Why Are Conservatives So Resentful Of Americans With Good Jobs?

[JoeB131]

[

By looking backwards all the time -- "OLD" labor is gonna become roadkill. I'm sure that many folks thought the same things about debit cards and ATMs at one time. And there might STILL be a few people who use a phone operator or a travel agent.

In a few years -- you will be rolling your cart thru a TSA style arch and paying for the total on the other side. America should be INVENTING and INNOVATING this stuff. Not blaming each other for the inevitable changes in the meaning of "a job". Think AHEAD or end up with the economy of Yemen --- Your choice "commie-light".

We should give up on making toasters and plastic toys, quit whining about "foreign" crap and start making the stuff that the rest of world CAN'T do. THAT'S what supports the American quality of life. NOT making basketballs and consumer electronics.

Here's the thing, guy.

If you have a choice between a make work job, or just having him collect welfare, I'd rather have him do a make-work job.

Because, honestly, you guys all whined about how Obama won because of the moochers...

Who took away the "moochers' jobs to start with?

I'd rather pay $10.00 to the guy who made my radio than .50 to him and 9.50 to the six middlemen who've managed to insert themselves in the way somehow.

 

[flacaltenn]

[

By looking backwards all the time -- "OLD" labor is gonna become roadkill. I'm sure that many folks thought the same things about debit cards and ATMs at one time. And there might STILL be a few people who use a phone operator or a travel agent.

In a few years -- you will be rolling your cart thru a TSA style arch and paying for the total on the other side. America should be INVENTING and INNOVATING this stuff. Not blaming each other for the inevitable changes in the meaning of "a job". Think AHEAD or end up with the economy of Yemen --- Your choice "commie-light".

We should give up on making toasters and plastic toys, quit whining about "foreign" crap and start making the stuff that the rest of world CAN'T do. THAT'S what supports the American quality of life. NOT making basketballs and consumer electronics.

Here's the thing, guy.

If you have a choice between a make work job, or just having him collect welfare, I'd rather have him do a make-work job.

Because, honestly, you guys all whined about how Obama won because of the moochers...

Who took away the "moochers' jobs to start with?

I'd rather pay $10.00 to the guy who made my radio than .50 to him and 9.50 to the six middlemen who've managed to insert themselves in the way somehow.

If you paid that Chinese worker $10/hour, all you'd do is pervert their society so that radio assemblers made more than doctors or engineers.

The ability to DESIGN, MARKET and DISTRIBUTE those $10 radios is much more important than the mere assembly of them. Realistically, the radio cost $3 to manufacture. It contributes to jobs to stock it, sell it, transport it. There is a lot of fairness in all that when the company that STARTED the effort is making just 10 or 13% of the revenue...

The more you learn about the "economic life of a radio" -- the less angry you might be...

 

[flacaltenn]

Believe me Joe --- If we could DITCH the "Class Warriors" heroes of yours in charge. We could create the conditions where that radio company could make that product in the USA for $3.30 and call it even. But NO entreprenuer is gonna invest in the automation required to do that here under the conditions this country is facing right now.

Most of my clients would consider "bringing it home".. But even if we had a free market govt and less villianization of "the rich" and Biz --- when the manufacturing came HOME -- it wouldn't look like the 50s or 60s and I'm not sure we're creating the type of NEW (reduced) workforce to operate a factory of that type..

 

[JoeB131]

Believe me Joe --- If we could DITCH the "Class Warriors" heroes of yours in charge. We could create the conditions where that radio company could make that product in the USA for $3.30 and call it even. But NO entreprenuer is gonna invest in the automation required to do that here under the conditions this country is facing right now.

Most of my clients would consider "bringing it home".. But even if we had a free market govt and less villianization of "the rich" and Biz --- when the manufacturing came HOME -- it wouldn't look like the 50s or 60s and I'm not sure we're creating the type of NEW (reduced) workforce to operate a factory of that type..

Do you actually believe your own horseshit?

