa. RoHS compliant solder needs high temps vs leaded solder, etc.."

Maybe you could try googling something else?

No manufacturing concern would relocate purely based on labor. Since labor is generally less than 20% of the cost of manufactured goods, there is little incentive to seek relief purely on labor.

I have said a thousand times now, labor PART of the problem. Albeit a BIG part.

Typically what we see is exactly what Apple has done with FoxConn. Apple did not relocate anything - they simply stopped manufacturing. FoxConn was an existing concern that Apple contracted to make components. A classic "buy/make" decision. A host of reasons drive buy/make decisions. Compliance costs are often one of the top concerns.

So you are saying that FoxConn's low cost (jailed) workforce does not play a factor in their ability to offer lower production prices? Or that their already well established production facilities are not a factor as well?

See, as long as Chinese businesses have the ability to exploit cheap labor and piggy back volume from existing (American) contract jobs, along a host of other unfair advantages. Supply Side (lowering the barriers for people to produce supply goods) IE: no barriers, limited regulations, allows the unfairly advantaged Chinese manufacturers to mop up our jobs.

I am not saying we need to abandon supply side (never had), I am just saying that core philosophy behind it allows it to happen.

Well, that's good to know. I'll let Vax Global know that I will no longer pay any shipping costs because a troll on an internet message board told me that shipping is free.

No doubt they will comply.

Nothing is "cost free," only leftist live in a world where fuel and massive ships have no cost.

What is the FOB for iPhone and iPad products from FoxConn? (might explain the "free" shipping.)

Leave to drowning right winger to take things out of context and extrapolate them the the farthest.

I never said it was free, I said it was VIRTUALLY free.. As in, reduced.

I know, you're a gazillionaire - all leftists are..

Whatever you wanna think, the world is yours to turn into conspiracy theories..