We had that wonderful Biz Iz Good mentality in the Bush years, and frankly, they just moved the factories out to Asia that much faster. And you had all those wonderful toys coming in from China laced with lead and roofies in the paint.

Until we start being real class warriors, it ain't gonna change.

 

[Liberal]

Look, you're a leftist - thus you have zero grasp of economics or finance.

"Supply side" is simply the recitation of Says Law "Supply gives rise to demand." This is an economic law that demonstrates the fact that people cannot demand that which does not exist. I may WANT a star trek teleporter - but there is no DEMAND for them because they don't exist. Before a product can be sold, it must exist.

So "Supply Side" has zilch, zip, nada, to do with outsourcing or offshoring.

You are a fucking moron (again, no surprise). Here is the "real" definition of supply side economics:

Supply-side economics is a school of macroeconomic thought that argues that economic growth can be most effectively created by lowering barriers for people to produce (supply) goods and services, such as lowering income tax and capital gains tax rates, and by allowing greater flexibility by reducing regulation. According to supply-side economics, consumers will then benefit from a greater supply of goods and services at lower prices. Typical policy recommendations of supply-side economists are lower marginal tax rates and less regulation.[1]

So now, that we have that out of the way.. Are you saying there is no demand for an iPhone in the USA? Hmmm.. Those are made overseas, are they not?

Designed here, consumed here (DEMAND), and built in Foxconn, Shenzhen.. Supply Side + China (cheap labor) = Double edged sword.

Again, you have no grasp at all of the basic terms, much less the concepts or realities behind them. You are in no position at all to spew about what "FAILS.'

Considering your inability to understand the fundamental supply side meaning, you are in no place to judge the use of any words..

You have absolutely no idea what you are yapping about.

Labor cost is rarely the driver to offshore, as shipping virtually always consumes more revenue than is realized in labor savings.

So there must be some other factor that you can't quite grasp.....

Standard Disclaimer: Regulation

I was just listing labor and the ACA as some examples...

All of the other stuff aside (LOL), you are truly showing your ass here. You know NOTHING, if you honestly think that that (quoted) is the truth.

I work in the most heavily exported industry, I can tell you that what is heavy (weight) stays here ONLY in small volume settings.

High volume (heavy or not) production almost ALWAYS benefits from overseas production, see, there is a big factor that you do not know about (aside from cheap labor). China courts all electronic manufacturing business in the USA, if they want the business in China they will offer the business a HUGE incentive (trained labor, free manufacturing space, you NAME IT) to move production over to China. We lost 3 of our biggest customers to this, they were pumping out 100,000 LED light bulbs a week at an amazing profit right here in the USA, China sent "officials" over here and offered them a deal they could not refuse.. Virtually interest free financing on equipment and dedicated floor space if it was moved to China. Guess where they went?

Aside from that, back to the point, we have companies that just ship their high labor assemblies overseas and cut labor here, final assembly was done in the states.. But it was basically built overseas.

So, yeah, labor cost is driver, amongst other things...

 

[Jarlaxle]

Consumers don't "make them pay a price", because "them" ain't gonna be PAYING the price. It would be CONSUMERS paying the price for tariffs or penalties or other imposed restrictions. You should know that. And anyway, cheap labor is NOT the evil-doer here. It's automation and efficiency that running rampant, depleting jobs like a domino fall. From travel agents to grocery clerks, from car body painters to phone operators --- the ability to employ armies of specialized labor is going away.

The Chinese are building 21st century factories WITHOUT cheap labor. They know that building dormitories and cafeterias for displaced low-skilled labor is NOT gonna be sustainable. Question is are we (YOU?) smart enough to drop the politically convienient bullshit excuses long enough to figure our WHAT POLICIES are really important for redirecting American business and labor. In THIS age. In THIS time. Before it's too late.

If you don't want to pay the tariff, don't buy the foriegn made shit. Simple enough. We used to fund the entire federal governent on tariffs and excises...

Often...there simply is no other option. Electronics simply aren't made here anymore. Televisions, computers, cell phones...they just don't make them here. Heck, I'm not sure anyone still casts brake rotors in the US! There are no more US-made trailer tires, just China bombs.

Now, you have a point about automation, but again, this is the consumers putting up with it. Frankly, I get annoyed with self-service checkout and robo-calls. For instance, when I got my local Jewel-Osco, they have 8 cash registers, and only 3 have human beings in them at any time. The others are empty, and they route people to the "Self-Checkout".

I prefer self-checkout...it's much faster and easier.

 

[The Infidel]

gawd, you are an idiot

Dainty.... Meet Mr. Pot & Mr. Kettle

 

[Gadawg73]

The question should be why are the moochers so resentful of those that have earned more than they have.

 

[flacaltenn]

So now, that we have that out of the way.. Are you saying there is no demand for an iPhone in the USA? Hmmm.. Those are made overseas, are they not?

Designed here, consumed here (DEMAND), and built in Foxconn, Shenzhen.. Supply Side + China (cheap labor) = Double edged sword.

I was just listing labor and the ACA as some examples...

All of the other stuff aside (LOL), you are truly showing your ass here. You know NOTHING, if you honestly think that that (quoted) is the truth.

I work in the most heavily exported industry, I can tell you that what is heavy (weight) stays here ONLY in small volume settings.

High volume (heavy or not) production almost ALWAYS benefits from overseas production, see, there is a big factor that you do not know about (aside from cheap labor). China courts all electronic manufacturing business in the USA, if they want the business in China they will offer the business a HUGE incentive (trained labor, free manufacturing space, you NAME IT) to move production over to China. We lost 3 of our biggest customers to this, they were pumping out 100,000 LED light bulbs a week at an amazing profit right here in the USA, China sent "officials" over here and offered them a deal they could not refuse.. Virtually interest free financing on equipment and dedicated floor space if it was moved to China. Guess where they went?

Aside from that, back to the point, we have companies that just ship their high labor assemblies overseas and cut labor here, final assembly was done in the states.. But it was basically built overseas.

So, yeah, labor cost is driver, amongst other things...

Wow -- so the secret China weapon is TRAINED LABOR, low cost of floor space, abundance of cheap utility power, and little to worry about in terms of regulation..

Wait Wait -- it gets better.. If you want to write a procedure for loading Wonder Bread on the SAME TRUCK as your Twinkies ---- you don't have to face down the UNION???

And let's talk about the IPhone and Foxconn. Foxconn is hiring over a MILLION robotic assemblers in the next few years. NOT more of that "cheap labor".. They want their factories to look like what ALL factories are gonna look like in the 21st Century. Largely because the Chinese govt is OK with FoxConn having a strategic LONG TERM vision that doesn't involve being ATTACKED and VILLIFIED by the political elite and PUNISHED for making huge R&D investments in their business. It's NOT about cheap labor. It's about freedom to run your business as long as you are planning for future growth and expansion.

Apple WANTS to be an innovator. Apple WANTS to lead their market. Manufacturing at that scale sucks the wind right out of a company their size. Apple couldn't be Apple with the added burden of running a supply chain and factories of that magnitude.

And therein lies the lesson. FoxConn NEEDS Apple to innovate. And the USA SHOULD be focused on product introductions and doing the hard stuff. The world values Intellectual Property now.. NOT button pushing. Not manual labor. You can shuck that off or realize that the ENTIRE world has a problem of how to serve each other better when replicators from the StarShip Enterprise are just a few years away. We should cut the political crap and ponder what "a job" means under those conditions...

Look at the 3D Printing thread over in the Science Forum and THEN tell me that "cheap labor" has ANYTHING to do with our labor problem in the next decade..

 

[flacaltenn]

Consumers don't "make them pay a price", because "them" ain't gonna be PAYING the price. It would be CONSUMERS paying the price for tariffs or penalties or other imposed restrictions. You should know that. And anyway, cheap labor is NOT the evil-doer here. It's automation and efficiency that running rampant, depleting jobs like a domino fall. From travel agents to grocery clerks, from car body painters to phone operators --- the ability to employ armies of specialized labor is going away.

The Chinese are building 21st century factories WITHOUT cheap labor. They know that building dormitories and cafeterias for displaced low-skilled labor is NOT gonna be sustainable. Question is are we (YOU?) smart enough to drop the politically convienient bullshit excuses long enough to figure our WHAT POLICIES are really important for redirecting American business and labor. In THIS age. In THIS time. Before it's too late.

If you don't want to pay the tariff, don't buy the foriegn made shit. Simple enough. We used to fund the entire federal governent on tariffs and excises...

Often...there simply is no other option. Electronics simply aren't made here anymore. Televisions, computers, cell phones...they just don't make them here. Heck, I'm not sure anyone still casts brake rotors in the US! There are no more US-made trailer tires, just China bombs.

Now, you have a point about automation, but again, this is the consumers putting up with it. Frankly, I get annoyed with self-service checkout and robo-calls. For instance, when I got my local Jewel-Osco, they have 8 cash registers, and only 3 have human beings in them at any time. The others are empty, and they route people to the "Self-Checkout".

I prefer self-checkout...it's much faster and easier.

You made me think about something JarAxle. We've lost electronics and apparel largely because the supply chain broke down. We did not know how fragile the "ecosystem" really was. But it turns out if you lose the ability to make capacitors, transformers, monitors, and other piece parts, the whole sector environment starts to come undone. A main advantage to assembling electronics in Asia is because there are HUNDREDS of separate businesses competing for each of those components and virtually NONE left here in the states. It's hard to recreate Eden once the Tree of Life is gone.

You see the same example of vertical supply chain STILL in Auto Industry because ALL of those pieces are neccessary to build cars here economically.

We have one play left to preserve a semblence of a middle class. And that is to BEAT the Asians to largely automated manufacturing. Using the best tools of robotics, artificial intelligience, 3D printing replication, nanotech and advanced materials. Just this one effort would spawn jobs and create an INTACT VERTICAL supply chain that would lead the world in the biz of making stuff. And start creating jobs at all levels.

 

[JoeB131]

The question should be why are the moochers so resentful of those that have earned more than they have.

Usually, because those who've earned too much stole it....

 

[Gadawg73]

The question should be why are the moochers so resentful of those that have earned more than they have.

Usually, because those who've earned too much stole it....

No, not usually.
Rarely and theft is prosecuted by the criminal courts.
And who defines what is "too much"?
Government?
God help us. If you had your way we would be a 3rd world nation in 10 years.
Everything would be "fair".

 

[JoeB131]

The question should be why are the moochers so resentful of those that have earned more than they have.

Usually, because those who've earned too much stole it....

No, not usually.
Rarely and theft is prosecuted by the criminal courts.
And who defines what is "too much"?
Government?
God help us. If you had your way we would be a 3rd world nation in 10 years.
Everything would be "fair".

Guy, thanks to the Plutocrats we are a third world nation now.

IN 1980, we were the world's largest exporter of finished goods and the world largest importer of raw materials.

Today we are the largest exporter of raw materials and the biggest importer of finished good.

By definition, we are a third world country, with a very rich elite benefiting from it all.

Until now.

 

[jillian]

The question should be why are the moochers so resentful of those that have earned more than they have.

no one is resentful... money is a wonderful thing.

but why should money earned in the stock market be taxed at a lower rate than money earned at a job?

don't you think that's absurd?

 

[flacaltenn]

Usually, because those who've earned too much stole it....

No, not usually.
Rarely and theft is prosecuted by the criminal courts.
And who defines what is "too much"?
Government?
God help us. If you had your way we would be a 3rd world nation in 10 years.
Everything would be "fair".

Guy, thanks to the Plutocrats we are a third world nation now.

IN 1980, we were the world's largest exporter of finished goods and the world largest importer of raw materials.

Today we are the largest exporter of raw materials and the biggest importer of finished good.

By definition, we are a third world country, with a very rich elite benefiting from it all.

Until now.

You might ask Gibson Guitar about the definition of importing raw materials and exporting finished goods. Men with guns from the govt didn't like the way Gibson was doing that. And Congress had essentially protected the jobs of Indian workers with their regulations on guitar materials. Glad you gave me a chance to show SPECIFICALLY where regulation IS the problem. (Other than attempting to wipe out the entire hand-crafted toy industry in this country --- as displayed in my footer)..

But you are ALMOST correct about where we are. It's not the "thieving elite" that are surviving the best. Where are all the companies that makes more than 15% profit in a year? It's also "non-thieving" folk like me that stay globally competitive by helping to build innovative new products for the market. Stuff that the rest of the world NEEDS.

The realization should be that if our workforce resembles a 3rd world nation, we will become a 3rd world nation.

The Global poverty rate has been cut in half in just 20 years or so. WITHOUT stimulus or forced redistribution. And if the US is not up to the challenge of PROMOTING our workers into higher skilled and more FLEXIBLE careers --- you WILL see a decline in the standard of living..

 

[Katzndogz]

The question should be why are the moochers so resentful of those that have earned more than they have.

Usually, because those who've earned too much stole it....

This is pretty much the way the left thinks. If you EARNED too much, by hard work, overtime, inventing, creating, then you actually STOLE what you have from someone who doesn't work, doesn't invent and doesn't create! It's called the entitlement mentality. You never earned it, you stole it from the rightful owner who didn't work for it but is entitled anyway.

And the Oscar goes to....

The worst actor because the good actor would have otherwise stolen the award.

 

[JoeB131]

You might ask Gibson Guitar about the definition of importing raw materials and exporting finished goods. Men with guns from the govt didn't like the way Gibson was doing that. And Congress had essentially protected the jobs of Indian workers with their regulations on guitar materials. Glad you gave me a chance to show SPECIFICALLY where regulation IS the problem. (Other than attempting to wipe out the entire hand-crafted toy industry in this country --- as displayed in my footer)..

But you are ALMOST correct about where we are. It's not the "thieving elite" that are surviving the best. Where are all the companies that makes more than 15% profit in a year? It's also "non-thieving" folk like me that stay globally competitive by helping to build innovative new products for the market. Stuff that the rest of the world NEEDS.

The realization should be that if our workforce resembles a 3rd world nation, we will become a 3rd world nation.

The Global poverty rate has been cut in half in just 20 years or so. WITHOUT stimulus or forced redistribution. And if the US is not up to the challenge of PROMOTING our workers into higher skilled and more FLEXIBLE careers --- you WILL see a decline in the standard of living..

Yawn... guy, you keep defending a bad system.

Gibson broke the law. Not seeing a problem with what was done to them.

 

[Vel]

The question should be why are the moochers so resentful of those that have earned more than they have.

no one is resentful... money is a wonderful thing.

but why should money earned in the stock market be taxed at a lower rate than money earned at a job?

don't you think that's absurd?

Why should money lost in the stock market be capped at $3000.00?

 

[bripat9643]

The question should be why are the moochers so resentful of those that have earned more than they have.

Usually, because those who've earned too much stole it....

Who did Bill Gates steal his money from?

 

[bripat9643]

Guy, thanks to the Plutocrats we are a third world nation now.

If we ever become a third world nation it will be because of socialists and union thugs like you, not because of rich people.

IN 1980, we were the world's largest exporter of finished goods and the world largest importer of raw materials.

Today we are the largest exporter of raw materials and the biggest importer of finished good.

By definition, we are a third world country, with a very rich elite benefiting from it all.

Until now.

Your definition of "third world nation" is bogus. It's based purely on union propaganda.